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When it Comes to Major Hassan, What About Exodus? [UPDATE]

(Bumped up from Nov. 9th.)

With the rightwing working itself into a froth because Major Nidal Hassan, the murderer of fellow soldiers at Fort Hood last week, allegedly claimed to be a muslim first and an American second, I was reminded of the movie, EXODUS.

If you are 53 years old (or older) I’m sure you remember the Paul Newman propaganda flick, EXODUS. Based on the Leon Uris novel it tells the story of the birth of Israel but uses some clever ploys to whip up public support for Israel. I call it propaganda because of how the diretor, Otto Preminger, uses the beautiful teenage girl, Karen (actress Jill Haworth) to symbolize the threat to Israel. She is sweet, sexy and innocent and is murdered by those dastardly muslims. The film closes with her burial and the Israeli freedom fighters grabbing guns as they head off to kill muslims (even though Paul Newman pays lip service to the Jews and Arabs living together in peace).

When the movie was made in 1960 terrorism was not a big deal. What is really fascinating now, with the benefit of hindsight, is how the film endorses terrorism as an appropriate tactic as long as the cause is perceived just.

Check out this link. Members of the Irgun, a Jewish terrorist group, bombed the King David Hotel and killed 91 people. The movie Exodus celebrates these guys and the link above is the clip of the Irgun’s attack on the prison housing those who planned and carried out the attack.

Why belabor this? I am willing to bet we will get some staunch pro-Israel supporters defending and justifying the Irgun and their attacks because they agree with the cause. But it was terrorism, pure and evil. It was organized and purpose driven. I want to draw your attention to how many Americans embrace a movie that endorses and glorifies terrorism as an appropriate tactic. If we can understand that then we can begin to understand why some muslims can readily endorse violence we find reprehensible because from their perspective it is justified because the cause is righteous (at least from their perspective).

Was Nidal Hassan a terrorist? No. He may have tried to contact Al Qaeda operatives but he acted alone. But he shared the mentality that justifies indiscriminate violence in pursuit of a cause he believed to be just. In this regard he is certainly a terrorist sympathizer and, based on several press reports, made no effort to conceal his devotion to an extreme vision of Islam.

There is not a lot we can do to prevent incidents like Hassan rampage. If Hassan was part of an organization there are things we could do to weaken and hinder their operations. But a lone wolf determined to wreak mayhem is almost impossible to defend.

Regardless of whether or not Hassan was a “terrorist” he has caused horror for hundreds of people who loved and were loved by those murdered by the twisted Army Major. The extremist mindset is not unique to Islam. That’s the point I want us to keep in mind.

UPDATE: I knew it would happen. I point out the indisputable historical fact that some of the folks involved with the creation of the State of Israel were terrorists. The actions of the IRGUN and the STERN GANG are the imaginings of anti-Semites. What is sickening are those people who excuse terrorism by Jews because they support the cause but then have an aneurysm when a Muslim does the same kind of thing. I despise religious extremists of all ilks–Muslim, Christian, Jew and Druid, etc. So here is a typical comment reflecting the crazy mindsent I am talking about:


Halli Casser-Jayne:
Submitted on 2009/11/09 at 3:38pm
Try again, Larry. Apparently, that old brain of yours has forgotten other potent parts of the movie (and it is a movie based on a work of fiction). For instance, the behavior of the Arabs who went on to hang and maim one of their own for wanting to have peace with his Jewish ‘brother.’ Or how about the role of the Brits in refusing to let the nomad Jews find a place to live after they’d been freed from the Nazi death camps and had no place to go. Or the role of the Mufti in terrorizing the Jews and refusing to follow a path to peace but whose focus was to insight the Arabs. Ari, the Paul Newman character, had misgivings of his uncle’s participation in the Irgun, as did his father played by Lee J. Cobb. That’s the movie.

In real life were the Jews terrorists?

The Jews were not out to terrorize the Arabs. They were out to defend themselves. They offered to share a homeland with the people who now call themselves Palestinians, to live in peace with them, and were rebuffed even as they are today. They weren’t new to the land, but the influx was, and the Arabs didn’t want Hitler’s survivors there.

Plus, they had no place else to go. Our lovely America didn’t want Hitler’s refugees anymore than the Arabs or the Brits did.

There’s a big difference between a nascent army and a terrorist organization. You might want to look up the word ‘terror.’

Jeez, Larry, I’m disappointed! Your comments wreak of anti-Semitism! They have no comparative rationale to the story of Major Hassam, whose ultimate definition is yet to be determined because we still are waiting for the FACTS.

Halli Casser-Jayne
Author, A Year in My Pajamas With President Obama, The Politics of Strange Bedfellows, http://www.thecjpoliticalreport.com

Yes Halli, in real life there were Jewish terrorists. In fact, Rahm Emmanuel’s father was part of one of the terrorist groups. Menachem Begin was another. You are as bad as a Hezbollah supporter. You excuse inexcusable behavior. Blowing up hotels and killing indiscriminately is not heroic.

I

  • Diana L. C.

    Larry,

    Wow! I hadn’t thought of that movie for ages; and, yes, I am old enough to remember when it first came out.

    You make a most important point. It always makes me wonder why people will take the metaphorical low road just because their enemy has taken that same low road.

    I also do not understand that urge to take others’ lives just because a person is so unhappy with his/her own life.

    I do feel great sorrow for the families of the dead and injured at Fort Hood. Our military families are under siege around the world, and should have a safe, welcoming place here in the U.S.

    • Tammy

      Nobody has thought of that movie for ages because it was a movie based on FICTION. 90% of Americans have never even heard of the film. The fact that you use a fictional film as a comparison to the events of today is ludicrous.
      Terrorist acts by Muslims occur every single day across the world(and most of them against their own people) but Larry chooses to compare them to acts in a movie. Wow. That’s really deep.

      Israel is the only Democratic country in the Middle East, and to compare their acts to the acts of Jihadi terrorists is mind boggling.

      I agree with the letter writer above: YOU, Larry Johnson, are an anti-semite.

      Have you been hanging out with Jimmy Carter?
      Disgusting.

      • gonzotx

        Was Nidal Hassan a terrorist? No. He may have tried to contact Al Qaeda operatives but he acted alone.

        There is not a lot we can do to prevent incidents like Hassan rampage.

        ******************

        I AGREE! YOU ARE SO ANTI-SEMITE. THOSE TWO STATEMENTS I HIGHLIGHTED ARE PROOF OF YOUR IMPENDING INSANITY LARRY.

        YOU DON’T NEED A HOMEY TO BE A TERRORIST AND REALLY LARRY, THIS TERRORIST LEFT MANY SIGNS HE WAS A TERRORIST, THE ARMY KNEW BUT CHOSE TO REMAIN POLITICALLY CORRECT AND NOW WE HAVE 15 DEAD POLITICALLY CORRECT REAL AMERICANS.

    • WaketheComatoseAmericans

      The stark fact that you have to avoid in order to discuss nuance is that the koran requires killing of non-muslims. Jews, Christians and other islamic sects that disagree with another islamic sect.

      As far as I am aware, Judaism does not demand the execution, conversion or subjation of non-Jews.

      All other issues are founded on this simple, undeniable, clear, FACT.

      There are more Hasan’s in America. Until we discuss fact, then the politically correct diversionary tactic pointing discussions of anti-semitism, racism, assignment of blame will assist and further islam’s attack on the West.

      Yes, I know this is not politically correct. The dead Americans in Ft. Hood and their families deserve better than polite obsfucation.

      God bless America. Thank you, veterans.

  • Elder Jane

    The point to keep in mind is that US Army officers were afraid to file reports on his treasonous behavior because they might appear to be discriminatory.

    The CIA was observing his behavior and associations but did nothing about it. Why? Because, we’ll find out, that Panetta, in a January/February flourish of De-Cheneyization, issued memos, emails, and stated in meetings that agents are not to engage in profiling. The CIA feared Panetta’s retribution if they pursued him with cause more than they feared that he would act.

    This is the tragedy.

    • http://NoQuarterUSA.net Larry Johnson

      Jane,
      I fully agree. Folks failed to do their job. Cultural fear should never be an excuse for doing what is right.

      • Elder Jane

        The real workers at the CIA and in the Army probably WANTED to do their jobs.

        However, the fucked up Obama regime of political correctness and automatically doing the opposite of what Bush-Cheney did, is putting us all at risk.

        Panetta will be OUT. Napolitano will be OUT.
        They are the truly treasonous ones.

        Obama will leave them under the bus with Jeremiah, Grandma, & Malia (and countless others.)

        • d2i

          Why does this conversation b/w you and Larry feel like deja vu?

          Aren’t these the same excuses made by the CIA, FBI and the military following 9/11?

          Wasn’t it FBI agent Crawley telling senior staff about the chatter she was hearing through her sources about an imminent attack but senior staff ignored her?

          One would have thought the senior staff of all of our intelligent agencies would have learned something by now. Makes one wonder just how broken IS our intelligence apparatus.

          • Tammy

            d2i:
            The intelligence communities are nothing BUT, and they repeat the same mistakes over and over again.
            And they are PROUD of it.
            Look at Larry: It’s everybody’s fault except HIS department.
            It’s Bush’s fault. It’s Clinton’s fault. It’s Bush I’s fault. It’s Reagan’s fault.

            But Jimmy Carter? NOOOOOO. Never HIS fault.
            The peanut farmer from the South?
            He talked and talked and talked, and the hostages in Iran were left to die.

            And that is their idol.

  • Bronwyn’s Harbor

    Great post and thoughts. Exodus was pure propaganda — both the book and the movie. It’s safe to say that it influenced Americans’ sympathies for Israel for decades. We bought the emotional appeal of the new country’s fight, ignoring its terrorism.

    • Ellen D

      Ah – a new country’s fight for freedom. Larry is right – history is written by the winners. And defined a lot by which country you are in. Americans who know the British burned down the White House in the war of 1812 usually don’t know that this was in retaliation for Americans burning down the Parliament buildings in Toronto.

      He’s also right that terrorism is the tool of a group against another group. Usually with defined aims.
      A one-man terrorist doesn’t fit the definition.

      • Carlaforhillary

        In Hasan’s mind he thought he was part of Al Queda. He was e-mailing them.

  • Mirlo

    Do we really know what drove this man to such destructive killings? I agree with you, Larry, that the end doesn’t justify the means – in no case. But I am not at all certain yet what caused a seemingly peaceful military psychiatrist to do this terrible, awful massacre.

    It is not acurate if you say, in an earlier post, that Nidal Hassan wasn’t traumatized, just because he wasn’t himself in combat situations yet. We don’t know that at this moment. I am a therapist, specialized in treating traumatized people (by torture, terrorist actions, natural disasters rape, domestic violence etc). Whether someone will develop PTSD depends very much on the mental constitution of the individual. Relatively small things can trigger it in someone with little mental stamina. Having to deal 5 – 8 times daily with severely traumatised soldiers over a long period of time without regular, frequent and proper supervision could very well lead to traumatisation in certain circumstances. Once a year supervision is highly negligent, I would recommend weekly or at least twice a month supervision with an experienced professional, even if you are a trained therapist or specially trained psychiatrist. Believe me, I know what I am talking about.

    But we do not know, at this time, what triggered Nidal Hassan’s devastating actions as yet; until we do, I would not rule out anything.

  • Ferd Berfle

    I don’t know why the major went on a killing spree but I’m sure the military will perform due diligence in pursuit of the truth, wherever it may lead. What concerns me, as I noted on a previous thread, is that we don’t collectively go off on a tangential track and do further damage to our Constitution and our own civil liberties as we did after 9/11. When we change our way of life in response to what they do, they win and we lose and what we lose is much more precious than a fleeting feeling of safety. I know I’ll get a lot of flack for this but I stand by the comment.

    • justme_kc

      When we change our way of life in response to what they do, they win and we lose and what we lose is much more precious than a fleeting feeling of safety.

      excellent post… couldn’t agree with you more. it’s like cutting off your nose to spite your face!

    • Animal Control

      No flack from me, I couldn’t agree more.

      • Ferd Berfle

        Thanks, AC and justme_kc. I am hoping this time around the country will collectively think before acting and respond appropriately. Frankly I grow weary of the baby being thrown out with the bath water.

  • Peggy Sue

    Although I take your point, Larry, I agree with Elder Jane that we also need to temper this PC mentality to protect our own from future attacks. We can agree that the entire Muslim community should not be stigmatized by the act of one deranged man. But I think we need to recognize that fanaticism comes in many shapes and sizes and right now it has infected Islam. From everything I’ve read thus far, Hasan should have been picked up months ago. Why wasn’t he? I suspect part of it is the over-sensitivity to being tolerant. The man was a Muslim, so he was cut additional slack.

    As far as being a Muslim before he was an American? That’s a piss poor excuse. Doesn’t mean only Muslims fall into this bracket. You mentioned the movie Exodus. I come from an Irish Catholic background. I never supported the IRA, but a number of Irish Americans did. Of course, we weren’t at war with the Brits, which puts an extra spin on this carnage. Christian fundamentalists gave birth to the yahoos who thought it was A-okay to kill doctors performing abortions and bomb reproductive clinics.

    Terrorism is wrong. I think most will agree. And right now, the majority of it is being performed by Muslim extremists. Both we and the Muslim community need to acknowledge that fact, be willing to say it aloud. And repudiate it, loudly.

