Flushing Forests—Literally!

I propose a campaign to create jobs, save the septic tanks and sewer treatment facilities, and eucalytus trees!

It used to be a “chicken in every pot”; now politicians could promise A bidet in every bathroom!!

Good article for thought but the math is not very good. I won’t do the math because there’s no way 23.6 time 38 equals 1000

LOL. That’s a good one.

Ok this obasession with what people use to whipe their buttocks is bordering on the rediculous. how ever, if obama and congress keep printing all this money to cover the massive dept they are creating, then we might beable to use green backs instead of Charmen.

I use Angel Soft. Although it is supposed to be safer for septic systems I’m sure it is not made from recycled paper. I would be willing to change if I find out how to get recycled toilet paper.

I was shocked when I came to the US the first time and found out there were no bidets….still puzzled as to the why not…
Americans living abroad used the bidet for potting plants…lol

PatR, what a line:

“I hate to inflict insight, …”

But you do! And your journey here from beginning with your fantastic cartoons to becoming a wholistic political commentator who can combine visual and verbal INSIGHT is something that we here have all enjoyed watching. You are an exciting, inspiring person who has also gone through much pain because of your political beliefs, which has not beaten you down, but made you stronger and taller. Bravo.

P.S. To our readers: On our little private writers’ list we had quite a discussion about Pat’s new message. We don’t want to give up our softies!!! But I did remind the list that not all that long ago, our ancestors (even grandparents and great-grandparents) had to use an OUTDOOR toilet and were forced to wipe with that precious Sears or Montgomery Ward catalog … which must have been sad because it was often one of the few pieces of reading material they received.

P.P.S. Since urine, best I know, is sterile and nothing to fear from having touched it, I often use a clean rag in lieu of T.P. (People in life/death situations without water often drink their own urine to stay alive — urine is not bad stuff per se!)

ALSO: AND THIS IS IMPORTANT (and more easily done since I live alone most of the time) — I DO NOT FLUSH when I urinate. There is NO NEED to flush. I have no idea how much WATER i save daily, but it must be tens of gallons. I just wish I could somehow make it popuar not to flush after urination.

Funnily enough though, if I walk into a public restroom, and see the toilet hasn’t been flushed even through there is just urine and a bit of toilet paper, my first instinct — certainly taught by the reaction of others when I was young — is to say/think, “Oh yuck.” YET!!! That unknown person has done nature and water conservation a favor.

Perhaps I will turn into a person who, when I use a public lavatory facility, will NOT flush when I only urinate. Perhaps we can make it a national craze. (NOW ALL I NEED is some environmentally SMART PERSON to tell us how much we would help our environment by not flushing all the time.)

Pat, Mr. Wipple will miss you. Good Cartoon and story Pat. Here’s two links where you can buy online if you can’t find recycled toilet paper at your supermarket.

http://www.treecycle.com/cattissue.html

http://www.amazon.com/Green-Forest-Unscented-Bathroom-Recycled/dp/B000F4Z84Y

Most supermarkets carry one type of recycled toilet paper.

My head says yes, but oh how I love the soft stuff.

Maybe they can throw in a little bamboo for softness so the recycled isn’t so rough? I know they are adding it into cotton fabrics – for softness and its eco friendly. Used to buy recycled pt paper many years ago. I’m older now. Like to enjoy a few precious comforts in life.

Powerful Cartoon Pat.

With your permission, I would like to print FLUSHING FORRESTS to hang above my computer as a daily reminder to reinvigorate my environmental conservationist side.

When I lived in England back in the seventies I was horrified to find out that the schools used WAX Paper for toilet paper.
At least I know what socialism really feels like…

Not quilty.

I mean not “guilty”.

Whoopsie–make that 42 people. Still a lot of trees! I changed it in the story.

