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What is a Democrat? – **Open Thread**

By Linda Anselmi on July 15, 2009 at 9:45 PM in Arlen Specter, Democratic Party, Linda Anselmi, Rep. Joe Sestak

I’m not sure I know anymore.

Nor am I, after the events of this last year, one to tout party loyalty.

But I can’t help thinking that it is a huge plus for all Pennsylvanians to have more than one Democratic party choice. Representative Joe Sestak (D-PA), who is conducting an exploratory tour of Pennsylvania’s 67 counties, has now officially announced he is running for Pennsylvania’s Senate seat. His opponent for the Democratic primary will be the current five term Senator from Pennsylvania, the former Democrat-turned-Republican-turned-Democrat, Arlen Specter.

___________
From The Ed Show July 9:

Visit msnbc.com for Breaking News, World News, and News about the Economy

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So what do you think?

Are these good Democrats?

And more importantly, are these good choices for Pennsylvania – and for our Nation?

  • Bob

    Specter is in terrible health— Doubt he will be able to run

    • http://noquarterusa.net/ SusanUnPC

      And he’s 79 years old. Besides having fought cancer — what — three times? If it were the House, it’d be one thing but Senators serve for six long years. We’ve already seen what the debilitating effects of very advanced age has done to Robert Byrd, who shouldn’t have run for another term.

  • Betty

    Democrat yes, they have a majority in both House and Senate and still when we get a look at their “health care reform” there is no single payer plan.

    How do they dare? When over 70% of the American people want a single payer plan? Democrats and Republicans belong on the scrap heap of history.

    • Dutch

      Where do you get 70% of Americans number from and who’s going to pay for all of this? We need reform, but I wouldn’t trust the crooks in DC, or Obama to come up with a plan that really helps any of us. The only way it would have any significance for me is if CONGRESS AND THE SENATE had to take it too. But, they and the unions will retain their own “gold bar” coverage…which we will also continue to pay for. Give me a break.

      • MrMike

        What? You would rather have the health insurance crooks taking your money the denying your claim?
        How are we going to pay for it? The same way you pay for the shoddy insurance product you have now.
        Only difference is there will be no skimming 30% off the top for “administrative” costs.
        Everybody will pay into a fund administered by the government directly or contracted out to a private company just as they do in Europe. That money will get you basic insurance. Then you can work for an employer that provides health and vision insurance as a benefit. Just like they do in Canada.
        Simple, isn’t it.

        • MrMike

          That third from last sentence should read Then you can work for an employer that provides dental and vision insurance as a benefit.

          • Jules

            I would also like to add that dental and vision insurance are basically pointless and not cost effective for most people. Insurance should be for unplanned events that are catastrophic in nature…not teeth cleanings and eye exams. If you add up what it costs to have your teeth cleaned ($100) vs what you pay in annual premiums, it’s not worth it. Most people are not going to have the more expensive dental procedures on a regular enough basis to make it worthwhile.

            • MrMike

              A solution for that (if Obama really cared) would be a pretax Health Savings Account that you could roll over from one year to the next.

              However, how many times have you heard or read that somebody put off going to the doctor until their condition became catastrophic? A basic plan could include a yearly check up and blood work.

              Do you smoke or know someone who does? Let them keep their habit but instead of using tobacco taxes fund blowing things up in Iraq put it toward the cancer treatments they’ll need.