    • Katmoon

      Thank you Peggy Sue, very well said.

    • sowsear

      We can agree that the entire Muslim community should not be stigmatized by the act of one deranged man.
      ———————-
      Aren’t all terrorists deranged?

      • d2i

        “We can agree that the entire Muslim community should not be stigmatized by the act of one deranged man.”

        If it were only one act, sure, but it’s thousands upon thousands of acts. Wives heads being cut off, children running away from home, hell, children being run over by their own parents, using children as suicide bombers, burying women up to their heads in an arena and stoning her to death, the three thousand souls lost forever on 9/11 and now the 12 innocents and 31 wounded.

        Yeah, there is something very very wrong with the Muslim faith and those who follow it. I will stigmatize all Muslims. I’m tired of their excuses and I’m tired of their horrific carnage. It’s an intolerable religion which shuns freedom which goes against the core of who I am as an American.

        • Alex

          And ignoring these well-stated facts will get more people killed. Islam falls far short as a “religion of peace,” and the sooner the world acknowledges that, the better.

      • justme_kc

        Aren’t all terrorists deranged?

        absolutely!!! but not ALL muslims are terrorists!

    • creeper

      Thank you, Peggy Sue. I’ve been trying to figure out how to say that all morning. You did it better than I ever could.

  • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

    I think anyone who shoots up a bunch of people in the name of Allah, in the midst of a global holy war against Western Civilization, is a terrorist. Whether or not he was part of an organized terrorist group is immaterial to me.

    This does not mean I am up in arms where I want to see all Muslims detained. It also has NOTHING to do with Israel in my mind.

    To me, downplaying this man’s publicly stated radical beliefs and is propaganda of another sort.

    Anyone who is posting crazy stuff on the Internet about how great suicide bombers are, and then runs around an army base shouting praise to Allah as he shoots people, is a terrorist to me. A lone terrorist perhaps, but a terrorist in my book.

    • http://www.sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com Sonic Ninja Kitty

      HOB, You may disagree with me, but I don’t think the “Allahu akbar” means anything: http://sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com/2009/11/08/ordinary-convention-or-meaningful-threat/

      I don’t mean to take the focus off the tragedy and the fact that Hasan is a criminal, but I also think there is a mountain made out of a molehill concerning that phrase. With all due respect. And–I wish we never had to discuss this at all. It’s a tragedy.

      • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

        I’m not an expert in Islam or that particular language. But I read your piece and I don’t find your argument convincing.

        The guy was living in America. I doubt he would be “casually” throwing that phrase around in his life here as he might be in an Islamic country.

        Also, comparing a phrase that clearly calls upon God (the Islamic name for God) is a much more powerful phrase than “here we go.”

        I don’t think you can ignore the spiritual element of those words.

        But even without the use of that phrase, the fact that the guy was waxing poetic about suicide bombings online before this happened is enough for me.

        • http://www.sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com Sonic Ninja Kitty

          I have heard it more times than I can begin to count, but OK, fair enough: we disagree.

          They guy is a nutcase and criminal–in no way am I defending him. Nutcases do say phrases other people say, too, though, and it doesn’t make the normal person a nutcase to be saying them. I think the emphasis on it is way overblown.

          • http://www.sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com Sonic Ninja Kitty

            Oh–and the waxing poetic about suicide bombings–I completely agree that part is unacceptable. I wonder why no one took action on it.

        • Alex

          I find her “argument” disgusting.

          • http://www.sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com Sonic Ninja Kitty

            I’m sorry you think my condemnation of Hasan in the strongest terms possible is “disgusting”.

        • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

          Well, it is the phrase they use before they blow themselves up; plow a plane into the ground (Flt 93), or mow down 40+ people. So I don’t really care about the meaning, etc., it’s what it means to me…they use to distinguish dying for their cause.

          And so far as I’m concerned, he’s a terrorist. I can’t believe the Army let him get away with making the distinctly un-American comments while serving. Pretty much a no-brainer.

  • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

    caught in spam!

  • Ferd Berfle

    Terrorism is wrong. I think most will agree. And right now, the majority of it is being performed by Muslim extremists. Both we and the Muslim community need to acknowledge that fact, be willing to say it aloud. And repudiate it, loudly.

    Exactly.

  • http://www.sonicninjakitty.wordpress.com Sonic Ninja Kitty

    Thanks for another reasoned post. I have been shocked at the crazed reactions to this tragic event.

    What happened to the other two suspects? Is the military trying to cover something or are they trying to isolate the blame on one person, and for what reason?

  • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

    BTW…

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,573166,00.html

    The gunman was trying to contact Al Qaeda before this happened. That’s someone who was intending to commit a terrorist attack in my book.

    • Alex

      Larry, your response?

  • HARP

    Please let’s not jump to conclusions. The Cambridge police acted stupidly………Never mind.

  • tango

    Oh my.

    Nidal Hassan Did the Right Thing

    “Nidal Hassan is a hero. He is a man of conscience who could not bear living the contradiction of being a Muslim and serving in an army that is fighting against his own people. This is a contradiction that many Muslims brush aside and just pretend that it doesn’t exist. Any decent Muslim cannot live, understanding properly his duties towards his Creator and his fellow Muslims, and yet serve as a US soldier. The US is leading the war against terrorism which in reality is a war against Islam. Its army is directly invading two Muslim countries and indirectly occupying the rest through its stooges.
    Nidal opened fire on soldiers who were on their way to be deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan. How can there be any dispute about the virtue of what he has done? In fact the only way a Muslim could Islamically justify serving as a soldier in the US army is if his intention is to follow the footsteps of men like Nidal.
    The fact that fighting against the US army is an Islamic duty today cannot be disputed. No scholar with a grain of Islamic knowledge can defy the clear cut proofs that Muslims today have the right -rather the duty- to fight against American tyranny. Nidal has killed soldiers who were about to be deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan in order to kill Muslims. The American Muslims who condemned his actions have committed treason against the Muslim Ummah and have fallen into hypocrisy.”

    http://www.anwar-alawlaki.com/?p=228

    • Doc99

      Members of a community which cannot be named danced in the street in West Paterson, NJ on 9/11.

    • Portia Elizabeth

      Oops. Sorry, tango. I somehow missed your post and put up a clip from the AP that says essentially the same thing you posted.

  • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

    On the issue of terrorism portrayed positively in films such as Exodus:

    I’ve never seen Exodus. But I have seen plenty of films that have portrayed “resistance fighters.” Especially in sci-fi. The new Battlestar Galactica touched upon some of these issues.

    Where’s the line between fighting a resistance and terrorism?

    If, e.g., someone organized bombing a hotel that killed civilians, but the hotel was housing important leaders of the oppressive tyranny, would the ends justify the means?

    My issue with Islamic terrorism is that they focus on killing innocent people rather than trying to target the people in power. I guess with an amorphous enemy such as “Western culture” maybe they see all Americans as being the ones in power.

    But let’s just say that Glenn Beck’s worst fears are realized (not likely, but just for argument’s sake): Obama and his radical team have taken over America, shredded the constitution, and instituted a communist/fascist state.

    What would the resistance look like? Would the resistance fighters be labeled terrorists?

    • HARP

      At least there is no evidence to Hasan tried to contact the real extremists…. tea partiers. (snark)

      • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

        You betcha. When we were campaigning the last weekend before the election for McCain/Palin, a young female member of one of the branches (Navy, I think) walked past us in the park, saying “I wish I could be with you but you know we’re not allowed to campaign. But thank you for standing for us.” So members of the armed services are made very aware of what they can and can’t do; what they can and can’t say.

    • Woodhull

      Interesting question. The answer is that the WH, including Pelosi (remember her saying how she saw protests in SF that lead to violence) have called those of us who are resisting, “terrorists”. And when they aren’t calling us that, we’ve been called “wrong thinking”, “stupid”, and a host of other things. It’s their way of marginalizing Americans who disagree on their policies and legislation.

      I think the word “terrorist” is losing its meaning and that it is being confused with other things.

  • tango

    Oops, I’ve been caught in spam too. Probably that link to the Muslim blgo where Hasan is hailed a hero got my post flagged.

  • oowawa

    The extremist mindset is not unique to Islam.

    Exactly correct. Religious fanaticism comes in many guises, but right now the Muslim variety seems to be causing a particular problem all over the world.

    • Obama: Dubya 2 Electric Boogaloo

      Exactly.

      When was the last time we heard of a catholic strapping on some homemade bombs and setting themselves off just outside Vatican City shouting “Jesus is Lord!”?

      When was the last time the Pope issued a decree that had to be followed by the entire country of Italy by force and carried a penalty of death?

      Oh, but, you know, don’t focus on Islam or anything, because we’re all bad.

      • ziggy

        I seem to remember a time when the word “terrorism” was most often used in association with the Irish Republican Army.

        I also recall the bombing of black churches during the American civil rights movement. White Christians were involved.

        There were the abortion clinic bombings, hit lists on the internet, and the methodical assassination of doctors.

        Timothy McVeigh had connections with the Christian Identity Movement.

        Muslim extremist don’t seem to have a monopoly on terrorism.

        • http://deleted BuzzisbackLatte

          You forgot Obama’s boyfriend, William Ayers.

          • Ferd Berfle

            But Buzz, Ayers is one of That One’s friends so we can’t question his actions. Yeah right–more selective indignation from the Kool-Aide crowd of mindless obamabots like Zippy..

          • ziggy

            I’m no promoter of Ayers, but his group at least took care to avoid causing deliberate injury to other human beings. I make a distinction on that point.

            • http://deleted BuzzisbackLatte

              Oh so blowing up three of their own in the Greenwich Village townhouse doesn’t count since they did it to themselves, huh. And the rest of the “symbolic” bombings were more about making a statement than destroying property and committing crimes.

              The excuses are profound, are they not?

            • Ferd Berfle

              As if that distinction has any real difference. Bombing is bombing and is designed to induce terror, whether people are killed or not. It is all about intent. Of course, he’s Obama’s friend so it was well intended. Yeah, right.

            • Alex

              OMG, you’re defending Ayers?

              • ziggy

                I’m suggesting that there’s an enormous moral difference between destroying property and deliberately killing innocent people. That’s not a defense of the destruction of property or of people who do so. It’s just putting things into perspective.

                • Unabashed Galt

                  See the “moral relativism” and “unintended consequences” references in the comments below.

                • http://deleted BuzzisbackLatte

                  Ayers’ girlfriend at the time was killed along with two others because of activities he was – along with her – involved in but, morally, that’s okay for Ayers. It wasn’t murder but it was illegal activity.

                  Ayers isn’t rotting in prison on a technicality, not a moral difference.

                  Oh, and he and his lovely bride are so sorry they didn’t do more. Lovely people and such wonderful friends to the Obamas.

                  Ayers has been a perpetrator of the so called “man-made disaster”. End of story.

                  • TeakWoodKite

                    Just think! BO invited him to the White to boot.

                    Bomb and kill, visit the white house. Do not pass GO. Wierd.

                  • tango

                    Well they’ve also been tied to a bombing that killed a police officer though they’ve denied involvement. I don’t think they’re as innocent as they claim to be.

                    “The bombing was listed by the FBI as the work of the Weather Underground, but Ayers and Dohrn, two of its top members, never claimed credit for the blast. They have tried to insist over the years that their bombs never hurt or killed anyone, except their own members. However, the consistent testimony of former FBI informant Larry Grathwohl, who participated in meetings with Ayers, has been that Ayers told him that Dohrn planted the bomb.

                    What’s more, the bomb that killed three of their own members when it accidentally exploded in a New York townhouse was an anti-personnel device intended for an Army dance at Fort Dix, New Jersey. Mark Rudd, another member of the Weather Underground, reveals in a new book that he was in favor of planting the bomb, saying that he wanted “this country to have a taste of what it had been dishing out daily in Southeast Asia…” What the U.S. had been trying to do was prevent a communist takeover of South Vietnam.”

                    http://www.worldtribune.com/worldtribune/WTARC/2009/ss_terror0180_03_03.asp

        • Ferd Berfle

          Timothy McVeigh had connections with the Christian Identity Movement.

          I don’t suppose you did any hand-wringing over his capture, indictment, conviction, and execution now did you? Being a native of Oklahoma City, I know I didn’t but then I’m consistent in my POV that you don’t kill innocent people because you can’t square your own beliefs with those of society at large. Frankly I don’t care why he did what he did. That he did it and what is to be done with him and the information he might provide investigators are the only issues.

          • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

            Extreme, violent fundamentalist Christians scare me in the same way that extreme, violent fundamentalist Muslims do.

            There’s apparently a personality type that is far too common that responds to religious fundamentalism with violent acts.

            • Ferd Berfle

              They do me, too and I think you’re correct about a certain personality type.

          • ziggy

            Nope. McVeigh got what he deserved. I won’t do much hand wringing over Hassan’s conviction and execution either, if the man proves to have been in any way rational. I’m not sure what I’ll think should be done with him if it turns out he’s psychotic.

            • http://deleted BuzzisbackLatte

              He was in good enough mental form to give away furniture and korans. He also was capable of making a plan, gathering the necessary guns, getting himself to the place of engagement, and to allegedly shout “Allahu Akbar!” as he methodically pulled the trigger hitting approximately 42-43 people.