I also think that a LOT of people use more than 23.6 rolls a year. We had house guests (2 people)once and they stayed for 4 days and used 8 rolls. I assume at least one of them had a problem, but still…

I guess it means the same thing either way:)

A funny thought:
The toilet paper used at my school could double for sand paper. Perhaps it started out that way!

Continuing in that same vein:
I’m watching C-Span’s coverage of the State of the Black Union with Tavis Smiley-10th year convention in L.A. Remember how O-bla-bla was just too busy campaigning to attend the meeting but our girl Hillary went and spoke so beautifully? I am sure the Messiah figured he didn’t have to attend that convention because he had the black vote sewn up already— especially after the racially motivated deceit he participated in during the S.Carolina primary.
Well, not only was King Twizzler absent last year, he didn’t bother to attend this year either. He spoke to the crowd in a pre-recorded video message–pitifully reading from a tele-prompter.

Just trying to figure out where his priorities lie–
Let’s see–he flew to Chicago to go out to dinner with MEshell, he flew to Denver to sign a bill, he served $400 per lb. Wa-Gee-You(sp?) beef @ the White House to celebrate passage of the Stimul-less Bill but he chooses not to travel to LA on a Saturday to speak to the Black Union? Not an important enough event? Doesn’t need to worry about the black vote anymore?
I imagine that Emperor Ego can pick any toilet paper he wants in the White House–damn the cost. He was black in 2008 but I imagine he’ll be green in 2012. And you can take that to the outhouse!

LOL–Good one!

conventional toilets hold 3.4 gallons x 300 million flushes a day equals (give or take) 1.2 billion gallons a day.

1 million gallons = 3.07 acre feet or 51.1 cubed.

All that water! Pat I tried the re-cycled kind but the ladies of the house poo-poo’ed it.

We should ask Obama to subsidize this green alternative to toilet paper. Reusable Toilet Wipes for every American: http://www.livescience.com/environment/090227-toilet-tissues.html

New legislation designed to limit tp usage to one square per flush is being introduced. The legislation will tax at 1400% any tp purchases over one roll per month for a family of four. Single users will be limited to 3 rolls per year and will be required to provide ID for purchases.

This will allow trees to mature naturally by allowing a longer growth period. Planting new trees to replace those harvested for human use disturbs the natural environment and will be prohibited.

Why would I wish to subsidize his Rhetoric?

Susan, thanks for your kind comments. I always appreciate you (as do all of the writers) for everything you do to encourage us and to keep us doing our best for you and Larry.

And, your eco tips are good ones! There truly is no need to flush after every urination (or #1 as my mother used to call it). Once a day is good enough.

DevilDog-
No Sh_t!!

LOL Choo Choo–I admit this eco-saver is more painful (both psychologically and perhaps physically) to implement. BUT, I ordered some recycled TP online (thanks Johnny B), and I am going to look at a market in town that carries mostly “green” and organic stuff to see what they have to offer.

Funny and well done cartoon on a subject matter that is often viewed as part of the unmentionables of life. We all talk about the importance of recycling, and yet how often do each of us go out of our way to make sure we purchase recycled paper products. I could understand if this is about not wanting to use recycled paper for medical products, but for the butts? Let us all give recycling a break and buy recycled toilet paper. I doubt if the butts of America will complain much and the planet will thank you and you will have found another way to feel good about yourself. I buy it and feel good about myself and my but has not complained even once.

And by the way, why not buy recycled tissue paper also. I think that the nose and what comes out of it can handle it.

Rich

What is this post doing on NQ? Toilet paper? Now toilet paper is an all consuming IMPORTANT issue? Are you kidding me, really? We’re being SCOLDED for having “pampered American butts”?

I’ve been coming to this site for almost a year and appreciate so much the thoughtful, interesting and RELEVANT issues presented but this is too much! If you want to talk about your potty practices pick up the phone and call someone who enjoys such discussions. What is your f@#%ing malfunction?!!!

You are grossly incorrect. Urine is sterile as it leaves the human body but becomes a breeding ground for contamination upon contact with environment. Please go bathe immediately.

