Is Barack Eligible to be President?

Here is an excellent site for US Citizenship Law.

http://www.aca.ch/hisuscit.htm

I believe the requirement, that Ann Dunham be 21 in order to give birth to a ‘citizen’ will hold.

Additionally, in 1961 Barack Hussein Obama would not have been considered a US Citizen at the time of his birth. Citizenship was passed down by the Father.

From Wikipedia:

Birthright citizenship in the United States of America follows from the rule of jus soli, whereby any person born within the United States and subject to its jurisdiction is automatically granted U.S. citizenship.[1] This status is unaffected by the legal status or the citizenship of that individual’s mother or father. Children born to foreign diplomats or to hostile enemy forces or born on U.S. territory while it is under the control of a foreign power are not considered subject to U.S. jurisdiction and therefore are not citizens at birth.

Unfortunately his citizenship is a non-issue.

Hey Larry –

I believe what this paragraph..

No person except a natural born citizen, OR A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President, etc.

..truly means is that at the time of writing the constitution, anyone who was a citizen at that time could be President, as there were many citizens who were not born in the country when the constitution was written.

The sentence does not pertain to “anyone” who is a citizen in the here and now.

Peace

It appears to be stating: or a citizen at the signing of the Constitution – ie, back then MANY were not born here but helped found the country. That appears to be the singular exception – and though barry often seems to get lost in time warps, this is indeed a LONG time since then.

HILLARY supporters, join in a timely personal thanks to her here:

http://unityindiversity-spiritedpolitics.blogspot.com

(Also link up with new central ACTION site.)

On November 23, 1993, President Clinton signed United States Public Law 103-150, which not only acknowledged the illegal actions committed by the United States in the overthrow of the legitimate government of Hawaii, but also that the Hawaiian people never surrendered their sovereignty. The latter is the most important part of United States Public Law 103-150 for it makes it quite clear that the Hawaiian people never legally ceased to be a sovereign separate independent nation. There is no argument that can change that fact.

United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.

In 1999, the United Nations confirmed that the plebiscite vote that led to Hawaii’s statehood was in violation of article 73 of the United Nations’ charter. The Hawaii statehood vote, under treaty then in effect, was illegal and non-binding. (The same is true of the Alaska plebiscite).

Larry, I’ve researched this. I don’t know who this Katherine is, but she’s a fool.

Federal law, not state law, determines United States citizenship. Obama was born on US soil, several years after Hawaii became a state.

That is that.

Even if we grant, hypothetically, the oft-heard (but absolutely un-proven) claim that Obama was actually born in Kenya, he is still a citizen.

The law you quote…

“If only one parent was a U.S. Citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least FIVE of which had to be after the age of 16.”

…is NOT “Hawaiian state” law. These words come from the federal Immigration and Nationality Act as it read between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986.

The new law, 8 U.S.C. 1401, Sec. 301(g), reads:

“…a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years…”

Obama’s mother clearly qualifies.

Now, I know what you are going to say: “But that’s the NEW law! We have to go by the wording of the law in effect when Obama was born…”

Nope. Here’s the part of 8 U.S.C. 1401, Sec. 301(g) that everyone ignores:

“This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date”

Barack Obama is a natural-born citizen, and it does not matter if he was born in Hawaii, Kenya, or Mars.

By all means, double-check my work. You know how to use Google.

On November 23, 1993, President Clinton signed United States Public Law 103-150, which not only acknowledged the illegal actions committed by the United States in the overthrow of the legitimate government of Hawaii, but also that the Hawaiian people never surrendered their sovereignty. The latter is the most important part of United States Public Law 103-150 for it makes it quite clear that the Hawaiian people never legally ceased to be a sovereign separate independent nation. There is no argument that can change that fact.

United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.

In 1999, the United Nations confirmed that the plebiscite vote that led to Hawaii’s statehood was in violation of article 73 of the United Nations’ charter. The Hawaii statehood vote, under treaty then in effect, was illegal and non-binding. (The same is true of the Alaska plebiscite).

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/HAWAII/hawaii.html

HAWAII is not a STATE therefore…

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/HAWAII/hawaii.html

Why does this law apply?

HAWAII is not a LEGALLY recognized STATE!

ck this out…..

http://www.hcsfjm.com/sowell.html

Except at one point someone thought his citizenship was Indonesian. . .was it?

Yep, I think that’s what it means. It would be clearer if they removed the comma, like this:

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible . .

But they had different rules of punctuation then.

Also, this is from the XIV Amendment:

1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

If Barack, Jr. was born in the United States, he’s automatically made a citizen regardless of the status of his parents.

Where did his birth actually take place? I thought it was in Indonesia, in which case he was not born on US soil, which would open the way for the other questions raised (age of his mother).
If he was born on US soil, those other things may be non-issues.
Where was he born?
Whatever the answer, he has to be pushed to release his birth certificate. It’s a basic requirement.

He does have dual citizenship….

Ok maybe there is nothing to this all but I think the DNC needs to SLOW DOWN …..

I this—-I am not a Constitutional scholar (nor is Barack for that matter).

I meant to say—I love this—I am not a Constitutional scholar (nor is Barack for that matter).

He is a citizen by all legal rights as stated above. He is eligible to be President, which is not to say that he is qualified to lead the country!!

Why is he running for President at this point in his career? Is it because he thought he could beat a woman? I dont get it — if he were so great, he could have waited his turn and done some apprenticeship, to prove his ability to the American people. I am mostly opposed to his inexperience.

1966 Act of November 6, 1966 (80 Stat. 1322), amended Section 301 (a) (7) of the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952 to read as follows:

“Section 301 (a) (7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided*, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 1 of the International Organizations Immunities Act (59 Stat. 669; 22 U.S.C. 288) by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or (B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 1 of the International Organizations Immunities Act, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date.

If Barack Hussein Obama was born Kenya then he is Kenyan. If he was born on Mars then hes Martion. Only if hes born in The United States of America(Bases Included) Is he considered a Natural born US Citizen….

Ahhhh,

All is right with the world. The Lakers won. Tiger makes a beautiful putt on 18 for birdie and all the NQ folks are STILL grasping at straws.

Life is GRAND

IMPORTANT….I AM TRYING TO FIND THIS PETITION….I got this reply to a post I had made …Pass it along to all you know…I don’t know why no dems have signed this…but if it is true we must contact our rep and tell them to get on board

Message:
remember to get out and tell people to call write congress, to get them to sign the petition for broadcaster act, mike fence has , he only needs 20 sig, no dem has signed it…its very important for our freedom of speech, they are trying to stop our choice of tv, and radio, and soon the net! this is urgent, so he can bring to the floor, the fairness doctrine is not fair it will allow any president to select what we can listen to or talk about…we know what selectiveness can lead to! the dnc has showed us that first hand! so have the environmentalists! remember obama wishes the prices didnt go up so fast! he wishes it was a slower increase, it caused to much attention to them, im sure they didnt plan that. the scheme to keep us paying the middle east our money and not using our resources, the ethanol scheme, will make many who are already hungry much worse off, those wonderful global greenies!

Commerce Clause ruling.

the 14th admendment gave natural citizen for anyone who was born on American soil because of slavery. That is because before 1865 the slaves were not considered citizens. That is why if you are born here then you are a citizen.

State law doesn’t govern citizenship.

The Constitution does.

The Immigration and Nationality Act is the applicable law.

Sec. 305.[8 U.S.C. 1405] A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.

Obama is a citizen.

Lincoln had far less experience than Obama.

It’s pretty obvious that his parents weren’t married when he was born, and mostly no one gives a rip about that any more. Speculation will only grow as to what else he’s trying to hide.

Stanley’s little mistake needs to release his REAL birth certificate, pronto.

The constitution just gives the framework. Legislative law provides the details.

He was not born in Indonesia – his mother did not marry and Indonesian man or move there until Obama was in grade school. he was born in Hawaii, he is a US citizen and Hawaii does NOT release birth records of its residents under many circumstances….hence, this rumor that he would not release his birth certificate started.

When people run for president, don’t they have to present documents that prove that they are eligible?

If so, who do they present them too?

I would think someone would be in charge.

But, in this election, it seems that no one is in charge, because Obama gets away with everything.

I would also like to know just what exactly does the FEC do besides petitions and money monitors.

As frustrating as the MI and FL voting was, and as dysfunctional, and what seemed to be unconstitutional, you would have thought the FEC would have played a role some how.

The people have the right to have fair representation of their vote.

I am off topic a little or a lot, but again, who does the candidate present his or her birth certificate or proof of citizenship to?

I do not know the answer………

Not true. Citizenship is not passed down by one’s father, not then, not ever.

Citizenship is based on having one parent who is a citizen or being born in the US.

And state law has nothing to do with whether you’re a US citizen.

LJ probably knows this and is just trying to spread another absurd rumor.

The law can’t contradict the Constitution. That dates back to the 1803 Marbury v. Madison case.

Good Old Chauncey here!

There’s no age requirement for the mother.

This approach of continually throwing stuff at the wall to see what will stick is entertaining, but generally a waste of time. Issue-based debate is healthy, but “gee, if only this were true, then that would be true” doesn’t convince anyone other than the already convinced. Just sayin…

Very silly. Hawaii is a state. It elects people to sit in Congress, it pays taxes, it has electoral votes, we have 50 states and it is one of them.

Nope. His mother was a citizen so he’s a citizen. And that’s true whether he was born in the US or not.

Hawaii was added as a state when again?

US citizenship is a federal issue, governed by the Constitution and applicable federal law. Obama is a citizen.

With all due respect to the late great President Lincoln, the world we live in today is far more dangerous and complicated than it was during his presidency. One needs MORE experience today in order to deal with the complexities one is faced with as POTUS. I highly doubt that we would find President Lincoln electable at all considering what is demanded of one in that office. This is obviously a ridiculous argument when given realistic comparison.

It doesn’t matter where he was born. If you went overseas and gave birth, your kid would be a citizen as long as you are a citizen.

I have a friend who gave birth in Germany. Her son is a citizen because she (the mom) is a citizen.

1959

We are speaking of Hawaii, a fairly young state, and the law as it pertained to Hawaii up until 1986.

Well I don’t give a damn where this nutwinger was born, to me he’s no American.

His mother is a citizen so he is a citizen.

Read the article.

If this goes before the Supreme Court how would they decide?

“United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.”

Barry Dunham would not have the same cachet.

Is this current law or law in 1961 with respect to a newly formed state?

OKAY FOLKS….WRITE OR CALL YOU REPRESENTATIVES…FROM WHAT I READ THIS IS BASICALLY A BILL WHERE THE GOVERMENT CONTROLS WHO IS ON THE AIRWAVES…THIS IS IMPORTANT…HE IS A LINE I TOOK OUT OF ARICLE….THIS ALSO IS A BILL TO BASICALLY SHUT DOWN TALK RADIO

QUOTE:

“The Broadcaster Freedom Act would ensure that no future president could regulate the airwaves of America without an act of Congress but it has yet to be scheduled for a vote.

WHILE YOU ARE AT IT TELL CONGRESSMEN THAT ABOUT ///ENDORSE OBAMA..YOU GET NO VOTE

ABOUT BIRTH CERTIFICATE….ACCORDING TO A STANDFORD LAW PROFESSOR WHEN OBAMA WAS BORN “BOTH” OF HIS PARENTS HAD TO BE AMERICAN, PLUS THE HOSPITAL IN HAWAII HAD NO RECORD OF HIS MOTHER HAING HIM THERE. RUMOR IS HE WAS BORN AND KENYA AND HIS MOTHER FLEW BACK AND THEN DAYS LATER WENT TO HOSPITAL. READ ALL ABOUT IT ON HILLARY CLINTON SUPPORTERS FOR JOHN MCCAIN…..ARTICLE IS ON FRONT PAGE OF SITE…www,hcsfjm.com

1790 First Congress, Act of March 26th, 1790, 1 Stat. 103.

“And the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond the sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States”.

Obama is corrupt.

It stuck, mkay?

States have ZERO say over who becomes a US citizen.

Obama’s mother was born in Kansas to two US born american citizens and was therefore a full-fledged citizen. Her child would be also regardless of who was the father.

I know you want to find a way to rule out Obama but you’ve got to do better than this!

Yes I also believe it is one of the 58 states.

Question still stands, why won’t Bambi produce a real birth certificate and not some graphic designed one that isn’t worth a damn?

Compare here the phoney vs the real one:

http://obamafact.blogspot.com/2008/06/lies-deception-and-who-is-fool.html

All Bambi needs do is produce the real Certificate of Live Birth and put this issue to rest, question is, why won’t he?

SORRY…TYPING TOO FAST…SHOULD SAY THE HOSPITAL SHOWS NOT RECORD OF HIS MOTHER HAVING HIM THERE, HE WAS BROUGHT IN DAYS LATER..THAT IS WHY THERE IS NO DOCTOR’S NAME ON IT

Please do a little more research and find out if Obama has dual citizenship because that could be another problem. Since his father was a Kenyan citizen and never a legal resident of the United States it is quite possible that he may have Kenyan citizenship also. There are several government sites regarding dual citizenship that plainly point out the conflict of interest and the responsibilities to the other country. I don’t think we want a president with divided loyalties which is why the requirement for president states emphatically “natural born Citizen“.

And I’ve checked the same sites as Joseph Cannon and there is much more legal information regarding the citizenship laws than he has quoted. I doubt anyone but an immigration lawyer would know for sure if Obama is or is not a citizen of the U. S. because Obama was born 1961 and Hawaii became a state in 1959.

Puget, was your name hijacked a couple of days ago?

DIAF

Ok then just produce the birth certificate with all the vital information—Hospital name, doctors name and etc.

I have been listening to too many many lies from this guy. Maybe this is a rumor, but his track record is not good.

“Barack’s mother registered his birth a few days after he was born. She listed the hospital in Hawaii where he was supposedly born.
That hospital has no record that his mother was there. This has fueled speculation that Barack was actually born in Kenya, and that his parents rushed back to the United States to register his birth fraudulently so that Barack would be able to enjoy life as a US citizen.” http://www.hcsfjm.com/sowell.html

If the above is true then there is a problem.
When Obama was born; home births did not happen, especially to an 18 year old, and in Hawaii.
Yes they did happen in 3rd world countries like Kenya.

I guess the stakes are going up—I’d like to see Obama’s regular birth certificate and his mother’s passport in reference to her travels around the time of his birth.
If she traveled to Kenya within one of two months prior to Obama’s birth then it is very likely she wasnt allowed back on a plane until after.
Back then they were Very strict about women traveling in their 7th, 8th and 9th months on planes.

it has been posted. Here is a copy of it.

http://my.barackobama.com/page/invite/birthcert

“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”

Section 1 of the 14th Amendment. Supreme law of the land. If Hawaii was part of the United States when Obama was born there, end of story – on that point, Hawaii’s state law is irrelevant. And anyone who has ever studied Civil War or civil rights history should have no problem understanding why.

That part of the 14th Amendment even makes children of unauthorized immigrants “natural-born citizens,” if they are born on U.S. soil. It has led to some controversy in the immigration policy context, because some people allege that parents cross illegally to deliver “anchor babies.” Being natural-born citizens, such babies can never be deported, and – the argument goes – DHS usually leaves the parents alone as well.

As far as a lawsuit, well, anyone can file a federal complaint. On the other hand, any federal judge can impose sanctions for frivolous filings.

No at one time women who were US citizens LOST their US citizenship if they married a non citizen. A few of my female ancestors married immigrants — non citizens in the 18th century — in the census they are listed as born in American and they remained non-citizens until their husbands became citizens.

This law has been changed (I don’t remember the year the change went into effect).

Women a FEW rights — their fathers, brothers and/or husbands were similar to the legal guardians of women.

Marriages were recorded in Colonial times because marriage was a legal contract which involved real estate and movable estate/goods.

Until fairly recently in the last century women could not take out loans in their own names — they needed the PERMISSION of husbands, fathers and/or brothers.

THIS is one of the reasons why the ERA — Equal Rights amendment is so necessary.

But back to the subject — women who married non US citizens lost their citizenship until the husband became a Naturalized citizen.

Genealogists need to know the details of the laws recording RECORDS — because the process of gaining citizenship yields records.

In countries like the US and Europe humans leave a paper trail from birth through death.

Amazingly Obama seems to have been able to eradicate or hide a good part of his paper trail — so that we don’t have records and documents to judge the sort of person he really is.

Why is he so secretive? What is he hiding?

Following WW2, Hawaii was placed on the list of non self-governing territories by the United Nations, with the United States as trustee, under Article 73. Under Article 73 of the UN charter, the status of a territory can only be changed by a special vote, called a plebiscite, held among the inhabitants of the territory. That plebiscite is required to have three choices on the ballot. The first choice is to become a part of the trustee nation. In Hawaii’s case that meant to become a state. The second choice was to remain a territory. And the third choice, required by article 73 of the UN Charter, was the option for independence. For Hawaii, that meant no longer being a territory of the United States and returning to being an independent sovereign nation.

Hawaiian Sovereigncy would negate Sec. 305.[8 U.S.C. 1405]

Is there any evidence that he was actually born to Ms Dunham?
In fact was he ever born? Maybe he descended on a sunbeam.

No, seriously,

He doesn’t look biracial to me.
Has anyone checked DNA analysis between him and his typical white grandmother?

Boy they must be really worried out there in the nobama camp. They have sent a whole lot of nobama lawyer trolls here to convince us to drop the issue.
Where is the dang birth certificate? If you are so sure of the points of the law why don’t you produce it?

The obamatrolls post here all the time asking larry to produce the tape which he has said a thousand times he does not have.

No isnobama claiming to never have seen his birth certificate.

PRODUCE THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE

Somebody needs to help that guy with that website. It’s carnivalesque. Is that a word? When I saw it I winced. The flashing stuff was seizure quality, I see that’s gone but the lettering that replaces it is grotesque. The site is almost National Inquirer in first impression. The concept of Less Is More would help. I am sure he means well but that site needs better taste in its format to be taken seriously. Just a suggestion.

…running and hiding.

Well perhaps you’d better tell that to the two senators from that state and take away their electoral votes!

Hi there. I’m a lawyer. (Graduate of Yale Law School, for what it’s worth, just like Hillary and Bill.) I’m a Hillary supporter, can’t stomach Obama, am currently planning to vote for McCain. BUT — sorry, gang: Obama is indeed a citizen. He’s not a Muslim, either. To be honest, I think people should stop beating those particular drums. There are plenty of reasons the man shouldn’t be president. I really think it’s better to focus on the man’s flaws, his dodgy associates and his inexperience rather than grasping at the citizenship and religion straws.

This is not true……..unless his mother passed the test for citizenship at the time of Obama’s birth then it’s not automatic for him! Frankly from what I’ve seen his birth certificate is fraud! I too was born in Hawaii in the mid 60s and my birth certificate LOOKS NOTHING like the one he’s passing off as legitimate!

All he has to do is show his birth certificate (and I don’t mean the one that’s on Kos)…well barry, we’re waiting.

LOL that’s the issue though….. he can’t prove he was born in the USA! His birth certificate is a fraud (SO FAR) looks nothing like mine, and I too was born in Hawaii about the same time! Even Queens Memorial (where he was supposedly born) can’t verify it as true!

Yeah.. here to call it as I see it, folly at it’s best. Amusing at times, perplexing most. Unending blind followers once the bitter end as come and gone. I suspect in January ’09 you’ll still be trying to elect Hill, calling the General Election and invalid Unconstitutional fraud. Good luck with that.

I would think someone would be in charge

Now that’s funny.

There is a lawsuit going forward…so that debunks your rumor theory..google that..and if the information is wrong..then there is a loophole we can not see or find..may I suggest that is why Larry Johnson ask for…Any lawyers out there?

LOL yeah I AGREE! Looking at the document he’s passing off as his birth certificate… I can tell you that is not a State of Hawaii birth certificate…. must be that he was part of some 58th State!

BUT — sorry, gang: Obama is indeed a citizen. He’s not a Muslim, either.

and in a court of law you can prove this because?

WE get this BS every other day — at least.

These Obamabots can’t keep up with the truth — so they make up garbage as they go along.

Obamabots are liars just like their messiah.

Very good. You must have been on your college debate team, yes?

Mr. lawyer,
Are we to take your word then that he is not a muslim either. because you say you went to yale? Is that a legal matter in the code now?
It is not a matter whether he is a muslim or not, it is that HE LIED for political expediency that he was NEVER a muslim. And there is plenty evidence that he was during his early years.

Perhaps that was not the barry that he knew. We don’t care.
We do not like liars. We want to know.

Actually I think you are one of the trolls.

1790 First Congress, Act of March 26th, 1790, 1 Stat. 103.

“And the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond the sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States”.

Not TRUE! Unless he was born on US SOIL……he’s not entitled to the right to be US President! Nothing I’ve seen so far proves that he was even born in Hawaii. Not even the hospital (Queens Memorial) in Honolulu can prove that he was…

that piece of paper Bambi posted on his website, according to Hawaiian law, isn’t even good enough to buy Barry a house, and he thinks it will get him clearance to the White House?

I think the Framers and Founders understood the possible conflict of interest.

Hawaii was NOT given the third choice.

I KNOW because I lived in Hawaii when it became a state. The Native Hawaiians were NOT happy — and still are not happy with this illegal vote.

