Seating Florida Delegates: Howard Dean Gets Motivated
By Campskunk on April 3, 2008 at 1:15 AM in Barack Obama, Democrats, Florida, Hillary Clinton, Howard Dean
After huddling yesterday among themselves, Florida’s congressional delecation and state chair Karen Thurman met with DNC chair Howard Dean, and emerged making positive noises. In attendance at the meeting from Florida were Sen. Bill Nelson, Reps. Alcee Hastings, Corrine Brown, Bob Wexler, Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, Ron Klein, Tim Mahoney, Kathy Castor, Allan Boyd, Kendrick Meek and Karen Thurman. Here is the joint statement:
“We are all committed to doing everything we can to ensure that a Florida delegation is seated in Denver. We all agree that whatever the solution, it must have the support of both campaigns. While there may be differences of opinion in how we get there, we are all committed to ensuring that Florida’s delegation is seated in Denver. We’re committed to working with both campaigns to reach a solution as soon as realistically possible. We are also laying the groundwork to ensure we win in Florida in November and spent time here today talking about how to do just that. We will continue to work towards a solution to ensure delegates are seated and logistics are in place for a Florida delegation in Denver.”
Ok, everybody wants the delegates to go to Denver, but what they’ll do there is where it gets sticky. Remember, both campaigns have to approve the settlement. Hillary’s campaign sounded facilitative:
The Clinton campaign praised the meeting. “We have long maintained that pretending the voters of Florida and Michigan don’t exist is not fair in principle and unwise in practice,” said spokesman Phil Singer. “Chairman Dean is clearly committed to seating the Florida delegation and we urge Senator Obama to join us in calling on the rules and bylaws committee to make this a reality.”
So.. .what’s Obama joining? Well, it’s hard to tell. The Delphic utterance from Tom Daschle is below:
(FL US Rep Debbie Wasserman-Schultz) also expressed a willingness to consider a proposal that would allow the full delegation to weigh in at the convention, but for each delegate to get just half a vote.
Former Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle, a supporter of Sen. Barack Obama, rejected that proposal, which seemed to gain traction as prospects for a new contest grew more remote.
He told CNN’s Gloria Borger that the Illinois senator would like to “give Florida the opportunity to vote” - but not in a way that would change the overall outcome.
In other words, Florida’s votes can count… but only if they don’t count. Thanks a lot, Tom. We knew we could count on you 
Dean seems to be moving; his earlier “they didn’t follow the rules, tough luck” posture has been sliding off its pedestal a bit now that the word is out on the machinations by Donna Brazile to increase the penalty from half the delegates to all the delegates- that position seems to no longer be defensible. As the days go by and the pressure mounts, we’ll see who is working toward a solution and who’s obstructing said solution. Looks like Howard isn’t going down with the ship on this one.
A little funny business posted by Ben Smith last night with Florida adopting a solution similar to the proposed Michigan one - half the delegates being allocated by Florida’s January 29 primary, and half by “national delegate count”, whatever that is, seems to have been a false lead. Nobody’s proposing it at the meeting today.
FL Senator Bill Nelson is on record as supporting going with the original penalty from the DNC rules before Donna Brazile bumped it up to the death penalty - half the delegates. Obama’s campaign shot that one down- too… umm… representative or something. See Dashle’s statement earlier. Maybe it failed the “doesn’t affect the outcome” test.
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Here’s the Dean/Brazille/elite plan as I see it: Everyday have a new Super D come out for Obama to demoralize Hillary, then after the last ten states have voted, declare Obama the winner and seat the Florida and Michigan delegates, even though no one in those states had any voice in selecting a candidate and never mind the fact that Hillary probably wins if Florida and Michigan were allowed to vote.
After all, Hillary should be punished because Florida and Michigan moved their primaries up, right?
This is not on topic, but I wanted to get it to you ASAP.
This was just posted on Truth Dig.
Watergate-Era Judiciary Chief of Staff: Hillary Clinton Fired For Lies, Unethical Behavior
Poster also had link to the article.
http://www.northstarwriters.com/dc163.htm
Is this Obama’s next line of attack? Does this story have legs? How best can I handle this? Should I even respond at all? I have never heard this before.