Good food for thought anyway you look at it. Liking the graphics is a given.

Americans are too much in a hurry to use bidets and still we call ourselves modern.

Chill out, ANON. Not everything can 100% be to your liking 100% of the time.

Grow up.

A nice funny, and accurate.
For the others above, my grandparents used to use cotton rag strips, which also were used to make paper. Now (modern times) we realize that paper made from cotton is “archival grade” but we bleach and process wood pulp to maximize profit. More damage is done to the environment from pulp processing than flushing every time one expels bodily waste.
It’s time to remember what we forgot.
I thank you for your time.

Pat, there is another environmental reason to use recycled TP and it has to do with our INTERNAL environment. If the TP does not specifically say something to the effect that “no chlorine bleach was used in the manufacture of this product” on it, it is highly toxic, especially for cancer patients and women. The genital openings of the body as well as the mouth and the nose are lined with highly absorptive mucous membranes. The use of chlorinated TP and other papers is a health risk that is kept off radar screens. You can buy non-chlorinated TP at Trader Joe’s and anywhere that the food coop brand is sold. Women should also be especially concerned about the chlorinated paper used in sanitary pads for the same reason and look for the non-chlorinated brands that are popping up everywhere.

Buzz,

Enjoy the playing in the urine and be sure to sip up hygiene disinformation. I have my standards and am unapologetic because they are clearly superior to yours.

I’m not sure how many people here have used Wax toilet paper from England or Sand paper from Russia, but I can tell you that it hurts.
Obama will end up taxing the amount of sheets and flushs we use…

I’ll give up my Charmin Ultra Soft when they pry it out of my cold, dead fingers.

You were warned by the cartoon of the content of this post before you read it. Since you chose to go ahead, it’s your own fault.

Keep in mind that manure is on tap from Washington, D.C. I read about it constantly. It makes me angry, and it can get downright depressing. So, a lighter topic a good thing to help keep the blood pressure under control and the arteries clear. Otherwise, one might [ahem]lose their sense of humor.

I remember the first American friend I asked about and she said : “But we take showers every day!” as if she thought bidets were to be used instead of a shower, rather than in addition to one…lol
Anyway, I second mountainaires proposal…

Can you find me one that I don’t have to use 4 times the amount to get the same fnction from?

Until you can explain the 3 seashells, I need to use tp!

Dig a little deeper, anon. It’s about the environment and about forests–otherwise it would not be here. These issues arise in a number of contexts.

Some of he forests being used for TP are over 300 years old. The Sounth American issue could be its own story. If you read the NY Times story in the hot link you will see many reasons as to why this story is not really about “potty practices.”

Sometimes you just have to get past what bothers you to see the true meaning of stories.

forgot the

Why are you still slumming here?

But your mental maturity is obviously not superior.

Arrogance thy name is Anon.

Hey, I already do. I live in Santa Fe and I have to pay for all the water I use, then my community charges me an additional “commodity” fees based on the water I use that the City reports to them, in addition to the Sewer fee.

Talk about gettin’ you coming and going. LOL sorry, couldn’t resist.

Welcome to the liberal Santa Fe!

Pat,
I’m more concerned with palm oil for fuel. The forests are being cut so that we can have bio fuels…Wrong!
You can add ethanol as being really stupid for the planet…Turning food into energy means starvation and extinction of species down the road.

Ah, but there’d be the depletion of the clay beds from which the bowls are cast; the loss of silica to mix the glazes for same.

Not to mention, an increased copper use to make the brass to make the valves and guts of same.

And, let’s not forget the waste of natural gas and/or electricity for the firing process.

Or the HUGE impact of remodelling public facilities of all kinds and types across the fruited plain under the soon-to-be adopted building/plumbing/mechanical code amendments, ANSI 117.1, etc. to ensure compliance with the “Americans Who Need to Poop Act.”