            • JozefAL

              Just how many times are YOU getting your teeth cleaned per year? When I did have dental insurance and had regular twice-a-year office visits and cleanings, you’re right, the insurance premiums weren’t cost-effective (I was paying just over $200 a year for the insurance; my twice-yearly office visits and cleanings–without X-rays–totaled $180; that, by the way, was more than a decade ago). HOWEVER, here’s where the big problem comes in. Where I now work, all the dental plans available will cover basic procedures (office visits and cleanings and X-rays) from the start but it can take up to two YEARS before things like orthodontia and root canal procedures can be covered, and even then, I would still have to pay as much as 25% of the total cost (or coverage might be limited to a certain amount per year and I’m responsible for any and all costs incurred above that limit). The last time that insurance coverage was offered, the cheapest coverage was about $300/year with a lot of caveats.
              As to vision insurance, my current insurer (Blue Cross) offers it FREE OF CHARGE if you’re buying coverage for yourself and your family; of course, the catch is that it’s only available to your minor, school-age children–neither you nor your wife (nor any college-age dependents who ARE covered under the rest of your health insurance plan). Well, that’s all fine and dandy, but *I* need vision coverage, and those eye exams are pretty darned expensive. I spent nearly $500 a few years ago to get some glasses replaced because I had to have an eye exam beforehand–the cost of the frames and lenses was responsible for a little more than half of the total. By contrast, after getting vision insurance (which comes to about $150/year), I paid a total of $125 for the exam and a new set of frames and new lenses and my co-pay. (My vision insurance coverage allows me a yearly eye exam and new frames every other year, with no cost to replace broken frames and a small fee to replace damaged lenses. Is that worth $150/year? Considering I’ve worn glasses basically for my whole life, yeah, it is. And if I could get decent dental insurance for that little, I don’t think I’d hesitate to add dental coverage.)

              • Jules

                You are providing anecdotal evidence.
                So maybe you are not one of the ‘most people’ I mention. Congratulations, you are one of the lucky ones that the other plan participants pay for when they don’t get their money’s worth.

                No company is going to stay in business if they collect $125 in premiums and pay out $500 in benefits for each person. But anyway, my point is that $500 in a year is not a catastrophic loss and technically it shouldn’t be insured for. I know some people on the consumer end will find that point debatable because they feel entitled to and enjoy benefits for every little thing…but I don’t find it debatable from a technical standpoint. If it can be planned for on an annual basis, it should not be insurable.

                Basically Vision and Dental are ‘feel good’ benefits that employers offer to retain workers. They are not really necessary for most people unless small sums are going to throw you into bankruptcy. That could be the case for some I suppose, but probably not if you are fortunate enough to collect a salary from a company that provides benefits in the first place.

                Also, I can guarantee you no company is really offering coverage, vision or otherwise, ‘free of charge’. It is built into their premiums and you might be told it is free as a feel good thing. And I know what I’m talking about on this as it used to be my job to rate these plans.

        • Jules

          NO THANKS. Are you saying the government will have no administrative costs? 30% (a totally bogus figure by the way) will look like a bargain when they are through with us.

          • MrMike

            A quick Google turned this up from 2005.

            http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/11/051110215547.htm

            Over the last decade, administrative costs have accounted for 25 percent of health care spending. Little has been known, however, about the portion attributable to billing and insurance-related functions,” said James G. Kahn, MD, MPH, principal study investigator and professor at the Institute for Health Policy Studies at the University of California, San Francisco.

            • MrMike

              The researchers found that private insurers use about 10 percent of premiums for billing, marketing, financial activities and profit. Physician offices spend 14 percent of their income on insurance paperwork, and hospitals spend 9 percent on insurance paperwork. This financial cost to physicians for insurance paperwork is especially high, according to Kahn.

              Of the total insurance premiums used to cover hospital and physician care, this research showed that 21 percent is spent on insurance administration. Another 13 percent is used to cover other administrative tasks. Only 66 percent is used for patient care.

              • Jules

                Your first post implied that the “insurance crooks” were skimming 30%, or that’s how I took it. I buy the 10% admin costs because I used to be a senior undewriter for various insurers and that’s about right. None of these insurers were crooks to be honest with you. And the rates were highly regulated by the state’s department of insurance. These companies weren’t raking it in, believe me. All the health insurers went bankrupt in our state with the exception of two.

                The other administrative costs (by the doctors) are still going to be there with a government plan. How would that go away? There’s still going to be tons of paperwork and regulations to contend with. If they’re not dealing with insurance companies, they’re still dealing with the government. In fact, many docs are quitting/retiring from private practice because the cost of making all their records electronic per Obama’s wishes. It is not worth it to them.