You’re wrong — Linclon had three times the experience of Obama when he ran for President.

Stop repeating these erroneous talking points.

Go check Wiki if you missed grade school history.

well considering the birth certificate he thinks is passing off as from the State of Hawaii…. (WHICH IS NOT) ask the person who found his birth notice in Kenya! LOL

I still think he’s hiding the space on the original Certificate of Birth designated for Religion. In this day and time he would not be hiding that his parents weren’t married. Jessie Jackson was the product of and unmarried single mother and no one made an issue of it back in 1988. (And please don’t give me “the nobody took his candidacy seriously” bullshit, he had more delegates than Ted Kennedy in 1980).

This is the post-Murphy Brown era. Besides, it would give Obama street creds if his parents weren’t married. Nothing he likes better.

It’s the Religion he’s hiding. And why? Because he lied about it!!! If he had simply told the truth he wouldn’t be penalized because children don’t have autonomy for such things.

Now he would be penalized for lying, especially because it ain’t the first lie he’s been caught in.

LOL! So this makes Obama experienced?

Like I said earlier….from what he tries to pass of as his test of citizenship…. I wouldn’t put money on it! LOL! That so called document is NOT a legitimate State of Hawaii birth cerfiticate! How do I know? I too have one from about that time … I was also born in Hawaii…and what he’s trying to pass off is NOT A BIRTH CERTIFICATE ISSUED IN HAWAII! Another fraud move on his part! I’m SHOCKED! LOL!

Not TRUE as far as the rules for President are concerned!

Comment by A Lawyer | 2008-06-16 00:00:10

Hi there. I’m a lawyer. (Graduate of Yale Law School, for what it’s worth, just like Hillary and Bill.) I’m a Hillary supporter, can’t stomach Obama, am currently planning to vote for McCain. BUT — sorry, gang: Obama is indeed a citizen. He’s not a Muslim, either. To be honest, I think people should stop beating those particular drums. There are plenty of reasons the man shouldn’t be president. I really think it’s better to focus on the man’s flaws, his dodgy associates and his inexperience rather than grasping at the citizenship and religion straws.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
What if Obama’s mother didnt give birth in a hospital and her passport shows her being out the the county days or weeks prior to the recorded birth of Obama?
You see that is the part that I am puzzled about.

How can you follow a guy who still gets his hair cut with a bowl? LJ looks like Moe. And he is a stooge!

Marbury VS madison gives the supreme court the power of judicial review. The supreme court is perfectly capable of ruling that the law trumps the constitution. In 2000 the election should have gone to the house per the constitution but the supreme court ruled the law of safe harbor to precedence.

THE QUESTION IS WONT BAMBI PRODUCE A VALID LEGITIMATE AND TRUE TEST OF A BIRTH CERTIFICATE ISSUED BY THE STATE OF HAWAII! The one he is ….IS NOT! I know ….I have one too from the State of Hawaii from the mid 60′s! Not even Queens Memorial (where he says he was born) can verify it!

If you are born inside the borders of the United States you enjoy U.S. citizenship. That has always been the case. The newborn would usually also have the citizenship of its parents, so it could be as many as three nationalities, but U.S. is definite.
Its nice to wish but grasping at straws doesn’t really help.

Because his father was an alien, at the time of his birth his mother would have had to be a resident of the US for ten years, five of which occurred after the age of 14. He was born when she was 18. That’s less than five years.

Sorry MEL! So far what Obama has produced as ACCURATE info (documents) regarding his birth ….ARE NOT! that is NOT a birth certificate from Hawaii! I can show you what is A REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE issued in Hawaii in the mid 60′s …what he produces is NOT! AGAIN, the hospital he claims he was born can’t even verify it! LOL! GO FIGURE!

AND AS TO YOUR MUSLIM QUESTION! OBAMA IS MUSLIM! His father was MUSLIM and according to MUSLIM law this makes OBAMA automatically MUSLIM! The same as a child born to a Jewish woman…automatically a Jew!

The only way this will be a problem is if Hawaii is not legally part of the United States of America at the time of the new Messiah’s birth. Otherwise there is no problem.
If it ever goes to court, SCOTUS has to decide the status of Hawaii.

The best way for now for Barry is to show his original birth certificate. It ends the controversy one way or the other

The sad part is that at this stage of the game we are debating whether or not he is a citizen! Hello?? Where was the vetting of this man?? MSM you can give us all the details of Britney Spears divorce or the latest American Idol’s lovelife, what about checking out some basic facts on the man who wants to be the leader of the free world.

Can you show us yours (personal info redacted of course)?

They could have celebrated his birth in Kenya even if it took place in the US. Africans in general are very pro-life.

But isn’t there a way to discover if his mother ever traveled to Kenya? Gosh didn’t these people have any friends? They’re a solitary/inuslar bunch.

I think you should throw away that law degree from Yale then…. LOL! I have several Arab partners in my business….ALL SAY THAT OBAMA is INDEED a MUSLIM! By DEFAULT of his FATHER who was MUSLIM! It’s similar to a Jewish mother giving birth….kid is automatically Jew! Obama is a MUSLIM! It doesn’t matter but funny how he should try to hide it! I CAN TELL YOU that the Arab community is PISSED about it! LOL

ALSO BUD…….I can tell you that the birth record he demonstrates as his citizenship record is a FRAUD! I was born in Hawaii about the same time as him…. I have nothing that even REMOTELY looks like what he thinks is a birth certificate from the State of Hawaii! Talking to friends from Honolulu seems the Queens Memorial Hospital has been bombarded with inquiries… (he was supposedly born there) NOT EVEN THEY CAN VERIFY that he was born there! I’m SHOCKED!

I was born in 1976. But if I went to Boston City hall to obtain a copy of my birth certificate it would most likely be printed on 2008 paper and template.

I WOULD NOT GET A PHOTOCOPY OF THE 1976 BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

ALL THAT MATTERS IS THAT IT IS CERTIFIED BY THE STATE.

WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?

It never ceases to amaze me at the amount of people who choose to be ignorant on this site.

Seems there is a screw up some place..His mother didn’t have him at the Hospital she went to three days after giving birth….All this news surfacing is probably why Obama is hiding his birth certificate…http://www.hcsfjm.com/sowell.html

Hawaii was never a legal state…United States illegally annexed it…..This is why President Clinton signed in to law to give Hawaii it’s sovereignty back….

Be it noted that Obama was probably born in Kenya…

Wasington Post did a story on this several months ago…It’s on snopes.com…Washington Post went as far as asking for his DNA…

cott, did you or do you know in Hawaii, you can file what is known as a late birth claim?

All it takes is someone to verify you are who and what you say you are and the original birth certificate is labelled a Late Certificate of Live Birth. But you ask for the computer generated certificate, you get the one Bambi is showing off.

So it is based upon the truthfulness of the people signing an afficavit stating such, and we all know how trust worthy Bambi and his people are.

So if his original is a Late Certificate of Birth, then he could have been born anywhere on the planet and does not give absolute proof he was born in the USA, or Hawaii.

Then all anyone has is Bambi’s word on a sworn document……lol

What Obama demonstrates as his Birth Certificate is NOT one issued by the State of Hawaii! I have both an original and a reprint and EVEN THE REPRINT has got a raised seal on the bottom and LOOKS NOTHING LIKE his live birth record (that he’s trying to pass off on the internet)…. That wouldn’t even get him a drivers license in Hawaii!

If she was not in this country at the time of his birth, then he is not covered under the exemption for “natural born” citizenship, since her age was the determining factor, and his father was a foreigner. She needed to be 21, but was only 18 when he was born.

It’s his responsibility to show proof of citizenship, since that’s a constitutinal requirement to be President of the United States. If he can’t meet that requirement, he’s inelible to run. Period. So, he needs to pony up, dig out his original birth certificate and prove it.

As a genealogist, I hate these new state certificates of birth and death. That being said, I was a little amazed that he had posted a new copy of his birth certificate, not an older one, since most people need that from time-to-time to prove identity and he should have a copy of an older one. I have copies of both.

A real birth certificate is needed to apply for a passport, the certification of birth that the Obama camp is showing is not a valid substitution.

So since Obama obviously has a passport, providing the real birth certificate should be an easy matter for him, so why doesn’t he just do it?

His State Department passport files were breached months ago. The story came out that it was just someone being nosy, as was the case with the files of both Senator Clinton and Senator McCain. What if it was really someone removing something from those files, i.e. a copy of his birth certificate?

Sometimes I feel like I’m stuck in the midst of a Tom Clancy novel, just waiting for Jack Ryan to show up and save the day for democracy!

Don’t you think that if there was even an inkling of an argument that Obama was not a true American Citizen the GOP, Clinton Camp, and McCain campaign would be all over it. Not too mention the hundreds of individuals and organizations pouring resources on digging up dirt on Obama.

Don’t be so gullible. Honestly. Take the tin foil hat off for one second and join the rest of us in the real world.

Exactly! A fraud trying to cover his tracks when he knows people are on to him! Funny how the people who breached his records were associated with a major donor of his….. HMMMMM!

Oh really? The bottom of the birth certificate he is presenting seems to say differently.

Or did you bother looking at it? Probably not.

Oh my god…this site is filled with morons. I better log off before my head explodes from the amount of stupidity I’m currently absorbing.

I can TELL YOU IT LOOKS NOTHING LIKE MINE! AND I WAS BORN IN HAWAII IN 1962! LOL I even have a reprint from 1999! MINE REPRINT even has a RAISED SEAL over the Secretary of State of Hawaii name!

RE: to Cannon

Why did you fail to cite this accurately?

It is not 8 U.S.C. 1401, Sec. 301(g) its 8 U.S.C. 1401, Sec. 301(g) b

The difference being that it is unclear if “this proviso shall be applicable to…” meant b or all of subsection g. It seems odd to me that so many persons’ citizen status could be changed retroactively by this law-I wonder if it is retroactive if there is not another section which limits it?

I doubt he is not a citizen-why would he run then.He would have to be crazy.

B) employed by the United States Government or an international
organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included
in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this
paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or
after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become
effective in its present form on that date; and

maybe you better! LOL

maybe you should…….I know it’s a lot for you to process at one time! LOL!

he’s a COMPLETE MORON that thinks everyone else is too dumb to figure him out! That’s why he’d RUN knowing he might not be eligible!

The History books and the law is for anyone to read..and the courts will decide since it is going to court!
From my search..this is what I found…
Ed Hale from http://www.hcsfjm.com/ has initiated this lawsuit.

A Federal lawsuit is now in the works to get an injunction barring the DNP from making Obama their nominee.

What was also fishy about the kos “birth cert” was that it listed his fathers race as “African”. I asked several AA’s about this (who are in their forties/fifties) & they all said their parents race was listed on their birth cert as: Negro. I googled the US Census classifications of race & it said that until 1980, in the US, non-whites were: Negro, American Indian, Japanese, Chinese, other non-white. Now the classification is Black or AA.

So what’s with the “African”? In 1961? Get real. What are they hiding? He must have an original, why not post it?

ScottVA..calm down…LOL…You are making me LMAO!!..When the caps show up…you made your point..LOL

It’s Ms. Lawyer, not Mr. Lawyer, thank you very much. And don’t call me Sweetie, either.

Several people above (deerest friend, pax, Ted, etc.) have posted the applicable portions of the Constitution and Federal law. If you don’t believe me and them, I suggest you go to a lawyer or a Constitutional scholar (or Hillary herself) personally and ask about it. True enough, you can’t see my law degree over the internet.

As for the Muslim thing, good lord, man (or woman, or Sweetie, as the case may be), the man was a church-going, card-carrying member of the Trinity Church of Christ for decades (which is hardly compatible with being a practicing Muslim). But right there’s where to look for your religious problems, if you want some. Reverend Wright et al. provide plenty of legitimate fodder.

You’re looking in the wrong place for a troll. I’m a long-time Hillary admirer, and cannot stand Obama. If I were a troll, I doubt very much that I’d point out that Obama’s flaws, dodgy associates and inexperience would make him a lousy President, and if you read my post, that’s exactly what I did say. I’m just trying to point out that you’re wasting your energy on this one, and suggesting that you focus is on Obama’s very real flaws instead of drying to patch together imaginary ones.

Why do I care? Well, there are a lot of people wavering on the fence about whether to vote for Obama. You (and I) would like to convince them not to do so, right? Well, if Hillary supporters go off on silly issues that explode in our faces, we’re likely to drive those people straight into the Obama camp — the same way obnoxious Obama supporters helped drive a lot of people into the Hillary and McCain camps. For that same reason, you should also avoid calling everyone who disagrees with you in any particular a “troll” and abusing them. It’s not a good way to win converts to your cause, which is what this site is about, isn’t it.

LARRY . . .

Like Obama I’m not a Constitutional lawyer, or a real lawyer either (again, very similar to Obama), but I read it as saying that you either have to be a natural born citizen, or at the Founding of this country if you were a citizen when the Constitution was adopted (Washington, Adams, Jefferson) then you could be President.

It’s natural born, but at the founding they needed to ease back on that, obviously.

Otherwise, it’s natural born, baby. Sorry Barack.

________

Also, my understanding is it’s to make sure that a person’s loyalty would be to America first, and to avoid Manchurian, America hating candidates. Again, so sorry Barack.

Yeah, she would have had to have gone there on a passport. I don’t know how far back passport records go, but if she went, it may be documented.

I agree, an immigration lawyer needs to answer this.

But let me ask this, McCain had a similar controversy having been born in the Panama Canal Zone to American Parents. His father being in the military. If the people here are so cock sure that Obama is a citizen when his father was Kenyan, why was McCain’s birth called into question since both of his parents were American and his father was on active duty in the military? Didn’t Congress pass some kind of special Act for McCain? Why was that necessary?

Are you talking about the piece by Thomas Sowell on that site? He’s not a Stanford law professor. He isn’t even a lawyer, according to his own bio:

http://www.tsowell.com/cv.html

You really ought to scrutinize your sources, before grasping at straws like this.

Hawaii is the 50th state. Still doesn’t mean Obama is a natural born citizen . . . thank goodness the founders realized there needed to be a way to only have America loving Presidents become 1/3 of our government.

Realchicken(shit), that illogical utterance is called an argumentum ad hominem. Don’t get us started now. Barack Obama, Michelle Obama and the rest of you members of the Wright/Pfleger/Farrakhan Cult do not meet any standard of style or pulchritude.

B.O.W.L.* Big Time in November (2008)
HRC – 45th POTUS (2012)
*Barack Obama Will Lose

His mother registered him 2 days AFTER his birth.

That’s odd, really.

And incidentally, no one has been able to find a marriage certificate or any record of his parents’ marriage in Hawaii.

Why don’t we ask his half brother?

I agree with you Ms Lawyer. But the point I’m making in regard to his Certificate of Birth is that the Religious designation could have stated Muslim and that’s why he’s hiding it.

Again, babies have no autonomy over such things. As adults people change their names and religions even their genders. Something like this could have easily been explained.

But if what I’m suggesting is in fact the case, it means he LIED…. yet again. And that I think is important. It ties into everything you say about why he’s not qualified and is too inexperienced to be POTUS. This is a character issue.

Larry, I believe “or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution,” should be read together.

In other words, if you were a foreign-born citizen of the US at the time the Constitution was adopted.

Ms. Lawyer,

Please!!! Are you telling us that if we ask for a birth certificate, a legitimate request, and if nobama actually produces a birth certificate, all the clinton supporters will immediately say hallelujah and flock to nobama. How superficial do you think they are?

If these issues seem silly to you then go find some serious issues to criticize nobama. Why discourage us from what we find important. And that too by making statements that he is not a muslim, when the issue is that he lied about never being a muslim.

You do your thing and let us do ours.

So, when’s he going to start debating issues? Didn’t seem to know “the issues” while running his dirty campaign against the honorable Sen. Clinton. What’s he going to do now–how’s he going to come up with “the issues?”

And FYI, hope and change aren’t real issues.

But here’s the question, Mimi…..there are no marriage records found for Obama’s parents. And his father was already married in Kenya, so on our soil, his marriage to Obama’s mother was null and void, as bigamy.

Perhaps he’s a citizen, yes.

But perhaps….what he’s HIDING is that his parents were never really married.

Obama is a glorifed anchor baby and probably a bastard to boot by the looks of it.

I’m sure though even if it is true about his citizenship, the Democrats can bend the laws to make Obama eligible for POTUS.

Obama Birth Lies

1) That Selma march got him born. Not true, you were trying to score points on civil rights grounds and made that up.

2) That the Kennedy family got him born. Not true, but it secured you the Ted Kennedy endorsement before the New York Times outed your fudging, and you were able to pretend you were a JFK reincarnation for awhile.

Other biographical lies: Uncle liberated Auschwitz. Untrue, you always tell an audience your biography matches theirs, you Huckster, Con Man, and Thief you.

Now, he seals up his birth certificate? Well, I’d say something is being hidden.

My certificate is straightforward and has been seen by many, his obviously isn’t or he’d have produced it by now.

Also…………something interesting is Farrakhan called Obama just like his “savior” because of his birth. Farrakhan’s “savior” had one half of his family born in Honolulu, even though he claimed to be black or Arab at different times.

In actuality, the Farrakhan “savior” seems to have been a guy who was half white, half Polynesian but preached a black/Islamic and ultimately crazy theology that went off the rails. Finally, he murdered someone and disappeared (some savior) and was watched and wanted by FBI for a very long time.

So, maybe Obama got in good with Farrakhan so quickly to become compared to his “savior” by pretending he was born in Honolulu?

It would be the fourth time we’d know of he’s done something like that, so it’s so much in character that we’d better look long and hard at whatever paperwork he produces.

He’s lied so much about his birth and life that he’s not to be taken at his word or paperwork on this one.

It is a simple thing being asked, someone brought it up and the fact is Obama produces a computer generated piece of paper as an answer instead of the real Birth Certificate.

His action speaks for itself Ms Lawyer and since Bambi beat the fact however he wanted even when Hillary gave a Senate speech on her reasons for voting for Bush’s Bill on Iraq in 2002, Bambi swept that under the carpet and continually used that vote against her.

So Bambi opened the door to provide verifiable proof on everything now, let him eat his own words now and provide the verifiable proof and not some paper that states “Certification of Live Birth” that is computer generated.

Obama tactics are reversing on him, too bad it is about time his Saul Alinsky tactics are now in reverse mode, but he started this world of dirty politics now he has to live with the outcome of them, especially after he has been proven a liar numerous upon numerous times!

Uh, Wild Child…..your compound sentences in a complete paragraph expressing a cogent and erudite thought, is WAAAAAAYY too hard for Democrat to understand.

Well said, and correct, though.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution.

age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident

The question that needs to be answered is what passport was used to enter Jakarta,Indonesia. Now if BO attended 1st grade school and his fathers status as a Muslim was used, which I understand is/was the practice, then being a Kenyan citizen he would have entered with a ? Passport?

Where was BO Born? Kenya or Hawaii? What is up with the lotto ticket to BO’s fabrication of the airlift to America? I (BO) was born during the Selma riots?

The truth IS out there and BO won’t say which is telling in of itself.

Mr. Johnson; got any contacts in Jakarta?

Where’s his birth certificate? No one else is sealing there’s. Also, see above for the reason Obama and birth lies are getting very numerous.

It will take a bit to learn where he was born, the last times bloggers and the New York Times had to Out the Lying Bugger.

Ain’t it the truth!

You can’t make this shit up!

I think you’re right.

No marriage records have ever been found.

Besides, his father was already married. By our laws, on our soil, any ceremony with his mom would be null and void.

We don’t recognize concurrent marriages here.

And you are Curly, so what?

Wikipedia isn’t going to stand up to this court of law…….try a real source, not one Barky could have written, or you.

Exactly. Too bad Barky, it’s natural born to avoid Manchurian and anti-American candidates. Thank God the founders thought of that.

Barack Obama is a natural-born citizen, and it does not matter if he was born in Hawaii, Kenya, or Mars.

By all means, double-check my work. You know how to use Google
==================

Well if he was born in Kenya or Mars he is not a ‘natural born citizen’ though he may be a ‘citizen of the United States’ And you have to be a ‘natural born on US earth ” to be President.

There is a birth certificate in Mobassa Kenya for him and so far no legal one has shown up in Hawaii. He has to show a legal bc in America showing he was born in America and give it to the proper authorities for vetting and looks like he doesn’t want to do that – that, for me, speaks to the problem and rumours that he was born elsewhere, especially with the bc in Kenya.

The whole thing is like the Twilight Zone. This guy has no experience and is surrounded by thugs, terrorists and criminals… He tells lies with abandon. Totally inconceivable that he is where he is without some very mighty dollars behind him and from where? Look he has even had the DNC moved to Chicago…what the….is all that about?

Welcome to George Orwell’s world. It aint pretty.

Ok, I have a headache now, however, what I suspect is that Obama is hiding something because he released a very bogus birth record to Kos.
Next, if he attended school in Indonesia, his parents had to present a birth certificate to enroll him, if his mother married his Indonesian father, he would have to become a citizen, so does Indonesia force you to renounce your US citizenship when you become a citizen of Indonesia?
Finally, if he were born in a Hawaiian hospital, there would be a birth record because, as someone who worked in labor and delivery, every birth is recorded (handwritten by the nurse or midwife who attended the birth) in a book and kept forever. The record entails, mother’s name, time and date, weight, sex of the baby and any other important details, such as c-section,etc.
So, it is still not certain that he is a citizen until he presents his actual birth certificate.
End of headache.

