Why Didn’t They Fire Him?
By Bronwyn's Harbor on November 12, 2009 at 1:30 PM in Current Affairs
When I see headlines and stories like these, I shake my head. EVERYTHING else aside, including his horrific murders, this man had NO business working with soldiers needing counseling. He had NO business in the U.S. Army. He should have been discharged (but also closely monitored thereafter).
Walter Reed Officials Asked: Was Hasan Psychotic?, NPR, November 12, 2009:
Starting in the spring of 2008, key officials from Walter Reed Army Medical Center and the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences held a series of meetings and conversations, in part about Maj. Nidal Hasan, the man accused of killing 13 people and wounding dozens of others last week during a shooting spree at Fort Hood. One of the questions they pondered: Was Hasan psychotic?
“Put it this way,” says one official familiar with the conversations that took place. “Everybody felt that if you were deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, you would not want Nidal Hasan in your foxhole.”
And, get this: They had “serious concerns.” Well, hell’s bells, yeah!!!
In documents reviewed by NPR and conversations with medical officials at Walter Reed and USUHS, new details have emerged regarding serious concerns that officials raised about Hasan during his time at both institutions.
Here’s more from the excellent NPR investigative report that will shock anyone:
Deeply Troubling, Schizoid Behavior
When a group of key officials gathered in the spring of 2008 for their monthly meeting in a Bethesda, Md., office, one of the leading — and most perplexing — items on their agenda was: What should we do about Hasan?
Hasan had been a trouble spot on officials’ radar since he started training at Walter Reed, six years earlier. Several officials confirm that supervisors had repeatedly given him poor evaluations and warned him that he was doing substandard work.
Both fellow students and faculty were deeply troubled by Hasan’s behavior — which they variously called disconnected, aloof, paranoid, belligerent, and schizoid. The officials say he antagonized some students and faculty by espousing what they perceived to be extremist Islamic views. His supervisors at Walter Reed had even reprimanded him for telling at least one patient that “Islam can save your soul.”
Participants in the spring meeting and in subsequent conversations about Hasan reportedly included John Bradley, chief of psychiatry at Walter Reed; Robert Ursano, chairman of the Psychiatry Department at USUHS; Charles Engel, assistant chair of the Psychiatry Department and director of Hasan’s psychiatry fellowship; Dr. David Benedek, another assistant chairman of psychiatry at USUHS; psychiatrist Carroll J. Diebold; and Scott Moran, director of the psychiatric residency program at Walter Reed, according to colleagues and other sources who monitor the meetings.
NPR tried to contact all these officials and the public affairs officers at the institutions. They either didn’t return phone calls or said they could not comment.
But psychiatrists and officials who are familiar with the conversations, which continued into the spring of 2009, say they took a remarkable turn: Is it possible, some mused, that Hasan was mentally unstable and unfit to be an Army psychiatrist?
Now GET THIS:
One official involved in the conversations had reportedly told colleagues that he worried that if Hasan deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, he might leak secret military information to Islamic extremists. Another official reportedly wondered aloud to colleagues whether Hasan might be capable of committing fratricide, like the Muslim U.S. Army sergeant who, in 2003, killed two fellow soldiers and injured 14 others by setting off grenades at a base in Kuwait.
Ya think??? Look at these headlines:
“Fort Hood shootings suspect may have wired money to Pakistan,” Dallas Morning News || blog reactions
“EXCLUSIVE: Fort Hood suspect contacted Muslim extremists, Washington Times (just published minutes ago) || blog reactions
Back to the NPR report:
Bureaucratic And Other Obstacles
So why didn’t officials act on their concerns and seek to remove Hasan from his duties, or at least order him to receive a mental health evaluation? Interviews with these officials suggest that a chain of unrelated events and factors deterred them.
For one thing, Walter Reed and most medical institutions have a cumbersome and lengthy process for expelling doctors, involving hearings and potential legal battles. As a result, sources say, key decision-makers decided it would be too difficult, if not unfeasible, to put Hasan on probation and possibly expel him from the program.
Second, some of Hasan’s supervisors and instructors had told colleagues that they repeatedly bent over backward to support and encourage him, because they didn’t have clear evidence that he was unstable, and they worried they might be “discriminating” against Hasan because of his seemingly extremist Islamic beliefs. …
And ultimately what did the bureaucrats at Walter Reed do? They passed the buck:
And finally, Hasan was about to leave Walter Reed and USUHS for good and transfer to Fort Hood, in Texas. Fort Hood has more psychiatrists and other mental specialists than some other Army bases, so officials figured there would be plenty of co-workers who would support Hasan — and monitor him.
You can catch more blog reactions via Memeorandum.com.
I get that the U.S. Army is a huge military structure, but this man’s behavior and stated views screamed for ACTION. That’s all I have to say on this.
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Large bureaucracies = SNAFU.
