The Moment of the Night: Hillary Closes [UPDATED]
By SusanUnPC on February 21, 2008 at 10:18 PM in Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Soldiers/Veterans
UPDATE: BELOW, some fascinating thoughts from Taylor Marsh on “the close” and Obama:
As for Obama, he has improved significantly. But once again, he can not find an end to his meandering explanations. I’m beginning to doubt if he could find a concise point on a Scrabble board, with a finite number of letters. His rambling is an obsession at this point and gets old quickly.
The last moment was her moment, talking about her struggles and what has tested her. The audience got it. She smiled. Then she mentioned The Intrepid. Then gave a moving and heartfelt statement that blew the room out, showing her humanity and her grace. Clinton stated that whatever she goes though is nothing compared to what others suffer. She said she was honored to be here, honored to be running with Barack Obama, which you could tell even touched him, then they shook hands. That moment at the end she owned. Her grace came through, her heart was open. The audience loved it.
At the end, the audience jumped to their feet. It was in great part because of Clinton’s close. It’s what people will be talking about. Women will be moved by her. She showed the same grace that came through in New Hampshire. Tremendous moment on which to end.
You’ll have to decide if anything was a game changer. I don’t think so. But if anyone was on the fence about Clinton, they likely moved solidly in her court.
I believe the final moment of this debate is something that could resonate.
READ ALL OF TAYLOR’S THOUGHTS.
===============
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that was a transcendent moment. she nailed it.
Ditto! (FU Rush!)
Come on, come on. Why no mention of the booing - you are living in fabtasy land. She lost it a long time ago……
Enter the Troll Patrol, with their Change You Can XEROX
BOOOO …You need some toner. Ie don’t disturb your trance.
Good heavens, she is wonderful!
Ditto!!! Again!
Wow wow wow - wow.
I couldn’t watch it real time - but am so thankful I saw “the tape”.
Strange - The big BO even tried to step on her standing O!
Creep!
That last bit was fabulous. I hope it’s replayed everywhere.
It is clear, now, that was THE MOMENT. Not just of the night but the debate season. She has no problems compared to what our soldiers and their families have endured. She gets it.
Evidence of the power is in the snarky comment made by Josh Marshall over at TPM. Josh is a good soul who is under the partisan sway of Obama. He dismisses her remark, which was very inspiring, as something copied from Bill. There were not a fresh crop of dead and wounded American soldiers back in 92 when Bill was running. Josh, in making such a reach, exposed his own fear–he knew she nailed the debate with that line.
Great analysis of Josh’s POOR moment of the night (and past several months). That used to be such a muckraker site in a great way. Sad.
(I loved the Xerox line too … but that’s just me.)
Me, too. But then I know it to be true!
THE MOMENT
Where was that up until tonight.
I was out with a group of ardent Obama supporters (4 white, 1 Black, and all upscale).
I was hoping that Hillary, if she does lose this nomination, find the wisdom to concede gracefully, with class, and in a way that everyone will remember.
Because for her there will be another day - in 4 years after Obama gets clocked by McCain and McCain’s one terms is unmemorable.
I would hope that she would spend that time creating her own legacy - following in the path of her predecessors (Moynihan and Javitz) - and be able to shed her reliance on her husband’s history.
McCain, Reagan, and JFK are great examples that you can live for another day.
Tonight showed what she can do - but unfortunately did not until now.
BINGO! S. MARKOM. BINGO!
I made that very point today to a key player in the blog world.
There is a scene in the awesome movie “The Right Stuff.” It’s from the Tom Wolfe novel about our Apollo astronauts. The book is awesome and for a change Hollywood didn’t f*ck it up; the movie rocked as well. (/Sidenote/Someone very close to me was an Air Force officer during this era. In a phone conversation one time I was trying to illustrate a point and cited the movie “The Right Stuff.” He came back and told me something I did not know: “I drank beer in O Clubs around the world with those guys.” Officer Clubs. I was suitably blown away.)