Thanks
Zeitman is getting this out via Accuracy in Media (Scaife funds). Wonder why this didn’t come out when she had Vince Foster offed?
http://www.aim.org/aim-column/hillarys-crocodile-tears-in-connecticut
It was my impression she stopped a republican dirty trick.
I was impressed.
rjj-those photos of Hillary appear to be from the time she started coughing and couldn’t stop. She wasn’t crying but perhaps teared up from the coughing.
Neil Boortz was pushing this story two days ago on his radio show. Breathlessly. Repeatedly. This is the wingnuts gone wild version of the Barack Obama theatrical production.
Nothing much to see here. But you can bet they won’t be moving along as long as there’s something to hammer Hillary over the head with…
Hmmm…?
“The actions of Hillary and her cohorts went directly against the judgment of top Democrats…”
So, as a 27-year old staffer answering to someone higher up, we are to believe she was a ring leader?
Right.
Call me a cynic but especially after the news on Razko, Nafta and Wright came out, a number of these superdelegates who pledged their support to BO did so because they want to see him fail and be a one primary wonder, while retaining the loyalty and vote of the Obamabots. Improbable? Not if you consider the field of ambitious senators, congressmen and governors who have much more impressive resumes than the first-termer Senator from Illinois. It’s far from preposterous to think that one - if not a few of them - actually resent being asked to support a candidate whose claim to fame - beyond his ability to harangue his audience with lofty words (some of them borrowed) - is his skin color! What an insult to people of color (or “no color”) who actually have toiled in Washington or in their respective State Capitol for years, building a case for their yet-undeclared candidacies for higher office!
I agree, they do tend to get very very jealous, and petty.
All of this “rules” business is so much BS. Obviously, if Senator Obama were ahead in these two states, his reps would be screaming from the highest hill to get this counted. Other states moved their primaries up without penalty. Gee — I wonder if those were states where they didn’t think Senator Clinton was going to do all that well. Nobody’s finger on the scales there.
Realistically, in a primary this close, for the nomination to have any legitimacy, all votes must be counted. I don’t think that when the primary began, people anticipated we would be at this place. Furthermore, Gov. Dean cannot give in to Sen. Obama’s team’s complaints when he advertised in FL and she did not. The vote is the vote. How can you penalize innocent voters for what the Republican controlled legislature in FL forced on the Democrats so we could have a paper voting record? Why is this not being covered?
The DNC made a crappy decision and now Dean doesn’t want to admit he screwed up. Sooner or later Dean will have to eat crow and reverse himself with an edict that accepts the January primaries from MI and FL. Delaying a reversal only postpones the inevitable.
hey friend I havnt been back to this blog in forever. dont know why. its a good one..
anywho. I need you guys to show me some love and give me two clicks to help me get on the cover of the san francisco deli magazine
http://www.thedelimagazine.com/sf/vote.php
to:Ann
How can you penalize innocent voters for what the Republican controlled legislature in FL forced on the Democrats so we could have a paper voting record? Why is this not being covered?
reply from Fly..i have posted this on so many web sites that i am tired of posting it..the only person in MSM i have heard mention it is Lou Dobbs, and it now looks like he is being forced to have obamabots on his show..to what??? slow the flow Of info..well i would bet that..
why is team Hillary not slapping that all over every boradcast they go on..each time they have someone on any of these shows..i scream..tell the whole story..heck we have 4 citizens in Fla who are going to be recieving the highest award from the ACLU for their work on that bill and to get clean elections with VVPB for the voters and citizens of Fla in May..but team Hillary is mum on the story..why??????
are they unaware of it..i have friends who are also dem workers in Fla who are begging to go on MSM and tell the stroy if Hillary ’s team won’t.
If people in this nation only knew what this bill had been about they would want to remove Dean for incompetance and mal practice .
This story must be gotten out and it is about time Hillary’s campaign and her people are versed in it so they can take the story to the American people..if the people knew that Dean and Donna Brazile gamed the system , i believe most dems would be furious!
fly
flyarm:
This story must be gotten out and it is about time Hillary’s campaign and her people are versed in it so they can take the story to the American people.