              Don’t think they’ll spend too much time on trying to make him psychotic.

          • Ellen D

            Righto, Ferd!

            you don’t kill innocent people because you can’t square your own beliefs with those of society at large.

            You know, this is a big world. Move to a country that has a society you agree with. No one is forcing anyone to stay in a culture they disagree with.

            It’s called freedom. Find your own place and go to it! I did.

      • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

        I think the Catholics would have to blow themselves up in Mecca or the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem to make a similar statement.

        • Peggy Sue

          You’re right, Annie. The Irish Catholics, the IRA, would have blown themselves up and anyone standing around them to make the same point.

          I did not support them then [though I'm one of the flock] nor do I excuse the excess of the Church in the past.

          But we’re not talking about the Catholic Church or the Reformation [which had plenty of violence and terrorism to its name]. And the Jews? Yes, they too, have perpetrated acts of terrorism.

          But right now, we’re talking about Muslim extremists, which today is the major source of violence and terrorism in the world.

          We have to be willing to say that, acknowledge that if we are ever to address what’s going on. Political correctness is killing us.

          We need to accept the fact that we are all capable of terrible deeds. But at the same time, we are all responsible for those deeds as individuals.

          No excuses, no qualifications, no “you must understand.”

          No! Wrong is wrong. I do not need to understand the most base response of human behavior. It’s wrong. And if it’s not?

          Then we’re nothing at all.

    • Ferd Berfle

      but right now the Muslim variety seems to be causing a particular problem all over the world.

      Yes, oowawa, if they just limited their philosophy and barbaric carnage to their own countries and stopped trying to bring their particular brand of extremism over here, they’d be doing us all a favor. We have enough homegrown zealots of our own to deal with. This is sheer unadulterated madness.

  • HEPT

    Nidal hasan is Muslim terrorist.
    he is a Muslim.
    He committed murder while shouting allah ackbar.
    he belong to radical mosques.
    he is an asshole.
    He better get the needle or a firing squad.
    Nidal Hasan, Muslim terrorist who committed a terrorist attack on his own troops.
    What does a movie about jews have to do with a very common muslim murderer whom Army Political correctness allowed to wear a uniform?
    Nothing.

    • bayareavoter

      thank you. well said. I was wondering the same thing.

    • Alex

      Uh, nothing?

  • No-nonsense-nancy

    As a tea party participant and part of the “resistance” I can say that we ABSOLUTELY ARE labeled as “domestic terrorists”!! Even the ninety year old ladies who attend tea parties.

    • Tammy

      No-nonsence:
      Nice to meet a fellow terrorist! LOL.
      I guess protesting about being taxed to death makes you and me “dangerous”.

  • Tammy

    HEPT:

    I agree with you 100%.
    And I don’t give a shit about Hasan’s State of Mind.
    Not. One. Bit.

    Why don’t you explain to this family “why” Hasan did it,hmmm?

    http://www.startribune.com/local/stpaul/69386657.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aU1yDEmP:QMDCinchO7DU

  • Craig Della Penna

    Thanks, Larry, for bringing up this important point.
    As “Exodus” revealed, ‘terrorist’ v ‘freedom fighter’ is largely in the eye of the beholder.

    Thus, to the right winger, any Muslim with a gun (Palestinian or otherwise) is a ‘terrorist’ whilst to the PC Left any Israeli (with or without a gun) is a member of the “Occupying Forces Oppressing the Just and Legitimate Aspirations of the Noble Palestinians for the Return of their Rightful Homeland”, kinda like a terrorist…

    The language we use is one of the major stumbling blocks to resolution of the conflict. These labels are used to inflame and to obfuscate reality. If we were able to ban these terms and were forced to speak in descriptive and explicative language, it might go a long way toward changing things.

    I’m reminded of Abba Eban (a onetime Israeli Foreign Minister and celebrated wit) who said: “When all else fails, they try reason.”

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      Abba Eban…eloquent man. It was wonderful to hear him speak.

    • Tammy

      You were in the CIA? What, were you a desk jockey?

      No wonder Hasan, the terrorist, got away with it.
      He knew that dhimmis like you were running the CIA.

      The “language we use”?
      Uh, no, dhimmi, it was the GUNS that HASAN used.

      Why don’t you email your post to the families of the dead soldiers? You know, the ones that actually protect and defend this country.

  • Obama: Dubya 2 Electric Boogaloo

    Personally I don’t get that it’s not a terrorist act as long as no others are involved. That doesn’t make sense. It’s like saying a lone individual who robs a bank isn’t a bank robber but a sick individual, but rob that bank with a couple friends and now it’s a bank robbery and a conspiracy.

    Second thing is that old school soviet loyalists must be pissed. Had they only been able to wrap up totalitarian communism with a glossy religious veneer they could have gotten away with anything. Hey, want to silence your political opponents? Change the Communist Party apparatus into Mullahs and you’ll have the world defending you instead of condenming you for human rights violations.

    • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

      “Personally I don’t get that it’s not a terrorist act as long as no others are involved. That doesn’t make sense. It’s like saying a lone individual who robs a bank isn’t a bank robber but a sick individual, but rob that bank with a couple friends and now it’s a bank robbery and a conspiracy.”

      Agreed.

      • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

        I agree as well.

    • ziggy

      I think you’ve got a point. Conspiracy isn’t necessarily part of the definition of terrorism. A single isolated individual can be responsible for a terrorist act. To me, whether it’s terrorism or not is a matter of motive and intention. If the primary motivation is to further a cause by inspiring terror, you’ve met the definition of terrorism.

      Hassan would be a true terrorist if he committed mass murder to further an extremist Muslim cause, either alone or with others. The possibility exists that he’s simply crazy, however, and rationalized his personal homicidal rage by framing it in a political and religious context.

      • http://www.hillaryorbust.com Hillary or Bust

        “The possibility exists that he’s simply crazy, however, and rationalized his personal homicidal rage by framing it in a political and religious context.”

        Umm…aren’t ALL suicidal terrorists crazy by definition, and simply framing their bloodlust in a political and religious context?

        What sane person straps a bomb to themselves and blows people up in the name of God? None that I know of.

        • ziggy

          Yeah, they all seem pretty much crazy as bedbugs to me. But if you go that route, you furnish them all with craziness as a moral or legal defense. You’ve got to take the position that some people can be sane, but so coldly calculating that they’ll commit horrors to further a cause. The default position is that everyone is responsible for their actions, until proven otherwise.

      • gonzotx

        ZIGGY…you are nuts

  • Linda Anselmi

    Excellent post Larry. And well said. Thank you.

  • devildog666

    The extremist mindset is not unique to Islam. That’s the point I want us to keep in mind.

    Let’s give the guy a medal for living up to his inner feelings, forget the infidel oath that he took which was evidently meaningless. His Inman certainly is giving him kudos.
    Personally, I don’t give a dam about your moral equivalency, the bastard should be hung.

    • Tammy

      devildog:

      This is the extremist mindset:

      http://iowntheworld.com/blog/?p=9894

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      Maybe he was just a “charming guy” with low self esteem issues. LOL.

  • TexasMirth

    Was Nidal Hassan a terrorist? No. He may have tried to contact Al Qaeda operatives but he acted alone

    How could you be so sure? Who was the visitor that Hasan had the day before? The neighbors said it was the only time they saw anyone come to Hasan’s apt.
    The people here in Bell County are waiting to learn more before they blandly accept the lone wolf theory.

    • Tammy

      He’s not sure, TexasMirth.
      He just assumes that Hassan worked alone, because if he DIDN’T work alone, then his buddies in the CIA would be blamed for ignoring the red flags.

      But then again, the CIA ignores almost everything, don’t they? They don’t want to “offend” the religion of piss.

      • TeakWoodKite

        The week before Fort Hood

        Peninsula (AQAP) leader Nasir al-Wahayshi wrote an article that called for jihadists to conduct simple attacks against a variety of targets. The targets included “any tyrant, intelligence den, prince” or “minister” (referring to the governments in the Muslim world like Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Yemen), and “any crusaders whenever you find one of them, like at the airports of the crusader Western countries that participate in the wars against Islam, or their living compounds, trains etc.,” (an obvious reference to the United States and Europe and Westerners living in Muslim countries)

        Al-Wahayshi, an ethnic Yemeni who spent time in Afghanistan serving as a lieutenant under Osama bin Laden, noted these simple attacks could be conducted with readily available weapons such as knives, clubs or small improvised explosive devices (IEDs). According to al-Wahayshi, jihadists “don’t need to conduct a big effort or spend a lot of money to manufacture 10 grams of explosive material” and that they should not “waste a long time finding the materials, because you can find all these in your mother’s kitchen, or readily at hand or in any city you are in.”

        .Stratfor

        You think Bill Ayers didn’t memorize “The Anarchist Cookbok”?

  • Five Thirty

    Time to blame Jews & Israel. I could set my watch by it.

    • Maggie

      Yup and mountainaires as Larry’s back up singer. Just-like-clockwork.

  • creeper

    Larry, I don’t understand. Why would the fact that Hassan acted alone keep him from being branded a terrorist? None of the definitions of the word “terrorist” that I can find are limited to membership in a group. Example, from dictionary.com:

    –noun
    1. a person, usually a member of a group, who uses or advocates terrorism.
    2. a person who terrorizes or frightens others.

    I think you’re wildly premature in making the flat statement that Hassan is not a terrorist. Worse, I see political correctness peeking its head above the crowd here. It makes me nervous.

    • TexasMirth

      Creeper, you echo my sentiments.

      • Obama: Dubya 2 Electric Boogaloo

        I also agree. See my comment above. By making Hassan to be some bat shit crazy individual rather than a terrorist it basically provides them a self-defense. Who wouldn’t classify the acts of a terrorist as “crazy”? By making Hassan a nutcase we’re essentially saying “not guilty by reason of insanity”. That’s BS IMO.

  • hokma

    I don’t condone the terrorist acts of anyone including the Irgun, but I do find it curious why you selected Israel to play out your point.

    You can look at any revolution through history, including out own, and you will unfortunately see acts of terror.

    The difference with Muslims is that they are using terror as a worldwide weapon to force Islam onto the rest of the world. They are taught a complete lack of tolerance of any other religion.

    As far as Major Nidal Hassan he is a terrorist and the excuses being used that he was mentally disturbed or a loner simply ignores the problem.

    He did not come to this point on his own and without assistance. At what point are we going o stop playing footsies with Muslims who propagate this intolerance in mosques in our communities and then act surprised when one of their own commits (or tries to commit)a vicious act like this?

    What is also disturbing is the reports that the great FBI knew about this man and he was allowed to remain on a military base with access to weapons and as a threat to our soldiers.

  • Portia Elizabeth

    “Exodus” was recently shown on the Retro channel and I watched it because I’m a Paul Newman fan. I must not have paid attention because I didn’t see it as a propaganda piece. It was one author’s point of view of a period of history, so in that sense you’d have to call “Gone with the Wind” propaganda. Or “Huckleberry Finn”.

    My understanding of history is that within hours of declaring itself an independent state, Israel was attacked by surrounding countries such as Syria and Lebanon. I cannot criticize Israel for fighting back against such odds. If surrounded by enemy, what would you do?

    By the way, I was raised a Southern Baptist, so I don’t have a dog in the hunt.

    • mountainaires

      History did not begin the moment Israel was declared a state; and history is revised as time goes by, depending on what documents or facts come to light. Israeli historians have studied new documents in the last decade, that were kept secret for decades, and have a much bigger picture of what occurred. Ilan Pappe, Avi Schlaim and other Israeli historians are now writing books disputing previous Israeli propaganda, so it’s helpful to read their opinions.

      Israel wasn’t a victim. At each point over the past six decades when Israel was offered a peace plan by the Arabs, Israel rejected it.

      My recommendation is that people read Israeli newspapers on a regular basis, read Jewish writers and historians, Amira Hass, Daniel Levy, Ran HaCohen and others who dissent from Israeli policy. There is a vibrant and open discussion in Israel, but we are routinely propagandized here in this country and don’t get the full picture about Israel.

      • hokma

        “At each point over the past six decades when Israel was offered a peace plan by the Arabs, Israel rejected it.”

        What? Be specific.

        Of course it probably is what your interpretation of “peace” is. My guess is that your interpretation of peace is that Israel unconditionally give back all land taken during any of the Arab wars as well as give Jeruslalem to the Arabs and allow open borders and citizenship to any Arab who wants to enter. Of course with that might mean a resumption of massive terror attacks inside Israel, but then why you should care about that. Afterall it’s only Jews.

