WARNING
By Larry Johnson
Email: larry_johnson@earthlink.net
Site: http://NoQuarterUSA.net
About: Larry C. Johnson is a former analyst at the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency, who moved subsequently in 1989 to the U.S. Department of State, where he served four years as the deputy director for transportation security, antiterrorism assistance training, and special operations in the State Department's Office of Counterterrorism. He left government service in October 1993 and set up a consulting business. He currently is the co-owner and CEO of BERG Associates, LLC (Business Exposure Reduction Group) and is an expert in the fields of terrorism, aviation security, and crisis and risk management, and money laundering investigations. Johnson is the founder and main author of No Quarter, a weblog that addresses issues of terrorism and intelligence and politics. NoQuarterUSA was nominated as Best Political Blog of 2008.[1] He has worked as a private consultant on issues of international terrorism and security for the U.S. Government and private companies. Johnson has appeared as a consultant and commentator in many major newspapers and news programs.[2]
Contents [hide]
1 Background
2 Views
2.1 1996
2.2 1998
2.3 1999
2.4 2000
2.5 2001
2.6 2003
2.6.1 Plame affair
2.7 2008
3 Notes
4 References
5 External links
[edit]Background
Larry Johnson moved to Washington, D.C. in 1979 to begin work on a Ph.D. at the American University. Although he completed successfully all coursework and comprehensive exams, he did not write a dissertation. In 1978 and in 1983-85 he worked in Latin America on community development projects as a community organizer. Returning to the United States in 1985 he joined the Central Intelligence Agency, thanks in part to a letter of recommendation from Republican Senator Orrin Hatch (R-UT) that helped to "open doors" for him at the Agency.[3] Johnson entered on duty at the CIA in September 1985 and was a classmate of Valerie Plame. Every member of that class was undercover. After a year in the Career Trainee program, which included a stint with the Afghan Task Force, Johnson was assigned as an analyst in the Middle America Caribbean Division in the Latin American Affairs Office of the Directorate of Intelligence. He received two Exceptional Performance awards and was promoted ultimately to Senior Regional Analyst for Central America.
Johnson remained undercover in the CIA until October 1989, when he resigned from the CIA and started a new job in the Office of Counter Terrorism at the Department of State. Johnson played an instrumental role in launching the Terrorism Rewards program international advertising campaign (working with Diplomatic Security officers Brad Smith and Michael Parks). [4] Johnson also was involved in a variety of crisis management response operations, including the release of hostages from Lebanon and liaison with the Pan Am 103 families. He left government service in October 1993 and started his own business as a consultant.
After leaving government service, Johnson became a frequent guest on many major television news shows when a question of terrorism came up. He was first interviewed by CNN following the capture of Carlos the Jackal. Johnson subsequently appeared on CNN, ABC's Nightline, CBS, the BBC, MSNBC, the Jim Lehrer News Hour, NBC, and NPR. In December of 1999, for example, Johnson was hired by NBC to serve as its terrorist expert for the Y2000 and was in Time Square with Tom Brokaw and Katie Couric ("a lot of fun and the best way to see in the New Year"). Johnson also was hired in January 2002 as a Fox News Analyst and remained under contract until February 2003.
Since 1994 a significant focus of Johnson's consulting work has been with the U.S. military special operations forces in scripting and conducting military counter terrorism exercises. He traveled under orders from the U.S. military to Iraq in May 2006 to work on a short term project.
A registered Republican who supported President Bush in 2000, Johnson became a strong critic of the Bush administration in May 2003 for its conduct of the war in Iraq and, a few months later, for its role in the outing of CIA operative Valerie Plame.[5] He was also featured in the 2004 political documentary Outfoxed: Rupert Murdoch's War on Journalism. Since Robert Novak's controversial disclosure of Valerie Plame as a CIA operative in July 2003, Johnson has contributed to public discourse on intelligence matters, often sparking further controversy. He has been interviewed by both the mass media and the alternative media and published commentaries on a variety of issues, including the Plame affair, the controversy concerning Mary McCarthy, and the resignation of Porter Goss as Director of Central Intelligence.
[edit]Views
This article or section may contain an inappropriate mixture of prose and timeline.
Please help convert this timeline into prose or, if necessary, a list.
[edit]1996
In 1996, Johnson noted that terrorism worldwide was on the decline. "Terrorist incidents [both internationally and in the US] have fallen to levels not seen since the 1970s. Whether measured by the number of incidents, the number of fatalities, or the number of groups, raw statistics demonstrate that the level of terrorist violence has declined since the mid-1980s. In fact, the evidence suggests terrorism was more widespread and deadly 10 years ago."[6]
He also wrote an op-ed piece for the New York Times suggesting that the newer and more deadly terrorist threat to the U.S. was embodied by "networks of terrorists, mostly foreign, working within its borders." Exemplifying this threat was Ramzi Yousef, one of the masterminds behind the 1993 attack on the World Trade Center. In the article, Johnson suggests that enhanced cooperation between intelligence agencies, particularly the FBI and CIA, is mandatory to meet the growing threat of terror networks.[7]
[edit]1998
In 1998, Johnson argued that while overall terrorism was declining, the threat from bin Laden and al-Qaeda should be the focus of American counterterrorism policy:
The nature of the threat posed by Bin Ladin is highlighted by my final chart, number 7. Osama Bin Ladin and individuals associated with him have killed and wounded more Americans than any other group. This chart also illustrates that groups such as Hamas and the Tamil Tigers (LTTE) prior to 1998 have killed more foreigners in the anti-US terrorist attacks. If we take into account the bombings of the US Embassies in Kenya and Tanzania, Osama's status as the most lethal terrorist is certain.[8]
In addition, he told USA Today that bin Laden had participated in "virtually every major attack of terrorism against the United States" in the 1990s. Johnson underlined the threat posed by bin Laden, saying that he was possessed by "hatred and craziness." If left unanswered, "he would continue to terrorize Americans around the world. He has no compunction about killing women and children. He's a complete egalitarian in his murderous attitude."[9]
[edit]1999
In an interview with PBS's Frontline for its 1999 program, Hunting bin Laden, Johnson discussed Osama bin Laden.[10] According to Johnson, Americans had "tended to make Osama bin Laden sort of a superman in Muslim garb." "Actually," he continues, "Osama bin Laden, in my view, represents more of a symptom of a problem, and the problem is this: the Saudi Arabian government, not just Osama bin Laden but many people in Saudi Arabia, have been sending money to radical Islamic groups for years." Johnson continued:
When you look at who's killed Americans in the last 10 years, the individuals he's supported and backed--I'm basing that upon the initial information that's been released in the indictments and conversations with others in the intelligence communities--Osama bin Laden has been the one killing Americans. No other terrorist group in the world has been out killing Americans except for Osama bin Laden.... Osama bin Laden remains out there as the one really targeting us. So, we recognize that he's the threat. He's serious about wanting to kill Americans, but as long as he's in Afghanistan, as long as he doesn't have access to a cell phone, as long as he can't just hop on a plane and travel wherever he wants without fear of being arrested, his ability to plan and conduct terrorist operations is extremely limited. We have to recognize [that] he would like to do a lot of damage. He would like to kill Americans, but wanting to is different from being able to, having the full capabilities in place.[11]
In the interview, Johnson doubted the ability of members of bin Laden's organization to plan and put their lives on the line:
There's not another Ali or Mustafa out there at this point and Osama bin Laden in my view has not been a very effective organizer or leader. He talks a great game and puts out terrific threats as far as stirring the passions in the United States and maybe firing up the imaginations of some young Muslims throughout the world. But when push comes to shove, can he get a group of people who are together who will say: we are going to plan an operation, we're going to put our lives on the line, we're going to go out and try and kill people and we don't care what the consequence is? It hasn't happened.[12]
Frontline asked:
[Is it] ... fair to say what you're saying is that the president of the United States, his national security advisor, his deputy national security advisor for counter-terrorism, are basically blowing smoke [about the danger posed by bin Laden] and his followers]?
