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	<title>Comments on: John Dean: Public Apathy Aids Bush + Friday Open Thread</title>
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	<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/</link>
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	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 10:53:59 -0800</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Jumundji</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-1257711</link>
		<dc:creator>Jumundji</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:59:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-1257711</guid>
		<description>Iam looking for a free reverse cell phone lookup directory for USA numbers. Have you heard of any free ones? I found this reversephonenet.com but they charge like 14 USD for a cell trace. Im not sure how accurate the info they provide though. Any ides?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Iam looking for a free reverse cell phone lookup directory for USA numbers. Have you heard of any free ones? I found this reversephonenet.com but they charge like 14 USD for a cell trace. Im not sure how accurate the info they provide though. Any ides?</p>
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		<title>By: Taimabluella</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-376021</link>
		<dc:creator>Taimabluella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-376021</guid>
		<description>Hey,  I&#039;ve been lurking here for a few months, and decided to create an account today.  Just figured I&#039;d drop in and say hi :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey,  I&#8217;ve been lurking here for a few months, and decided to create an account today.  Just figured I&#8217;d drop in and say hi <img src='http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: lester</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-30166</link>
		<dc:creator>lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2007 22:32:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-30166</guid>
		<description>taters cut and pasted that.   wow,  your a real rebel, coming out in favor of our 3 trillion dollar a year  warmonger government.  edgy stuff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>taters cut and pasted that.   wow,  your a real rebel, coming out in favor of our 3 trillion dollar a year  warmonger government.  edgy stuff</p>
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		<title>By: P J Evans</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-30053</link>
		<dc:creator>P J Evans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2007 16:32:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-30053</guid>
		<description>If it kills that show, traffic in my neighborhood would improve, because their trucks would be off the streets. (So would the pickup-driving wanna-be cowboys who work for them.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If it kills that show, traffic in my neighborhood would improve, because their trucks would be off the streets. (So would the pickup-driving wanna-be cowboys who work for them.)</p>
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		<title>By: mudkitty</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29881</link>
		<dc:creator>mudkitty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Oct 2007 14:27:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29881</guid>
		<description>First cousins are allowed to marry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First cousins are allowed to marry.</p>
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		<title>By: Dee Loralei</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29628</link>
		<dc:creator>Dee Loralei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 08:33:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29628</guid>
		<description>Oh LOL and ROTFLMAO at Taters. Dammit quit making sense and being funny. Just.Stop.It.Now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh LOL and ROTFLMAO at Taters. Dammit quit making sense and being funny. Just.Stop.It.Now.</p>
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		<title>By: Dee Loralei</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29626</link>
		<dc:creator>Dee Loralei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 08:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29626</guid>
		<description>Susan,

Steve Benen has his own blog The Carperbagger Report. He does some amazing work and his regular commenters are highly intelligent, well-versed people. http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/

He posts at TPM on weekends, and C&amp;L during the week as well. He&#039;s probably my favorite lesser known blogger. Please check him out. It&#039;s well worth your time.

I think Dean&#039;s wrong about it being apathy. I mean there is much apathy. But it&#039;s much more pervasive than that I think.

In 2000 we saw a stolen presidential election, a so called yuppy protest that intimidated and halted vote counting, a presidential candidate who assumed the best and got the worst, and by his own inaction caused the election to be stolen.And then we saw our Supreme Court, the final last word law of the land, deliver a decree that halted any and all vote counts and declared and annointed Bush, in a one time only judgment, to be King, I mean President.

The Dems in the House and the Senate did not dispute this and allowed the electoral college to deliver it&#039;s fraudulently arrived at votes. And most of us sat by, thinking it couldn&#039;t be sooooo bad, so we tolerated their decision. And we had a national press who laid down and refused to question anything about the Governor from Texas and his checkered past. Nor did they question the ways in which he was elected, Years later we hear about voter caging and denial of votes to minorities in the very state that &quot;delivered&quot; the electoral college to Bush, a state governed by his own brother. And yet still most of the mainstream press ignores it.

We saw in 2002 how real war heros like Max Cleland were tarred and papered as weak and pro-enemy. Accused by chickenhawks of their own worst failings and shortcomings. And still we sat idly by. Shopping and re-financing our homes, buying Hummers, cheap Chinese made goods from WalMart and oil from Saudi Arabia.