Widening Handicapped Access toilet spaces to facilitate bidet use by the wheelchair crowd? There’s a barrier that must be hurdled by statute.

Additional fuel to run the trucks which will now make more trips to jobsites; additional depletion of rubber trees to mold the increased number of tires required for same.

We can also look forward to more on-the-job injuries due to plumbers having to wrestle toilets AND bidets around the job as well as up and down stairs, thus further straining their spines and thighs, leading to Lower Back Trauma.

It will be necessary to hire even more Health Educators in K-12 school systems to teach the unwashed how to properly mount, use and dismount these devices, as well as amending the curriculum in the various colleges of Education to teach same.

For the financially needy, there must be Federal programs (grants, interest-free loans) to retrofit their domiciles, that they may enjoy their Right to Pooper Justice and Parity with those more fortunate who merely wrote checks to contractors.

There will be Federal Toilet Inspectors. At which GS- level will we pay them? What Training and Education will be appropriate? Obviously, they will all need to hold degrees. This will burden the university system again.

New copies of HUD’s Minimum Property Standards will be required in the office every architectural design professional, mechanical engineer, plumber and contractor in the US and Territories.

And, finally, imagine the blizzard of paperwork appurtenant to all the above.

“Oh, the humanity!!!

Linda,
I’m really not so much against recycled toilet paper as long as it’s not like the stuff
I was forced to use in socialist England.
Just so everyone knows I was born in America used soft toilet paper for many years and then was forced to use the wax paper that never does the job.
Just wanted to mention my nationality in case there is still some xenophobics that don’t like opinions from people that have lived around.

In Key West, the domestic water supply is a pipeline to the Mainland. It USED to be itty-bitty, and water was extraordinarily dear.

I can still remember the sign in the hotel bathrooms (circa 1963):

“In This Land of Sun and Fun, We NEVER Flush for Number One!”

Look, I’m all for environmentally responsible policies and practices but its pretty obvious that this ‘pet’ issue has gone way overboard in many respects. In my opinion, this post is an example of just that phenomenon.

And the discussion above about urine being sanitary is just incorrect and foolish. Sorry to have upset some of you but really… toilet paper?

>>> The toilet paper used at my school could double for sandpaper.

That which does not kill us makes us stronger!

He will never understand this. Don’t you know that “The One” neither deficates nor urinates–he is tooo clean for such humanly things.

In Latin America (Honduras, Guatemala, Nicaragua), because of the inability for many sewer systems to keep up with the flow, it’s quite common in private homes to keep a box in each bathroom for the collection of the used toilet tissue.

Somebody needs to make rubberized pine cones.

Actually, snow is my favorite.

Seattle while I use some recycled brand of tp, I agree it would be terrible if we legislated against the Charmin and other kind. It would create a backlash.

We must not pass some crap law, let’s just create awareness so it doesn’t come to this.

Cheryl Crowe will be pleased!

The paper industry really should get out there and do some self-promotion. Most paper is made from sustainable forest farms but people don’t know this. So these kids are cheering on the demise of newspapers because they think it will save the forests.

There’s also lots of excess recycled paper sitting in some country somewhere, I saved a bookmark to write all of this up but the old computer died.

That’s COLD, man!

lol

I’m not opposed to recycling either, as mentioned down below. But everytime I do try, it’s either hard, falls apart, or just unusuable and costs so much more.

For example, paper towels I try not to even use. But I haven’t had a sink in my kitchen for 3 months now-DON”T ASK, you don’t want to hear my sob story. So now I have to use paper towels more. Well, the recycled paper towels from Wild Oats cost more than I buy others, but, I can’t even put one off with out it ripping in to shreds and then it won’t absorb any water, having to use 3 sheets folded back and forth and it still crumbles up.

I won’t even mention the fingers going through the toilet paper or how many kleenex I have to use.

Can they not make a better product of recyclables so their less waste and COST?

We must not pass some crap law,

LOL

sorry for typos, ie, put, s/b pull and their s/b they’re.