          • MrMike

            Then I found this about the program republicans love to hate (because they can’t get their hands on any management fees).
            http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/07/social_security_administrative.html

            Yikes. Meanwhile, the facts are much as they’ve always been: The administrative costs of the main Social Security program are 0.6 percent of expenditures. The disability insurance program clocks in a bit higher: 2.3 percent. It’s all pretty lean.

            • Jules

              Sorry, I am confused about Republicans and management fees. Huh? Also, Social Security is not equivalent to private healthcare by any means. You would do better to compare the private sector to Medicare, though you can’t get an accurate read on Medicare admin because most fees are hidden and therefore not accounted for. Also, any figures you do get are not comparable to the private sector due to Medicare acceleration of benefits–meaning senior benefits/claims are HUGE because they are older people and need LOTS of care. Therefore, the admin fee PERCENTAGE looks lower because the claims are so much higher than for the younger people covered under regular health plans. So good luck with that comparison.

  • rose

    remember Obama said we should all have the same care as the sen. and congressman in the primary and general.Of course he has changed this and I wouldn’t be so quick to slam unions because I don’t think he has their back either. Being a union member on Disability retirement let me tell you our co pays and prescription plans costs have really gone up quickly.

    I don’t think so many of us in Pa. like Rendell so much .I detest him,he either wants to privatize or cut everything he is no friend to the ordinary citizen.

    Most don’t want Spector so if sestak isn’t an obama robot Pa. would be glad to vote for him. Again not counting Philadelphia.

  • Babs

    I live in PA, in Specter’s district, and along with facing the energy increases if cap and trade passes, we are also facing a deregulation of the electric industry that will raise our electric bills an estimated 30%-50% in the next few years. Sorry, this Dem is going to be pulling the R lever for as long as it takes for these guys to get the message that I do not like anything shoved down my throat without long and hard consideration as to the effects it will have on Main Street. The Dems have failed me miserably. IMHO they will never get the message if even one of them escapes the repudiation they deserve, and I can help relay that message only at the polls.

    • MBC

      I live in PA and I will be pulling the R lever too. Electric cars the size of tuna cans won’t get any of us to work here in PA in the middle of January. That is if we have a job to go to or if we can afford the gas. What are these DumbDems thinking? They need to step outside and see what the real world is dealing with day in and day out.

      • MrMike

        If Obama really cared that bailout money wouldn’t have gone to his Wall Street contributors.
        It would have gone into projects that would help us get to work during those miserable January snow storms.
        I live along the Harrisburg to Philadelphia Amtrak line. There are days you can’t find parking at the stations because that many people use it. The Mount Joy stop doesn’t have any shelter for riders waiting for trains but Obama’s good buddies all got bonuses.

  • jwrjr

    Disclaimer – I don’t live in Pennsylvania. That being said, I would trust Specter about as far as I could throw him.

  • Diana

    Do you mean what was a Democrat?

    It used to stand up for state rights. The people. It was against the nationalization of banks. It believed in regulation to keep greedy corporations/banks from harming the poorest. Lower taxation. Promoting education. Equal rights. The promotion of new ideas. It was for the farmer, the laborer. Taking care of the poorest, by designating programs to help them.

    Now they apparently believe that just because you’re born in a country, that doesn’t mean you have to support it.

    They have no desire to support equal rights, in fact they go out of their way to attack/belittle women, or anyone that doesn’t fit into their agenda. Including members of their own party.

    They’re no longer progressive in their thinking. It’s now the in thing to be racist(unless it’s someone they support. How many times were AA’s called Uncle Tom for not supporting Obama? What was done to Michael Steele), misogynist, against gay rights. I now understand why the term “The Borg” was used.

    After listening to several Republicans on Sarah Palin. What Mr. Buchanan said today…Republicans are no better.

    They’re the ones with all the deregulation crap that allowed financial institutes to become loan sharks, to allow corporations to gorge people, to put just about anything they want to in our food, drinks. Doesn’t matter if it’s killing people. That caused a lot of the messes we’re in now.

