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Debate, you wuss! (+ Wide Open Thread)

By SusanUnPC on February 13, 2008 at 11:04 PM in Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Nuclear weapons

Via Truthteller2007:

Debates are not debatable.

What else is going on in the world? Btw, Jonathan Schell of The Nation was on Charlie Rose re nuclear proliferation.

  • John Witherspoon

    Attack attack! we’re losing!

    • Banquo’s Ghost

      Notice how the Clinton campaign is now trying to distract from this losing streak by changing the frame in people’s perception to be “all that matters is Texas”?

      This way, they can lose 15 states in a row, but try to spin it as “all that matters is Texas” as they try to convince the elite party insiders to hand them the election. Think sweetheart deals and buyouts and all that. Creepy, dirty, politics as usual.

      But, hey, they’re from Washington DC. What else would you expect?

      • Nathan

        Gosh, a politician who’s trying to win an election! Someone call the authorities!

    • CK

      That is the guaranteed way to tell if a candidate thinks they are losing ground. They demand more debates. Debates = free exposure. Candidates who think they are pulling ahead see no benefit in giving opponents exposure. It has been ever thus. In the presidential, McCain will be weaseling for more debates. Three or six or a dozen debates are not enough when you think the brass ring is slipping away. When you think the brass ring is within your grasp one debate is too many.

  • http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

    Finally got a chance to check the Seattle newspapers. Here are a couple interesting tidbits:

    1) Yahoo in talks with News Corp.
    Yahoo is discussing a possible partnership in its latest effort to repel Microsoft or prod it into raising its current takeover bid, sources say.
    – Please, not News Corp, Yahoo. Please.

    2) Remember Mike McKay, the Seattle U.S. attorney made famous when Gonzales got rid of him for not investigating the 2004 Washington state gubernatorial election (because McKay found no evidence of any wrongdoing)?

    The Seattle Port Commission voted Tuesday to hire former U.S. Attorney Mike McKay to run its investigation of possible fraud and wrongdoing in Port construction projects.
    Full story. (McKay should do a great job, I would think. The Seattle Port is accused of a lot of corruption — I haven’t followed it closely, but recall that they’ve blown millions of taxpayers’ money on various sweetheart deals, and padding their own wallets.

    • TeakWoodKite

      SusanUnPC: it sounds like “On the Waterfront”

      I do hope you are on the mend. I keep good thought going your way.

  • http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

    Arrogant:

    After touring a General Motors plant in Janesville, Wisconsin, Sen. Barack Obama delivered a speech on the economy that he said is on the “brink of a recession.”

    The senator told GM workers to bear with him as he gave a more policy oriented speech. Opponents have accused Obama of delivering speeches short on details and long on rhetoric.

    “Today I want to take it down a notch,” he said, saying his speech would be, “is a little more detailed, a little longer, with not as many applause lines.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/13/obama-i-want-to-take-it_n_86555.html

    • CK

      Here’s his speech:
      http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/samgrahamfelsen/Cmzm
      son of a gun stole a whole bunch of Ron Paul’s economic proposals.
      Tax cuts for seniors, tax cuts for the middle class, tax credits for schooling, tax penalties for companies that profit from NAFTA.
      Not much on the failed war on drugs or the savings attainable by bringing the troops home from the middle east, korea, germany, etc etc.
      I do hope the speech sounded better than it read. Pure Gorean wonkery of a speech as written.

      • TeakWoodKite

        Pure Gorean wonkery-

        Got to (not) wonder where they would find a speech writer with such a speciality.
        Yikes!

  • John Witherspoon

    aren’t you one of those people that have accused “Obama of delivering speeches short on details and long on rhetoric.”

    You should be happy!

    • http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

      I covered his speech below — the post about him “borrowing” from Clinton’s plans that were presented far sooner.

      • Banquo’s Ghost

        Susan, you can’t even cover your own derriere in a political argument, yet alone someone’s speech. Come on already.

        • chris

          Banquo, and you think your faux witty retorts would impress Socrates with your syllogistic prowess?

        • TeakWoodKite

          “Prithee, see there! behold! look! lo! how say you?/Why, what care I? If thou canst nod, speak too”

          • John Witherspoon

            the difference being, shakespeare actually makes sense…

  • Jacek

    My question is…is he a 3/5 of a wuss (because he agreed to 2 of 5 debates)? Or, less? How many more or less debates do you need to do before you are not a wuss? 4? 8? Does he need to agree to every debate demanded before he is not a wuss? What are the threshold requirements for being a wuss?

    • John Witherspoon

      also, would he be less of a wuss if he cried publicly before the next contest?

      • TeakWoodKite

        Yes.

      • Mike Howell

        Urkle?