Need more coffee.

We have plenty of coffee up here!

I will start using recycled toilet paper when I can use this variety….

http://www.dailyhaha.com/_pics/obama_toilet_paper.htm

lmao

now have to share that with hubby!

Cut it out! LOL

Priorities …

why not start conserving with junk mail which serves NO useful function other than as make work for postal service employees?

We all promise to give up Charmin as soon as Obama gives up flying AIR FORCE ONE here and there at the cost of $250,000 per trip… that is paid by the taxpayers. Did we really deserve to have to pay a quarter of a million dollars so he could have fun in Chicago for Valentines Day? And what about all the free R&B at the White House while millions of Americans are facing foreclosure?

BTW. Am I the only one sick of seeing him on TV everyday? Notice that whenever he gives a press conference on TV that Wall Street absolutely tanks?

I guess you can say that no subject is taboo here at NQ. Okay, so here’s my two-cents worth:

Better wax paper than crepe paper or sand paper, as such seems to be the case in some European countries. But Europeans do use the bidet (a Godsend, in my view!), and they have grades of TP according to the consumer’s budget and preferences. TIP: Since many countries the world over have the custom of just washing, specifically with the left hand, it is wise when traveling abroad to avoid touching food at the table with your left hand (even using it at all) lest you offend someone. Oh, and don’t forget to wash your hands!!

Fresh and clean. Fresh and Clean.

Just think, with sand paper one can wipe and exfoliate at the same time. Our bottoms never had it so good!

I don’t know how well it would work as toilet paper, but if the gov’t would get over its cannabiphobia and allow commercial hemp-growing, the trees wouldn’t need to be cut down in such numbers for other things (like regular paper, including newsprint).

Why not talk about TP and potty practices? Since Obama “won” the presidency, we’re now all in one big sh@#!t hole, as it were.

Let’s all enjoy the comfy seat!
http://www.moonbattery.com/obama_toilet_seat.jpg

Hey, Anon! We’re just trying to wipe our concerns away here….

But I’ll try to elevate the discussion a bit. Have any of you read Pynchon’s GRAVITY’S RAINBOW, especially the chapter on the sh#@t hole? Disgusting–but literary, I must say. Also, the film DOGMA has a character in it who raises scatological humor to the level of philosophy. Who knew sh!@#t could be literary and philosophical?

Pat, as usual, this is a great cartoon and right on target. It brings two things to mind for me:
1. Why not grow hemp for use as toilet paper. I have heard that it makes paper that is much better than our wood-stuff paper which is why marijuana was outlawed in the first place. Maybe it is time to change the law so we don’t have to cut down trees to make stuff to flush down the toilet.
2. About 30 years ago, there was the funniest advertisement on television. It showed women being asked which type of toilet paper their husband would be happy to use at home. I will never forget the first time I watched it; I laughed until I cried. I could just imagine what my husbad would say if I went on national television and discussed which kind of toilet paper he would use. No matter how much they were willing to pay me, my husband would have died a natural death.

That’s a good point. What kind of TP does the WH use? Let’s start there and in Congress. This said, I am for conservation.

You are not alone. He has been on for something every day. It’s almost as though he has to give the bots their daily shot of hopium so they won’t forget about him. He and his wife are extremely overexposed. She is following along too with the fashion thing…now her “official” portrait. Very ego centered. Hopefully the next administration will keep it stored in the basement. I’ve never heard of official portraits being done so early.

Anyway…back to the subject…
In CA, we are not so focused on paper as water. However, the rougher paper is hard on the pipes too. I had a plumbing bill after the last time I tried that. Guess it isn’t as degradable.

Since the severe CA drought of the 70′s (and a few smaller ones inbetween) I have a hard time not following “If it’s yellow it’s mellow, if it’s brown flush it down.” At least at home. The penalties for overuse of water were astronomical so people were quite observant. Of course, you can’t put paper in the bowl for mellow yellow with every sample so you have to keep a paper bag under the sink to dispose of that. Many of the commercial centers have water saving toilets and restaurants (haven’t been in one for awhile) I hear have stopped bringing water to table unless requested.