Johnson responded:
They're grossly exaggerating the problem. They are hyping it. They shouldn't be talking about rising terrorism. Instead of saying "terrorism's rising," it's not. "Terrorism is spreading," it's not. "More people are dying from terrorism," not the case. But what they should be saying is, "There's one individual out there that really doesn't like us, and he's made it his mission in life to kill Americans, and we've gotta deal with him." But we need to have a voice of reason in that process instead of putting ourselves out crying wolf, because this is essentially what's taking place right now. They call it the administration that cries wolf.[12]
[edit]2000
Johnson co-authored an article in 2000 with Milt Bearden which focused on the threat posed by al-Qaeda specifically, rather than terrorism trends in general. Beardon and Johnson note that new information emerging about the bombings at Kenya and Tanzania in 1998 points to the threat posed by Imad Mugniyah and Osama Bin Laden will require "a coordinated policy that will employ a full range of covert, clandestine, diplomatic, and military operations," concluding:
The Clinton Administration has shot its bolt on the terrorist problem with small effect, and no last minute show of force will change the record. A new administration can start afresh with a more sharply defined set of terrorism goals – Mughniyeh and bin Laden and their protectors for starters – and bring the full, coordinated force of American diplomatic, military, and intelligence capabilities to bear on the problem.[13]
[edit]2001
After Johnson's testimony to the special forum at the U.S. Senate, Gary J. Schmitt, executive director and CEO of the Project for the New American Century, refers in the Daily Standard (blog) to an op-ed piece Johnson wrote two months prior to the 9/11 attacks, claiming that Johnson argued that the US had little to fear from terrorism.[14]
In an editorial entitled "The Declining Terrorist Threat," published in the New York Times on 10 July 2001, Johnson says:
Judging from news reports and the portrayal of villains in our popular entertainment, Americans are bedeviled by fantasies about terrorism. They seem to believe that terrorism is the greatest threat to the United States and that it is becoming more widespread and lethal. They are likely to think that the United States is the most popular target of terrorists. And they almost certainly have the impression that extremist Islamic groups cause most terrorism.... None of these beliefs are based in fact.... While terrorism is not vanquished, in a world where thousands of nuclear warheads are still aimed across the continents, terrorism is not the biggest security challenge confronting the United States, and it should not be portrayed that way.[15]
Ten days after the 9/11 attacks, after quoting the above passage, Timothy Noah concludes a post in his "Chatterbox" feature at Slate: "Johnson's analysis, we now see, was bold, persuasive, and 100 percent wrong."[16] Johnson defended himself against such attacks:
The rightwing is resurrecting an op-ed I wrote in July 2001. I stand by the full article. It is still relevant today. I am accused, incorrectly, of ignoring the threat of terrorism. In fact, I correctly noted that the real threat emanated from Bin Laden and Islamic extremism. President Bush, for his part, ignored the CIA warning in August 2001 that Al Qaeda was posed to strike inside the United States.[17]
After September 11, Johnson appeared several times on FOX News to address the question of military action against terrorism. On 14 November, he defended the FBI's proposal to interview 5,000 students in the U.S. suspected of having information relevant to the September 11 investigations:
I think they should talk to everyone that they feel they have a need to talk to. I mean, look, this is war. This is not a legal proceeding. This isn't the O.J. Simpson trial. The folks that attacked us -- they murdered Americans. And we've got to recognize that in wartime, we should do things differently.[18]
[edit]2003
In January 2003, Johnson wrote an analysis of the relationship between the upcoming U.S. invasion of Iraq and the threat of transnational terrorism. According to Johnson, Bremer's response was to tell him that "it didn't matter what Saddam did or didn't do, we were going to war."[19] The paper warned that an invasion would "do little to destroy the infrastructure of radical Islamic terrorism responsible for the 9-11 attacks." Noting that Saddam Hussein's regime has been a longtime supporter of regional terrorist organizations such as the PLO, Johnson examines contacts between Saddam Hussein and transnational terrorist organizations such as al-Qaeda:
There is no doubt that Iraq is a state sponsor of terrorism—i.e., a country that provides financial support, safe haven, training, or weapons and explosives to groups or individuals that carry out terrorist attacks. . . . According to Central Intelligence Agency data, there is no credible evidence implicating Iraq in any mass casualty terrorist attacks since 1991. . . .
Johnson notes that the period immediately leading up to 2003 saw a rise of activity surrounding terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, suggesting that "Iraq is willing to help a movement that it would otherwise oppose on ideological grounds. Nonetheless," Johnson concludes, "it is important to understand that Iraqi entreaties to Al Qaeda, are most likely intended as a tactic to bolster Iraq’s ability to fight off a U.S. invasion rather than a deep-seated theological and ideological commitment to the terrorist agenda of Bin Laden.[20]
In that analysis Johnson also warns that the U.S.-led invasion was likely to backfire:
In fact there is a serious risk that a U.S. led war against Iraq may crystallize the diffused anger in the Arab and Muslim world — a heretofore unattained goal of bin Laden and his followers — and persuade more Muslim youths to take up the terrorist banner against America and her citizens.... If we decide to invade Iraq we must be prepared for the contingency that our attack will inspire young Muslims to pursue jihad against the West in general and the United States in particular. Just as the 1979 Soviet invasion of Afghanistan rallied many Muslims, especially young adults to the cause of jihad, a U.S. attack may enable Islamic extremists to attract new followers.[20]
Johnson also gave interviews on the topic of what to do with captured al-Qaeda leaders; while he did not condone torture, he suggested that a "sleep deprivation and reward system" might be useful for getting information from Khalid Sheikh Mohammed:
I don't see a constitutional right to have eight hours of sleep. You shouldn't subject someone to freezing but they don't get to wear mink coats, either.[21]
In May 2003, Johnson joined members of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS) in condemning the manipulation of intelligence for political purposes:
It is a misuse and abuse of intelligence. The president was being misled. He was ill served by the folks who are supposed to protect him on this. Whether this was witting or unwitting, I don't know, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.[22]
[edit]Plame affair
After Robert Novak wrote a column identifying the wife of former ambassador Joseph C. Wilson as a CIA officer, the media invited Johnson to comment on the ensuing scandal because he had been a member of the same Career Trainee class with Valerie Plame Wilson. For example, in October 2003, he appeared on Democracy Now to discuss the Plame affair. He told interviewer Amy Goodman that Valerie Wilson's cover should have been respected whether she was an "analyst" or a "cleaning lady": "if she's undercover she's undercover, period. If the media allows themselves to get distracted with those kinds of curve balls, they ignore the issue."[23]
He told a Senate Democratic Policy Committee in October 2003, "My classmates and I have been betrayed. Together, we have kept the secrets of each other's identities a secret for 18 years. Each and every one of us have kept that secret, whether we were in the CIA, in other government service or in the private sector. But this issue is not just about a blown cover. It is about the destruction of the very essence, the core of human intelligence collection activities: plausible deniability, apparently, for partisan domestic political reasons."[24]
Johnson testified at a special joint hearing of Congressional and Senate Democrats on 22 July 2005 about the consequences arising from the Plame affair.[25]
[edit]2008
In 2008, Johnson emerged as a staunch supporter of Hillary Clinton and a strong critic of Barack Obama. Larry Johnson's blog, NoQuarterUSA, became a rally point for Clinton supporters wary of Barack Obama's qualifications to be president. Supporters of Barack Obama insist that a story that first appeared on Johnson's blog--a report that Republican operatives have a tape of Michelle Obama making racially insenstive comments about caucasians--has been "refuted" Barack Obama's Fight the Smears website.[26]. However, Johnson never claimed to have the tape and reported that the Republican operatives controlling it intended to release the tape sometime after the Democratic Convention in August 2008. On October 21, however, he asserted that the operative in possession of the tape had been instructed by the McCain campaign not to release it.[27]
[edit]Notes
^ http://2008.weblogawards.org/polls/best-political-coverage/
^ Larry C. Johnson, "About Me," No Quarter (personal blog).
^ "Former CIA Official Larry Johnson Delivers Democratic Radio Address," transcript posted on official Democratic National Committee's website for The Democratic Party, July 23, 2005], accessed November 21, 2006.
^ Interview with Larry Johnson, confirmed by his supervisor
^ "Ex-CIA official Blasts Bush on Leak of Operative's Name: Democrats' Radio Address Focuses on White House Aides' Role," CNN July 23, 2005, accessed November 21, 2006.
^ Gail Russell Chaddock, "Why Terrorists Pick On the French," Christian Science Monitor (5 December 1996) p. 1.
^ Larry Johnson, "Terrorists Among Us," New York Times (20 August 1996) p. A19.
^ Terrorism Today
^ Lee Michael Katz, "The Hunt for Bin Laden," USA Today (21 August 1998) p. 1A.
^ See Transcript of original interview with Larry C. Johnson, as broadcast on Frontline in 1999. Cf. "Interview: Larry C. Johnson," for Hunting bin Laden, transcript of interview broadcast on Frontline subsequently on 13 April 2001. See also dedicated PBS webpages for media links: Iraq and the War on Terror, Frontline PBS, online featured programs, accessed 19 November 2006.
^ frontline: hunting bin laden: interviews: larry c. johnson | PBS
^ a b [1].
^ As posted in [2].
^ Gary Schmitt, [ 07/25/2005 "Meet Larry Johnson: The CIA official Turned Democratic Spokesman Has a Pre-9/11 Mindset," Daily Standard (blog), July 25, 2005, accessed November 20, 2006.
^ *Larry C. Johnson, "The Declining Terrorist Threat," The New York Times 10 July 2001: A19.
^ Timothy Noah, "(Not Exactly a) Whopper of the Week: Larry C. Johnson," Chatterbox: Gossip, speculation, and scuttlebutt about politics (blog), hosted by Slate September 21, 2001, accessed November 20, 2006. Note the full context of this quotation:
It is, to be sure, a little bit cheap (and slightly at odds with the usual parameters of this feature) to criticize someone for making an erroneous prediction, particularly after a tragedy. Chatterbox is especially reluctant to tag Johnson because Johnson's op-ed was argued forcefully, backed up meticulously with factual data, and bravely at odds with conventional wisdom at the time of its publication. Add in that Johnson now makes his living as a consultant to corporations about terrorism, and therefore had everything to gain by exaggerating the dangers terrorism poses, and the guy practically looks like a hero. Chatterbox, who two decades ago was an editor for the New York Times op-ed page, would have published Johnson's piece had he still been an editor there this past July. In his capacity at Slate, Chatterbox might well have written up Johnson's prediction, and perhaps even endorsed it.