I forgotten the particulars. What I distinctly remember is the phrase used. There’s Sputnik and the Soviets have the early lead. There’s some development in the race between the USSR & the USA. They won that round. The US reporters ask iirc, Ed Harris (the actor), who, iirc, was playing John Glenn (the real astronaut and later Senator from Ohio; and now supporter of Hillary. He likes her program around science) about it. Glenn acknowledges reality of the situation and then something about how we, the US, are going to be
“forthright, gracious & magnanimous.”
And the cameras and the reporters leave, and Ed Harris spins away and walks with a few of his fellow astronaut buddies. Out of camera and microphone range he says with a little bit of heat, “I’m tired of being forthright, gracious and magnanimous.”
Point of the story.
1) While it sometimes feels that way, the Obama Hillary contest is NOT the USSR vs. the USA.
2) One of these two will be leaving the race and will have to be “forthright, gracious & magnanimous.” Correction, even though they feel like crap for losing, they would be wise to be gracious.
I also want to point out at someone who has done this every two years since 92, and whose wife hates, just positively hates, loathes and despises election time. Because her hubby “wraps himself around the axle” about this stuff and physically and mentally put everything into it and runs myself into the ground by election day. Ranger school is known to be grueling. What isn’t well known is how grueling political campaigns are/can be. My teenagers have a phrase, something is “Narsty.” Campaigns = Narsty. Right now, all over America, staff and volunteers are wiped out. The debate was in Austin, TX tonight. I was stationed in Texas. There’s a saying in the Lone Star state is: “Honeychile, you look like you’ve been rode hard and put to bed wet.”
What I’ve learned is to mentally prepare myself for both scenarios. That is armor. It falls in the “no-sh*t-sherlock” category that winning feels better. Imj, a wise warrior prepares for both….and is thus, imj, more effective.
I want y’all to remember that phrase. Because either Barack or Hillary is going to be called upon to do that. Correction, even though they feel like crap for losing, and even though they harbor a little animus against their opponent, they don’t have to, but they would be wise to be gracious.
You win with class. You lose with class.
Sadly, Josh has forgotten that he was for the war in Iraq before he was against it. TPM has become a wasteland of far left-wing conformism, and it’s not just the anti-Hillary stuff.
Speaking of Josh- and I know this is harsh, but Somerby recently said:
http://www.dailyhowler.com/dh012508.shtml
And you’re not, Larry? Give me a break.
I was so proud of her. I admire her so much.
An amazingly beautiful and eloquent close that shows us the strength that comes from graciousness and caring for others. This moment was not just a good moment for Hillary, it was a good moment for all of us.
I hope Texas, Ohio and Pennsylvania voters were watching this. Hillary really hit a lot of high marks and nailed it at the finale. Bravo.
Where was the ass kicking? Come on. She needed to come out swinging (with grace). Democrats don’t like negative campaigning, forgetting that this is not about feely touchy BS, this is about choosing the strongest monkey. This is about strength and the courage to lead the pack. It’s mammalian politics, whether we like it or not. When McCain and the Republicans get a hold of Obama, the Democrats are going to wish they had a fighter, not a prissy philosopher king.
Did you miss it?
You want to win, or you just want go around pretending you have balls?
“Ass kicking” is what Cheney and Bush wanted to do to Iraq, and the middle east.
It failed.
A beautiful tribute to Hillary from the Emerald Isle,
the Republic and Northern Ireland - Protestant and Catholic.
http://www.irishecho.com/newspaper/story.cfm?id=18626
Morris thinks that Darby O’Gill is a documentary, fuck ‘em. Yet despite all my animosity I would personally pay for this first trip to the island and set him up in the Europa if he’d wave the tricolor during the celebration of the next 12th in Belfast.
It is the damndest symmetry between the Clintons and the Morris clan, though. Both men were caught in well publicized peccadillos, Bill of cigar fame, Dick, the toe sucker, and re-united in blissful matrimony.
I don’t think this story ever touched the Irish press, north or south. I searched the archives of the Irish Times, The Irish News and the Belfast Telegraph which covers all papers of record both in NI and in the Republic. I found one reference to it in Newshound but that pointed to a FOX article. The main Northern political blog, Slugger O’Toole was zip for posted articles.
After the past forty years they know bullshit when they see it.
O’Hanlon does publish in the Irish News yet the referenced article was in the stateside Irish Echo, the least green of the two New York expat rags.
