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Hope Takes Time To Heal [The Economy]

(bumped up by Susan from last night — this is a great backgrounder on the stimulus package, which the House will be voting on shortly)

I find Mariah Carey’s song fitting when discussing the current economic climate. You don’t have to be an economic expert to see that the economy sucks right now. Here in Washington state, our biggest corporations–Microsoft, Starbucks, Boeing, Weyerhaeuser–are laying off people seemingly every day, and it doesn’t seem like there is any end in sight. As the song says, when you’re hurting so bad it takes time to heal and it sure seems like we are gonna be hurting for a while.

LD has been doing a great job discussing the economy and I’m sure he’ll have more to say about it, as will myself and others. But recently, there’s been some discouraging discussion about the recent stimulus plan and how long it will take to kick in. Here’s a clip to a McLaughlin Group discussion from Friday:

(See here and here for more clips from that same show.)

The reason for these discussion is because the Congressional Budget Office has come out with a report looking into the stimulus bill, H.R. 1.

The key finding from the report that McLaughlin seems to be focusing on is this:

Assuming enactment in mid-February, CBO estimates that the bill would increase outlays by $92 billion during the remaining several months of fiscal year 2009, by $225 billion in fiscal year 2010 (which begins on October 1), by $159 billion in 2011, and by a total of $604 billion over the 2009-2019 period. That spending includes outlays from discretionary appropriations in Division A of the bill and direct spending resulting from Division B.

In other words, its going to take time for the bill, as it stands, to start injecting money into the economy. It’s going to take some time for all that hopiness to have any effect. Furthermore, if you want to believe economists such as Paul Krugman, Obama’s stimulus has a big problem:

By my calculations, the Obama plan is supposed to reduce average unemployment over the next two years from 8.7% to 7.6%; over the next three years, it reduces average unemployment from 8.4% to 7.3%. So it closes around a third of the gap between actual unemployment and the natural rate.

In addition to this stimulus taking time to kick in, it might not even do half the job needed!

If you’re like me, you’re pretty bummed reading this. The stimulus probably won’t be an immediate fix and it may be way way too small. Many are now focusing on the former (the slow implementation) as a way to criticize the stimulus. (I’m more inclined to criticize the stimulus for the latter reason.)

A good question to ask is whether the bill will be useful at all since it’ll take some time (ignoring the inadequeacy for now). Fortunately, Paul Krugman someone much smarter than I has already adressed that:

It’s not a problem if some or even most of the stimulus arrives after the official recession, as determined by the NBER, is over. Why? Because in modern recessions, unemployment keeps rising long after the NBER has determined, based on things like industrial production, that the recession proper is over. You can see that the need for stimulus doesn’t end with the recession by the simple fact that in each of the last two recessions the Fed continued to cut interest rates long after the official cycle trough. if it’s good enough for the Fed, it’s good enough for fiscal policy.

What Krugman is saying is that even though the stimulus may not provide immediate help, based on recent historical trends, the stimulus can still be beneficial–unemployment is likely to keep increasing over the next couple years anyway. I realize some may not click on the first link in the above excerpt so I’ll reproduce the graph here so you can see exactly what he’s talking about (look at the last two recessions):

uemployment-recession

If you’re like me, this little bit of comfort is just that: a little comfort. I could continue on with some things I think we could do to get more jobs quickly (and I may at some point in the future), but I’d rather hear from the readers now. What jobs in your state and community need to be done? Are there any projects that have already been in discussions with state and local officials?

  • http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

    I strongly recommend that EVERYONE watch that video. It is, to say the least, edifying. If I could, I’d make PBO sit down and watch it.

    • sowsear

      http://www.readthestimulus.org/index.php

      Only 20.8% of that money will be released in 2009. 79.2% will be released in 2010 or later, meaning 2012 when BO is running again.

      • wodiej

        exactly….

      • http://none maq

        QUOTE: “79.2% will be released in 2010 or later, meaning 2012 when BO is running again.”

        I reckon he sees that he cannot corral a fresh Billion Dollars from his Foreign $$$$ friends and the financial institutes for the ’10 and ’12 elections.