But boy, is he glad he didn't! Johnson's analysis, we now see, was bold, persuasive, and 100 percent wrong. Sadly, a mistake this embarrassing cannot be ignored. As a fellow skeptic, Chatterbox in all sincerity wishes Johnson better luck next time.
^ Larry C. Johnson, "Johnson vs. President Bush," re-posted and updated by SusanHu at DailyKos (blog) July 25, 2005.
^ FOX News Interview with John Garrett (14 November 2001) Transcript #111405cb.260.
^ [3].
^ a b Larry C. Johnson, "Setting the Record Straight on Iraqi Terrorism," posted in Booman Tribune: A Progressive Community (personal blog) 27 January 2003. accessed 19 November 2006.
^ Qtd. in Toby Harnden, "CIA 'pressure' on al-Qa'eda chief," The London Telegraph 5 March 2003: 16.
^ Qtd. in Nicolas D. Kristof, "Save Our Spooks," The New York Times 30 May 2003:A6.
^ Democracy Now (3 October 2003)[4]
^ U.S. Senate, Democratic Policy Committee Meeting on the CIA Operative Leak, (24 October 2003).
^ Letter to the Senate.[Needs full source citation; see "References" section.]
^ Tumulty, Karen (2008-06-12). "Will Obama's Anti-Rumor Plan Work?", Time Magazine. Retrieved on 20 June 2008.:"a story that apparently first made a big splash on the Internet in late May in a post by pro-Hillary Clinton blogger Larry Johnson"
^ Whitey Tape, API, Phil Berg, and Andy MartinSee Authors Posts (1090) on May 30, 2008 at 2:45 PM in Current Affairs
This does NOT apply to 99% of you, however, a couple of lost souls have posted threats against Barack Obama on this blog. Be forewarned, I will turn all threats over to the Secret Service (they are investigating two at this moment). While I don’t believe Barack is qualified to be President, nothing justifies or warrants a death threat. Please play nice.
(small, medium and large sizes; for both dogs and cats)
+ 
I totally agree; leave the over-the-top zombie fanatacism to the other side; they are better at it anyway.
Ed Schultz, in the final half hour of his putrid show on Air Obama Radio this afternoon, calls for Debby Wasserman-Schultz to “get fired”– “It wouldnt bother me one bit if she’s removed as Secretary of State for (garbled) Hillary Clinton..” then he affected what I guess was supposed to be Schultz’s imitation of any woman he doesn’t like- he put on a whiny voice with a lisp and said “And I supoooooooosseee……if she wants to come on my showwwwww….that would be fiiiiiinnnnne……”
Apparently Hillary Clinton’s female supporters are all whiny, lisping idiots. At least, they are in Big Eddie’s World. What a pig.
Of course, you know there is a joke in here, better left unsaid…
apparently the people who were making the threats got sick of hearing all the death threats coming from the obamabots against Hillary.
Is this why they go on and on about the RFK statement? To project what they really are up to?
To hide the truth of their intentions?
They are great at projecting what they are guilty of onto Hillary and her supporters.
If you want to know what they are up to then watch what they accuse Hill and her supporters of.
Exactly. I’ve noticed that, too.
I’m beginning to wonder that myself, my goodness, they’re are so impressed with their own feeble attempts at cleverness….
no my friend it yourself and other commentors like you who are overly impressed w/ themselves and the legitimacy of your claims.
Funny… perhaps you can explain why Hillary has changed her rationale several times… first it was the popular vote, then it was the delegates only that mattered. Now she wants some delegates from Texas unseated… but she still says “every vote counts”… even though she predicted the nomination race would be over in Feb… negating all the votes yet to even be cast.
So… which is it?
Right on.
Obama is agreeing to the rules, 1/2 the delegates (or a half vote each for all) get seated.
Seems to me Clinton is trying to be clever by demanding all, rules be damned.
that’s simply insane…that’s like the Bush administration argument that the absence of evidence of a connection between Iraq and 9/11 is simply evidence that they’re trying harder to hide the evidence…you need to come back down to earth.
Violent Obamabots should also be careful. Remember the one Obamabot who mentioned a pitchfork when he discussed Hillary Clinton?
Obamabots should refrain from issuing death threats against Clinton.
http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/05/23/typical-obama-supporter-open-thread/
Stop Hillary Now | jkldjlkj@jlkjkldj.net | IP: 98.145.181.16
“We all remember Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June in California. I don’t understand it,” she said, dismissing calls to drop out.
Hillary is batshit, Liebercrat crazy.
Fuck her with a pitchfork.
May 23, 3:28 PM — [ Edit | Delete ] — View post “Would You Buy An ObamaMobile From Tom Friedman?”
Yes, I saw that pitchfork comment and I have been “haunted” by it for a week now.
Thanks, victim.of.violence.of.obama.supporters for raising the issue about Hillary’s safety.
Larry is right - there is no reason not to “play nice.” Logical critiques and dismissive words are one thing, but violent threats are a whole other ball of wax.
I strongly suspect some of those threats may be coming from Obama supporters in an attempt to make this site look bad. But the point is well taken. Threats of violence have no place on this site, or anywhere else on the Internet.
That’d be pretty damn stupid because the U.S. government has its means of finding them.
(Having had to handle some of those comments, I can tell you that it made me shake all over, as well as feel incredibly saddened that there are people who are capable of saying and thinking such terrible things that I will never repeat them here.)
I can imagine what you must read in the course of your job…we sure have some “loose cannons” out there…I am glad this crap is being turned over to the FBI….get the crazy hoots!
Thanks for all the wonderful reporting today and everyday Sue and Larry….No Quarters is truly a safe haven and we can come here without of the bullshit we have to listen to over at DD….I stopped going there because I don’t enjoy playing with a bunch of kids…they really bring nothing to the table…I have said for so long, if you don’t fight with them, they’ll go away….JMO
thanks again for all the great work…
“Pretty damn stupid” describes at least some of the Obama supporters.
Having been required to do some computer forensics I get what you are talking about SusanUnPC. Having a “close encounter of the word kind” and knowing there is some very real and evil sub human life forms is not fun.
There were about 20,000 links in the wake of Mr. Johnson’s story about Michelle Obama’s challenged speech pathology. Even 30 pages deep, the comments on some of these are very much from the dark side.
The force is strong with NQ.
My thoughts EXACTLY. Obama’s people have tried to cause problems for Hillary supporters before. If there is a problem at the protest tomorrow it will be caused by Obama’s people.
“I strongly suspect some of those threats may be coming from Obama supporters in an attempt to make this site look bad.”
..too late.
Aren’t you clever and smug. You should probably last here another hour or so.
They appear on AOL on the PM election blogs. So far they are just aimed at anyone who is not in favor of Obama. But they remain on, undeleted and the bloger is not called out on it.
Larry, i whole heartedly agree. although there are many that feel strongly that Barrack Obama is not at this time qualified to be POTUS (and some who likely believe he will never be qualified), we all should refrain from waging threats against Obama, his family, and supporters. Indeed, these types of comments reflect poorly on our collective effort to convey our disapproval of the candidate AND our effort to support Senator Clinton. Lets stick to highlighting the weakness of his candidacy (and there are many), while highlighting the strengths of Senator Clinton.
Im gina too! and I agree with this Gina!
Larry
this is what some people to do . its hard to tell who they support -OBAMA or HATE .
BUT THATS WHAT THEY DO ,THEY DO THAT ON ALL PRO-HILL SITES , they involve u in talk and take it to bad level of talk ,,and then they post ur angry comments everywhere making hill supp look bad .
BUT THANKS –AT LEAST U R GIVING A WARNING ,,, unlike obama,s site –they were drowning hill and no one stopped them ,,
keep ur honest work .
I will not engage them or discuss anything. I have no proof if they are Americans. I won’t do it.
They employ “operation agitate”. I’m not available for comment to them.
Delurking again (I seem to be doing that too often lately) to advise that I’m very glad you’ve set down the limits. While most commenters were very respectful, there were some that were downright threatening. It’s a bonus for you to make it clear you will not tolerate that nonsense. If people cannot exhibit self control, even on the supposedly “free” internet, then they need someone to put the brakes on. I’ve been working in Telecom for 40 years. I wonder if these people realize that they are not truly anonymous, that they can be tracked and that their verbal diahhrea can get them into really deep trouble?
Back to lurking.
Quit showing up and dissapearing like “thing”
and post more often HT. 40 years of experience in any field is of value and can be learned from.
LOL….Thing was my favorite but grew out of that by the age of 8 then I moved onto Lurch and Cousin It…..
So true! When it comes to posting on the internet, the posts never go away. It’s like standing on a street corner and yelling at the top of your voice, with everyone recording your words.
Amazing how people think they are anonymous and can’t be tracked down, when your computer has it’s own IP address AKA individual name.
How on earth do people think it’s all kept straight? Perhaps they think it’s magic or something.:-D
Hillary supporter’s are not like Obama’s peeps.
Except…
Have you seen the latest ‘Young Hillary Clinton’ video?
We need a video showing how ‘young’ Obama so easily strolled into his IL seat…with so little experience.
We know the Republicans will work on such a video!
Anyone know the video maker’s?
The threats surely weren’t serious since the Nation of Islam - especially Farrakhan is in love with BO!