    There is no party for women. Neither party is interested in mine, my daughter, or my granddaughters rights or views as a woman. It’s all about what is between our legs. I am more than just a uterus. I am also more than a barefoot pregnant woman who belongs in the kitchen, that you let out from time to time to parade around.

  • steel magnolia

    What Diana said.

  • Peggy Sue

    You’re asking an important question, Linda. What is a Democrat? I’ve been a lifelong Dem, but I don’t have an answer anymore. The Democrat Party was tradionally the party of the little guy, the working man and woman and was dedicated to giving people from all walks of life a fair shake. I don’t see that anymore. They seem to represent their own self-interests and the money that brought them to the party. They don’t speak to me or my values beyond empty lipservice.

    But that doesn’t mean I’m running into the arms of the Republicans, who may have recently found their moral and fiscal center but also flap their lips and say very little. In fact, I remember listening to McCain’s mother say most of the people claiming to represent the Republican Party did not represent her own party definition.

    A lot of us are caught in this no-man’s land with neither party representing ordinary Americans. All we get is trash talk from both sides, hot button issues, and men and women making grandiose promises that they never keep.

    What is a Democrat? I don’t know. But it isn’t me anymore.

    As far as the Pa election. I can tell you this: if I still lived in the area, I wouldn’t touch Arlen Specter with a ten-foot pole. I guess he thought flip-flopping made him a Democrat. Maybe that’s the best definition out there.

  • MrMike

    My understanding is that Obama wants Specter so I’m going to vote for Joe Sestak.
    Then if things don’t change I’ll vote for what ever loon wins the republican primary in the general.

    • MrMike

      I’m thinking this is going to play like the Ned Lamount vs Joementum Lieberman (D-Backstabber) race in Connecticut.
      Remember, you can’t spell Lieberman with out lie. :)

  • NMK

    Ditto on what diana said.

  • helenk

    What is a Democrat?
    After almost 50 years as a registered democrat I left the party this election because they made me ashamed to be called a democrat.
    May 31 2008 the day the democratic party lost any honor, integrity and sense of loyalty to the voters.
    I became an independent. I am from Pa but live in Ca now I if I was back in Pa you could not pay me to vote for Arlen Spector. I am a female old enough to remember his treatment of Anita Hill. Also remember the single bullet idea.
    Diana you said it perfectly.

    WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS

    PUMAS, BUBBAS, EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE

    • carr50

      “May 31 2008 the day the democratic party lost any honor, integrity and sense of loyalty to the voters.”

      I never expected the democratic party to be perfect, but when they proved they are just as corrupt, if not more so, than the republican party, I left the party also. I’ll never be a republican, but I’m just trying to find people in the center, who will stand up for what’s right, not what the party wants.

  • EllenD

    In Canada, the politicians are in the single payer like everyone else.

    • EllenD

      This should have been posted higher – sorry about that.

  • SoCalDem

    Nobody knows any more. I only know that they don’t speak for me. The RBC meeting was the last straw for this armed and bitter church going old woman.

    Country before Party!!

  • wbboei

    THE REAL GAME

    War is a game of deception. So too is politics.
    Case in point: Barack Obama. He presents himself as one thing. In reality, he is quite another. Consider the following:

    First, Obama claims to be the antecote for Bush. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his failure to end the Iraq War? his expansion of the war in Afghanistan? his expressed intention to create an army within the United States? his failure to investigate possible war crimes?

    Second, Obama promises to provide transparency in government. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his use of signing statements? his planted questions to the press? his serial threats toward super delegates and now Congress? his secret liasons with business lobbyists, daily access by GE?

    Third, Obama claims to be a liberal. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his reversal on wire tapping? his plan to regulate the internet?
    his support for anti gay groups? his support of big business over constituents?

    Fourth, Obama claims to support private enterprise. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his tax program on small business? his protection of unions over investors? his takeover of detroit? 31 year old car czar? his pressuring solvent banks to accept TARP funds?

