Remember Florida? Well, Let Me Tell You, Florida Remembers … [Update]
By SusanUnPC on April 14, 2008 at 11:50 PM in Barack Obama, Electoral College, Florida, Hillary Clinton
The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey in Florida shows McCain attracting 53% of the vote while Obama earns 38%. Last month, amidst talk of a possible Florida revote, Obama had closed to within single digits of McCain. In February, however, Obama trailed McCain by sixteen points.
Howard Dean? Nancy Pelosi? Donna Brazile? Hello? Anybody there? Well, if you are here, you might want to cover your eyes:
Florida Survey of 500 Likely Voters
April 10, 2008
|
John McCain (R) vs. Hillary Clinton (D) |
|
|---|---|
| John McCain (R) | 44% |
| Hillary Clinton (D) | 45% |
|
John McCain (R) vs. Barack Obama (D) |
|
|---|---|
| John McCain (R) | 53% |
| Barack Obama (D) | 38% |
UPDATE THOUGHTS: It’s obvious why Barack Obama doesn’t want a re-vote in Florida. (He’ll get whupped.) But in avoiding that humiliation, he’s infuriating Floridians. Does he really think that — if he’s the general election nominee — that the Floridians will forget all about THE SNOB’S SNUB, and rally to him come November? Especially with a candidate like McCain who appeals to centrists and independents?
Barack Obama and Howard Dean may “win” the Florida “battle” right now. But they’re setting themselves up to lose the DAMN WAR in November!
(This is so patently obvious that I am dumbfounded it isn’t clear as day to Howard Dean, Donna Brazile, and to every superdelegate.)
_____________________________
Then there are the general election numbers … Barack Obama is “a far weaker candidate” than Hillary Clinton, especially when we look at an Electoral College map:
Writes Richard Baehr for RealClearPolitics, re-published at Yahoo News, in “McCain’s Electoral College Math”:
[...]
Despite all this [the economy, Democratic fundraising, etc.], John McCain is in very good shape for the general election run. The Republicans have landed on the one candidate in their party ideally suited for the race this year, with broad appeal among Democrats and independents, a veteran and war hero during a time of war, a candidate with a reputation for being a straight talker (and not talking down to voters, or outright lying to them), and with real strength in larger swing states. McCain is also benefiting from the fact that the Democrats continue to snipe at each other rather than at him, and each candidate has exposed weaknesses in the other, which become ammunition for McCain in the fall campaign.
McCain opens up the map to a broader Electoral College victory than George Bush achieved in 2000 and 2004, particularly against Barack Obama. Though Bush won 30 states in 2000 and 31 states 4 years later, the loss of any state Bush won in 2000 would have given the election to Al Gore, and the shift of 60,000 votes in Ohio in 2004 would have resulted in a John Kerry victory.
[...]
At the start of this seemingly interminable Presidential campaign, Democrats saw a very favorable Electoral College map. With Hillary Clinton as the likely nominee, Democrats believed they could turn many states from red to blue, including Ohio (20), Florida (27), Iowa (7), New Mexico (5), Nevada (5), Colorado (9), and possibly Arizona (11), Virginia (13), West Virginia (5), and Missouri (11). But Clinton is unlikely to get the nomination.
Barack Obama is a far weaker candidate in many of these targeted states, but in particular in Ohio, Florida., Missouri, Arkansas, and West Virginia. McCain takes Arizona off the table against either nominee. Obama is polling better than Clinton in the competitive southwestern states and Iowa, as well as in Oregon, but trails badly in Virginia, which has elected a string of Democrats in recent years to statewide office. Some Democratic Party officials have written off Florida if Obama is the nominee (in some surveys he trails in the state by 10% or more, though he only trails by 4% in the Rasmussen survey). The Rasmussen survey shows McCain with a 7% lead over Obama in Ohio. Obama lost badly in that state’s Democratic primary (by 10% to Clinton) winning only 5 of 88 counties. Now having insulted rural voters for their attachment to guns and God, the state has become even less friendly turf for him.
The Electoral math looks this way: if Florida and Ohio are safe for McCain, and Virginia and Missouri are too, as they now all appear to be, then McCain has a base of 260 Electoral College votes of the 270 he needs to win. He would need to only win 10 from among the states Bush won last time that are in play this year: Colorado (currently tied), New Mexico (3 point Obama lead), Iowa (4 point Obama lead) and Nevada (4 point Obama lead), and several tempting blue states in which McCain is currently competitive: Michigan (18), Pennsylvania (21), New Jersey (15) Wisconsin (10), Minnesota (10), Oregon (7), and New Hampshire (4), among them. …
Those numbers are so sobering that I think I need a stiff drink.