He’s the editor of the Echo, BTW.
“They” are now claiming she stole her closing statements from Edwards….
Local media here in Dallas-Fort Worth highlighting her “cheap shot” with the Xerox statement.
Personally, I loved the line.
Olbermann can’t stop snarling that Hillary stole the statements from Edwards. I can’t believe that, not so long ago, his show was absolutely must-viewing to me. Now I avoid it like the plague- the cheap snots, the bull sessions with Dana Milbank, Chuck Todd etc. about how crappy Hillary is compared to the awesome Obama– ugh, whatever.
Go take your big paycheck and buy yourself some class, Keith. I can’t believe how far you’ve fallen, and all to destroy Hillary- WHY?
Yes, John. Why? Why is KO being a total douchebag? You probably know more about the media world than I do so you need to write a post on KO. Is he being told by his bosses to treat Clinton like shit? I don’t get it.
His paltry audience is almost entirely composed of the young thugs at DailyKos and their ilk. People like me and others here have been dropping off from his viewership in droves. The pontificating was a bit much … I got so, when I dvr’d his show, I’d stop it at his special commentaries, and erase it. And, funnily enough, I posted an ad for his book here, and not a single person bought it, and only a couple people even clicked on the ad. His book was just transcripts of his “special” commentaries anyway.
I used to like him. Some of his Bush-bashing days were great. But even that was a bit of a con…. he found out it worked to help bump up his tiny numbers, so he stuck with it. It’s not from his soul, I sense.
(I also found his constant snark about Britney Spears et al. to be repulsive. First, it was cruel. Then, it was NOT news. I also objected to the “funny” videos he’d find of animals put in horrific conditions — such as elephants in Thailand and India who are tortured into submission — and go mad sometimes and smash up cars. That Keith found that funny made my stomach turn.)
The absolute WORST thing about Olbermann’s show- before he became a full-time Hillary-basher, I mean- was his decision to devote a good ten minutes a night on “analyzing” American Idol, with an American Idol EXPERT as a guest, no less- and not only do this, but do it in a revoltingly phony “Oh jeesh, I really HATE this, but we HAVE to talk about this, gosh I wish we DIDN’T, but we DO” attitude-complete with sighs and bs groans and eye-rolling. “Why do people pay ATTENTION to this crap? Guess America’s really stupid. Haha. Well, back tomorrow for more on American Idol…”
And yes, his obsession with Britney Spears is just disgusting- “haha, let’s laugh and snark at this obviously disturbed and lost young woman, hahaha sucks to be her, huh?” And ditto your comments on “Oddball”- that segment is so brain-numbingly dumb, my father is a big Olbermann fan but was completely put off when Olbermann devoted an entire show Christmas week to NOTHING BUT ODDBALL segments- hey Keith, it was called America’s Funniest Home Videos many years ago, and film of people being hurt and animals being tortured weren’t funny then, aren’t funny now.
Up until a year ago, I would have had his baby if he’d asked. His was the only program I worked my evenings around. But then the subtle hypocrisy began piling up….snide remarks on Anderson Cooper’s sexuality, Britney and Cruise stalking, mocking the appearance and misfortune of others, interviewing Mary Carey, tasteless on-camera donation to Bill Clinton…and so on. Disappointing.
I’ll be Voting Early With Hillary tomorrow morning in Dallas.
The closing was remarkable. The poise throughout was impressive. The “Change you can Xerox” line was great from a partisan perspective, but may not play well.
Finally, the coded message in her closing comments may go unnoticed by most, and unbelieved by those who do notice, but Hillary explained what motivates her life-campaign tonight.
John and Charles are proud.
I’m so glad you’re voting for Hillary. It was my privilege to vote for her by absentee ballot about three and a half weeks ago, although my Democratic party refused to count my vote.
TELL all your friends!
Susan…You inspired Me to go to the Dmocrate Caucus..becuase I knew you would have but couldn’t..becuase you werein Hospital…I Spoke up for hillary becuase I knew you would but couldn’t…and I Was elected a delegate for her…because Iknew you would .have offered..
I did it for you..and for Hillary..because we both know she deserves Our Support..and that requires Making a Commitment..Going to Vote..