Hey I believe Obama’s parents are who he says they are. And yes Obama has an American mother.

My problem right now is that I’m confused as to where he was born, especially since it looks like it might not have been in a hospital.

It also looks like there is a possibility that his birth was not reported until a few days after the birth. At the time of Obamas birth this also was not a common practice.
At the time of Obama’s birth it was not a common practice to give birth to a child at home either.

I would love to see this guy knocked out of the race, and yes this sounds crazy. But Obama has brought this all upon himself with all his half truths.

WHY cant he just come forward with the birth certificate.
However, now I have a feeling people are going to want to see his mother’s passport too!!

Question, A Lawyer:

If Obama claims his parents were married, but we now know that his father was already married to his 1st wife in Kenya at the time (his Mom 2nd concurrent wife…as in bigamy), wouldn’t any marriage to his Mom, by our law, be null and void?

Not saying he’s not a citizen.

Just saying that his parents’ “marriage” wasn’t valid by our law.

Correct, or not?

Question, A Lawyer:

If Obama claims his parents were married, but we now know that his father was already married to his 1st wife in Kenya at the time (his Mom 2nd concurrent wife…as in bigamy), wouldn’t any marriage to his Mom, by our law, be null and void?

Not saying he’s not a citizen.

Just saying that his parents’ “marriage” wasn’t valid by our law.

Correct, or not?

Larry, this is way off base. John McCain is actually foreign born. But who had enough CLASS to write a bill clearing McCain?

SENATOR BARACK OBAMA.

KNOCK IT OFF LARRY. PLEASE.

Are you a court– no? Then once we unseal Obama’s records and prove their as inauthentic as the 2002 Anti-War speech that Axelrod “produced” because there were no copies, and nobody remembered it, then we’ll see.

Obama bots will never tell us when something is over, they’re known for lying.

Obama’s biography and personal statements have lied about 1) Selma march getting him born 2) Kennedy getting him born and 3) uncle freeing Auschwitz.

Unfortunately, Obama has a history of lying about his biography. His word is to be expected to be a lie at this point.

Too bad for him the U.S. Constitution is not the Oprah Book Club.

Didn’t he get Alice Palmer out on a technicality?

Hmmmm…. as was done by Barack, shall be done unto Barack.

Comment by Lynn | 2008-06-16 00:58:36

Why don’t we ask his half brother?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Isnt Grandma Obama still alive??

If for some weird reason Obama was born in Kenya I bet Grandma had a hand in the delivery. In most countries like Africa, Grandmas played a very prominent role in birthing.

Probably right, Mimi.

He’s not a Muslim. Not now. Saying he is, is foolish tripe.

But if his birth certificate, by paternal right, says he was born a Muslim, then it doesn’t cause religious problems.

It causes PUBLIC RELATIONS problems.

And why is it so hard for you to understand that we, the Democratic voters, who do not want him to be the nominee demand to see the original and since he wants our votes why not just shut this controversy down by simply showing us a clear photcopy of the document so we can read it for ourselves?

Obama is the one that is making it hard.

If you wanted to see my original right now, I could produce it. Why would I hide it, especially when I wanted to be POTUS?

If questions like this make your head explode, then fasten your seatbelt, it’s going to be a bumpy ride to November.

Mr. Johnson,

Harvard Law School Professor Laurence H. Tribe is a Constitutional expert; ask him?

I’ve been involved with him from the time he graduated from Harvard Law,” Tribe said. “Barack is enormously mature, brilliant, and inspiring in his commitment to make people’s lives better and to the American ideal in its best form.”

“http://www.thecrimson.com/article.aspx?ref=519324″

Natural born, only citizens at founding were enough.

Arnold Swarzenneger is a citizen, this law is to keep us from having anti-American Manchurian candidates. Wise move.

Natural born.

He was born on an American naval base, you twonk. So you’re saying that every baby born on every military base through out the world since the inception of this great country is not an American citizen? Christ…HOW COULD McCAIN POSSIBLY LOSE TO THESE IDIOTS?

He may very well HAVE the original one that includes the state seal and a notary seal and signature, JR, but doesn’t want that published.

But you’re incorrect about the most recent one. It has no notary seal or signature, and legally, doesn’t count for official documents.

RealChicken…Why do you have to make PERSONAL insults..if you have something to add to the conversation that makes sense or has facts..fine..but talking about LJ looks is immature and makes you look like a little kid being hyper from drinking all that extra sweet kool-aid!..LOL! Put your picture up and let us see you..oh..you can’t cause your REAL CHICKEN!!!

All Mr Transprency needs do is provide his locked up rocords he demanded his opponents provide. Because it is Barry, he gets a free ride, is that your defence?

Weak weak weak one, we are just following Barry’s lead on this whole transparency thing, you should be estatic over it, why aren’t you?

This is how I take this. Personally, him being a Muslim in childhood is not the issue, him stating absolutely that he is not now, NOR HAS HE EVER BEEN, a Muslim. Seems that his stepfather was a Muslim and that little Barry may have practiced that religion.

If he was raised in that religion, then so be it. And if he converted to Christianity in adulthood, so be it. But don’t lie to me about it.

He’s got way too many secrets, too many contradictions, and I’ve seen this before. Back in 2000. Guy named Bush did this. So, I’m extremely skeptical of the guy named Obama.

Still won’t vote for him anyway.

No, JR. There’s no official notary seal or signature. It’s not the official certificate.

NO. This law only applies if Obama was born OUTSIDE the United States. The above law is not quoted in its entirety.

If he was born in HI, he is a citizen. If he were born in Kenya, he would not have met the requirements for residency of his mother.

I think he was born in Kenya…a theory that the obama-nuts like to ridicule to no end. However, it was suspicious to have claire mckaskill putting forth a bill allowing mccain to be president despite being born outside the us (and barky standing right behind her when she introduced the bill.) As if we are supposed to believe that mckaskill and obarfa, two of the meanest and ugliest Democrats going are capable of noble gestures to ensure their opponents get to remain on the ballot. Ha. It was laughable then as it is now.

Mimi, your premise that the original says “Muslim” as religion could be a good reason the passport breacher didn’t want that original birth certificate to be available.

Shades of George W. Bush and his National Guard records, eh?

I don’t think people care about that these days. And it’s already been discussed about his father’s wives.

It’s the Religion he’s hiding. And because he lied about it when he didn’t have to. Babies can’t control what their parents put on their Birth Certificates.

But he chose to LIE.

And there’s the rub.

Why don’t we ask his half brother what he has heard?

If he’d just release the damn original everything would be settled.

But he resists doing so.

THAT creates the suspicion. His own choices.

BO wrote a bill clearing McCain for citizenship? Wow, he’s taking credit for something that was passed in 1790? Not to mention all the other laws that gave John McCain his natural born birth right.

LMAO!

Yes, because Lincoln had it SO easy . . . I mean, it was just a petty little civil war.

THIS LAW WIL NOT HELP US

HI was a state- but this is a federal, not a state law. The law Larry is using only applies to childrenborn outside the United States- like McCain.

See here for an explanation:

http://www.visalaw.com/05jan1/2jan105.html

However, if he were born in Kenya- then he is toast.

I think we ALL know what his half brother Malik said.

His cousin Odinga, too.

This is a federal law, not a state law because states cannot determine citizenship. A

lso, this law only applies if O was born outside the US. I got excited too- but this law does not help us unless he was born in Kenya.

Do you guys not have access to Wikipedia? Because the rules for American citizenship are really simple:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthright_citizenship_in_the_United_States_of_America

Anyone know anything about Indonesian immigration law? Because that was his mother’s next stop after the Kenyan abandoned her, maybe Dad just had the baby to get his citizenship and then qualify for more financial aid to further his Ivy League education.
However from skimming Indonesian immigration law, it appears what Obama may be hiding is that his mother was there illegally and therefore he was illegal also, to become a citizen you must renounce US citizenship and be there a certain number of years… I am not good at legalese but I am sure some lawyer types can research this.

I think you’ve nailed it, Mimi. It’s the religion he’s hiding (not his fault as a baby), and the “passport breach” was to remove any copies of birth certificate that could be found and published.

It’s a public relations issue for him.

He LIED, and he never really needed to.

Damm , you’re smart.

we have access to it, but no access to bambi’s birth cert yet, just a scrap of computer paper

No. The federal government has jurisdiction over ALL matters relating to citizenship. No state can make any law in this area.

In Dreams for My Father, to me, Obama implies the vagueness of his parents marriage, that maybe they never married.

Has anyone ever tried to find divorce records so that she could marry Soetoro?

I’m convinced that it isn’t this. We are long over that hump. There are too many single women having babies now.

and if that’s his sole reason, he could release that document now and evoke a sympathy card over this and the kool aid crowd would eat that up.

Hie’s hiding the religious designation of Muslim on his CoB.

And only because he lied about it and can’t figure a way to spin it.

It opens the door for more questions: Did you ever practice? When did you stop? And this could mean more lies that could come back to haunt him if he continues lying.

He lied and can’t get out of it now!

NO- this law only applies if O was not born on US soil.

I think you’re right. Obama knows he was born in Africa and wants to ensure that if McCain becomes eligible, he will too. But McCain was born of two natural born parents in a US base (Panama) because his father was serving in the military. That situation would not apply to BHO.

Not true. IF O was born in Kenya, then he would not be a natural born citzen because he only has one parent that was a US citizen and she would not have met the age/residency requirements for the above federal law during the time of his birh.

You had it right earlier.

Larry, I believe that element you refer to, “or a citizen of the United States,” is further clarified by the following, “at the time of the adoption of this Constitution”.

Meaning that anyone of that era who was a citizen, a citizen at the time the Constitution was adopted, but not born here, could be President. In other words they would be “grandfathered” into the eligible class.

The key is “a citizen at the time of adoption”. A very selective statement applying to all would had become citizens prior to the “natural born clause” being written, and the Constitution itself.

Would not apply once that body of citizens had died out. Would not apply to any one becoming a citizen AFTER the date of adoption.

Congress did nothing special for McCain. I do not know when the federal government addressed that issue, but for as long as I can remember, military bases have always been considered sovereigns for the purpose of determining citizenship.

This is the correct answer;

Unless he was born on US SOIL.

I am a natural born citizen, two of my siblings are naturalized. Only I could seek the office of POTUS.

In the same way…sorry about the example but… If a Mexican national has a child on US soil that child is a US citizen.

What passport was usedby BO to gain entry to Jakarta, Indonesia will answer this question.

Comment by prabhata | 2008-06-16 01:46:36

I think you’re right. Obama knows he was born in Africa and wants to ensure that if McCain becomes eligible, he will too. But McCain was born of two natural born parents in a US base (Panama) because his father was serving in the military. That situation would not apply to BHO.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If I remember right there are laws covering Military men and their families. I think if its on a milary base and both are legally married its different.

Zennie is probably referring to S. 2678, “a bill to clarify the law and ensure that children born to United States citizens while serving overseas in the military are eligible to become President.”

S. 2678 was meant to remove any doubt, since some questions had been raised in media reports, about McCain’s eligibility. It was written by Sen. McCaskill, and cosponsored by both Obama and Clinton (which, in legislative terms, means they wanted to be viewed as co-authors).

Or she may be referring to S. Res. 511, “a resolution recognizing that John Sidney McCain, III, is a natural born citizen.” It was also cosponsored by Obama and Clinton, and adopted by the Senate.

The bottom line is that Obama & Clinton wanted to prevent anyone from even trying to challenge McCain’s eligibility in court.

Why don’t you stupid Obamabots do some reading before you open your big traps??? Why must other people do your work for you?

The part that Larry posted is true: …If only one parent was a U.S. Citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least FIVE of which had to be after the age of 16.”

The above quoted law was a not a Hawaii state law it was a law that applied to all U.S. states and was in effect from 1952 through 1986. Soooo if Obama’s mom was a U.S. Citizen and his father was not a U.S. citizen and Obama was born when his mother was 16, Obama would not have become a legal U.S. Citizen until his mother was 21 IF she had lived in the U.S. TEN YEARS, FIVE OF WHICH HAD TO BE AFTER THE AGE OF 16. THAT MEANS OBAMA WAS NOT AUTOMATICALLY A U.S. CITIZEN UNTIL HIS MOTHER TURNED 21. That law changed in 1986 probably before all you Obamastupids were even born.

So if Obama’s mother MOVED to Indonesia let’s say in 1965 when she was 20 years old and Barack was 4 years old then Obama NEVER ATTAINED U.S. Citizenship because she wouldn’t have lived in this country for five years after the age of 16.

You get it now??? So the questions that now remain ARE: 1) Where was Barack really born?, 2) Did his mother satisfy the requirements of citizenship and turn 21 before she moved out of the country?, 3) Was Barack actually born somewhere else and did someone lie and say that he was born at home and apply for a Hawaiian birth certificate for him.

It was a lot easier in the 1960s to get a birth certificate stating you were born in Hawaii because a lot of babies were born at home back then. Someone from Hawaii told me all you needed was an affidavit from the parent stating that you were born in Hawaii and were born at home or some such nonsense. The thing is the real birth certificate that would have been issued at that time would have had a date of filing on it that differed greatly from the actual date and time of birth. In another words (got to keep it simple for these morons that Obama leads) when you’re born now you have a few days to pick a name and then the application for a certificate of live birth goes to the County Clerks’ office to be filed. That means the actual recording of the birth takes place in the county records within a week or two (maybe three if they’re backed up) of a baby’s actual birth day.

Maybe that’s why Obama doesn’t want to release the real birth certificate because the date it was filed could be a long time after his actual birth and then would come the questions as to why it wasn’t filed days after his birth if he was really born in Hawaii. That’s the only reason I could see why he would seal his birth certificate.

By the way the thing that is called Obama’s birth certificate that was posted on Kos is not actually a birth certificate. Birth certificates here in the U.S. say Certificate of Live Birth at the top and they have mom’s name, dad’s name, parents birthdates, delivering doctor’s name and signature. What was posted on Kos looks like a real document (because it looks like my Hawaiian marriage certificate) BUT it is just a barely legal document that a person can use for I.D. like to get a driver’s license or passport. I’m not even sure if you can get the certificates of live birth with parents names, ages, doctors signature on them anymore.

I reapplied for my children’s birth certificates a few years ago (they were born in the late 70s) and they were laser printed, had Certificate of Live Birth on them, had father’s name, mother’s name, date and time of the child’s birth and were stamped with a brightly colored notary seal them.

Not that I am aware of.

Another anomaly is that they do not have to have, nor qualify for, even a secret security clearance, much less top-secret.

And…as I understand it, given the guidelines under which I was repeatedly checked for the original and renewals, Ayers alone would disqualify Obama, as would any false information about his life, and or travels.

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/fightthesmearshome/

Here is the link to the birth certificate. Obama has posted it. Case closed.

14th Amendment.

“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”

Obama is a citizen.

People, if his birth certificate would disqualify him for the presidency he would know about it right? And he also knows he cant hide it forever right? So would he really run for President knowing that the instant his birth certificate pops up, he’ll have to withdraw? That doesn’t make sense.
And I think Snopes have already debunked the rumour that he was born in Africa.

The 14th amendment was an amendment related to firearms.

There are clearly many many questions to this whole birth certificate / eligibility thing.

Personally, I would not trust anyone in the dem party to validate Obama’s eligibility, I would only trust the republicans hiring lawyers to look into it.

http://www.visalaw.com/05jan1/2jan105.html

Obama was 6 yrs old at the time he lived in Indonesia, then returned to Hawaii at age 10. His mother remained in Indonesia where she died in 1995.

Unless his daddy was a US citizen Obama is screwd or America is one…His mother did not live in the U.S. 5 yrs after Obama’s 14th birthday…

What are the rules for people born between December 23, 1952 and November 13, 1986?

Again, children born abroad to two US citizen parents were US citizens at birth, as long as one of the parents resided in the US at some point before the birth of the child.

When one parent was a US citizen and the other a foreign national, the US citizen parent must have resided in the US for a total of 10 years prior to the birth of the child, with five of the years after the age of 14. An exception for people serving in the military was created by considering time spent outside the US on military duty as time spent in the US.

While there were initially rules regarding what the child must do to retain citizenship, amendments since 1952 have eliminated these requirements.

Children born out of wedlock to a US citizen mother were US citizens if the mother was resident in the US for a period of one year prior to the birth of the child. Children born out of wedlock to a US citizen father acquired US citizenship only if legitimated before turning 21.

Sorry the 14th amendment also applies to citizenship but a naturalized citizen is not eligible to run for president, just ask Ahnoooold.

Well, the practical purpose of that clause was to assure that there COULD be a President. You’ve got to remember that until the Constitution was officially adopted and ratified (by the necessary 9 of 13 states), there was NO United States of America. And if there were no country, there couldn’t be any citizens. (This is also the point invoked over Andrew Jackson’s being President. While most historians accept 1767 as the year of his birth, there is some doubt that he was actually born on American soil–claims range from his being born in one of the Carolinas or on the border between the two to having been born on a ship bound for the Americas to having been born in Ireland, from where both of his parents emigrated. As he was a “citizen of the United States at the time of adoption” of the Constitution–if nothing else, his service on the American side of the Revolution would have earned him that much.)
Prior to the adoption and ratification of the Constitution, there was no “United States” as we understand that notion today. There were 13 sovereign states which had formed a general alliance but maintained completely separate systems under the Articles of Confederation. The Articles did establish a “United States of America” but there’s not really any evidence that one was a CITIZEN of the “United States of America” or if one was a citizen of a particular state (such as being a Georgian, a New Yorker, a Virginian or whatever, rather than “an American”).

.

This guy has no shame, really and he’s arrogant. Frankly, I’m more inclined to believe he was born to a muslem father, therfore according to the Koran, barky is one, the certificate shows it and he’s trying to hide it. Or he was given a Christian name but converted to Islam later in life, then converted to Rev. Wright’s Church of eternal I Hate America. Either way, he’s hiding something and people will wonder what.

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Actually it is the age of 16 not 14. See below:

http://immigration.findlaw.com/immigration/immigration-citizenship-naturalization/immigration-citizenship-naturalization-did-you-know(1).html

4. December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986
If only one parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least five of which had to be after the age of 16. There are no conditions placed on retaining this type of citizenship. If your one U.S. citizen parent is your father and you were born outside of marriage, the same rules apply if your father legally legitimated you before your 21st birthday and you were unmarried at the time. If legitimation occurred after November 14, 1986, your father must have established paternity prior to your 18th birthday, either by acknowledgment or by court order, and must have stated in writing that he would support you financially until your 18th birthday.

Guy, aren’t you a little ashamed that you have to resort to such childish pranks? You do understand that the main reason many people are refusing to vote for Obama is because of this very kind of childish behavior. But this just goes to prove what we’ve felt all along. Barrack is not worthy of the highest office in the land, just look at the types of people he attracts.

I was born in 1960 (in New York though) my sister was born in 1961 and our birth certificates look nothing like Obama’s birth certificate looks. My birth certificate looks like a negative of a photograph. It also has a lot more detail on it such as what my dad did for a living. Also it says how many live births prior to this child, etc. Obama needs to release his original birth certificate, the one he released is not the original. How do we know it’s even real? Where is the raised seal? Also, I would like to see his mother’s tax return if she filed one in the state of Hawaii with his name on the tax return. Did she work back then? Did she file taxes? Could the IRS help out with this? Also, is the Doctor’s name on the birth certificate? How do we know he wasn’t born in Indonesia or Africa? His mother had wanderlust, also, no one attended the wedding.

I heard that a child was born in his father’s town in Kenya on the same day with the same name Barack Hussein Obama II. If Obama was born in Kenya then he is not eligible to be President.

Guy is just an immature idiot.

check out this website: http://www.dontvoteobama.net very interesting information is there.

Strawberry, I like your name.

My sources tell me that Barack Hussien Obama Winfrey was born in the Kabba at Mecca during a lunar eclipse in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. It’s mother was a pig.

j/k

I heard that a child was born in his father’s town in Kenya on the same day with the same name Barack Hussein Obama II.

Well if you heard that, it definitely must be true.

stray exactly. A boy child was born in Kenya on the same day as Barack Hussein Obama II with the same name in the same town. Sounds like Obama should have run for the Kenyan Presidency.

“Barack’s stubbornness on the birth certificate issue”

People. It’s been posted online for days now. The paranoia is astounding.

(but seriously…Guy Incognito? That was really annoying. You’re not helping.)

Thanks, I had to change it due to Project Echo Chamber. Hopefully I’ll be able to change it back soon.

c.s. In other countries you can hold dual citizenship but the US does not recognize divided loyalties.

What’s been posted on line for days now? A minimal copy of a birth record, not the actual Certificate of Live Birth? Is that what you’re talking about?

Actually, according to the state of Hawaii’s website it was an original. They show a sample one there and they look nothing alike. And why would Kos get ahold of it before Obama himself released it?

That should read, not an original.

democrat — a citizen yes but not a natural born citizen. Its not good enought to be President of the United States.