      • Banquo’s Ghost

        No, no, you misunderstand. A woman is allowed to play the victim card whenever she wants. Men have to meet higher standards of visibly demonstrated toughness and resolve. Women in races for the presidency, on the other hand, are rewarded for crying under pressure.

        It’s just psychology, nothing else.

        • Mike Howell

          Banquo’s Ghost –

          You sure are intimidated by women. It is psychology. And maybe they can help you work out your many issues with women.

        • chris

          What the hell are you talking about “crying under pressure’?

          You and others refer to a moment when Hillary Clinton “choked up”. If you have simply decided to play the right wing talking point game without checking your context, just say so. But there was context to that “choke up”. It came from the context of why run in the first place. Mrs. Clinton said because there’s a lot on the line, and she was reflecting on the opportunities people have in this country. To me it seemed she was humbled by opportunity and that it meant a lot.

          But every cynical stab at that moment comes off like Sour Grapes when I have not read anyone keep the context of the conversation. And if you think showing that sort of emotion is weakness, then you my friend are full of shit. If you think she faked it, fine you might be right. But being human in the face of history can be powerful and tears don’t always reflect weakness bubba.

          This is more of the same old sexism that has brought us to this volatile point. “A WOMAN IS ALLOWED TO PLAY THE VICTIM”

          No bucko, Women have been, and continue to be victims of this bullshit macho world. And if they don’t act Macho enough, they are called weak for not fighting like Men.

          So pipe up about “its just psychology, nothing else” when you show so little understanding of the psychology of the players in this game.

          Its not hard to be a cynic, a critic, or a smack talker. Raise your level of snipes.

          • John Witherspoon

            Ok, Turbo. You can claim that women are all poor little helpless victims, but:
            a) You’re the sexist.
            and
            b) Who here wants a victim for president? Last I checked any prez, man or woman, is still the commander in chief and head of state. I personally really want someone who repeatedly publicly cries under pressure!

            • chris

              I don’t know what you are sipping, but I am not claiming that “women are all poor little helpless victims” jackass.

              And you continue a false smear about “cries under pressure”. Ready to cite some events, or are you going to just follow talking points?

              And your current commander in chief cried when moved, the last one did, the one before that…what the hell are you talking about crying under pressure numbnuts.

              Yes, I am a sexist. I was raised by very strong women who dealt with lots of bullshit from the men in their lives. Yep, I’m a sexist, I still hold a door open…for either sex. Yep, I’m a sexist, I want to vote for a woman to have a different leadership than 43 men have provided us.

              Yep, I’m a goddamn sexist for believing that women still live in a world of glass ceilings, executions for looking at young men that they fancy. Yep, I’m a sexist for seeing that the standards for women are still different than that of men.

              The fact that I support laws that would protect a woman’s right to choose what happens in her body no matter what others tell her, makes me a terrible sexist.

              But John, don’t stuff words in peoples mouths then argue with your own words.
              “Poor Little Helpless Victims?….your words turbo

              • John Witherspoon

                either women are equal or they aren’t. You can’t pick and choose which parts they are equal in and which they aren’t. Otherwise you are stating that there is an inherent difference between men and women. Your whole post is about why you feel you need to protect women. Why not protect men? Essentially your argument continually refutes itself. You are arguing for equality for women because they are victims that need your manly protection. How is that not misogyny?

                • chris

                  You cannot be that dense.
                  Women are “equal” and that can be affected by not treating them as equal.
                  Are you going to manufacture some bullshit here?
                  If the general populous does not treat a class of people as equals, they will not receive the equal opportunities.

                  You also assume facts not in play in the comment about what else I support, or what else I could of, and didn’t need to write.

                  I didn’t “pick and chose” areas where women were equal and not, I start from the premise that women are equal to men and that the society around us isn’t acting in accordance with this.

                  You really need to go study that “projection” you are fixated on, because you are the one projecting bucko.

                  And your comments about “need your manly protection” is more of your own character imposed where you want to.

                  You can do better than flame bait can’t ya John Witherspoon?

                  What you haven’t figured into the equation is that I’m pissed off about how my partner, my daughter, and other women in my life are being treated compared to the view of the world we are sharing. I’m sick of those who wish to pretend that sexism and racism are things of the past while I watch it play out every single day in front of me.

                  So, Mr. I’m Gonna Show How Much Your Shit Stinks, what additional take do you wish to rabbit hole? Flame bait is what you are doing, not creating a substantive argument about sexism.

