Our Nation’s “Lonely Eyes” Seek A Savior
By SusanUnPC on January 4, 2008 at 10:32 PM in Bush/Cheney, Clinton, Current Affairs, Democrats, John Edwards, Obama, Presidential Candidates
What’s behind the astonishing successes of Mike Huckabee’s and Barack Obama’s campaigns last night in Iowa? BBC correspondent Katty Kay knows. People are “fed up,” she said tonight on BBCAmerica’s exceptional hour-long news program, BBC World News America. Ms. Kay continued:
It’s the wonderful age-old mantra of “I can fix it for you by being an outsider. I am on your side.”
We are “fed up” alright. We, the people of this nation, are so desperate to get past the Bush administration that we’ve been obsessing since last year about the race for a president who won’t take office until late January 2009. In the last of his series of columns for The Guardian — which The New Yorker’s Hendrik Hertzberg says is “an unparalleled running history of the ideological and moral squalor of the George W. Bush Administration” — Sidney Blumenthal summed up how far America has fallen:
Every aspect of George Bush’s foreign policy has now collapsed. Every dream of neoconservatism has become a nightmare. Every doctrine has turned to dust. The influence of the United States has reached a nadir, its lowest point since before the second world war, when the country was encased in isolationism. [...]
The quest for absolute power has not forged an “empire” but provoked ever-widening chaos. … Squandering the immense influence of the US in such a short period has required monumental effort. [...]
But this is not rock-bottom. There is further to fall.
About the “neoconservatives” who wrought this catastrophe, Blumenthal notes that, for them, “Self-examination is too painful and in any case unfamiliar.” So too is “self-examination” too painful and unfamiliar to most Americans, especially how they got themselves in this horrific mess with Mr. Bush. Indomitable and hegemonic as Americans been for so very long, we, as a people, are not given to the sobering habits of self-questioning or self-doubting. So, instead of self-examination, the American people have rushed heart-long into paroxysmal love affairs with saviors who promise them a “new morning” in America — like a dying patient who is willing to try any quick-fix treatment, undeterred by sober warnings about quackery.
The mantra of “I can fix it for you by being an outsider. I am on your side” is an elixir for humiliated, desperate and frightened people. Fittingly, the conservative Hoover Institution’s Shelby Steele talked on Charlie Rose’s post-Iowa show about the “magic appeal” of Barack Obama. He represents “dramatic change,” said Steele. Obama is a “bargainer,” Steele continued. He’s someone “basically who makes a bargain with white America saying that I won’t rub America’s shameful history of racism in your face if you won’t hold my race against me. And whites show a lot of gratitude for that kind of a bargain. Oprah Winfrey is a classic bargainer. They have a special magic.”
“You’d have to have a heart of stone not to feel moved by this.,” writes David Brooks, the conservative New York Times columnist, about Obama’s Iowa win. Pragmatism and “political substance” are out; “personal uplift” and idealism are in.
Conservative speech writer Peggy Noonan, in the Wall Street Journal, uses the word “huge” — three times — to describe Obama’s victory. “[S]omething new begins on the Democratic side,” pens Ms. Noonan, with Obama’s message, which she italicizes: “Look at who I am and see me, the change that you desire is right here, move on with me and we will bring it forward together.”
“Look at who I am and see me, the change that you desire is right here, move on with me and we will bring it forward together.” If that’s not “ethereal,” I don’t know what is.
“[S]omething new begins.” What exactly that might be, we have no idea. But Ms. Noonan urges us to believe.
But, suspicious as I am, I have to wonder why conservatives like David Brooks, Peggy Noonan, Shelby Steele — and, also today, Karl Rove and rightwing Web sites like RedState.com and even Free Republic — are gloating over Obama’s victory.
Suspicious as I am, I think that perhaps I should have titled this article, “Republicans Celebrate Obama Iowa Win: Obama Sized Up As Weakest Democrat.”
Mark Crispin Miller hits on the problem with, as I wrote about the other day, Obama’s “mushmelon bipartisanship”:
In his big summary speech in Iowa the other day, while going on and on and on about the “change” that he keeps saying he represents, [Obama] said that “it’s change that won’t just come from more anger at Washington, or turning up the heat on Republicans.” With his gaze, as ever, nobly fixed on some bright galaxy far, far away, he added: There’s no shortage of anger and bluster and bitter partisanship out there. We don’t need more heat. We need more light.”
Now, I’m as keen on civilized relations as the next man; but if the next man is a fascist, it would be foolish to expect him to reciprocate. …
Larry Johnson laid it out first and best in his “give ‘em no quarter” piece, “Why Are the Rightwing Republicans Hyping Obama?”
Following close on the heels of Obama endorsements from the neoconservative Weekly Standard and the conservative Republican newspaper the Sioux City Journal, yet another conservative Republican newspaper the Dallas Morning News has now rushed to support Obama.
There’s definitely an Obama bandwagon out there – built and pushed by Republican neocons eager to put another right-wing Republican in the White House.
There is no question in my mind that the right views Obama as the one Democrat most easy to beat in a general election.
