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Criticizing America: “Don’t Bite the Hand That Feeds You”

By Old Grumpy Guy on February 18, 2009 at 3:10 PM in Congress (House & Senate), Current Affairs, Nancy Pelosi, OldGrumpyGuy, Open Thread

This recording was apparently unearthed in Australia. Written in 1915, with words by Thomas Hoier and music by Jimmie Morgan, it was recorded in 1929, the year that saw the start of the Great Depression.

It raises some interesting questions, particularly for someone like me who arrived on these shores rather late in life. One of the questions is: Just when is it okay for an immigrant to point out some of the things he or she might not like about this country – the great melting pot of immigrants who arrived here from all over the world?

And what is the difference between constructive criticism and destructive criticism?

I admire America more than any other country for its hard working citizens, its open-heartedness and the core values enshrined in the Constitution (something that Britain still does not have). I believe it remains the freest and most democratic country in the world.

But, as in any society, there are inevitably aspects that can be improved. And as someone who perhaps takes a slightly more objective view of the situation than someone who was born and raised in America, should I be pointing out the faults I see?

Am I biting the hand that feeds me if I say, for example, that in my view Congress is a very sick entity, led by inept people like Nancy Pelosi and corrupt people like Barney Frank?

It would be interesting to get some perspectives from NQ readers and writers on the whole subject of criticizing America, along with the views of different individuals about what’s right and what’s wrong in America right now (apart from the new government).

  • obamastolemyboyfriend

    Our Government has become a joke and it has been this way for a while. The Government is supposed to do what is best for the majority of the people they serve and at some point instead took a What’s in it for me policy. Our country could be and should be great, but we have allowed the people we elect to forget that they work for us! They are supposed to do what we say and not the other way around.

    America will be great again when we storm the Capital and drag these mentally ill felons out of the chambers by their shirtcollars and start electing leaders whose goal is to serve the United States of America and all of it’s people, regardless if race, gender, age, or political party!

    • Old Grumpy Guy

      I have to agree with that.

    • Astra14

      (APPLAUSE!)

      I totally agree with you!

      • http://noquarter foxyladi14

        standing cheering and clapping..right on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • tango

      The fault for crappy legislators falls to the people who elect them. So many act like they don’t know what their elected officals are doing, but they do, they just choose to ignore it or hope it will change. Come on, if for once the voters would remember at voting time that the evil they have known for years is NOT better than the evil they don’t know and actually vote some new blood in, then we will have the government we deserve. And then we need to vote out a person as soon as it becomes obvious they are not representing our interests rather then giving them chance after chance. Watch and note behavior, not words.

      Funny how we say the Senate and Congress is not doing what we want them to do but when it comes time to prove that it’s not acceptable, we vote to leave the same old crooks in office. We have taught them how to treat us then complain when they do the job too well.

      • Old Grumpy Guy

        It’s amazing how someone as inept and unethical as Barney Frank not only continues to get elected, but retains his position as leader of the finance committee.

        • destardi

          Well..IMHO, and this will be labeled as “racist” or “homophobic”, because people are stupid these days, but there are certain protected statuses that help to immunize people in all sorts of positions, across the country. What once had its place in our society, this protection of minority classes, has crept into our collective conscience and caused us to be so sensitive, ridiculously so, and walk on eggshells around others so we don’t offend.

          I’m tired of it. I’m one of the “minorities”, but enough is enough. A person ought to be judged on their actions, not ONE THING MORE.

          • Ellen D

            I agree, I’m sick of these sacred cows. And I don’t feel like having any more “conversations” about race. I also think this is a great country – I’m also a late immigrant with a British-type background.
            I think you can go ahead and say what you please OGG – you earned it – you live here. It would be different if it came from someone outside the country.

            • Magic Puzzle Box

              I do a lot of volunteer work among the local immigrant community, and I have to say, most of them are far more pro-America than many Americans are. So I have no problem with them complaining about corruption or Pelosi or what have you. That actually makes them sound more American. Some come from countries where you can’t criticize your government without serious repercussions. In fact, one woman recently complained to me that a local school she went to didn’t have students say the pledge of allegiance.