    Fifth, Obama presents himself as lord protector of the Constitution. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his exhoneration of the mayor of Sacramento who embezzled stimulus monies? his exhoneration of members of the New Black Panther party for voter intimidation? his refusal by the DNC to investigate 2000 cases of voter fraud and intimidation in the primary? his reliance upon and subsequent funding of ACORN despite its mutiple violations of election laws which are a matter of record. He speaks of holding power 14 years from now, despite the 2 term Amendment prohibiting same.

    Sixth, Obama pretends to be a Platonic guardian of our country with superior judment, which trumps experience. But if that is true, then how does one explain: his constant change in policy positions?
    his excessive reliance upon a teleprompter, and the profound wisdom of a 27 year old speechwriter? his promotion of foreign policies inimical to our security and economic policies which will bankrupt the country, and increase the liklihood of foreign control over our lives?

    In sum, what we have here is a politican who claims to be a bona fide liberal, the antecdote to Bush, the soul of transparency, supporter of small business and protector of the Constitution. In fact, he is something radically different.

    The chasm between Obama’s words and deeds is wider than the Grand Canyon. Consider the people who voted for him. Many of them do not notice how far he has drifted. They like the brand and that is as far as they go. If you ask they say he needs more time. Those who do notice, are disappointed, but they cannot bring themselves to repudiate him because he is black and is better than Bush.

    You can wait until the Republicans field a candidate who can compete with his celebrity. You can wait for Hillary to claim the role that was rightfully hers–and hope that this happens. You can spend your time talking about what he is not–and preaching to the choir.

    Or you can talk about what he is. And that is the answer to everyones dilemma. Conservatives do not need to waste time levelling the false charge that he is a liberal. The liberals do not need to wrestle with their conscience over what he says vs what he does. And big media can begin asking the right questions, but that will be the last fort to fall.

    The pertinent question, then, is who is Obama–if not the carefully crafted figure we see? The answer to that question is the key to his defeat. Why? Because empires fall when their message no longer explains what is happening in terms of reality. Here are the undeniable facts:

    1. Obama is a product of the Chicago Political Machine. (Hint: the new paradigm is to see him through that lens rather than the false image which he projects through his big media complicit propaganda campaign. That is the beginning of wisdom)

    2. The Chicago Political Machine controls all aspects of political life down to the Ward level. Obama now controls state political parties through the DNC. At the end of the primary, the DNC was moved to Chicago, and threatened the state parties whose voters supported Hillary overwhelmingly.

    3. The Chicago Political Machine runs on patronage and graft. It has it enforcers and its corrupt politicians. The machine protects them. By the same token, Obama has the New Black Panthers, the Mayor of Sacramento both of whom committed crimes and were let off the hook by his Attorney General Eric Holder.

    4. The Chicago Machine has its foot soldiers who corrupt the voting process. Obama has ACORN. And he has ensured that they have funding and will be involved in census taking. This gives his machine more information to take over.

    5. The Chicago Machine has its Ward Chairmen who control city government. They are fiercely loyal to the Mayor. Nothing moves without the Mayors say. Obama has set up a similar system with his army of 33 Czars who control all aspects of the economy. They exist over and above his cabinet, which has had only one meeting since he took office. Foreign policy is run out of the White House as opposed to the State Department. Finally, it is hardly a coincidence that the two kingpins who run the White House for Obama–Axelrod and Emanuel are both scions of the Chicago Machine. It is seamless.

    6. The Chicago Machine leeches power from other institutions of government. Likewise, Obama seeks to undermine the powers of Congress. This can be seen in his claim of right to enact treaties without congressional oversight, and his use of Czars who are not suboenable by Congress.

    7. The Chicago Machine eliminates political competition, and allows big business, democrats and republicans to share in the graft. Likewise, Obama moves to neutralize Republican opposition by offering them seats in his cabinet and promoting weak Republicans like Governor Crist as what as an example of how the opposition should behave, even as Crist pays homage and begs for a piece of the action. Finally, Obama has an open door to big business, the head of GE is one of his eight advisors, and GE is a major beneficiary of the CAP and Trade and Health Care iniatives in exhange for their media support during the campaign.

    I could go on but I think you have got the picture. Obama is the vehicle through which the Chicago Machine is going nationwide. That is the political model if you will. It is the single unifying explantion for most everything you see.