Soon, we’ll see fines for water running in gutters or other noticeable overuse. We have been promoting drought resistant, indigenous plants, rain barrel collection and zero lawns for sometime now. They can make quite beautiful gardens.

As opposed to crappy laws….

kgirl, my very thoughts.

LOL Linda. I was thinking hemp also. Maybe I will check into that. (I live in Santa Cruz, CA–lots of hemp people here.)

Didn’t McCain also speak at the Black Union?

Ha! rjj. That is a funny comment. Love it.

anon, darling, are we to ignore anything that happens to have some social significance even though it is not the usual table talk?

The only thing the average person does more often that “eating and eliminating” is laughing. So such a universal behavior (and what is associated with it) should be fair game for any discussion.

And, we all need to laugh a little these days. Some funny comments here. I was having a bad day until I read this story and the comments. Even you are getting into it!

Quit it!

Less flushing would also make it difficult to clean the bowl because the bowl gets discolored and you spend time scrubbing. Take it from me as I do clean toilets on a regular basis. And so the solution is really use a bidet and if you can afford it, a built in dryer as well. I installed a bidet in my master bedroom toilet and when I had a house fire, my entire home was rebuilt. It gave me a chance to change all my toilets. Now in the master bedroom, I have a bidet that cleans both front and back plus a dryer too! This has reduced our use of toilet paper. We are empty nesters so I decided to install bidets in the other three toilet and bath and it has reduce our use of toilet paper. When my sons come home for vacation, we encourage them to use the bidet and that further saves more toilet paper.
WE have traveled quite extensively and many of the more expensive hotels in Asia have bidets… Imagine how much toilet paper can be saved. Again, the US is so far behind in this regard and yet the US demands the rest of the world to follow their own path of being green.

Reminds me a story my mom used to tell about living in Alaska. The ship with the paper products on it sank. Everyone knew it would take a while to get another one up there.

So within short order all the paper products at the stores were gone. Empty aisles and shelves everywere.

Last but not least…that left the Sears catalog from the mail and those you could pick-up in the store. Since they had a lot ink that would rub off….it wasn’t on the top of list. But everyone knew eventually you would be happy to have those pages.

Can you spare a square?

And, to appeal to the Upscale, Yuppie crowd (and those who simply like The Finer Things) we could use fly ash from industrial processes and swear that it’s Black Sand from the (fill in the blank) Beach at (name a place where Yuppies wanna go..Bora Bora? Honokalanai?), mined under a full moon by Polynesian virgins using coconut shells.

THAT oughta get us $20/roll!

I’m writing the ad copy for Kerr’s, Southern Living and Town and Country with my other hand, even as we speak.

DISCLAIMER: Bambi was not injured, nor were any dolphins or unicorns molested in the promulgation of this Communication.

Ah, Pat, you rascal! I was IN Santa Cruz back in October, on my way to Monterey.

Nice place. Lotsa Granola Cookie girls running around carrying books. Vistas of the ocean were magnifico!

If it only smelled like Gilmore…

I love Santa Cruz. I am green w/envy.

if it,s yellow.let it mellow!!
if it,s brown.flush it down..

I take it most of you have never had to prepare for a colonoscopy.

Just wondering, but does anyone know how much our use of paper gone down with the advent of e-mail?

Good cartoon and issue, as usual, Pat.

You can always wash your butt in the toilet bowl and wipe with an old worn out throw-away sock. Back on the farm in the ’30′s, farmers out in the field would wipe with a corn cob when they had to go. Maybe that practice should be promoted.

not this american. once you go bidet, you never go back.

if it,s yellow.let it mellow!!
if it,s brown.flush it down..

Sounds like that guy who spoke at Obama’s inauguration.

