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Open Thread * Rules re Posting & Economic Unrest Spreads

By SusanUnPC on January 30, 2009 at 3:50 PM in Economy, Open Thread, United Kingdom, World News

Here are a couple easy rules for posting comments at NoQuarterUSA.net:

(1) You must provide a legitimate e-mail address in your comments. No one but the administrators sees the address. We need it in case we need to contact you about your comments. If your e-mail bounces, that’s grounds for immediate banning. This morning, an e-mail I sent bounced, but I but the person (Bazooka) on moderation in the hopes that he/she sees this and responds to susanunpc at gmail dot com.

(2) We need to avoid personal attacks, and stick to the subjects. Now, ahem, Larry and I are imperfect this way; I’ve “gone off” on a reader whose remarks irritated me, but I’m trying to change my ways because it’s not conducive to good, rational discussion where we can all learn from each other. We do NOT require that you agree with each other or the writer’s POV. In fact, we encourage disagreement. But let cooler heads prevail!

NOW, a video from the UK, via CNN, on more unrest among workers due to the worldwide recession. Of note: This protest has spread across the entire nation, including Scotland and Wales. (Story below.)

If you missed it, be sure to check out all the videos from France, Iceland, and other countries where economic unrest is hitting the streets: “Recession Sparks Protests Across the World, from Iceland to Paris to Latvia to China.

There were over one million protesters in France yesterday. Iceland has had days and days of riots in front of its parliament building. And WorldFocus.org’s worldwide bloggers are reporting in on more protests and riots around the world.

Here’s the accompanying CNN story on the UK unrest:

Oil refinery dispute spreads across Britain

Photo Caption: “Protesters gather outside the Total Lindsey oil refinery in north-east England on January 30.”

LONDON, England (CNN) — Hundreds of energy workers across the UK have taken strike action Friday in protest over the use of foreign workers on a multimillion-dollar oil refinery project on the northeast coast of England.

The dispute surrounds the decision by oil giant Total to award Italian company IREM a contract to build a new hydro desulphurization facility at its Lindsey Oil Refinery in North Lincolnshire.

The British Press Association reported that several hundred demonstrators had gathered for a third day outside the plant, following a walk-out by contractors on Wednesday, but the unofficial action has now spread to other parts of the UK, including Scotland and Wales.

In Scotland, hundreds of workers at the giant Grangemouth oil refinery walked out following an early morning meeting Friday. According to PA, the mechanical contractors, who work for BP and INEOS, said they were supporting their colleagues in Lincolnshire.

Elsewhere, PA reported that police were called to the Aberthaw power station near Barry in South Wales after workers staged a protest, while around 400 workers staged a demonstration at the Wilton oil refinery in Teesside, north-east England. ….

Belle Gardens

I checked my mail this morning, and lo and behold, I found a solicitation from my credit card company, offering money.

It’s a little disconcerting to see they simply don’t get it, indicating it’s not going to get better for any of us until Washington bottoms out, too.

If I need the money to pay bills, then I’m lacking work, not in a position to be borrowing.

And if I’m mistakenly looking at it as a gift rather than a loan, I’m fiscally irresponsible, not apprecitating the lessons of the last eight years or heeding the warning signals indicated by the massive lay offs.

Work availabillty is shrinking, why would I borrow money I’m not sure I can back?

So, why are they offering to lend money, or even raise credit limits, with this financial crisis enveloping us? This is WHY they got into trouble, in part, in the first place.

Shouldn’t they at least acknowledge they’re aware of the reality?

http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

How interesting. So they want you to keep using their card, probably expecting that you’ll end up spending a lot more than their “gift” and thereby be even more indebted to them. Ugh.

Belle Gardens

Memebers of family have been layed off (management) or are teetering on lay off, working for companies that are suffering for lack of work.

As a consumer, it would be a bad risk for me (and them) to take money I many not be able to pay back in a timely manner and it is simply not responsible to pretend everything will be OK.

If the job sector were expanding, or even developing, I would feel more confident, but it’s shrinking.