I was Proud to put My hillary Sticker on My Coat…and Hold the Door Open ..and greet all those who came to caucus..men..women..Children..Young and Old…in Wheel cahirs and on Crutchs..and I felt Proud to By an American..and Thankful to be part of the
Process..
“I’ll be Voting Early”
And vote often
She has defined herself tonight as her own person. Whatever happens, she has already blazed the trail, set the bar, and established herself as the ultimate role model. It matters only to the history of this country if she wins the nomination, but for her gender she has already won. The victory is hers as a woman.
Well - now it is up to the people and the media. If the media is having some buyers remorse on the person they selected, Hillary will get the Xerox and closing sound bytes.
If not, it is up to Ohio and Penn. Texas realy is not critical as they go red in the General Election anyway.
It is amazing how our primary process allows the lowest qualified to use Elmer Gantry techniques to be competetive
Josh is right.
That Line
I mentioned at the end of my debate blog that the pivot of Hillary’s powerful concluding remarks came from Bill Clinton’s 92 campaign. Clinton had various permutations to it back then. But TPM Reader CG found one example in this November 1992 article by Anna Quindlen …
Clinton, 92: “The hits that I took in this election are nothing compared to the hits the people of this state and this country have been taking for a long time.”
Hillary Clinton, tonight: “You know, the hits I’ve taken in life are nothing compared to what goes on every single day in the lives of people across our country.”
Just to be 100% clear, there’s nothing in the least wrong with this. And it’s a great line. But I think it shows the silliness of the ‘plagiarism’ charges based on a few borrowed lines. Politicians borrow good lines and catch-phrases. Happens all the time. There’s nothing wrong with it.
–Josh Marshall
I wonder where Josh got that. Hmmm … I wonder:
Does it matter so much where he got it?
It is accurate? Did she say that? Did her husband say that?
Is it plagerism?
Why avoid the ventral question about that posting?
Sad…very sad.
1. Obama didn’t “borrow a few lines.” He lifted entire sections of someone else’s speeches and presented the words as his own. This isn’t like someone using “Ask not what your country can do for you…” It’s PLAGARISM.
2. Obama is all style. If he were a man of substance, this wouldn’t matter so much. But being a wizard with words is ALL HE HAS. If he can’t even do that himself, what is his claim to the White House?
3. Even if what Obama did WAS something that “happens all the time,” I thought the good Senator was supposed to be DIFFERENT. If he’s just another politician– again, what’s his claim to the White House, again?
Cee,
Help me out dear. Which is it? Hillary uses one sentence that is something similar to what her husband said in 92 and that is bad, while she is making the broader point about the suffering our soldiers have endured. Obama lifts verbatim several lines form speeches and that’s not a problem? A little clarification please.
Amen, Larry - which one is Milli and which one is Vanilli - Obama or Patrick?
They share the same choreographer,too.
There were no real “hits” in ‘92 - they were yet to come.
“Help me out dear?”
How condescendingly sexist. Had Obama addressed Hillary in those terms I think Taylor Marsh’s head would have exploded. Or is it only sexism when it’s said by someone you disagree with? Right, sweetie?
WOAH. MSNBC gave Clinton a better grade than Obama???
Has the world turned upside down?
This is upsetting. I’ve been watching CNN and MSNBC and many are saying that Clinton’s best moment of the debate was a conciliatory speech. WTF. Do you think her statement was in any way a concession to Obama just because he shook his damn hand? I also haven’t heard a single criticism of Obama tonight which is why I’m surprised MSNBC gave Clinton the better grade. I always think she’s the best debator but to have these Obamabots give her any credit is a change. Maybe because they think it’s over for her??
The obamabots were writing her obituary back in Oct and Nov. It’s the only story line they have. The press thinks that Obama has it in the bag I guess. Of course, how many times have they been right? Remember how Obama was going to blow out CA and MA?
Grace. Under. Pressure.
A quality we’d probably all welcome in a President.
Nice.
Exactly my thoughts!
Exactly what America needs!