This guy has no shame, really and he’s arrogant. Frankly, I’m more inclined to believe he was born to a muslem father, therfore according to the Koran, barky is one, the certificate shows it and he’s trying to hide it. Or he was given a Christian name but converted to Islam later in life, then converted to Rev. Wright’s Church of eternal I Hate America. Either way, he’s hiding something and people will wonder what.

Im sorry but thats just a bonkers post. Do you have ANY evidence whatsoever to show that Obama was/is a Muslim? Apart from dragging in his father who as Im sure you are aware renounced his religion and became atheist.
And you are saying because his father was a Muslim at the time of his birth he is a muslim according to the Koran! Do you think thats how we should decide what someone’s religion is? “Yes Barack you have been a Christian all your life but technically the Koran says you are a Muslim because of your father so we must all consider you a Muslim irrespective of your wishes”- thats ridiculous.

THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION
THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION
THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION

ITS HIS LISTED RELIGIOUS STATUS THAT WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO HIDE – BET ON IT!!!

Comment by mimi | 2008-06-16 01:39:49

Hie’s hiding the religious designation of Muslim on his Certificate of Live Birth.

And only because he lied about it and can’t figure a way to spin it.

It opens the door for more questions: Did you ever practice? When did you stop? And this could mean more lies that could come back to haunt him if he continues lying.

He lied and can’t get out of it now!

That’s what its about folks.

He isn’t hiding it because it may disqualify him from being president because of citizenship laws.

Lets be honest, the citizenship is a hanging chad debate…argueable enough that the politicians in the pocket would move heaven and earth and pass what ever resolution neccessary to qualify him and they would bend the law however they needed to to allow him to continue his run for president.

He is hiding it because it has his religious designation as Muslim.

SOmetimes its the simple truth that is the most damaging.
I would bet money on it folks. MIMI has it right.

Its not about his legal citizenship status, its about Barack junior classified as Muslim on the certificate of live birth.

The damage to him after hiding his muslim religious background and beliefs for so long and then REPEATEDLY LYING ABOUT IT would derail his presumptive presidency.

You can be sure that the republicans will get a hold of his actual Certificate of Live Birth after the Fraudulant Democraptastic National Con-vention.

Is this the kind of Hope and Change yo were talking about Senator Barack Jesus Maria Santos Dominicus Baptismo Nomuslimo Obama???

I’ll repeat it for the obama idiots who are pooping their panties:

Hie’s hiding the religious designation of Muslim on his Certificate of Live Birth.

And only because he lied about it and can’t figure a way to spin it.

It opens the door for more questions: Did you ever practice? When did you stop? And this could mean more lies that could come back to haunt him if he continues lying.

He lied and can’t get out of it now!

And just incase thts not clear, lets repeat it one more time. Because as we all know the citizenship issue is just another old style political distraction. Here is the real issue:

Hie’s hiding the religious designation of Muslim on his Certificate of Live Birth.

And only because he lied about it and can’t figure a way to spin it.

It opens the door for more questions: Did you ever practice? When did you stop? And this could mean more lies that could come back to haunt him if he continues lying.

He lied and can’t get out of it now!

ITS HIS LISTED RELIGIOUS STATUS THAT WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO HIDE – BET ON IT!!!

THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION
THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION
THE CITIZENSHIP ISSUE IS A DISTRACTION

I think Obama was born in a manger because there was no room at the inn. The manger however, was in Kenya — and he cannot be president.

Susan

please ban Guy Incognito for spamming the thread with posts filled with “-” + Line returns.

Aha, a fake. Knew it was a fake by race saying African. No such thing back in 1961. The word black wasn’t even used. It was Negroid or Negro back then.

The crux of the matter is this: If Snotbucket has nothing to hide, why make matters worse by sealing the real birth certificate. The only reason someone would hide a document is there is something on it he doesn’t want the general public to see. Whether it says his religion is Muslim to the fact that maybe someone lied and it is a late recording of a birth which might lead lots of questions as to why it was filed late and then to someone finding out he wasn’t even born in the U.S. at all. What else could there be on it that has him so paranoid about releasing it?

Oy Freakin’ Vey we have reason to question why he doesn’t want his birth certificate released and it is not just paranoia. He may not even be eligible to run for President. If it turns out he isn’t a U.S. citizen they can’t just pass a law that says he can run because then Ahnoooold in California would have a conniption fit because he’s a naturalized citizen and has wanted to run for President but he can’t. He’d put up a big stink and the Terminator would be after skinny ass Barky. It would set too big a precedent to let a naturalized citizen run for Pres.

Don’t try to reason with a Obamaborg.

The Collective just keep repeating the same nonthinking talking points.

“Oabama has more delegates” (ignoring that he did not have ENOUGH)

“Obama is a citizen” Yeah, and so the fuck what? So is Arnold.

Sheesh. It’s like WHACK A MOLE. Impossible to shut the mindless buggers up.

They have no shame and have used worse tactics…he needs to be banned instantly, but more Obamathugs will employ the same desperate pathetic methods.

No knucklehead, some faiths like my own assume one of the parents religon. My birth certificate states that I’m a Catholic because that is what my father was. I believe Jewish people take the faith of the mother. The Koran states that the father is the deciding factor. So therefore, logically his birth certificate would read Muslem. He knows this would be a problem for a post 911 world. So he feels he has to hide it, why I’m not sure. I believe we already have a Muslem congressman, or is it senator? I’m guessing Obama actually praticed it for a while before converting to that nasty racist Wright church.

The LA Times has his live birth certificate

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html

he was born in Hawaii on Aug. 4, 1961, at 7:24 p.m

Yes, Susan & Larry, please get rid of Guy. Jeremiah, I agree with you that he’s hiding something. My God, could his campaign get any wierder.

Also–thanks YoNoForObama for explaining that law in a way that made it easier to understand.

I’ve been posting here for a few months as “annie”, but now I see there are other “annies” posting, so, like Strawberry, I changing to “socalannie” which is what I post under on other sites & on TM (back in good ole days).

I have a difference of opinion on this one with you Mimi. I agree it probably states his religion is Muslim but that would be something I think he would be too easily brush off for lying about. He’s showed he’s Teflon man and able to weather small storms.

I really think his citizenship is what is questionable here and I don’t think they would move heaven and earth to let him run as a “naturalized citizen”. Arnold Swartzenegger has wanted to run for President and has been unable to because of the citizenship issue. Arnold would be screaming bloody murder if they made an exception for old Barky and it would set a really bad precedent all the way around that they’ve kept a California governor from running but they’ll make an exception for Obama. I know you think everyone and their mother is in the tank for Obama (and I do too) but not to this extent. I think the Repubs behind Arnold would be screaming bloody murder if they tried that. The Repubs aren’t just going to roll over and play dead.

And besides, if barky can demand that Hillary release her taxes and demand McCain release his medical records and he demanded that one of his political opponents open up is divorce records, than we can demand that Barky release his medical records and a copy of his real birth certificate. Turn about and all that.

agree, mimi, re the lying. also, the pattern of going to great lengths to hide/dissemble/cover up – very nixonian.

as with nixon, it’s not so much the thing – it’s the coverup of the thing.

re obama – either he was born in kenya, in which case he’s not eligible for the presidency – but the coverup operation will ensure that we never know – or he was born in hawaii, as he claims, but his birth certificate shows his religion as muslim and/or his illegitimate status, which we don’t give a hoot about, but which he has taken great pains to deny, thereby revealing once again his lying ways.

one way or another, obama is once again revealing himself to be a liar.

with nixon, we had to wait for his almost-impeachment and his resignation – unprecedented events. hopefully, with obama, it will not come to that.

the current democratic-led congress would never take action against obama, no matter what facts come out. but if, heaven help us, he is elected, odds are high that the repubs will take over congress in two years and they will treat him the way the gingrich types treated the clintons in the 90s.

the difference is that the clintons are hardy and obambi is weak. he will fold like the cardboard cutout he is.

I’m guessing Obama actually praticed it for a while before converting to that nasty racist Wright church.

I hate to bring up such pesky issues as EVIDENCE but can you please provide some? I could say whatever I wanted about Hillary Clinton- HEY PEOPLE SAY SHE ORDERED THAT VINCE FOSTER TO BE KILLED- but that wouldnt make it true would it? Although thats in keeping with larry Johnson’s standards of evidence-’I dont have the tape but I know people who have seen it so it must be there’. No offence mate, but the burden of proof is on you to prove any link to Obama and Islam aside from the birth certificate (he didnt really have a choice in that did he?)I can agree with you that Wright’s church was racist though and for me the single most damaging thing about Obama.

even the corrupt dnc can’t change the constitution. and the constitution is the supreme law of the land.

any law the corrupt congress might pass enabling a non-natural-born citizen to be president would be unconstitutional. the only way to legally change it would be a constitutional amendment, ratified by two-thirds of the states, a process that would take years (and likely only benefit schwarzenegger).

another ms. lawyer.

I am not a lawyer. However, this depends on HI state law at the time. If O’s mother and father had a wedding, registered it, AND the mother did not know about the first wife and no divorce, then the “marriage” of O’s parents is not automatically void.

The wife could be seen as a putative spouse- that means that she would have been afforded the protections of family court in a dissolution.

Sorry Mimi it wasn’t you. I apologize. It is Jeremiah I have a difference of opinion with.

the bill wasn’t necessary, as the law is clear and there was never any doubt that mccain qualifies.

maybe obambi decided to play along with the unnecessary bill to cover his own butt? who knows? irrelevant anyway.

Mary — what kind of dipchit was Obama’s mom to marry a guy with another wife. Could it be that Obama was the product of a one night stand.

It would seem to me that Kenya is the place to check because what difference would it have made to his mother whether he was considered Kenyan or American. She had no way of knowing that he would run for President. Obama is freaking out now because he knows he has a natural born citizenship problem would make him ineligible to run for the Presidency.

wikipedia as the source of knowledge about the law? interesting and pathetic concept.

EXCLUSIVE: Who is Mohammed Al-Churbaji?: Key Al-Qaeda Terrorist “Abu Salim’s” Son is Barack Obama Fundraiser

One of Al-Qaeda’s top terrorists still in America was recently on trial for deportation. And almost no-one noticed.

I was the only journalist to cover the April/May trial of Mohammed Al-Churbaji a/k/a “Abu Salim,” a/k/a “Abu Mohammed Salim,” at Immigration Court in Detroit.

And the Al-Churbaji trial was illustrative of the multiple Achilles heels of American counterterrorism and immigration policies:

Mohammed Imad Al-Churbaji is one of Al-Qaeda’s top terrorists in America. His connections at the top of Al-Qaeda are tight and span the global Al-Qaeda network, from Syria to Hamburg to Spain to Afghanistan to Peshawar to Ein El-Hilweh and Dunniyeh, Lebanon, to Ann Arbor, Michigan, to HAMAS operations in Richardson, Texas.

[...]

But even if Al-Churbaji is deported, at least two of his six children, a son and a daughter, were both born here and are by law U.S. citizens. These terrorist anchor babies can carry on what he started.

One of them is his son, Mohamed Salim Al-Churbaji a/k/a Salim Alchurbaji (heretofore referred to as, “Salim”). He is a student at the University of Michigan and serves as a Barack Obama fundraiser and organizer, according to Salim’s own testimony. He testified that he, Salim, has made at least one recent trip to terrorist host state Syria, their father’s native country, but his brother testified that it was actually at least two trips, including one in the last year-and-a-half.

[...]

A ruling by Immigration Judge Elizabeth Hacker–whom this site has praised in the past for her insightful decisions deporting Islamic terrorists–is expected to issue a decision on Al-Churbaji, late this summer. Hopefully, she will make a similarly wise decision here. But even if she rules he must be deported (for the second time), he can still appeal the decision all the way up to the Supreme Court, which could take years, while he remains on our soil and fathers more American citizen terrorist anchor babies.

In the meantime, this hardened Al-Qaeda terrorist–Mohammed Al-Churbaji–is free as a bird on American soil. And his son continues to be a fixture of the Barack Obama campaign . . . when he’s not making mysterious trips to Syria.

I’m guessing Obama actually praticed it for a while before converting to that nasty racist Wright church.

Hate to bring up pesky issues like EVIDENCE but do you have any aside from your gut feeling and the fact that his father was once a muslim?

JR I think the Republicans will be all over this after the Convention when they are sure he’s the nominee. If they destroyed him now Hillary would be the nominee.

It would be good to know what was on your birth certificate. Can you tell us?

Well if barky would release his damned Birth certificate, we wouldn’t be arguing now would we, toots? And yes I demand to see it, if he can demand to see Hillary’s taxes. What are you guys hiding?

the difference between arnold’s citizenship and barrys is miles apart.

Neither of arnolds parents were citizens at his birth.

Its the religious designation on his certificate…bet on it.

its the religion issue and his campaign has been the one that actually made it such a big issue.

His constant denials of being muslim having been muslim that it was a smear all the protestations…thats would not be able to be brushed off.

People would classify him as a manchurian candidate for lying about it and hiding it and then trying to brush it off.

My spidey sense tells me thats where the money shot is on this one.

The issue of his eligibility is so borderline that it’s senate resolutionable, and thats assuming he was born overseas.

SOmeone check Stanley Dunhams pasport records and see where she was during the 3 months prior and 3 months after barry’s birth.

I think Obama has a member of his campaign team that runs a company that con do that no?

Well if barky would release his damned Birth certificate, we wouldn’t be arguing now would we, toots? And yes I demand to see it, if he can demand to see Hillary’s taxes. What are you guys hiding?

No the point I was disputing was someone’s assertion that he had once been a practising Muslim. Im sure his certificate would say he was a Muslim as his father was at the time but that would mean he was only a Muslim by birth.
And as for the ‘what are you guys hiding’- well Im not one of them. I think he is a credible candidate and at times I lean towards supporting him, but Im still more neutral than not. I dont defend him here because I belive in his change shtick- its more of a devil’s advocate thing. I just believe he is being savaged out of proportion to his ‘crimes’.

chicagoagainstobama.wordpress.com/2008/06/15/by-telling-the-truthbarack-obamas-half-brother-malikbecomes-public-enemy-number-1for-obamas-smear-stoppers/

Far be it from me to question Barack Obama’s half Brother.

After all while Barack Obama is not a man i wish to know personally, he is a man that his borther would know.

http://chicagoagainstobama.wordpress.com/2008/06/15/by-telling-the-truthbarack-obamas-half-brother-malikbecomes-public-enemy-number-1for-obamas-smear-stoppers/

link should work now

“just believe he is being savaged out of proportion to his ‘crimes’.”

Hmm…I think you’ll have a hard time floating that one. The problem is that he (Obama) gets away with all his “crimes” and his blog warriors and the msm just continue to praise him for his “greatness”.

Someone, somewhere has to take a good long look at this guy so it might as well be us. I’m sorry if we’re causing you discomfort, but after all Huffpo & kos are just a couple of clicks away!

The phrase “a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution”
was surely meant to accommodate for being able to elect a president from among the people who became citizens when the U.S. became a country.

Otherwise, they’d have had to go at least 35 years without a president.

Carolyn Kay
MakeThemAccountable.com

I think all 3 or 4 of his grandmothers are still alive. The racist one who raised him is put away from the public. His step-grandmother (the first wife of O’s dad) is the Kenyan who O treated like a grandma.

His constant denials of being muslim having been muslim that it was a smear all the protestations…thats would not be able to be brushed off
Thats an interesting debate- if he said ‘I have never been a Muslim’ and his certificate said he was at birth what would that mean? After all his mum raised him and there is no evidence he practised Islam in any way shape, or form

Hmm…I think you’ll have a hard time floating that one. The problem is that he (Obama) gets away with all his “crimes” and his blog warriors and the msm just continue to praise him for his “greatness”.

Someone, somewhere has to take a good long look at this guy so it might as well be us. I’m sorry if we’re causing you discomfort, but after all Huffpo & kos are just a couple of clicks away!

Oh Im not uncomfortable at all or I wouldnt even be visiting the site. I do read Kos and Huffington but with Kos the vitriol is often even worse than here. And while I agree with you that the MSM has by and large been more lenient on him than Hillary, I do think it has asked the tough questions- witness the media furore over the Wright affair. I think the media criticism has become a lot stronger down the line- it was very muted in the first few months of his campaign.
So yes I do like visiting his site even though I dont agree with the vast majority of you. I like to read opinions different from my own and I like to debate people with those opinions.

intestesting site. So as the family in Africa states that BO’s Father was a muslim, the Hawaii birth cert would have probably listed the Fathers religion that way.

Still, I thought that was already known about the Father. Wasn’t it in one of Barky’s books or something?

He’ll get a forged birth certificate if he has to. He’s deceitful.

dont listen to me- i got it a little wrong above.

His step grandma was one of the four wives of his grandpa. Sorry- it gets very confusing. O’s Kenyan granddad had 4 wives and O’s dad had 3 wives and one lover. 8 children in total from O’s dad. O’s step dad also had children or a child from O’s mother.

okay

then you should investigate a bit more about how credible a candidate he would actually be.

feel free to read the multi part investigative piece done by Evelyn Pringle here:

Barack Obama – The Wizard of Oz
opednews.com/articles/genera_none_080328_barck_obama___the_wi.htm

Barack Obama – Operation Board Games For Slumlords
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080404_barack_obama___opera.htm

Barack Obama – Subplots of Operation Board Games – Part I
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080418_barack_obama___subpl.htm

Curtain Time for Barack Obama – Part II
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080513_curtain_time_for_bar.htm

Curtain Time for Barack Obama – Part III
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080515_curtain_time_for_bar.htm

Curtain Time for Barack Obama – Part IV
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080516_curtain_time_for_bar.htm

Curtain Time for Barack Obama – Part V
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080518_curtain_time_for_bar.htm

Final Chapter – Curtain Time for Barack Obama
opednews.com/articles/genera_evelyn_p_080522_final_chapter___curt.htm

Then enjoy this little piece about how Barry got his Accomplishment Groove on:
houstonpress.com/2008-02-28/news/barack-obama-screamed-at-me/print

too many links so just cut and paste.

There is much much more but i think thats more than enough reading material for one sitting.

It is your obligation as an american to question and scrutinize the candidacy of every man or woman who asks you to entrust your country to them.

If they deny you that priveledge, deny them your vote.

True, true…I wonder how he’ll list his fathers race on that one? Will he stick with “African”, or go bold with something like “Kennedysian”.

The information regarding Hawaiian law is interesting. But I think that the Constitution – particularly the 14th Amendment – would override any state law.

As long as Obama’s birth certificate is legit, he is qualified to run for President.

Yes, the 14th Amendment ensures that each citizen enjoy the privileges of citizenship in every state.

This means that no STATE can make a law that takes away 1st Amendment protections, for example. The 14th is NOT a grant of power where states can determine US citizenship. The 14th tells the states not to make laws which abridge citizenship.

The problem here is that if the birth certificate comes out and there is no political dirt, many people will come on here saying ‘well it must be forged then’. A lot of people have basically made up their minds although they claim to be keeping an open mind as they wait for the evidence.

This is an Obama interview with NYT Kristof 3/6/2007

http://select.nytimes.com/2007/03/06/opinion/06kristo
f.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

“I was a little Jakarta street kid,” he said in a wide-ranging interview in his office. He once got in trouble for making faces during Koran study classes in his elementary school, but a president is less likely to stereotype Muslims as fanatics — and more likely to be aware of their nationalism — if he once studied the Koran with them.

Indonesia is an Islamic country (obviously). One of the key rules in Sharia law is that non-Muslims must not attend Muslim classes and nor may Muslim students attend a non-Islamic religous class.

So, if Obama is in Koran class.. then he’s regarded as a Muslim by society!

Mr. Obama recalled the opening lines of the Arabic call to prayer, reciting them with a first-rate accent. In a remark that seemed delightfully uncalculated (it’ll give Alabama voters heart attacks), Mr. Obama described the call to prayer as “one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset.”

How many non-arabic speaking people who aren’t Muslim or were never Muslim can do the call to prayer in perfect Arabic?

Thanks for bringing this out. So its been in the mainstream, why doesn’t he release his birth certificate? Why is it a secret?

He’ll get a forged birth certificate if he has to. He’s deceitful.

A deceitful politician? Running for President? Get out of here! This is going to set a bad precedent surely? Out of genuine curiousity what did Hillary’s supporters think of her fibs like the ‘sniper fire’ incident? I wasnt reading this site at the time.

i think its the religion of the birth child that is the big secret they are trying to hide.

If its listed as muslim…suddenly we have a problem, not because its muslim but because Barky has spent so much political capital denying he was ever a muslim or practiced islam and that people just say that to smear him.

This would make snipergate look like romper room.

This would make snipergate look like romper room.

Sounds great! I wish it could happen soon!

I would imagine about the same that Barack Obama loons thought abut the “My Uncle (who was in the navy by the way) Liberated Auschwitz” comment.

Are you sure your not an obama troll?

Let me know when you read those articles M, i want to see how much they conflict with the talking points Axelfraud hands out to you at your internet warroom desk each morning.

We thought it was just another false accusation against the voters’ preferred candidate, fueled by a misogynistic media, in conjunction with Obama’s dirty campaign.

Are you sure your not an obama troll?