Wall Street and the government are making the same mistakes, learning nothing.

http://www.dwarfhamster.com dst

Another bad day at the market except for shorters. Where are all the punitives who had January been an up month, would be out in droves shouting “As January goes so goes the year”. Where is the BO rally? After watching him in that photo-op yesterday where he starred down the CEO’s and their bonuses (after the fact) with nothing but read fancy speach writer words, I find him reminding me more and more of Edwards, a flea trying to be a heavy weight.
http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

THERE is our Helen! Asking Robert Gibbs when Obama is finally going to hold a press conference! Gibbs replies, “You’ll get your chance.”

I love this transparency.

elise

FOX news reported there are now ten former lobbyists working in the Obama Administration. All exceptions to the rule are welcome to apply. All you have to do is recuse yourself from any business your position requires. I love transparency too.
http://undercoverblackman.blogspot.com Undercover Black Man

God bless Helen… but “finally” hold a press conference? Obama has been in office for 10 days! (I know it seems like longer.)

WildChild

At least BOBO was ready by day ten. It sure is lucky for us we didn’t really need a president between days one and nine.

http://firefox AnnieCollier

But, but, he already had a ….oh wait. That was an interview. Maybe Helen should start hanging out in Dubai with the Arab TV channels.

tek

I am totally in sympathy with all these workers. Yesterday a guy in France said why should average people suffer because the people running the banks and the government have done stupid things? I agree.

http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

Oh yes! What I find astonishing is:

1) we’re not having protests or riots in this country (we’re so damn passive here these days); and

2) our news outlets aren’t covering these stories more.

Of course, the less that Americans know how REAL citizens behave when things go terribly wrong, the less they’ll be inspired to protest too.

obamastolemyboyfriend

Susan, I am also astonished. We should take to the streets here (I’m freezing my tush off in MN so I am hoping the masses are more motivated round about May-haha). Some of the problem may be that the MSM isn’t really letting the dumbed down public (aka-Obama supporters) know how bad it is and how this porkulous package is not the anwswer. These uninformed folks always take evrything at face value, the democrats say it will help, I’m a democrat, therefore I can trust them. It makes me nuts. Until they lose their jobs or can’t buy their cheetos, they simply continue to live in fantasyland.

Could the problem be who Obama gets his advice from? I recall in the Saddleback forum he answered Rick Warren’s question about who he would seek advice from and he answered, Michelle and his mother-in-law, I think! Yep, the term President experiment is under way!

I think it is time for some economic/financial experts to storm the whitehouse and just push for real solutions!
Karma

They don’t want it to spread.

There was a CIA agent on the Discovery Channel smoking cigars discussing how they helped overthrow a govt with some walkie talkies.

The guy was a character….forget his name though….but essentially he was sheep herder on that operation.
UKforDems

Thank you Susan for that post. I do not exactly agree with many on here, but I have had very reasonable discussions. Seattle Moss is one such example; his views are patriotic, but not bigoted and he has a full understanding of economics because the poor economy really does hurt him. In fact we agreed about the irony of the US and UK Governments spending billions on affordable housing and now spending trillions on keeping them unaffordable.

I still stick to my guns – this is not caused by “illegals” and it is ver5y very important to slap down those trying to spread the meme that the recession is their fault.

Seattle Moss

Hey UK,
You flatter me thanks…I’m blushing!

I have traveled long and far this week.What I have seen will spook you all.
Although things are looking up for me as I acquire new business to make up for the deep losses of the last four months I have haunting feel that what we are witnessing is the fulfillment of prophesy.i sad right here on this blog in June that we would see an Obama collapse if he were to win…I don’t blame Obama, but I do blame in part the movement behind him by playing class warfare and insuring that we indeed have socialism
As someone that has lived in a socialist country the UK back in the 70′s I can tell you that we have years of Stagflation ahead of us.
Lets not forget who really creates the jobs. Those of us that have businesses who need a break in our taxes or regulations so that we can invest in more equipment and employees to take it to the next level
If we had a tax holiday for the next six months I believe that our economy would stimulated and the markets rebound.

Qualeville

Moss, you’re prediction of future stagflation is right on the “money”. With the Fed printing money and pouring it into the economy, we will have a classic situation on our hands of “too many dollars chasing too few goods”. Inflation is the cruelest on those who make the least, or are past their prime and living on fixed incomes.
We need tax breaks so the private sector can gain momentum, and fuel our recovery. Meanwhile, Congress and Obama want to throw 400 Billion down the rat hole now know as climate change (formerly known as global warming).
Green Jobs=Jobs that pay in cash

Seattle Moss

Hey Quayleville,
As someone who has seen boom busts cycles before any jobs in climate change are dead end at the moment. I feel sorry for anyone that invested in this area as it’s BUST time.
Obama will spend billions on regulations and so called green jobs which will further strangle the private sector.