Actually, what those numbers make me realize is that it’s NOW OR NEVER. We must do all we can in the coming weeks to ensure that Hillary Clinton holds on and wins convincingly.
There is so much that we each can do.
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By Sarah Palin (Release date: November 17. 2009)
This is why Obama (and Dean) desparately want Fla votes (among others) to not be counted. The only problem being that without using republican ‘keep out the votes’ tactics, Fla, etc are going to come back and bite Obama and Dean in the a**.
Maybe Dean thinks if he skewers this election, he will be good to run in 4 years?
Dean is threatened. This whole thing is built on fear of riots. Nobody can be as stupid as Dean is pretending to be.
I think you’re right, Uppity. Howard Dean is not as stupid as he appears to be in this mess. Threats of violence is the only thing that makes sense.
Since when DO WE SUCCOME to threats of violence?!! Even talking about it is profoundly absurd! Is this what obama and his cult are all about??? This is the great moral hope and change. The great ’savior’?!! It looks more like the dark ages and much too akin to the ranting , chanting, shooting AK-47s in the air footage we see of the extremist protests in middle east. Is THIS the leadership we want in this country??? I for one WILL NOT BE HIJACKED by this self-serving, arrogant, physcopathic fool.
If they’re so afraid of who these people are, then you would think they sure as hell wouldn’t want to elect them! That would be the height of stupidity. And yet that is exactly what they are doing.
I still come back to the face that Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina also broke Deans precious rules and they still count.
And none of you are right. Obama’s motives are clear: He’s running out the nomination clock.
Dean does want FL & MI to count but he’s also aware–and has always said–that in the end someone will lose, and the loser has to feel the process was as fair as possible. I guess everyone here thinks it’s only a fair process if Hillary comes out on top. If that happens, you still need the Obama supporters on your side and someone had better start thinking now how that will happen since Obama thinks he just has to smile pretty and all of Hillary’s supporters will flock to him.
Now if all of you armchair quarterbacks would remember that little factoid, we can return to the serious business at hand of getting Hillary nominated.
So you mean that disenfranchising 2 million voters is a small price to pay for making the (2) remaining candidates feel that the primary process was fair? That is the kind of massive rationalization that will sink the Democratic Party in the fall.
Are we Democrates or are we Republican’s. When the situation changes, the rules that apply to the situation must adapt and change as well. If not, then we are like the Republican’s, who will not deviate once they set down a path; no matter how costly or bone-headed the action may be!
My God, I never thought I would hear supposed “progressives” parrot the right-wing talking point, “…but the rules”, in all my days!!
[ERROR] Democrat’s
But that’s just unbelievably stupid — it’s like WINNING THE BATTLE but LOSING THE DAMN WAR! Like the war in November? HELLO?
OMG.
The selective disenfranchisement of Florida and Michigan is one of the most shameful episodes in Democratic history. And bad politics.
Dean the uber Putz et,al. have done more to hurt the Democratic party than anything imagined in a republican wet dream…OBAMESSIAH is their puppet.
Jeebus isn’t this what we Hillary supporters have been shouting for months? The only response we have gotten is snarky insults from Donna Brazille and requests for money from Dean.
Everyone who is at all surprised raise their hand. anyone? anyone? Bueller?
Obama as the nominee means a McCain presidency. And the longer he is around the worse he gets. No way he carries OH or PA in the GE. Think you can kiss MI and NJ guh-bye as well. VA? no way. CO, doubt it seriously. ding ding ding! order up! TOAST!
I would vote for the Old Man first. That is how objectionable Obama is to me.
I agree with this comment… here in VA… MANY of the Democrats will vote for McCain before Obama. Why do you think McCain is polling way ahead of Obama here? The GOP will get help from a lot of the moderate and conservative Democrats like me.
hah, Bambi will win Idaho !!!
Only if the 4-legged sheep get to vote, too.
Idaho- home of Mt Home AFB? No way- Idaho goes McCain
Uppity I hear you.
And I also will NOT vote for snobama EVER.
The more I learn about him, the more I realize that he is an awful choice for ANY elected office.
If he and his supporters do not stop threatening to riot and destroy my state, he will never win in Colorado. It doesn’t matter if he is nominated, the fact that they threatened violence on Coloradans if he is not annointed will not play well in Colorado.