        • mountainaires

          That is a direct quote from this interview with Ilan Pappe, Israeli historian.
          But why should you care about him, he’s
          “only a Jew.” As are all the following sources you really should read, so you aren’t so fucking stupid. ;-)

          Alan Hart Interviews Israeli Professor Ilan Pappe

          Like all Israelis, Ilan Pappe was brought up, conditioned, to believe Zionism’s version of the history of the making and sustaining of the Arab-Israeli conflict. It wasn’t until he went to England to continue his academic studies that he had access to documentation which enabled him to understand that Zionism’s version is a propaganda lie.

          http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article23893.htm

          How Israel brought Gaza to the brink of humanitarian catastrophw

          Avi Shlaim The Guardian, Wednesday 7 January 2009

          Oxford professor of international relations Avi Shlaim served in the Israeli army and has never questioned the state’s legitimacy. But its merciless assault on Gaza has led him to devastating conclusions

          http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/07/gaza-israel-palestine

          Jews to Israel: Stop villifying Goldstone:

          “When it comes to Israel, hard-core censorship and intimidation by those claiming to speak in the name of the Jewish people have been the order of the day,” the letter said regarding Israel’s response to the Goldstone report findings.

          http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1125830.html

          On 22 Sept. ’09, Rabi’ a-Tawil, from East Jerusalem, entered Israel through the Mevo Beitar checkpoint. At a nearby gas station, soldiers took his identifying documents and went to the checkpoint. A-Tawil continued to a second gas station, some two kilometers from the checkpoint, where soldiers shot and killed him, although he did not endanger them.

          http://www.btselem.org/English/

          • hokma

            All of your references are from a rabidly anti-Isael nut and has no credibility but does support your anti-Jewish view.

            • Ferd Berfle

              Thank you for pointing that out.

              • mountainaires

                Ha! Oh, Ferd, really, you’re so transparent. You didn’t even know who they were. And, Hokum is clueless about both of them.

                Honestly, why don’t you both just MAN UP and accept that you’ve been drinking the Kool-Aid when it comes to Israel.

                :-)

            • mountainaires

              Jewish Terrorists

              Jews have the right to kill non-Jews in just about any circumstance, according to Israeli news reports quoting Rabbi Yitzhak Shapiro, the head of a Jewish religious school in the illegal settlement of Yitzhar, near Nablus.

              “If we kill a gentile who has sinned or has violated one of the seven commandments… there is nothing wrong with the murder,” Shapiro wrote, according to Hebrew-language Israeli newspaper Maariv on Monday.

              http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1126890.html

              http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=238444

          • Tammy

            Ahh, the Jew hating is coming out on this site.

            Blame Hasan’s actions on the Joooooos.

            Unbelievable.

        • Ferd Berfle

          Spot on, Hokma. IMO, there will be no peace in the ME until every Islamic country recognizes the right of Israel to exist. That should rightfully be a precondition to any peace agreement.

          • mountainaires

            Even the PLO recognized Israel’s right to exist; as has Hamas.

            Must “every Islamic country” also recognize the “right of Israel” to slaughter Palestinian children? Steal Palestinian’s land? Destroy their homes? Re-route their water? Put a checkpoint on every corner so they cannot get to the hospital when having babies? Shoot them when they go through checkpoints for no reason other than their hatred of Arabs? Force them to live in starvation through collective imprisonment, and blockades?

            Meet Amira Hass: Ferd’s version of an “anti-semite” My version of an Israeli hero.

            Amira Hass / The one thing worse than denying the Gaza report

            Like the Serbs of yore, we Israelis continue thinking it’s the world that is wrong, and only we who are right.

            Israel struck a civilian population that remains under its control, it didn’t fulfill its obligation to distinguish between civilians and militants and used military force disproportionate with the tangible threat to its own civilians. Air Force drones and helicopters fired deadly missiles at civilians, many of them children; the Tank Corps and Navy shelled civilian neighborhoods with weapons not designed for precision strikes; soldiers received orders to fire on rescue crews; others fired on civilians carrying white flags; and others killed people in or near their homes. Troops used Gazans as human shields, soldiers detained civilians in abusive conditions, the army used white phosphorus shells in dense civilian areas and, on the eve of withdrawing, destroyed wide residential, industrial and agricultural areas.

            There is only thing worse than denial – the admission that the IDF indeed acted as has been described, but that these actions are both normal and appropriate.

            http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1115232.html#resp

            The daughter of two Holocaust survivors (Bergen-Belsen), Hass was born in Jerusalem, and was educated at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, where she studied the history of Nazism and the European Left’s relation to the Holocaust. Early in her career, she traveled widely and worked in several different jobs. Frustrated by the events of the First Intifada, she began her journalistic career in 1989 as a staff editor for Ha’aretz and started to report from the Palestinian Territories in 1991. As of 2003, she is the only Jewish Israeli journalist who has lived full-time among the Palestinians, in Gaza from 1993 and in Ramallah from 1997.

            Hass was the recipient of the Press Freedom Hero award from the International Press Institute in 2000, the Bruno Kreisky Human Rights Award in 2002, the UNESCO/Guillermo Cano World Press Freedom Prize in 2003, the inaugural award from the Anna Lindh Memorial Fund in 2004 and Hrant Dink Memorial Award in 2009[1].

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amira_Hass

            Books by Amira Hass

            Drinking the Sea at Gaza
            Beautiful, haunting, and profound, it will stand with the great works of wartime reportage, from Michael Herr’s Dispatches to Rian Malan’s My Traitor’s Heart.

            • Tammy

              No, you moron, Hamas has called for the extermination of the Jews. They even have cute Barney type characters to teach their Muslim brethren that Jews drink the blood of Muslims.
              What planet do you live on?

              Your Jew hatred is just growing and growing and it’s all being exposed.

              Where did you go to school? Harvard? Columbia?
              Or do you work for the State Department?

              • mountainaires

                Tammy, please crawl back into your sewer with the rest of the shit. You stink up the place.

                • Tammy

                  No, your JEW hatred stinks up the WORLD.

              • Peggy Sue

                Tammy, put a lid on it.

                And what? A degree from Harvard or Columbia is now an absolute indictment?

                Or a position in the State Department?

                Earth to Tammy! We can criticize our allies, even Israel, without being anti-anything.

                Your hate-spew is wearisome.

                • Tammy

                  Your lack of knowledge is too, Peggy.

                  I guess I hit a nerve.
                  you must have been indoctrinated by one of those Universities.
                  MY HATE SPEW?????
                  I hate people who ignore the facts and indoctrinate our young to believe that Israel is the problem.
                  Obviously, you drank the koolaid that mountainmuslim drank.

                  • TeakWoodKite

                    IT Must suck to be you Tammy. All those people’s body language that you expertly fathom. I mean it must be a bummer to know that people respond negatively to you.

                    What I can’t figure out is how it is you have a gig speaking to anyone.

                    Jew hater? Seek help.

                    • Tammy

                      It doesn’t suck to be me, teak.
                      It must be hard for you to hold back you hatred of Jews. But then again, you’ve already played that card haven’t you/

                      Ahh, that POOR misunderstood Hasan.

                      No mention on this site of the DEAD SOLDIERS.
                      The innocents.
                      The people who just showed up for their jobs.
                      Sad.
                      But YOU, here at this Site, have sympathy for no one except the KILLER.

                      And I will continue my work. Just wish I could see your face, Teak.

                    • TeakWoodKite

                      See, here’s the thing Tammy and I will spell it out for you as fucking clear as someone can make it for your level of impaired comprehension.
                      I hope they string this pig up by the balls , as small as they must be for the coward he is…I have ZERO sympathy for him and sadly while he pulled the trigger, it was the chain of command that failed to remove a seditious piece of crap from the ranks and they had many opportunities to do so.
                      My views on Islam or the existence of state Israel are not important.
                      But you are too blinded by your your own anger management issues and very shallow intellectual abilities to comprehend that Jews are not the issue. But that won’t prevent you from calling PBot, who discloses his Jewish heritage, a Jew Hater. That is a sign of mental illness on your part. I am no fan of PBOT but you are beyond rude and frankly I pity you for the unthinking bigot you are.
                      Mr. Johnson recalls a factual event via a Movie about Jewish terrorism against a BRITISH target which Menachem Begin admitted to, and you go ballistic spraying your verbal violence on anyone who differs from the view from your little toxic fishbowl.

          • Senneth

            yes, I agree Ferd and Hokma. And I even find myself in agreement with Tammy and with Five Thirty and Maggie. I don’t get it. I think Peggy Sue put it most eloquently.

        • mountainaires

          “It’s only Jews.”

          “It’s only Arabs.”

          I do not subscribe to either of the above philosophies, so why you would even state such a thing is a bit befuddling to me.

          Unfortunately, your offensive stupidity gives me a glimpse into your own racial/ethnic bias. I do not know of any reason for you to say such a stupid thing otherwise. So, my hope is that you will educate yourself, so that in the future you do not repeat such malicious, ignorant, moronic and offensive assertions.

          “Be specific.”

          Okay, I will. That is a direct quote from Israeli Historian Ilan Pappe. You can hear him here:

          Zionism’s Jewish Enemy

          Alan Hart Interviews Professor Ilan Pappe

          Like all Israelis, Ilan Pappe was brought up, conditioned, to believe Zionism’s version of the history of the making and sustaining of the Arab-Israeli conflict. It wasn’t until he went to England to continue his academic studies that he had access to documentation which enabled him to understand that Zionism’s version is a propaganda lie.

          http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article23893.htm

          How Israel brought Gaza to the brink of humanitarian catastrophw

          Avi Shlaim The Guardian, Wednesday 7 January 2009

          Oxford professor of international relations Avi Shlaim served in the Israeli army and has never questioned the state’s legitimacy. But its merciless assault on Gaza has led him to devastating conclusions

          http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/07/gaza-israel-palestine

          Jews to Israel: Stop villifying Goldstone:

          “When it comes to Israel, hard-core censorship and intimidation by those claiming to speak in the name of the Jewish people have been the order of the day,” the letter said regarding Israel’s response to the Goldstone report findings.

          http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1125830.html

          On 22 Sept. ’09, Rabi’ a-Tawil, from East Jerusalem, entered Israel through the Mevo Beitar checkpoint. At a nearby gas station, soldiers took his identifying documents and went to the checkpoint. A-Tawil continued to a second gas station, some two kilometers from the checkpoint, where soldiers shot and killed him, although he did not endanger them.

          http://www.btselem.org/English/

        • mountainaires

          I have replied to you twice, but my replies didn’t show up. So, here goes a third time:

          “At each point over the past six decades when Israel was offered a peace plan by the Arabs, Israel rejected it.”

          “Be specific.”

          No problem.

          It is a direct quote from Israeli Historian Ilan Pappe.

          Alan Hart Interviews Professor Ilan Pappe

          Like all Israelis, Ilan Pappe was brought up, conditioned, to believe Zionism’s version of the history of the making and sustaining of the Arab-Israeli conflict. It wasn’t until he went to England to continue his academic studies that he had access to documentation which enabled him to understand that Zionism’s version is a propaganda lie.

          http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article23893.htm

          “It’s only Jews.” That certainly gives us a glimpse into your own racist ideological mindset. But it has absolutely nothing to do with my own perspective. So, you’ve exposed yourself as a stooge of propaganda, but contributed nothing else to our enlightenment here.

          • hokma

            “Even the PLO recognized Israel’s right to exist; as has Hamas.”

            Do you just make this stuff up???

            It is in the Hamas Charter that denies the existence of Israel and they have never withdrawn that.

            As far as peace agreements, Israel has had peace agreements with Egypt and with Jordan.

            The problem in the Middle East begins and ends with Iran. They will not allow Hamas or Hezbollah to negotiate any sort of peace with Jews.

            • Ferd Berfle

              It is in the Hamas Charter that denies the existence of Israel and they have never withdrawn that.

              And they have consistently refused to so do. No negotiations until they put it in writing. And even if they do put it in writing, I’m sure a splinter group will form and simply continue the violence under another name. Of course this will also be blamed on the Jews and so it goes.

              • mountainaires

                Hamas has agreed to “recognize Israel’s right to exist” for years; but Hamas defines the borders as being within the ’67 borders; Israel is sly about refusing to identify any borders when it makes its demands. And, you are confusing Hamas with Fatah on this issue.

                http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3249568,00.html
                http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0531-23.htm

                “Recognizing Israel” or any other state is a formal legal and diplomatic act by one state with respect to another state. It is inappropriate – indeed, nonsensical – to talk about a political party or movement extending diplomatic recognition to a state. To talk of Hamas “recognizing Israel” is simply to use sloppy, confusing, and deceptive shorthand for the real demand being made of the Palestinians.

                “Recognizing Israel’s right to exist,” the actual demand being made of Hamas and Palestinians, is in an entirely different league. This formulation does not address diplomatic formalities or a simple acceptance of present realities. It calls for a moral judgment.

                There is an enormous difference between “recognizing Israel’s existence” and “recognizing Israel’s right to exist.” From a Palestinian perspective, the difference is in the same league as the difference between asking a Jew to acknowledge that the Holocaust happened and asking him to concede that the Holocaust was morally justified. For Palestinians to acknowledge the occurrence of the Nakba – the expulsion of the great majority of Palestinians from their homeland between 1947 and 1949 – is one thing. For them to publicly concede that it was “right” for the Nakba to have happened would be something else entirely. For the Jewish and Palestinian peoples, the Holocaust and the Nakba, respectively, represent catastrophes and injustices on an unimaginable scale that can neither be forgotten nor forgiven.

                To demand that Palestinians recognize “Israel’s right to exist” is to demand that a people who have been treated as subhumans unworthy of basic human rights publicly proclaim that they are subhumans. It would imply Palestinians’ acceptance that they deserve what has been done and continues to be done to them. Even 19th-century US governments did not require the surviving native Americans to publicly proclaim the “rightness” of their ethnic cleansing by European colonists as a condition precedent to even discussing what sort of land reservation they might receive. Nor did native Americans have to live under economic blockade and threat of starvation until they shed whatever pride they had left and conceded the point.