I know some great Green jobs…Pick the harvest and put them apples in my bags!

Qualeville

Moss,

Ha Ha! One bad apple (Obama) will spoil the whole bunch! Rotten to the core, like Blago, whom he was the campaign chair for.

Welcome Back Carteh

Not stagflation, but hyperninflation.

Seattle Moss

UK…I agree that using the Illegals card is a scapegoat.Actually Illegals have been good for certain segments of the economy..
Central Washington has depended on cheap labor to pick cherries,apples,pears and grapes. Until the crack downs harvest were at record levels
Last year as I was looking at the orchards I could see fields of rotting fruit with no one to pick.
Now the Chinese are planting 5 million acres of fruit which will decimate the fruit business in America.
We need a competitive edge!!
Americans don’t pick fruit…but cheap labor in china will…
Seattle Moss

UK,

In fact we agreed about the irony of the US and UK Governments spending billions on affordable housing and now spending trillions on keeping them unaffordable.

We are trying to put floor boards in the collapsing economy. The reality is that for years the economy to scale did not support the prices of housing. In fact housing reached the 90% of first time buyers unable to buy a house in California. Only through speculation, overbuilding, low interest rates and bad loans was this housing market able to reach the point of implosion.
The truth is there is going to be pain. Either now or strung out over the next ten years.
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/the-home-front/2009/01/23/peter-schiff-let-the-housing-market-crash.html?ref=patrick.net

http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

I am in sympathy with the workers but we can’t blame it all on the CEOs.

I knpw people who got into the business of selling bad mortgages. They are a huge part of the problem. And it was also irresponsible on the part of people who bought houses that they could not afford.

The greed went all the way from Wall Street to Main Street.

wodiej

agree….

Tricia Spiegel

Thanks for reminding us about etiquette. I actually enjoy spirited debate–the more spirited the better–but when one person becomes just plain rude and is not responsive to the subject at hand, it is irritating and ruins the flow of the fun.
Karma

Congrats to Mr Steele….voted in as the new chairman for the RNC.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/republicans

oowawa

Well, that’s certainly interesting! Articulate and smart, he is now the first black RNC chairman. The times they are a-changin’.

Karma

“We’re going to say to friend and foe alike: ‘We want you to be a part of us, we want you to with be with us.’ And for those who wish to obstruct, get ready to get knocked over,” Steele said.

Looks like he will be hitting the ground running.

He was always one of my favorite talking heads on Fox. Smart, funny, with common sense and decency.

And in my opinion, Mr Steele has suffered more racism in his elections than Obama did. Not that makes him better, simply that he didn’t throw the race card down first as a tactic without truth like Obama. Rather the racial tactic was actually thrown at him and he fought it honorably.

wodiej

I don’t know anything about this guy but from what you’ve said, I like him already.
FranSC

I agree. Michael Steele was the only AA republican that stayed loyal to his party in 2008. The others caved to the bipartisan drama of an AA becoming president.

Michael seems to understand many of the aspects that got not only Obama elected but the democratic take over of congress in 2006 and 2008. He realizes that Nancy Pelosi and the democratic congressional campaign raised all that money that got those democrats elected. But if he is to be successful, Michael will need to understand a lot more about that fundraising.

Pelosi used a company in her district that would hone its skills to later raise the nearly $700 million for the BO campaign. These fundraising techiques were first successfully used by Howard Dean, using a different but similar company in his failed 2004 run for POTUS.

The republicans will never be able to compete with that first-of-its-kind fundraising until they understand this is not fundraising as either party has ever known it. It is not just from their party fat cats or millions of volunteers giving small $5 contributions, although this is what the democrats would have us continue to believe.

Judy L. NC

The party of Lincoln after all. . .

Seattle Moss

Michael Steele is voice of reason in a sea of knee jerk reactions…I don’t know how this economy is going to be repaired.
It seems that those in power are in the business to increase their power.
The stimulus package of 800Billion should be scrapped and a slash in corporate and capital gains should be written into law.
We should cut back on regulations as this is the time for survival of the fittest.
Because the global economy has seen a 30% reduction in demand and industrial output we have a few years before we need to enact global warming standards. In fact the earth could be cooling again precisely because of the fall in industrial output.