Please demand that BO release his birth certificate, when he was confirmed at TUCC, his and Michelle’s passport records and medical records - not some stupid summary.
I want to see his birth certificate too. I want to make certain he is human for one thing. Then I want to know if he was born from a dog like Damien in The Omen.
Interesting, do you see signs of the Anti Christ in him too?
It’s just the pepperoni pizza talking, Pagan Power.
pro-Hillary AND anti-obama. is there even a difference at this point?
hope the secret service are on it re: any death threats.
i’m thinking they have come over from the obamacamp to bring discredit to this site, the Hillary supporters, and the refusal here to accept obambi as prez.
ever.
Agreed. Obama bloggers who may not be Americans are great at posing and pretending to be someone they are not. They like to tarnish the Hillary supporters by any means necessary. Americans know this is not something you do..threaten people in government.
Maybe it was one of the many Canadian Obama bloggers.
They need to mind their own business and stop butting into our election process.
We all have experiences with the Obama bloggers. We don’t want any of that nonsense here. My feeling is that when people get carried away, they should be warned and then removed. This is far too serious now to be stupid. People who cannot control their impulses need to walk away from the computer. I know that I can be as bad as the next guy, but that is no reason for hate turning into threats.
Comments/threats like that are despicable.
While I do not or will not support Obama, I wish him no harm.
I agree
agree, except do wish him the agony of defeat (old sports phrase….from old me). then hillary can have the thrill of victory in 2012.
hillary or mccain. no other option.
The only harm I wish on him is that he grow a conscience. That will be mighty painful for him.
Good…Now lets see some of those Anti-Hillary Obamaphiles get prosecuted for the threats they made against her life. Will anything come of it? I sure damn hope so!
As for making threats against Obama. Only a fool would do such a thing.
1.) No-one in their right mind would spout that bullpoop!
2.) The Gov is watching and they WILL find you.
3.) Although I don’t like the “Man”, I don’t wish harm to come to him. He has a family and that would devastate those who love him not only cause a backlash we don’t need. Wishing harm on someone is an indicator that you are truly off your meds!
4.) I suspect it is those Obamaphiles that do such a thing so as many of you said, they can run back to their “Masters” and say..”SEE THEY WANT HARM TO COME TO HIM”! don’t fall for that trick.
Besides…karma is a motherf*****!
Let’s see the Hillary-bashing sites follow suit and come down on people who make pitchfork threats, etc.
I know. That will be the day…because in their logic Hillary’s a MONSTER and Monsters “deserve” violent attacks.
I agree no need for threats. Negative energy brings negative energy.
check out this story on obama’s use of chicago politics in texas.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/casey/5808894.html
amazing! as an update, today richie and his wife endorsed obama.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hY742M_s1ttD_ycf2Zusn1o1fD3QD90VV5U00
obama got two more supers the easy way….he bought them.
larry, you may want to look into this…it stinks!
Re: reporting death threats to the Secret Service - that is as it should be. I want Obama to be unemployed. That will be sufficient.
Absolutely my feelings, jwrjr.
I don’t hate Obama or his family, I just think he’d be a crappy president, and I have a total distrust for his circle of advisors and friends. And his vocal supporters have turned me so far away from him. Had they been decent and even civil, I would not have such an aversion to Obama.
I don’t ever wish harm on anyone… Politics is just a difference of opinion, imho. And the most popular opinion seems to be the winner of the day when all is said and done.
Gee, one hopes that pro Obama trolls wouldn’t show up here and make Obama death threats attempting to discredit this blog as being populated by a bunch of violent lunatic Hillary supporters. One hopes
Great for taking a very very clear stance on this, Larry. There is no place for those kinds of comments. On Jake Tapper’s blog yesterday, there was one particularly vile Obama poster that stated that the “retard hillary supporters should be shot!” I believe his posts were deleted, eventually. I have yet to see a true Hillary-supporter utter anything even close to that.
However, any time there is a place for discussion against a candidate, it brings the fringies out of the woodwork who feel it’s okay to express their hatred. There is also that element of Obama supporters who do that to make Hillary supporters look bad. Either way, ony a complete moron would think that the internet is anonymous.
There are days when I think the internet is a gift… other days? A total curse.
I realized once that someone I had wondered about on a different blog site was posting from a mental ward. He had a set time he could go on-line. He shared some rather interesting tales with me that strayed into the bizarre and paranoid regions. As time went on, he shared he’d been diagnosed with multiple personalities. (I had picked up on that.)
But I think usually it’s a case of mental illness at work.
My former newphew used to write threatening letters to the president. They checked him out. He was really quite harmless, so I think they just let him continue with his little “hobby.” He had an accident which left him severely handicapped mentally.
I was told by someone on another site that they were going to track me down. That type of direct personal threat is scary. I ignored it, but I probably shouldn’t have.
I tend to think most of that stuff is just hot air, but then I can be a bit dense sometimes and too trusting.
I figure if they want to track me down, they’re welcome to it.
I’ll fight.
I won’t be intimidated.
And from what I’ve seen, they are very stupid.
Larry,
You seemed like a reasonable guy on the Plame issue. Did you forward these death threats to the secret service?
Larry, you’re a good American citizen. I wonder how many of the owners of pro-Obama blogs would put out such a warning against threats to Hillary.
Sadly, very few.
The big sippy cup blog that shall not be named actually sent banning warnings to Hill supporters who pointed out threats being made against her. So not only did they not warn those making the threats, they in effect supported it by stifling any complaint about it.
I completely agree with you Larry. Threats like that are inexcusable and have no place among democratic Americans like us (the TRUE Democrats).
Lou Dobbs is on his way to DC to report the news of the FL & MI convention meeting.
Until then. enjoy your day.
There are Obamabots and there are Hillarybots. They both suck.
I support Obama more or less, but I’m not a follower. I used to think most of Hillary’s supporters just had a different opinion from me, but over the past couple of months I’ve seen that many of them are mean spirited, bigoted, batshit crazy. Whether that’s most of them, or just some of them, I have no way of telling, and I don’t really care.
In any case, I was never going to vote for Hillary anyway, but I’m still civil enough to give others the benefit of the doubt as far as their opinions are concerned, and that’s all I ask from others as well.
Gee, you noticed us getting a little mean spirited? THE PAST COUPLE OF MONTHS???!!!! Look here, Sparky, most of us got chased off of places like KOS, Americablog, Huffington Post about December. Hell, and I was a Clark supporter with no chance in hell of my candidate even running and I got called a racist bitch after I asked folks over at KOS for ‘No Dem on Dem Violence’. AND THEN!!! I went to my caucus and had to stop little snotnosed Obamabits from harassing and belittling little old ladies. I stopped posting over at my favorite blog, C&L, aftr punks and thugs took them over after being there for damned near 4 years. AND YOU WONDER WHY WE’RE A TAD BIT FUCKING PISSED? DON’T EVEN GO THERE, LITTLE ONE. I’M IN NO MOOD. You guys started this, now eat your wormwood like a good little lad and let the grown ups talk.
Woohoo, Strawberry! That was an awesome rant.
So, two wrongs make it right. At least you are honest.
Well said. I gave up on a bunch of former favorites for the same reasons. Bunch of arrogant bullies ruined the places.
I really doubt your benefit of the doubt.
All Obama supporters are Obamabots, for you do not even know why you support your candidate.
I wonder if the secret service finds the people who make death threats boring?
I mean, even reading some of the people who post, hatefully, gets pretty dull, their minds don’t exactly sparkle with creative ingenuity, I would imagine it gets DULL, after a while.
Look at the trolls, here, and the silly attempts to feed a “civil” war, or the silly Alinsky tropes…
DULL.
No one can tell, no one can see you.
Really.
You trolls are genius.
Really, I mean that, genius.
/snark…
Good on you, Larry.
Larry,
In one comment after the “Demos Defecting” post, I said I thought the Democrats had a death wish, but I was talking about the death of the Democratic Party. And that my husband and I were leaving it. I said they’ve been warned (about some of us bolting the party). I hope that wasn’t misconstrued!
But, thank you for your caveat! I’ll choose my words more wisely!
I hate to sound full of ‘doom and gloom’, but this is
nothing compared to what is to come.
The backlash caused by Wright and this priest is going to be something I really fear. These two idiots
have set racial relations back at least 30 years.
I try not to think about it, but it is coming.
IT IS ALL SO VERY SAD.
Quite sad, but true.
Everyone. PLEASE don’t feed the trolls. I know it’s so tempting, but it just diverts our energies into ugly post back and forths, and as far as I can see, not a single one of those has done any good.
They are showing up en-masse everywhere. Let’s not feed them by responding to their inciting messages. They will never be convinced, nor do they come here to do so. Please do not respond to them, and let them rest in peace in OUR space.
I saw the same thing happening on Kos and now MYDD. People get lured into so-called “conversations” which aren’t conversations at all.
Let’s get back to work where it counts: focussing on Hillary and her win.
It is amazing how the Obamabots seems to be infecting all pro Hillary sites, they have wrecked Taylor Marsh site, ABC Political Punch, Democratic Underground, now on to this site.
For persons that love to protest that this thing is over Obama is the nominee you would think they would of been trying to heal the gap and encouraging others to see Obama in a different light, but guess not.