Larry points out the motivators behind the Kumbayah praise from all of these conservatives and right-wingers:
Could it be because his positions on the crucial issues of health care and Social Security are closer to those of the Republican right wing than those of any other Democratic contender?
Could it be because his pose of rejecting what the Morning News calls “the divisive politics of the past” make him an easier mark for Republican leaders who still go down the line with the partisan and hyper-divisive George Bush and Dick Cheney?
These Republicans have proved for many, many years that they are all for divisive politics, so as long as it helps the right. So maybe that’s why they are promoting a Democrat who talks like Barack Obama does – and why they loathe the prospect of running against tested fighters like Hillary Clinton and John Edwards.
Or maybe it’s just that these Republicans just want the Democrats to nominate someone they know will be easy to best. Yes, I know some polls suggest Obama does better in a nationwide match up. If you buy that nonsense let me sell you a bridge.
Does anybody seriously doubt that the Dallas Morning News – or the Sioux City Journal or the Weekly Standard–or Karl Rove – who have all hyped Obama, will all support the Republican nominee in the fall election …?
Me? All I can hope for is that voters — so desperate to feel good again about themselves and, most of all, their country — will see that it’s the Republicans who most want them to see their savior in Barack Obama. All I can hope for is that those Americans, somehow, will sober up and take a hard look — why, even a pragmatic “due diligence” review — before it’s too late.
While besotted voters are awe-struck, the conservatives are having the time of their lives, lying in wait, for an untested Barack Obama they can defeat in a general election. The conservative bloggers at Hot Air are giggling themselves silly over Hillary’s runner-up position. And here’s the image up last night, and all day today, at a smirking RedState.com:
And Clinton enemy Dick Morris? He’s so ecstatic that he links Barack Obama’s speech last night at the top of his column today. Then he says:
THE amazing victories by Barack Obama and Mike Huckabee in Iowa last night are truly historic. They demonstrate the impact and viability of a message of change in both parties.
Dick Morris adds this laughable, and cruelly untrue, statement to buttress his promotion of Obama:
On the Democratic side, Obama - by winning in a totally white state - shows that racism is gone as a factor in American politics.
Racism is gone? My god. Morris is so eager to bash Hillary and get Obama as the candidate-to-beat in the general election that he indulges in utter fantasy.
Morris then denigrates experience:
Her campaign professionals (including Bill) decided to stress experience, precisely the wrong message in a Democratic primary. Prematurely appealing to the center and abandoning the left, she fell between two chairs - not sufficiently centrist to win independents or liberal enough to attract Democrats.
Morris is still worried though. He’s worried that Democrats will take a hard look at Obama, and get past their giddiness:
With the limelight comes the spotlight. Obama will be subject to the scrutiny that comes with being the leader. Can he weather the examination?
Perhaps not. Democrats may turn on him, worried that he may not win in November. The doubts about Obama, up to now hidden behind concerns about Hillary’s candidacy, will be on center stage.
Morris remains upbeat about Huckabee and, more importantly, his ultimate target, Obama — who you can be sure he’ll fight against tooth and nail until November 2008:
Their appeals are truly unique and obviously resonate with voters. Their approaches are now and the outcome shows how relevant their message is.
“Their approaches are now?” What in the hell does that mean? “[H]ow relevant their message is”? Whatever that message actually is, Morris doesn’t make clear, mostly because the vagueness, the ethereality of that “message,” he knows, is what makes Obama such a prime target for a 24/7 attack during a general election.
Further, I contend, that to get past “the ideological and moral squalor of the George W. Bush Administration,” we’re going to need a hell of a lot more than a message. What we will really need is a president who can take charge before Day One and actually make change happen through true grit and hard work. Soaring speeches won’t go far in the relentless scrutiny of any presidency. And the promises that we can work with Republicans will fail, with depressing regularity, thanks to the day-to-day resistance of a Republican party that will be dedicated to destroying an Obama presidency.
If you still don’t believe me, read what a person posted at Free Republic. This is exactly the kind of tripe that Obama will face in a general election — and not just in print, but also in whispers across backyard fences:
Did the weakest Dem candidate for the general election won tonight? I think so.
By sending forth Hussein Osama out of Iowa, Democrats have unwittingly weakened their general election prospects.
Hussein’s exotic mixture of radical liberalism, Kwanzaa Socialism, antipathy towards the unborn, and weakness against his jihadi brethren will all come back to destroy him against almost any Republican opponent, even the snake-grope from Hope.
I think we as Republicans should be celebrating tonight at the coronation of Hussein, in whose presence millions of Democrat women, from elementary school teachers to journalism majors to law school grads to dykes on bikes will go weak in their knees.
As defenders of this great Republic, and of the pinnacle of Western civilization that it represents, we should all come together tonight and agree on a common strategy that will keep the White House from becoming a madrassa.
Don’t dismiss them as fringe crazies. That’s how a lot of Americans still think, even if they know better than to talk like that to you. (It’s no matter that Dick Morris doesn’t agree, at least in print.) And they’ll rush to the Republican candidate, and go “nuclear” to destroy Obama’s message.
The only mistake that that Free Republic nut made was to reveal their fondest wishes too early. He needs David Brooks and Karl Rove to explain the game plan to him.