              What would bother me, however, is Ayers-style America bashing. That is, criticizing America as a symbol, American exceptionalism to some degree, democracy, even overarching American values like belief in merit and hard work. It’s kind of funny where this has led me. Although I don’t like Geert Wilders, I really agree with him more than I expected in the wake of his hate speech charges.

        • tango

          Exactly. Now maybe he represents his voters quite well but then again, maybe many who vote for him just vote the party line and equate one Democrat with another. As we have learned, just because you have a “D” or “R” behind your name doesn’t mean you always tow the party line.

          Also, it is set up that only those with tenure in the house and Senate have any real power because of their committee assignments, etc. Sometimes I think voters keep reelecting them because of their supposed power and how they feel it would benefit their state or local area better verses someone new at the bottom of the food chain. So they sacrifice because they feel it’s better on the whole. But who knows.

    • anon

      I’ve been profoundly proud of the House Republicans even though I was until last June a democrat. They stood up against GWB on the bailout (at least initially and never folded completely) and the stood firm against the porkulus. Let’s not drag them out by the collar just yet!

  • raGing

    I’m good with it, Grumpy. My relatives spoke with funny accents, but I never considered them less than American. they’re the ones who made this country a better place to live. they would be very dissapointed to see where it’s going. Granny paid for her home/mom&pop store twice due to the Great Depression. She would laugh at these wimps who get in over their heads & want Gov assistance.

  • Peggy Sue

    Since you’re living in the States [I'm assuming that's the case from your post] then you’re enjoying the benefits and suffering the flaws. Along with the rest of us!

    I think there is a difference in constructive criticism and tearing down. I’m often distressed at things I read [on other boards] where the United States is portrayed as the worst of the worst, the creator of all ills of the world. Lots of America hating going on anymore.

    But criticizing foolish political moves, the greed and lack of integrity that motivated and moved the Shakers of Wall Street, and the less than sterling performance of our Congressional Reps? Well, that’s just being American. I think protest and dessent is as American as apple pie. We fully enjoy our freedom of speech! And when that speech is focused and well-aimed, we can change things. Because words do matter.

    I’m a patriot. And I make no apology because I know for a fact I’m living in the greatest social experiment that the world has ever seen. And I want the country to live up to its best promise, its finest expectations: a nation where we can live under just laws with our basic human freedoms intact and have the opportunity to become what we wish to become as individuals. But we have a contract together. And to make it work, we have to believe that it can and will work and continue to flourish.

    God knows, the United States has made mistakes. But so has every other country/nation throughout the history of the world. And as Americans, we do strive to do the right thing, even when our government may fall short.

    So, as long as the howling is always striving to improve, rather than tear down and/or destroy, I say bring it on. We’re striving towards a more perfect union. We’re not there yet. But we continue to push.

    • Old Grumpy Guy

      Yes America has made a lot of mistakes (like all the best countries) but it has got a lot right, and in my view is the best country to live in.

    • destardi

      I’m right there beside Peggy on this one; I couldn’t have said it any better.

      And FYI, criticizing the GOVERNMENT, is NOT the same as criticizing the country.

      IMHO

      heh

  • Rob G in Chicago

    A few hundred years ago, Brits came across the “pond”, settled here, and most of them criticized the ruling government. That criticism led to the American Revolution; generally recognized as a favorable development (or favourable, if you wish), so go ahead and criticize, Old Grumpy Guy. :)

    • obamaphobe

      A New Revolution against the New, New Deal. Things that make you go HMMMM.

    • oowawa

      A few hundred years ago, Brits came across the “pond”, settled here, and most of them criticized the ruling government.

      Yep, and the Brits back home could have sung exactly the same song to their naughty brethren over in the colonies, except they would have to change “Uncle Sammie” to “King Georgie” or whatever.

  • lark

    should I be pointing out the faults I see?

    Absolutely. You can criticize America all you want when you sincerely find fault with anything that will impinge or modify our future way of life.

    You shouldn’t criticize what has been our history or ways in which we became what we presently are, because there is no way that anyone can change what they are or how they have become who they are. That doesn’t mean that you can’t comment on it (historical issues) or have an opinion about them; if it was right or wrong that we have done things in a certain way. You can say your opinions, but not to criticize as if we could have done it differently because we couldn’t have done it differently.