                  • John Witherspoon

                    funny how you fail entirely to address my argument at all. You make a series of nonsense statements:

                    “Women are “equal” and that can be affected by not treating them as equal.”
                    (categorically impossible)
                    “You also assume facts not in play in the comment about what else I support, or what else I could of, and didn’t need to write.”
                    (just complete nonsense. also run on sentence)
                    “I start from the premise that women are equal to men and that the society around us isn’t acting in accordance with this.”
                    (who cares what society does, they are immutably equal or not.)
                    “You really need to go study that “projection” you are fixated on, because you are the one projecting bucko.”
                    (I never said “projection”)
                    “What you haven’t figured into the equation is that I’m pissed off about how my partner, my daughter, and other women in my life are being treated compared to the view of the world we are sharing. I’m sick of those who wish to pretend that sexism and racism are things of the past while I watch it play out every single day in front of me.”
                    (and you conclude that women in your life need your protection)
                    “So, Mr. I’m Gonna Show How Much Your Shit Stinks, what additional take do you wish to rabbit hole? Flame bait is what you are doing,”
                    (really, you should take a remedial english class!)
                    “not creating a substantive argument about sexism.”
                    (And after blathering on and making no argument or sense for a few paragraphs, you arbitrarily conclude that i’m somehow not making an argument)

                    • chris

                      JOHN WITHERSPOON:
                      ” You are arguing for equality for women because they are victims that need your manly protection”

                      RESPONSE:
                      “You really need to go study that “projection” you are fixated on, because you are the one projecting bucko.”

                      JOHN WITHERSPOON
                      (I never said “projection”)

                      You really need to slow down turbo, you’re blowing your circuits.

                    • John Witherspoon

                      How do you type if you are illiterate? Seriously, its amazing! Lets take another look:
                      ” You are arguing for equality for women because they are victims that need your manly protection”

                      “You really need to go study that “projection” you are fixated on, because you are the one projecting bucko.”
                      You seriously cant see the difference?
                      (hint T and J are not the same letter!)

                    • John Witherspoon

                      Eh? No Pithy (and Idiotic) response? wassa matter? your pussy swallow your balls?

                    • chris

                      no nimrod, YOU ARE PROJECTING YOUR BULLSHIT. You are Projecting that I believe someone needs my “manly protection”. That is your bullshit. You are making up characterizations of people to play a little game. You are asserting your inner problems on others and I can see it as clear as can be.

                      Are you so petty that you are going to play syntax games instead of forming a coherent position on your supposed fascination with “wuss” “pussy swallow your balls”? or is that your best game.

        • TeakWoodKite

          A woman is allowed to play the victim card whenever she wants

          It’s just psychology,
          no it is just a cultural stereotype.

        • Nathan

          Tell me again: when did actually cry? Video please because the two incidents where it seemed “men” like you were so hyper-sensitive that you screamed, “The horror! The horror!” were NH when she never cried, just got a bit choked up and at Yale where she didn’t drop so much as a tear when her mentor from decades back talked about how proud he was of her and he cried a bit.

          And knock it off with the “victim” card. Calling for more debates is standard during an election. That you would go so far to inject your paranoia into it is a reflection of you and the other who you replied to. If you have a problem with it, argue it on the issues.

  • ybnormal

    The State of Health Care

    My co-workers and I all work for a company which is probably in the better end of the health care plan spectrum as most jobs go. Nevertheless, each year brings a new “re-negotiated” plan. I have a feeling we’re not the exception to the rule.

    Here’s a quote (identifying information [deleted] for obvious reasons) from one co-workers’s email to the rest in our workgroup. He’s referring to the “discount” quantity drug pre-purchase program. This particular person had accumulated a complex set of health problems lately.

    I just ordered refills for my prescriptions for the first time this year and the total came to $400. They caught me by surprise and automatically billed my credit card. I can’t afford $400 every 3 months so I won’t be ordering any more refills. It is amazing how bad the Health Care system has become. The presidential debates speak of trying to get Health insurance for the masses but apparently they don’t realize that even if they GAVE everyone in the USA FREE medical insurance then only the very wealthy will be able to afford the C0-PAYMENTS. Healthcare costs have risen so high that it seems insurance is useless.

    Has anyone else experienced this problem with the new [hmo name] rate increases?

    Then our boss replies:

    How many scripts did you fill ?
    Brand or generic?
    How much did it used to be ?
    Did you confirm if they charged you correctly?

    Answer:

    5 scripts
    4 brand name 1 generic
    It used to be about $100.
    I did call verify that the price is correct per the newly implemented plan

    Well, I have enjoyed a nice couple of years of medicated good health but now I’ll just have to return to the suffering life prior to good insurance. The only choice is to keep the blood pressure medicine and give up the medicines for: Acid reflux, cholesterol, arthritis, nasal blockage, asthma, and urology.

    On top of this, the new “re-negotiated” life/disability plan has benefit exceptions for death by either stroke or heart attack. What the FUCK are we supposed to SAFELY die from so our families survive?