    The downsides of this model are rather obvious. It makes a mockery of patriotism, and is a parastic force which bleeds the people dry and reward corruption. If the people of this country cannot stand up against that, then our future is bleak.

    The way to stand up is to do what Emile Zola did: Jaccuuz! Barack Obama, you sir are a tool of the Chicago Machine and your goal is to take it national and reward the few at the expense of the many. This is not some rock video, this is reality, and by your actions not your words you have told us who you really are and where you are taking us.

    We will fight you because we know there are hopeful paths to the future, as Hillary proposed. There are other paths–those proposed by Obama, which lead onl to despair and from which no one ever returns.

    Finally, the public today has been so bamboozled by Obama and his bread and circuses act that we must come up with an agreed to set of criteria by which the American People will evaluate their fitness for office, and future debates should center around these criteria, among them: i) a willingness to put country over party, ii) a proper regard for the separation of powers, iii) an insistence upon the separation of church and state, iv) a renewed appreciation for the inherent value of experience, vi) a proper balance between the private and public sector, v) a rejection big media which rejects the truth and censors relevant information, etc.

    If Obama is allowed to continue building this Chicago Machine nationwide, and disaster hits then anarchy will follow–sure as night follows day.

    • tzada

      Great post. You ought to be a writer, but then maybe you already are.

    • trixta

      Certainly, wbboei, Obama is a product of the Chicago machine, as you say, but he is also a fascist tool. Indeed, he is Phase II of the corporatist / fascist take-over of this country (GWB being Phase I), only this time instead of Haliburton and Energy pulling the levers, it is the bankers and Wall Street who are managing their puppet president behind the curtain.

    • Word Police

      A very nice essay, wbboei. And I agree with most of what you have written.

      I have only one criticism. As a writer, you should have checked to make sure you were using the correct word when referencing Obama being the “antecdote” to Bush.

      Antidote = 1. a medicine or other remedy for counteracting the effects of poison, disease, etc.
      2. something that prevents or counteracts injurious or unwanted effects: Good jobs are the best antidote to teenage crime.

      Anecdote = a short account of a particular incident or event of an interesting or amusing nature, often biographical.

      Everyone should bookmark this link:

      http://dictionary.reference.com

      Hope this helps. Have a nice day. :)

  • Karma

    Since it is an open thread.

    I read on the ticker at the bottom of FoxNews that the ‘Car Czar’ resigned with hints of a ‘pay to play’ scandal brewing prior to this czar appointment.

    A few days prior one of the auto execs was praising the guy for basically coming up to speed so fast. Since he wasn’t a car guy on any level.

    What happened?

    • Karma

      http://www.alternet.org/workplace/140441/how_obama‘s_’car_czar’_steve_rattner_is_bankrupting_gm/

      Just to remind us of some of his recent work…..pay off the banks first.

      We all saw who was Obama’s biggest supporters.

      • tzada

        Obama Opposes House Plan to Protect Chrysler, GM Dealerships

        July 15 (Bloomberg) — President Barack Obama “strongly opposes” an effort in Congress to require General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC to restore relationships shed during bankruptcy proceedings, while stopping short of a veto threat.

        The administration said today in a statement that “the decision by Chrysler and GM to rationalize their dealer networks was a critical part of their overall restructuring to achieve long-term viability in order to save jobs in the long run.”

        http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aioxPp9w.vzM

  • wbboei

    This Spector thing is morbid. He is in terrible health. But he is so determined to hang on to power that he puts that single goal ahead of life, loyalty and political party. Even if Joe Sestak were not the great leader he is, a credit to our country, and a Hillary supporter, I would still want him over the Spector. Spector has nothing to offer, and the deal he has with Obama is a faustian pact for both parties. I intend to support Sestak for all those reasons.

  • FrenchNail

    What is a Democrat?

    Something I do not want to be called anymore.

