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	<title>Comments on: Waterboarding and Torture</title>
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		<title>By: wan optimizers compared</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-1027895</link>
		<dc:creator>wan optimizers compared</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 09:12:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;strong&gt;wan optimizers compared...&lt;/strong&gt;

I\&#039;ve found that in our network WAN accelerators have made a big difference...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>wan optimizers compared&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>I\&#8217;ve found that in our network WAN accelerators have made a big difference&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: jeux casino en ligne</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-340374</link>
		<dc:creator>jeux casino en ligne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 10:15:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-340374</guid>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>tournois de poker gratuites</strong></p>
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		<title>By: AMERICAN NONSENSE &#187; Do You Believe Kiriakou?</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-82580</link>
		<dc:creator>AMERICAN NONSENSE &#187; Do You Believe Kiriakou?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Dec 2007 21:01:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-82580</guid>
		<description>[...] any evidence at all that Kiriakou is telling the truth. &#160;Larry Johnson has already expressed his doubt that Kiriakou is telling the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] any evidence at all that Kiriakou is telling the truth. &nbsp;Larry Johnson has already expressed his doubt that Kiriakou is telling the [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: reggie</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-81917</link>
		<dc:creator>reggie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Dec 2007 18:03:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-81917</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://legofesto.blogspot.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Waterboarding: Charlie Don&#039;t Surf&lt;/a&gt;

&#039;Malcolm Nance, an advisor on terrorism to the US departments of Homeland Security, Special Operations and Intelligence, publicly denounced the practice. He revealed that waterboarding is used in training at the US Navy&#039;s Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School in San Diego, and claimed to have witnessed and supervised &quot;hundreds&quot; of waterboarding exercises. Although these last only a few minutes and take place under medical supervision, he concluded that &quot;waterboarding is a torture technique – period&quot;.

&lt;strong&gt;The practice involves strapping the person being interrogated on to a board as pints of water are forced into his lungs through a cloth covering his face while the victim&#039;s mouth is forced open. Its effect, according to Mr Nance, is a process of slow-motion suffocation.

Typically, a victim goes into hysterics on the board as water fills his lungs. &quot;How much the victim is to drown,&quot; Mr Nance wrote in an article for the Small Wars Journal, &quot;depends on the desired result and the obstinacy of the subject.

&quot;A team doctor watches the quantity of water that is ingested and for the physiological signs which show when the drowning effect goes from painful psychological experience to horrific, suffocating punishment, to the final death spiral. For the uninitiated, it is horrifying to watch.&quot;&#039;
&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://legofesto.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">Waterboarding: Charlie Don&#8217;t Surf</a></p>
<p>&#8216;Malcolm Nance, an advisor on terrorism to the US departments of Homeland Security, Special Operations and Intelligence, publicly denounced the practice. He revealed that waterboarding is used in training at the US Navy&#8217;s Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School in San Diego, and claimed to have witnessed and supervised &#8220;hundreds&#8221; of waterboarding exercises. Although these last only a few minutes and take place under medical supervision, he concluded that &#8220;waterboarding is a torture technique – period&#8221;.</p>
<p><strong>The practice involves strapping the person being interrogated on to a board as pints of water are forced into his lungs through a cloth covering his face while the victim&#8217;s mouth is forced open. Its effect, according to Mr Nance, is a process of slow-motion suffocation.</p>
<p>Typically, a victim goes into hysterics on the board as water fills his lungs. &#8220;How much the victim is to drown,&#8221; Mr Nance wrote in an article for the Small Wars Journal, &#8220;depends on the desired result and the obstinacy of the subject.</p>
<p>&#8220;A team doctor watches the quantity of water that is ingested and for the physiological signs which show when the drowning effect goes from painful psychological experience to horrific, suffocating punishment, to the final death spiral. For the uninitiated, it is horrifying to watch.&#8221;&#8216;<br />
</strong></p>
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		<title>By: Mr.Murder</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80784</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr.Murder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Dec 2007 03:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80784</guid>
		<description>&quot;The Dread Pirate Bin Laden


How thinking of terrorists as pirates can help win the war on terror.&quot;


By Douglas R. Burgess Jr.
http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/July-August-2005/feature_burgess_julaug05.msp

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;INTERNATIONAL LAW LACKS A DEFINITION FOR TERRORISM as a crime. According to Secretary General Kofi Annan, this lack has hampered &quot;the moral authority of the United Nations and its strength in condemning&quot; the scourge. 