        Gonna try to buy the election with Taxpayer Money.

        Can the Obamabots tough it out Unemployed for forty eight months.

        • wodiej

          I don’t know, Starbucks is going down….

      • no kidding

        sowsear which is more important injecting the economy with stimulus or waiting two years in order to give the Democrats something to run on.

    • Chris Martin

      There is little that can be done to speed up new projects from being undertaken. However, if states and localities had stuff in the pipeline already, then I’d imagine that the planning, permits, zoning, etc may already be addressed so work can begin more promptly. That is why I asked if folks knew of local/state projects in the works. It wouldn’t be a bad thing if significant allotments of funds went to states to disburse to “shovel ready” projects. I know several city and county efforts that want to be undertaken in CA. Many of them already have some plans drawn up, which would decrease the “shovel ready” time.

      If we had the choice, what would we do?

      • BB

        There is no CBO report. What are you talking about? Once again, no much good analysis or really verifying of the facts on this website.

        ” Reports of a recent study by the Congressional Budget Office, showing that the vast majority of the money in the stimulus package won’t be spent until after 2010, have Democrats on the defensive and the GOP calling for a pullback in wasteful spending.

        Funny thing is, there is no such report.

        “We did not issue any report, any analysis or any study,” a CBO aide told the Huffington Post.

        Rather, the nonpartisan CBO ran a small portion of an earlier version of the stimulus plan through a computer program that uses a standard formula to determine a score — how quickly money will be spent. The score only dealt with the part of the stimulus headed for the Appropriations Committee and left out the parts bound for the Ways and Means or Energy and Commerce Committee.

        Because it dealt with just a part of the stimulus, it estimated the spending rate for only about $300 billion of the $825 billion plan. Significant changes have been made to the part of the bill the CBO looked at.

        The CBO numbers were given to a small number of congressional Democrats and Republicans, but were not posted online because they’re not an official CBO product. (Media outlets, while reporting widely about the “report,” have declined to post it online. Here’s the whole thing.) Democratic aides say they are certain that the GOP leaked it to the Associated Press in order to undercut the spending portion of the stimulus.

        A Republican aide for the House Appropriations Committee denied involvement, saying that her staff did not see the CBO numbers until after the AP reported them. The Washington Post followed the AP and reported that aides to Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) provided the report.

        “I didn’t leak it. It was sent to the Hill and considered public. If a reporter was writing on it I made sure they had access to it; it’s a public document,” said McConnell spokesman Don Stewart in an e-mail. ”

        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/23/a-controversial-cbo-repor_n_160495.html

    • Bazooka

      There is no CBO report. What are you talking about? Once again, no much good analysis or really verifying of the facts on this website.

      Reports of a recent study by the Congressional Budget Office, showing that the vast majority of the money in the stimulus package won’t be spent until after 2010, have Democrats on the defensive and the GOP calling for a pullback in wasteful spending.

      Funny thing is, there is no such report.

      “We did not issue any report, any analysis or any study,” a CBO aide told the Huffington Post.

      Rather, the nonpartisan CBO ran a small portion of an earlier version of the stimulus plan through a computer program that uses a standard formula to determine a score — how quickly money will be spent. The score only dealt with the part of the stimulus headed for the Appropriations Committee and left out the parts bound for the Ways and Means or Energy and Commerce Committee.

      Because it dealt with just a part of the stimulus, it estimated the spending rate for only about $300 billion of the $825 billion plan. Significant changes have been made to the part of the bill the CBO looked at.

      The CBO numbers were given to a small number of congressional Democrats and Republicans, but were not posted online because they’re not an official CBO product. (Media outlets, while reporting widely about the “report,” have declined to post it online. Here’s the whole thing.) Democratic aides say they are certain that the GOP leaked it to the Associated Press in order to undercut the spending portion of the stimulus.

      A Republican aide for the House Appropriations Committee denied involvement, saying that her staff did not see the CBO numbers until after the AP reported them. The Washington Post followed the AP and reported that aides to Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) provided the report.