Please heed Sidney Blumenthal’s warning:
But this is not rock-bottom. There is further to fall.
Indeed there is “further to fall.” And further we will surely fall if we end up with eight more years of a Republican presidency.



Thanks again for the sanity, Larry. Hope? Positive thinking? Spirit of cooperation? An end to the things that separate us? The partisan divide is all an illusion, a bad dream that will go away if we only elect a uniter?
I have seen this film before.
George Bush Cedar Rapids, Iowa 1999
The next president must close this gap of hope. It is the great challenge to America’s good heart. But changing our culture requires more than laws. Cultures change one heart, one soul, one conscience at a time. Government can spend money, but it can’t put hope in our hearts or a sense of purpose in our lives.
This country is hungry for a new style of campaign. Positive. Hopeful. Inclusive. A campaign that attracts new faces and new voices. A campaign that unites all Americans toward a better tomorrow. I say a better tomorrow because I’ve learned that people want to follow an optimist.
It feels to me like an old era of American politics is ending — like Americans are waiting for new hopes, new energy, new idealism. We will show that politics, after a time of tarnished ideals, can be higher and better. We will give our country a fresh start after a season of cynicism.
George W Bush,July 1999 Presidential campaign speech
This is where my campaign is headed. We will carry a message of hope and renewal to every community in this country. We will tell every American, “The dream is for you.” Tell forgotten children in failed schools, “The dream is for you.” Tell men and women in our decaying cities, “The dream is for you.” Tell confused young people, starved of ideals, “The dream is for you.”
As Americans, this is our creed and our calling. We stumble and splinter when we forget that goal. We unite and prosper when we remember it. No great calling is ever easy, and no work of man is ever perfect. But we can, in our imperfect way, rise now, where there is hatred, sowing love; where there is darkness, shedding light; where there is despair, bringing hope.
George W. Bush, A Victory Speech, December 2000
The spirit of cooperation is what is needed in Washington, D.C. It is the challenge of our moment….We must put politics behind us and work together to make the promise of America available for every one of our citizens.
I am optimistic that we can change the tone in Washington, D.C. Our nation must rise above a house divided. Americans share hopes and goals and values far more important than any political disagreements.
Our votes may differ, but not our hopes.
Together, guided by a spirit of common sense, common courtesy and common goals, we can unite and inspire the American citizens. We have discussed our differences. Now it is time to find common ground and build consensus to make America a beacon of opportunity. [...]
I was not elected to serve one party, but to serve one nation. The president of the United States is the president of every single American, of every race and every background.
Holy cow. That is just plain EERIE stuff. Thank you.
Yeah, Bush ran as an outsider…as if.
Sorry, this one was Susan’s, not Larry’s! Thanks to you then, Susan!
TY! Hurried to get it done because my friend Tim is bringing me groceries — he’s a former fellow Deaniac who remade an ugly old convenience store into a sparking, beautiful little organic grocery, and he’s been delivering me groceries since late October. Of course, we always end up chatting about politics! (He and his wife Sherry adopted the two cutest girls from China — they come along sometimes when he drops off my groceries.)
WMCB qoutes Bush:
….We must put politics behind us and work together to make the promise of America available for every one of our citizens
As we found out in hindsight, for a price.
SusanUnPC:
We’ve got COWS!!! (Gusting to 160 in Lake Tahoe)
Great job.
TY!
What??? The wind is 160 MPH?
Tim just left after delivering my groceries. He said it’s a good thing I stocked up because — grrrrr — we’re getting snow again. (I don’t listen to the ghastly local radio station — it’s all Limbaugh and O’Reilly — so I miss out on weather reports sometimes.)
LAKE TAHOE is so beautiful. Lucky you.
SNOW? When? It’s in the 40’s and raining.
The wind earlier was kinda wild though. Probably stronger out where you are.
It was completely unbelievable here! Shredding umbrellas, and blowing people this way and that, and the building was swaying and shaking on the upper floors.
It was REALLY cold here yesterday. An icy wind whipped right through several wool layers and a coat as if it were nothing. But it’s supposed to warm up over the weekend.
New York?
California?
Yup! It rained like crazy, and the wind was just unbelievable. I lost two loyal umbrellas to the storm. I felt oddly sad - they had been with me for quite some time.
And my hair looked SO CUTE when I left the house, and three steps out of the house I was wondering why I had bothered. I could have saved myself twenty minutes of primp time ’cause I was going to look like a cross between a drowned rat and a bag lady today no matter what. Today was one day when I really envied women who wear headscarves. Makes life so much simpler really.
No California; winecountry. Iwas watching the local weather and that what was reported in them there hills. It was so windy here it stripped the bark of the Eucyliptis out back. My yard is a mess. No kite flying today for sure.
Yeah, I heard it was a mess up there. They closed the Golden Gate bridge, too.
I haven’t been able to really check out my property because I got home after dark, but the roof is still on the house, the house appears intact and the electricity stayed on all day. I’ll take a look tomorrow.
Shirin, your beloved umbrellas, and your hair. … It is tough. My mom always wore those rain hats, but they’re so lame looking. Me, I gave up on umbrellas long ago. They always turned inside out in the wind, or I’d lose them. I have very thick, straight hair so the worst that can happen is that it hangs like planks of wood down along my cheeks.