Grace at ANY time, compared to the shitknocker we have…
Hillary Clinton has moved on from the debate to do more work! Reports Halperin:
Friday: Clinton hits network morning shows, tapes “Texas Monthly Talks” to keep pushing the contrast. Permalink
http://thepage.time.com/2008/02/21/clinton-tv/
Even if the Xerox line gets lots of play, it certainly can’t be helpful for Obama. It makes him the butt of jokes IMO.
Anyway, perhaps this is a turning point and things will start to get a little better for the Hillary campaign.
Larry and Susan, I appreciate greatly everything you guys are doing to help.
Hopefully, the media will start uncovering some of the stuff about Obama so we’ll either know what we are getting into or luckily get us out of.
The obamabots are freaking out about this debate. Anybody have a clue as to what’s with that? Something coming down the pike?
“I believe the final moment of this debate is something that could resonate.”
Certainly.
A great closing speech. A great reaction from the crowd.
Who’d have thought positive politics, inspiring words and hopeful sentiments would resonate with an audience?
Off topic, and I beg your pardon but any truth to the rumor Nicole Kidman will be portraying Valerie Plame - Wilson?
http://moviesblog.mtv.com/2008/02/12/breaking-nicole-kidman-outed-as-valerie-plame/
What about Obama’s answer to the question before Hillary? Talking about his single mother, oh boo hoo. Or his bad youth decisions, that sounds an awful lot like George W Bush to me. What are we, running for senior class president? Go ahead, Obama campagain, fire back charging plaigarism. This man is dead on arrival against McCain, even after 8 years of GWB, and for good reason. Hillary will survive, she always does.
Hillary out Obama’d/ Deval Patrick’d Obama, BIG TIME to his face!
How was he most tested? Oh just growing up I was tested???
I mean sure, he did have an unusual childhood.
Tested any time in your adult life, Senator?
It was so close to The Onion’s bio of George W. Bush who had to overcome a lot of hardships like once he scraped his knee.
Obama’s no Dubya, but that “tested” answer was so telling.
Clinton Tonight:
You know, whatever happens, we’re going to be fine. You know, we have strong support from our families and our friends. I just hope that we’ll be able to say the same thing about the American people. And that’s what this election should be about.
Edwards the December 13 debate:
What’s not at stake are any of us. All of us are going to be just fine no matter what happens in this election. But what’s at stake is whether America is going to be fine.
Mr. Obama described complaints of using lines from other people’s speeches as “silly season in politics.” Now that his campaign supporters are running around trying to show Senator Clinton is “lifting” lines from other people’s speeches, what do you call it?
She didn’t let that pass if I recall.
It’s time for an other session of Let’s Get Silly With Barcak and feed these into his teleprompter:
“Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Führer!”
“Now we are able to carry on a determined offensive against the kulaks, break their resistance, eliminate them as a class”
“Cuba sí, yanquis no”
Now if we could only get him to salute like Strangelove………..
I call it hypocrisy but that’s just silly ol me.
Well, that is not a xerox of what Edward said. First, it is not an original argument that Edwards was making, it is a common argument that has been made by politicians, sports stars, celebrities, etc (see Hillary’s Fact Hub, “Whatever” giving many examples). Second, even if you tried to argue that this is not a common argument, which you can’t really do, her words are not a xerox of Edwards’.
On the other hand, Obama parrots Patrick’s words exactly and they are unique arguments Patrick was making to a very specific kind of empty rhetoric challenge. His campaign looks foolish and petty to push this, and I think it hurts him because it means the media keeps talking about his copying of Patrick.
Hannity & Colmes had a focus group that seemed to favor Hillary. One man voiced my sentiments, that it wasn’t much of a debate & that makes it difficult to discern the differences. Alot more people seemed to approve of the format & said they liked seeing the candidates “getting along & working together.” Go figure. It was repetitive, 80% a phoney lovefest, 10% another slobbering match over illegals, (unquestioningly accepting the premise that in 50 yrs the country will have 150,000,000 Hispanics), 5% mutual insult & 5% seduction. I think she won by 10 points.
“You’re a bum Rock”
Burgess Meredith pre-Rocky: Batman vs. Penguin
Enjoy.
there are many points i could make, (besides forthright, gracious and magnanimous above) & i’m going to say one thing positive about obama.