You have accused me of this before but repeating it over and over again is not going to make it true- unless your definition of troll is someone who does not agree with you.
And I havent denied that Obama can be deceitful(although as for the concentration camp story, I do recall that he said the wrong camp but corrected it later- certainly not a difficult mistake to make but correct me if Im wrong) My point is that virtually all politicians are deceitful-not that Obama isnt deceitful. I brought up Hillary just to show that your high horse might not be so high after all.

How does repeating a lie about Hillary prove that “virtually all politicians are deceitful”? Have another hit off the Hope Bong.

At what point are candidates vetted? Why is this issue coming up now if there are questions about his legitimacy as a citizen? Does our country allow just anyone to run for the Presidency if there is a questions about their citizenship? Surely we don’t just take their word for it! Any person applying for a visa, let alone naturalization, goes through extensive background checks and would not pass the test with the type of associates Obama has had for years! I can’t imagine that a person could run and not be screened, including proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that he meets Federal laws of citizenship.

I’d really like for someone who knows to answer at what point someone/anyone checks out people running for the highest office!

How does repeating a lie about Hillary prove that “virtually all politicians are deceitful”? Have another hit off the Hope Bong.

Thank you very much for your offer but I respectfully decline- love the way everyone who defends Obama becomes characterized in that 2D way. ‘You are just addicted to hope!’ etc. As Ive mentioned before Im not really an Obama supporter but you wont believe me so Ill just let it slide.
Anyway do tell me how I lied? Was Hillary’s ‘sniper’ thing something we all imagined? Run me through it please.

I’ve heard from two different sources that know what Hawaii’s “certification of live birth” looks like that in addition to what was shown on the front of Obama’s, on the reverse should be a stamped state seal in the middle and a stamped registrar’s name and signature with the date the copy of the certification was made.
The only thing that shows through from the back in Obama’s is the date. Why doesn’t this other information show through? At the very least what was released is incomplete. You have to show both sides to confirm it is an authentic document with the stamped signature of the state registrar.

-Bob

I think when it says “or a citizen of the US” that part is contingent on the “at the time of the signing of this Constitution” part. Thus, only natural born citizens can be president. The other part was just to cover those who were in the room or in the country at the time the Constitution was formed.

If you’re not born in America, you’re not eligible. Sorry, Arnold.

Actually, you didn’t defend Obama at all. You merely changed the subject–a favorite logical fallacy of Obamites. Not that I’m calling you an Obamite.

Actually, you didn’t defend Obama at all. You merely changed the subject–a favorite logical fallacy of Obamites. Not that I’m calling you an Obamite.

Well your accusation is correct but only if you take that comment in isolation. I’ve defended him through the rest of the thread as well. And I was changing the subject by talking about Hillary which I would argue is extremely relevant as he did run against her and this site is by and large Pro-Hillary. Surely discussing Hillary and Obama in conjunction is not a logical fallacy?
And you still you havent proved to me how I lied. I stated that Hillary had lied about being under fire when landing in Bosnia. You said I am repeating a ‘lie’. Im still waiting as to how that is untrue.

I’d normally say “you’re kidding”, but you sound too stupid to be kidding about such stuff. Regardless, Hawaii’s status as an American state is fait accompli, an established fact. While there is a strong case to be made regarding the sovereignty of the Hawaiian people, Leon Siu isn’t the guy to make it.

FYI, Siu is a colorful eccentric who two months ago led a small band of political malcontents in an attempt to re-occupy Iolani Palace in the name of the reconstituted Kingdom of Hawaii. Read his press release at the bottom of the link:

“A Declaration of Independence, authored by His Majesty Edmund Kelii Silva, Jr. and signed by Prime Minister and Regent Samuel Keolamauloa Kaluna, Jr. and the Hawaiian House of Nobles, proclaims the Kingdom restored and states the intent of the Kingdom of Hawaii to purchase back its lands and govern them under an independent constitutional monarchy.”

Does this sound like a guy you want to take seriously?

Barack Obama was born in Hawaii two years after statehood. His mother was a U.S. citizen. Ergo, Barack Obama is a citizen.

Case closed.

The world is a heck of a lot more complex than it was back then.

Look at education. Your average high school graduate knows more now than university graduates in Lincoln’s time. It’s called progress.

That’s common tactic with Muslims too. I’m not saying that person is.

Seems clear to me. He was born in the US, Period.

Jesus Christ! Barack Obama was born in Honolulu. Both pparents were students at the University of Hawaii. That makes Obama a natural-born citizen.

That is a fact that is not subject to debate, except perhaps by a bunch of fuckin’ morons.

Citizenship has nothing to do with the ability to run for President. There is a differnt, higher, requirement in the Constitution.

Even if both of Obama’s parents were citizens, but he was born in Australia, he would not qualify.

Since its not in doubt, lets just show the Birth Certificate then. We show it to stary school. get a driver’s license and to get a passport, but not to run for President?

Probably because there’s no such thing as “Queens Memorial”. The name of the hospital is “The Queen’s Medical Center.”

Anyway, the record of his birth would not be at the hospital, but with the state. Here’s Obama’s birth certificate, courtesy of the L.A. Times.

This is a legal copy of his birth certificate, as issued by the State of Hawaii. You haven’t a fucking clue as to what you’re talking about, and you’re simply full of shit.

You’re a fucking moron. Here’s Obama’s birth certificate.

Not true.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/legislation-int.html

Congress passed a special, non-binding resolution stating “Resolved, That John Sidney McCain, III, is a ‘natural born Citizen’ under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.”

It was not necessary since the Panama Canal Zone was a U.S. Territory at the time of McCain’s birth (it reverted to Panama in 2000). Had he merely been born in a U.S. military base, the question would be somewhat different.

And I have to agree with the bloggers who suggest the actual place of birth is critical to the legitimacy of Obama’s ability to serve as (or even run for) POTUS.

Dude, you’re in Hawaii.. what are you so angry for?

No – the clause: “a citizen of the United States” refers to the next phrase “at the time of the adoption of this Constitution” because some of the Framers of the Constitution (e.g., Alexander Hamilton) had not been born in the United States (or what had then been the Colonies), but they were clearly dedicated patriots – many of whom had served in the Revolutionary War – and they wanted to ensure that foreign leaders would not be able to make mischief in our presidential elections. The notion of foreign “cabals” was very real to them and was one of the reasons that the presidential electors meet in their respective states and not in one place to cast their ballots for president.

Given what the Hawaii law states – Sen. Obama is not eligible to serve as POTUS.

That said – it is doubtful (much like McCain’s being born in the Canal Zone) that anything will be made of it. To “disqualify” him on a “technicality” (his mother was too young to make his citizenship automatic) at this point (after all concerned have believed that he was always eligible) would be seriously problematic (don’t forget the threats of violence that have come from Obama’s camp, if he is not the Democratic nominee!).

Still, he should release his birth certificate. What exactly is he hiding?

Citizenship does not require any parents to be born in the US. The child has to be born in the US.

IMHO, this is a non-issue. If obama was born in the us all those nuianced arguments are irrelevant. Obama is not quailied to be president and it is not because his father was born in kenya–it is because he has NO EXPERIENCE to be president.

Also not true. Many Americans hold dual U.S./Canadian citizenship. One of my mother’s best friends is a U.S. citizen living in Ontario. She married a Canadian citizen, and their children are citizens of both nations. That being said, I am quite sure that they would not be eligible to run for POTUS.

This is an official copy of Barack Obama’s birth certificate, as issued by the Department of Health of the State of Hawaii. The department does not issue facsimilies of the original document as a matter of state policy. Further, this copy would be embossed with the state seal to attest to its authenticity.

Hey! I resemble that remark. Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk.

Well isn’t that informative. But unfortunately it doesn’t clarify a damned thing. The law is VERY specific as it should be. And being born in the USA does not necessarily qualify someone for citizenship.

Mary, unlike other states, the official seal is on the reverse side. So to show the complete document they need to show both sides. That’s the only way to know it is authentic.

– Bob

ROTFLMAO! That is NOT the BC from the hospital. It is NOT the original. Where’s the ORIGINAL? I have MY original BC. Where’s his? He’s hiding something. That’s why he won’t release his original BC.

ROFLMAO!

except those are the requirements for citizenship not the requirements of becoming President of the US

And how do you know this to be true? Have you seen his original Birth Certificate?

Here it is.

This is a legally valid copy for public use. The Hawaii Department of Health does not issue xeroxed copies or facsimilies of original signed birth certificates as a matter of state policy.

Everyone seems to think Obama is a Muslim except maybe Howard Dean and the rest of Obama’s cult. Even Farrakhan thinks obama is a Muslim. hell Farrakhan said “Obama is the hope of the world”. In the eyes of the Islamic peoples all other people of varying religions are considered infidels, ungodly, unclean, pagans. I am sure Farrakhan would never say a none-Islamic is the “hope of the world”. Hell yes Obama is muslim-a RADICAL muslim.

IMHO, this is a non-issue. If obama was born in the us all those nuianced arguments are irrelevant. Obama is not quailied to be president and it is not because his father was born in kenya–it is because he has NO EXPERIENCE to be president.

A very salient point which suprisingly has hardly been mentioned in this whole affair. Picking on the minor points and ignoring the bigger ones is not an effective tactic to defeat Obama. Another example is the whole ‘videotape’ non-story. There are so many valid criticisms one can make of Obama-his ‘unconditional negotiations’ thing for example- it seems ridiculous that this phantom videotape is being given so much credence and talked about as some kind of smoking gun.

Mary, I have heard from two people one who has his own and another one who’s relative has one that the state seal and registrars seal are on the REVERSE side.
Think about it. These certifications can be used as an official indication of someones date of birth and citizenship. There HAS to be a signature somewhere of a state official attesting to it’s validity.

– Bob

No kidding! I am so sick of these lite thinkers throwing out the erroneous “Lincoln was inexperienced” crap. Don’t they make you study history in school anymore? Used to be the life of great Americans like Lincoln and Washington was required reading. Can’t they at least watch the History Channel Or at least acknowledge the fact that we have read a biography? Get a real argument!

of parents one of whom is an alien

I have no problem at all accepting that at least one of Barack’s parents was an alien.

I am fairly certain the Constitution doesn’t allow for Presidents that were born on another planet.

This diary is so ill-informed as to border on the embarrassing.

State law does not define citizenship. The 14th Amendment to the US Constitution does, and it states that anyone born in the United States is a US citizen. Period. End of story.

[...] over to Larry Johnson’s and find that he’s still trying to perpetuate the rumor that Obama isn’t an American citizen…something neither COB6 nor I questioned when the crap was flying around in the middle of last [...]

What if you’re born in Saudi Arabia?

(just kidding)

Here is a zoomed portion of this document.
I have enclosed the interesting portions in red.
http://www.tbof.us/images/misc/bczoom.jpg

Notice how on the left the green bar is covered completely by the letter R.

You don’t see green inside the letter R because it appears that the text of this document has been pasted on to it from another document.

If you’re born in the US, you’re a US citizen. It doesn’t matter who your parents are. It’s why some of the “I Hate Mexicans” politicians get so pissed off about the whole “anchor baby” business. Look at Alberto “I Went To Harvard Law, TOO” Gonzalez. His parents were illegals, he’s a US citizen.

Look at the hassles the Bush administration has had dealing with “terrists” who have US passports by virtue of being born in the USA.

I want to see BHO’s original–not a reissued copy–birth certificate because there’s SOMETHING on the original he doesn’t want us to see. Maybe his parents weren’t married (well, considering that Dad had four “wives” total, that could be, it’s not a big deal) and he’s embarrassed about that. Maybe his original name was different (how could it matter, really?)…but he’s hiding something, there. What it is, who knows?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jun/01/barackobama.uselections2008

Maybe Obama does not want to produce birth certificate because he is lying about his age. It’s possible he was born before Hawaii became a state and he rewrote his age and history to run for office. Someone should tell Obama that the “Rulz” are the “Rulz” for being president and he needs to produce birth certificate and passport pronto.

“There is a birth certificate in Mobassa Kenya for him and so far no legal one has shown up in Hawaii.”

That’s bullshit.

Courtesy of the Los Angeles Times, this is a legally valid copy as issued by the Department of Health of the State of Hawaii.

So, as far as U.S. (not Hawaiian but U.S. law goes, is this the technicality which might disqualify him because his mother’s residency does not meet the standard of at least 5 years after the age of fourteen? –

(quote)”….parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years…”(quote)

Legislation does not trump the Constitution. That’s basic law 101 that any partisans on either side of the Clinton/Obama divide who are attorneys learned in their 1st 30 minutes of law school.

DHS has nothing to do with deportation orders. It doesn’t matter if the parents are parents of a US citizen.

The US citizen child cannot be deported, but the parents can and will normally take their child with them if they are deported.

The alien parents are free, of course, to leave their citizen child with relatives in the US.

Once the child is a certain age (18?), he/she can petition to have the parents granted legal immigration status based on relationship to a citizen. Even that scenario can entail a lengthy wait.

On the other hand, the Senate seems to be stepping in on these fuzzy questions and maybe they can “revise” for Obama the way they did for McCain. In April the Senate passed a resolution clearing up the “Panama Canal Zone” birth of John McCain — this is from Patrick Leahy’s senate web site:

(quote) Senators Say McCain Eligible For Presidential Run

WASHINGTON (Wednesday, April 30, 2008) – The Senate tonight unanimously passed a bipartisan resolution expressing the sense of the Senate that John McCain, a U.S. Senator from Arizona currently serving his fourth term in the Senate, is eligible to run for President of the United States. McCain is the presumptive Republican nominee for the presidency.

McCain was born on a U.S. military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936 to American citizens. In February, The New York Times published a report calling into question the legality of McCain’s presidential run based on whether he is a “natural born Citizen,” as required by the Constitution. The issue was recently analyzed by former Solicitor General Theodore Olson and Harvard Law School Professor Laurence Tribe, both of whom concluded that McCain is a natural born citizen within the meaning of the Constitution.

The bipartisan resolution was introduced on April 10 by Sens. Claire McCaskill (D-Mo.), Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), and Tom Coburn (R-Okla.). It is also supported by Democratic presidential candidates Sens. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) and Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.), and Sen. Jim Webb (D-Va.). The Senate Judiciary Committee, which Leahy chairs and of which Coburn is a member, unanimously reported the resolution on April 24, and the Senate swiftly passed the measure.

“This bipartisan resolution erases any doubt that Senator McCain is eligible to run for president,” said Leahy. “The Senate was right to quickly pass this measure, and we can now put to rest any question of his eligibility.”

“There’s no question in my mind that Senator McCain is eligible to become president, and I’m proud that my colleagues in the Senate came together on this resolution to help quickly put this debate to rest,” McCaskill said.

“John McCain was born while his father was fulfilling his patriotic duty to his country. Even though they were not standing on American soil, his father’s uniform still proudly displayed the flag of this nation. John McCain and his family have a proven record of public service and sacrifice and I am proud to support this bipartisan resolution recognizing the fact that John McCain is a natural born citizen,” said Coburn.

McCain has served in the U.S. Congress representing Arizona in both the House of Representatives and the Senate.(end quote)

It’s elementary. Alaska and Hawaii were adopted as States, and that’s why we have 50 of them. Are you smarter than a fifth grader?

The point is that he was born a Muslim (Kenyan father), and as a boy in Indonesia (living with his Muslim stepfather) went to school as a Muslim, studied the Koran, went to the Mosque (admitted in his own autobiography); there are pictures of him as old as 24 years of age in Muslim garb with his half brother, also a Muslim (who happened to mention when interviewed last week that Barack was a Muslim). Now, OB flat out denies that he EVER was a Muslim – that’s a lie! It’s the cover up!

It’s easy to dismiss this as silliness like I did when McCain faced the same question back in 2000. But then you look at all the lawyers and constitutional scholars McCain consulted with, as well as the bill in congress, and obviously many people had some concerns. Earlier this year the McCain campaign was again consulting with lawyers and Obama went and consponsored that bill declaring Mccain “natural born” for the purpose of the presidency.

Since the issue has been brought up regarding McCain, Obama should expect it to be brought up regarding him too. If Obama wasn’t so arrogant, he would release all the documents necessary and put the matter to rest.

When this race first started I researched htis subject. i don’t know how true this is but in March I read he had dual citizenship and in fact was born in Kenya. Mom flew to Hawaii and registered his birth 2 days after he was born. Can this be what he is hiding? Dual citizenship and the fact that the one in Kenya that says he is a muslim? Who views the paperwork to declare he is eligble to even be President it should be shown publicly! Where can I find more information about this lawsuit I read it mentioned on gretawire that it was going to court this week. I asked for source and never saw one. Any one else have the 411 on it?
http://www.hillaryloyalistnowformccain.com

I can tell you right now he’s not a naturalized citizen because last I checked Hell is not one of the 50 United States…

Interesting.

W.W.B.D.? (What Would Barack Do?) if he was facing an opponent in a similar situation?

Go ask Alice (Walker).

Donald “from Hawaii” – you’ve posted that link a zillion times. It’s not a birth certificate, and everyone appears to know it except you (which is curious, you being from Hawaii and all that).

It’s positively stupifying how silly this is getting! ~ To “DonaldfromHawaii”, alright aleady, we get it, it’s your job to spread the word of the “birth certificate” anywhere and everywhere you can, complete with added profanity for more, yanno, emphasis? (YAWN) You need to chill, snack on some pineapple, make a lei. Your redundancy is giving away your desperation.
To “GuyinCognito”, well what can I say, that ‘cognito’ place must be really boring, they seem to be a people of limited words, with mucho space between the ears.
If BAOB has nothing to hide on his CoB and wants to put this to rest, all he has to do is release it , say for instance, at a press conference? Then he can throw that under the bus, too!
PS ~ My name is really JillFromVenus, I’m still putting the finishing touches on my Venutian CoB, damn laser printer is out for repair!~
What a country!

Sign the petition: I included the lovely Donnna Brazile.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/65/petition-for-howard-dean-to-resign-as-dnc-chair

I can tell you right now he’s not a naturalized citizen because last I checked Hell is not one of the 50 United States…

Heat Index of 104° here yesterday for an outdoor fish-fry. Reminded me of William Tecumsah Sherman’s quote about his time commanding Union forces in Texas after the civil War: “If I owned Hell and Texas, I’d live in Hell and rent out Texas.”

Gosh, that Sherman quote was funny!

Seriously though, my comment above was only a joke to lighten the mood, but I agree with several of the other commenters up-thread. I don’t care where Obama was born, he isn’t qualified to be president because he sorely lacks the experience. I don’t care if he wiggled from Abraham Lincoln’s loins! Why in God’s name would any of his “defenders” here even consider him ready to be leader of the free world? Sheesh!

LOL! Good one, Sugar. But I think we annexed hell. There’s 57 states now.

Perhaps the law in Hawaii was set up to make sure there was not an influx of “outsiders” claiming US citizenship soon after it became a state.

So, for example, because it was a new state, there was a law adopted specific for it that attempted to achieve this purpose. It would be important to read the legislative history of that law…to see the intent of the legislators.

I bet Larry Johnson checks out the next “ooh! ooh!” research his friend ‘Katherine’ sends him before he posts it and makes a fool out of himself. Ya think?

And for those of you who (still!) haven’t heard about the debunking of the Obama birth certificate rumor, I suggest you click on the thumbnail:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html

Now aren’t you embarrassed? Or are you just going to jump on the next conspiracy-theory bandwagon you can find?

Actually, yes, being born in the USA does necessarily qualify someone for citizenship. However, I believe that McCain was bron in Panama. I wonder how the law applies in that case?

DHS (through its Bureau of Immigration & Customs Enforcement, which used to be housed in DOJ as part of the INS) “has nothing to do with” orders of removal?

Who, then, do you think initiates & pursues proceedings, or carries out removal orders – or, in the case of expedited removal, handles everything?

This is getting way off the subject at hand, but since you threw it out there, please kindly enlighten me. My point was that in the case of anchor babies, DHS can deport the parents, but they may exercise what any immigration lawyer knows is called “prosecutorial discretion.”

FYI, the age requirement you mention, for immediate relative visas, is 21.

When McCain’s Panama birth was questioned earlier this year Congress IMMEDIATELY passed a law to make him qualified to be President. And, they would likely do the same for Obama if it was to turn out that he was born in Kenya.

Bull…his birth certificate is being questioned. It has no authentic embossment and they can find no record of his birth in hospital. We demand to see both. The Dr. attending his birth and etc. Just like all the rest of us authentic Americans have.

You act as though this cannot be questioned. Yet, the Obama camp purused John McCain’s birth issue. That would be the Obama camp as represented by the DNC or some other lame supporter.

This is a good post!!! I have a question; Is anyone, official looking into Obama’s birth certificate? I am a military wife and I can tell you that the Obama birth certificate posted would not work anywhere in the world. It is not official.

Why isn’t someone legally debating this citizenship. Years ago, it was so easy to enter the US on a US passport showing citizenship and obtain a US birth certificate for a newborn. That is, it was easy to accomplish this back when Obama was born. It was seen as acceptable to provide a baby whose parent was a citizen, a US birth certificate. BUT, if Obama was born in Kenya….he is not presidential material. Perhaps his citizenship would never be challenged, but his run for office should be.

where’d ya hear that?

your link isn’t working.

dahhhh…yes. There are hundreds of things surrounding Obama he has hidden from America. Do you honestly think he thought his pastor wouldn’t matter? How about the fact that he worked along side Louis Farrakhan, you know who he is; to organize the Million Man Muslim March in Washington, DC. Did he hide this? Yes he did. How about his cousin Obinga or Odinga, one is his counsin the other his Uncle. He didn’t shout this from the rooftops either. Would he hide his birth certificate? Yes, he probably has been doing that for a long time. The guy is real comfortable with distorting truth.