      “I didn’t leak it. It was sent to the Hill and considered public. If a reporter was writing on it I made sure they had access to it; it’s a public document,” said McConnell spokesman Don Stewart in an e-mail.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/23/a-controversial-cbo-repor_n_160495.html

  • wodiej

    pork running down Pennsylvania Ave…LOL

    that one lady is full of shit. What’s wrong w that? Dumbass, what does all that shit have to do w reviving the economy?? This is the 2nd time today I have heard we need income tax cuts for workers and business corporate tax rate cuts.

  • http://liberalrapture.com/ John (from Liberal Rapture)

    okay are we even sure this thing is going to “kick in” at all?

  • eurogirl70

    Oh, It’s so nice to see Mort Zuckerman on the panel again! (Snark)
    I guess he needs the money now that he’s lost some change to Bernie Madoff.

  • diane

    http://www.poorrichardsalmanac.biz
    video: THE OBAMA DECEPTION!

  • diane

    http://www.poorrichardsalmanac.biz
    SHOCKING COWARDICE!
    VA TECH STUDENT DECAPITATED IN RESTAURANT AS EMPLOYEES WATCHED!
    7 VA TECH STUDENTS RAN AWAY IGNORING HER CRIES FOR HELP!
    8″ KNIFE USED TO SAW HEAD OFF BEAUTIFUL CHINESE FOREIGN STUDENT IN BLACKSBURG, VA!
    NOBODY HELPED HER!

  • sandshark222

    Just the fact that this Pork Package… err I mean stimulus gives ACORN access to an estimated 4.19 BILLION DOLLARS makes me wanna vomit. That’s our tax dollars folks.

    I don’t know about you, but I work waaayyy too hard for my money to see it dumped into that slimy organization.

  • http://deleted Aaron

    Cut federal spending, including defense, and the payroll tax. The reduction in payroll tax will help employees and employers tremendously.

  • James

    Eleanor Clift is such an Obama shill. Has she ever criticized him?

  • EWard

    Obama is going in the opposite direction and making us dependent on the government. If you want federal spending cuts, it isn’t going to happen on Obama’s watch.

    The public is outraged when executives from these financial companies are buying private jets

    Yet, Nancy Pelosi rides to and from CA in a private plane at the expense of taxpayers.

    Obama and the Dems are throwing up roadblocks and making it impossible for private companies to survive.

    Case in point the auto industry – they are setting up standards for the automakers to build cars that the public doesn’t want

    2nd case in point – energy – BO and the Dems do not want offshore drilling – If CA wants to drill for oil the surrounding states have to approve it & the feds not the states will receive most of the revenue

    Acorn – is an organization set up to keep BO in power-this is why money is in his stimulus package – BO is probably the most radical and corrupt President we have ever had…..

    • Chris Martin

      If you think banks failing and businesses going under every day are bad you have no further to look than conservative “small government” policies to thank. Our recession (bordering on depression) is the result of conservative policies, much like the 1930s depression. You can criticize the big bad “big government” bogeyman all you want, but the current economic crisis has nothing to do with that. Its the repeated failed policies of conservativism that is to blame.

      • Patience

        It should be noted that McCain and other Republicans, and even the Bush administration, sounded the alarm about the [then looming] financial crisis years before it came to a head. Their warnings went unheeded. They may be guilty of failed leadership but the policy of beefing up sub-prime mortgage lending began in the Clinton administration. Granted, conservatives jumped on the bandwagon as the home building industry (and related businesses) boomed during the housing bubble.

        Have we already forgotten that the biggest beneficiaries of financial industry campaign contributions were Chris Dodd, Barack Obama (managed to rise high on the list in spite of only being a senator for 2 years) and Barney Frank? Shouldn’t this fact make us at least wary of “solutions” they offer?

        • Obama: Dubya II – Electric Boogaloo

          The Democratic Party Apologists only know two things…all evil and failed policy is a result of the GOP and conservatives and the Dems can do no wrong. It’s a handy excuse for failed Democrat leadership and passing the buck ala George Bush.