I believe Obama wore a silver bracelet on his wrist. It, if I’m right, is the name of a US soldier who died in Iraq. Branch of service. Date he died. He may have met the soldier’s Mom on his recent swing thru Texas. And if he did then I say “outf*ckingstanding.” This is one of the most important symbolic acts that any national politican has done in many years. A similiar type of thing was when Jim Webb wore the brown desert boots every day of the campaign that the Marines, including his son, wore in Iraq/Afghanistan. It became a major piece of the Jim Webb story. Media stories go better with a “visual.” They go better with a “hook.” The candidate doesn’t even have to open his or her mouth. BOOM! You see the boots/the bracelet. You KNOW! (Disclosure: I do not, repeat, do not have a dog in the Obama Hillary fight.)
In 2004 John Kerry inspired a ton of people to wear the yellow “LiveStrong” Lance Armstrong. (And also raised a ton of money for Armstrong’s cancer foundation.)
Wearing these bracelets is a very common practice in our military today.
It harkens back to the solidarity the U.S.A. showed when we learned about our POWs being tortured in North Vietnam. There was a massive campaign then and I don’t know how many folks wore them. But it was a whole sh*tload. They were a grey pewter color. Name of servicemember. Branch of service. Date s/he went down. (I remember wearing a POW/MIA bracelet for years. I was about 13 years old when I started.) This is a story for another day, but the Nixon administration didn’t want this out; the wives did not concur. There is the story of how Jeremiah Denton blinked out with his EYES in Morse Code the word T-O-R-T-U-R-E. For a while most thought he was severely messed up; a tiny portion knew he was trying to say something, but what the dickens was it? There was worldwide awareness on the torture issue. The North Vietnamese started treating our guys better. For another day.
I have tried - w/o success to date - in certain circles to get a nationwide campaign going today to honor the US dead in Iraq and Afghanistan by wearing a bracelet. Obviously not POW, but KIA. (Killed in Action.) It is also a way to a) take a concrete action step, instead of ranting at the computer, to b) express solidarity, to bear rememberance, to bear witness, to c) be visible, esp. to the media and the politicans, to our fellow citizens, as well as kindred souls (there’s more of us out there than you’d think, and when we’ve been told to “sit down, shut up and watch what you say” it’s good to know that there’s another citizen AWOL from Ari Fleischer’ Division of Dunderheads, d)it is a great “conversation starter” and e) will speed the day when all of our troops come home. “E” won’t happen on the timetable I would like. I feel like I am running in a sea of molasses. But this campaign would shorten, imj, this clusterf*ck.
~~
(There would also, if I had my way, be a registry where families who didn’t want their kin’s name could opt out. There was some guy who was obviously emotionally RAW, and when Cindy Sheehan and Co. posted white crosses with the names of the KIA’s in the ditch outside of W’s Crawford ranch ran over a few with his pickup some crosses and almost some people. What the antiwar crowd does rankles some………..Which, truth be told I can appreciate and honor. You don’t know what HELL is just the physical and mental agony of waiting for the Damoclean Sword to fall. And sometimes it does, 2 officers, in dress uniforms, get out of a government sedan, and knock on your door.)
Peace. Out.
couple of corrections. should have read:
And if he did then I say “outf*ckingstanding.” This is one of the most important symbolic acts that any national politican has done in many years.
bracelets & s/he. the she possibility was for this war not nam.
Clinton rocked it last night, so much so she got a standing O, therefore of course the Obamamaniacs are going into overdrive to rewrite history and tell us that what we saw wasn’t what we saw.
They have to convince themselves as well.
By the end of the day today, the Obamatron blogs and pundits will be telling us the standing O was for Obama and not Clinton. Or it was for both of them, not a response to Clinton’s words. Because they can’t fathom that Clinton herself has the power to move with words.
Words only matter if they drop like golden pearls from Obama’s mouth, never mind if they are someone else’s words.
And folks will fret that the Xerox line will be damaging to Clinton, don’t believe it. That line will get big play on the street because it soundbytes Obama perfectly. People love that shit, because it’s both funny and TRUE.
But surprise, surprise, the Headline over at Raw Story is that “Clinton Gets Booed”. Not a word about the standing O just a screaming headline about how some Obamabots in the audience didn’t like her Xerox line and booed it. How the hell can she win when the left twists the truth just like the right?