Due to its contact with the skin, can wearing hemp clothing get one high?

Oh please don’t start that trend in public bathrooms! I am such a bathroom phobe I would freak if people started not flushing. The nightmare! hahaha

Hello – splash back! I could never pee over some strangers pee. I have enough anxiety over public bathrooms without having to always flush for other people, before i use it. hahah

A lot of the toilets here have the dual flush. Light flush for #1, and heavy flush for #2. They are cool.

If you really want to save water in public bathrooms people need to install the *turks*. But they too are my public bathroom nightmare.
http://bitsofturkishdelight.blogspot.com/2008/02/squatty-potty.html

LOL! It does sound like him!

….and then, there were Sears and Montgomery Ward catalogs in outdoor priveys! When you got done reading the catalog, you used the paper for other things!!

…and there was no flushing!!

sara,

I second that!

Well, let’s put things into perspective. In Brazil, the primary crop used for ethanol is sugar cane (and the Governor of Alabama has even suggested checking into the possibility of growing sugar cane on state-owned land for ethanol; sugar cane used to be found growing wild in much of the southern half of the state–I can recall on visits to family members near the Florida state line seeing wild sugar cane growing in DITCHES and creek beds).
Also, there does need to be more development of other ethanol sources, such as the millions of acres of kudzu that grows all over the South (kudzu, incidentally, was used by the Japanese for food, but it was imported to the US as an ornamental vine which, unfortunately, ran amok; the vines are rarely eaten by North American native wildlife and are incredibly resistant to virtually all commercial pesticides and defoliants–not even wildfires manage to kill the stuff for long).

Here’s your perspective..
Palm oil threatens to wipe out Orangutans
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/JustOneThing/wireStory?id=6675131

The obvious warm-climate solution here is to snake a garden hose in through the bathroom window.

Speaking as a postal employee, I honestly hate junk mail. (I don’t know of many of us in the processing end who like seeing that crap.) The biggest problem is that the bulk mailers have managed to lobby the Postal Service to get HUGE discounts for mailing that junk. The bulk mailers are paying about half what first-class mass mailers do (that refers to companies that mail 1000s of pieces of mail–usually bills–at a single time), anywhere from 14 to 20 cents per piece (depending on the amount of presorting has been done).
Also, the junk mail is absurdly heavy and most of it does NOT fit our machines or the trays we have to use for sortation. We’re limited as to how much of it can go to the flat-sorting machines even when the pieces are better suited for the flat-sorter (primarily because the rates most of these bulk mailers are getting are based on LETTER rates; flat rates are higher by at least a dime per piece).
A standard letter tray can hold about 500 pieces of regular letter mail, but with most of the bulk (junk) mail, we’re lucky to get 300 pieces in a tray. A lot of that junk actually requires special processing to put bar codes on the mail for sortation (unfortunately, that takes up time that could be used in processing first-class mail).
Believe me, if the Postal Service could get out of it, we wouldn’t run that damned junk. If it were up to me, the bulk mailers would be forced to pay their fair share. Comparing bulk mail to first-class, we can run two to three times as much first-class as bulk mail in the same amount of time (and the number-crunchers in the Postal Service, for some reason, expect us to handle the bulk mail at the same rate as first-class–my own theory with that is the number-crunchers haven’t worked on the machines in years, if ever).
I would also point out that if people quit ordering crap from the junk mailers, they’d eventually quit sending the junk. Part of the reason the junk mailers lobby so hard for lower rates is because with those cheaper rates, they only need a low rate of return. If they get responses from only 10 or 15 of every 100 pieces they send out, that’s worth it. If their mailing costs required them to need 40 or 50 responses from every 100, they’d stop sending out so much junk.
Contact your Congressional representative and senators and demand that the junk mailers be required to pay their fair share for the privilege of filling your mailbox. As long as Congress (which has to approve any postal rate increase has no incentive to force the bulk mailers to pay their fair share, the bulk mailers are going to have no incentive to quit sending the junk.