We do not respond as well to threats as you all think. He may be forced on us in the primary, but we will remember he threatened to destroy our beautiful capital city.
We need an army out there to keep them under wraps! OOPS sorry all the Guard units are a little busy now- maybe get the bikers to do security? What the hell is this country coming to?
I’ve been saying this for months! The Obamatrons need to stop sipping on the kool-aid and get a good dose of reality - the guy is just not electable. He’s the new McMondukakerry - he’s done.
which makes him even more desirable to AOL Time Warner and General Electric.
Thank you blobert — spot on. When I saw how hard CNN and MSNBC/NBC were pushing Obama on us, months ago, of course I got suspicious — gee, who benefits? Obama is much weaker and a lot more corporate friendly — so with Obama they win — more likely they know he can’t win so the narrative they push has always been with the idea of ousting the more formidable candidate first — Hillary, obviously.
Even the DNC cannot be this goofy — the longer they work to disenfranchise FL and MI the more it will be apparent that other states moved their primaries up too, beyond the legal limit and received no penalty. Game the system, anyone? This is the story that needs reporting.
Exactly. They were seasoning him for the roast.
YACK! Gross- I might never eat roast beef again! LMAO
David Shuster said Chelsea was being “pimped out” by the Clinton campaign.
In this youtube clip, Keith Olbermann accuses Bush of “pimping” General Petraeus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xPsxhN8yuA
I understand that Michelle Obama is scheduled to appear on The Colbert Report Tuesday.
If you extrapolate out MSNBC/Olbermann/Shuster’s analogy to its logical conclusion, then it seems to suggest that Obama is “[insert word]” Michelle on the campaign trail. Or, does “[insert word]” only apply to “typical white people”?
Simply put, does Obama meet the “[insert word]” test, or not? Just curious. :-0
Colbert was really fun to watch on LK and was a calling Obama a bong head…Larry had to ask “A Bong”?
Yeah Teak I saw that. It was a riot. Yes We Can!…snort…Yes We Can! Poor LK just doesn’t grasp satire though. It’s almost painful to watch Colbert do him.
Obama obviously does not respect you. He shows it every day, so you have no reason to worry about the fact that you do not respect him. He hasn’t earned your respect. I’m not giving up the rights I fought for in deference to this piece of crap and I don’t care what they call me.
I am with you! Tired of being disrespected and called a racist or a republican for doing my homework and supporting the BEST candidate>
Go Hillary!
FL and MI is about more than November 2008. Its about whether or not the Democratic Party is legitimate or not after August.
The party will be marginalized, just like ‘72. For years to come. They will lose the election AND congress. Their contributions have gone into the crapper because angry people are not going to donate to a party that doesn’t represent them. When the Obama college children find another diversion for fun, the base of the party still won’t be donating to the party. The damage will resonate for years to come. That’s how it worked before and Dean was wimpy enough to make it happen again like it did in ‘72.
You are correct….If I was a True Paranoid I’d almost wonder if Dean the Putz was a republican operative…
there’s only so much he can do.
I doubt anyone expected Obama to win as many early states as he did.
Disenfranchisement, Rev. Wright, Rezko, “bittergate;” How many more self-inflicted wounds will it take before the party elites realize Obama can’t win?
McCain will not only beat Obama, he will be able to claim a “mandate” from the size of his victory.
You forgot NAFTA-gate. Bambi was caught red handed
They already know he can’t win. I am thoroughly convinced that they feel threatened by race riots. Well that’s nothing compared to the threat that this entire party will disappear to the curb again just like they did with McGovovern. Nobody is going to let a bunch of star struck pisspots leaching off their parents pick a president. It will never happen. Ask McCarthy. Ask Dukakis and most of all ask McGovern. The only difference today is fear of riots. Even feminist me cannot describe Dean as anything else but a pussy. And this threat that will be the reason the party dies for another generation will be the direct fault of the people who need this party the most. And if you think that’s racist, it’s also the truth, so tough shit. Nobody is going to allow America to go back to that savage Ayers and the 70s– and the people who think they are going to pull that off had better get it out of their heads right now.
No Dean is a slug — a huge Banana slug with no spine.
Yeah….We can thank the good Rev. Sharpton for that threat…
Mandate that funny GW claimed he had on after winning by a nose.
McCain will be able to call himself King John after destroying Barry in November.
Amazing WE could see that Obama was unelectable in November and yet the “party” leadership keeps pushing this creep who has so many skeletons in his closet he could have a Halloween haunted house all by his lonesome.