[...] Larry Johnson today has a new spin on the Obama Birth Certificate rumor: Obama is disqualified by an uncited, unlinked alleged 1952-1986 era Hawaiian state statute requiring both parents to be US citizens for their child to be a US citizen. [...]

Snicker. That’s the same fake certificate they were circulating on dailyKurse

We will overlook Obama’s ineligibility if the Dems overlook Gov. Arnold’s. McCain and the Terminator – that would be an interesting team!

That font was not available in 1961.

where are the signatures?

we’ve been through this.

. The font was not available in 1961

. There is no signature

Obama was living in Indonesia at ages 2 to 6. He returned to Hawaii at age 10. The problem Obama has is,is his mother did not return to the U.S. She remained in Indonesia where she died in 1995. Obama’s mother would have had to return with him and remain in the U.S. 5 yrs after the age of 18..She did not…

Here is what the Law says>>
What are the rules for people born between December 23, 1952 and November 13, 1986?

Again, children born abroad to two US citizen parents were US citizens at birth, as long as one of the parents resided in the US at some point before the birth of the child.

When one parent was a US citizen and the other a foreign national, the US citizen parent must have resided in the US for a total of 10 years prior to the birth of the child, with five of the years after the age of 18. An exception for people serving in the military was created by considering time spent outside the US on military duty as time spent in the US.

While there were initially rules regarding what the child must do to retain citizenship, amendments since 1952 have eliminated these requirements.

Children born out of wedlock to a US citizen mother were US citizens if the mother was resident in the US for a period of one year prior to the birth of the child. Children born out of wedlock to a US citizen father acquired US citizenship only if legitimated before turning 21.

I see I was quoted by someone as an authority on the question of citizenship at birth. If Obama was born in a US state, he is automatically a citizen and would therefore be eligible to run for President even if both parents are non-citizens. The only exception is for certain children of diplomats, obviously not a problem here.

I would also note that physically being born on US soil is not necessary. If that were the case, John McCain might have problems given his birth in Canada. While I have not closely studied the question, the forefathers were aiming to bar naturalized citizens and that children born abroad to US citizens would be considered eligible under a statute on the books since the first Congress in the 18th century. The question is a little more complicated when the child has only one US citizen parent and in that case it would depend on whether the parent spent his or her childhood in the US. That would quite clearly have been met in this case since Obama’s mother, by all accounts, did not live abroad as a child.

If folks want to find reasons to target the Obama candidacy, I’d say they need to keep looking as this one looks pretty clear.

I honestly think that this is a nonstarter. The Constitution supercedes ANY state law, and under the fourteenth amendment, anyone born in the United States is an American citizen–even children of those pesky illegal immigrants. The ONLY reason that state law even enters into it is that this is one way that states can get around providing state to children of illegal immigrants–at least, that’s been my reading of such statutes. And if you do not believe me, consider this–the ONLY document that one needs to obtain a U.S. passport is his/her birth certificate showing that he/she was born on American soil.

The original birth certificate, which presumably is on file, is called the “book form” certificate. It is the one that would have originally been submitted to the custodian of birth records by the attending physican or midwife or perhaps the parents if none was otherwise filed. If might even be a delayed record of birth filed by parent if one was not filed soon after birth. Each state has its own laws on what constitutes a “delayed” record of birth and the evidence required to file one. This book form certificate is the one that needs to be submitted to put this to rest. The document that is being passed off, if real, only verifies that the person was born.

I would hope that there is no problem with his status, even though I am not a supporter. It just seems strange that, for somebody who called out so stridently for Clinton to release records, he is unwilling to put this one to rest.

WELL APPARENTLY IT’S NOT GETTING THROUGH……LOL The Kool Aid has really taken it’s TOLL on a lot of MINDS!

Maybe the Obama campaign thought that an official Certification of Live Birth from the Hawaii Department of Health would be sufficient to quell these absurd rumors. That should be more than enough for reasonable people.

That should read:

The ONLY reason that state law even enters into it is that this is one way that states can get around providing state assistance/resources to children of illegal immigrants–at least, that’s been my reading of such statutes.

That explains why several states have passed legislation to provide for children of illegal immigrants to obtain in-state tuition to attend state universities.

Whatever the reason for the state statute, there is little doubt that the fourteenth amendment supercedes it so that Barack Obama’s state citizenship at the time of birth is not an issue in determining that Barack Obama is, in fact, a U.S. citizen by birth! I agree with others on this matter–if you are looking for a reason to disqualify Obama from running for POTUS, this ain’t it!

The requirement for 2 parents to be Amercian citiens is for a person not born in US territory. It has been the case for a long time now that anyone born in US territory is a natural born citizen (required by the constitution to run for president). Obama was born in Hawaii, a US state at the time of his birth .

I’m confused. How does Hawaii STATE law apply at all?

“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside.”

Hawaii became a State on August 21, 1959

Barack Obama was born August 4, 1961.

Federal laws apply, not State, correct?

Ms Lawyer, when did things change so that a Muslim>>, Farrakan enjoys attending a Christian church? Has it ever occurred to you that for obvious reasons Obama,Wright and Farrakan are hood winking America using the, I’m not a Muslim tactic but all three support one another…Yes Wright has as much Muslim in him as Farrakan…

Under the Muslim law if your daddy is Muslim,you are Muslim…

This question should get the attention of all the skeptics>>> Do you really believe a Muslim will associate with someone that walks away from their Muslim roots to become a Christian?

Why does Obama attend meetings with Muslims..Why did Obama say the Palestinians have suffered more than any other people,including the African American and the Jews?

Out of all the undesirable lunatics Obama is associated with,how many has he actually denounced? ZERO!!! Obama denounced the words by Wright,but not Wright,nor has Obama denounced Rezko,Ayers or any other undesirable lunatic he’s associated with…

Which undesirable lunatic should have denounce first? Ayers should have been the # 1 lunatic,but Obama never has and never will denounce him…

Obama’s campaign said they are friendly with Ayers….Still friendly with a lunatic that said he did not do enough bombing and would do it again…

How can any American vote for a person that is friendly with Terrorist?

but hillary isnt the condidate currnetly is she. The vetting of Ali Obaba must occur.

Obama DOES have dual citizenship with Kenya, as a result of their 1963 Constitution. Here is one link:

http://www.politicalgateway.com/main/columns/read.html?col=731

IF he was born in Kenya that raises another question in my mind. The British did allow Asian Sub-Continent citizens the additional privelege of British Ctizenship. For example, if you were born in India, prior to it becoming an independent country in 1949, you had Indian and British Citzenship.

What I do not know is if Britain did the same with it’s African colonies. Lawyers out there need to let us know if African Citizen also had British Citizenship under Colonial Rule.

If true, this means that Obama’s father had both Kenyan and British Citizenship. Under those type laws, if Brack was born Kenya in 1961, he would have both Kenyan and British Ctizenship.

Obama doesn’t seem to be smarter than a fifth grader, believing that there are 57 states.

Donald,

My husband took and engineering job out of college. Originally, the arrangement was that he would travel to a location and be home weekends.

After 6 months, we received a call from the company, at 4 Pm on a Friday afternoon, stating we needed to be in Green Bay Wisconsin the following Monday, and that plane resverations had been made for the 3 of us, myself, my husband and our young daughter for Sunday. We were told to bring copies of our birth certificates to the Air Port to get our tickets.

It was too late to go to city hall to get a copy of my daughter’s birth certificate. However, the administrative office of the hospital, where she was born, was able to provide us with a notarized copy the next day.

My daughter was born in 1968. So please explain to us why Queens Hospital or Medical Center is not able to produc a notarized or certified copy of Obama’s birth?

His mother, I would think would have had to provide some type of documents to travel to Kenya. The British have long been sticklers for records.

At that time (1961) there were not that many airline carriers traveling to Africa. Hawaii, at the time had only 1 major airport.

For someone local, it should not be that hard to check airline carriers at the time, and see if a Stanley Ann Dunham was a passenger to Africa in 1961

I don’t quite understand how an official copy of the birth certificate of someone born in 1961 could be produced on a form that was revised on 11/01. Does this mean that someone just took the more recently revised form and typed Obama’s alleged particulars on it? How does that make it “official.” Does anyone have his original birth certificate? A photostat of same?

There is subsequent legislation written and passed to cover people like McCain, who were born to military folks, but outside the U.S. So McCain is legal.

This is from a lengthier discussion that was posted elsewhere on this topic, but am posting it here (cutting and pasting from someone else). It shows why McCain is a U.S. citizen:

In 8 USC 1403, the law states that anyone born in the Canal Zone or in Panama itself, on or after February 26, 1904, to a mother and/or father who is a United States citizen, was “declared” to be a United States citizen. Note that the terms “natural-born” or “citizen at birth” are missing from this section.

In 2008, when Arizona Senator John McCain ran for president on the Republican ticket, some theorized that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): “a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person.”

I have duel citizenship and I am also a lawyer so you might want to stop selling yourself short. You people have to remember the dates. All the new laws do not pertain to him. You cannot create a law to make something so. Everything is grandfathered in. Even with McCain. However McCain was born in a US territory so hes covered. The senate was going to pass something for him, however the Supreme court could strike it down if it so desired. AGAIN you cannot make a law to make something so. Well you can… but it is not legally constitutional. Checks and balances.

Ms. Lawyer,

To me resolution of PLACE of birth is a critical compnent.

That said, I agree with you that Chicago Associations being more recent, are definitely more relvant.

If Anyone googles some detail about “Black Liberation Theology”, it seems that James Cone, the so called author of that “Theology”, copied wholesale passges of Karl Mark into his idealogical books, and that is a MAJOR issue.

Ha ha … Trying to use Obama Elimination Tactics on the Person who invented it Huh ? ..

Well its NOT gonna work ‘cos Obama is a TRUE American Citizen and Patriot …

President Obama ’09

Go to your own county records clerk and order a copy of your own birth certificate. They will print a copy from the computer on the current offical form.

They will not pull your original signed birth certificate (if it even still exists) out of your file and copy it for you.

To answer your question re; Indonesia. No, at least as recently as 1994, Indonesia does not require you to give up other citizenships.

The population of Indonesia and Malaysia is comprised of three major groups:

1. The indigenous people known as Malays – and who are ususally the “ruling group”.

2. Chinese – immigrants.

3. Indians or Asian Sub Continent – Also immigrants

Then there are the “mixed” populations due to inter marriages.

And unless the law has changed, multiple citizenships are allowed in those countries.

Larry,

IANAL either, but I think the 14th Amendment would apply here. Specifically the part that says:

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

Quick note to Larry Johnson, upon listening to the Rush Limbaugh show today.

(I thought you would get a laugh out of this)

Rush in trying to defend himself in response to the FighttheSmears blog……regarding the possibility of a Michelle Obama tape said the following…

1) Larry Johnson is a left-wing liberal democrat

2) Larry Johnson is a left-wing democrat party hack

3) Larry Johnson saw the Michelle Obama tape himself.

Mel nice blog. Great overview of Obama’s Communist/Marxist allegiances.

Uppity like the word Marxist – so guess we can go with that. Althogh it seems the Chicago group has rebranded their same old ideology as “Socialist” now.

SOS – different day – different name.

I am having a hard time with this being an issue; why hasn’t the original certificate of live birth been produced ?

I have no doubt that Obama is a “citizen”. My doubt lays in the “Natural Born Citizen”. The President of the U.S. HAS to be a “natural born citizen”. ( I would add that McCaskill also wanted to have an Amendment to change the “natural born citizen” from our Constitution.)

If Obama is a “natural born citizen”, then a original copy would dispell the rumors. If it is a “delayed birth certificate’, then the questions would have to be answered as to his mothers travels; if there is no official record of birth, as in a home birth.

Where can a citizen find the “requirements” of proving “natural born citizen” ? That is the true problem. If the Constitution hasn’t been amended ( by 2/3 of the States), then the original is still in place ? Is there additional “requirements” for children with only one parent that is a U.S. citizen ? Where is that found ?

We, the citizens of the U.S., demand the answers. The Constitution of the U.S. MUST be upheld.

The Obama campaign has produced the Certification of Live Birth from the Hawaii Department of Health. It shows that Obama was born in Hawaii. End of story.

Seriously, this is ridiculous.

She was born in Kansas…what sort of citizen test would she have to pass?

The Constitution rules, so in this case he is a US citizen.

Slim….there is a difference between certificate of live birth and a birth certificate.I made a mistake with my first posting, as to not differentiating between the two and stating “certificate of live birth” and not “birth certificate”.

Without the original birth certificate, that which shows the Doctor and/or mid-wife, along with the place of birth; ie, hospital, home; the parents place of birth, weight, length,ect,;then there continues to be a question.

Why does it bother you to discuss this ?

If it is a waste of your time, then why post ? Citizens have a right to question the candidates for the Presidentcy.

Ye flipping gods.

I posted this in the thread about Obama’s birth certificate:

-CITE-
8 USC Sec. 1405 01/03/2007

-EXPCITE-
TITLE 8 – ALIENS AND NATIONALITY
CHAPTER 12 – IMMIGRATION AND NATIONALITY
SUBCHAPTER III – NATIONALITY AND NATURALIZATION
Part I – Nationality at Birth and Collective Naturalization

-HEAD-
Sec. 1405. Persons born in Hawaii

-STATUTE-
A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before
April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as
of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30,
1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was
a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared
to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.

-SOURCE-
(June 27, 1952, ch. 477, title III, ch. 1, Sec. 305, 66 Stat. 237.)

-MISC1-
ADMISSION OF HAWAII AS STATE
Hawaii Statehood provisions as not repealing, amending, or
modifying the provisions of this section, see section 20 of Pub. L.
86-3, Mar. 18, 1959, 73 Stat. 13, set out as a note at the
beginning of chapter 3 of Title 48, Territories and Insular
Possessions.

-End-

Link.

Emphasis mine.

Note that since this applies to people born before Hawaii was granted statehood, it doesn’t matter whether Hawaii is legally a state or not.

So, the question boils down to whether Obama was born in Hawaii or not. His campaign has provided a copy of his Hawaiian birth certificate; like Texas, Hawaii doesn’t issue a facsimile of the original hospital birth certificate, but prints out the relevant information on a new form. To be a certified BC (usable to obtain a passport or as other proof of citizenship) it must be embossed and signed by the state registrar.

The “Birth Certificate” on Obamas site is a PHONY.

The state of Hawaii DOES ISSUE original “Certificates of Natural Birth”.

See my blog, http://nobho.blogspot.com/, for a sample copy of real Hawaii “Certificate of Natural Birth” and compare it to Obamas phony one..

there is a difference between certificate of live birth and a birth certificate.

Not when it comes to determining proof of citizenship.

As I posted in the birth certificate thread, I have had to get a certified copy of my BC from the Texas Bureau of Vital Statistics. What I got was not a reproduction of the original hospital birth certificate; it was a new form, printed from a laser printer, showing the relevant information including the original certificate number.

That “certification of birth” is considered valid proof of citizenship. The things that the original BC would show that the certified copy doesn’t are frankly not relevant to the question of citizenship.

I’ll belive that when Obambi produces a real and Certified Hawaii “Certificate of Natural Birth”

Compare the real certificate on my blog, http://nobho.blogspot.com, to the phony one on Obambi’s SMEAR site.

Markos and Axelrod who faked everything from a tape of Clinton supporters using a racial epithet against Indiana voters, to the 2002 anti-war speech (total fake by Axelrod) cannot provide this legal requirement.

Nor can a blogger. This will have to go to court– see above for Obama’s history of lies about his birth (this would be his 4th and he had good reason to do it) or the fact that his mother may have traveled to falsely register her child. Also, the history of Obama’s team in producing false documents along with Obama’s many biographical lies (see above for just the ones pertaining to birth) are reasons why he is to be presumed lying again.

This will go to court.

Is that what you get when you request a certified copy of your BC? Or is that the certificate issued by the hospital at the time of birth? The two are not necessarily the same (I’m trying to check myself, but Hawaii’s web site is being slammed; hmmm, wonder why?).

Again, the certified copy of my BC that I got from the state of Texas doesn’t look much like the hospital BC.

Sorry to say, the laws have been different at different times, you have to look at the laws at the time of Barry’s birth.

Your info. is very helpful, but it does have to be the law at the time of the person’s birth.

Did you miss it? The papers here showed a copy of Barack’s birth certificate on Sunday (he realeased it friday or saturday). Lawyers here say it’s kosher and he’s just as eligible to run for prersident as john McNUTCain.

Here’s the modus operandi–if you don’t have anything of substance to say, resort to personal insults.

And Barry’s kids seldom have anything of substance to say. Much like their Fearless Leader.

On November 23, 1993, President Clinton signed United States Public Law 103-150, which not only acknowledged the illegal actions committed by the United States in the overthrow of the legitimate government of Hawaii, but also that the Hawaiian people never surrendered their sovereignty. The latter is the most important part of United States Public Law 103-150 for it makes it quite clear that the Hawaiian people never legally ceased to be a sovereign separate independent nation. There is no argument that can change that fact.

United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.

In 1999, the United Nations confirmed that the plebiscite vote that led to Hawaii’s statehood was in violation of article 73 of the United Nations’ charter. The Hawaii statehood vote, under treaty then in effect, was illegal and non-binding. (The same is true of the Alaska plebiscite).

In a world where nations are as governed by laws as are men, Hawaii is not and has never legally been a part of the United States. Hawaii was stolen from the Hawaiian people, and they want it back.

The passage is citizen of the U.S. at the time of adoption of the constitution. There are no more of those people left alive. At the time of adoption of the constitution there were U.S. Citizens who were born in France and England, and they were grandfathered in. The clause is obviously to keep future generations of non-American born citizens from becoming president.

Being a citizen is one thing, being naturalized or natural born is another. The original would have stated whether it was a “delayed” certificate. Right ?

If in fact his mother bore him out of the country, and, she wasn’t military or a govt. employee, then the law says that he may become “naturalized”, correct ?

So, without the original, there is no paper trail. Without the confirmation from the hospital, there is no paper trail. Without his mothers passport, there is no paper trail.

14th Amendment, stated portion above:
“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside”

This makes clear, that there is two distinctions, “born” and “naturalized”. So, the citizenship is not the question for me, but the naturization.

There have been reports of Obama being a citizen of Kenya also. Is there a distinction in regards to citizens that hold dual citizenship ? ( This is a question on the requirements for President, not citizenship.) This brings into play the “under juristiction thereof”.

Within my passport, obtained 2008, page 7 talks about two portions that could be relevant, though I’m not sure.
#13 LOSS OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP
#14 DUAL CITIZENS

I bring forth these two sections, as they may pertain to “juristiction thereof”.

I am sure sources were provided before he posted this article! Ya think?

It’s because most of them have the mentality and maturity of a 12-year-old.

Unfortunately for Obama, his army of 12-year-olds can’t pay his DNC bills.

LJ wrote: “I am not a Constitutional scholar (nor is Barack for that matter).

– Barack Obama was a constitutional law professor. Google is your friend. Thanks for the laugh, you ignorant slut.

For me, it doesn’t matter, Donald. I’m not voting for him anyway.

But the hospital in Honolulu has no record of his birth, and no one has been able to find any record of his parents’ marriage.

I couldn’t care less if he’s “illegitimat.” I don’t believe children are illegitimate, just parents.

But I DO care if his so-called “story of his life” is completely fabricated, or if it’s all just more of his LIES.

That speaks to character, and we GET to know.

Got that, Donald?

Yes, and with no notary seal or signature.

Notice that Donald doesn’t mention that.

This certificate Donald is saying is the “real thing” would not be accepted in applying for a passport.

And that’s the point.

NOTARIZED copy.

What our Donald is posting as the “real” certificate is NOT notarized.

It’s what Axelrod gave Dkos to post on his blog.

NOT notarized.

I think we can see why Larry is no longer in the CIA.

NOt really.

Our average high school graduates actually know LESS than university grads in Lincoln’s day knew.

NOt really.

Our average high school graduates actually know LESS than university grads in Lincoln’s day knew.

Since when is “African” a race, Donald?

Obama’s father didn’t TELL his mother or her parents that he was already married. She didn’t know.

But she never told Obama that as a boy.

He found that out when he visited Africa after his father’s death.

Farrakhan calls Obama their “savior.”

Troubling, I think.

Without a notary seal and signature, it isn’t valid.

But if that information is on the back, then Obama should release copies of same.

The fact that he hasn’t just raises more doubts.

Great. Then let Obama release a copy of the back.

Get to it, Axelrod.

The grandma who actually loved and raised him WASN’T a racist.

Fight the Smears, you know. Even the ones Obama starts.

Well, all that, and the fact that Louis Farrakhan calls Obama their “savior.”

Publicly. On tape.