Good post Josef!
Junk mail is going the same route as the consumer economy..Off a cliff!
I think we are on the verge of ending many things that are printed..
Newspapers
Junk Mail
Books
Checks and bill paying by mail
Fax
document storage

Not to mention that housing construction on a big scale is done for at least 10 years.

Maybe we can even brave it out and use that wax toilet paper I hate so much.

The industrial economy is going to be down 30-40% for some time..Nice to give the planet a break!
However, this process is very painful and so far the world has seen 50 million people lose their jobs and 200 million thrown into poverty.

“Watch out where the huskies go,
And don’t you eat that yellow snow!” – Frank Zappa

I’ve been using TP from recycled paper for over a year now (Seventh Generation) and also paper towels. I tried the tissues but since I have allergies, they were just too harsh on my nose.

(sigh) I do luvs my Charmin and 2nd choice Cottenelle.

Oh well…maybe I’ll just scoot my butt on the carpet the way the dog does on occasion. (will I have to yell at myself then?)

Hey, Anon! We’re just trying to wipe our concerns away here….

Rimshot!

Sick to death, Barb. Also sick of commercials for everything from tort lawyer to car dealers saying “yes we can”.

When I was a child, we visited a farm in rural Mississippi. They grew corn which they fed to hogs and used the cobs in the outhouse. They didn’t have electricity, but they got up with the sun, used a kerosene lantern for an hour or two at night and went to bed early. They invited us for dinner and served ham they had smoked and eggs from their own chickens. The woman cooked on a wood stove. I know the kerosene and wood stove were not good for the environment, but she made the best biscuits I have ever eaten. They were almost entirely self sufficient. That was in 1962 and have never forgotten and never had an experience any thing like it since. When my mother told me I was supposed to use the corn cob, I couldn’t believe it but they were actually soft.

LOL!!! Good one, Baba Rum Raison.

Fredster, stop it! I was dirnking coffee!

A simple tube and spray device works very well if the water isn’t super cold.

Just blotting with most any ol’ tissue drys things up.

A picture: http://tingtongman.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/IMG_3864.jpg

How many trees are cut down everyday to print the New York Times? [never mind the WaPo and WSJ...]

* To produce each week’s Sunday newspapers, 500,000 trees must be cut down.

There is quite a lot of edificational substance at this link… Here’s maybe 5% of it:

During World War II when raw materials were scarce, 33% of all paper was recycled. After the war, this number decreased sharply.
http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/7tw2v/dear_reddit_how_many_trees_are_cut_down_everyday/

Better…

The New York Times [linked at top; started all this] once again blasts away at another American industry…

Here are some interesting data about the NYT regarding their use of wood…

1. Counting all editions, M-F, plus Sunday edition–6,830,000 copies a week (2007)

http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?s=new+york+times+company&gwp=13

2. This press run consumes 27,320 cords of wood a week or about 1,430,640 cords a year

3. One acre produces about one cord of harvestable wood per year.

4. So the New York Times consumes the harvestable wood on about 1,430,640 acres a year.

from: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/clay-waters/2009/02/26/dead-tree-hypocrisy-nyt-massive-paper-user-lectures-toilet-paper#comments

Hemp cannot get you high. It is not marijuana.

The Declaration of Independence was written on it. Sails were made of it for hundreds of years. The nation’s founders grew it. For many years, if one owned more than a certain number of acres, it was required by law to devote a portion to hemp.

I have a hemp jacket that is probably 8 years old and looks like new. It is extemely soft.

The first roll toilet paper was sold in 1857. Hemp TP was used until hemp was made illegal.

Couldn’t help it. And puhleeze…don’t ask the folks who have irritable bowel syndrome to give up the soft stuff. I have I.B.S. or something like it and there was one time I had to run at work to the restroom. Got done, wiped and wanted to
s-c-r-e-a-m!! The next day I brought in my roll of Charmin.