For the good of the party Obama should quit. But the narcissistic bastard thinks only of himself — so that won’t happen.
He won’t quit b/c Pelosi gang ia actually encouraging him to keep going. Pelosi gang is determined to rid of the Clintons and Bambi is their weapon.
Pelosi will live to regret this. And she should be ashamed of herself by helping to demean a woman who would open more doors for her. Women are such fools sometimes when it comes to “competition”. They don’t think of the long haul. Pelosi thinks it should be her instead of someone else. This stupidity is a lesson most intelligent professional women learn a bit faster. Apparently, Nancy isn’t a quick learner. Or perhaps she herself mistakenly thinks she should stand alone.
Look at Pelosi’s electorate base….ID politics centered New Left. She’s one of the worst speakers we have ever had….Ol’ Tip is rollin in his grave.
You’re right. snobama lives in a bubble. I have a feeling he is getting advice from people who are as self centered as he is.
But hey — at least the media is covering the democrats.
If Obama does drop out then they will completely ignore Hillary.
So at least parts of the Clinton message are seeing the light of the corporate media gaze.
I just sent an email to a friend who is a Republican and told her that Clinton supporters are watching Fox news in order to get a more balanced presentation of the democratic competition for the nomination. So adores Fox and has a snitty when the cable tv connection goes haywire.
Amazing how alliances change — I’m not speaking to my sister-in-law who just adores snobama. YECK.
My dad told me and mom last night he will vote for “that soldier” aka McCain if Hillary does not get the nom. We were shocked at first when he said “soldier”, who is that? he just calmly said My VietNam buddy, Mr McCain. He has never voted for a repub ever.
If Obama gets the nomination, they deserve what they get.
Again, I think a McCain administration may even be worse than a Cheney administration.
But if those rich idiots want to elect those who shouldn’t be near the presidency, well, good luck to them.
They’ll lose everything.
Which might be the plan, just ask Cheney how it worked out for him.
They are so stupid…
IMHO the whole Democratic Party will live to regret this election. On the whole the attacks have been no worse than in most other elections. It’s been the “tone”.
Misogyny has come out of the closet and become mainstream. Democrats not willing to climb on board the U.S.S. Obama are now commonly referred to as racists by other Democrats.
Media has chosen the two final contestants in the Democratic Contest and is now unabashedly cheering for the Obamans to win. Obama can say nothing wrong and Hillary Clinton can say nothing right. Didn’t progressives once decry the lack of a level playing field? Or was it just another self-serving piece of hypocrisy really meaning that progressives just want the field to be tilted in their direction?
By their willingness to disenfranchise the voters of two states the Democratic Party has proven that they, and the candidate they are trying to shove down our throats are no better than the Republicans. Corrupted and cowardly and full of hot air is pretty much SOP in the political arena. We simply try to chose those we find less objectionable and who will actually try to do things that will benefit the country as a whole. Since all politicians lie being able to separate the wheat from the chaff is seldom easy.
But Obama, and his surrogates and supporters help us in our ability to see the “guts” of their candidate.
Say repeatedly that “Hillary will do anything to win”. Then be willing to disenfranchise the voters of FL and MI while giving FL SC and NV a pass on moving up their primaries.
We may be low-information, low-class, clingy, bitter people out here in the real world. But many of us, most of us recognize when we’re being conned given enough time and an honest media. Time we still have. T’other? LOL
Excuse me. No offense but I think the guy is really really dumb. He stutters and falls all over His words. He makes zero sense when he talks. He is just plain dumb and is an embarrasment to America. The world is watching and hoping we do the right thing. Vote Hillary. “It’s a no-brainer” Cher
Hillary takes all the big blue states, and then takes Florida and Ohio away from McCain, too. The argument is airtight; Hillary would win. Even top Republican strategist Alex Castellanos agrees in the latest New York magazine issue.
Obama will never win. If Hillary is the nominee, she will.
I am still hoping for the things to turn around in our favor. But there is no doubt that the Deans, Braziles, Pelosis have to pay for where we are today — Obama will pay no matter what. After he loses now or in the GE, he will be a nobody, especially the way he has conducted his campaign — it appears to me that whoever is supporting him now are all using him for their own ulterior motive; there is no one who really believes he is a good candidate or will be a good president.
FL and MI is a shameful situation for the party — I keep repeating how like a third world country is the position of the party and Obama is: “don’t count the votes for fear of losing.” Carter supporting this guy is a joke instead of telling him a thing or two about democratic elections like he does in those third world countries.