Yeah - I have to give those poor umbrellas a decent send-off to the next world. They died doing their duty.
As for my hair, well, that was quite a tragedy, but I got through it.
This is playing at the Roxy in SF with a Q&A after with the directors Steve Connors & Molly Bingham.
http://meetingresistance.com/
I caught an interview with the film makers. They concur with what you were saying about Iraqi people not being segragated on cutural /religious lines prior to being invaded.
Thanks, TWK. I have also heard some interviews with them, and would like to see the film. It sounds as if their experience confirms much if not most of what I know to be true about Iraq, Iraqis, and the resistance, and of course it feels good to be vindicated. :o}
weather.com girl. type in your zip code and you are good to go.
(also, if you have cable, the weather channel. “on the 8’s” gives you your local weather at 8 past the hour, 18 minutes past, 28 etc.)
A levee broke too, in Nevada. Hundreds of homes flooded. What else is going to break down there in the USA? Ron Paul is right. Stop spending on foreign policy. We really need to repair our own back-yards.
God. No kidding. Our infrastructure sucks. Hillary has talked about it a lot — and from the standpoint that one big PLUS is that a big infrastructure rebuild will create hundreds of thousands of new jobs!
I was on the oregon coast late last nite … one of my favorite places to be when a big one decides to come in. the rain and the foam from the surf was blowing sideways … a great sight!
[...] from larry johnson’s ‘no quarter’ [...]
“Hope” is NOT a plan…
But FRED!
“Change” IS a plan. Come on, Fred.
I worried about an Iowa relative caucusing for Obama, because they listen to Limbaugh and have been talking up Romney for months. They just wanted to go with a winner? Hard to say…
They really don’t like Hillary Clinton, or even Huckabee. (Limbaugh don’t like Huckabee, you know.)
The profound lessons learned from Iowa is:
1. Independents are voting Democratic.
2. Iowa, a state that is 92% white, voted an African American as their nominee.
I hope that Obama and Clinton try to make inroads among the celebrated NH independents by seizing on McCain’s “100 years in Iraq” comments. McCain I fear.
despite this the 80th psychotic anti obama topic in a row, the topic starters point is well taken. we have a 3 trillion dollar budget. we cannot be “unified” when we have a government this big. When it moves it shifts the entire leviathan over to the left or right to the point where the opposite side will not be able to abide by it.
If socialized medicine passes it will be the dem equivelent of the iraq war. people who don’t support it and don’t want it will have to read about it everyday and pay for it. obviously it won’t be as destructive as the iraq war but it will be as devisive.
the only way we can be unified is to be free to live as we want to: states rights with a weak central government. then we can all be proud of america.
this positive hope stuff isn’t the answer.
…..If socialized medicine passes it will be the dem equivelent of the iraq war. people who don’t support it and don’t want it will have to read about it everyday and pay for it. obviously it won’t be as destructive as the iraq war but it will be as devisive…..
The people that don’t want it will just have to grin and bear it because there isn’t any other place in the world they can go to escape it. You see, every country in the civilized world has a health plan for it’s citizens and SANE politicans making the decisons. In these responsible countries, anyone that has a death wish for his neighbor is regarded as a nutcase.
Susan,
Amen. Beware of Greeks bearing gifts.
Morris hates Hillary - she was always on to him, unlike her husband.
Yet, as a Clinton insider of that era, Morris is distinctly qualified to comment on Hillary’s “presidential experience”.
Uh, Morris is so consumed, so obsessed with Hillary, that he’s become a caricature. Caught him recently on BookTV (C-Span2 weekends) promoting his latest book, and she was all he could talk about. I think Taters has it nailed. And I’ll be he knew that Hillary was on to him, and that she was an influence in getting rid of him finally.
While besotted voters are awe-struck, the conservatives are having the time of their lives, lying in wait, for an untested Barack Obama they can defeat in a general election.
How funny. We already saw the tactics the GOP will use from the Clinton campaign.
He was tested.
Did anyone watch 20/20 last night? I saw it only once, so I may not have all the details correct.
20/20 showed a segment on political “dirty tricks”-how each candidate has their own research organization to uncover items that would be damaging to other candidates. The last part of the segment dealt with push-polling in Iowa’s 2007 causcus and an Iowa woman who said she had been called and recorded the call. The caller/pollster asked about Obama and Edwards with questions suggesting possible unethical practices on their part, but no questions were asked about Clinton. The host of 20/20 pointed that out the push/poll may have been conducted by the the Clinton campaign as no smear questions regarding Clinton were asked. I plan to attend an open house at a new campaign office for Senator Clinton in Phoenix this afternoon. Perhaps someone there will have a comment. What do you guys think about the segment and a network program airing it less that a week before the NH primary?
I’d guess, if it happened as the woman describes (it’s anecdotal), that it came from a 527 — a union perhaps.
Also: I’m very wary of 20/20 these days because of John Stossel, a ‘winger if there ever was one.