If Obama is the nominee and he loses the GE I hope they will all be willing to carry part of the blame, because there are going to be some very pissed democrats out there after waiting 8 years to capture the WH, getting so close to the best chance in years of getting it and then putting Obama only to have a defeat, its going to be a hard pill to swallow for some.
Dean, Nancy and that group will have to really explain what happened there, it would be fun watching them squirm, MSNBC, CNN, ABC what a fun time its going to be.
Despite that, though, the trolls are still losing.
I dont see sites such as DK**, or even MY DD, as relevant, do you?
So, it matters, but it doesn’t.
Larry’s traffic is up, I’m glad, I hope he makes a mint and continues to be successful, but perhaps it’s less a “take over” than it is evolution, you know?
And the trolls dont seem to be able to think past the template of carpeting a site, you know, like the US army in Iraq, with shock and awe, or in the republican, and now, Obama case, stealing political office, but then what?
They can’t capitalize, or manage, so it’s nothing more than a minor infection, body can handle it, without drugs.
They “invade” and fade, some really poor minds.
Period.
And then I wonder who is really being trolled, us, or them?
There was a time when I didn’t pay attention to politics. I thought it really didn’t affect me at all.
Then, in 2003, after recognizing that Bush was the worst of the worst, I heard Wesley Clark on CNN, and my political life changed. I began to read, listen and watch intensely, and now, in 2008, after spending thousands of hours watching and learning, I wish I could go back to my “time of innocence”.
I don’t know if all I have learned since then (I’m 56) has really done me much good. It’s taught me that power players rule us, and that the process is far more corrupt than I ever could have imagined.
Before I started watching, I really thought that all people basically wanted to do good. And perhaps that is still the case. But our system does not appear to allow anyone with true integrity to rise to the top any more.
I am heartbroken, and fighting the dirty fights that apparently need to be fought (for what? Something different?) are killing my spirit.
I need to get back to the current day, the bird songs outside my window, the winds blowing gently or hard, the colors of trees, landscapes, and waters.
Without them I will continue to turn into another bitter political person, without planetary perspective, and I can’t let that happen to me, as it would sap my true strength and beliefs.
I’m afraid I’m not cut out for these hard-core fights that dismiss the core principles of democracy, human rights, environmental sustenance, and so on.
Just had to say that. I wish I could go back to the time before the Bush election, when I though we all were trying to do good.
And I know that can never happen, but I CAN choose what I pay attention to, and perhaps I should start paying attention to the great things around us that are here still, and point them out.
I hope these were actual threats and not something taken out of context or misunderstood. We all know that Hillary’s RFK comment was put out there as her wishing for the worst. I don’t believe anyone should be threatening Obama, I believe those comments should be removed, But I think that as long as there are websites that are called Hillary Death Watch, I will not be policing rightful angry Clinton supporters. I do not want to censor myself when I am commenting out of fear I will be misunderstood so I probably won’t comment on here anymore.
I have “declared war on obama” on here (just like Lou) and don’t want that misstaken as a death threat. I hope you post what you are speaking of and Go after the Obama supporters who threaten Sen. Clinton.
I must say that I am STUNNED that death threats are being issued from this site! With everything that has been in the press of late, to think that a left leaning site actually inspires death threats against a fellow Democrat is not merely horrific, but it is unacceptable!
What on earth has gotten into everyone? WE ARE ON THE SAME SIDE, REMEMBER??? We are just FOR a different candidate within the same party.
What is it going to take to make that point known? And why on earth is that FACT not being unreinforced here and other places where this goes on right now?
What has happened to the left? This is simply disgraceful and shameful!
The ability to soldier on despite complete and utter failure is remarkable.
To my fellow Hillary supporters, plz just remember…Obama’s supporters are largely your average college students caught up in hope and change while getting drunk and doing drugs. We all know where their heads are after all, we’ve had an alcoholic, coke snorting average college student in the White House for the last 7 years! They want change, but they are supporting the exact same disaster we have in G.W.Bush just in a “New and Improved” wrapper. Seriously, someone really needs to do a side by side comparison of GW and Obamessiah and see just how similar they are other than party and skin color. Though I still have to wonder…when Obama admitted to doing coke, was it just coke or was it really crack cocaine.
I take issue with your slovenly and denigrating profile of the average Obama supporter. Perhaps you need to realize that your idea of who supports this man is far different than what is going on within your own mind. There is a huge diverse cross section of the populous who finds Obama to be the candidate they think would be best for the United States as President.
PLEASE, can’t you just NOT like Obama instead of denigrating his supporters?
Remember, we are supposed to be on the same side and snide comments like you made only make matters worse.
He’s corrupt, there is no middle ground.
YOU may want to commit suicide by voting for this POS, but the rest of us are healthy, healthy enough to walk away from this mess of a candidate, and the morons who support him.
You really don’t get it, do you?
Wow.
I DON’T get why you insist on denigrating Obama supporters when it is the candidate with whom you have an issue. I don’t understand why you seemingly want to ravage the Democratic party when in doing so you will help the Republicans win and IF that happens, the common threads that hold the democrats together will be demolished.
Do you not care about Roe V Wade, the Justice System, The economy, the WAR(s) and so much more that is at stake here? We will have at least 2 more Supreme Court Justices that will need to be appointed and IF the Democrats are not in office, we will be set back at least 30-40 years!
THAT is what what I don’t “get”!
I’m afraid we don’t care much about Roe v. Wade, anyone worried about that should have supported the Female Presidential Candidate …and the past 4 years were the years to worry about Supreme Court Justices.
One of the wire service headlines this morning stated that more Americans trust McCain on the Economy than Obama.
Comment by HillaryMadamePresident | 2008-05-30 20:34:52
———————————————-
Wait, you DON”T care about Roe V Wade??? A woman doesn’t care about NOT having the right to CHOOSE? I find that horrifyingly crazy that issue doesn’t hold any value for you. And since when does it matter which candidate you prefer if they are both pro choice? If Hillary was the nominee I would vote for her and I don’t denigrate you nor other of her supporters because you don’t agree with my preference in candidates.
As far as the last 4 years as being the time to worry about Supreme Court Justices, yes they were and I fought hard and long to get the Democrat nominated to make sure that Bush and his ilk didn’t muck it up any more than they had already. AND might I add that the next 4 years WILL BE CRUCIAL as another 2 will need to be replaced…what happens then IF the Republican gets into office?
Is that really what you want?
I didn’t denigrate you. I stated my opinion, just as you stated your opinion. We are at an impasse, no?
I never said YOU denigrated ME, I was talking about the bigger issue here of the split within the party. Just look at many of the other comments here and you will find all kinds of smears against people just because they didn’t vote for who you voted for. It simply just doesn’t make sense to me…
I felt the same way at Huffington Post. Try saying something positive about Hillary there and you will know the true meaning of being denigrated by people who don’t agree with you…which is why it’s best to find your niche of a blog and stick with it.
And that is all he needed as the last Democratic President said, “It is the economy stupid!”
I really hope he comes to terms with his interpersonal demons and starts sounding like Scott.
Time to face the music BO.
Obama sings a verse of “Papa was a Rolling Stone”
.
.
wuoops! Wrong tent!
You don’t understand a thing I said.
Corruption is indicative of a psychological aberration, unnecessary chaos in ones life, it is psychologically unhealthy.
Psychologically healthy people can recognize the issues, and the mess, and stay away, like they would from a loser mate.
You’re the woman who hooks up with the wife beater, continually, because you can’t recognize your own lack of psychological health.
But you do it with corruption.
And look at you, no one respects you as a talent, as a person, nothing.
Why would anyone want to support someone who who, like Bush, will drive himself, and those associated with him, into the toilet?
Look at Rezko’s life, hell, look at Obama’s life, how long until he’s indicted?
They are crazy, why the hell would I want to be associated with people whose own lives are so chaotic(covered by CNN, no doubt) why would anyone?
Why do you KEEP hooking up with the wife beaters, wannabe troll?
spamccensor | 2008-05-30 20:44:28
————————————
Unfortunately your post is indicative of what I am speaking toward. You make insane accusations calling me all kinds of names and attributing crazy things to “my kind” without even knowing me. That is my point, why do such a thing when your main issue is with OBAMA and not me?
Polly, nobody is allowed to ask potential justices how they would rule on specific case law, such as Roe vs. Wade.
That is a huge flaw in this argument.
Gosh, so kooky, might as well be Samantha Power, supporting Obama while decrying genocide, and corruption.
Who the hell would want to be associated with THAT mess?
AnninCa | 2008-05-30 20:52:16
——————————–
Of course you can’t ask the supposed banned question before asking a Supreme Court Justice, but you know all too well what we are talking about here. And seemingly it will be OK with you that woman GO BACK to the horrid past of back room abortions and bloody deaths.
To me, that is NOT worth any amount of election fever. Just because I didn’t sign on to Hillary, doesn’t mean I wouldn’t vote for or support her on this and other causes.
Nothing to do with anything, you have no credibility.
Can’t you see?
Here’s a thought…. Obama supporters were told over and over that Clinton supporters were not going to vote for Obama. The polls kept going up and the number of Clinton supporters who won’t vote for Obama is twice of those who won’t support Clinton. ‘IF’ RvW was so important to you, you would have switched and demanded everyone you knew switch, donated to Clinton’s campaign and made calls for her. You are a hypocrite. You should have supported the candidate people have faith in to represent them on this issue.