    Take for example, Hillary. People here are almost incapable of criticizing her. But doesn’t it seems that she’s a joke. Just as much of a joke as the administration she became a part off.

    What’s wrong is for a foreigner not to criticize America when they see its shortcomings. To love our country means to want our country to be a better country.

    That’s why the MSM failed us. They refrain from criticizing The One and now we have him for President. We are screwed.

    Criticize what we are but not who we are. We are a bunch of imbeciles, but good imbeciles, that mean good, and like to help others get ahead.

  • bert

    Strictly and technically speaking from the first second an immigrant arrives and/or becomes a citizen in America, under the First Amendment to the Constitution they enjoy freedom of speech. So they can say what ever they want. It is their right and for many that was one of the reasons they came to America. That and freedom in general and economic opportunity.

    However, I have never known an immigrant, starting with my own grandmother and grandfather, who was not openly and strongly pro-America and who often stated how much they appreciated and loved this great land.

    As to what is right and wrong in America today, I think there is still more good than bad. We still have freedom of speech and freedom to worship as we wish. Most of us still have more food to eat than we need to stay alive. Many people in the world are starving. Most of us have a roof over our heads. Lots of people in the world, and some here, do not.

    Money and jobs are a real problem right now. But still, more people have jobs and income than those who do not.

    While I am upset that for the last eight years torture was condoned, and unhappy that Obama has not been stronger on this, most of us do not have to fear torture as many in other places do.

    I know I have, and I think most others do, lots of friends for companionship and comfort. That is a blessing. And most American are a loving, caring, generous sort. No matter what happens, my friendships will endure. And we will help each other if needed.

    I prefer to live in a state of gratefulness. So on whole; I am blessed to be an American despite not always agreeing with what my elected representatives do.

    I don’t think it gets much better than that.

    • Old Grumpy Guy

      You always have a good perspective on things bert.

  • athena

    Well I am the sort that gets a lump in my throat everytime I hear The Star Spangled Banner being played! Everytime…. Although I know we are not a perfect country or a perfect citizenry. We are damn near it! I hate seeing THE CHANGE that is coming to our country. I only hope my worst fears are just fears and not realities. But more than HOPE I am going to stand up and oppose all that I do not agree with in this new administration with everything that I have….

  • cheech (or maybe chong)

    I’m disappointed with my country at present. One of my disappointments has to do with the extreme negativity in some quarters concerning Barack Obama, the democratic leadership in general, and anyone who is generally inclined to support their efforts.

    Healthy criticism is one thing. Demonizaton is quite another. It’s of no useful purpose, except to those who want to encourage rising levels of partisan anger and division.

    I fail to see how anyone wanting that can have the good of the nation at heart. Particularly when we have so many common problems.

    • Ferd Berfle

      I’m disappointed with my country at present.

      If you really thought unity was a great thing, you would not have supported That One who is as divisive as Bush ever was. In fact, Bush was a piker, comparatively speaking, in the realm of division.

      • truthorconsequences

        A man or woman who turns his/her back on our AMERICAN flag has already turned his/her back on our America.

        • cheech (or maybe chong)

          My reality does not consist entirely of an assemblage of carefully selected, out of context media moments.

    • http://firefox AnnieCollier

      Freedom doesn’t come from “go along to get along.”

    • gonzotx

      Have another toke on that pipe and you won’t be so disappointed in those that wanted someone who actually could do the job.

    • Magic Puzzle Box

      Would you be referring to the striking unity of the past 8 years? I have yet to hear any demonization in the past few months since the new administration took over. Only rational criticism.

  • http://firefox AnnieCollier

    Well I am the sort that gets a lump in my throat everytime I hear The Star Spangled Banner being played! Everytime…

    I am too athena. All my ancestors came over from England early and were part of the Revolution. Even though they settled in the South and found themselves in the way of Sherman’s army, they have always been 150% in love with America. Throughout WWII and afterward, they were the most staunch patriots. They were shocked that I protested VietNam. I, however, consider it my patriotic duty to criticize a temporary government, guided by wrong-headed politics that gone against our national principles. I protest what has happened today for the same reasons.