Conversely, Obama himself ran a radio ad in Iowa that accused John Edwards and Hillary Clinton’s health plans of deficiencies while falsely claiming his own plan is better. (We’ve cited numerous sources for that here in other stories. The last was from Elizabeth Edwards herself who was clearly angered by Obama’s radio ad, and said Obama’s ad spread “false” information about both her husband’s and Clinton’s plan.)
FYI: I’ve read several anecdotal reports of Obama staffers pressuring Iowans at the caucuses. At some caucuses, Obama people told Bill Richardson supporters that Richardson had instructed his supporters to go to Obama’s group if he didn’t meet the 15% requirement. Richardson did no such thing.
Then there was the behavior of Obama supporters last night at the traditionally formal NH Democratic dinner. Obama’s people brought in a lot of young people who (1) booed Hillary Clinton during her speech, and (2) began waving their Obama signs, and shouting for Obama, as Bill Richardson finished his speech. I.e., they didn’t show courtesy to other candidates, as is de riguerre at all Democratic formal functions.
So, dirty tricks abound. And frequently it’s Obama’s campaign that executes the trickery.
in your FACE no quarter!!!!!
http://www.time-blog.com/swampland/2008/01/hillary_booed_at_nh_democra tic.html
Hillary booed at NH Democratic dinner
If the New Hampshire Democratic Party’s 100 Club dinner is any bell weather – Barack Obama will handily win here. When Obama, the dinner’s last speaker, took the stage the crowd surged forward chanting “O-bam-a” and “Fired Up, Ready to Go!” So many people pressed toward the stage that an announcer asked people to “please take their seats for safety concerns.”
By comparison Hillary was twice booed. The first time was when she said she has always and will continue to work for “change for you. The audience, particularly from Obama supporters (they were waving Obama signs) let out a noise that sounded like a thousand people collectively groaning. The second time came a few minutes later when Clinton said: “The there are two big questions for voters in New Hampshire. One is: who will be ready to lead from day one? The second,” and here Clinton was forced to pause as boos from the crowd mixed with cheers from her own supporters. “Is who can we nominate who will go the distance against the Republicans?”
The dinner held in the Hampshire Dome in Milford is the largest political dinner in New Hampshire history, Republican or Democrat. More than 3,000 people attended.
By comparison Hillary was twice booed.
I don’t care for this behavior.
Lester, we know the media hates the Clinton’s. I read that she took coffee and bagels to them and not one person spoke to her. They kissed W’s ass. Nasty people.
I’m not impressed by anything that TIME reports.
They have an agenda to destroy her. The question people need to answer is will they support the opposition if or when she’s out of the game.
I know a New Hampsherite who was at the NH Democratic dinner last night. As a longtime Democratic party member, he was given the job of helping to hand out the tickets to attendees. Campaigns had bought up some tickets for their supporters. He was shocked to see that almost all of those who’d been given Obama tickets were high school kids. Which explains the grossly uncharacteristic and impolite behavior during BOTH Clinton’s and Richardson’s speeches. (Poor Richardson — those teenagers were waving their Obama signs and screaming “Obama” while Richardson was still finishing his speech.)
This focus on the young by the Obama campaign has had me concerned. While the Obama/Oprah machine spin Obama as the “agent of change” and the “antiwar candidate” and “bold”. Obama skips town on the Kyl Lieberman amendment (when he could have demonstrated that he truly stands for diplomacy
instead of racing towards pre-emptive military action against Iran).
He could have taken a stand…he did not.
Obama making less than a quarter of Senate votes
Full of words
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2007/12/report_clinton_readies_web_att.html
Obama Missing in Action
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/11/02/obama.missed.votes/index.html
That speaks volumes of Obama’s supporters to boo her.
If Obama claims that he is an outsider and that he is the candidate of change - the anti Clinton - why does he tout the fact that the has many
of Bill Clinton’s former employ as his people now?Actually he
lieduh, misstated and said he had more than Hillary (He just couldn’t divulge their names) Which is untrue. Yeah, right.Like Larry said, this guy uses Rovian tactics. Why does Rove want Obamna to win?
Here’s what Earl Ofari Hutchinson says…
Rove Cheerleads Obama for a Reason: He Thinks He is Easier Prey for the GOP than Clinton
Dec,4, 2007
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/rove-cheerleads-obama-for_b_75246.html?load=1&page=2
Her campaign did this. She’s paying for it now which is why they say they aren’t planning any other negative attacks. Has Penn been fired yet?
Susan,
Pressuring caucus members is part of the plan. Odd system.
I finally looked up the term Magic Negro. Someone here mentioned it a while back.
I found this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xm6hlj-BV0s
And you are BRAGGING about this? You are proud, and not embarrased, that Obama’s supporters behave in this manner?
Well, this story has certainly convinced me, if there was any question, that Obama is not for me. It hasn’t changed my mind about Hillary one way or the other.
Well, one thing for sure: Such behavior NEVER occurs at a formal political party dinner — Republican or Democratic. The party faithful are invariably polite and respectful to all who speak at their events.
I glanced at Memeorandum.com this morning, and all the ‘wingers were writing up the booing. They love it. It helps them, they think, bring Clinton down and promote the candidate they most want in the general, Mr. Obama.