                John V. Whitbeck, an international lawyer, is the author of, “The World According to Whitbeck.” He has advised Palestinian officials in negotiations with Israel.

                http://www.palestinematters.com/news/newsDetails.asp?newsID=11

                Hamas and Israel’s “Right to Exist”
                by Virginia Tilley, South Africa

                Absent clear borders, recognizing Israel’s “right to exist” must mean something else. And of course it does. Clearly implicit in the term is Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish state. In other words, the “right” Hamas is being required to endorse is that Israel can legitimately compose itself as a state in Palestine that is populated and run primarily by Jews, primarily for Jews. Such a state would thus be authorized by Hamas to sustain whatever laws and policies necessary to preserving its Jewish majority, even rejecting the return of Palestinian refugees mandated by international law. Or building a massive Wall on Palestinian land designed to protect the Jewish state from the “demographic threat” of mass non-Jewish citizenship-i.e., the Palestinians. Israel’s would also be legitimized for past actions on the same agenda, such as expelling the Palestinians from their homes in 1948, and for its future plans, such as confining Palestine’s indigenous people to cantons.

                Israel’s leadership has declared all these measures necessary to preserve Israel as “a Jewish and democratic state,” as phrased in Israel’s Basic Law (and reiterated by Mr. Sharon, Mr. Olmert, and almost every Israeli party across the political spectrum). Yet it is not the fact of this open policy of ethnic cleansing, but Israel’s right to pursue it, that is expressed in the phrase, “right to exist.”

                http://www.currentconcerns.ch/index.php?id=296

                Mousa Abu Marzook, PhD, Deputy of the Political Bureau of Hamas, in a July 10, 2007 Los Angeles Times Op-Ed titled “Hamas’ Stand,” wrote:

                “The sticking point of ‘recognition’ has been used as a litmus test to judge Palestinians. Yet as I have said before, a state may have a right to exist, but not absolutely at the expense of other states, or more important, at the expense of millions of human individuals and their rights to justice. Why should anyone concede Israel’s ‘right’ to exist, when it has never even acknowledged the foundational crimes of murder and ethnic cleansing by means of which Israel took our towns and villages, our farms and orchards, and made us a nation of refugees?”

                J
                uly 10, 2007 – Mousa Abu Marzook, PhD

                • hokma

                  That was over 3 years ago!

                  They spoke about a cease fire – that’s it.

                  Look at something more current – like last month – look at the Hamas Charter.

          • Tammy

            I’ve figured it out: Hasan killed our brave men and women who were unarmed because of the JEWS.

            Thanks, mountain-muslim!
            I just got an education from a scholar who reads anti-semitic propoganda and calls it truth!

            Now I can sleep better knowing who to hate.
            It’s those damn JOOOOOOOS.

            This website is making me want to vomit.
            And the intelligent people here must be feeling just as sick as I am.

  • Portia Elizabeth

    From the Associated Press:

    The personal Web site for a radical American imam living in Yemen who had contact with two 9/11 hijackers praised Hasan as a hero.

    The posting Monday on the Web site for Anwar al Awlaki, who was a spiritual leader at two mosques where three 9/11 hijackers worshipped, said American Muslims who condemned the Fort Hood attack are hypocrites who have committed treason against their religion.

    Awlaki said the only way a Muslim can justify serving in the U.S. military is if he intends to “follow in the footsteps of men like Nidal.”

    “Nidal Hassan (sic) is a hero,” Awlaki said. “He is a man of conscience who could not bear living the contradiction of being a Muslim and serving in an army that is fighting against his own people.”

    • TeakWoodKite

      This is were my thoughts have been.

      How can anyone have two masters in a military orginization? I make know distinction between any extreme religous beliefs. Just in this FUBAR example, those of the Muslim faith by default can’t have both.
      Still if Islam is a religion of peace why do the a large pertentage of wars and terrorist acts on the planet involve people of this faith?

      The only distinction in the story Mr. Johnson cites I find is that it was about Jewish nationalism, as contrasted with a belief system that does not acknowledge the state as an authority, but only the laws of Islam as such.

      As I am admittedly not as informed as I would like to be in the realities of the muslim contratictions; If I am off base, PLEASE show me were I am in error.

      • Katmoon

        I agree Teakwood. How can you join the military after the attacks here, as a Muslim; and a doctor, than 6 years later you are outraged about the war, so much so to the extreme of perpetuating terror on your fellow soldiers?

        Sorry I don’t buy it. My son and the many, many soldiers I know have served far longer, been in Croatia, Iraq, and Afghanistan and do have questions of faith when it comes to death caused by war (which is all I will say as that is a very hard conversation to have with your child). They are clear what their duty is, the one they swore to when they took their oath to serve, at that time it was sans the large amounts of cash to entice people to enlist, and it was before 9/11.

      • Ferd Berfle

        I don’t know as much as I probably should about the faith of Islam but I have a couple of friends from Egypt who are just as afraid of militant Islamists as any Westerner would be. There are militants in every religion but the Islamic militants appear to have much more strength within the confines of their religion than other religious militant sects do within theirs. The question as to why is one which I still haven’t been able to fathom.

        • IslamIsNotAReligion

          Well, freddy, maybe you should just pick up a koran and then read some hadiths. You know, educating yourself with factual, first source information can stabilize and anchor waffles.
          Try it.

          I anticipate your POV after you have read the source of jihadism: the unholy koran.

    • NomNomNom

      more than one person has parsed the idea of Al Awlaki being CIA. one might wait for a lot more facts to emerge before relying on anything said by him to determine one’s opinion. just google his name and CIA together.
      If Major Hasan can be tied in any way to Al Qaeda– whether legitimately or no– this will create a lot more support for the war in Afghanistan.
      Just sayin.

  • Lonni

    Was Nigal Hasan a terrorist? Yes, not No. Was he terrorizing the people at the Post based on his radical beliefs as a Muslim? The prior actions of his vocalizations concerning the wars in the ME and how he believed they were a “war against Islam” as well as his yelling “Allah Akbar” would indicate that truly his mindset was such that he “made no effort to conceal his devotion to an extreme vision of Islam” and acted out his devotion in the terrorizing and murdering of a lot of innocent people.

    I think, as Hasan gains strength,in his recovery from the gunshots he received, we will find out what he had intended…or not. By Islam rules, He won’t be allowed to commit suicide so He is going to have to face the consequences of his actions. I’m curious to see how far his lawyers will go to keep him alive. I hope he lives and understands the gravity of what he has done. After all, he is a terrorist and should be well acquainted with what he is now facing…a terror of his own making.

  • TexasMirth

    Joe Lieberman is calling for an investigation. Thank you, Senator Lieberman, for not accepting the pablum being pushed by the P.C. crowd.

    • http://N/A breeze

      IMHO a ‘terrorist’ is an individual who threatens
      other(s) with TERROR, literally!!!

      Hasan certainly fits the dictionary description.

      Furthermore, he is TWICE a traitor, to the

      HYPPOCRATIC OATH
      and
      SOLDIER’S OATH

      • Katmoon

        And you have to wonder how PC this would be if this was a freckled face red head, from TN who committed the attack and murders. I already know. I can hear the redneck remarks now.

        However, that young man described above was killed by his fellow brother in arms.

        MOUNTAIN CITY, Tenn. — One of the soldiers killed during Thursday’s shooting spree at Fort Hood, Texas, was a Tennessee man — 29-year-old Army Spc. Frederick Greene.

        Greene, of Mountain City, Tenn., was among 13 people killed when an Army psychiatrist allegedly opened fire on fellow soldiers at the Army post last week.

        Greene’s family released a statement Sunday calling him a loving son, husband and father who often acted as the family’s protector.

        “Even before joining the Army, he exemplified the Army values of loyalty, duty, respect, selfless service, honor, integrity and personal courage,” the family said.

  • Citizen70

    Look, all resistance and freedom fighters might participate in terrorism. I don’t condone it at all but the larger issue to me is fighting against anyone who declares war on my rights as a female, and this is what radical Islam is about. As far as I can see, Israel doesn’t restrict women’s freedoms. So, yes, it is a war and I know whose side I’m on.

    • hc123

      Me too. I say no to Sharia. It is antithetical to freedom and liberty.

      The bombing of the King David was a terrible act of terrorism, murder, mayhem or whatever you wish to call it to get you through the day.

      Major Nidal’s attack was the same, it differed in execution and planning. Not in spirit.

      • Ferd Berfle

        I concur with both of you.

    • mountainaires

      Israel does restrict women’s rights to freedom.

      Women have to get permission by the Rabbi in Israel to divorce their husbands; there is no civil marriage in Israel.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_views_of_marriage

      • Katmoon

        The Israeli High Court of Justice has carved out several exceptions to this rule obligating the rabbinic courts to follow general civil law in connection with the division of marital property (absent agreement of all parties to apply religious law) and to give proper weight to principles of basic human rights as defined and established in Israels Basic Laws.

        Rabbinic courts have the authority to force compliance with its orders, including those requiring husbands to grant a Jewish divorce, with tools ranging from revocation of a drivers licenses to prison terms for recalcitrant parties.

        Source:http://www.international-divorce.com/d-israel.htm

        • mountainaires

          Thanks, Katmoon, but it doesn’t change the fact that there is no civil marriage in Israel, and women must get Rabbinical permission to divorce their husbands. There is a movement to pass a bill granting civil marriage, but until that passes, the Rabbi determines who marries and who divorces.

          • TeakWoodKite

            It has been this way for centuries. And only in tha last 100 years or so in this country did a woman have this avenue.

            Doesn’t mean it right, it most certianly isn’t. But do you see members of the Jewish counity doing honor killings or running over a family member because they were not “Jewish enough”?

            We measure progress by degree. Allah has a very long way to go and was 600 hundred years to late.
            Screw Sharia Law and all who practice it. That is not the popular PC view, but frankly I could give two *()#. Women are not chattel or property.

            • Katmoon

              Thank you. Having been Catholic we had our own battle for divorce as well; excommunication from the church stopped involving death centuries ago. When the faith stopped serving women, women left the church. The divorce laws, in terms of the Pope got a bit looser.

              • Peggy Sue

                Yes, Katmoon. The Catholic Church has a way to go to enter the 21st Century. Divorce is still a thorny issue. As is the inclusion of women into the priesthood, the marriage issue and, of course, contraception and a woman’s right to choose her own biological destiny.

                That’s not to say that the Catholic Church or any other Christian denomination hasn’t had its time in barabaric custom.

                But to my knowledge, we are no longer stoning women, burning at the stake or condoning “honor killings” because women do not conform to the “faith’s” rigid doctrine.

                And frankly, there is no room for this mindset in the 21st Century. And particularly in the West.

                We can argue until we’re blue in the face about who is right or wrong. But I think there are few people in the West who would agree to the barbaric and hideous treatment of women under fundamentalist Muslim practices.

                Sorry. But I have no wish to return to the 7th Century or the 14th Century. We are of this century.

                And if you cannot get with the program? That’s too damn bad!

            • mountainaires

              Katmoon, and Teak:

              Thanks for your comments, and in many ways, I do agree with what you’ve said. I appreciate the tone and content.

              Honor killings in Israel? No, I don’t think so. But I believe they also occur in India.

              I’m just pointing out that Israel isn’t vying for sainthood when it comes to its treatment of women. To be sure, the US hasn’t achieved its own sainthood, and I’d sure rather live here than in Saudi Arabia.

              Israel is a westernized nation, yet an American woman–a tourist–visiting Israel was attacked on a bus by an Orthodox Jewish man for not acquiescing to his religious code of women sitting in the back of the bus. Religious zealotry is not just a Muslim thing.

              Sharia is not practiced by all Muslims, and many Palestinians are Christian. Even Hamas elected a woman and a Christian.

              [After the January 2006 legislative elections, the 24-member Palestinian Authority cabinet was made up by a Hamas' member majority, including one woman and one Christian.]

              I’m certainly not arguing in favor of Sharia; I just despise intellectual dishonesty and racism, stereotyping and hypocrisy when it comes to Arabs and Israelis. And, I will continue to condemn anyone who spews the epithet “anti-semite” at someone who points out a fact about Israel they don’t want to hear. It’s the most offensive and odious slander imaginable, and it’s just plain ignorant. Anyone who does it deserves to be hung on their own petard.

              • TeakWoodKite

                mountainaires, Since the bible is illegal in Saudi Arabia, that says volumes. As sure as I object to the madrases in Falls Church VA and elsewhere funded by the Saudis, to a person inside Islam, it’s conceivable to have a different point of view, (in which I am dead.)

                I responded to creeper up thread, which was spammed, as it occurred to me on the way home from work that the irony about The King David Hotel was it was targeting a British target, not a Muslim one, which is not taught in public schools in the US.
                (fingers crossed this posts :)
                As I can not see Sharia law in Texas, a Muslim may not like seeing Western jurisprudence being forced on the Iraqis. In spite of the tyranny of Saddam.

                The youth of Iran certainly appear not to favor getting Jack booted the Mullahs. The Pakistanis don’t like the Taliban but nor do they condone the US drone strikes on their soil with the tacit approval of their government.The Afghans? See what sharia law did for the women in that country, lord forbid you practice Christianity there as well.