  • tzada

    Years ago when I was young and naive I read an article on the NWO. In it the claim was made that there was no difference in the Democrats or the Republicans. That the whole scheme was like a bird with both wings part of the same body and guided by it. Truth to tell I now understand that what I thought was beyond belief may be true.

    “They” groom people from both parties and don’t really care which side wins, because they “own” them anyhow.
    In my opinion,right now what we are seeing are the MSM and Congress trying to ingratiate themselves with what is “behind the curtain” in order to secure themselves a place in what will emerge as the NWO.

    Some of them are fooling themselves. They will be eliminated once their usefulness is over. Far fetched? I certainly hope and pray that my thoughts are just nightmares and I will awake and it is 1776 again.

    • Carmen

      You are so right. What is a democrat? There is no democrat any more. Now they call themselves “progressives” ie. COMMUNISTS! Same there is no Republican either. The earlier writer was correct, except everywhere they have Chicago machine, should be substituted one world order communists.
      Glen Beck is laying it out step by step every day on his show. Today he is playing the fireside chat of Roosevelt where he layed out the communist steps he wanted to take to “make us all comfortable”. They were defeated by our more intelligent, and still awake grandparents. So he tried to stack the supreme court, which too was stopped.
      They sound so strangly familiar. They tried to establish a new “bill of rights” that we should all have the RIGHT to A job, enough food and recreation, to sell your crops for a “fair” price without interference of the market, freedom from monopolies, the RIGHT to a decent place to live (hello Fannie and Freddie, and Obama as landlord) and (wait for it) thats right, the RIGHT to health care! There are more, but I cant remember them all right now. 7 total I think Glen said.
      He also played the audio of Roosevelts agriculture minister whom he forced to meet with the Russian leader who after the meeting gave a speech where he reported the Russian told him that his grandchildren would be communist. That soon there would be no Democrat or Republican. That Americans were so asleep that they would not notice the little drips of socialism until one day they woke up and were totally communist.
      I dont know about you guys, but I am WIDE AWAKE! We cannot trust either side now. Politicians have to be chosen on their absolute love of country and constitution. We have to yell at the bums in office every day and tell them what we want and maybe we can slow them down enough to get to an election, maybe we will have to take other steps first. Everyone should be making plans to be in Washington on 9/12. Millions of us have to show up and make our demands known or consequences from the people will be coming.
      Obama touts that the people want health care. Sure, if you say do you want a free dog, people will say yes. If you say, do you want to give up your liberty, and freedom and I will run your lives from cradle to grave and tell you what to do you might get a different answer.

    • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

      It took the propaganda of the 2008 election to wake me up and see that the NWO stuff is true. Obama is a puppet and most definitely expanding on what Bush started. It is so obvious now. My liberal friends can’t see it because they aren’t paying close enough attention and get swayed by his progressive platitudes.

  • I’m a Linda too

    My position…..I gave a donation as soon as I heard he was thinking about jumping in. Then when I received another email in updates asking for more contributions, I sent it to my family. lol My one sister wrote back “he sounds great, I just sent my donation”.

    Joe sounds like basic hard core Democratic principles. No guarantees for the future, as we see from these politicians, but here, now, he has the pluses.

    Go Jooooe!

  • Docelder

    According to Obama’s science czar, traditional families are obsolete. I wonder if traditional America is just as obsolete?

    President Obama’s Science Czar, John Holdren, took a controversial and amoral approach to the science of population by recommending mass compulsory sterilization and even forced abortion (and/or forced marriages) under certain circumstances.

    Wow, and some were worried about losing abortion rights just a few months ago… how about marriage and or procreation rights? Now… who wants a H1N1 flu shot by the way? ;)

    http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/More-Holdren-Traditional-family-is-obsolete-50807107.html

  • Docelder

    Pravda’s take on manmade global warming the coming ice age.

    The main flaw in the AGW theory is that its proponents focus on evidence from only the past one thousand years at most, while ignoring the evidence from the past million years — evidence which is essential for a true understanding of climatology.

    The reason that global CO2 levels rise and fall in response to the global temperature is because cold water is capable of retaining more CO2 than warm water.