Qualeville

Moss,

Since the earth has shown to be cooling since 1998 (our warmest on record since 1934), how could 6 months of economic downturn effected this trend? Interesting how much you are interested in freeing the mechanisms of growth, yet blind to the biggest threat to our recovery and future prosperity: Global Warming Taxation, and the Carbon Credits Indulgencies Industry.

Seattle Moss

Qualyville….I’m not for carbon taxes..NO Way!!

But reality shows that every so often these loons try to enforce anti-business laws..So I’m prepared!
I have studied climate change for many years and believe that Human activity could be the only thing preventing an ice age.
We are in an 12000 year interglacial period and that could change on a dime..The perods of ice last for 100,000 years with small warm ups in between.
An Ice age is death to all. I can hand some warming

WildChild

A return to the carboniferous period would be equally tragic.

Seattle Moss

WC..You’re so funny!
The carboniferous period was 350 million years ago.
I was traveling through the channeled scab lands today in central Washington being awed at the landscape that saw the greatest floods in history happening a scant 12000 years ago by retreating glaciers.
I also gain comfort back home in Seattle realizing that I’m able to live here because a mile high glacier no longer exists on top of where my house is located.

WildChild

The funniest thing about the carboniferous period is that the oil and coal we are burning is also 350 million years old, and unlike the millions of years it took that CO2 to sequester, it won’t take millions of years for us to send it back into the atmosphere. If we keep going the way we are we will have to worry ice, because it’s going to melt before I finish my beverage.

Seattle Moss

I have thought like you for years
However, I believe that even with Global warming this will cause an ice age

Why?…Greenland is the tipping point.Whenever enough glacier melt hits the north Atlantic drift this cools down Europe leading to an ice age world wide

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0130-11.htm

WildChild

It has been hypothesized that a massive polar melt dumped into the north Atlantic could shut down the gulf stream and cause an ice age. However the melting we see is steady. It is exposing more water and land surface which by nature absorb more heat. Increased heating intensifies the gulf stream and rushes the cold melt water even faster to the equator nullifying the effects of the increased melting. As long as things remain steady, you won’t see an ice age caused by global warming.

Strawberrybitch

Thanks WC. And thanks Susan, Larry and No Quarter. And goodnight.
WildChild

Night strawberry
Seattle Moss

WC…I believe in both theories right now..Look around the world sucks what we’re doing to it.
I feel like I’m on a tread mill.

We are destroying everything!

However we can’t stop because our lives depend on work and economic growth.
WildChild

Our lives depend on work and keeping the money moving. Having watched the recent collapse of all that which “grew”, we should seriously start to consider if “growth” is just another in long line of scams to make rich men into obscenely rich men. We’ve already discovered that the invisible hand is invisible because it doesn’t exist. Growth seems to be another illusion manufactured along the same lines
Seattle Moss

WC…It’s nice to think about stopping the growth mirage, but the reality is that we are Energy and as a species we produce and consume as all species have done since the beginning of time.
Life itself is bizarre in that there is no mercy for those that contemplate a more just existence.
WildChild

it’s not an issue of justice. It is a you say a flow issue, but not of energy, rather of money. To keep the lights on the electrons in the wire have to be moving. It’s not an issue of how many elections are in the wire because the number is the same whether or not the switch is on or off. The same is true in an economy. There wer as many ral dollars in the us economy the day after the 29 crash as there was the day before. What causd the depression is those dollars stopped moving. No motion, no work, no prosperity. We just gave close to a trillion dollars to the guys that gave us this mess and they are sitting on it to “ride it out” s that money is out of the mix. Guys are getting laid off so that money is out of the mix. Then there is the rest of us who are cutting back our spending so that money is out of the mix. The engine is shutting down. The only issue of justice who do we volunteer to starve to death first.
Seattle Moss

The engine is shutting down. The only issue of justice who do we volunteer to starve to death first

In a capitalist society economic Darwinism will decide
In a communist/socialist society it is the government that will decide who lives or dies.