Obama is a failure on this issue. He voted for Thomas B Griffith, he did not want to participate in a filibuster of Alito and wanted to vote for Roberts. His record and his sexism are blatant demonstrations of his distaste for women’s issues.
prudence | 2008-05-30 22:43:37
=================================
I disagree with who you want to vote for as President, I do not disagree with your right to vote for whomever you want, nor should you.
Regarding your post:
++++++++++++++++++++
IF’ RvW was so important to you, you would have switched and demanded everyone you knew switch, donated to Clinton’s campaign and made calls for her.
++++++++++++++++++++
I don’t know what [RvW] is and why would I switch? I didn’t and don’t like the vitriol on both sides but I didn’t want Hillary as my candidate. What’s so wrong about that and why would that make ME a hypocrite? I stand true to who I think would make the best candidate but that doesn’t mean you have to support the same person. Heck, there are a number of people in my family who are all at odds in this same fight. We all like different candidates, but we talk, we debate and we are still family in the end.
Kumbayah…now go away. You’re accomplishing nothing here other than interrupting a conversation among friends. That’s rude.
Thanks for your service POdVet. An MRE is an MRE. Layfette Park or the 313…take your pick. Side by side…can’t tell them apart on some important and basic levels.
I just don’t understand how a sane person who has lived as long as most Hillary supporters can’t remember all the evil Hillary has done. My God people she has lied, cheated and even stole things from the White House yet you senile people think she is sooooo good and noble. What planet are you from? Where were you when she changed her mind just in this race? How many different positions she has taken this year! And every state is the one to the White House! She is over 200 delegates short!!!!! That is not even close. If she wasn’t such a vindictive get evener the SD would have already ended this but she gets you back if you cross her. Now that’s a fine president for you! We already have an unethical person we don’t need another.
I would love to have a female president; however, I want my first to be honest and capable. Not someone who can’t face truth.
Yeah, Barry’s just a finger flippin’ guy with some really far out friends.
It’s just so funny that I remember an excellent economy with BILL’s Presidency. It was all about the economy then. I suspect Hillary knows how to deliver a good economy, as well.
I think Obama will be indicted, flat out.
And they’re supporting him for President.
Look at Rezko, thinking Fitzgerald, fired, would solve the problem. Same with Rove, they think the same way, like little children.
They’re still coming for you, the investigations didn’t stop, did they?
Care to add any other right-wing canards about Hillary? You’re on a major roll there, sweetie (to quote your messiah). Do a little research. The Clintons “stole” nothing from the White House. They only took what the Park Service and usher’s office told them they were entitled to (the head usher confirmed this), and returned some things when it turned out there were mix-ups on the lists. None of that was their fault.
It’s amazing how clueless some people really are.
You left out sabotaging Ron Brown’s plane and stealing all the “W”’s from the WH keyboards there, Lucy.
Comment by Old Lady For Obama | 2008-05-30 19:58:02,
our comments can’t possibly be helping Obama on this site. If you don’t like Hillary, than don’t vote for her (like myself), BUT your issue is really with Hillary and NOT with her supporters.
Please, we are supposed to be on the same side and if we forget this fact we will fail in our run for President come November.
…and I happen to agree with your points about a female President. I too want one, I just don’t want this one.
What are you precisely trying to accomplish here?
Go back to Obama and tell him sending paid trolls to be sanctimonious xxxxx doesn’t help a bit.
Beat it.
That’s really OK that you don’t understand. McCain gets us.
He even was the one to get that Hillary deserved to be defended today. Now, commonsense would say Obama would have defended Hillary. It was his spiritual advisor who was so hideously demeaning. But, nope, no quarter given.
Such a savvy guy, out to win over her supporters like a pro.
So it’s alright that you, like Obama, don’t get it. I am fairly certain that’s why you’ll lose soundly in the Fall.
And I won’t “get” why you didn’t see it coming.
AnninCa | 2008-05-30 20:55:50,
You might be right that Obama will lose IF he is the nominee come November, but frankly I have thought for quite awhile now that Hillary was planning to run with McCain since March. IT may or may not happen and who knows who will win in the end, but what I am talking about here and now is what has become of the Democratic Party. This just isn’t right IMHO
That’s completely silly. LOL*
HuffPo talk there. We enjoy not having to pay homage to silly talk here.
I’ll probably vote for McCain because Obama is simply not qualified to be president. That simple.
But Hillary is not a Republican.
That particular meme out of Obama supporters was always one of the most offensive to me. To talk about the Clintons that way when they are the only Democrats to have 2 terms in my lifetime was perfectly ridiculous.
I finally figured it out. They can’t stand the way Bill and, now, Hillary understand the people in the working class and rural America.
It’ll be interesting watching Obama win with just the city votes. Oh, and Iowa.
You got it AnninCA !!
Anne,
=============================
As I said, you may be right about who wins in November, but I’m not really talking about THAT. I am trying to address the fractured state of the Democratic Party at the moment, and THAT is horrid.
I am trying to address the larger issue here and not for whom you will be voting come November.
Are you one of those Obama paid trolls testing the unity thing?
It won’t work. I have no idea where have you been these past months but Dean, Pelosi, Brazile and OBAMA himself have destroyed the democratic party as it was. Kaput, gone. Their disgraceful and despicable behavior and divisive tactics are unforgivable and unforgettable.
I have no idea what are you trying to accomplish here.
Try some other blog where Obama’s dirty tricks might have more traction.
There are many ‘I want a woman-just not this one’ posts going around the last few days. What a bunch of drones. I hope Obama doesn’t get stuck paying for this.
Polly Tics, Though I disagree with you about Hillary, I appreciate your post.
PYW | 2008-05-30 20:43:39
———————————
Thank you and I yours. My main point here is just because we don’t agree on WHICH candidate we prefer, doesn’t mean we don’t like each other, nor should it mean that we should be at odds.
I appreciate your extended hand.
I am no longer a Democrat, this race made me change my affiliation to independent. I will not conform or vote for Obama at any cost. It is my right and my vote. I will vote for McCain.
NQ Friends:
There are lots of trolls around trying out various sanctimonious unity shtiks. Please don’t feed them. Remember they get paid by the # of replies.
You can assume what you want, but I am here because I was horrified at hearing about the death threats against Obama. When I came here to read and see what other “Democrats” were saying I was a bit stunned, yes.
I find the hate to be seething hot and it doesn’t make sense to me. Your issue is WITH THE CANDIDATE and not with those who may have voted for them.
Aha!! Funny you identified yourself !!
Where did you hear about *any* death threats before thsi post??
The threats here were likely by punks that visit us all the time pretending to be something they are not and are OBVIOUSLY Obama supporters f— around.
Obama_is_Weak | 2008-05-30 21:29:34,
————————————————
I hope you are right that they are merely from punks, but I think any and all death threats are serious business.
I came here because I heard there was lots of dissension (talk about understatement) about the election and then in reading the main page I saw the post from Larry regarding the death threats.
And THAT post of Larry’s is what got me to actually comment here today.
Perhaps you are used to hearing this kind of thing, but I’m not and it upsets me frankly. Do with that what you will but I don’t understand the “hate” toward the supporters.
I understand anger and aren’t we all angry at this blasted never ending primary at this point, and I even understand being angry at supporters who are cruel, unfair or just plain lousy; but I don’t understand unmitigated hate toward another Dem of a different opinion.
I think we have I have already replied you to that above, and AnninCA did as well. Read our comments again and please do some thinking if you want to really what is going on.
Most of the Obama supporters in the party, the media and the bloggosphere –including those like you that comment– need to take responsibility and eat a lot of crow for what has happened here. The DNC leadership, the Obama campaign and its supporters in the media and blogs have destroyed the Democratic Party.
This is your problem not ours.
Obama_is_Weak | 2008-05-30 23:00:48
————————————–
I need not eat any crow nor have I done anything worth apologizing for. As for taking responsibility, I try at every opportunity and I actually thought that trying to discuss the problems here, right here with all of you just MIGHT be a way to get somewhere. You know, to take responsibility for figuring out what went wrong, with whom and what to do about it.
This problem is ALL OF OURS and it is positively ridiculous to imagine it any other way, as it will be the LEFT who will lose this November IF this continues at this pitch.
And deservedly so. At any rate I don’t care about “the Left” and their self-centered behavior. And I could even argue with
what you mean by “left”.
But enough already.
No, you’ve misanalyzed the problem.
The rift is deeper. In fact, I don’t particularly hate Obama at all. My rift comes with the Democratic Party leaders who are responsible for this mess AND with the absolute despicable attitudes and insults flung at Hillary by his supporters for over a year.
The vitriol was non-stop.
I wouldn’t join that club if you paid me.
AnninCa | 2008-05-30 21:30:42
====================================
Fair enough, you don’t like Obama nor the Democratic leaders which I have little respect for myself these days. I have found our leadership to be ball-less wonders who don’t seem to know how to actually legislate any longer. And yes, I am with you on getting new people in the top slots, they are needed badly!
I’m sorry you found such awful talk from Obama supporters, but you also must understand that not everyone is like the idiots who insult and blog. There have been terrible things said from both sides and it stings, it does not good and most of all it really stifles any discussion as to what we want.