But attempts to provide a definition have failed because of terrorists&#039; strangely hybrid status in the law. They are neither ordinary criminals nor recognized state actors, so there is almost no international or domestic law dealing with them. This gives an out to countries that harbor terrorists and declare them &quot;freedom fighters.&quot; It also lets the United States flout its own constitutional safeguards by holding suspects captive indefinitely at Guantánamo Bay. The overall situation is, in a word, anarchic. 

...

Coming up with such a framework would perhaps seem impossible, except that one already exists. Dusty and anachronistic, perhaps, but viable all the same. More than 2,000 years ago, Marcus Tullius Cicero defined pirates in Roman law as hostis humani generis, &quot;enemies of the human race.&quot; From that day until now, pirates have held a unique status in the law as international criminals subject to universal jurisdiction—meaning that they may be captured wherever they are found, by any person who finds them. The ongoing war against pirates is the only known example of state vs. nonstate conflict until the advent of the war on terror, and its history is long and notable. More important, there are enormous potential benefits of applying this legal definition to contemporary terrorism. 

AT FIRST GLANCE, THE CORRELATION BETWEEN PIRACY AND TERRORISM seems a stretch. Yet much of the basis of this skepticism can be traced to romantic and inaccurate notions about piracy. An examination of the actual history of the crime reveals startling, even astonishing, parallels to contemporary international terrorism. Viewed in its proper historical context, piracy emerges as a clear and powerful precedent. &quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Read this today in a football archive that links the above story.


International law has quite a precedent in dealing with piracy, even in addressing state sponsorship of those acting outside borders...
&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;This was codified explicitly in the 1856 Declaration of Paris, and it has been reiterated as a guiding principle of piracy law ever since. Ironically, it is the very effectiveness of this criminalization that has marginalized piracy and made it seem an arcane and almost romantic offense. &lt;b&gt;Pirates no longer terrorize the seas because a concerted effort among the European states in the 19th century almost eradicated them&lt;/b&gt;. It is just such a concerted effort that all states must now undertake against terrorists, until the crime of terrorism becomes as remote and obsolete as piracy.&quot; &lt;/blockquote&gt;

This matches every demand we have in dealing with the topic at this time:
&lt;blockquote&gt;If the war on terror becomes akin to war against the pirates, however, the situation would change. First, the crime of terrorism would be defined and proscribed internationally, and terrorists would be properly understood as enemies of all states. This legal status carries significant advantages, chief among them the possibility of universal jurisdiction. Terrorists, as hostis humani generis, could be captured wherever they were found, by anyone who found them. Pirates are currently the only form of criminals subject to this special jurisdiction. 

Second, &lt;strong&gt;this definition would deter states from harboring terrorists on the grounds that they are &quot;freedom fighters&quot; by providing an objective distinction in law between legitimate insurgency and outright terrorism.&lt;/strong&gt; This same objective definition could, conversely, also &lt;em&gt;deter states from cracking down on political dissidents as &quot;terrorists,&quot;&lt;/em&gt; as both Russia and China have done against their dissidents. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Imagine that, by adhering tot he International Court we could actually strenghthen and reinforce Democracy. Something George W. Bush is more than pleased claim is his vision, like Johnny Appleseed, tossing Napalm, White Phosphorous, Rendition and Torture, anti personnel minds packaged similar to various  relief items, and targeting of civilians all over the world. Like some legendary good tidings from am an in burlap with fruity presents for every village he wanders upon.

It takes a Village Idiot. Burlap would make fine clothing for the Boy King, seeing as now the Emporer Wears No Clothes...

Alas, all the logic that could propel such prosecution of terror is disabled by Bushco. and its policy in protecting certain persons such as Mr.Kissinger:

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;Third, and perhaps most important, &lt;strong&gt;nations that now balk at assisting the United States in the war on terror might have fewer reservations if terrorism were defined as an international crime that could be prosecuted before the International Criminal Court&lt;/strong&gt;.&quot; &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Et tu, AWOL?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Dread Pirate Bin Laden</p>
<p>How thinking of terrorists as pirates can help win the war on terror.&#8221;</p>
<p>By Douglas R. Burgess Jr.<br />
<a href="http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/July-August-2005/feature_burgess_julaug05.msp" rel="nofollow">http://www.legalaffairs.org/issues/July-August-2005/feature_burgess_julaug05.msp</a></p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;INTERNATIONAL LAW LACKS A DEFINITION FOR TERRORISM as a crime. According to Secretary General Kofi Annan, this lack has hampered &#8220;the moral authority of the United Nations and its strength in condemning&#8221; the scourge. </p>
<p>But attempts to provide a definition have failed because of terrorists&#8217; strangely hybrid status in the law. They are neither ordinary criminals nor recognized state actors, so there is almost no international or domestic law dealing with them. This gives an out to countries that harbor terrorists and declare them &#8220;freedom fighters.&#8221; It also lets the United States flout its own constitutional safeguards by holding suspects captive indefinitely at Guantánamo Bay. The overall situation is, in a word, anarchic. </p>
<p>&#8230;</p>
<p>Coming up with such a framework would perhaps seem impossible, except that one already exists. Dusty and anachronistic, perhaps, but viable all the same. More than 2,000 years ago, Marcus Tullius Cicero defined pirates in Roman law as hostis humani generis, &#8220;enemies of the human race.&#8221; From that day until now, pirates have held a unique status in the law as international criminals subject to universal jurisdiction—meaning that they may be captured wherever they are found, by any person who finds them. The ongoing war against pirates is the only known example of state vs. nonstate conflict until the advent of the war on terror, and its history is long and notable. More important, there are enormous potential benefits of applying this legal definition to contemporary terrorism. </p>
<p>AT FIRST GLANCE, THE CORRELATION BETWEEN PIRACY AND TERRORISM seems a stretch. Yet much of the basis of this skepticism can be traced to romantic and inaccurate notions about piracy. An examination of the actual history of the crime reveals startling, even astonishing, parallels to contemporary international terrorism. Viewed in its proper historical context, piracy emerges as a clear and powerful precedent. &#8220;</p></blockquote>
<p>Read this today in a football archive that links the above story.</p>
<p>International law has quite a precedent in dealing with piracy, even in addressing state sponsorship of those acting outside borders&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;This was codified explicitly in the 1856 Declaration of Paris, and it has been reiterated as a guiding principle of piracy law ever since. Ironically, it is the very effectiveness of this criminalization that has marginalized piracy and made it seem an arcane and almost romantic offense. <b>Pirates no longer terrorize the seas because a concerted effort among the European states in the 19th century almost eradicated them</b>. It is just such a concerted effort that all states must now undertake against terrorists, until the crime of terrorism becomes as remote and obsolete as piracy.&#8221; </p></blockquote>
<p>This matches every demand we have in dealing with the topic at this time:</p>
<blockquote><p>If the war on terror becomes akin to war against the pirates, however, the situation would change. First, the crime of terrorism would be defined and proscribed internationally, and terrorists would be properly understood as enemies of all states. This legal status carries significant advantages, chief among them the possibility of universal jurisdiction. Terrorists, as hostis humani generis, could be captured wherever they were found, by anyone who found them. Pirates are currently the only form of criminals subject to this special jurisdiction. </p>
<p>Second, <strong>this definition would deter states from harboring terrorists on the grounds that they are &#8220;freedom fighters&#8221; by providing an objective distinction in law between legitimate insurgency and outright terrorism.</strong> This same objective definition could, conversely, also <em>deter states from cracking down on political dissidents as &#8220;terrorists,&#8221;</em> as both Russia and China have done against their dissidents. </p></blockquote>
<p>Imagine that, by adhering tot he International Court we could actually strenghthen and reinforce Democracy. Something George W. Bush is more than pleased claim is his vision, like Johnny Appleseed, tossing Napalm, White Phosphorous, Rendition and Torture, anti personnel minds packaged similar to various  relief items, and targeting of civilians all over the world. Like some legendary good tidings from am an in burlap with fruity presents for every village he wanders upon.</p>
<p>It takes a Village Idiot. Burlap would make fine clothing for the Boy King, seeing as now the Emporer Wears No Clothes&#8230;</p>
<p>Alas, all the logic that could propel such prosecution of terror is disabled by Bushco. and its policy in protecting certain persons such as Mr.Kissinger:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Third, and perhaps most important, <strong>nations that now balk at assisting the United States in the war on terror might have fewer reservations if terrorism were defined as an international crime that could be prosecuted before the International Criminal Court</strong>.&#8221; </p></blockquote>
<p>Et tu, AWOL?</p>
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		<title>By: Buck Naked Politics</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80507</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck Naked Politics</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 23:04:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80507</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;More on the John Kiriakou Interview and &quot;Enhanced Interrogation&quot;...&lt;/strong&gt;