We saw again in 2004, how another true war hero could be slandered and hatred drummed up against him and his wife. And he sat idly by without fighting against those who so slandered him. And we saw again, even more voter caging. And yet another stolen election.

People who care deeply about politics, about who is our President and who controls our houses of congress have become disenheartened. We realize our vote very often is not even counted.

But what did this disenheartened people do? We arose en mass to take back the People&#039;s house and to wrest the Senate from the plutocrats and oligarcs in 2006. We overcame all the default fake vote counts supplied by Diebold et al. And we knew from the reporting of Greg Palast and others that the default was 3%. And we overcame that. Our anger and our fear drove many, many more of us to the polls. For a non-presidential election, it was a huge turnout, which is why they couldn&#039;t steal it.

And what did we get for that? Yes, control of both houses of Congress. And they&#039;ve passed some good bills most sentient beings appreciate. And they&#039;ve had some great inspective hearings.

But have they halted or scaled back the war? Have they stopped some of the more egregious power grabs by the executive branch? Have they condemned any of the traitors within? Hell have they condemned anyone other than MoveOn or the Iranians? Have they actively worked to stop a new war with Iran?

The answer is no. Impeachment is off the table, and so must ending the occupation be too. The theft of America&#039;s youth and her purse are well and truly acceeded to by both parties.

The fact that the Dems will not stand up for the people of this country is why Congress&#039;s approval rating is fixin&#039; to enter the single digits. We&#039;ve known from the past 6 years that no Republican will ever listen to their constituents or frankly &quot;give a flying fuck&quot;(YAY Kurt Vonnegut quote!) about them. We&#039;ve had it shoved in our faces these last 9 months that neither will the Dems.

I fear that the voter apathy will only increase. We voted Dems and for what? More of the same.

The Dems are now in full ownership society role. They refuse to end the war, &quot;it&#039;s too hard&quot;; they refuse to impeach, &quot;it&#039;s off the table, too hard, takes too much time and we can&#039;t multi-task and do that and get bills passed so Dubs can veto.&quot;

I fear the people are so sick and disgusted with the entire electoral process that they may actually sit out the &#039;08 election.