          Obama is truly Dubya II: Electric Boogaloo

        • BernieO

          You are wrong and Chris Martin is spot on. It was Bush’s SEC that dropped requirement that the big investment banks hold a specified proportion of capital to debt after the big five asked them to. It was done immediately and the media ignored it. Bear Stearns went to a 33 to 1 debt to capital ratio. This was Republic economics – extreme deregulation.
          Bush did not warn that the economy was in trouble – he repeatedly said up until the big crash in the fall that the economy was A-OK. They did complain about Fannie and Freddie but it was not Fannie and Freddie that caused this meltdown – they held less that one fifth of the bad loans.
          We have repeatedly had economic meltdowns after allowing Republicans to weaken regulation or avoid oversight. That is what caused the S&L crisis, and so many others that followed. (LTCM, dot-com, Enron, etc.) It is also what caused the bank collapse of ’29. The wealthy were allowed to manipulate the stock market and the banks were not required to hold a reasonable amount of capital to cover their debt. If we do not finally learn our lesson about this, we will keep repeating this cycle until we do.
          The media also bears a large share of the blame. For example, they did not report on the SEC meeting that allowed such dangerous deregulation. They also were complicit in the dot com bust, deliberately hyping stocks instead of giving viewers objective information.

      • Obama: Dubya II – Electric Boogaloo

        This would be true if the Dems actually expressed any opposition to the GOP’s economic policies but if you go back and look at the votes I’m sure you’ll find Dem support for programs that are now being squared away on the GOP.

        The Dems were put in charge to fix this mess, and when they fail, and you know they will, the public will have little patience in listening to Dem Party twits point fingers at GOPers and whine about how conservatives fucked up America.

      • Wisewoman

        Chris. Your lack of knowledge is why we are in the fix we are in. The blame for economic melt down has been laid completely and squarely on the repubs with absolutely no responsibility for Obama or the Dems. My research shows that the one person in the country who bears the most responsibility for the economic mortgage disaster and resulting Wall Street debacle is Obama along with his democratic cohorts. The country elected the same crooks that got us into this mess. WAKE UP AMERICA, THE DEMS ARE MOSTLY TO BLAME FOR THIS ECONOMIC FIASCO.

        1. 1994>> Through Acorn’s community and legal actions, Sen Obama & other attorneys sued Citibank Federal Savings Bank in Chicago in federal court charging racial discrimination in housing lending (Link 1 below).
        2. 1998>> They won the case, bank entered into a consent decree to lend money for housing to less qualified buyers with insufficient collateral. Obama’s is listed as the 10th name as attorney on page 3.
        3. 1999>> Clinton administration entered into other consent decrees with other banks. Eventually Fannie Mae (FM) and Freddie Mac (FM) backed these mortgages. (Links recently removed from U- tube where Bill Clinton acknowledged that Dems were responsible for fiasco at FM & FM, and where in their own words Dems were shown to be derelict in their duties.)
        4. FM & FM backed mortgages mainly caused the economic melt down.
        5. Through his action and inaction, Sen Obama bares a heavy responsibility for the stock market losses impacting 401ks, retirement, and other income. In 2005, Sen John McCain attempted to prevent this melt down through needed legislation. Dems stonewalled. Sen Obama did nothing.
        Links Provided:
        Link 1: Legal document showing discrimination case, outcome, and attorneys of record. Find Obama’s name.
        Link 2: Watch third (Bill Clinton at 8 min mark), twelfth, and fourteenth video down on right side of page. (Document removed, I removed Link 2)
        Link 3: Watch video 3 on right side of page featuring Andrew Como. (Document removed, I removed this Link 3 also)
        Link 4: General information about the mortgage issue and Obama’s involvement with ACORN..

        Link 1
        http://clearinghouse.wustl.edu/detail.php?id=10112&search=source|general;caseCat|FH;orderby|caseName;

        Link 4
        http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/09/27/consumer-rights-league-obama-acorn-and-the-subprime-mortgage/

        The greatest of all US scandals is how Dems destroyed the financial system with a socialist housing scheme and looting the GSEs for political money and got away with blaming the Repubs.

        • IndianaDem

          My research shows that the one person in the country who bears the most responsibility for the economic mortgage disaster and resulting Wall Street debacle is Obama along with his democratic cohorts.