    Anyone else looking for a good job with good “benefits”?

    • GR3

      Just changed health insurance companies myself. The rates went up 17.5% at the beginning of the year, of course.
      Discovered a generic for acid reflux (ranitidine) that is also in a Pepcid product.
      Trying supplements like polycosanol, red yeast rice, and omega 3 for cholesterol instead of expensive statin drugs. (And I can drink more than 3 beers a week!)
      Whether it’s advice from a good specialist or online info from many sources, Americans are going to have to discover health benefits beyond medical insurance.
      Anyone else trying to lose weight???

      • CK

        GR3
        You might wish to avoid any intake of High Fructose Corn Syrup. Nasty shit that stuff is. Screws up the body’s signalling mechanism. Your body doesn’t know it is sated.
        Probably help with your acid reflux issue and your desire to lose weight.
        You might also wish to substitute a good single malt scotch for your beers.
        If you are using a butter substitute, dump it before it kills you.

  • John Witherspoon

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/14/us/politics/14delegates.html?ref=politics

    Obama is ahead in delegates and hillary is basically in a position where she has to either sweep every other state or rely on superdelegates to win. I assume any liberal in here thought it was BS that gore won the popular vote but lost the EC. Will you cry foul if hillary wins by extra-democratic means?

    • TeakWoodKite

      No.

    • GR3

      Obama and Clinton will have to get superdelegate votes to win. It’s not a winner-take-all setup in most states. And with Senators Kerry and Kennedy in MA as examples, the superdelegates won’t all be following their state’s primary results.
      Personally, I thought it was BS that Florida’s electoral votes were stolen for W by his brother’s administration. Sounded too much like a third world scenario to believe at the time… And how many calls for eliminating the electoral college were there in 2001?
      Anyone tired of the anti-Obama all the time crap should check out the Brad Blog. You will find interesting items beyond the latest political screeds.

    • ybnormal

      “I assume any liberal in here thought it was BS that gore won the popular vote but lost the EC.”

      For the record, Gore did not lose the Electoral College. What Gore lost was 5/9′s of the Supreme Court.

      Check back in the news archives. Look for something done by a consortium of news organizations, but ironically under-reported. They sponsered a full recount of all the Florida ballots. What they found was that by any standard of ballot counting, Gore won!

      What this means is that if the Supreme Court had chosen not to intervene with their own decision, and instead authorized a full ballot count, then Gore would have been president.

      So did Justice David Souter cry, or didn’t he? He might as well have.

    • Banquo’s Ghost

      No, they won’t cry “foul”. They don’t care about anything except their “side” winning. These people are not thinking people, for the most part. They are a crowd at a football game, and they’re has been a lot of beer sold.

      • Hope

        Wow Ghost how erudite!

        • John Witherspoon

          whereas you my contrast….

          i fail to see the point of all these “wow how blah blah blah” posts. are you trying to exemplify the fact that you have nothing to add?

      • chris

        you sure project yourself all over people.

        My side isn’t even in the game bubba. I want honest campaigning and it isn’t happening. I have every damn right to gripe about the process by which this country king and queen makes.

        Nice again how you have to build characteristics of your ideologically different citizens in order to elevate yourself as a superior political beast. Too bad that is all it is, a characterization.

        I won’t cry foul if a campaign does like Gore’s and spends its time fighting windmills (Nader in 2000) instead of real threats (Bush in 2000).

        Interesting when people started to question Obama’s record, the attack dogs had to come and make sure that shit wasn’t gonna fly. And you are different than your Characterizations of Clinton supporters?

        Nothing worse than a hypocrite, Democrat or Republican, Libertarian or AnarchoSyndicalist.

        I’ve been clear with the Obama and Clinton camps that I won’t vote for them in the primaries if they cannot respond to the fanatics of their base. Obama’s fanatics have been about as looney as the Alex Jones/Paul fanatics when they hit the net.

        If you think criticizing Obama’s positions, and history are the same as the smears on Clinton’s advocates, you’ve got bigger issues than this election. I can handle people who say they truly are scared of Hillary Clinton becoming the candidate. I have heard all about her record, including the outright fabrications.

        (FOR THE RECORD)
        it isn’t impossible to go to the Thomas archive to see what these people spend their time voting on. but if you just want to follow talking points: (hasn’t authored any major legislation), go for it. I cannot stop you from making shit up and treating it like its real. But I read the archives, and the bills. Better hit the archive again before stating that HRC hasn’t authored any major legislation.

        Your insults don’t change me a damn bit. I can tell who you are by your insult, and you can judge me by mine. I hold your posts in contempt for their ignorance of what many have actually been saying here instead of your reframing of their comments. Pick and poke for the parses you need to complete your perfect vision of your political wet dream.