Off-Topic, but I just have to remark on this “story,” by Michael Gerson in yesterday’s Washington Post:
Sen. Robert P. Casey Jr.’s endorsement of Barack Obama last week — “I believe in this guy like I’ve never believed in a candidate in my life” — recalled another dramatic moment in Democratic politics. In the summer of 1992, as Bill Clinton solidified his control over the Democratic Party, Robert P. Casey Sr., the senator’s father, was banned from speaking to the Democratic convention for the heresy of being pro-life.
The elder Casey (now deceased) was then the governor of Pennsylvania — one of the most prominent elected Democrats in the country. He was an economic progressive in the Roosevelt tradition. But his Irish Catholic conscience led him to oppose abortion. So the Clintons chose to humiliate him. It was a sign and a warning of much mean-spirited pettiness to come.
Are there any journalists left on the Washington Post? Is there anyone with any honor at all? This “Casey was refused permission to speak because he was Pro-Life” story has been debunked more often than the Hitler Diaries, and yet here it is again, rising from the grave to serve its common purpose, to strike at the Clintons.
Mr. Gerson: you know damned well that the reason the late Gov. Casey was not allowed to speak was because he refused to endorse the candidate of his party for President. There were SEVERAL Pro-Life speakers at the Democratic Convention in 1992. You, and all those who continue to peddle this “Clinton Mean-Spiritedness” BS are just LIARS who KNOW you are LYING. You should be ashamed, if you are even capable of that emotion any longer.
I have pointed out elsewhere that Senator Obama seems quite sanguine to let the January results count as they were cast, as long as he gets a share of the delegates that he did not merit based upon the January results. Either the votes were valid in January, or they were not. Either we count them the way they were cast, or the voters in Florida and Michigan get a new chance to express their opinions.
You know what? I talk to a lot of people from Florida, my family had a winter home there for decades till a few years ago. It doesn’t matter now what Obama does, they want his ass to be grass. I have never seen people this angry. They could seat them as-is or not seat them as-is, or not seat them. People in Florida are not chomping at the bit for Barack Obama. Add Michigan, where his two cronies/co-chairs fixed it so the state senate didn’t vote on a re-vote and then smirked on National TV about it (”It’s great to be in the lead”), and this guy is lucky if one typical white person votes for him in either of those states. To them it’s clear. Obama rigged the primary for himself. So far.
Do you know about the Can movement? They sent tin cans decorated with “Can I vote?” were individually sent to Nancy Pelosi. I bet she counted cans and thought about her own can. Add to that all the emails Dean and Pelosi got telling them that people were leaving the party and never giving them a dime. The movement behind the scenes was huge, and there you have it. They “decided” they had better cut the crap. So suddenly, they aren’t so bold. But still, they have that sneaky set of 25 delegates “appointed” by Dean. Car salesmen. Lobbyists! College Students. 25 stacked votes. At least now they know they are being watched.
There were plenty of articles about how the Party was way down in their contributions in March, broke even at the end of 2007. People are donating directly to their candidate and Hillary supporters aren’t going to send the party money with the shabby treatment they are getting. Hit ‘em in their wallets and their hearts and minds will follow.
Still I don’t trust them. They will find another way, if they haven’t already. It will be a long long time before I trust my party again, if ever.
As for Brazile, I watched her face morph over time. She was a strong Hillary superdelegate and suddenly one day, she had this odd look on her face. They strong armed her, you can bet on it. Look what happened with Lewis. You can TELL he’s uncomfortable with his “switch”. God knows what these people are doing to AA superdelegates. I fully expect Dave Paterson, the new governor of NY and a strong Hillary person to morph soon. Obama was in NY for his “economic plan” presentation (on Wall Street, lol). I’ll bet he paid Paterson a visit. Sickening. Just sickening. Fear and arm breaking will be Obama’s historical footnote.