Marge — I believe that she was booed by the Obamabots in the audience (as they are always wont to do) because the XEROX remark stung, and can be effectively repeated as a soundbite. While Hillary could have made the remark sting even more by looking more comfortable and smiling sweetly while delivering the shiv, she scored nonetheless, and the boo-birds recognized this.
She “gets it”? The only thing she “gets” is how to tell the American people what she “thinks” will get her elected. It’s not Hillary that needs to “get it”; it’s the American people that need to “get it”. Policitians will lie, cheat, steal, and assassinate the character of anyone in order to further their own cause. Hillary is no different; nor is Obama, nor any other candidate on either side of the aisle. One of her advisors probably gave her this “closing moment” in order to bolster her already failing position. I can’t see that I’m going to vote for ANY of the candidates because they all suck in my opinion. Sadly, voting seems to have become a game of having to vote AGAINST another candidate by voting for someone we wouldn’t otherwise choose. When will we finally get a candidate that we can vote FOR?
So what’s your point other than to bitch and moan that everything and everyone is just awful? Got any solutions in mind? Cause I too am sick and damn tired of the status quo.
And we will, or could, get candidates that we would be happy to vote for when we stop allowing the media to choose our candidate for us.
We will get the candidate we want, or say we want, when we allow candidates to tell us the truth instead of what most of us want to hear.
We will get the candidates we, or most of us, deserve so long as we use the same criteria to elect a president as we use to vote for somebody on American Idol.
And we will get the same bias, half-assed, dishonest, media we deserve so long as we tune into their crap and keep their ratings alive.
There, I’ve had my little rant too and I feel better and it’s lowered my blood pressure some which is fortunate since I don’t have any insurance and can’t afford any. Which is why I support Hillary Clinton because with her leadership I just might have a chance to get some. And thus just might live long enough to rant another day.
It was a great moment. Go, Hillary.
The possibility of losing the power of this woman named Hillary, her intelligence, passion, ideas, grace, charm, compassion and humor is almost unbearable to me. For the life of me I cannot understand the American people. She is the female president “we have been waiting for.”
God help us if she loses the nomination. After what I saw last night, we will be making the biggest mistake since Jimmy Carter if Hillary does not secure the nod, because following a failed Obama presidency, stand back for another generation of Republican supremacy in America.
No party knows how to lose as spectacularly as the Democratic party…
I’m going to put “change you can xerox” on my bumper sticker because it sure sums up how I feel about politics in the US.
I think there’s a lot of meaning behind those words and it goes way beyond copying speeches. These elections are getting very scripted and I think we’re just playing tag team politics. I don’t think elections are in the hands of the people anymore, I think the media is being handed a script and we’re all like extras in a movie production.
Sorry, I just can’t seem to find a silver lining today.
I guess I’m the only one who thought the “change you can xerox” was really funny and pointed. And it would have been to everyone if the argument had been framed beyond the plagiarism charge. The Deval Patrick thing was about undermining Obama as something new, fresh and original, if they had stayed on that, that Obama is just a clone, a slick politician peddaling hope and appealing to the masses just to get elected without any real substance or proven ability to bring about any of the things he is promising, if the Clinton campaign had done that, she would have scored points. Now everyone is focusing on plagiarism, on words, and proving that even she is guilty of this. It’s about the only thing Obama has said that I agree with: it is ’silly season.’ But the fact that he, like Deval Patrick who got elected by insiring the voters with words, but in the reality of the post-election, all those words, and inspiration don’t mean squat when you have to govern. Again, maybe that’s why Mass went for Hlllary even though Ted and John Kerry endorsed Obama. If only they had focused on that. But I love ‘change you can xerox and will be using it from now on.
I think it was beautiful, “change you can xerox.’ Seriously,I’ll hold onto those words all thru the election. And beyond. I think she nailed it.
But the people (represented by some of those dailyobama sites I am fleeing from) have totally trashed her words and are basically parroting the pundits.It’s discouraging.
The Xerox was a true statement but it was seen and will be perceived as a ‘low blow”. She was far better when she said,”Since words are so important to you, they should be your own words.” Or something to that effect. It was to the point, but wasn’t sarcastic or put down [audience booed].