[Once more: I think Obama is terrific. He's brilliant and politically able. But he needs more time in the Senate. And he needs to work harder. I posted this a while ago:
Longtime members of the Senate are unhappy that Obama hasn't bothered to learn the rules of the Senate, which is Senate 101-kinda stuff. Jeez. Then there's that he was given a chairmanship of a Foreign Relations subcommittee on Europe and NATO, and he hasn't held a single hearing. Heck, he doesn't even list his chairmanship on his own Senate Web site! (I searched the entire obama.senate.gov site.) The 100% fair-minded Steve Clemons is very unhappy about Obama's lack of work on his subcommittee and failure to even travel in Europe.
And his occasional Qs during Foreign Relations hearings are a snooze. I watched those because I was curious what allthe excitement over him was about, and I didn't get excited. I didn't witness this, but a trusted friend did: Joe Biden read the newspaper while Obama was questioning someone. Biden, a true expert on foreign relations knew it was going to be pro forma questioning. Not good. Just not good.]
Shirin, I respect your concerns about Sen. Clinton. And I forgot to tell you that you made me laugh out loud for your comment the other day that I can’t get on your case for hammering on a point anymore because I’ve been doing precisely that. Yup! You got me! One thing that I sympathize with about Sen. Clinton’s stands is that, as a woman, she has to “appear” tougher on national security matters, moreso than a man would have to, because male voters are SO much harder on women candidates. You know this, Shirin — we women have to try twice as hard to get half the credit. But I look at the body of her life’s work — how she traveled over and over, for years and years, to remote villages in Africa and Asia and South America to help impoverished women get microeconomic grants (and she also set up that program in Arkansas for women) — plus her 35 years of work for women’s and children’s rights, and i know that that’s where her soul LIVES. It’s just that to run for prez, she needs to sound tough. (Personally, I wished she’d done what Edwards did, and apologized for her Iraq authorization vote — she has said she regrets it — but she has to be careful saying AT THIS TIME what she’d do with the troops in Iraq because, in the vicious general election, the Republicans would pulverize her if she comes across too leftie on the issue. I think, in office, she’d move a lot faster than she can say at this moment.)
I think, in office, she’d move a lot faster than she can say at this momenent
I think this true and it has been mentioned Hillary was running her campaign as if it was the general election. I figure this would her allow her some flexibility, but in the short term is problematic.
Thank’s for your comments, Susan. I am glad you found my hammering away remark amusing. I have to say that you currently hold the hammering championship, and I’m gonna need to work hard to regain it!
Susan, the only things I have to go on that are real are a candidate’s history and a candidate’s words. All the rest is pure guesswork, and often wishful thinking. That is not a reliable way to predict what someone will do. Therefore, I just don’t accept the argument that you (and others) have put forth that her statements do not really reflect what she intends to do. In that case she is lying about her intentions, isn’t she? Aren’t we all sufficiently sick of lies, or does it depend on whether the lies are coming from someone we dislike versus someone we like?
And by the way, we could play exactly the same sort of guessing game with any of the candidates regarding policies or statements we don’t like. I could decide that John Edwards’ statements that he will leave a few thousand troops in Iraq is just an effort not to turn off voters who are opposed to a complete withdrawal of troops, and that he actually intends to have all troops out within 16 months. And I could decide to support him on that flimsy basis. I could, but I won’t.
Looking at Hillary Clinton’s record going back to her years as First Lady I see someone who very consistently has readily supported and at times urged military action for all kinds of things, including forcing compliance with United States’ (or in some cases Israel’s) wishes. Listening to her statements as a Senator and as a presidential candidate, it becomes obvious that she considers military force to be an acceptable tool of foreign policy. I find her stated intention to expand the military and increase and already outlandishly huge military budget to be more than slightly worrying.
As for all her humanitarian activities, bully for her, and if her soul lives in women’s and children’s rights, it’s just a shame that her soul only lives in that place for certain portions of humanity and apparently lives somewhere else entirely for certain other portions of humanity.
Where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights for the eight years that she was cheering on her husband’s systematic starvation of Iraq’s women and children? Where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights for the eight years that she encouraged her husband to continue to deprive millions of Iraqi women and children to the most basic necessities of life - a healthy diet, potable water, medical care (and this in a country whose medical system had been held up as a model in the region), education, proper sewage disposal and treatment, paper, pencils, books and on and on and on and on? And where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights each time she supported or encouraged all her husband’s other uses of military power in Iraq, in Kosovo, in Somalia, and elsewhere? Does she not know that the primary victims of any military action - and particularly of bombs dropped from the air - are women and children?
And where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights when she was giving her gung ho support to the lies that resulted in the human rights catastrophe that her government has turned Iraq into? And where was it when she officially gave the go-ahead for shock and awe without even bothering to read the document that was supposed to, but did not, justify it? And where has it been for the last five years during most of which she has remained one of the cheerleaders for Bush’s Iraq debacle, and in any case has never once attempted to take concrete steps to bring an end to it?