                Sure as Plymouth Rock exists to remind Protestants of why they came here, to worship in peace, I would understand. There can only be one set of laws as their can only be one chain of command and one oath of loyalty given. Laws are there to guide a free people not enslave them.
                History is to learned from and as painful as it might be to ones predilictions, not be revised to suit ones current agenda.
                LJ did a great job of getting the part started.

              • Tammy

                You love Sharia, you liar.
                You post nothing but Jew hatred. And YOU are the ignorant one here, not me or others who defy you.

                The “palestinians” have a country. They just don’t want to civilize it and make it official.
                They are actually Jordanians, but even the Jordanians don’t want them.

                “Palestinians” have to create their OWN civilized society, but since they aren’t civilized and just re-instated crucifixion, they aren’t moving in the right direction.

                According to your blather and hatred the Jews are the reason for all of the world’s woes. Blah blah blah.
                You are sickening, and should join a neo-nazi group if you want to be taken seriously.
                I may not be taken seriously by some of the posters here, but I will fight against a Jew hater like YOU.

                • TeakWoodKite

                  Tammy BLAH BLAH BLAH.

                  Your problem as Onfre’s Arm gently and I thought very sincerly pointed out your mouth is getting ahead of your brain.

                  Sad.

      • Tammy

        Jew hater

        • Peggy Sue

          That’s just like the “racist” title that we all enjoyed last year.

          Way to go, Tammy, You’re part of the “in crowd.”

          • Tammy

            So are you, Peggy Sue: Dhimmi.
            Ignorant of facts, but great on idiotic replies.

    • NomNomNom

      “Israel doesn’t restrict women’s freedoms.”

      you are aware that in a synagogue a woman gets to sit behind a screen and is prohibited from chanting scripture?
      maybe they’d have a little problem getting into it at that:
      “Blessed are you, Hashem, King of the Universe, for not having made me a Gentile.”
      “Blessed are you, Hashem, King of the Universe, for not having made me a slave.”
      Blessed are you, Hashem, King of the Universe, for not having made me a woman.”

      http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/apr/08/israel-feminism women cabinet member photoshopped from orthodox papers replaced by males
      http://haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=801449&contrassID=19 woman accosted by modesty patrol told to sit at the back of the bus, beaten when refused

      an excellent feminist jewish websit, site has many more on blogroll: http://blog.elanasztokman.com/

      • mountainaires

        Nomnomnom, thanks so much for those links. I checked out the feminist jewish website and it perfectly illustrates the situation. It’s a great website. Here’s one example:

        Nine Years Waiting for Freedom:

        “Rachel” an ultra-Orthodox mother of 12 living in Jerusalem, got divorced this week. It’s cause for celebration for two reasons. First, this grants her much-needed freedom from her severely violent and erratic now-ex-husband, a man who viciously controlled, manipulated and abused her and her children during the marriage and separation. But the real jubilation is because the divorce process – receiving her get – took nine years. Nine years! That’s a marathon that deserves acknowledgment. Unfortunately, Rachel is not alone. Thousands of agunot and mesoravot get (women denied divorce) are stuck in limbo – sometimes for years or even decades – neither married nor divorced, waiting for the rabbinical court to come to their aid.

  • Neo

    Maybe if Janet Napolitano hadn’t been spending so much time scrutinizing “tea-bag people” she could have connected the dots on the worst domestic terrorism since 9/11.

    • Citizen70

      Great point!!

    • creeper

      *ding* *ding* *ding*

      Give that poster a cheroot. If what’s beginning to come out (Hassan’s connections to Islamist jihadists) is in any part true, it amounts to nothing less than dereliction of duty.

      If you want to blame someone besides Hassan, blame the people who were aware of the threat he might pose and did nothing.

      Does anyone else wonder if assigning Hassan to Iraq may have been done deliberately to “teach him a lesson”? Common sense ought to tell you that sending a Muslim to fight a war against other Muslims is playing with fire.

      • TeakWoodKite

        creeper, then following that logic, anyone is of the Muslim faith should not be sent to fight a war that has other mulsims involved. Which is contrary to the Constitutional oath they swore.

        So are we to have people of the Jewish faith not serve in Muslim countries? Where does it end?

        The great land of Multi-culturalism, why does the distinction of cultural origin matter when the oath is to Constitution?
        It’s not that I disagree, just want to clarify what you meant.

        I actually would think that he would have been used as a honeytrap in Iraq. That is what I would have done.

        • creeper

          TWK, you read me right. I would submit to you that being a Muslim is incompatible with service in the US military. Islam is not a religion. It is a way of life and adherence to it renders any oath to a state invalid.

          You can’t have it both ways. The Koran makes it plain that your first (and only) allegiance must be to Islam. If anything drove Hassan over the edge it may have been his inability to reconcile two conflicting promises.

          So he made a choice.

          • TeakWoodKite

            That is my lowly understanding of the basic tenent of Islam.

            He wasn’t conflicted at all. He had enough to surface on the FBI’s rader 6 months ago. oops
            His class mates raisied objections to his expressions of Islam and denigration of his uniform. I would object to the Christian fundamentalist preaching that goes in the US military as well on similar grounds. It is documented as well.

            There is an interesting comparision to the internment of US citizens of Japanese desent during WWII.

            From “The Complete Idiots Guide to Jerusalem” by H Paul Jeffers.

            “British Raid on Jewish Agency”

            There were many “secret” documents noted Irgun leader Manachem Begin, “which a wisely run orginization in such circumstances would never have allowed to be there.” The “booty” which the British carried away, Begin recalled was “considerable”. The material “gave the lie” to emphatic denials that the Jewish Agency knew nothing about Irgun actions. Among the documents was an unfinished report of a speech by an Irgun leader to the Zionist Council in which he praised the blowing up of bridges and explained the political signifigance of such activities. In response to the raid, the Irgun began developing an “eye for an eye” plot in which the target was to be British Head quarters in the King David Hotel.

            .

            The people being blownup didn’t make any distinction about nationalism or Islam, I did earlier. My bad.

          • TeakWoodKite

            I responded creeper and got pick pocketed by the spam filter. He got a way with my wallet too.

            • creeper

              I see a comment from you above this, TWK. Hope that’s the one you were referring to.

              It’s depressing to see this discussion disintegrate to the level it has. When are we going to stop looking backward and start looking forward instead. Certainly I don’t advocate ignoring history. Santayana was right…those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

              What amazes me is that the bright people here who do remember the past don’t seem to be learning anything from it. It’s as though we’re standing beside a nice pile of bricks, out of which we could build a really good house, but we’re throwing them at each other instead.

              • TeakWoodKite

                True that. Thanks.

  • hc123

    Of course the extremist mindset is not unique to Islam. However, those who look to Islam for help in difficult times should not be surprised if they find little peace.

    Islam as not a religion that fosters love and tolerance. Quite the contrary. Much like “old testament” loving Jews and Christians, Islam is a fire and brimstone faith with a ton of rules and regulations governing almost every aspect of life.

    A person looking to Islam for answers is likely to find anti-western sentiment, anger and mysogyny. In the west it will be couched in the veil of cultural relativism to make it more palatable. But it will still be there.

    • Pam in Houston

      Does hc123 stand for HILLARY CLINTON? This sounds just like her.

      • hc123

        I am much less politically correct than is HRC.

  • Ferd Berfle

    We can go back through history to trace the lineage of Middle Eastern violence but ultimately that wouldn’t be the point. The point is that a man who swore an oath to medicine and to the Constitution apparently decided his own system of belief was superior to that which he had duly sworn an oath to and killed many innocent people because of it. This is extremism, no matter how one might rationalize, excuse, talk around, or ignore it. Whether he did it alone or with the help of others does not change this as he is accountable for his actions. As to whether other religions do it, have done it, will do it is irrelevant to this particular incident and represents nothing more than a diversion, as well. I won’t indict a religion but I will indict extremism, no matter where it rear its ugly, savage head.

    • Peggy Sue

      Ferd said:

      “he is accountable for his actions.”

      What a concept!

      Yes, he is accountable as we all are accountable for our individual and personal actions. Hasan made a choice to pick up those guns, walk into a reception area and open fire on a group of unarmed men and women.

      His choice. No one forced him. No one put a gun to his head. Was he deranged, under stress, pulled by alligience to faith and/or country?

      It doesn’t matter. The choice was his. The carnage is his. And the end result will be his and his alone.

      A murderer is only one thing . . . a murderer.

      There is no excuse for what the man did. And whatever he gets? He absolutely deserves.

  • Pam in Houston

    I don’t see what the corrolation is? A fictional 1960′s movie about Israel’s fight for their right to exist with non-fictional event of an acutal murder of Americans on US soil by a Muslim extremist in our Armed Forces, supported by our tax payer dollars, to disrespect and kill our US soldiers, that is tied to a religious belief!!

    Come up with a better post than this hog wash, Larry.

    America be aware. Be very aware.

    FROM LARRY JOHNSON:

    PAM, IT IS “CORRELATION” NOT “CORROLATION.” IF IT IS SUCH HOGWASH THAN DON’T WASTE YOUR TIME COMMENTING AND GO ELSEWHERE. NO ONE IS FORCING YOU TO VISIT THIS BLOG. BTW, THE EVENTS PORTRAYED IN EXODUS WERE NOT REPEAT NOT FICTIONAL. BOMBING OF THE KING DAVID HOTEL BY IRGUN WAS QUITE REAL (AND DEADLY).

    • http://noquarter foxyladi14

      spot on.

    • hc123

      Yep.

  • http://N/A breeze

    Officials:
    U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda
    Army Major in Fort Hood Massacre Used ‘Electronic Means’ to Connect with Terrorists

    By RICHARD ESPOSITO,
    MATTHEW COLE and
    BRIAN ROSS
    ABC NEWS
    Nov. 9, 2009

    U.S. intelligence agencies were aware months ago that Army Major Nidal Malik Hasan was attempting to make contact with people associated with al Qaeda, two American officials briefed on classified material in the case told ABC News.

    Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan tried to make contact with people linked to al Qaeda.It is not known whether the intelligence agencies informed the Army that one of its officers was seeking to connect with suspected al Qaeda figures, the officials said.

    Rep. Peter Hoekstra (R-MI), the ranking Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, said that he requested the CIA and other intelligence agencies brief the committee on what was known, if anything, about Hasan by the U.S. intelligence community, only to be refused.

    In response, Hoekstra issued a document preservation request to four intelligence agencies. The letter, dated November 7th, was sent to directors Dennis Blair (DNI), Robert Mueller (FBI), Lt. Gen Keith Alexander (NSA) and Leon Panetta (CIA).

    Hoekstra said he is “absolutely furious” that the house intel committee has been refused an intelligence briefing by the DNI or CIA on Hasan’s attempt to reach out to al Qaeda, as first reported by ABC News.

    “This is a law enforcement investigation, in which other agencies—not the CIA—have the lead,” CIA spokesman Paul Gimigliano said in a response to ABC News. ” Any suggestion that the CIA refused to brief Congress is incorrect.”

    • TeakWoodKite

      This guy was on the FBI’s radar. So it would be of interest to know what the CIA was briefed on from the FBI. As it was a failure of military command that let this pig run free, there will much CYA’s going on.

  • Doc99
    • mountainaires

      What is the most lethal of all is that people actually go to Pajamas Media to be propagandized into numb-nuts….

  • http://www.thecjpoliticalreport.com Halli Casser-Jayne

    Try again, Larry. Apparently, that old brain of yours has forgotten other potent parts of the movie (and it is a movie based on a work of fiction). For instance, the behavior of the Arabs who went on to hang and maim one of their own for wanting to have peace with his Jewish ‘brother.’ Or how about the role of the Brits in refusing to let the nomad Jews find a place to live after they’d been freed from the Nazi death camps and had no place to go. Or the role of the Mufti in terrorizing the Jews and refusing to follow a path to peace but whose focus was to insight the Arabs. Ari, the Paul Newman character, had misgivings of his uncle’s participation in the Irgun, as did his father played by Lee J. Cobb. That’s the movie.

    In real life were the Jews terrorists?

    The Jews were not out to terrorize the Arabs. They were out to defend themselves. They offered to share a homeland with the people who now call themselves Palestinians, to live in peace with them, and were rebuffed even as they are today. They weren’t new to the land, but the influx was, and the Arabs didn’t want Hitler’s survivors there.

    Plus, they had no place else to go. Our lovely America didn’t want Hitler’s refugees anymore than the Arabs or the Brits did.

    There’s a big difference between a nascent army and a terrorist organization. You might want to look up the word ‘terror.’

    Jeez, Larry, I’m disappointed! Your comments wreak of anti-Semitism! They have no comparative rationale to the story of Major Hassam, whose ultimate definition is yet to be determined because we still are waiting for the FACTS.

    Halli Casser-Jayne
    Author, A Year in My Pajamas With President Obama, The Politics of Strange Bedfellows, http://www.thecjpoliticalreport.com

    • mountainaires

      Washington Report, May/June 2006, pages 14-15

      Hamas: A Pale Image of the Jewish Irgun And Lehi Gangs
      By Donald Neff

      http://www.wrmea.com/archives/May-June_2006/0605014.html

      A photograph dated 1947 shows a poster issued by British police forces seeking 18 wanted Jewish terrorists from the Irgun Zvai Leumi and Stern Gang. Pictured at top left is Irgun commander and future Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin (AFP Photo).