In this case, I think that FUBAR is more accurate.
Having worked in bureaucracies, it is the Political Correctness that stops the natural process in almost all cases. The paranoia of being targeted by some victim group or by union attorneys overrides common sense.
I think it is more a function of large institutions. Whether it’s the Post Office, Church or Army; the sheer size of these mega-institutions renders they completely impotent to handle any problems or deviations quickly.
They are so top heavy and bloated with bureaucracy they can only lumber along at a snail’s pace. Even when the situation requires a sprint.
Oh please.
If this guy was a problem for SIX YEARS, the military’s need to be “PC” is such a weak excuse. SIX YEARS?? And they even
‘talked about possible psychosis’ for ONE AND A HALF YEARS?
This is not a ladies club we are talking about!!! This is the organization that topples REGIMES in a matter of hours! If they were truly concerned, they surely could have moved one little desk jockey out of the program in some way.
Come on, people–critical thinking time! Think about your own workplaces. There are ways to get people to leave within WEEKS, and the military expects me to believe they couldn’t find a way to remove him in SIX YEARS?
This is just too much. I’ll tell you what’s the PC thing holding everything up here: people’s unwillingness to question the military!
Oh–but they are the ‘good guys’–they never lie. Why are we so incredibly forgetful?
Weapons of mass destruction.
Pat Tillman.
Ask questions before blindly accepting stories! http://www.examiner.com/x-23316-Madison-Independent-Examiner~y2009m11d10-Ft-Hood-Official-story-full-of-holes
And what you can’t get through anyone’s head is that eloquent speeches don’t fix systemic problems. I’m so glad that the President can give a fantastic speech. Now, if he could just do something–you know, relieve an incompetent general, fire the director of the FBI–something of substance.
But wait–he can do that. When an official in his White House terrified some New Yorkers with a low-flying airplane, he was swiftly removed from his job.
The difference here is, you don’t politically embarrass this White House. That’s a firing offense. Everyone else? Promotions and medals.
I understand and agree with your general sentiment but digress on the fantastic speeches. His words are vapid, hollow, unoriginal and uninspiring to me. Perhaps this is due to me knowing his obvious lack of charter, being void of real substance and wisdom.
Me too. Even the much ballyhooed speech of 2004 left me bored. It was all air, and not in any way substantive. I remember in 2004 scratching my head as to why everyone was so excited about that convention speech.
Scariest is that people actually fall for that hot air.
He’s got his speechwriters to thank for his ‘inspiring’ speeches. Since they aren’t even his, maybe we should have elected one of his speechwriters…you know, one of the 26 year olds like Jon Favre, that immature, self important Hillary maligner.
what inspiring speeches! he had a good moment at the democratic convention for kerry. however i have not seen grace or spellbinding oratory from the boychild since then. quite the contrary!
I feel way too many people are like wolves (no offense to non-metaphorical actual wolves intended), and need to be lead and told what to do. Stick practically any moron in front of a podium and a bunch of folks will listen attentively and follow said moron right over the cliff. Case in point: the aforementioned shallow uninspiring bozo squatting in the oval office, and his zombie followers.
People make speeches and sermons and tell others what to do, yet time and time again we find the speech makers do not practice what they preach. Sad, sad state of affairs…
Um, it was sarcasm.
I realize getting digs on Obama is what passes for sport, but the real dig is that there’s no substance there. Millions have reacted with blind enthusiasm to his phrasing and eloquence without realizing just how little the man is willing to do.
How hard does Obama actually work? I have no idea. Seems to be insistent on down time, as was President Bush.
Not to his followers. That’s what I thought you meant.
You know, I forgot how insane it is over here.
As the kids say, my bad.
Chill. We’re not as rabid as you, it would appear.
Never thought I would be comparing Bush favorably with anyone, but at least he got to the office at a regular hour and stayed there for some time. From what I can gather, Obama wanders over about 9-10 am to get started on the nation’s business. That is if he doesn’t have a speech or some such thing that entails his getting on his “spiffy ride” and having a day out of the office. For most Presidents, a day out of the office comes every couple of weeks at most, other than weekends. It seems that with Obama, a day in the office comes every couple of weeks, between speeches and “date night”. Anyone who pulls in $500,000 a year, plus major perks, should be required to put in a 40 hour work week, at the very least. Bill Clinton hit the office at 6 am every day, and was still there when his staff dragged their weary butts home at midnight. Clinton did more work in a week than Obama has done his whole term, so far. Someone should tell Mr. Obama that when you are President, voting present isn’t an option, you have to do the work.
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These are the lines that stood out for me, Bronwyn:
” . . .they repeatedly bent over backward to support and encourage him, because they didn’t have clear evidence that he was unstable, and they worried they might be “discriminating” against Hasan because of his seemingly extremist Islamic beliefs.”