    Because the release of CO2 by the warming oceans lags behind the changes in the earth’s temperature, we should expect to see global CO2 levels continue to rise for another eight hundred years after the end of the earth’s current Interglacial warm period.

    Well, it does sound like there are actual scientists out there besides Al Gore who are looking at this who don’t have any interest in the carbon exchange scheme. Anybody who thinks countries like Russia and China are getting on this bandwagon with us needs to think again.

    http://english.pravda.ru/science/earth/106922-1/

  • Katmoon

    FYI Since this is an open thread:

    July 16, 2009
    A letter from the Tea Party Patriots National Coordinator Team:

    ‘Health Care Freedom Protests’ Set for July 17
    Tea party patriots will gather all across the country to demonstrate against ObamaCare.

    Source: http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/health-care-freedom-protests-set-for-july-17th/

  • http://www.commongroundpolitics.net Common Ground Politics

    A related discussion:

    “What is a Liberal?”

    http://www.commongroundpolitics.net/discussion/showthread.php?t=41762

  • http://www.commongroundpolitics.net Common Ground Politics

    Can you say something positive about your least favorite politician?!

    http://www.commongroundpolitics.net/discussion/showthread.php?t=47231

  • Carmen

    Page 16 of the health insurance bill states that after it becomes law it will be ILLEGAL for private insurers to write ANY new policies!
    No this is not communisim. You can keep your insurance if you like it. This will not put private insurance out of business.

    OBAMA IS A COMMUNIST, AND HE IS LYING TO US!
    Get your heads out of your ass and start marching at the tea parties, and go to Washington on 9/12 with us.

  • TexasMirth

    Carmen – you are absolutely right – on both your points.
    Now…will someone here please take on Barbara Boxer?
    What a buffoon she looked like trying to put the Black Chamber of Commerce, President and CEO Harry Alford in “his place.” This thread’s title is WHAT IS A DEMOCRAT? Well, watch Boxer and see how condescension looks coming from that Democrat:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FoekBjhtWE&feature=related

  • Seattle Moss

    Obama and his minions fail to understand the central concept of life…Darwinism!
    Survival of the fittest!

    In foreign policy Obama has shown a profound weakness and ignorance that emboldens our enemies and ignores the Darwinist concept of peace through strength.

    Obama’s economic policy also ignores Darwinism with a unilateral cap and trade and surcharges on wealth at a time of collapse.

    As you all know…I’m as hard core Darwinist!

    Last year when I saw the collapse coming I marshaled my forces to bring business to my manufacturing by approaching the Canadians. Sure enough earlier this year my plant was down 30% in business. With a little positioning and timing I was able to predict the dollar easing in value which has led to an avalanche in orders from the Canadians.

    Folks..I’m now EVEN for the year running the plant 24/7.

    The Darwinism part of this…My competition who never thought where the next sale was to come from are down considerably with the real prospect of going out of business.
    I have been putting the screws on them for many years but this is now the game changer. If this is the case I will gain what’s left of their business and buy up their equipment for pennies on the dollar.

    • TeakWoodKite

      Much continued success to you Seattle Moss.

      I think Bo Pelosi and gang escaped from a certian island and will not be a part of evolution.

      • Seattle Moss

        Thanks teak,
        We all remember who we were talking to back during those scary days of December.
        We have only seen the beginning of the shake down in the economy and the elites that are in control now.

        Mankind sits on the precipice of history.

        Either we embrace the technology that allows us to be born and support 6 billion people or we turn our backs on our advance and allow mankind to implode and the glaciers to advance which it surely would without the products which act as a barriers to nature that allow people to live.

        • TeakWoodKite

          Seattle Moss, what is most distrubing is that this shakedown cannot be sustained. When this house of cards comes tumbelin down I want to be in a position were Darwin is my friend.

          I recall reading were the collective farms in the former Soviet Union were being bought by international companies who brought in mechinized farming. The people who farmed this land as part of the collective can not compete.

          They were left with the small potatoes. I am not saying they should be displaced nor given unfair advantage or subsidies, just a fair shot.

          BO and his circus are international but with out the equipment.