And where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights while she was giving her all-out support to Israel’s unspeakably criminal 33 day attack on Lebanon - an attack during which Israel destroyed vital civilian infrastructure, along with thousands upon thousands of women’s and children’s homes? And where has that soul been while Israel has absolutely refused to provide mine removal teams with maps of the mine fields they laid down in Lebanon during their horrible 18 year occupation there? And where was that soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights when Israel responded to the cease fire agreement with Lebanon by spending two days carpeting southern Lebanon with cluster bombs - the gift that keeps on killing - and where is her soul every time a woman or a child is killed or dismembered by those most indiscriminate of weapons that lie in wait for curious young hands to pick them up, or unaware feet to step on them. Does she even think about the tens of Lebanese children who have already been killed or maimed by these weapons? If she did would she give a damn?
And where has that soul been that lives in women’s and children’s rights for the decades and decades that she has enabled, encouraged, and applauded Israel’s depredations on a captive Palestinian population, its collective punishments of women and children for the alleged actions of their relatives, its blocking of women’s and children’s access to food, water, electricity, medical care, and education? Its theft of their land and their means of survival? Where is that soul of hers when Israelis block women in labor from reaching medical facilities? Where is that soul of hers every time a mother dies or a baby dies because the Israeli will not let them pass so they can get the care they need and deserve?
If her soul is in women’s and children’s rights, then why does she show such utter contemptuous for the rights and well being of the women and children of certain segments of humanity?
Without diminishing her no doubt very real contributions to the women and children whom she HAS helped, there is something terribly, terribly wrong here. I would not go so far as to suggest that she has not been sincere in wanting to improve the lives of women and children, but she has certainly been very selective, hasn’t she? Her soul that lives in women’s and children’s rights does not seem to mind a bit supporting, encouraging, cheer leading, and even taking a part in some of the most horrific violations of those very same rights her soul supposedly lives in.
No, thank you, Susan. I’m not buying.
lester could you be any more immature? i know you are a libertarian/republican which automatically makes you immature but good god … perhaps you could take some time to read, develop a couple analytical skills, and lear a bit about logic before befouling this bog with your postings.
secondly, your comment about states rights being better then a strong central government makes no sense in light of you being so thrilled with the neoconic agenda. pay attention, the neocons have done more to erode state rights [well even federal rights] then the democrats could ever accomplish.
finally, your comments about a national health program also is a quick primer to why libertarians are so very wrong … choosing not to have health insurance is not a decision that just effects the individual making the choice … ah, i know this logic escapes the truly selfish and immature.
Should Obama be elected President in 2008, he will find quite quickly just how much the Republicans are willing to work with him in 2009 to grapple with the economic morass we will find ourselves in. Just how quickly will he be willing to abandon Social Security and Medicare, not to mention many other programs, to persuade the Republicans to join in doing anything to prevent the complete collapse of the economy?
The real mortgage reset season starts next spring and the accelerating foreclosure season will become apparent within six months - after the next President is elected. The Republican-led bankers will plead for a new source of cheap funds to forestall bankruptcy and the only ready source from their perspective will be Social Security. Obama won’t even be able to get the Fed to print money, because it’s headed up by a Republican adherent. We’ll be seeing a replay of the Carter administration - except this time the Republicans will be laying the blame on a young, black Democratic politician.
Why wouldn’t the Republicans be chortling at the prospect of an Obama Presidency? They figure they can force him to drink the poisoned chalice they’ve prepared and try to explain to the public why it’s good for them. That’s bipartisanship for you.
They figure they can force him to drink the poisoned chalice
The Democratic leadership has already been drinking gallons.
Try another argument.
The wheels are coming off already.
Clinton: Obama’s Too Liberal
http://matthewyglesias.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/01/clinton_obamas_too_liberal.php
lol sorry for my above exhortation.
above: change is a plan.
could someone, PLEASE, ask him:
CHANGE TO WHAT? WHAT CHANGE?
The big blogs (such as the big orange) never challenge either Edwards or Obama when they say CHANGE won. Clinton is the establishment. All slogans. I never seen a lamer campaign slogan than change.
Markos, Atrios, and Josh all have their smug (or in case of Josh, know-it-all with glasses) faces that, Oh, we are so neutral this time.
I am tempted to write a diary at dkos, and call Joan Walsh (at Salon) an idiot, b/c she says the blogfathers have stayed neutral this time. I want to say, “and you call yourself a journalist?”
Wait, they all call themselves journalists.
But then, Americans vote for sleek, unprepared salemen with empty slogans, and the rest of the world is doomed.
The SERIOUS danger is the PRESS, the BLOGS, and Amercan VOTERS do not understand the urgency of this MOMENT. They tell themselves, why be paranoid? It always works out in the end. Like the gambler which keeps going double or nothing.
Why don’t Americans see that the world and the planet are in A MAJOR CRISIS. Crisis which needs steedy leadership and solutions. The consequences are simply enormous.
Well, egoists would think, we can sing Kumbaya now and gamble. The adults will rescue us. Bill and Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, and others would come and save us.
To Markos and Josh who just think of their business (despite claims to the contrary) and Atrios who is just amusing himself, meet the new media in the mirror, same as the old media. They are responsible for the shit that follows.
Nader said in 2000 that Gore, Bush, what’s the difference?? We found out at a huge price. Now, bloggers think, what’s the difference? We might as well go for a hipper guy and we hate Hillary anyhow (and all claim they are not sexist). Well, they may just find out.