  • Alien

    Obama stated after iowa-’we will repair the country,we will repair the world ‘ or similar. No No No We dont want a preacher boy preachin to us. We are not like you.

  • Banquo’s Ghost

    So let me get this straight. Emasculating a man (“you wuss”!) is OK, but if a man so much as makes the vaguest comment (“pimping”) pertaining to a woman, then he is a “sexist”?

    Susan, I find you to be vacuous and hypocritical, in this regard, and, to be blunt, vacuous in a larger regard. You accuse Obama supporters (I am barely one of these, barely at all) of being “cultists” while operating a web site that makes the Scientologists look calm and balanced in comparison.

    It’s time to grow up, Susan. Obama and Clinton, it turns out, are not remarkably great candidates. A few ups and few little possible changes maybe is all that any would get out of either. The Clintons it also turns out have an absolutely atrocious history, one which supporters like you will never acknowledge or answer for because you are too weak and cowardly.

    This campaign season has been one of the worst I’ve seen, because, after 8 years of George Walker Bush, all we have is another tawdry horse race with the same chanting partisan crowd.

    You aren’t helping.

    Perhaps you should forgo your copy’n'paste addiction for a day, and spend a little time reflecting on the meaning of demagoguery. To make that completely clear (as if you could understand without help) I am saying that, with respect to demagoguery, things in this race are neither black nor white but both.

    Or are you too much of a “wuss” to consider that?

    • TeakWoodKite

      you are too weak and cowardly.

      WOW that took real manly man strength and courage to say.

    • Hope

      Hurry someone call an exorcist! Hurry get the crucifix!

      “An empty headed haunting heard
      Proclaiming prophecies absurd!”

    • chris

      yeah, i’m impressed. Funny, Susan and Larry run this blog, which is their constitutional right to do…and stupid jackasses come here and say, DON’T YOU DO THAT!!!

      You’re too much. LOL
      You know…they make decaffinated brands that taste just as much as the real thing.

      Look buddy, I don’t like the rediculous crap they post at DailyKoz, or FreeRepublic…so I don’t go there, and don’t post. WOW, what a freakin ingenious response to something I don’t like..I don’t go there.

      You must like bashing Susan and Larry. Gives you a sense of selfrighteousness. I love that feeling, selfrighteousness. It feeds my fevered ego on days that I must lash out at the world that I’ve grown to loathe.

      People who go to sites they hate and post their crap there…how are they the noble politically saavy brand that can demonstrate a better way or a better day?

      I happen to Like Obama’s speeches, and yet I’m suspicious of his past because I’ve been dealt a bad hand before…wow…how amazing that this could be. That my mind and heart aren’t in alignment. And yet, Banquo and others will just tell me what the right way will be. wow…so kind of them to make sure that as a Larry Johnson sychophant, I too can be purified and make sure that my mind is in line with the Movement.

      Or

      I can keep asking questions, raising concerns, and debating what matters to my family. I agree with Larry J that people act out of their own self interest and right now it is in my self interest to not be conned again by a charleton. THAT DOESN’T MAKE OBAMA a Charleton, it means I have to make sure.

      Oh, but don’t ask a question to get there…nooo. that would be an attack.

      The good news for Obama, is that I will be trying hard not to hold him accountable for the idiotic automatons that are following him now. The pathological partisan attack dogs who assume that I must be a party member, give a shit about the DNC, or have any faith in any of their candidates.

      Earn my vote damnit, is that so wrong.

      (conclusion)
      yes, there is a big difference between the ongoing hidden attacks on women and the emasculation of men. I don’t agree with either, but men have a boys club that is too old and needs to be disbanded. And the power has been run by their boys club too long to do us any good.
      And if you are going to call Susan a hypocrit for using Wuss and calling Sexism, then you are a double hypocrit for calling her on it, and then doing it some more. You aren’t offended by calling someone a coward, or a wuss. then you aren’t offended by Susan calling him a wuss.

      Which is it genius?

      • John Witherspoon

        And if you are going to call Susan a hypocrit for using Wuss and calling Sexism, then you are a double hypocrit for calling her on it, and then doing it some more. You aren’t offended by calling someone a coward, or a wuss. then you aren’t offended by Susan calling him a wuss.

        Which is it genius?

        You realize that you failed to make any actual arguement right? like, there are no choices here…

        • chris

          “which is it genius”
          (better wording)
          “which is it,
          1. you are you actually offended by “Wuss”
          2. you’re making up shit to fight about when you really aren’t offended by “wuss”
          3. or simply a bombastic hypocrite who tries to jump someone for wuss, when you resort the same words via “coward” and “weak”.
          4. or simply a bombastic hypocrite attempting to call someone else hypocrite. ( very common phenomenon among hypocrites)

          The attack he’s making isn’t about sexism, or susan’s comments on Sexism, or emasculation, its simply muckraking.

          thanks john witherspoon.