The words “clear evidence” is almost laughable. What sort of evidence were they looking for? The guy wearing a suicide vest? From what I read there were plenty of disturbing signals that should have raised red flags all over the place. They bent over backwards? No, they just closed their eyes, held their nose and bent over.
And they were worried about “discriminating” against his “seemingly extremist Islamic beliefs? WTF!! Isn’t that what we’ve been fighting against for the last 9 years? Sorry, I have no problem with discriminating against Nazi’s, Klansmen and Islamic extremists. Do these people have the right to believe what they believe? In this country, yes. But we don’t have to reward that, or worse yet, kick the can down the road.
This could have been stopped at Walter Reed. Instead, the esteemed staff decided to hand Hasan off to Ft. Hood.
Lots of questions to be answered on this one.
Good article!
Great comment, Peggy. Isn’t that pathetic. I’d LOVE to hear Charles Krauthammer, a psychiatrist, weigh in on that. Perhaps Bret baier will do that today! Hope so.
Never mind the extremist views, what really chapped me was that he had counseled soldiers returning from Iraq and told them to convert to Islam, “to save their souls”. As a psychiatrist, it was against every tenet of psychiatry for him to invoke his personal feelings and beliefs, no matter what they were, in a session with a patient. He should have been suspended as soon as that occurred, given it was a major breach of professional ethics. I have had counseling at various times in my life, and if one of those professionals had at any time tried to impose, or even suggest, a course based on their personal views, or religion, rather than one based on psychology, etc., I would have immediately filed a complaint with the proper authorities, like the state licensing board. So, the Army could have gotten rid of him without even mentioning religion. Simply dismissed him for breaches of professional ethics that could have been, and probably were, traumatic to his patients. Medical ethics are for ALL doctors, even Muslims.
And these are the same idiots that want to run our health care, they couldn’t even take care of one muslim terrorist…
Hasan’s base pay was approx $90,000 per year + $13,000 a year housing allowance + special duty pay, or as some would say “TAD” Temporary Additional Duty pay. Was the TAD until he shipped out to Afghanistan? he was in a transit company. The guy was making more than $100,000 a year, for what? stalking American service men and women? Now the National News Networks are saying that if he should be tried and convicted and given the death sentence, the president would have to approve of the sentence.
Obama says we shouldn’t jump to conclusions about this, (Islamic redical), guy. All those red flags and Obama says don’t jump to conclusions?!!! Jumping to conclusions is what he, Obama, did when he said the white cop that arrested the black professor was dumb, Obama had no red flags or any other evidence that would suggest the white cop was dumb. How would anyone here at NQ like having this guy (or another like him) guarding your back in Afghanistan? NO THANK YOU!
westexan thanks! i agree with you.
And what happened to all that money? They say he lived in a small apartment. How much did he funnel to jihadists?
That is coming out now Bronwyn the money he was funneling through Pakistan!
They were saying this morning on “CBS”, Hasan was living in a $350 a month apartment, even though his military housing allowance was $1100 per month. They (CBS) then continue to express the sentiments of his known associates of just how generous and wonderful this creep was toward the poor and how he handed out money to them. No lady friend(s), no hobbies, no nothing, but from other postings at other site he obviously liked to hang out at the strip joints. Sounds like a real wierdo wearing flip-flops and a kimono (robe)topped with a skull cap. A genuine religious sicko.
I seem to recall somewhere he had signed up at a match making site or similar for muslims and his character was so off the scale they were unable to match him with any female……
The women are the ones breathing a sigh of relief after we now all know his character was skin deep at best.
I do know he had posted a search on-line for a Muslim wife who would wear the burka and abide by all the other Islamic garbage–but he had no takers. I think maybe even the Islamic women in this nation are becoming a bit wary and weary of that phoney religion. Why in the world would anyone in their right mind think God would put any significance on a woman wearing a face cover or mask or viel-whatever? But the men seem to think that is worth killing over? How utterly disgusting.
I agree!! Totally disgusting.
Exactly. I think we know where Obama’s loyalties lie. Also got this in my email today:
So what came first in Hasan’s case? The alleged mental health issues or the muslim jihadi beliefs and actions?
Or do the two feed and support each other in etiology?
It doesn’t seem to be a case of mental health issues to me but rather a case of an Islamic religious zealot hell bent on becoming a martyr. This was premeditated beyond the shadow of a doubt. The investigators found the packaging materials that once contained the laser sights for Hasan’s guns. Taking time to mount, and then sight in, the lasers seems to be quite evident that he was thinking about using the guns for ***SOMETHING***. Hunters do not generally use hand guns (especially large bore) for varment hunting. And the pronouncement, Allahu Akhbar, he used while shooting is more like the old “Remember The Alamo” than it is a wild turkey call. This was premeditated murder.
He was just charged today with premeditated murders of 13 people. Good.