Posted by Damozel &#124; According to ABC News, the CIA is pretty upset with John Kiriakou. (ABC) They reportedly aren&#039;t going to prosecute him for revealing classified information, cooler heads having prevailed, but that doesn&#039;t mean they aren&#039;t upset a...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>More on the John Kiriakou Interview and &#8220;Enhanced Interrogation&#8221;&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>Posted by Damozel | According to ABC News, the CIA is pretty upset with John Kiriakou. (ABC) They reportedly aren&#8217;t going to prosecute him for revealing classified information, cooler heads having prevailed, but that doesn&#8217;t mean they aren&#8217;t upset a&#8230;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Retired</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80480</link>
		<dc:creator>Retired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:23:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80480</guid>
		<description>For an interested write up on this topic, see:
 http://thespywhobilledme.com/the_spy_who_billed_me/2007/05/outsourced_dirt.html

from the May 2007 archives of The Spy Who Billed Me website.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For an interested write up on this topic, see:<br />
 <a href="http://thespywhobilledme.com/the_spy_who_billed_me/2007/05/outsourced_dirt.html" rel="nofollow">http://thespywhobilledme.com/the_spy_who_billed_me/2007/05/outsourced_dirt.html</a></p>
<p>from the May 2007 archives of The Spy Who Billed Me website.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80468</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:57:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80468</guid>
		<description>The ones in Iraq are. Don&#039;t know about the others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The ones in Iraq are. Don&#8217;t know about the others.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Retired</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80430</link>
		<dc:creator>Retired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:53:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80430</guid>
		<description>&quot;Leaked footage?&quot;  Is that some type of pun?  This is an obvious fabrication.  Come on, if you guys are going to fake something, you can do better than that.  Another red pill moment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Leaked footage?&#8221;  Is that some type of pun?  This is an obvious fabrication.  Come on, if you guys are going to fake something, you can do better than that.  Another red pill moment.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: reggie</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80426</link>
		<dc:creator>reggie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80426</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dandare.org.uk/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Mekon&lt;/a&gt;

Now tell me they weren&#039;t separated at birth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.dandare.org.uk/" rel="nofollow">The Mekon</a></p>
<p>Now tell me they weren&#8217;t separated at birth.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Retired</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80424</link>
		<dc:creator>Retired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:45:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80424</guid>
		<description>No, I am by no means pro-Republican.  I was a colleague of Valerie&#039;s, and I think what was done to her and her family by this administration was not only a betrayal of her personally but of every American intelligence officer who risks his or her life more often then many realize to try and get accurate information back to decision makers.  I have said this many times on this blog.  And we do agree on one thing: let the chips fall where they may.  Let those who were actually at those briefings, including the working level intelligence officers who were actually giving the briefings and received direct, face-to-face feedback from members of the oversight committees, both Republican and Democrat, tell their story without fear of reprisal and budget cutting by vengeful members of Congress and the administration.  That is the threat, no matter who is in power, and that is why we have always kept silent.  Perhaps until now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I am by no means pro-Republican.  I was a colleague of Valerie&#8217;s, and I think what was done to her and her family by this administration was not only a betrayal of her personally but of every American intelligence officer who risks his or her life more often then many realize to try and get accurate information back to decision makers.  I have said this many times on this blog.  And we do agree on one thing: let the chips fall where they may.  Let those who were actually at those briefings, including the working level intelligence officers who were actually giving the briefings and received direct, face-to-face feedback from members of the oversight committees, both Republican and Democrat, tell their story without fear of reprisal and budget cutting by vengeful members of Congress and the administration.  That is the threat, no matter who is in power, and that is why we have always kept silent.  Perhaps until now.</p>
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		<title>By: reggie</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80420</link>
		<dc:creator>reggie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:42:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80420</guid>
		<description>Is it just me, or does Michael Hayden bear a striking resemblance to The Mekon? (http://www.dandare.org.uk/)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it just me, or does Michael Hayden bear a striking resemblance to The Mekon? (<a href="http://www.dandare.org.uk/)" rel="nofollow">http://www.dandare.org.uk/)</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Retired</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80415</link>
		<dc:creator>Retired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80415</guid>
		<description>&quot;Goss, who saw the 2002 and later briefings because he was the ranking GOP member of the House intel committee (just like Pelosi and Harman were the Dem members of the same committee), was tapped in 2004 to run the CIA. He brought with him a guy named Jose Rodriguez. It was Rodriguez who trashed the torture tapes in 2005 — under Goss’ watch — in direct defiance of a court order.&quot;

For those who were actually there, we now know the limitations of PW&#039;s access.  Goss didn&#039;t &quot;bring Jose with him&quot; when he became DCI.  Jose is a career DO officer who, in fact, was still a bit in the doghouse when Goss arrived because of an earlier incident.  Jose was appointed DDO because he was pretty much the only top level DO officer left when Goss and the Gosslings purged the senior DO ranks and the DDO and ADDO resigned in protest.