Better to go with the first part, and Hillary would have scored a bigger point.
She still did not close on his allegations that some people cannot afford healthcare [15 million], and we know Hillary has better plan, but she still could have been more finite. Most people don’t know anything about healthcare details, and Obama has been bamboozling on this.
She was substantive, but she avoided Iraq Obama attack which she will be obliged to deal with GOP, if she is nominee. She’s explained it before and should have explained it again….and better.
She was terrific at the end. Her closing was perfect. Overall she was more interesting and dynamic. I found that he drones on, and while he has a sense of humor, there’s a lot of generalities when he explains. But his debating skills are improving.
She needs to show the voters that she won’t penalize them if some can’t afford healthcare, as they are being influenced by Obama that this will happen. She must show the alternative and change this perception and [fear] Obama tries to create.
He says that Hillary’s plan “garnishees their wages”. Entirely misleading, but it needs to be carefully taken down.
It’s really hard for Hillary to take down Obama as his followers are the real clones, so if Hillary takes him down too personally, or attack his cultist effect, she will not to win any Obamaites over. Why?? Because the Obamites feel personally attacked and KNOW thet are blind followers who don’t want to even HEAR anything negative about him no mattter how true. Audience boos; MSM attacks her.
It’s for others to do, and the MSM really hasn’t done this except sporadically and occasionally.
It would have to be done by a 527, and Obama’s lawyers are alreasy threatening Hillary with lawsuit, blah blah.
Most of these scare tactics are to halt info from coming out. And to halt negative info about Obama prior to convention.We’ll see.
But Hillary’s internet fundraising is inferior to Obama’s as he works from a huge Rolodex that self perpetuates. People match other’s contribution dollar for dollar and follow with letters from donors who matched original contribution.
In some instances, a $50 “match contribution” generates match donors to come up with $50 and sends a thank you to original contributor. This also bonds people. $50.00 becomes $100 when three “matchers”
come up from Obama’s internet Rolodex.
Who the hell did Hillary hire to fundraise on internet that keeps asking the same people to contribute over and over again? Her internet crew have not been original and this a leadership problem arising from Mandy Gruenwald, or Wolfson, whomever is in charge of this.
The only way to change cult/clone syndrome is to uncover real facts that have substance and need no editorializing, as the truth could do the job.
Excuse my math. Obama supporters giving $50.00 for matching, and attracts 3 contributors, becomes
$200.00 in matched and original $50. contribution. Excellent fundraising internet method.
1. The Xerox moment, while containing truth, did in fact get mixed reactions.
2. However, the really memorable moment was the finale. She owned it. The live audience knew it, she seemed to surprise herself a little when she realized it, and I sensed that even Obama knew it.
Yet to be seen the net effect, but at least some prospective voters will be saying to themselves, the bar was pushed higher for her, she saw it and said, I’ll take that bar and raise you a notch.
The Xerox moment captured the truth about Obama supporters, who cannot seem to accept any fault with their silver tongued empty suit!
The begining and the end for Clinton were the highlights of the night, but the most obvious and unquestionable factor that came out again last night is that Obama is unable to talk smoothly or properly when he is off script!
He has proven his true being that when it comes down to core specifics, he is completely non-intelligent, grasping at words! His studdering and his constant long silences searching for words to answer simple questions proves him to be lacking in substance! And this is just when confronting an opponent, how will he be when confronting another head of state?
At least David Letterman will be able to keep his “great moments in Presidential speeches” going after Bush leaves if Obama is the next President!
I am disappointed though in Clinton not putting an end to Obama’s continual repeating of his Iraq War judgement he stumps, when he flip flopped on it with Tim Russert, that is the truth of the matter!
I am also again disappointed in the tactics of CNN trying to push Clinton into a corner and hardly touching their darling Obama, but there again, there isn’t much to say about a 5 liner stump speecher who’s entire platform is basically taken from Clinton’s plans!
That is the Xeroxing that is the real basis of debate, a copier cannot enact what an originator designed, plain and simple!
No comments on it’s-my-byline-and-I-can-make-up-all-the-shit-I-want Seelye’s take?