          • John Witherspoon

            refutation by dictionary:

            American Heritage Dictionary – Cite This Source – Share This
            wuss (wŏŏs) Pronunciation Key
            n. Slang
            A person regarded as weak or timid and especially as unmanly: “Cats are for wusses, dog men say” (Laura Blumenfeld).

            [Probably blend of wimp and pussy1.]

            ergo, a sexist term relating a man to the lady parts.

            weak /wik/ Pronunciation Key – Show Spelled Pronunciation[week] Pronunciation Key – Show IPA Pronunciation
            –adjective, -er, -est.
            1. not strong; liable to yield, break, or collapse under pressure or strain; fragile; frail: a weak fortress; a weak spot in armor.
            2. lacking in bodily strength or healthy vigor, as from age or sickness; feeble; infirm: a weak old man; weak eyes.
            3. not having much political strength, governing power, or authority: a weak nation; a weak ruler.
            4. lacking in force, potency, or efficacy; impotent, ineffectual, or inadequate: weak sunlight; a weak wind.
            5. lacking in rhetorical or creative force or effectiveness: a weak reply to the charges; one of the author’s weakest novels.
            6. lacking in logical or legal force or soundness: a weak argument.
            7. deficient in mental power, intelligence, or judgment: a weak mind.
            8. not having much moral strength or firmness, resolution, or force of character: to prove weak under temptation; weak compliance.
            9. deficient in amount, volume, loudness, intensity, etc.; faint; slight: a weak current of electricity; a weak pulse.
            10. deficient, lacking, or poor in something specified: a hand weak in trumps; I’m weak in spelling.
            11. deficient in the essential or usual properties or ingredients: weak tea.
            12. unstressed, as a syllable, vowel, or word.
            13. (of Germanic verbs) inflected with suffixes, without inherited change of the root vowel, as English work, worked, or having a preterit ending in a dental, as English bring, brought.
            14. (of Germanic nouns and adjectives) inflected with endings originally appropriate to stems terminating in -n, as the adjective alte in German der alte Mann (“the old man”).
            15. (of wheat or flour) having a low gluten content or having a poor quality of gluten.
            16. Photography. thin; not dense.
            17. Commerce. characterized by a decline in prices: The market was weak in the morning but rallied in the afternoon.
            [Origin: 1250–1300; ME weik

          • John Witherspoon

            refutation by dictionary:

            American Heritage Dictionary – Cite This Source – Share This
            wuss (wŏŏs) Pronunciation Key
            n. Slang
            A person regarded as weak or timid and especially as unmanly: “Cats are for wusses, dog men say” (Laura Blumenfeld).

            [Probably blend of wimp and pussy1.]

            ergo, a sexist term relating a man to the lady parts.

            weak /wik/ Pronunciation Key – Show Spelled Pronunciation[week] Pronunciation Key – Show IPA Pronunciation
            –adjective, -er, -est.
            1. not strong; liable to yield, break, or collapse under pressure or strain; fragile; frail: a weak fortress; a weak spot in armor.

            [Origin: 1250–1300; ME weik

            • John Witherspoon

              i wish it would stop truncating my comments….

              • chris

                Its probably tired of becoming your paste and run section.

                Yes, I’m quite familiar with the use of Wuss, Pussy, Wimp, Coward, Cockold, Whipped, etc.

                Now…would you like to actually formulate a position? You are sounding like a bad take on the Monty Python “Argument Sketch”. Simply saying No It Isn’t.

                Iconoclastic behavior can be rather addictive, so I’d be careful about spending too much time only saying, “No it isn’t.”. After a while your words will become so vacant nobody reads them.

                Since you are such the activist against Sexism, perhaps you can write a post about the sweeping effects of sexism including how it comes back in the form of emasculation. But, that would be more than simply, “No It Isn’t!”

                • John Witherspoon

                  my point is that both “coward” and “weak” are non gender specific, whereas “wuss” is a specific term for emasculation. Ergo, using “coward” and “weak” is not sexist but using “wuss” is. I personally don’t know why people like you get your panties in a twist (sexist phrase) over sexist terms, but a hypocrite is a hypocrite, you sniveling, co-bag, girlie-man.