And who is your pro-Pelosi/Harmon &quot;anonymous source&quot;?  Those who know me are cracking up at your assertion that I&#039;m speaking for Porter Goss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Goss, who saw the 2002 and later briefings because he was the ranking GOP member of the House intel committee (just like Pelosi and Harman were the Dem members of the same committee), was tapped in 2004 to run the CIA. He brought with him a guy named Jose Rodriguez. It was Rodriguez who trashed the torture tapes in 2005 — under Goss’ watch — in direct defiance of a court order.&#8221;</p>
<p>For those who were actually there, we now know the limitations of PW&#8217;s access.  Goss didn&#8217;t &#8220;bring Jose with him&#8221; when he became DCI.  Jose is a career DO officer who, in fact, was still a bit in the doghouse when Goss arrived because of an earlier incident.  Jose was appointed DDO because he was pretty much the only top level DO officer left when Goss and the Gosslings purged the senior DO ranks and the DDO and ADDO resigned in protest.</p>
<p>And who is your pro-Pelosi/Harmon &#8220;anonymous source&#8221;?  Those who know me are cracking up at your assertion that I&#8217;m speaking for Porter Goss.</p>
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		<title>By: Retired</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80404</link>
		<dc:creator>Retired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:14:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80404</guid>
		<description>Take the red pill and believe what you want, PW.  Both Pelosi and Harmon saw videos of the sites and the techniques and they approved of them.  Neither was the least bit indignant at the time of the briefings, which were relatively close to 2001.  Their statements and letters are very carefully crafted and Harmon&#039;s loss of memory on the details of what she heard and saw very convenient.  If Pelosi and Harmon really felt strongly that the techniques were breaking the law, or immoral, why didn&#039;t they take stronger action?  Because in the closed briefings, they concurred.  Politically, they had to.  If someone like Kiriakous had surfaced and said that waterboarding only took 30 seconds and could save lives back in 2002 and 2003, Pelosi and Harmon would&#039;ve been laughed out of their press conferences by most Americans who had the memory of 9/11 fresh in their minds.  These ladies are saints.  They are politicians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Take the red pill and believe what you want, PW.  Both Pelosi and Harmon saw videos of the sites and the techniques and they approved of them.  Neither was the least bit indignant at the time of the briefings, which were relatively close to 2001.  Their statements and letters are very carefully crafted and Harmon&#8217;s loss of memory on the details of what she heard and saw very convenient.  If Pelosi and Harmon really felt strongly that the techniques were breaking the law, or immoral, why didn&#8217;t they take stronger action?  Because in the closed briefings, they concurred.  Politically, they had to.  If someone like Kiriakous had surfaced and said that waterboarding only took 30 seconds and could save lives back in 2002 and 2003, Pelosi and Harmon would&#8217;ve been laughed out of their press conferences by most Americans who had the memory of 9/11 fresh in their minds.  These ladies are saints.  They are politicians.</p>
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		<title>By: Sometime-CIA-Defender</title>
		<link>http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80402</link>
		<dc:creator>Sometime-CIA-Defender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:12:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2007/12/11/waterboarding-and-torture/#comment-80402</guid>
		<description>Saw Michael Baker on MSNBC this morning and what&#039;s-his-name last night on Abrams.  The latter stated that he believes waterboarding to be torture (now, but not back then).  Baker on the other hand said it was just a matter of what was legal, and talk of what is good and evil (and by extension what is ethical?) is irrelevant.  Hence my screen name.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Saw Michael Baker on MSNBC this morning and what&#8217;s-his-name last night on Abrams.  The latter stated that he believes waterboarding to be torture (now, but not back then).  Baker on the other hand said it was just a matter of what was legal, and talk of what is good and evil (and by extension what is ethical?) is irrelevant.  Hence my screen name.</p>
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