I will take my chances with capitalism
Warts and all!
WildChild

ah, but our society is neither capitalist nor socialist. I know this to be true because all the die hard capitalists just had their hands out for a little of that government sponsored socialism. We are exactly what out national motto says we are.\: E pluribus unum, out of many… one. This country isn’t all one thing or all another. It’s everything making up one thing

Anyway, you’re talking ideology and I’m talking flow. I don’t care what mechanism moves the money, I just care that it moves. The three major players are consumer spending, private investment and public investment. The first is scared, the second is “riding it out” and the third has been vilified by the second for the last thirty years. In the absence of the first two, number three is all there is to get number one and two of their asses and moving.

LOL but we have BOBO running the show and he was making supply side arguments in the primary. So we are probably screwed
Seattle Moss

number three is all there is to get number one and two of their asses and moving.

For thirty years I have been saying the same thing.Investment in infrastructure and the future of this country instead of relying on the next quarter in the stock market.

How come when it has finally arrived all the democratic aspirations that I have fought for I’m no longer happy

That’s because I have no faith in Milhouse O and or his Pelosi cabal.
WildChild

I don’t have much faith in them either. A lot of people have been fuming over the latest stimulus package and for good reason. It was more of a payback package and less of a stimulus package. However it shouldn’t shock or surprise anyone that they did it. Now having gotten it out of their system they will get the opportunity to show us all if they are any more effective then the republicans at running a nation.

Seattle Moss

yet blind to the biggest threat to our recovery and future prosperity: Global Warming Taxation, and the Carbon Credits Indulgencies Industry.

I think you miss read me on that one.

I’m for whatever it takes to increase manufacturing in this country

With 30% off the top decline in world output all the goals the global warming proponents have been far exceeded.

Qualeville

Moss,
Ah, I see what you mean, every cloud has a silver lining I guess. I misread your meaning.
Would it serve to further the “Green agenda” by limiting our capabilities to produce energy and goods? Imagine how “good” it would be for our planet if we lost 50% of production and the ensuing “polution” of CO2 release. How about 70% Who cares about the people, we’ll seem more european and sophisticated when we all HAVE to ride bycicles.

Seattle Moss

National security for sure!

It just makes sense to reduce the carbon foot print for everyone as long as it doesn’t kill business.
The difference between now and 1980 when the last bust occurred is that Obama is willing to invest in Green despite the cost effectiveness for the long term strategic national interests
I’m all for that but worry that he will destroy private business along with it.

Zeke

Moss,
Here’s my plan. Everybody who sees climate change as being the fault of people can directly impact their carbon footprint immediately.
The average adult breathes 12-20 times per minute thus exhaling a large amount of CO2 that many times each and every minute! Now, if they could all practice holding their breath for say, oh 30 seconds, quickly exhale (Through a charcoal briquette for the truly dedicated) and re-inhale and hold that one for 30 seconds etc…. we are reducing the human generated carbon footprint by a gigantic factor. Naturally, there will have to be sleep periods where the respiration count will rise back up to non-contributory levels but you can’t train people overnight. There is room for mandatory briquette filtering devices for sleepers so that they can still be part of the cause.
A “conservative” (please pardon, admin) estimate would be expected to yield somewhere in the range of 40-60% reduction in CO2 emission.
Truly dedicated believers can move to the “Comet Catcher” Level and “Go for Zero!” I applaud their efforts and hope their recruitment programs are a great success.

Seattle Moss

Zeke,
I look forward to that communist utopia. I’m sure they will regulate flatulence next by controlling what we eat..

I’m selling bean commodities short!

Zeke

Screw that, go long on Beano stock and cut to the finish!

Seattle Moss

LOL!

T-R

Conservatives have been praying hard for this day since Ronnie Raygun – they should be VERY proud -

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!!

Karma

I truly thought they were going to beat the Democrats to the first black President with Gen Powell. Too bad it wasn’t the Gen in the WH for the 2000 election.

And agree, they should be very proud. At this point, I think they got the better man.

G-funkadelic

Susanunpc-
I have read many of your articles and am generally approving of your rhetoric matching the facts. Today, you are off the mark rabble rousing about British riots as on par with France and Ireland when all we’re talking about is maybe 3000 people over three sites limited only to an energy worker dispute. You make it seem like riots are spreading through the whole country.