    • http://OUTRAGEDBUTNOTSURPRISED bama_barrron

      after reading numerous of you postings banquo i must say i’m extremely underwhelmed by your use of logic and more then a little tired of your anti-female screeds. oh what does this mean:

      This campaign season has been one of the worst I’ve seen, because, after 8 years of George Walker Bush, all we have is another tawdry horse race with the same chanting partisan crowd.

      i guess this means you not only dont like the process of picking a president but you arent impressed with any of the candidates or their supporters. this leads to me wonder why you are spending so much time and effort with your insulting posts if you truly dont have a horse in this race. i think it might have something to do with an abusive personality disorder when it comes to women. so do everyone you know a favor: grow the hell up, boy.

      • chris

        here here

  • cruz del sur

    Can anybody tell me how did Hillary vote on the retroactive inmunity for the telecoms?

    • GR3

      She wasn’t there.
      Is that your point?

      • cruz del sur

        You mean to say that she don’t care about our rights??? How can I vote for her (for the record, I will not vote for neither Hillary nor Obama) if she wont even bother to show up for such an important vote.

        It would be nice to see an end to the Bashobamafest.

        • chris

          What about these other Senators who VOTED FOR the immunity?
          Democrats who voted to protect ATT and Verizon from the law and make sure GW can tap your phone with impunity
          Baucus (D-MT)*
          Bayh (D-IN)
          Carper (D-DE)
          Casey (D-PA)
          Conrad (D-ND)
          Inouye (D-HI)
          Johnson (D-SD)*
          Kohl (D-WI)
          Landrieu (D-LA)*
          Lincoln (D-AR)
          McCaskill (D-MO)
          Mikulski (D-MD)
          Nelson (D-FL)
          Nelson (D-NE)
          Pryor (D-AR)*
          Rockefeller (D-WV)*
          Salazar (D-CO)
          Webb (D-VA)
          Whitehouse (D-RI)
          *Election in 2008

          I would indeed love to hear from Hillary Clinton’s camp, and will call them tomorrow, to find out why she didn’t show up to vote against it. But one logical reason could be, she knew these damn traitors would already be voting for it. So…now Obama votes for legislation…and Not Voting on legislation is the highest of crimes. Isn’t it interesting how votes count to those who want to count them? Where was Obama during other critical votes

          And wait, who were the assholes who voted for the FISA Fix last August?
          Sen. Evan Bayh (D-IN), Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-CA), Sen. Thomas Carper (D-DE), Sen. Robert Casey (D-PA), Sen. Kent Conrad (D-ND), Sen. Byron Dorgan (D-ND), Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-CA), Sen. Tom Harkin (D-IA), Sen. Daniel Inouye (D-HI), Sen. Tim Johnson (D-SD), Sen. John Kerry (D-MA), Sen. Mary Landrieu (D-LA), Sen. Joseph Lieberman (ID-CT), Sen. Blanche Lincoln (D-AR), Sen. Claire McCaskill (D-MO), Sen. Barbara Mikulski (D-MD), Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA), Sen. Bill Nelson (D-FL), Sen. Ben Nelson (D-NE), Sen. Mark Pryor (D-AR), Sen. Ken Salazar (D-CO) and Sen. Jim Webb (D-VA).

          Both Obama and Clinton voted against the FISA fix in August.
          Yes, it would be important to ask Clinton why she didn’t go on record yesterday about it, but considering the total of the turn coats and the loyalist Republicans who voted 100% in unity, considering that Harry Reid played games with the vote the entire time…this may…be a red herring.

          The names listed here though…they voted to give immunity. It would be in our civilian duty to call and chew their ass instead of bickering who didn’t vote, and who voted No. Here are the names who betrayed you.

          • cruz del sur

            And call them I did (not all ). As one of those who called a friend in Afghanistan in 2003 (previously calling the FBI and letting them know that I was about to make a phone call to Afghanistan to contact a buddy who I had lost contact 30 years ago just in freaking case, and was told to go ahead) and suspect that I am one of those spied uppon, believe me I have been emphatic abput the issue. And you are so right that they betrayed me!

            What I can not understand is why in heaven would Hillary not show up, and put herself in such a vulnearble position in the midst of the primaries. In a debate, Obama will chew her ass. Big mistake!!!

            • chris

              I cannot attempt to make an excuse for Clinton, because I want an explanation, but it was already known that these people were intending to vote FOR the bill. I called Conyers office on different matters (IMPEACHMENT IS OFF THE TABLE STILL) and there was strong resistance in the House.

              She needs to explain her absence. But I would guess it has something to do with how many were already voting for it, and that Harry Reid is a failure of a Senate leader when it comes to stopping minority rule of the Republicans.
              (NOTE: this is not an dismissal pass for Clinton from me)

              • chris

                It should also be noted that neither Clinton or Obama voted in the “Senate votes to Ban CIA waterboarding” because both were on the campaign trail. So lets see who fires across the bow of each others ships on this.