OK, now we are talking, OB is hiding something about his passport, the birth cert is a distraction.
He went to Indonesia with his mom, his mom married an Indonesian the only way they could is if she renounced her us citizenship no dual citizenship in Indonesia. If step dad adopted OB this makes him an Indonesian citizen, no longer a us citizen.

Someone needs to go to Indonesia, the answer is there, ask the family, ask the step-dad. Go visit his school, the answer is there.

he was born technically American soil, because it was a Naval Hospital.

I think we can see why Barak Obama will not be in the White House.

Louis Farrakhan calls Obama the “savior.”

He doesn’t mention Larry.

Home births happen now, as they happened then. So do hospital parking lot births, and taxi cab births.

NO they won’t! In KY you have to order from the state capital, or drive there and get it. It looks very offical, stamp signed and all. I have 3 kids who needed theirs for school and I needed mine from Ohio. Birth certificates are important documents that you can’t get at the county clerk… the county clerk will be telling you to get it from the state for them when you need drivers liscenses and such!

If she had Obama when she was 18, does that mean she was under-aged at the time of conception? Anyone know the laws of Hawaii as it applies to such marriages. Would she have had to get consent from her parents?
Also I believe that according to Kenyan law, Obama is a dual citizen. Doesn’t that immediately disqualify him for POTUSA? Doesn’t he have to renounce his Kenyan citizenship? I believe he was in Kenya (2006) campaigning for his cousin,
Raila Odingo who is a Muslim-Marxist. I might ad a rather radical Muslim extremist.

what’s the problem with publishing the original birth certificate, if he wants the job of POTUSA?

Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Hawaii was a state in 1961, when Barack Obama was born.

The Constitution supersedes any state laws involving National Citizenship

The 14th amendment states (in part) that All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Hawaii was a state in 1961, when Barack Obama was born.

The Constitution supersedes any state laws involving National Citizenship

The 14th amendment states (in part) that All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

End of question. The constitution controls in this context. Barack Obama is a citizen of the United States

Look, Barry has some psychiatric issues. He was abandoned by his father at age 2. His father was offered a scholarship for PhD at the New School of social Research that would have include providing for his family. He was offered a lesser scholarship at Harvard that only provided for him. Obama Sr. took the latter. Obama jr has a pattern of succumbing to older father -figures, like Frank Marshal Davis, when he was a kid. Frank was a communist. And you all know the other rabid men in his life.
Originally Barack told Frances McEnvoy, an astrologer, his birth time was 1:06PM. Now they’re using this 7:24 PM data.
all lies.

I e-mailed Larry about this issue more than a week ago. I believe Obama is not eligible under the two parent rule of US citizenship. The INS has the best information on this issue and i don’t see how Obama is eligible.
Where is the media, the GOP, everyone on this issue? I don’t know of another President having this issue before.

read the 14th amendment:

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside.

everyone born within the jurisdiction of the united states is a citizen, regardless of the citizenship of their parents. no state or federal law can preempt the constitution.

hawaii is one of the states, and has been since 1959. therefore, anyone born in hawaii in 1961 is a united states citizen.

the residency requirements apply only to children born to american citizens NOT born within the borders of the united states.

Ummm. read Amendment XIV of the Constitution much? Everyone born in the US is a citizen at the time of birth, end of story.

In Hawaii you generally get the paperwork completed in the hospital and it is mailed to you several weeks later. If you look at any registered birth certificate you will see it has the birth date at the top and the last line is the registrar and the “accepted” date which is generally many weeks later.
In Obama’s case for some reason the mother after having a baby (after just two days—well actually less as he was born in the evening)went down town to the government offices, stood in line, in the middle of summer to registrar her son. Why?

That birth certificate was printed on June 6, 2007…you can see the date on the certificate.

I thought this was interesting (I’ve posted this to other posts on this site):

http://www.foreigndocuments.com/images/docs/marriage_usa_hawaii_small.jpg

Amendment XIV-
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

It doesn’t matter if his parents were citizens. IT doesn’t matter what the statutes are. ANYONE born in the US is a citizen.

he can be a citizen, but in order to be POTUSA, he has to be a natural born citizen, not a naturalized one. And, he can not have dual citizenship, which he does have by kenyan law. He would have to renounce his kenyan citizenship.
But, really why doen’t he just tpony up with an authentic bc?

Notice how you’re in KY. Every state does things differently.

Seriously, we don’t need to repeat the nightmare of of our last president with a foreign born parent (that would be Woodrow Wilson)

Comment by Ryan | 2008-06-17 05:44:50

Seriously, we don’t need to repeat the nightmare of of our last president with a foreign born parent (that would be Woodrow Wilson)

INteresting.. there’s more similiarties too..

They both claim to be “Progressives”… They’re both academic types.

Wilson had a nation-wide network of people who would commit violence against anyone who would get in Wilson’s way.

Obama doesn’t do this of course.. but he is affliated with Nation of Islam and i’m sure other groups that do do that sort of thing.

The Collectivist Left were the fascists of teh early 20th Century..We need to be alert.

woodrow wilson was born in Stanton virginiawhere are you getting this from?

Once again, I’ve had to request a certified copy of my BC within the last few years (post-9/11), and what I got was not a reproduction of the original hospital BC, but a new certificate generated from electronic records. It looked similar to the form that was posted to KOS and Obama’s web site (difference being this was Texas and not Hawaii). The non-certified copy I carry in my wallet shows the date that the original was filed (04-07-1965) and the date the copy was issued (01-28-2004).

That copy is just as much an official record of my birth as the original hospital BC, even though it doesn’t reproduce all the information on the original.

I am guessing the original post is cited from here: http://www.hawaiiankingdom.org/info-hawn-citizenship.shtml as it is one of the first links on hawaiian citizenship you’ll find on google and corresponds with the qouted claims. However, you should take note of the updated law here: Immigration and Nationality Act

The relevant section is Act 305

Which states:

Sec. 305. [8 U.S.C. 1405] A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.

The quesition is which site is more up to date. The government’s site on immigration law or the Hawaiian Kingdom’s site.

all of this speculation would be put to rest if he would simply release his authentic bc. Doesn’t the FBI have to vet him? I mean no one is questioning that he is a citizen. But in order for him to run for POTUSA, he has to be “natural born “. There’s a new theory on the net and this has been written about by http://charliverse1.blogspot.com/2008/06/obamas-plan-for-fighting-gops-dirty.html
who, in turn got it from http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/
In effect, the RNC has sent its operatives to Mombasa Kenya who were able to retrieve Baracks’s birth certificate there. They also had access to British intelligence information about Barack Sr. and information that an Arab Kenyan light-skinned woman is Barack’s mother, not Stanley Anne Durham. The RNC also claims to have a picture of Stanley in a bikini one month before Barry’s birthday. I have done an astrological analysis of the two charts both at 7:24 PM (one in Kenya and one in Honolulu).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cr1GhSvuGcs

The prhase “If only one parent was a U.S. Citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least FIVE of which had to be after the age of 16.” only applies to people born outside the US.

@ Bobbi you are a moron of the highest order..

Raila Odinga is such a Muslim-Marxist that the US government invited him over to sign two new agreements with the US on Jun 18th…
Raila in washington DC yesterday(Jun 18th). Notice that Wolfowitz was in attendance..(video link below)…kind of makes your argument fall flat on its face.

http://media.csis.org/csistv/?080617_kenya

Annie come on…African was the term for someone born in Africa.A Kenyan/Ghanaina,etc in 1961 was described as African..i.e a non US citizen black born in Africa. Stop grasping at straws..

ANd how do you know obama was born in Hawaii and how do you know he was born there two years after it became a state?

Just produce a birth certificate and it can be settled.

I thought it was 57 states and possibly one more? At least that’s what obama said.

Can some intelligent Obama supporter please tell me why his father’s race is listed as AFRICAN, because that is his NATIONALITY.

His race was NEGRO!!

Obama’s mother’s original Social Security Number Application

http://webofdeception.com/obamamother‘sssapplication.html

I can’t read this document. What does it say?

realchicken~ you could only wish to have intelligence like Larry~ who cares about the hair~ his words are golden…

None of the stuf on the visalaw site apply to him if he were born in the US. According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural-born_citizen
he would be a natural born citizen even if neither of his parents were US citizens.
Interesting story:
Akon is a very versatile R & B, Hip-Hop artist, famous for his top of the charts records. In 1966, Katherine Dunham, famous Afro-American dancer and then President Johnson’s ambassador to Senegal bought his father, Mor Thiam, a famous Senegalese jazz percussionist to the States,where Akon was born in St Louis. However, Akon, or “Aliaune Damala Bouga Time Puru Nacka Lu Lu Lu Badara Akon Thiam”, returned to Dakkar, Senegal for his 1st 7 yrs.
http://hubpages.com/hub/Astrology-of-Akon-RB-Hip-Hop-Country-Musician–Producer
He is a US citizen.
I also received a note from the FEC today saying that the presidential candidate does not have to file a birth certificate.
I mean, he has secret service guards protecting him!

If the GOP has all this info and they can prove it, what do they intend to do about it ?????
Inquisitive minds would like to know.

For heavens sake—have you no spine. Children cannot pick their parents!!! Married or not the illegals here are the parents not the offspring. Welcome to the 21st century!!!

Welcome to the 21st century. Note: in 1910 my gramma married,at 16 on July 10. She bore a child on August 12th of that same year. Do the math—”1st babies can come at any time—all the rest take 9 months.”

Bull crap, sir. this is the 21st century—-the parents are illegal—not the baby Give me a break you biased a-hole.

Again—-I am the mom of a MULTI racial child SO HAVE BTDT TOO MANY TIMES TO BOTHER COUNTING.—–please refer to her and all others as a member of the HUMAN RACE!!!!! I think that is a basic requirement to be the president—making a monkey out of you for these ridiculous opinions and comments and therefore,thank goodnesss, ineligible!

“AND AS TO YOUR MUSLIM QUESTION! OBAMA IS MUSLIM! His father was MUSLIM and according to MUSLIM law this makes OBAMA automatically MUSLIM!”

You obviously know nothing about Islam, or the various schools of jurisprudence lumped under the term Sharia (Hanafi? Hambali? etc…)
here’s some schooling for you: http://religiondispatches.org/Gui/Content.aspx?Page=AR&Id=272&SP=1

However, let’s imagine that it is the case that mainstream Islamic belief is that all children of Moslem fathers are Moslem (fact is, though, it’s not true). Is Sharia the law of the US? Are you saying Obama was not free to pick his faith? If so, that’s not very American of you.

“The point is that he was born a Muslim (Kenyan father), and as a boy in Indonesia (living with his Muslim stepfather) went to school as a Muslim, studied the Koran, went to the Mosque (admitted in his own autobiography); there are pictures of him as old as 24 years of age in Muslim garb with his half brother, also a Muslim (who happened to mention when interviewed last week that Barack was a Muslim). Now, OB flat out denies that he EVER was a Muslim – that’s a lie! It’s the cover up!”
Where to begin?
1. There’s no such thing as being born Moslem. You pick your faith.
2. In Indonesia he went to two schools: Sekolah Dasar Negeri (“National Elementary School”) Menteng (Menteng is a jakarta neighborhood) #1 (it’s old name is SDN Besuki, named after an Indonesian independence hero). This is a secular state school that had and has Moslem, Christian and Buddhist children enrolled. He earlier attended SD Franciscus Assisi, an elementary school named for the Catholic saint. He was indeed listed on the paperwork as a Moslem here — a matter of convenience since that was the official religion of his stepfather.
3. I’ve studied the Koran. Does that make me a Moslem? At any rate, he may have read passages as a young man, but that does not make him a Moslem.
4. There is no such thing as “Muslim garb.” But what if there were? He adopted local dress as a courtesy on a visit to distant relatives. Is every woman who ever wore a head scarf a Moslem?

“What if Obama’s mother didnt give birth in a hospital and her passport shows her being out the the county days or weeks prior to the recorded birth of Obama?You see that is the part that I am puzzled about.”

There is no evidence that either of these things are true. Shown the obama birth ceftificate, the spokeswoman for the Hawaii department of health said: “It’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate.”

What’s puzzling is that you think some vast, impenetrable conspiracy is more likely than the truth.

rite on! the b.s. the libs give out is eaten up by the looney voters as the gospel. that has been going on since fdr.the proof in the pudding will be if the impersonater running for the office is elected, and all who voted for him will be to blame the first time one of those arabs straps on some whatever and walks into a building loaded with people some where in the states and sests if off. then let those voters look into a mirror and say that the impersonator didn’t say that would happen. smokey

But that is a fake. If it were real, how could this: happen so easily? http://img212.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bofakeac6nq5.jpg

The law clearly states she must have been a citizen for 10 years, 5 after the age of “14″, not 16, and she was 19 when he was born, not 18. Get your facts straight!

You had me going there, right up until I read “astrological analyses”.

Al Gore was born 9 months after the aliens landed in Roswell, NM – coincidence??? Yet nobody questions his citienship or parentage. Where’s the hard-hitting journalism when you need it?

“If only one parent was a U.S. Citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least FIVE of which had to be after the age of 16″

Urm, that requirement only applied to persons NOT born on US soil.

This is dangerous territory,
What happens if Obama wins the election and then Bush inc decides he is ineligible to become President and refuse to transfer power.This election is very important, the Demarcates better resolve this issue before the convention or they will be in big trouble come November.

Obama needs to produce a certified hard copy of his birth certificate so that this distraction goes away.

I see a copy of Obama’s birth certificate. There is no signature on the document that I can see. All one has to do is go to the Honolulu county office register of documents it would seem. I think most birth certificates require a signature of an official and sometimes the county seal.

and I, as white woman, dont like those PERSONAL attacks!!!
Stop this nonsense!!!

When did this get so ugly. I am sorry, but as a former Hillary supporter I am saddened by recent posts by you and others like you. We are Americans, people are watching. Don’t you want to reclaim the respect and adoration that others held for us again. I want to be respected around the world, not plotted against. Senator Obama is the right choice for right now. Instead of making mean comments, go educate yourselves.

Obama certainly can run for president. His mother is an American. He was born on US soil…this makes him an American. I’m shocked at the outlandish remarks from the right. But I guess you have to pull at something. Your candidate just chose the most inexperienced person on a major party ticket in modern history. I join Joel Goldstein (scholar of vice presidency) and presidential historian Matthew Dallek as we shake ourr heads at the calamity of the McCain Palin ticket. I still can’t get over the choice.

Not exactly true.

Under the laws in effect at that time in Hawaii, where he claims to have been born, to be a citizen, a person must EITHER be born of two American parents (even if not born on American soil), OR have one American parent who lived within the United States for at least five years after their 16th birthday before the birth of the child. For him to be president, his mother had to be at least 21 when he was born. She was 18.

I did hear them discussing this on the news (PBS-”All Things Considered”) a couple days ago. Although they were not sure, it appears when he filed, he produced a US passport as proof of citizenship. IF he has a US passport, why did he need to supply a fake record of birth?

[WAIT, I just remembered - I believe, besides an original of your birth certificate or ROLB, that naturalization papers are also accepted for a passport. So they can check with the passport people to find out what papers were used for Barack "Barry" Hussein Obama Soetara.]

The submitted certificate of live birth has already been checked by a forensics expert and labeled a forgery. The question is why, and what, if anything, the government will do about it.

Since it is my contention that the elections are “fixed” anyway, whether he is a citizen or not, will not really matter. Whoever they want will be elected and if that is Obama, congress will pass a law retroactively that will allow him to hold the office.

That is what it boils down to.

Check the information from the forensic expert that found Obama’s “birth certificate” to be a forgery.

The printing did not align with the border, as it would have if printed by an official government record, and while the fonts used were almost the same, the ‘kerning’ (stretching and compression) of letters was incorrect. Bottom line, someone typed up the information in a font they thought looked right to the eye and cut and pasted it onto a valid certificate background.

Oops, misspelled his Indonesean last name. Sorry, it should have read, “Soetoro”

It IS the requirement to be president.

Here is a link to the appropriate section of the Constitution. http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.articleii.html#section1
The fifth paragraph of Art.II-Sect.1 states:
“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.”

Pres. Eisenhower signed the bill into law and Hawaii became a state Aug.21, 1959, if I remember correctly.

(I was a young teenager at the time, and still have a letter from President Eisenhower thanking me for my design of the 50-star flag.)

True but the Constitution requires it to be president.

Look at Article 2, Section 1, the fifth paragraph:
No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

No, the certificate that the Obama campaign submitted to the news media, is supposed to have been printed in JULY, 2006. However, read elsewhere the problems with the copy.
They did not submit an original or even a notarized copy, but a computer .jpg file, which was found to have had information simply cut and pasted onto a 2006 version of the background for a real certificate in the wrong font to have been done by the Hawaiian government.

His parents were NOT both citizens. His father was a Kenyan citizen. He met Obama’s mother at college in Hawaii.

If Obama was born in the US (Hawaii) then he has a very good chance of being ratified as a citizen, even if his mother was under 21 at the time.

The PROBLEM is that since he submitted a fake certificate of live birth, then perhaps he is trying to hide something.

It leads people to immediately suspect that his parents had already moved to Kenya and Barack was born there, instead of it happening after he was born. Which would mean he is NOT a citizen of the US, until later ‘naturalized’.

No, that is the .jpg “copy” provided by the campaign. That has already been deemed a forgery by a forensic expert.

I am not going to repeat it all again, -just look it up. That is why everyone is wondering why he is on the ballot, if the copy has been shown to be a forgery.

Note at the bottom that it says “Any alterations invalidate this certificate” and the information is altered – cut and pasted onto another certificate.

” Unstamped certificate suggests Obama may not be “natural born” US citizen
By Reuven Koret June 24, 2008

The “birth certificate” claimed by the Barack Obama campaign is not certified as authentic and appears to be a photoshopped fake.

http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Politics/12939.htm

“An authentic Hawaiian birth certificate for another Hawaiian individual has since surfaced which, using the same official form as the presumptive Obama certificate, includes an embossed official seal and an authoritative signature, coming through from the back. Obama’s alleged certificate lacks those features, and the certificate number referencing the birth year has been blacked out, making it untraceable.”

“Janice Okubo, Director of Communications of the State of Hawaii Department of Health, told Israel Insider: ‘At this time there are no circumstances in which the State of Hawaii Department of Health would issue a birth certification or certification of live birth only electronically.’ And, she added, ‘In the State of Hawaii all certified copies of certificates of live birth have the embossed seal and registrar signature on the back of the document.’”

So, are you saying/implying that neither Obama OR Palin are US citizens?

So are you saying he could be president of the US as well as King of England(UK)?

Grin…

What I am still wondering about Obama is his “god-complex”… It is not a legal standpoint, but why does he call himself Allah (“the One”)?

Well, he does use the nickname, Allah (the One), so maybe you have something there.

I read somewhere that some people do consider him the second coming of Christ.

We know that and agree. The question is regarding WHERE he was born. He has not produced a valid NOTARIZED copy of a Hawaiian birth certificate. So where WAS he born and why doesn’t he release his real birth certificate?

BULL SHIT!!!!! Donald are you so blind that you can’t see that this is a fake…

ok, i’m looking for an absolutely bi partisan answer to the question. this is a research project for me, devoid of emotion. it has nothing to do with how i vote in november. i just would like people to send me their opinions, complete with some sort of evidence. i can be reached at malkah1980@yahoo.com. thanks!

Well, interesting comment with one major flaw. We do not know if Barack Obama was born on U.S. soil since he is afraid to provide his birth certificate. therefore we do not know if he is qualified to run for president. I had to provide my birth certificate when I got my passport. Shouldn’t Barry do the same for running for the highest office in the land. Makes everyone wonder what he is hiding??

Larry, you are reading the sentence wrong:

it reads:

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen at the the time of the adoption of this constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.”

so unless Obama was a citizen at the time of the adoption of the constitution or a natural born citizen, he is not eligible….

Please re-post this blog with this updated info!!

You are correct! Who can we give this information to?

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution”

that doesn’t open up anything, it just means citizens at the time of the adoption of the constitution.. so like, if he lived in america when we adopted the const… you get it.

fairly new state? hmm what were the federal laws?

[...] I think that in a perfect world, for me anyway, we would have a John McCain candidate with respect to foreign policy and military experience, who also had a strong track record of conservatism.  If we had that guy (or lady), we might then find the more liberal members of the Republican party  feeling disenfranchised.  Therefore, I think McCain is an average candidate from my perspective.  Compared to Barack Obama, he’s George Washington.  Mr. Obama simply doesn’t have the experience yet to be considered for president.  He might not even be eligible to be president because of where he was born.  For some reason, Obama won’t release his birth certificate to the media.  The reasons why he won’t are discussed in great detail here. [...]

[...] authenticity of that claim, but here’s a blog that discusses whether Obama qualifies for POTUS: Is Barack Eligible to be President? : NO QUARTER I must admit I initially thought this was a farfetched question. But there is a significant body [...]

I normally dont follow politics close enough to care. But to best of my knowledge, if 1 parent is an American citizen, then their kids are also no matter where they were born. I think you guys/gals are getting worked up over the words “natural born citizens”. No where does it say natural born = born in the 50 states. If im wrong show me the exact text and links that say natural mean actual birth within the 50 United States of America.

I am very impressed with Philip J. Berg. He’s no flake, not by a long shot.

