“Deathers.” That’s what those of us who have read the 1,000 plus pages of the latest bill and have problems with it are to be called now? H’mm, sort of like when I worked for Hillary Clinton and was called a racist.

We need health care reform. Badly! But this bill is a mess. Even Democrats have said that you need 2 lawyers to understand it. It is so vague in so many places that you can interpret it however you want.

Well, tell you what. Let’s meet here in a year and see what’s what. If I owe you an apology, I will give it willingly and sincerely. But I believe it will be you who will be telling me that maybe I was on to something back then.

Or do you just take it upon yourselves to spread complete utter falsehoods? I guess Pat, we would consider you one of the “Deathers” conspiracy people. Frankly, it is despicable that people like you are shilling for the health insurance industry. A few trying to destroy a very important reform for our nation by spreading falsehoods or at the minimum not doing the work to know what they are talking about or presenting all sides of the story. I know this fits into your and NQ’s trash Obama no matter what narrative, but this is ridiculous, given this very important issue.

“Deathers point to several parts of the House bill as evidence that health care reform means letting old people die. Most prominent is the end-of-life consultation provision mentioned above. An article on World Net Daily argues that the proposal “specifically calls for the consultation to recommend ‘palliative care and hospice’ for seniors in their mandatory counseling sessions.” In fact, the bill says the meeting must include “an explanation by the practitioner of the end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice”—not a recommendation of it. Still, Obama pointed out that it’s not too late to remove the language: “If this is something that really bothers people, I suspect that members of Congress might take a second look at it.”

Another seemingly scary provision is one that permits “the use of artificially administered nutrition and hydration”—or, more accurately, the withholding of it. Some think the provision is a disturbing example of the government making decisions for the patient. But the bill specifically says that an order to withhold, say, an IV drip, must be one that “effectively communicates the individual’s preferences regarding life sustaining treatment, including an indication of the treatment and care desired by the individual.” In other words, a doctor can’t make you do it.

Yet another bugaboo is “shared decision-making.” The House bill would establish a program that “provide[s] patients with information about trade-offs among treatment options, and facilitates the incorporation of patient preferences and values into the medical plan.” The legislation makes clear that this is an educational tool to help patients make informed decisions about whether a treatment is likely to help.”

http://www.slate.com/id/2223754

I’m done. If I don’t like it, I’m not supporting it, period, and you guys can wail about how I don’t understand the severity of the crisis all you want. Believe me, I understand all too well. So? You don’t want me stubborn and digging in my heels, congress? Then stop giving me the choice of “Nothing or Crap – take yer pick.” in order to browbeat me into picking CRAP.

I’ve decided not to play by those rules anymore. I can and I WILL start choosing “Nothing”, until you morons start doing your damn jobs.

It’s a hard call but, I know of one hospice fined a million dollars for keeping patients on for a few weeks past the six month cut off…funding is not provided for it but, they did bill medicare anyway….they should not have done that but, it’s NOT as cut and dried as some claim.

Also, under Obamacare, medicare and medicaid ARE being cut and hospices are already letting medical social workers go and cutting medical staff. Even those who voted for the jerk are afraid for their jobs right now. So no hospice care??? Where will those in the dying process and their families go??? HOW will end of life care be paid for???

There was no good way to do this except cover everybody…it will not work Obama’s way but, he’s pandering to the lobbiest who will benefit from this enormously.

You can have a two tiered system with dental, physio in some cases and eye care say being with private insurers and everything else being public medicine. I’ve lived all over the place and my family are mostly all medical care providers in the U.S…..the scare mongering about the Canadian health care system is laughable…we need a similar system or there is NO WAY IN HELL it will even resemble something that will work best for most Americans.

Obamacare is not national health care for all..it’s bullshit wrapped in the language of “health care” as usual Obama using “words” with no meaning behind them. He has not got a clue what he’s doing and on this score a lot of people are going to suffer for it. Not only that but, anything even coming CLOSE to Hillarycare will not ever get passed now because Obama will screw things up SO badly that HIS example will be pointed to in the future as an example of “what might happen by the same people who brought you Harry and Louise.

*sigh* Can this GET anymore fucked up?? The question is rhetorical because with Obama YES IT CAN!!

Before you suggest that I am a scare-mongering right-wingnut plant, please read the full text for yourself. (That will be more than many members of the House are apparently willing to do.) If you can’t fully understand it, you are not alone. It reads as ominous and intrusive in a muddled, sneaky sort of way, and it scares the shit out of me!

You are a gentle soul, who always is considerate of others.

However FACTS make this the scariest thing ever. And I am a tough old Yankee from NH who does not care easily, and I am terrified – given what Obama and his “Health Advisory Board” have planned.

Pat is 100% RIGHT – read the damn thing with a lined pad and pen in hand so you can take notes and try and get a full comprehensive picture.

True, these AARP VIPs may be wealthy elitists, but don’t assume that means they are Republicans – most are “inside the beltway” Democrats and most donated heavily to Obama’s campaigns. In effect, ultra-lib Dems appear to have hi-jacked the AARP years ago, and exploit the elderly members into backing Lefty policies –same as the DNC was hijacked. Get it now?

http://www.verumserum.com/?p=6253&cpage=1

In 2007, the AARP joined forces with the Service Employee International Union (SEIU), led by Andy Stern, to launch a $60+ million promotional campaign called “Divided We Fail” to advance an agenda within their membership base centered around universal healthcare. And while the AARP ostensibly claims to be non-partisan, the SEIU makes no such pretense. In fact they are solidly behind the President’s health reform plans including the public insurance “option”.

Commenter writes:
AARP backs Government programs; they are afraid of losing their tax-exempt status.
AARP is only interested in selling insurance; AARP President makes more than President of U.S.
AARP is only interested in making money off seniors; they will not confront Obama.
Where do you go?
http://www.seniors league; phone 202-776-0640 might be an answer.