      AS EASY as it is to dismiss clichés as banal and misleading, the troubling problem is that they often cloak an essential truth. Scoffs and derision often greet the cliché that “one man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.” Yet freedom fighters is exactly how Israelis view the early Zionists who fought in 1947 for the establishment of Israel—and how Palestinians now consider their fighters resisting Israeli occupation.

      [...]

      Sixty years ago, however, at the time of the British Mandate, it was Jews in Palestine who mainly waged terrorism against the Palestinians. As Jewish leader David Ben-Gurion recorded in his personal history of Israel: “From 1946 to 1947 there were scarcely any Arab attacks on the Yishuv [the Jewish community in Palestine].”

      The same could not be said for the Zionists. Jewish terrorists waged an intense and bloody campaign against the Palestinians, British, and even some Jews who opposed them leading up to the establishment of Israel.

      The two major Jewish terror organizations in pre-independence Palestine were the Irgun Zvai Leumi—National Military Organization, NMO, also known by the Hebrew letters Etzel—founded in 1937, and the Lohamei Herut Israel, Fighters for the Freedom of Israel, Lehi in the Hebrew acronym, also known as the Stern Gang after its leader Avraham Stern, known as Yair, founded in 1940.

      The Irgun was led by Menachem Begin, the future Israeli prime minister who was a leading proponent of Revisionist Zionism, the militant branch of Zionism pioneered by Vladimir Zeev Jabotinsky, which openly despised the Arabs and sought restoration of what it called Eretz Yisrael, the ancient land of Israel. By this was meant “both sides of the Jordan,” the Irgun slogan meaning all of Palestine and Jordan was the rightful home of the Jews.

      ]…]

      The Irgun was the dominant Jewish terrorist organization, both in size and the number and frequency of its attacks. Its most spectacular feat up to this time had been the July 22, 1946 blowing up of the King David Hotel in Jerusalem, with the killing of 91 people—41 Arabs, 28 British and 17 Jews. Mainstream Zionists despised Begin and his Revisionists, although there was cooperation between the two on military matters. Ben-Gurion, the leader of mainstream Zionism, fought throughout his premiership with Begin.

      The other major Jewish terrorist group, Lehi, was more extremist than the Irgun, claiming all the land between the Nile and the Euphrates as belonging to the Jews. When Jabotinsky declared a cease-fire in the fight against Britain and its mandate troops in Palestine during World War II, Stern broke with him and founded Lehi. Stern sought alliance with the Nazis, both because they shared an enemy in Britain and because Lehi shared Hitler’s totalitarian ideology. During the war Sternists openly celebrated Nazi victories on the battlefield.

      Read full article:

      Donald Neff is the author of the Warriors trilogy, Fallen Pillars: U.S. Policy towards Palestine and Israel, and Fifty Years of Israel, all available from the AET Book Club.

      SIDEBAR

      1947: A Year of Terror
      Jan. 12—Four killed by Irgun terrorist bombing of British headquarters.
      Jan. 13—Arab kidnapped and castrated by Jewish terrorists.
      March 1—Sixteen Britons killed by Jewish terrorists/Britain invokes martial law
      March 10—Jewish informer killed by Jewish terrorists.
      March 11—Two British soldiers killed by Jewish terrorists.
      April 8—British constable killed by Jewish terrorists.
      April 8—Jewish boy killed by British troops.
      April 8—Jew beaten to death by Arabs.
      April 22—Eight killed in Jewish terrorist bombing of the Cairo-Haifa train.
      April 25—Five killed in Jewish terrorist bombing of British camp.
      April 26—British police official killed by Jewish terrorist.
      May 8—Three Jewish shops in Tel Aviv whose owners refused to contribute to Jewish terrorist groups burned down by Jewish terrorists.
      May 8—Jew killed near Tel Aviv by Arab terrorists.
      May 12—Two British policemen killed in Jewish Jerusalem.
      May 15—British policeman killed in terrorist ambush.
      May 15—Two British soldiers killed in terrorist Stern Gang attack.
      May 16—Two British police officers killed by terrorists.
      May 18—One Jew killed, one wounded by Arab terrorists.
      June 5—Jewish terrorists introduce letter bombs in Middle East.
      June 28—Four British soldiers killed in Jewish terrorist raids.
      July 3—“Anti-terrorist” Jewish families beaten up by Irgunists.
      July 18—British soldier killed by Jewish terrorists.
      July 19—Another British soldier killed by Jewish terrorists.
      July 20—Yet another British soldier killed by Jewish terrorists.
      July 23—65 Jews killed when Haganah sinks immigration ship.
      July 26—Two British soldiers killed in booby trap.
      July 29—Three Jews executed by hanging. Jewish terrorists retaliate by hanging two British soldiers.
      Aug. 5—Three British police killed by bomb; plot discovered to poison the water supply of non-Jewish parts of Jerusalem with botulism and other bacteria.
      Aug. 10—Four Jews killed in Arab terror attack on Tel Aviv café.
      Aug. 12—Five Jews, four Arabs killed, others injured, in spread of violent incidents over three days.
      Aug. 15—Twelve Palestinians killed in raid by Haganah troops.
      Aug. 18—Shops of five Jews in Tel Aviv destroyed by Jewish terrorists.
      Aug. 23—Five Arabs of one family—two men, a woman and two children—killed by Jewish terrorists.
      Sept. 7—French foil Stern Gang plot to air bomb London.
      Sept. 21—British messenger killed by Jewish terrorists.
      Sept. 26—Four British policemen killed in Irgun terrorist bank robbery.
      Sept. 27—Illegal Jewish immigrant killed by British.
      Sept. 29—13 killed, 53 wounded in Irgun terrorist attack on British police station.
      Oct. 4—Two Jews killed in ambush, two Arabs killed in retaliation.
      Oct. 13—Two British troops killed by Jewish terrorists in Jerusalem.
      Oct. 26—Jewish settlement policeman found killed near Gaza.
      Nov. 3—Jewish policeman killed, reportedly by Stern Gang after refusing to reveal secret police matters.
      Nov. 12—21 killed in British-Jewish clashes.
      Nov. 14—Jewish terrorists kill 4 Britons in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv
      Nov. 30—Violent riots erupt throughout Arab world following adoption of U.N. partition plan. In Palestine, seven Jews killed and eight wounded in the first day. All told, during the first week at least 159 persons were killed in the Middle East, 66 of them in Palestine.
      Dec. 2—Palestinians begin 3-day protest strike; 20 Jews, 15 Arabs killed. Five Arabs and seven Jews were killed the next day during a six-hour battle on the Tel Aviv-Jaffa border.
      Dec. 13—35 Palestinian civilians killed in Jewish terrorist attacks.
      Dec. 14—14 Jews killed by Arab Legion in retaliation.
      Dec. 18—Palmach (“assault companies”) kills 10 Arabs, including 5 children, in nighttime raid on northern Galilee village of Khissas. The following day Haganah troops blew up the home of the village elder of Qazaza in central Palestine, killing several inhabitants. Wrote The Times of London: “While the Jews are suffering mainly through sniping at their road convoys, the Arabs have lost many lives through Jewish assaults on their villages.”
      Dec. 20—Haganah raid on village of Qazaza kills one Palestinian.
      Dec. 24—Stern Gang member killed for betrayal of another member.
      Dec. 25—16 Arabs, Jews and British killed on Christmas.
      Dec. 25—Palestinian landowner killed for selling land to Jews.
      Dec. 26—Ben-Gurion proposes major offensive to reduce Arab population.
      Dec. 26—Jewish terrorists get $107,000 in heists of diamond plants.
      Dec. 29—14 Arabs killed by Irgun bomb in Jerusalem.
      Dec. 29—Irgun flogs British major and three sergeants.
      Dec. 30—41 Jews, 6 Arabs killed in riot sparked by Stern Gang.
      Dec. 31—Irgun claims to have killed 374 Arabs and British during year.—D.N.

      http://www.wrmea.com/archives/May-June_2006/0605014.html

  • hc123

    It seems to be legally required to mention Israel whenever a Muslim behaves badly.

    • Patience

      Yeah, I’ve noticed the same thing…

      I’m sick of people only regarding this country as a Land of Opportunity and not wanting to assimilate more. It’s a trend all over the world, actually. I’m not suggesting immigrants and their families should give up their religion or ethnicity. But we’ve gone too far in the other direction, tolerating hatred and customs that are against basic Western principles and culture.

      This shooter shouldn’t have been allowed to use the military while spouting anti-American hatred. He should’ve been booted and billed/sued for the cost of his education and salary when his true allegiance became known.

      Those responsible for tolerating and overlooking Hassan’s conduct need to lose their jobs over this tragedy.

  • Katmoon

    Done.

  • Alex

    http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=terrorist

    S: (n) terrorist (a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities)

    Yep, Hasan is a terrorist. Check your ego AT the door.

  • mountainaires

    Jewish Jihadists are not only in the past, like Irgun, Stern Gang, Haganah, Lehi and others. They have been committing terrorist acts in the past 2 decades:

    Kach is a hard-line Israeli militant group that advocates for the expulsion of Arabs from the biblical lands of Israel. The U.S. State Department listed it as a terrorist organization in 1994. Kach, as well as the splinter group Kahane Chai, condones violence as a viable method for establishing a religiously homogenous state. The group has not staged a large terrorist attack since 1994, although people affiliated with the groups have been arrested for “low-level attacks” since 2000, according to the State Department’s 2006 Country Report. In 2006 a U.S. Federal Court upheld that Kach was rightly listed as a terrorist organization in an appeal.

    What are Kach and Kahane Chai?

    Kach and Kahane Chai are two marginal, extremist Israeli groups that have used terrorism to pursue their goals of expanding Jewish rule across the West Bank and expelling the Palestinians. Both groups grew out of the anti-Arab teachings of Rabbi Meir Kahane, a U.S.-born extremist who founded and led Kach (its name means “thus” in Hebrew) until he was assassinated in New York in 1990. Israel outlawed Kach and its offshoot Kahane Chai (“Kahane Lives”) in 1994, a month after a Kach supporter shot and killed twenty-nine Muslim worshippers at a West Bank mosque. The leader of Kahane Chai, Meir Kahane’s son, Binyamin, was killed along with his wife by Palestinian militants in a drive-by shooting in the West Bank in December 2000.

    http://www.cfr.org/publication/9178/

    • Tammy

      Jews.
      Damn them.
      Kill them
      They are the bane of the world.

      I can’t believe that this site has become a haven for Jew haters but here they are!

      I’m not even Jewish. I love reading the spewing of the truth: JEWS are to blame for EVERYTHING.

      Hey, mountainmuslim, you and Hasan were probably roommates!
      At least you are honest in your hatred!

      • mountainaires

        Tammy:

        I’m not a Muslim. I’m not an anti-semite. I’m Irish/English and old enough to see a wing-nut bigot like you coming from a mile away. I’m a veteran, married to a veteran, the daughter of a veteran buried at Arlington, and I am from a military family who has served in damn near every war since the Civil War, including Iraq and Afghanistan. My brothers and sisters are also veterans, many of us are retired, some of us are Colonels, retired. At least one of us is female and served in Somalia during the Black Hawk Down incident. Another flew fighter jets in the Persian Gulf War, another flew fighter jets in Korea and Vietnam. I have lived all over the world including South Korea for two years just a few miles from the DMZ. I paid for my undergraduate and graduate degrees with the GI BILL.

        I have earned the right to speak out any time I please, and I intend to do so. I try to be honest at all times. I don’t have to apologize to you for my opinions or my clearly superior intellect.

        So, now, you introduce yourself, Tammy. No, let me guess, you sad, pathetic little twit. You are clearly an ignorant redneck with a drinking problem. My guess is, you got off your job at the IHOP, stopped and loaded up your truck with cheap beer and even cheaper cigarettes and decided to come down and enlighten us “Jooooo-haters” and “Mountain Muslims” with your downhome rants in between chugs of Bud slimy, fetid slugs on your cigarette.

        So nice to meet you.

        ;-)

        • NomNomNom

          :mad: I’m hoping you said “ignorant redneck” to qualify her from the intelligent, upstanding, quality-beer-drinking, nonsmoking rednecks. And yes, I do have a truck.

        • ces

          Happy early Veterans Day, to you and your family, mountainaires.

          Thanks for your service.

  • http://www.thecjpoliticalreport.com Halli Casser-Jayne

    Larry, first of all, I do not consider myself a “staunch pro-Israel supporter.” Nor am I a religious zealot. I consider myself a rational, bright, educated writer who reaches conclusion based on facts as I interpret them, as I’m sure you do, Larry.

    On the other hand, apparently, you don’t consider yourself an anti-Semite. How people see others is surely a measure of their interpretation and opinion.

    Further, I did not call you “crazy” and I resent your insinuating that I am because my point of view differs from yours. That kind of accusation gets us no where in our dialogue. It makes you sound like Rush Limbaugh or Glenn Beck, which you are not.

    Apples are apples, and oranges, oranges, Larry. Terrorists and victims of terrorism are not the same. While I don’t care for violence as a means to an end, not all violence is terrorism.

    No where in your piece do I see so much as an ounce of sympathy for the Jews. You seem to have much for Major Hassan, which shows an uneven hand and led me to my conclusion that you sound like an anti-Semite.