So that’s it, that’s my entire speech if you can call it that. I’m sorry you have had awful things said to you, but not all are represented by a few blogs.
Be well, vote and let’s all see where we stand come November.
Do you want Unity? Here is what you can do to help:
http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/05/30/want-unity-start-by-condemning-hate-speech/
Why does Obama draw the cult crowd, the voters he does, given his abject, horrific corruption?
Well, now we know.
I think you are disingenuous, btw.
OT–
Each Republican troll is an unintended unique sophmoric event, unconnected to any greater plan, despite the pretensions of continuity. They are THAT inept, and that predictable.
They’re like a drunk who drinks to forget he’s a drunk, but doesnt know he’s a drunk.
WHAT a cycle.
That NEXT troll will do it, never mind the fire consuming their OWN house.
If they were even that sophisticated, or smart.
Which they aren’t.
No wonder they can’t win.
Your ignorant accusations about me and why I am here are the very thing I am speaking toward.
It’s crazy to hate, especially when the hate is directed within your own party. We will NOT get what we want come November with this attitude, that is IF you and I even want the same things anymore.
Perhaps that is the more accurate question…
I want Clinton or McCain. I’m sorry you won’t get what you want. shhhh, there, there.. it will be ok. It must pain you that you have ripped the Dem party apart because you couldn’t resist the shiny, new (empty) toy packaged for you by astroturfing Axelrove. You are carrying a terrible burden in that you put your country last. I understand you are in pain. You are very confused right now because others don’t want to destroy the country like you and your candidate. Your grief will pass…. shhhhh, hush sweetie, everything will be just fine. We’ll take care of the country for you……
Prudence,
———————–
That kind of snide and insulting retort is the very thing I resent and was addressing earlier.
I have no further need to converse with you.
That snide commentary is normal for people here on this board it seems.
pathetic
Larry, I agree with your stance. I do not approve of anyone calling for anyone’s head — or anything else — because that’s flat wrong.
I hate to suggest this, but could some of the nastiness actually be coming from the Obama bloggers? Trying to stir us up, or paint all Hillary Clinton supporters and/or people who will not support Barack Obama for the Presidency as unrepentant idiots? (I agree with your above-written statement wholeheartedly. And I would add, I have no trouble with Senator Barack Obama, D-IL, being a Senator or even being a Vice President or perhaps being a Cabinet member or going to the UN as an ambassador. I just don’t think he’s ready for the Presidency. That is my right as a US citizen. And me believing that he is unqualified does not make me a racist, or an idiot, or a “lost soul.” It merely makes me an honest dissenter.)
I know there are lost souls out there, and I feel great pity for them. But other than praying for them (and pitying them, which isn’t a requirement to pray, of course), what can I do other than say, “That’s not appropriate here, and you should know that.” (Other than notify you, of course, if you haven’t already spotted it.)
Good point and it’s good that Larry takes this seriously. I personally have not seen any threats here at No Quarter. I imagine they never made it onscreen or were pulled immediately.
That trotsky guy made a veiled reference to “Sirhan” and said that we were probably wishing for someone like him. I find him odious. There are people who come here with fake “Hillis …” screen names and screed. We need to turn them in and have them pulled. I think they are trolls. They are new. They curse without provocation and are inappropriate. They are not interested in discussing issues. They deposit their filth and run. No back and forth dialogue. Just hate and filth.
It was tootsky, the gas guy, truth in advertising, that’s our “toot” sky…
Oh, thanks for the update..I’ve had the Spring sinus congestion , thought it was the Flu thing and out of the loop for a couple of days. I could not imagine what this was all about.
Speaking only for me — the one thing we won’t let the obamanation trolls do is stop all dissent. They have knocked out discussion at Huffington Post and turned it into Pravda. They drove discourse out of Daily Kos. They have closed down — one after another — any outlet for DEMOCRATS to disagree with Obama, his campaign, his policies or his followers — and that is WRONG. This will not happen HERE. They will not come HERE and falsely spread their artificial obama threats and faux obama peril and clasp their bloodied facist fists to their breasts in moral outrage. They have abdicated the moral high ground in caucuses where they bullied and bashed people. They have left behind the vestiges of human decency when they made inflamatory and false phone bank calls in Oregon to people calling Hillary Clinton a Marxist. They have stepped on the flag and crawled over the bodies of the forgotten voters in Michigan and Florida — rallying around some sanctimonious cry for RULES! RULES! RULES! when they piss on the rule of law and rule of decency. I will turn in ANYONE who preaches violence against a candidate for the office of POTUS — but I will not be fooled by callow little cowards who rub their filthy palms together and plot the ruination of the once proud Democratic party. I don’t need to kill those people. They are already dead to me.
I don’t care what they think. Just that simple.
They so blew their credibility this primary season that I simply do not care.
In real life?
Someone brings up the Florida vote stuff, I say, “We’re hopelessly split. Nobody will be happy. It’s like divorce.”
The “obama supporter” brightens up, nods, and we go on munching dinner and talkig about Sex in the City.
It’s clear. She didn’t lose.
I don’t care what the idiots want to proclaim. Hillary didn’t lose. Obama hasn’t won.
That’s clear to anyone with a brain.
You all come across like a bunch of sociopaths. Except Obama supporters of course.
Polly_Tics, I’m willing to give you the benefit of the doubt about your intentions, so I will give you an honest answer why I can not only not support Obama, but can not sit idly by while his supporters try to destroy Hillary Clinton. I know full well she has made some mistakes, some lies in fact. There is a fundamental difference in the level of inflations and lies between Clinton and Obama.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0805/S00171.htm
If you take the time to fully read the rather lengthy articles by Ms Pringle you will see a beginning of a picture that shows rather pointedly there is much to wonder about Senator Obama. Much of what Ms Pringle wrote I had already learned from several months of researching before I cast my vote in the Indiana Primary. But that is just the start. Add into that the 20 yr association with Wright and Pfleger who are both well and long known for being racist and anti-semites. Ayers who is an admitted terrorist, add in Obama’s actually running on the Marxist ticket his first try for office. His campaigns “Democrat for a day” program, which did the EXACT same thing Obama’s campaign complains about Rush doing, except Rush did his in response to the Democrats doing it first. Obama’s campaign started their program with one explicit purpose…To destroy Hillary’s chance at the White House! Flyer’s and emails they sent out said exactly that. Vote against Hillary by voting for Obama. Add to that, there is documented election fraud by Obama volunteers and supporters in the Texas caucus side of the Texas primary, 200 cases with 2000 complainants.
Then you have to take into account his other chosen associates and what they have done at his request. Axelrod helped Obama’s cousin Odingo run for President in Kenya. Odingo has confirmed that he speaks with Barack on a nearly daily basis. This is the same Odingo who when he LOST that race started having his people murder innocent people until the lawfully elected President of Kenya was forced to name Odingo Prime Minister and share power with him. I believe it was over 1600 people who died to get Odingo the power he craved.
Barack himself has been careful not to call Hillary a racist, but his staff has and continues to spread knowingly false rumors and outright lies to paint Clinton and her campaign as a bunch of racists. That forces you to wonder why Michelle’s college thesis has been sealed until after November. Barack tries to say she should not be a target since he’s the one running for office, but Hillary showed what a true First Lady can do when she took on the Republican machine.
And if you actually dig into things deep enough to get past all of the posts and video’s that Obama’s campaign has had scrubbed out of view from a quick search, you find all the other goodies. Like how after Rev Wright blew up in his face, Obama supporters claimed Clinton’s preacher was a convicted child molester. That is still posted on pro Obama blogs to this day, even though it has been proven to be a flat out lie. The preacher who was named was at a church in upstate NY over 100 miles from the church the Clintons went to. Someone seized on the fact that an unrelated parishioner to the church had the last name Clinton and they used it. Even after it was proven to be total BS the Obama campaign left it on their official website blog for 3 weeks until another website called them on it.
And as the final straw, go to any website that is “supposed” to be Pro-Democrat now like as previously mentioned HuffPo, DKOS, C&L, Politico etc etc…and 90%+ are blatant pro Obama rags now where anything negative about Obama or positive about Clinton is immediate and continual fodder for the Obamatons. They have even gone so far as to edit 15 yr old clips from video tapes to make false accusations of racism. So why should any person who rather than listen to a speech, chose instead to thoroughly look into ALL Candidates and make an informed decision about supporting Hillary, put up with being bashed, insulted and threatened by Obamatons who never bothered to check about anything but listen to him talk. Bush gave a good speech too, in a down home folksy kinda way and I’d never vote for him. Hitler was a hell of a motivational speaker…but when the roots of the tree are rotten, it will never grow tall and strong no matter how beautiful those Spring Blooms might seem the first year.
POdVet | 2008-05-30 23:02:51
————————————
I appreciate the time you took to post your reasons and I will read them all, but I really don’t want to convince you to vote for anyone other than you are already intending. I just want folks to know that not all posters voting for a different candidate wish Hillary (or you) ill. Some do, sure; but not all.
I can appreciate WHY you want Hillary and don’t intend to ever try to convince you otherwise. I also know Obama is not a perfect candidate, but in my world view he is the one who comes closest to what I want for the country. Now, I know you probably just squirmed like crazy when I said that, but please do try to understand that we are of a different opinion as to where these 2 candidates can or will take us.