                • John Witherspoon

                  You cant even get a metaphor right! “Firing across the bow” is a warning shot. Jesus, its like arguing with fucking retards in here,

    • CK

      She was not present for the vote.

  • burgerking

    mr. bowlcut guy,
    you have a bad haircut. you should see a stylist when they are open. plus, nobody likes hillary. she is like tracy flick. no one will pick her. even the aramadilla say “too much baggage!”

    • Mike Howell

      burgerking –

      Didn’t Tracy Flick come within a vote of the idiot guy?

    • chris

      nobody will vote for….you might want to go back and check these primary votes…and the pledged superdelegates…they’ve already indicated they are voting for Clinton. And every day that ticks by with the Obamatons in their loony attacks will drive me to vote in the primary in Texas for Hillary Clinton. Each statement that she has no experience…secures my vote, each statement that she hasn’t authored significant legislation, will secure my vote. Obama needs to tell his base to pipe down from their raving cult enthusiasm because not everyone is buying the punch.

      And the fact that they can’t handle that others disagree with them so much only convinces me that I would not want that leader in the white house. I’ve seen that crap with George Bush and his beer drinking buddies across America in 2000 who thought he was just so cool. He was a buddy, ya knowa, against the Stiff, nobody likes him, his record, Al Gore.

      Learn from the past campaigns and their failures or be doomed to repeats.

  • justsomeone

    I had CNBC on this afternoon & some talking head said Obama’s economic advisers (Chicago School of Economics)announced Obama wants to raise the tax on cap gains from 15% to 24%. Anybody know what’s HRC proposing for cap gains? If she wants votes she ought to come out for keeping it at 15% for the first 25K, it would placate the little fish investors & still allow her to shake the trees of the big guys.

  • justsomeone

    Almost every one I know has the economic jitters.

    • TeakWoodKite

      justsomeone: same here;

      OT: I responded to your global inquery

    • CK

      The remainder of the folks you know will have them very soon. Today The New York City port Authority saw $100,000,000 in tax free municipal bonds rise to a 20% offered interest rate. And NOT SELL. New York MTA bonds also failed to sell. New York State Dormitory authority bonds failed to sell several days ago, Nevada Power and Georgetown University were the first failures several weeks ago.
      20% tax free and no insitutional buyers. Jitters is not the word. The Fed is giving money away to the big banks. The Fed is charging 3% interest in an economy with a ( nominal ) inflation rate of 4.5 and if you are middle class homeowner on a budget you know that your food, fuel, medical insurance, property taxes, and credit card minimums have gone up closer to 15%. In effect the FED is giving money away at a negative interst rate, and still the banks can’t spend. Job creation is going negative. Unemployment is rising. Arizona, California and Texas are all reporting the beginnings of a movement by the least employable illegal immigrants to return to mexico where there is work. The subprime mortgage fallout will hit the local property tax receipts this quarter, meanwhile the market value of homes is expected to decrease by approx 30%; the assessed values and the millage are not expected to be decreased of course.
      There are 0 total savings in the financial institutions. Just trash federal reserve notes now printed by the pallet load and decreasing in value at a compounded 6% a year. The economic news gets worse each day. This fall the USA will be deep into the BUSH/McCain economic depression. ( There are already Hoovervilles springing up although we really should call them Bushtowns.)

  • justsomeone

    If I remember correctly during the Clinton yrs cap gains was taxed at 20%, now if Obama is really going up another 4% on top of that, even on the 1st 25K, I’ll be real interested in hearing how that’s going to help the lower & middle class. I recall a long time ago reading Hillary made 145K in the cattle futures market (alledgedly her first trade). Recently I read, sorry can’t remember the source, that Obama parlayed $1000 into more than 150K in a series of 4 or 5 futures trades. She & Bill are supposedly worth 50 Million. These people are all so far removed from what I think of as middle class that there ain’t no tellin’ what they’ll do. The Obamas are probably eeking by on a measley $425,000 a yr + investments. This is getting interesting & scary.

  • justsomeone

    Teakwoodkite, Thanks, but what “global inquery”? I didn’t know I had one.

  • Percy

    Staunch defensive of Obama….even when he is wrong.

    He doesn’t want to debate Hillary… he is not at his best side by side her.

    They have only one chance so far to debate by themselves, it doesn’t matter how many they have done. Heck free media for him too!!!! Lots more people would see him on TV.

    Oh my kind of Obama to add subtance… could he tell that he was really weak? Is he concerned about loosing him momenteum if people found out he is a phony? He is the one that said.. his message has been the same, his style the same… he said… If it ain’t broke then don’t fix it. So why is HE course correcting?

    He delivered the plan on the stump so he could practice it… before he deabtes Hillary.

    It is not his plan by the way…it was plagarised.

  • Jack