“NOW, a video from the UK, via CNN, on more unrest among workers due to the worldwide recession. Of note: This protest has spread across the entire nation, including Scotland and Wales.”

False.

i hate to say it, but such exaggeration is reminiscent of Obama’s scare tactics, something you’ve written extensively opposing.
My Name is Red

We need [your email address] in case we need to contact you about your comments.

This statement begs a couple of questions, Susan:

1) What sort of comments create the “need” for you to contact people?

2) What do you say in these contacts?

My Name is Red

I’ve just searched backwards through the articles for the comment from Bazooka that required you to contact him or her directly. The only one I found is one in which the harshest thing Bazooka says is this:

“You seem a little naive…”

That remark is so innocuous that it throws into high relief the fact that the remark was addressed to you.

Did you put someone on moderation simply because you insist on being able to directly confront anyone who disagrees with you?

Ferd Berfle

Ahem…it is their website. What are you–the blog protocol police?

Zeke

Ferd,
You’re right that it is their website. What may be at issue is that there really aren’t First Amendment Rights on blogs and now that this truth is enforced with greater impetus here, there is some surprise.
In the past, it seemed that as long as one kept the punches above the belt in their styles of insult that the give and take was good and opinion thrived. When someone went over the top, one of us would dime him out and, “Poof, like that, he was gone…”
If somebody had game, he got to play. You remember trolls who could spray the manure with the best of them and we ate them alive. Then came along a new breed of candy-ass who, rather than stepping into the ring and showing their stuff, would run to admin and whine that somebody hurt their feelings.
So, in order to level this playing field in which we have enjoyed the freedom to use our common language to its fullest potential, there are new rules of behavior which will allow those of less intense belief the right to dilute the brew, add more mixer to the punchbowl and, in general, roll over and show just how good a puppy we can be. No extremes… just gray.
pardon my enthusiasm

Ferd Berfle

I get your gist. However, the regulars here are rarely admonished or banned unless they get really out of hand. I have yet to be banned or lectured even though I do get a bit ~~testy~~ nasty, at times.

My Name is Red

What are you–the blog protocol police?

No. Susan is saying that’s her role. Pay attention.

Ferd Berfle

Which part of “it is their website” do you fail utterly to understand?

Move on, dud–there is nothing to see here.

My Name is Red

It’s weird how you chase after me just to tell me to go away. If it bothers you to read my posts, don’t click on them. What a concept!

ChiTown

They banned me because someone complained about my private website .. didn’t even warn me.. Just flat out banned.

WTF?

Susan and Larry ban really nice people and chase off the people with brains and heart. Then they keep people like Strawberrybitch who threatens to kill people because she has a steroid problem. Go figure.

Strawberrybitch

That is libel, OIAF. Or who ever you are calling yourself today, Sybil. You just stepped over the line. I will be contacting Larry this time.

WTF?

Why would it be Libel when there is a printed document where you told a poster you would “kick their ass?” I don’t get it. If that’s what you want to do, good for you. You keep calling people here OAIF. What’s up with that? There’s a group of people here who are friends that are documenting this stuff, especially some blog that advocates bodily threats.

Larry posted a big thread about NOT doing that, but they never banned a psyscho who threatened to kill another poster. YOU decided that threatening bodily harm to people was okay. You forget that we have it in writing and have forwarded it to the DA. You can take up your “libel” nonsense with the DA, who thinks you are psycho and dangerous.

WildChild

so then you were lying when you said… Then they keep people like Strawberrybitch who threatens to kill people because she has a steroid problem

that type of lie would fall under libel.

WTF?

I suggest, if you nuts are going to scream about lawyers, to get one. I tend to think that if someone puts in writing that they will kill someone it’s pretty serious. I know, I know, you people don’t believe in the law. But, thank God, there are some judges and lawyers who do. Give it a shot. Some people don’t like to read on screen that a so called “woman” claims to be a big “bitch” and a real “body builder” and that she is “going to kick your ass.” Did you miss it? Ask Larry. It’s against the law. For the same reason saying you would do it to Obama is.

Ferd Berfle

We’re talking about a serious tempest in a teapot, here WTF. I guess that molehill looms like a mountain for someone of as little consequence as you.