DEM need Florida to win GE. No dispute. And HRC is THE candidate that will carry the state, compared to any D or R.
http://www.diversityj.com/Florida2000to2008.html
In the GE match up, HRC will also win.
http://www.diversityj.com/ElectoralVoteStates.html
If Obama had won the Florida primary Al Sharpton would be threatening civil unrest unless the votes were counted. Unfortunate for Senator Clinton- white ladies rarely riot. We are relying on the DNC and Dean to do the right thing. If the Florida votes are not counted, and the delegates not able to vote proportionate to that vote(no 1/2 vote screw job) we will hit the Democratic Party where it hurts the most: our vote, our money, our time.
If the Dem power brokers get away with a false nomination of Oploblem for the GE, I would have to swallow at least one bottle of Ipecac after casting my vote for their guy. As it is I’m not partial to throwing up, so I’m writing in my choice and it will be a Dem and I’m confident my vote won’t be the reason the GOP will win the GE.
I do not feel as charitable as you do. I am in a “punish the culprits” mood. But let us hope that will be unnecessary.
This line from Daschle has to be strongly challenged:
“He told CNN’s Gloria Borger that the Illinois senator would like to “give Florida the opportunity to vote” – but not in a way that would change the overall outcome.”
What nonsense! Do we already know the overall outcome now? Who decided the overall outcome before it happened? If they think the revote will change the overall outcome (because Obama has bungled it and made it worse and he may come out worse than before, then they should accept counting Jan 29th).
COUNT FL AS IS NOW!
and how exactly is it a “vote” if it can’t affect the outcome? we’re not the uneducated ones - they are.
What do you expect since Daschle serves as one of two national co-chairs for Obama’s presidential bid.
And there’s no sign that Daschle has left his million dollar a year job with K Street law firm Alston & Bird.
So much for Obama not having K Street pukes on his staff.
I’ve created intros into the actual footage of rule breaking from the Texas caucuses and mashed it together with the footage. Please circulate far and wide!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIJVLxhmbXw Obama Calling Hillary Delegates
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjBeVYvMOwc Rules Schmules!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgWLtY6AVTs Resolutions? Anyone?
Kim
Kim, the links were great. I just wish what was going on had been explained a little better. Maybe it was the bad audio. On the first clip, did their having her down as an Obama delegate mean that a vote would go down for Obama when she showed up at the convention?
The third clip is chilling. Good work!
I’m quite sure you remember what your mother (or your grandmother if you hadn’t thrown her under the bus) told you about a certain over-sized feline not being able to change its spots. Well, this one (others who have taken the lethal Kool-Aid say he is “The One”) simply can’t. A few days after publicly appearing “statesmanlike” by encouraging the continuing candidacy of his rival in the primaries (who would have been declared as the rightful nominee after the votes in Texas, Ohio and Rhode Island came in - had the right to vote of the people of Florida and Michigan been recognized that is), here he goes again being unable to resist the urge to stoke his Titanic-sized ego and his over-riding belief in his greatness - by asking Nobel laureate Al Gore to do his bidding and crown him! Such hubris! It’s like asking a surviving relative of a Holocaust martyr to sign a manifesto honoring Il Fuhrer. I bet Tipper was not amused! And while I mourned his loss to John Thune in 2004, I no longer wonder why the God of history allowed it to happen. And it’s just sad that the former Majority Leader-turned-Minority Leader-turned-Obama-operative is ignoring the lessons of history. Again.
Nobel laureate Al Gore was not asked. Obama “used” the name dropping of Al Gore to side step the fact Obama represents Oil and Coal and has no interest in the sustainablity of the ecosphere.
Another BS lie by BO. If I was VP Gore, I would be pissed. He was on 60 min last Sunday and said he was getting called everyday. He flat out said he was not endorsing anyone…
“It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything.”
Joseph Stalin
=====================================================
Since when do the candidates get to decide the outcome of a political election? They should not be the one’s to count the votes and skew them in their favor. This is a bad precedent for the future.
And no candidate should get votes that they haven’t earned. A candidate can’t demand he be allocated votes based on some mathematical calculation when the people in actuality haven’t cast their votes for him. That’s cheating and totally undemocratic. Any candidate who would secure delegates in this fashion will be perceived as illegitimate should they secure the nomination.
The only equitable solution is to have a direct primary revote in MI and FL and let the chips fall where they may.
Dean needs to grow a spine and do what’s right for this country. Either that or we are in truth a banana republic.