Carter should be arrested and put in a home.
Awe come ON!
I spent 6 yrs in the Army (4 of it during the Clinton years)
I LOVE that man! HE never sent my ass out on some illegal invasion of a foreign country that was weaker and had more OIL than GOD.
He was not that stupid greedy or assinine (sp)
I’m sorry it was 4 of it during the CARTER years!!
lmao
oops
Florida…..a scary state (of mind).
A friend just said something funny, about Obama (and a little mean).
“Obama. . . too elite, effete, easy to defeat.”
I am one that is NOT in the majority here I guess about Dr. Dean.
I have always liked him and respected his abilities. If it turns out he is in the tank for OBAMA against the will of the people then I will change my mind.
Until then, I still think he’s done a pretty good job getting DEMS back in the house and senate. Better than Terry did for sure. But it’s jmo.
I also never hated the DLC like so many from the DNC blog used to always blame them for everything.
This is the History of Politics I hear.
No wonder I never got involved before. It’s too hard to keep up with all the back door vendettas. Some of us don’t live our lives trying to repay old debts. It’s very NON productive!
just complaining (to the air) lol
thank you for the space
GO HILLARY!!!!!
GO AWAY OBAMA!!!!!
Did anyone see Joe Klien on Charlie Rose last night?
He is so in the tank for Obama it’s really unbelievable. He said that Hillary has played the
race card…..c’mon again?????? Hillary has been
losing the black vote by 90%. Can anyone explain to me how Hillary “played” the race card? She had 60% African American support in Oct. 07 and 10% in Feb. It’s so irrational and typical of the press corps who has been in the tank for Obama.
Although Hill supporters have every right to Obama bash, for the months of Obamabot bashing that still goes on, we need to refrain from it and simply keep pushing the issues:
1-Fla and Mich must count!
2-Be thankful to Hill for continuing the fight against all odds for knowing Obama will implode eventually, that is AMAZING JUDGEMENT!
3-keep pressing the DNC to advise Obama he is by his own doing, NOT ELECTABLE!
4-Keep Hill’s bank fluid
5-Keep blogging everywhere promoting Hill on the simple basis that America will never elect a BIGOT!
6-Keep writing the DNP and Super Delegates to swing to Hill
7-Caucus States left to vote, keep contacting people there to stack the caucuses to fend off Obama stacking!
8-Keep blogging here and everywhere as to the missdeeds of Obama!
9-Keep phoning shows like the new Rhodes show asking why she promotes a bigot!
10-Keep writing Obama campaign demanding answers as to why he voted on things like Cheney’s energy bill and is taking money from Exelon and other poluters!
That is enough to keep things rolling for now!
But most of all, hit Hill’s blog today and thank her for remaining in the race and praise her for being so strong against the ignoracne that camp Obama has continually thrown at her and Bill!
Do not forget one thing above all else, Obama is an opportunist and no crack can be given to him, because the GOP already has the ammo to destroy him!
The word is getting out. John Judis at The New Republic also points out that Obama is the weaker candidate against McCain in November.
Woe Is He
by John B. Judis
Barack Obama’s going to be the bitter one at the end of this.
April 15, 2008
John B. Judis is a senior editor at The New Republic and a Visiting Scholar at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.
http://www.tnr.com/environmentenergy/story.html?id=bf08a566-7c44-446a-aa34-7889b0f24b5a
Gee, he’s “unelectable”? Florida voters are “bitter”, you say? Could it possibly be because people such as yourselves are working overtime to pin this on Obama, when it was actually the DNC who wrote the rules of engagement for this primary season?
Where were you people last summer when these rules were being written? Was anybody bitching about this then? Why did this suddenly emerge as a huge problem a couple months ago, when anybody with a brain could have forseen this being problematic a year ago?
Could it possibly be that one year ago, Hillary had been all but crowned the victor, with no worthy opponents in sight?
You all are working overtime to destroy Obama at the expense of the party you claim to belong to — blaming FL and MI on him; saying he’s unelectable; trying to “re-claim” the party from the alleged elitist intruders who want to take it from you; defending heinously racist remarks… all this just from the last few days!
Do you want the Dems to win in November or not? And do you really believe in the things you say, or is that just a smokescreen?
I have to agree with bubbleboy.
I mean you all post like your hearts belong to the democratic party but then if HIllary doesnt win you dont mind setting the party on fire just because she doesnt get the nod.