LMAO

http://www.cheneywatch.org/ truthtelling007

MNisRed,

the reason is that spamming the site bogs the server, bogs the discussion, and there’s no reason someone can’t simply leave an email to make sure if there is a need to moderate their comment it isn’t simply done blindly. I can tell you that Susan doesn’t like to moderate any of the comments here, but we have had death threats towards the presidents, present and past, blatantly racist and sexist words here that the NQ owners will not support.

By having a valid email they can simply ask the person to tone it down. I need not give examples of people here who were asked to tone it down and I’m very thankful they are still here. If they were “ban” happy, trust me, more would be gone.

Moderation is the prerogative of the owners to manage the conversation on the site for the best of the readers and the security of the blog.

Right now for instance I’m deleting spam posts you might notice here and there that contain gibberish text and is designed to exploit the site’s resources. Some are done by online macros that simply search for blog systems and propagate their codes in the comments to rob resources.

Having a legitimate email makes sure real human beings don’t get thrown out in the mix.

Additionally there are a few extreme voices that wish death upon others or can’t control their turrets level attacks. They aren’t here to argue differences but to troll. In order to make sure that there is no confusion, I think it is impressive that Susan and Larry will talk with them. If it were my blog, I’d probably not do that because I’m not getting paid to listen to drivel. They aren’t getting paid either.

It is my request of you and all others to respect Susan because trust me her tolerance for comments around here is much greater than anyone might imagine.

“What do you say in these contacts?”
I’ve seen them encourage dialogue even when intense. Sometimes it is to let them know that their comments keep showing up as Spam and they are trying to figure out why. It isn’t always punitive in nature.

Judy L. NC

Now THAT was helpful, TT.
My Name is Red

TT,

First of all, I’ve got to say I appreciate the fact that you are willing to respond to people in a serious and respectful manner. I understand the issue you explain about spam, but with all due respect, that doesn’t address my other question about why Susan felt the “need” to contact Bazooka directly. As I said, the record makes it appear that her “need” was based on the mere fact that he disagreed with her, even though he did it in the most mild way possible.

Your openness stands in stark contrast to Susan, the apparent boss of this blog, who does not practice your level of transparency. It has nothing to do with politics to say that if she’s going to announce that people’s comments can earn them an email from an administrator, and she’s going to name people who have been slapped with moderation, then it’s just common sense and common courtesy to give the details of what set her off.

I’ll try one more time: Susan, what was it that Bazooka said that you couldn’t let pass?

And I’ll be up front in case any administrators haven’t noticed: I use a made-up email to access commenting here. I do that for these reasons:

1) Using my valid email would give my identity to anyone with NQ administrative privileges.

2) Most of the people with NQ administrative privileges–including Susan–do not disclose their identities here.

3) As you have just demonstrated, TT, there are people who appear to be just outside commenters, but who actually have administrative privileges that are well-kept secrets.

4) There are some angry acknowledged administrators here, and some very angry commenters who might also be administrators. I’m not going to take the chance that one of them might use their access to my email–and by extension, my life–to express his or her hostility towards me in more concrete ways than just posting insults here. As Susan admits in the above article, she sometimes has trouble with people coming here and disagreeing with her, and I wouldn’t want her to start emailing me–or worse–just because she doesn’t like the way I think.

My approach to NQ is this: it’s a place to say what I want to say, and what I say here stays here. If there are any administrators out there who can’t abide not being able to follow me back to my house–figuratively and literally, then you can just keep on blocking the IDs I create.

Yes, “My Name Is Red” is not the first ID I’ve commented under. I’ve had others that stopped working. I don’t know why that happened, but it’s no skin off my back if was the work of an undercover administrator who wanted to keep my point of view off NQ. I just sign in with a new ID and keep talking.

I like discussing ideas and vigorous debate, and I like people who engage on an adult basis (like TT) instead of wanting me gone if I don’t agree with them. I’ll give Susan credit for paying lip service to tolerance with her new rules for commenting, but as I’ve pointed out, her actions towards Bazooka seem to call her commitment to open debate into question.

Again, I register with a fake email. If you don’t see “My Name Is Red” here any more, you’ll know there was a least one NQ insider who couldn’t abide even the tepid kind of criticisms I’ve just made.