Thanks for your take on Obama and for the time spent here, I appreciate it.
Anyone who chooses spiritual advisors as he does……
Is not safe to be president.
And so we part paths.
I hope you lose. I think he’s a loose cannon and dangerous.
But you’re entitled to one vote, just as I am.
Democrats control the senate and will do so in 2008 with a bigger working majority. If McCain tries to appoint a right wing justice, Reid has the right to say I will not even bring his/her name to the floor for a vote. It’s that simple, no filibuster needed!
Please, Obama supporters stop trying to scare us! Roe vs Wade will be protected!
You’re giving the Dem leadership wayy too much credit. Assuming the GOP nominates conservative judges that have sterling academic/professional reputations, and there are many, there is little any Dem can do - without overturning decades of precedent - to stop them from being confirmed. That being said, you are entitled to your vote. If you want to put your faith in the Dem leadership to stop McCain, then by all means go right ahead.
Wow - I just read through this blog entry, which is headed up by an entry warning people to cool it because there have been several DEATH THREATS generated in the course of discussion. Nice stuff.
Of course, there are always a few hotheads that generate that kind of stuff, death threats worth of being reported to the secret service, that is. What amazes me is the discussion that follows.
No contrition. No shock or revulsion. No self examination, no questioning about what it is about the discussion that might have contributed to these threats being put forward, not even much of a sense that anyone here thinks it to be a problem, really.
Instead, I would characterize the discussion as petulant and bitter, and somewhat bizarre when the discussion turns around to death threats generated by the opposition (no links or evidence offered, of course).
One opposition supporter swings by trying to smooth things over, and they are roundly jeered by the mob and pretty much ejected. It is explained to them that this place is a place where like-minded people meet, and their placatory views and well-wishes just arent welcome.
Wow.
Im impressed. I really want you guys on my team.
DDD…It’s late and Folks at this site get pretty fed up with troll wars and such….I get pissed off if any thuggery is used in this election…I’m from Texas and I saw it down here form Obama suporters…Check out the Houston Chronicle as he’s doing it again trying to prevent one of his own SD’s from running for office within the Texas Party….It’s fascism and folks have a right to fight against it and the NQ folks that support Hillary don’t resort to thuggery….Only Obama does….
By the way the link for the story was posted on another thread Larry’s story starting with the word Revealed from yesterday….The SD might jump to Hillary as a result and she’s a AA woman….and Rightfully Pissed off
I just did a search and see that the violent post to which referred was NOT removed and for that it is a horrid error. I thought Larry Johnson was to remove this, but I see now that it must have merely been a assuagement and platitude.
I once admired Larry Johnson’s opinion and wit, but it would seem that I have misjudged. Perhaps I should have taken note from friends and reported this to the Secret Service after all.
.
workingclass artist: “the NQ folks that support Hillary don’t resort to thuggery…”
Clearly thats not true - two death threats generated on this board have been reported to the secret service. Thats thuggery, by Hillary supporters.
Would you agree that making death threats is wrong, by whichever party, and for whatever justification?
Wouldn’t it be great if one of the leading Hillary supporters stepped forward and said something like “hey people, making death threats is counterproductive, so calm down and stop it”
Do you have a link to the Houston Chronicle article? Id like to read about what you are talking about.
Here’s a little example of what happened here in the Ohio primary:
Akron man charged with assaulting Clinton supporters
Posted by Maggi Martin March 04, 2008 13:58PM
Categories: Breaking News
An Akron man was charged Tuesday with assault and weapons charges after he attacked supporters of presidential campaigner Hillary Clinton on Monday night, police said.
William Bonner, 26, is in Summit County Jail Tuesday where he faces additional charges of vandalizing a police cruiser after he kicked at a window and damaged the frame.
Bonner was also charged with carrying a concealed knife, disorderly conduct and public intoxication.
Police said at 5:30 p.m. Bonner approached a group of Clinton supporters carrying signs at East Market and Summit streets.
Bonner took a campaign sign away from one worker, hitting several workers and punched a 61-year-old supporter in the back of the head, police said.
He kicked at the window when police put him in the back of a cruiser. Officers subdued him with pepper spray.
The workers were not seriously injured.
http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/03/akron_man_charged_with_assault.html
This is a little more than the usual removing of signs from front yards, don’t you think?
Yep. Thats thuggish behavior. Drunk, armed, violent, arrested. Definitely qualifies, and I condemn it as much as you do.
This quote from that link is interesting:
http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2008/03/akron_man_charged_with_assault.html#772012
Thank you for monitoring this and doing something about it. On other blogs I’ve read, they don’t. Words do matter and threats against individuals are unacceptable, despite where they appear.
Comment by LSekhmet |I agree with you about what you said , that you just do not think Obama is right for the presidency does not make you racist,it in fact does not. That’s a pretty dumb reason to vote for someone based on his color anyway. How on earth does the color of skin make one qualified mind you?I think if there are Obama supporters suggesting this, they are just trying to use the race card to guilt you. I would say to Obama’s supporters who are doing this,that is pretty lame on your part and you have yet to give any meaningful responses as to why you think Obama is the best candidate. Using the race card has not helped you, you have succeeded in alienating more voters though. Congratulations. Mission accomplished.I once considered Obama as the candidate I would vote for if Hillary did not get nominated now I am leery and have decided to either not vote or write Hillary’s name in. I’m still undecided.Does it make me a racist when I once thought if I voted for Obama at least Hillary and he are similar on issues and he’d make a still decent president and I have changed my mind because I now have doubts?
Oops, still make a decent, I meant.
Mccain will probably win the presidency as it is. Obama’s supporters have alienated too many white voters with accusations like dumb , middle class ,uneducated hicks or racists.Smart move.Talk about sabotaging your own candidate and shooting off your own foot to spit yourself.
Mccain will probably win the presidency as it is. Obama’s supporters have alienated too many white voters with accusations like dumb , middle class ,uneducated hicks or racists.Smart move.Talk about sabotaging your own candidate and shooting off your own foot to spite yourself.
I had that ploy pulled on me almost 8 years ago when I was working at Sam’s .I had reported a Mexican man to the manager because he was not doing his job and the rest of us were getting in trouble and threatened with write-ups because certain things were not being done.He had the gall to suggest I was picking on him because of his race. I told him that was the oldest con in the book and it had nothing to do with his race but the fact he wasn’t doing his job and the rest of us were being blamed for it .He had no reply.
“Akron man charged with assaulting Clinton supporters” What now? Will the police be accused of being racist because they arrested the man for assault?
Karl Rove is probably rolling in the dirt laughing his arse off
I am personally not happy with the prospect of another 4 years of a republican president who mirrors Bush and wants to make his tax cuts permanent and follow Bush’s policies.I am also concerned with McCain leaning toward the right .http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=25143 Something women here may want to read and consider.
I read too and have done extensive reading on the right. So now where do I go from here? Like I said not vote ,write Hillary’s name in or vote Ron Paul or some other independent
Ok, if you can’t get the link ,here is the article:McCain Sticks to Bush Script on Judges
Pledges to continue record of support for judges who have undermined Americans’ rights
Sen. John McCain’s speech about judges today stuck to the script written by right-wing ideologues and followed by President George W. Bush.
People For the American Way President Kathryn Kolbert released the following statement about Sen. McCain’s speech:
Here’s what McCain was really telling the party base: If you liked George W. Bush’s nominees, you’re going to love the judges John McCain will put on the bench.
McCain also touted his support for the so-called Gang of 14 as a supposed sign of moderation. But the fact is that he has voted to give lifetime jobs as federal judges to every one of President Bush’s most dangerous and damaging nominees. And they’re already eroding individual rights and legal protections. We’re all going to be living with the consequences of those votes for a long, long time.
The two Supreme Court justices nominated by President Bush are already making it harder for workers mistreated on the job to get justice. They’re letting politicians get away with making it harder for some people to vote. They’re redefining our Constitution and laws to erode progress on women’s rights, educational opportunity, environmental protections, and more.
People For the American Way activists were on hand at Wake Forest University to let attendees know the consequences of Sen. McCain’s unwavering support for Bush judicial nominees who are undermining Americans’ rights and legal protections. Activists held a banner reading “Sen. McCain: We don’t need more bad Bush judges,” and distributed information about the damage done by the Bush judiciary. Before the speech, People For also distributed a translation guide to right-wing buzz words McCain was expected to use.
Right wing judges folks mean less rights for women.I’ve studied it ,I know what is going on. I’ve done extensive reading on the radical right.And they are not advocates of women’s rights.
Just a few other sites:http://www.au.org/site/PageServer (Americans for separation of church and state) and http://www.theocracywatch.org
Hey - I just realized that this site is called “No Quarter USA”, which basically means “take no prisoners”, or in more explicit terms “kill the enemy even if they try to surrender”.
This is, of course, a great name for a website on which civil political discussion is intended to happen.
The name seems to be apropos.
The problem IS that we, as fellow travelers, brothers and sisters all, do not listen to each other and instead offer seething anger and/or violence to stead the fright.
If this continues, we as a society, are lost.
But see, you can post here and no one curses you or takes your comment down …. can you say the same of the places you normally post at?