“For one thing, Walter Reed and most medical institutions have a cumbersome and lengthy process for expelling doctors, involving hearings and potential legal battles. As a result, sources say, key decision-makers decided it would be too difficult, if not unfeasible, to put Hasan on probation and possibly expel him from the program.”
Does that hold water? It’s been reported that Hasan had gotten legal help to try to get out of the service. It doesn’t sound like the army would have had much of a “potential legal battle” to get rid of him.
So what came first in Hasan’s case? The alleged mental health issues or the muslim jihadi beliefs and actions?
*********
The PC crowd is backing into a corner. He may have a severe psychiatric illness but to base that diagnosis on his acting on his Religious beliefs leads into some interesting directions.
They not only didn’t boot him out of the army, they promoted him.
Here is an Army Major’s take on what happened and why Hasan was never discharged from the military:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/11/12/why_i_am_angry.html
Sadly as Bill Kristol from the Weekly Standard points out, “Major Keller will get in more trouble for writing this, than anyone in Hasan’s chain of command or elsewhere in the government will get for failing to do their job”.
Sometimes I notice the military likes to fire, “move” or force retire senior leadership in response to much lower level screw ups. I wondered as I watched Lt General Cone do the first news conference after the shooting, if he’d have to take the total fall for this event. Same with the Commander of Walter Reed, Lt General Carla Hawley-Bowland.
Oops, sorry, it’s Major General Carla Hawley-Bowland.
Interesting article by a soldier:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/11/12/why_i_am_angry.html
I don’t understand why they just didn’t say he was gay and kick him out right away. Plant a link to a gay porn site on his computer…..bye-bye.
Gay/Lesbian soldier, bounce them out instantly.
Islamo-fascist nut job, promote and transfer him.
priceless.
I want him tried as a terrorist. I do not want him at gitmo. No Caribbean island for him. I want him to live out is life in the coldest most miserable surroundings possible. I do not want him killed. I want him to have to know that people will pray for him not to get the 72 virgins but 144 pox ridden hags. I want every day of hi s useless life to be as miserable as possible.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
Army: Fort Hood suspect charged with murder
AP
Thu Nov 12, 2009
FORT HOOD, Texas
– The Army psychiatrist suspected in a deadly rampage at Fort Hood, Texas, has been charged in a military court with 13 counts of premeditated murder.
U.S. Army Criminal Investigation Command spokesman Chris Grey told a news conference Thursday at the Texas base that additional charges may also be filed against Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan.
Hasan is suspected of killing 12 soldiers and one civilian in last Thursday’s shooting spree at Fort Hood. He was shot and wounded by two police officers at the base, and remains in recovery at an Army hospital in San Antonio. His attorney says he was read the charges at the hospital.
THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE.
Check back soon for further information.
AP’s earlier story is below.
Whenever I read that “72 virgins” bit, I always smile, and remember that Catholic nuns are virgins. I wish him 72 nuns, with rulers, for all eternity. He deserves them. Oh, and nuns are “eternal virgins” so no sex, just rules and rulers. Hehehe.
And I want all of his guards to be women…strong, voluptuous, gorgeous women who constantly remind him that he was brought down by a woman. I want him challenged by these women every single day with him not being able to do a thing about it. I want it to be torture for him.
WASHINGTON
(AP)
— Military officials say the Army psychiatrist accused of killing 13 and wounding 29 in last week’s shooting rampage at his military post in Texas will face 13 charges of premeditated murder under the military’s legal system. The decision makes him eligible for the death penalty if convicted.
A formal announcement about the charges against Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan is expected later Thursday. Two U.S. military officials described the charges to the AP on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak about the case publicly.
The officials said it is not yet decided whether to charge Hasan with a 14th count of murder related to the death of the unborn child of a pregnant shooting victim.
I heard on a radio news program that he carried business cards that read: “Nidal Hasan — Soldier for Allah” Can anyone confirm this?
Ironically, it made me think of Paladin: “Have Gun Will Travel”
If true, why on earth would anyone still believe this guy is merely a nut job?
Per story at:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,574546,00.html
“Hasan, an Army psychiatrist, reportedly obtained the business cards over the Internet. In addition to listing his profession and contact information, the cards contain a discrete reference to his religion: “SoA(SWT).”
Watchdogs say the first letters are shorthand among militant Muslims to “soldier of Allah.” The last letters refer to “Subhanahu Wa Ta’all,” which means “glory to God.”
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/
Larry
how will this affect things between muslims and the other citizens of this country?
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
How many other Nidal Hassans do they know about?
Fort Hood jihadist may have sent money to Pakistan…
The Dallas Morning News (via Hot Air) reports that Malik Nidal Hasan may have wired money to Pakistan…
Simple answer:
The services are hurting for officers. Academy grads are staying long enough to fulfill their obligation and leaving.