    • http://firefox AnnieCollier

      that have gone…

  • truthorconsequences

    Speaking the truth isn’t being critical, it’s being realistic. Truth seems to be something the American “government” CAN’T handle anymore and that in a nutshell is what is wrong with America today and we have become a nation in decline for that reason.

  • The Real HC

    America wasn’t supposed to feed you. You were supposed to be able to come here and work and be free from the excesses of government and mob rule.

    Thats what America WAS all about. Not so much now.

    We are still free to express our discontent. Citizens can even vote to change things. I say exercise these rights as often as you like. Its how the system is designed.

    The US Government isnt going to fall because of excessive complaining. It may fall because of excessive complacency.

  • http://noquarter foxyladi14

    i love my country i am proud of her and all her children.there are no finer people anywhere.
    it,s the corrupt people in government we are complaining about.
    fire them all and start over with some real americans..

  • I’m a Linda too

    You live here, you work here, you are affected by what this country does. Of course you should speak up. That is after all what we are founded on, our rights. But most of all, we all learn and should be eager to hear others experiences and points of view.

    What a great country if we could take the best ideas from all the other places learned and hard fought and enacted them here in the place called America. … oh wait. :)

    • I’m a Linda too

      btw, that does not limit to us only who live here either. What kind of place would this “free” country be if we declared our visitors no right to speak their mind?

  • Linda C.

    During 1915 through 1929, immigrants were in deplorable conditions in this country. Therefore, the song was in a way of saying shut up, be thankful for the crumbs while huddling in squalor tenements.

    Americans don’t like to admit that we can be wrong and we in differing periods in our history treat our fellow citizens and people less than what decency should minimally dictate.

    • http://firefox AnnieCollier

      That may be a bit revisionist, Linda. What the song says it be thankful that you came here and have opportunity to become more and have a better life.

      Do you think that any immigrant in the early days, had a better life where ever he came from? No they didn’t and not only that, they had no way to rise through society for anything better. There was no middle class and you were either rich or poor. Landed gentry or serf. Very few were able to affect change. That’s the difference.

      And, no I don’t think visitors should come here and criticize us. From their own shores, fine. I would never think of being so crass or rude as to go to England and criticize the Queen even if many Brits do. Once you are a citizen though, we are always free to criticize our own.

      • anon

        Annie, with respect to exercising good manners, I completely agree. Being a guest somewhere and all…

  • Choo Choo Magoo

    I’m thinking the world wide mess we’ve started kind of blew the doors off alot of countries, so we’ve got to expect a bit of blowback. Fair is fair.

  • anon

    I and my siblings are first generation here in the USA. My parents fled what became a part of the Soviet Union after 1949. The depth and richness of our liberties and our freedom to create our own wealth through our own hard work were the two pillars my parents revered. Their love of their new country was born of gratitude and devotion.

    I studied law and the two technical pillars of federalism (state sovereignty) and separation of powers are what I revere because all that is good, just and true about this great country evolve from those two principles taken together.

    Free speech is sacrosanct (Congress shall pass no law abridging the freedom of speech). One man’s rant is another’s criticism, it is for the listeners to discern but not for government to silence. When we keep our guiding principles before us, our ship of state maintains a fruitful course. I’ve wondered if incoming members of Congress and other appointees ought not be given a basic Constitutional Law 101 refresher. Men and women of good heart would welcome it and be well served by it in their duties. Heck, everyone would be.

  • Robert J.

    Most of the problem falls on the Goverment. They give, free food, free housing, free medical, free education and free money to a lot of immigrants (but you must be a Illegal immigrant). You can’t be a US Citizen to get it. The money they get it more then you get on SS. I would like to know how I can turn my citizenship in. And becoming a Illegal Immigrant so I can get the freebees, Insteed of having to work for the last 35 years paying my taxes, paying into SSI (unlike congressmen or senators who do not have to pay to get full benefits)

  • Sander

    Some hypocrites up in here. Freedom of speech should be without boundaries. That’s what the freedom-part implies. So criticizing all the ails America suffers from (and there are a lot) should be a basic freedom, be it past or present ails.