Katmoon

It is a simple rule to follow, allowing the owners and site administrators access to your real e-mail, having nothing to do with discourse nor freedom of speech. In the end if anyone is booted it is because for whatever their reason is to not follow the simple request. I don’t assume anything, but have to wonder why not. I have never heard of anyone soliciting from this site(as in the owner and administrators), nor does our information travel in a mysterious way to anyone else. Too often(not saying this is you Red) there have been viruses, and problems created by those who could not follow this simple rule. So if anyone gets banned it is more than likely more important to have anonymity than to proceed as requested as a gueston this site. Perhaps just e-mailing to Susan to let her know your e-mail; this is not censorship it is a legal responsibility of websites and blogs. Please do not try to ring that bell of censorship of criticisms from NQ, it does not happen here.

My Name is Red

Too often(not saying this is you Red) there have been viruses, and problems created by those who could not follow this simple rule.

This sounds like you are an administrator, Katmoon. Are you?

See my point? NQ doesn’t disclose who has access to the email addresses of participants. There is NO stated privacy policy, and NO clear ownership of responsibility.

Perhaps just e-mailing to Susan to let her know your e-mail;

Let me repeat: Susan conceals her identity here, as do virtually all the other acknowledged and unacknowledged people with administrative access.
It’s simply a bad idea to send your personal information to anonymous strangers.

[requiring valid email] is a legal responsibility of websites and blogs.

No, it’s not. There’s a special federal law — sorry, can’t remember the name right now — that exempts website owners from responsibility for the content posted by unsupervised commenters. This law has repeatedly frustrated people who tried to sue over blog comments.

Please do not try to ring that bell of censorship of criticisms from NQ, it does not happen here.

Susan has admitted that it did in the past. I’ve seen it first hand. I criticized Larry over a false statement he made and said it was part of a pattern. Within a few minutes:
1)Larry’s article was edited to remove the false statement
2)My comment was deleted
3)I could no longer post comments

So please, don’t tell me critics don’t get censored here.

And the fact remains that today, Susan is saying she put someone on moderation when she couldn’t contact them about a comment, and the only thing that appears to be wrong with the person’s comment is that they gently disagreed with her.

That’s what is “happening here.”

Ferd Berfle

Your Name is Mudd:

This isn’t your website and how Larry chooses to run it is his business. You are an anal-retentive, control freak of a bot, aren’t you? Go lower the IQ of a more deserving website–like your own.

My Name is Red

Dear Ferd,

A) Susan invited the entire online world to discuss this particular topic. If you have a problem with me accepting that invitation, you should take it up with Susan.

B) It should have been pretty clear by now in this thread that Susan is the one trying to assert control on this issue and I’m the one objecting to it. Now that I’ve stated it explicitly, do you see it?

C) And as for telling me to leave, as you so often do instead of saying anything interesting, well…after you, my friend. After you.

Ferd Berfle

I have no problem with Susan, dingaling.

Your comments are bereft of any relevancy, Goober. If molehills were mountains, you might be onto something. They aren’t and you aren’t.

I like this website and will continue to come here. It is you who appears to be having a hissy-fit over nothing. Go away and stay away.

Katmoon

No, I am not an administrator, and honestly don’t understand your upset.

My Name is Red

I’m not upset. Susan was Susan. I said my piece. Truthtelling chimed in with something constructive. You didn’t understand what I said. And Ferd was Ferd.

JADINQ (just another day in NQ)

Ferd Berfle

You didn’t understand what I said. And Ferd was Ferd.

And you are a troll. You have worked yourself up into a foamy lather over a tempest in a teapot. You’re frothing at the mouth over a mountain that is a mere molehill.

Bah. Enough of your melodrama.

My Name is Red

Enough of your melodrama.

You keep proving you can’t get enough of me.

You wish you knew how to quit me, you little stalker.

http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

That’s entirely individual — it depends on the person’s comments. Most often, it has to do with the first problem I discussed. Regardless, the note is polite and we always first ask for cooperation.

Katmoon

Everyone had a piece to say, we cannot see or hear the intent, all we have are the written words. I got the impression you were upset, I think this is the problem, perception, and agreement or lack thereof.

My Name is Red

No hard feelings, KM. It’s a pleasure just to have a polite exchange. That doesn’t happen much here, and it’s not unique to NQ. As you say, text messaging doesn’t have the visual and auditory cues that help make face-to-face communication clear.