The birth of apathy has many mothers. A disengaged electorate is sired by many fathers. The rape of your one voice is mere sleight of hand and leaves very little CSI: VotingBooth evidence. But knowing from empirical facts that your voice may not be counted, that your opinion does not matter, that your thoughts and hopes and dreams are for naught surely weighs most heavy. If they don&#039;t count my vote, why should I take the time and effort to go and actually vote?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Susan,</p>
<p>Steve Benen has his own blog The Carperbagger Report. He does some amazing work and his regular commenters are highly intelligent, well-versed people. <a href="http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/</a></p>
<p>He posts at TPM on weekends, and C&amp;L during the week as well. He&#8217;s probably my favorite lesser known blogger. Please check him out. It&#8217;s well worth your time.</p>
<p>I think Dean&#8217;s wrong about it being apathy. I mean there is much apathy. But it&#8217;s much more pervasive than that I think.</p>
<p>In 2000 we saw a stolen presidential election, a so called yuppy protest that intimidated and halted vote counting, a presidential candidate who assumed the best and got the worst, and by his own inaction caused the election to be stolen.And then we saw our Supreme Court, the final last word law of the land, deliver a decree that halted any and all vote counts and declared and annointed Bush, in a one time only judgment, to be King, I mean President.</p>
<p>The Dems in the House and the Senate did not dispute this and allowed the electoral college to deliver it&#8217;s fraudulently arrived at votes. And most of us sat by, thinking it couldn&#8217;t be sooooo bad, so we tolerated their decision. And we had a national press who laid down and refused to question anything about the Governor from Texas and his checkered past. Nor did they question the ways in which he was elected, Years later we hear about voter caging and denial of votes to minorities in the very state that &#8220;delivered&#8221; the electoral college to Bush, a state governed by his own brother. And yet still most of the mainstream press ignores it.</p>
<p>We saw in 2002 how real war heros like Max Cleland were tarred and papered as weak and pro-enemy. Accused by chickenhawks of their own worst failings and shortcomings. And still we sat idly by. Shopping and re-financing our homes, buying Hummers, cheap Chinese made goods from WalMart and oil from Saudi Arabia.</p>
<p>We saw again in 2004, how another true war hero could be slandered and hatred drummed up against him and his wife. And he sat idly by without fighting against those who so slandered him. And we saw again, even more voter caging. And yet another stolen election.</p>
<p>People who care deeply about politics, about who is our President and who controls our houses of congress have become disenheartened. We realize our vote very often is not even counted.</p>
<p>But what did this disenheartened people do? We arose en mass to take back the People&#8217;s house and to wrest the Senate from the plutocrats and oligarcs in 2006. We overcame all the default fake vote counts supplied by Diebold et al. And we knew from the reporting of Greg Palast and others that the default was 3%. And we overcame that. Our anger and our fear drove many, many more of us to the polls. For a non-presidential election, it was a huge turnout, which is why they couldn&#8217;t steal it.</p>
<p>And what did we get for that? Yes, control of both houses of Congress. And they&#8217;ve passed some good bills most sentient beings appreciate. And they&#8217;ve had some great inspective hearings.</p>
<p>But have they halted or scaled back the war? Have they stopped some of the more egregious power grabs by the executive branch? Have they condemned any of the traitors within? Hell have they condemned anyone other than MoveOn or the Iranians? Have they actively worked to stop a new war with Iran?</p>
<p>The answer is no. Impeachment is off the table, and so must ending the occupation be too. The theft of America&#8217;s youth and her purse are well and truly acceeded to by both parties.</p>
<p>The fact that the Dems will not stand up for the people of this country is why Congress&#8217;s approval rating is fixin&#8217; to enter the single digits. We&#8217;ve known from the past 6 years that no Republican will ever listen to their constituents or frankly &#8220;give a flying fuck&#8221;(YAY Kurt Vonnegut quote!) about them. We&#8217;ve had it shoved in our faces these last 9 months that neither will the Dems.</p>
<p>I fear that the voter apathy will only increase. We voted Dems and for what? More of the same.</p>
<p>The Dems are now in full ownership society role. They refuse to end the war, &#8220;it&#8217;s too hard&#8221;; they refuse to impeach, &#8220;it&#8217;s off the table, too hard, takes too much time and we can&#8217;t multi-task and do that and get bills passed so Dubs can veto.&#8221;</p>
<p>I fear the people are so sick and disgusted with the entire electoral process that they may actually sit out the &#8216;08 election.</p>
<p>The birth of apathy has many mothers. A disengaged electorate is sired by many fathers. The rape of your one voice is mere sleight of hand and leaves very little CSI: VotingBooth evidence. But knowing from empirical facts that your voice may not be counted, that your opinion does not matter, that your thoughts and hopes and dreams are for naught surely weighs most heavy. If they don&#8217;t count my vote, why should I take the time and effort to go and actually vote?</p>
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		<title>By: DMcD</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29623</link>
		<dc:creator>DMcD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 08:01:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29623</guid>
		<description>DEMOCRACY was a GOOD IDEA ------ WHILE IT LASTED !!

THANX for that ---- RED STATES !!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DEMOCRACY was a GOOD IDEA &#8212;&#8212; WHILE IT LASTED !!</p>
<p>THANX for that &#8212;- RED STATES !!</p>
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		<title>By: taters</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29607</link>
		<dc:creator>taters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 02:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29607</guid>
		<description>Reasons to Vote For Ron Paul!!

Do we really need a FAA? 

If I wanna get shitfaced and drive a car, isn’t that my business? I mean as long as I don’t hurt anyone, right?

Why do we have mining regulations? They know what they’re getting into.

States and local municipalities should decide if they want public education.

Why should I have to be insured if I drive?

If a 12 year old kid can put in 60 hours a week at a steel mill, why shouldn’t a company be able to hire him or her? &lt;em&gt;We need to stop killing the spirit of entrepeneurship in this country&lt;/em&gt;. 

It should be legal to get a Barrett .50 cal sniper rifle off the internet, w/armor piercing capabilities, without a background check or proof of ID. We have too many laws on the books as is. And if terrorists and the military have rocket launchers - well shouldn’t I be able me to get one?