I believe watching this video will cheer you and give you greater hope than anything we have seen so far. This is not a rumor of a RICO indictment; this a lawsuit in the courts right now that is just waiting for the judge to make a decision.

I urge you all to take the mere 10 minutes and 52 seconds it will take to view the video at the link below, and perhaps spread the link around.

This man is a true hero if he’s right.

The pleadings are here: http://tinyurl.com/4fq8lf or http://dockets.justia.com/docket/court-paedce/case_no-2:2008cv04083/case_id-281573/

The video is here: http://tinyurl.com/4fwsac or
http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/11/the-question-of-the-birth-certificate/#comment-6812

I am enormously encouraged.

So if you want to feel better, and more hopeful, watch it immediately.

If Berg is wrong, what is Obama really hiding, and who signed off on his qualifications to run for president? Somebody in this country must have — but who, and what are *they* hiding by remaining silent?

Berg is going to take this to the Supreme Court if necessary, particularly, I think, if this court looks like it’s going to delay rulings until after the election. I don’t know if there are any statutory time requirements for the pending rulings, but Berg is not going to lie down and give up at any point.

http://dockets.justia.com/docket/court-paedce/case_no-2:2008cv04083/case_id-281573/

http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/11/the-question-of-the-birth-certificate/#comment-6812

You are right, there is no raised seal. Barack could not even get a drivers license with this fake birth certificate.

Sarah Palin was born in Idaho which has been a state since 1890. She is a NATURAL BORN US CITIZEN unlike it seems Barack H Obama.

Because being born on US Soil makes you Natural Born US Citizen. All US military bases and US Embassies I believe are considered “US Soil” and because both parents were US Citizens.

Sorry if I change the topic Larry, but some time ago you said that a very damaging tape of obama would surface 2 months before the election. The elections are 22 days away, So where is that Republican saving tape???????????

I wouldn’t pin all my hopes on Phil Berg. He apparantly is a conspiracy theorist and believes that 9/11 was masterminded by the American government. When researching the facts I came acroses this webpage which debunks pretty effectively most of what has been said here: http://tesibria.typepad.com/whats_your_evidence/2008/10/berg-v-obama–1.html

Your best bet is still a McCain resurgence together with a major Obama mishap. But the chances for that are slim.

“A truth’s initial commotion is directly proportional to how deeply the lie was believed. It wasn’t the world being round that agitated people, but that the world wasn’t flat. When a well-packaged web of lies has been sold gradually to the masses over generations, the truth will seem utterly preposterous—and its speaker a raving lunatic.”
~Dresden James, Author

A state law that modifies an amendment of the Constitution? That would be what we call “unconstitutional.” Sorry, Amendment XIV prevails.

The phrase, “or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the approval of this constitution” was inserted because many who were alive at the time of the document’s passage were actually born in other countries. Once all the original “citizens” not born in the US died, the previous clause in the sentence applied.

Mr. Obama cannot occupy the Presidency simply because he was not born in the U.S.

See documents here:

http://axj.puntoforo.com/viewtopic.php?t=774

i am 57 years old and seen enough. in 63 kennedy was killed and the last of the centrist demmocrats died with him. check the history of the congress starting in 65. you will find the enactment of vast federal expeditures that had enslaved “progressives” to the state. Welfare is available now to every “able bodied american” Ask not what your country can do for you”… john never envisioned the nanny state we now shamlessly embrace. We are going to see double digit inflation very soon. Plant a big garden and get a big gun to gaurd it.

Obama is absolutely a U.S. citizen. You need to update this post to reflect that 1) his birth certificate has long since been released (Google “Obama birth certificate” for a confirmation from the L.A. Times) and 2) everyone born on U.S. soil, except children of diplomats and foreign occupying military forces, are U.S. citizens.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark (1898) represents the current recognized and not successfully challenged U.S. Supreme Court precedent on the matter, which interprets the 14th Amendment to mean exactly that. Neither state laws, nor U.S. laws (e.g. statutes) have authority over the constitution and its amendments. If there is a contradiction, which there does appear to be, the 14th amendment wins by virture of being a constitutional amendment.

Obama is a constitutional lawyer. If Obama could really be challenged on these grounds, he would have been challenged long before he became a U.S. senator and you would certainly see Republican lawyers, funded by the McCain campaign, suing him by now.

BTW, Arnold Schwarzanegger can’t become president for the reason mentioned before: the “or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution” phrase is only meant to apply to people who were citizens before the U.S. Constitution was ratified, otherwise no one could ever have become the president.

Well..and the Answer is….

The rule of law that applies to everyone else,,,does not apply to Democrats. Soo,,if Obama was born in France,,,it would not matter. AND,,you would find it hard to be reported by the main media. You got it…the main media CNN,MSNBC, ABC included are not to be trusted. DO NOT WATCH them.

This fact has been seen over and over again for the last twenty years.
Many examples to support that the Democrats do not have our country laws apply to them.

Indeed,,today’s Democrats are full of Deceit, Nonsense and Corruption.

You are such an idiot. Respected around the world u say….HA. What a stupid position considering that many of our so called friends are nothing but friends. France?? Think again. France has nothing but stolen from billions of dollars from the U.S. channeling billions of dollars via the U.N. to their own country.

As a widely traveled individual and associated with U.S. govt. missions,,,you are very ignorant of what the real international facts. Let me guess,,you get your news from CNN, MSNBC, ABC….

As a child Barack did not need a passport in the 60′s to go to Indonesia. When I was in 8th grade my family (all 8 of us) and I moved to Guatemala and only our parents had passports, that was all that was needed. I hope that there really is something to the natural born citizenship question, but the fact that Obama may not have had a passport is irrelevent.

He said 57 states, and while that seems like merely a “boneheaded” remark. There ARE infact, 57 Islamic States.

Obama had a “slip of the tongue” at a recent rally, which was glossed over by the mainstream media. He said he had visited “57 States”. Watch the clip of him saying it and read the information – there are 57 States in the Organization of Islamic States. http://www.stoptheaclu.com/archives/2008/05/12/obamas-freudian-slip-there-are-57-islamic-states/ and also at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organization_of_the_Islamic_Conference

Talk about a Freudian Slip! Personally, I don’t trust the bastard as far as I can throw him! And it has nothing to do with his color, but all to do with his hidden agendas and the Socialist and Communist influences he’s had in his life! Say NO to Socialism in America!

Please people, people, people, JUST DO your homework on the left wing lying,hiding,decieving, liberals (OBAMA/BIDEN) and then click right (Right) wing religious MCcain/Palin 2009, for PRESIDENT. (nobamaEVER)

This issue is not going away. The G. Gordon Liddy radio show featured a Hillary Clinton campaign aide and lawyer who filed suit against the Obama campaign and Barak Obama in Federal Court in Philadelphia to force Barak Obama to make his birth certificate public. This Hillary Clinton campaign aide filed this lawsuit during the Democratic primaries, but the Obama campaign had until September to reply or in effect admit the allegations stipulated in the lawsuit were true.

Now in my mind a “Certificate of Live Birth” is synonymous with “birth certificate” and if Hawaii has legitimately put its stamp on it, if indeed that is true and not a forgery, then the matter would be closed. But I am told these documents are not the same, and the referenced document does not suffice as a birth certificate. Obama is visiting his ailing grandmother. If the reports are true that she was with his mother in Kenya when he was born, then she needs secret service protection during this visit.

I can agree with your statement… states delegate laws that have no specific provisions in the federal gov’t… NOW… on to your candidate and his undeniable disdain for the 2nd amendment… unconstitutional…

THE LAW IS THE LAW IT NEEDS TO BE ADHERED TO, OTHERWISE WHY DO WE EVEN HAVE THEM? SO LETS JUST LET CHINA RULE US IF WE DON’T NEED A FULL FLEDGE CITIZEN TO RUN OUR COUNTY. BARACK HAS A SCHEMING MIND AND IF BOTH PARTENTS ARE TO BE CITIZEN’S THEN THAT’S IT..
HE’S DONE AND HILLARY’S BACK IN. NO PROBLEM AT LEAST WE KNOW MORE ABOUT HER THE OB

Its not the original BC that you are seeing. Its BO info on a new Birth Certificate form.

Do you understand the problem.

Show me the orignal BC.

J

obama is not an American where is his birth certificate and why is he scared to reveal it, he is a liar, if u vote for this chump we’ll see some changes alright but for the worse how can anyone support this P.O.S.

Inexperienced????? I guess a community organizer is more experienced than an executive!?!?

Well she still has more experience than Obama and she is a US citizen. Do we know that Obama was born on US soil? NO there is too much evidence saying he was not. Why wont he produce his original birth certificate? That is what you need to ask. And in Sarah’s defense, I would be scared to say anything that is scrutized and wrong no matter what. Even Katie kept saying what do you read – yah and then they would have knocked her for anything she read.

Please THINK CRITICALLY before you vote in this election.

I am NOT a racist. I don’t use CODE words.

I have no problem having an African-American or black president. I think it would be great day in history when we achieve that in this country. But those that support Obama you need to REALLY ASK YOURSELF if Obama the POSTER BOY you want to make that statement in American History.

Obama’s policies and his presidency will be what defines history for a black president – not the mere fact that he is black. If he does not live up to his promises, has failed policies, or responds inappropriately to this *guaranteed international incident* – THAT WILL BE THE ONLY THING REMEMBERED ABOUT THE FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT. And how long do you think it will take for this country to recover from that and for the country to be ready to elect another black American?

With the state of the economy and foreign policies – the chances of ANY president being successful are very low. If Obama screws anything up – and I mean anything – THAT will define what a black president stands for in history. If you have ANY questions in your mind – ANY AT ALL – do not allow this black man to define the First Black President of the United States of America.

Please allow an honest, upstanding, black man with a high level of integrity to be elected as the FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT. Please don’t send this country back 200 years in our fight for racial equality!

I agree with Butch. If it is that simple and Obama doesn’t have anything to hide, just produce the birth certificate and prove your eligibility. As for his being “tested” if he wins, I will just be one angry citizen if the US looks more foolish after the election while we are proving that we just electred someone who wasn’t even eligible to run.

To your question about Arnold. No he can’t be president. I’m not a lawyer, but its the phrase after “or a citizen of the United States,” that finishes the qualification. That is, “at the time of the adoption of this Constitution”. Otherwise, George Washington and those to follow couldn’t have been president, as no one born in the U.S, would be of age 35.

Regarding the Hawaii state law, not sure how Hawaii state laws (given Hawaii became a state a 1959) could supercede federal law. I doubt they did. Anyway, his mom was a citizen which makes him a citizen. Haven’t heard anyone questioning his mom’s citizenship.

also , he has run his mouth for over 18 months & still has not said a word that you can believe

Are you nuts!!!

Go watch Fox News. Oh and by the way

Fox-a symbol of cunning and trickery. They dont even try to deny the fact that they are propaganda in their own broadcasting name lawl. gg. Ron Paul 08

Seriously! I’d have a hard time finding my birth certificate-I was born in Italy. So, If I was born at 5:00 p.m., Italian time, does that make me a liar if I say I was born at 10:00 a.m.?
This is all frivolous fodder for those who are looking to stir up something.
I’m thinking let’s get the hell out of Iraq, strengthen the US economy, do something about the health care system that neglects the misfortunate, get all the f——– illegals out of this country, elevate our educational system to compete with the majority of civilized countries who are outperforming us, and GET OUT AND VOTE FOR ISSUES, AND THE CANDIDATE WHO DOESN’T DWELL ON slander, gossip, and headlining a nonplumber with whom he can’t even begin to identify!

Oh, holier than thou,there are some Mormons who might disagree with you.

When I was in the Military we had to be Polygraphed for certain jobs / clearances (Top Secret). Funny that this job(POTUSA)requires none. It would definately clear up any lies on Citizenship, Relationships with known terrorist and so forth.
Scary election this term!

how can you vote for a person who is for abortion and gay marriage?

wow your a hipacrit you talk about liberals being disceptive and untrustworthy but your just as bad as what you say about someone or something you really dont understand all your trying to do by saying that is brainwash people into thinking the way you do! eat it bitch

skin head!!!

Also, Barack went to school in Indonesia, and you can’t go to school there without being an Indonesian citizen, so he would have had to trade his citizenship.

Did anyone notice the date of the paper in the bottom left corner 11/01 Laser.

So they got the year of the seal on top correct but they messed up on the bottom.

When a child is born on an American military base outside of the US, that base is considered to be American soil. That is why we are able to fly our flag in that country on that base. So John McCain’s situation is different from Obama’s. This is not something new or done to accommodate McCain.

Now that Obama is preseident.
Go fuck yourself in the ass…really really hard, den suck ur own fucking dick, get AIDS and go slowly die somewhere in a corner.!
pleas excuse my language but you evidently know how to upset an individual! So unless you’re ignorant don’t post anymore comments like these.

AMEN

Obama Supporter…You show your IQ by your lack of Vocab. Profanity shows lack of character and creativity.
I don’t know how you can be sworn into office with something like that over your head. He needs to give out the whole document and background info otherwise this will be a big problem for lots of people. Including myself. What is there to hide? Why did his Kenyan grandma say she was there in Kenya where he was born? It raises too many questions. I’m not a fan of either candidate and wasn’t going to be dancing in the street either way. It’s a simple thing really to produce the doctumentation if you have it. I’m just stating facts. I’d say the same thing if John McCain was in question.

I am so glad that someone is not on this parade of Obama like the rest of the ignorant americans are. I do not condemn you for voting for Obama, but i will acknowledge your ability to stand up for facts. I agree with your argument about providing an actual (original) birth certificate. The rest of us americans have to provide this certificate in order to attend school and grasp jobs, however Obama does not have to provide one to run our country? He is causing too much attention to himself and it is ridiculous. From my understanding is, he tried to forge one once before and apparently he got caught. i don’t know the whole story on that, but i would like to know more. As for the conspiracy of Obama being born in Kenya, I would like to know more on that as well. Unfortunately, she passed away, however we still have to mother and father to fall back on.

well I am glad Obama won, but I find the birth cerificate unusual as well.. the ariel font was not available in 1961, I believe that only the old fashioned typewriters were used, but sometimes I think we need to look at the bigger picture.. some constitutuial ammendments need to be revised, to keep up with the changing world… as not to outcast anyone that may be qualified for different Government Office, but, that is just my opinion.

We all should pray because a BOLD FACE LYING MUSLIM is going to the White House.
We may never recover from this.

Sir,

The relevant FEDERAL statute states that in order to claim derivative citizenship, the applicant must be able to claim one person who has been in the United States 5 years beyond the 14th birthday, which Mr. Obama cannot. See also U.S. v. Ortiz-Diaz, 849 F. Supp. 734 (E.D. Cal 1994)

Where did you get your law degree?

isnt that the truth prayer is about the only thing we have to protect us.

Its funny how this country was founded by honest God fearing people and has always been based around christianity, now we are going to have a president that will take all of that away. Everyone sais this is a historical election and there right this day marks a turning point but unfortunately its for the worse. I will continue to support my country but I WILL NOT SUPPORT OBABMA. I will stick to my christian beliefs and pray for my country to realize obama is not a true american.

Wow good job america. You have brought a man who’s birth has not been made public yet President. Yeah he’s not for real people . He has good speaking skills. If more then 10% of people would pick up a bible now and then you would know what i am talking about. Lets read over this again. WHERE THE HECK WAS HE BORN . I want an answer . You people are so freaking stupid its not even funny. He can’t promise you ANYTHING until its passed through congress. People don’t understand “well he’s gonna give us free healthcare” bull crap if he does we will end up like canadians lying on our deathbed with nothing to help us . Well its time Americans that can work to get off the couch and work instead of drawing welfare. Well after his “dictatorship” and yeah i said he’s going to be a dictator , i hope you can realize what you have done. He is the antichrist some people think . I agree with that . But i just thought … if Obama would have lost, there would have been a HUGE racial dispute that would break out and he would say he was discriminated against because he was black and all that crap that just gets old.

McCaine I wish you would have won
its going to be a sad rest of our lives

Because, right after her new son Barack was born, she had this really big premonition that he was going to be President one day and just wanted to make sure the paperwork was in order.

Also, I believe that if you lose your birth certificate or it gets destroyed somehow, when you apply to the state the get a new one, they aren’t going to print it in the original format. They’re probly going to put it on modern paper and pattern and, oh my, maybe even print it on a laser printer. My birth certificate from 1981 was destroyed in 1998 and when I got a replacement, it was printed in the 1998 design and format and looked nothing like the one that was issued when I was born. Has anybody thought that maybe Barack lost it and applied for his replacement, just like many other Americans have done before?

I’m pretty sure that a man who raised hundreds of millions of dollars to become President would, along with his party 1) make sure that he was eligible to run, and 2) not fake a document that was needed to prove he was eligible, and if 2a) he were going to fake a document, make sure that it was done properly and beyond the scrutiny of the so called ‘forensic experts’ that are claiming what he has presented is fake, given all the millions he has at disposal.

Also people, i have a close friend who was born in France to two American parents and is a US citizen, naturally. If you are born a citizen, you are a natural citizen and eligible to be President.

Obama has held public office for many years now (in the Illinois State Senate and the United States Senate) and isn’t a citizen, but somehow gets to sit, passing laws? I’m not convinced.

Sorry but obviously you and Gov. Palin seem to have taken the same geography lesson.

Kenya = country.
Africa = continent.

And, yes, African can be used as a race. I know several lovely Africans. They come from placed like Kenya, South Africa, Rwanda. The term ‘African’ is often used in the United States to denote race.

Barack Obama = African-American.
Dave Chappelle = African-American.
Dr. Martin Luther King = African-American.

Yes, the United States, in fact, does recognize dual citizenship with many countries. Ask that of the many thousands of dual Canadian-American citizens (of which I know at least 20) and regularily cross the border without hassle or question of ‘divided loyalties.’

Which you can do until you are an adult!!! As long a your custodial parent is a citizen. I lived it!!!!!

We still can’t get over the choice of Obama!!! for President…so back to you!
We can now call it the “Black House” instead of the White House. You should read the Washington Times editorial on Sunday 11-2-08 on page B1 and find out what kind of America we will have after Obama. This is the America that my grandchildren will be living in. You don’t have a clue as to what is going on in this United States and evidently you only care about his color, or his looks. Read some our Obama’s liberal newspapers and you might find a little truth in them to learn something. Obama wants change…..that’s all you will have left in your pocket when he’s finished. Besides making this country a socialist country bepending on the government for everything. Don’t you have any backbone at all…Government should take care of our country and keep it safe, states should take care of the state, and the PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE CARE OF THE THEMSELVES. Try getting a job and feeling good about it, paying your own bills and not asking mom or dad or government to pay them. The government tries to supply all the toilet paper now, pretty soon they will be wiping your butt for you … that’s what Obama wants. Grow up.

Anyone who was a citizen at the time the CONSTITUTION was adopted was eligible, as well as all natural born citizens who came after that date; not any citizen…

have you been asleep for the last 8 years? the “conservative” busy/cheney administration has made the government larger and more powerful than ever before. that’s the opposite of people taking care of themselves. you’ll see how much better things are in 4 years.. but i’m sure you’ll deny it anyway.

let me guess.. you get your news from fox news.

yeah, the last 8 years have been great for our country. what a terrible time for change.

obama’s “army” of new voters are far more in touch with today’s society than you, or your old, rich croneys who’ve run the show for far too long.
-26 year old white conservative independent

he’s a half-black, half-white Christian you moron. people talk about the republican party as being the “Christian” party just because they vote against abortion and gay legislation. how about keeping down the poor? how about lying and deceit? i disagree with obama on abortion, but obama will be a more Christian President than the evil Bush/Cheney.. easy to see.

I’m a white independent conservative Christian, and found that Obama was easily the candidate for the job. I disagree fully with his stances on gays and on abortion, but these are not political issues.. they are not government issues. The Republican “Christians” always vote against abortion but also vote against funding those who can’t care for their own. Despite my Christian values, this hypocrisy can not be tolerated. Abortion will exist, whether we like it or not. Those are decisions to be made by families and individuals, not by us. To add to that, the “Christian” Bush has done nothing but make the world hate us more than ever before. Republicans have used their campaign trickery to make Christians think that because they’re Christian, they must be Republican. However, despite their record on voting against gay and abortion legislation, they have done everything else to bring our name down as Christians.. a war that was moved to Iraq without real justification except monetary gain, an economic system that keeps the rich richer and the poor poorer (which we see the results of now), a closed-door policy to keep out those who will disagree. They are unbelievably anti-Christian in nearly every step they’ve taken and it’s time for change. It’s time for the old to step out and the young to step in. It’s overdue, and whether you agree with me or not, when January 2013 comes we will have come a far distance from the destruction that have been caused to our nation over the last 8 years. God Bless us all, and the USA.

welcome to republican america. you are guilty of anything that any nutjob says about you until you can prove it’s not true. jeez.

I must dissagree, the only reason some might think that Obama is “The right choice for right now” is because he is of African decent, not because he was qualified for the job. Also, why hasn’t he produce his “Original Birth Certificate”? I would like to add, I Hate the term “African-American” America should come first. I wonder how other americans of “color” like Jamacans, Dominican Rep., Hatians, etc… feel to be automaticaly grouped in and referred to as African-Americans. Since my parents are decendants of Italy and Germany, I would like to be referred to as German-Italian-American.