          So… Exactly how many loose screws were there in the average Studebaker, anyway?

          • Pennsylvania Red

            One of them just posted this comment.

            • IndianaDem

              That goes without saying. *G*

              Maybe once we’ve resolved whether it’s entirely Bush’s fault or entirely Obama’s fault, we can try to reach some reasonable compromises about what needs to be done.

              I’ve gotta say, though, that’s giving a lot of credit to a party that’s been effectively out of power for the better part of 8 years. Apparently they totally screwed things by having bad attitudes.

  • Sammie

    I was hoping that with an eye towards his legacy, Obama would do his best to ensure that the stimulus package was designed to work (after all, if it doesn’t, or isn’t as effective as he claims, that certainly could impede his chances of re-election and possibly forever tarnish his reputation). However, based on what I’ve heard about the package so far, I’m not optimistic.

    It doesn’t seemed focused or targeted to our major problems, and some of the programs, although well intentioned, seem to fall short of what you would expect would be needed …. I mean, granted increasing insulation sounds like a good idea, but didn’t we already go down that road before?

    I don’t understand why they can’t create a sound stimulus package that can be easily explained and sold to the American public. As it stands right now, even the Obama cheerleaders are having difficulties explaining and defending it.

    • Obama: Dubya II Electric Boogaloo

      Pay to play…that’s how it’s done in Chicago, and now it’s the way it’s done in DC in the Obama era. This is exactly what everyone here has pointed out, it’s a giant Dem pork bill along with a future Dem/Obama slush fund for 2010 and 2012. No GOPer in their right mind would have voted for this.

      But what are the Dems here really upset about? That the GOP showed some balls and good old fashioned “hanging together or hanging seperately”? If the situation was reversed you KNOW that at least 50-60 dems would have crossed the aisle to show their corporate contributers that they like to play nice with the right!

  • glennmcgahee

    Just try to read that stimulus package bill. The 5000 pages of government speak refer to tables in other gov’t handbooks and regulations in others. The Congress is supposed to read and vote on this bill within 4 days. Thats exactly whats wrong with our government. This should have time to be studied by economists from all over and commented on before anything is passed. Tell us exactly what it will do and what it will not do. Then our Representatives should actually listen to their constituents instead of the party heirachy and vote accordingly. Of course, nothing close to this is happening.

  • Richard
    • Chris Martin

      Been there done that. Was at a party, going outside and got distracted by some ladies near the glass door which was open as I approached. By the time I turned to go outside, someone had closed the door and I slammed right into it. Of course I still try to play it off…

      • oowawa

        O’s unheralded secret slogan:

        “Fake it ’til you make it.”

  • Lizzy

    I am concerned about the lack of deliberation being given to this stimulus package. It seems that with the amount of money involved we should be careful and examine the plan closely. Given Obama’s record of grabbing lobbiest money and gaming the system Chicago style, I don’t trust him to spend this kind of money without having it go to donors and cronies. One thing though; they are talking about tax cuts, but a tax cut doesn’t help you if you don’t have a job. I don’t really think a stimulus will address the problems of job creation.

  • Lizzy

    Our industrial base and the welfare of our workers have been eroded since Unca Ronnie R. was our president. I think that to rebuild our production with good jobs is going to require a deeper analysis than just throwing money at it. They have spent years shipping our jobs off shore.

  • Chris Martin

    I’m not sure I agree with you. Government intervention has averted crises the world over for a long time.

    Privatized banks failed miserably yet everyone seems to trust them despite catastrophic failures. The government, while not perfect by any means, has saved corporate asses time and time again yet they are somehow still the bogeyman. That’s very interesting to me.

  • Obama: Dubya II – Electric Boogaloo

    Funny, I thought the Government was supposed to represent the people, yet you admit that the Govt keeps bailing out “corporate asses” time and time again.

    You know what? I’m fucking tired of having my money go down corporate black holes because corporate leadership is failed to be held accountable while looking for hand outs from the public piggy trough. And the Govt is more than happy to rape and pillage it’s own people because business leaders are complete failures at their jobs.

  • Pennsylvania Red

    Amen bro

    or sis as the case may be