&lt;strong&gt;WHY SHOULDN’T FIRST COUSINS BE ABLE TO MARRY?&lt;/strong&gt; Where in the constitution does it say anything about that? I challenge you.

If you, like me, want government off your back - vote Ron Paul!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reasons to Vote For Ron Paul!!</p>
<p>Do we really need a FAA? </p>
<p>If I wanna get shitfaced and drive a car, isn’t that my business? I mean as long as I don’t hurt anyone, right?</p>
<p>Why do we have mining regulations? They know what they’re getting into.</p>
<p>States and local municipalities should decide if they want public education.</p>
<p>Why should I have to be insured if I drive?</p>
<p>If a 12 year old kid can put in 60 hours a week at a steel mill, why shouldn’t a company be able to hire him or her? <em>We need to stop killing the spirit of entrepeneurship in this country</em>. </p>
<p>It should be legal to get a Barrett .50 cal sniper rifle off the internet, w/armor piercing capabilities, without a background check or proof of ID. We have too many laws on the books as is. And if terrorists and the military have rocket launchers &#8211; well shouldn’t I be able me to get one?</p>
<p><strong>WHY SHOULDN’T FIRST COUSINS BE ABLE TO MARRY?</strong> Where in the constitution does it say anything about that? I challenge you.</p>
<p>If you, like me, want government off your back &#8211; vote Ron Paul!</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29606</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 02:49:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29606</guid>
		<description>&quot;&lt;i&gt;Millions voted in 2004 and together their votes changed the makeup of Congress.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Which has, so far, turned out to be a nearly pointless exercise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;<i>Millions voted in 2004 and together their votes changed the makeup of Congress.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Which has, so far, turned out to be a nearly pointless exercise.</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29605</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 02:45:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29605</guid>
		<description>Moodi?!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Moodi?!</p>
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		<title>By: Fred C. Dobbs</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29594</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred C. Dobbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 23:32:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29594</guid>
		<description>I think it was Brett Butler who said the she thought we needed a revolution, but that she was afraid that she wouldn&#039;t be able to get any good Moisturizer if we did.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it was Brett Butler who said the she thought we needed a revolution, but that she was afraid that she wouldn&#8217;t be able to get any good Moisturizer if we did.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred C. Dobbs</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29593</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred C. Dobbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 23:29:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29593</guid>
		<description>If you were sick and tired of Nancy Reagan, imagine how tough it would be to endure Princess (soon to be queen) Judith.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you were sick and tired of Nancy Reagan, imagine how tough it would be to endure Princess (soon to be queen) Judith.</p>
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		<title>By: lester</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29578</link>
		<dc:creator>lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:50:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29578</guid>
		<description>leslie-  exposoing abu graib didn&#039;t end the war.  we can , at best, embarass various politicians.  

while  the beltway is isolated and powerful,  the executive branch is even more isolated and even more powerful.  they would bomb iran as soon as order pizza. 

  Nothing good can come out of washington, I don&#039;t care if you elect Gandhi and the legistalture is run by ...really smart people.  BULLDOZE THE BELTWAY</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>leslie-  exposoing abu graib didn&#8217;t end the war.  we can , at best, embarass various politicians.  </p>
<p>while  the beltway is isolated and powerful,  the executive branch is even more isolated and even more powerful.  they would bomb iran as soon as order pizza. </p>
<p>  Nothing good can come out of washington, I don&#8217;t care if you elect Gandhi and the legistalture is run by &#8230;really smart people.  BULLDOZE THE BELTWAY</p>
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		<title>By: Delia</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29577</link>
		<dc:creator>Delia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 21:20:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/09/29/john-dean-public-apathy-aids-bush-friday-open-thread/#comment-29577</guid>
		<description>Furthermore, if there is a march the media
a - ignores it
b - underreports it
c - focuses on the craziest participants, no matter how small a minority and spends all the time filming them in order to marginalize and diminish the importance of the whole event.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Furthermore, if there is a march the media<br />
a &#8211; ignores it<br />
b &#8211; underreports it<br />
c &#8211; focuses on the craziest participants, no matter how small a minority and spends all the time filming them in order to marginalize and diminish the importance of the whole event.</p>
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