Hillary wants change. She wants this to be the country we were in the 90’s when we had peace and prosperity. Hello America!!! You have permission to HOPE without voting for Obama. Hope never changed anything only hard work toward a specific goal does that. In order to make an omelet you have to break some eggs. If you just compromise with the eggs you go hungry. Obama thinks that all he has to do is become president and show his face to the world and everything will change. I know he can’t be that stupid — but he must think we are.
It pains me to remember that Bush made that same kind of Washington outsider “can’t we all get along” speech in 2000. That was before he spyed on us, took away habius corpus and led us into 2 protracted wars. We are condemned to live in interesting times.
I heard her say that the first Clinton cleaned up after the first Bush and she’ll clean up after this one. Good line. The truth is an entirely different matter.
What Robert Perry wrote has really stayed with me.
The First Clinton-Bush Deal
That’s exactly what happened in 1993 when Bill Clinton entered the White House after defeating George H.W. Bush.
Clinton and other senior Democrats shut down or wrapped up four investigations that implicated senior Republicans, including Bush, in constitutional abuses of power and criminal wrongdoing during the Reagan-Bush years.
http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/123107.html
Cee … i was never a bandwagon bill clinton supporter … he had plenty of warts and made numerous mistakes and deals no doubt. BUT … and it deserves to said loudly … more americans did well when he was in office then almost in history. call it luck, call it criminal, or just ignore it … this is a bottom line historical fact that can not be debated.
go figure … hey
Jeez, what sour grapes. Give me a break.
Would you say that Taylor Marsh has been irresponsible for promoting HRC like she’s the second coming? I really like Taylor, but her blog has become nothing but an obsessive Go Hillary! site. And the commenters there brook no dissent from anyone supporting Obama.
Larry and Susan are firmly in Hillary’s camp and most of their posts are devoted to that point. I sometimes get really tired of all the Hillary promotion, but these people run their own sites and are private actors in the political scene. They have no obligation to stay neutral or try to please readers. Same goes for Edwards and Obama supporting blogs.
But, hey, it’s kind of cool that you think the blogs have so much power to sway the electorate, because if that’s really the case then we will certainly have a Democrat in the White House come January 2009.
From your lips to …
Btw, by the time I got done with my blogging duties, I was too tired to watch all of the debate last night (DVR’d it). But I must say, at the beginning, on Pakistan and nukes, John Edwards did very well, imho. I was half-asleep so couldn’t quote him, but he gave me the strong impression he has done the HARD study and talked to a lot of people. If my #1 doesn’t make it for some reason, I could easily support Edwards. (Just to make it clear: I’m not saying that to be nice. I mean it. I think he’s mature enough, hard-working enough to do the job.)
“her blog has become nothing but an obsessive Go Hillary! site.”
And this one hasn’t?!
Actually, this one has been more like “Obama sucks, so you better support Hillary”. And Edwards almost might as well not exist, despite Larry’s claims that he supports him rather than Hillary.
The difference, though, is that Larry and Susan are not myopic, and they allow dissenting views. Have you seen ever Susan fly off the handle in anger at commenters? I haven’t. I believe they have thicker skin. This place attracts intelligent and diverse views. The commenters at the other place have circled the wagons to defend against against any questioning of their candidate and their blogger host. (It’s become quite paranoid, believe me.)
So, I can come here and put in my two cents without getting attacked and labeled as a “troll” or a “sexist” (which was always ridiculous to have to tolerate over there, considering that I’m a woman.)
And yes, you will notice some of those commenters are now showing up here because they think this is the only blog in the entire blogosphere that also supports their candidate. I actually read some comments over there to the tune of “I can’t ever trust Josh Marshall again! He’s such a hyposcrite! I will NEVER go to TPM or Kos or C&L again!” Believe me, there’s a whole lotta whining goin’ on.
Let me add this as well.
http://www.consortiumnews.com/2008/010408.html
we had peace and prosperity because clinton didn’t get us in to any unending wars like the one his wife supported and still supports. but he didn’t change the policy on iraq and he strongly believed in intervwening all over the place and dropping bombs on innocent people and sanctioning them.
and nice try attempting to spin the crowd reaction in new hampshire. first you say it’s not true because Time was reporting it and they are anti-hillary. then another one of you say obamas supoprters are rude.
susanpc = “Also: I’m very wary of 20/20 these days because of John Stossel, a ‘winger if there ever was one.”
kind of like former CIA officer Larry Johnson. and chuck hagel and barry goldwater.
this place has gone from liberal fever swamp to stalinist stanford prison experiment.
spin spin spin
Lester, what makes you think that Barak “Bomb ‘em all, friend or foe” Obama would be any different from Hillary “I never met a war I didn’t love” Clinton? They look to me for all practical purposes virtually identical on foreign policy, military policy, and they are very much on the same page when it comes to Iraq.
At least Hillary took a stand on the Kyl Lieberman amendment which Senator Webb described as “tantamount to declaring war on Iran” while the “anti-war, agent of change, bold” candidate Senator OBama happened to be out of town on the day when he could have taken a clear anti war s