Honestly if you believe that Clintions polocies are way better than McCains then during the elctions you should vote Obama if he gets the nod because honsetly on polocy they are both pretty much have the same stances on issues.
Obama/Clintion are on a totally different page than McCain. So if Clintion looses then why vote for someone who has totally different views than your own.
I mean you guys should be pumping up the team and not a player.
I’m really curious to see what will become of this blog if Obama gets the nomination. So much hatred, where will it go? Will you pretend the past few months never happened? Delete your entire backlog of posts? Move forward with a sense of pride and unity, knowing you’re supporting the candidate who was selected by members of your own party as its most worthy representative?
Are you prepared for that? You hate him so much, how on earth will you ever be able to pull it off?
Bubbleboy….
your online name is priceless, for you are indeed living in a bubble!
As for your argument that we should get behind Senator Obama because “he has been selected by members or your own party”, I have some swamp land in the Florida Everglades you might wish to purchase for a low, low price.
Obama was not chosen by the core constituency of this party. He was chosen by “Democrat’s for a Day” that will vote Republican in the GE. He was chosen by 25 year olds who shouted down everyone else in very un-Democratic caucuses. He has carried states that this party will not carry in a GE matchup with Senator McCain. We will not carry Idaho, Nebraska, Virginia, South Carolina, Kansas, Louisiana, or Georgia. We can carry Tennessee, Arkansas, Florida, W. Virginia, and Kentucky provided that Senator Clinton is our party nominee. Otherwise, the blow of defeat will be grander than it was on the night McGovern got his ass handed to him by Nixon!
IF, eurogirl, IF. As in “IF Obama gets the nomination… [will you] Move forward with a sense of pride and unity, knowing you’re supporting the candidate who was selected by members of your own party as its most worthy representative?”
Or wait, is your argument that the people who voted for Obama aren’t really Democrats? That the true “core constituency” of the party are by definition Hillary supporters? Are you really trying to make that argument? If so, then I’m afraid I’m not the one who is living in a bubble.
My question still stands, but now I will pose it directly to you: IF Obama is chosen as the nominee for the Democratic Party, what will you do? Will you shed your anger and rage and hatred and vote for him? Or do you think McCain’s values are a better match for the core constituency of the Democratic Party?
As a woman and a lesbian I will under no circumstances cast a vote for Senator Obama. I will not vote for Senator McCain either. I will either abstain or I will write Senator Clinton’s name in.
I have voted as a Democrat in every election since I became eligible in 1988. I will not cast a vote for the “lesser of two evils”. I saw people like you, Arianna Huffington, Maureen Dowd, Frank Rich, Sam Sedar, etc. disparage Al Gore in 2000 and vote Nadar. Now these self-same appointed members of the pundit-ocracy are telling me to come together for the good of the party and the country.
This is my time to lodge a complaint!
Well then, go for it. Vote for whomever you prefer. But please refrain from calling me “people like you” when you know nothing of me or my voting record.
I’m just voicing my shock and horror at the disturbing in-party slash/burn tactics I see at play here. So many here claim to be “true” Democrats, yet their unflinching loyalty to a single candidate tells a different story. For true Democrats, party loyalty should supercede all else.
If the goal truly is to put a Democrat in the White House, this is the wrong way to do it. It’s one thing to sell your candidate on his/her best qualitites, and another to try and tear down the other with any and every tool at hand. Personally I find it difficult to stomach that people who consider themselves “The True Democrats” are willing to excuse racist remarks made by a Republican. That is truly beyond the pale.
One last point — do you realize that if you don’t vote for whomever the Democratic nominee is, you will become one of those “people like you” who voted for Nader in 2000? Whether you agreed with their vote is irrelevant, those people were lodging their complaints as well.
Umm I live in North Dakota which is in your words very Un-Democratic and I must say that most of the people who voted were older than I was and I am 25 and obama won with 65%.
Also a college prof who studies elections said that if these “Un-Democratic” caucuses were run as regular voting races then Obama would have come out with a larger vote.
I dont know whats so bad about Caucuses I mean besides waiting in line for 4 min and taking anouther 5 min to figure out the area where I voted it didnt take me for than 13 min to get my vote in and be back in the parking lot.
I’m sorry but the whole argument that clintion is making that caucuses is Un-Democratic is stuipid.
Its funny that Clinton say we shouldnt disenfranchise FL and Mich and let them vote. Yet Clintion will disenfranchise Caucuse states because she didnt win them.
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