    Further, I believe I defended Major Hassan, and said that I am waiting to learn the truth of who this man is when the facts come out…unlike you, who seems to be so certain about his motives before you have the facts. I am happy to say that I haven’t had an aneurysm while I wait.

    But going back to the times that Exodus addressed in the film, there is much to dispute about the history of those days, which you point out by mentioning that new information and interpretation comes to the fore all the time. That is why we can all go back and read historical interpretations, or now read new information, or new interpretations as to what actually occurred as the years go on.

    Let me say, by the way, that one man’s terrorist is one man’s Prime Minister Begin.

    Halli Casser-Jayne

    • mountainaires

      Unfortunately, there is not much to “dispute” about the fact that Israel engaged in terrorism, Halli. Read Israeli historians like Avi Shlaim (The Iron Wall) and you’ll stop being so ignorant and offensive by calling people “anti-semite” when you don’t even know what it means.

      That goes for you, too Ferd.

      • Ferd Berfle

        You ought to actually read the history of the ME, stop believing all the garbage you read, and stop trying your damnedest to rewrite it. Yep, if this is Monday, it must be it’s-all-the-Jews-fault-all-the-time show. There’s more than enough blame to go around with the conflagration called the Middle East–it’s time you actually recognized such as it takes TWO to continue the fight. But you won’t and I’m not patient enough to wait for you to come to that epiphany.

        • mountainaires

          Oh Ferd, comron. You’re starting to bleat, to sputter in rage. It’s a sure sign you are inadequate when it comes to this issue. I have read many Israeli historians over the course of many, many years, I have a library on the history of the middle east and US involvement in the region. I read all sides, and don’t close my mind. Conversely, you would call this man an “anti-semite”:

          July/August 1995, pgs. 18, 119

          From the Hebrew Press

          Israel’s Discriminatory Practices Are Rooted in Jewish Religious Law

          By Dr. Israel Shahak

          (This is an abridged translation of an article by the author published in the Israeli newspaper Davar on March 15, 1995.)

          Israel Shahak, a Holocaust survivor and retired professor of chemistry at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, is chairman of the Israeli League of Human Civil Rights.

          http://www.wrmea.com/backissues/0795/9507018.htm

      • hokma

        Avi Shlaim does not believe in the right for Israel to exist as Jewish state.

        Try to understand that just because someone is Jewish does not mean they support Israel or even other Jews. There have always been Jews who have turned their back on their own people and supported anti-Israel and anti-Jewish causes.

        Your stance is well established.

        • mountainaires

          Shlaim is a zionist. So, your argument is ludicrous, Hokma.

          • hokma

            A Zionist believes in the right for Jews to have a Jewish state in Israel. Shlaim does not believe that.

            • mountainaires

              Don’t try to misrepresent Shlaim’s views, Hokma. Shlaim defines the “Zionism of Today” differently than what zionism was originally intended to be, or what he felt as a young nationalist. He rejects the virulent racism and hatred of the ultra-religious zealots and settlers, and right-wing Likudniks and former terrorists [like Ariel Sharon] will destroy Israel. And, I agree with Shlaim completely.

              Here is what Shlaim said in 2004:

              “One can fully accept Israel’s legitimacy within the pre-1967 borders while opposing its colonial project beyond the Green Line. That is my position”

              Here is what he said in 2005:

              “What I do know is that a lot of decent people, without any anti-Semitic baggage, are furious with Israel because of its oppression of the Palestinians. There is simply no getting away from the fact that attitudes toward Israel are changing as a result of its own shift towards the Zionism of the extreme right and of the radical rabbis. During the years of the Oslo peace process, Israel was in fact the favorite of the West because it was willing to withdraw from the occupied territories.

              Israel’s image today is negative not because it is a Jewish state but because it habitually transgresses the norms of acceptable international behavior. Indeed, Israel is increasingly perceived as a rogue state, as an international pariah, and as a threat to world peace.

              • hokma

                “Shlaim defines the “Zionism of Today” differently than what zionism was originally intended to be …”

                Thankyou. You just made my point.

                • mountainaires

                  Okay, if you insist. I’m not particularly interested in debating the merits of zionism. But Shlaim’s definition of zionism aside, he is certainly a credible source on Israeli history, as is Ilan Pappe, Amira Hass, Sara Roy and other Jews who dissent from Israeli policy, some of whom like Roy and Hass, have actually lived in the West Bank and Gaza for years doing reporting or medicine or research. If u’d read Shlaim’s book, The Iron Wall, youd know these dissenters are honest, courageous Jews who love Israel.

                  Clearly anyone who thinks Ariel Sharon or Bibi Netanyahu is good for Israel, has a twisted sense of what Israel was intended to be or what is good for Israeli’s future. They are pure hatred and evil. Anyone who thinks Shlaim and Pappe don’t love their country, doesn’t know the first thing about what it means to love their country.

      • Tammy

        No, YOU are the ignorant one, you Jew hater.

        Jews do not strap bombs on their babies, wives and their mentally challenged.

        Muslims do that.

        I am strident on this site, but I will not back down from the REAL hate that you spew.

        • mountainaires

          “strident?” No, just stupid. You haven’t the first clue about Palestinians, Arabs or Muslims. And, you’re a bigot because you are making broad sweeping generalizations about an entire culture and ethnic group based on propaganda poison you’ve been fed from some right-wing hate site. You’re a very sad little person, in my opinion, a person filled with hate for a people you know nothing about.

          Me? I love Israel and I love the Jewish people and I know for a fact that they will never be safe, and never be a shining light until and unless they end this horrific military occupation and the crimes against humanity they are currently committing against the Palestinian people.

          Hasan is a very sick man. He’s not a “jihadist.” He’s delusional, mentally ill, and the military failed to even notice. It’s a tragedy.

    • http://NoQuarterUSA.net Larry Johnson

      You can polish your delusions anyway you want, but when you write that I “wreak (sic) of anti-semitism” you have crossed a line. First of all the correct word is REEK. Apparently your skill at spelling and proper word usage is akin to your grasp of history.

      Second, I consider you crazy because you accuse me of being an anti-semite for the simple act of reporting historical facts about Israel’s creation that always get excused away by folks with your limitations.

      • Unabashed Galt

        It is true the founders of Israel engaged in terrorism, as did the founders of the United States and many other nations. I don’t have a problem with being honest and accurate. I do not find your honesty to be anti-Semitic, Larry.

        I think if we honestly look historically at all struggles for freedom, most have a pretty heavy element of terrorism.

        Rather than hide from this truth, I hope humanity can learn from history and seek alternatives not involving terrorism to address their grievances.

        You can’t hope to fix something unless you begin with honesty! :)

        I have a disdain for double standards — which I think is your main point, Larry.

      • http://www.thecjpoliticalreport.com Halli Casser-Jayne

        Oy vey, Larry. How old are you? You sound like a two year old. Sticks and stones may break my bones but names will … blah, blah, blah!

        Further, you have absolutely zero sense of humor, and apparently a limited vocabulary, thus you missed the play on words, reek/wreak. Look it up.

        I may be crazy, but you are an anti-Semite, which, by the way is spelled anti-Semite.

        • Tammy

          I agree.
          And Israel was not created in 1947, Larry.

          Read a history book.
          Israel has been around for something like, oh, 2000 years.
          But then again, I’m not a Jew, I just read books.

          Palestine? It’s a made-up term by State Department idiots and guys who love Arafat.

          Damn, it’s amazing how fast you CIA types suck up to the propaganda that is spewed out by the State Department.

  • shadow

    The U.K. Telegraph reported yesterday:

    “Major Nidal Malik Hasan, the gunman who killed 13 at America’s Fort Hood military base, once gave a lecture to other doctors in which he said non-believers should be beheaded and have boiling oil poured down their throats.

    He also told colleagues at America’s top military hospital that non-Muslims were infidels condemned to hell who should be set on fire. The outburst came during an hour-long talk Hasan, an Army psychiatrist, gave on the Koran in front of dozens of other doctors at Walter Reed Army Medical Centre in Washington DC, where he worked for six years before arriving at Fort Hood in July.

    Colleagues had expected a discussion on a medical issue but were instead given an extremist interpretation of the Koran, which Hasan appeared to believe.

    It was the latest in a series of “red flags” about his state of mind that have emerged since the massacre at Fort Hood, America’s largest military installation, on Thursday.”

    Sounds like a terrorist to me.

  • http://deleted BuzzisbackLatte

    Will Hasan be the poster boy for the end of political correctness in the military?

    Red flags popping up everywhere and yet, no one dared to do anything…

    • Ferd Berfle

      We can only hope. But I’m sure the government will finagle a way to curtail a few more of our rights while they’re at it. This is really maddening.

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      Yes, Buzz. It sounds to me that in true bureaucratic style, the people at Walter Reed, aware of how much had been invested in Hasan, either didn’t know what to do with him or didn’t want to deal with him and resolved their problem by kicking him upstairs…let the guys at Ft. Hood decide what to do with Looney Tunes. Whatever their issue, they should all be brought up on charges. Hasan is a terrorist and I never have had any doubts whatsoever.

    • ziggy

      I’m not at all sure about the “political correctness” spin that’s being applied to the Fort Hood story all of a sudden.

      It’s politically convenient. It changes the discussion. It gets traction for using Fort Hood as a way to score points.

      In the process, it distracts from what’s beginning to look like some sort of systemic failure in our military to respond in an appropriate manner to obvious warnings signs about Major Hassan.

      No one with their head screwed on straight would ignore clear danger signs in deference to “political correctness”. We can’t let attention be diverted onto anything so vague as that.

      Something much more specific went wrong here. It’s essential to know exactly what.

      • Alex

        I agree. The most dim-witted person would know attempts to contact al-qaeda would be a VERY BAD THING!

        So, first we elect a Muslim president, who doesn’t even want to TALK about the Ft. Hood incident, so he yammers on about a meeting for two full minutes first. (And don’t EVEN try to say Barry “My Muslim Religion” Obama is not a Muslim.)

        Then our “intelligence” looks the other way while a nutcase ON AN ARMY BASE, IN A POSITION OF POWER, publicly says things that a normal person would find extremely inflammatory/dangerous/alarming?

        Then, a supposedly trustworthy ex-CIA agent says, “Aw, it’s nuthin’”?

        And I thought LAST year was Bizarro World!

  • Portia Elizabeth

    Well I’m glad I came back in time to catch the lecture on Israel.

    I followed that link Larry posted above about the bombing at the King David Hotel. I’m conflicted on why it’s so shocking. The account in the link says the hotel was contacted and forewarned multiple times prior to the bomb being exploded. In addition the French Embassy across the street was contacted and it took defensive action. The bombers made the calls to give the hotel time (~ half an hour), to evacuate the building. According to the link the target was the records stored within the building, which held military offices and was not just a hotel.

    Soooo, …while I don’t approve of what was done, I think people at the WTC would’ve appreciated 3 warnings to evacuate. I’m pretty sure those Ft. Hood soldiers would’ve, too.

    • Unabashed Galt

      The account in the link says the hotel was contacted and forewarned multiple times prior to the bomb being exploded.

      Exploding a bomb with warning is not terrorism? I think it still is. Its a threatening act designed to instill fear into people. And someone could still get hurt or even killed in the process by accident. I think it could be considered moral relativism if we start slicing things into terrorism versus terrorism-light?

      • Portia Elizabeth

        Galt — at no time did I say the hotel bombing was not terrorism. I think it was. But I was pointing out that, bad as it was, the Israelis responsible tried to minimize human loss of life by calling the hotel switchboard at least three times before the bomb was detonated so that there could be evacuation.

        If I could have one wish, it would be that those in the Middle East could peacefully coexist. I’m a big enough dreamer to think it could happen some day.

        • Unabashed Galt

          Galt — at no time did I say the hotel bombing was not terrorism.

          That’s why I phrased my retort as a question. :)

          Exploding a bomb with warning is not terrorism?

          Thanks for the clarification.

          If I could have one wish, it would be that those in the Middle East could peacefully coexist. I’m a big enough dreamer to think it could happen some day.

          I share a similar wish, albeit on a grander scale: that humanity could not only peacefully coexist but do wonderous things together. :)

          • Portia Elizabeth

            Galt — I appreciate your civility. As I mentioned above, I don’t have a vested interest either way, but I do think there are fundamental differences between the path the Israeli fighters chose in 1946 and the path of Islamic jihadists today. I made my comments in part because I was surprised to read the details of the King David bombing since they were included in the link Larry chose to argue his point.

            As for your hopes for humanity, I concur, but I doubt I’ll see it in this lifetime. Perhaps in the next…

        • Unabashed Galt

          “Galt — at no time did I say the hotel bombing was not terrorism.”

          Portia Elizabeth, I was not sure exactly about that, which is why I framed my reply as a question:

          “Exploding a bomb with warning is not terrorism?”

          Thanks for the clarification. :)

          • Unabashed Galt

            Sorry for the double post. :(

        • mountainaires

          The IRA [Irish Republican Army] called the Brits to warn them, too. It’s very thoughtful of them, don’t you think? You can’t be a terrorist if you call first!

          I’m just snarkin’…:-)

    • TexasMirth

      Thanks, Portia, for posting that. I didn’t know the hotel was forewarned multiple times that there was a bomb. That information draws a big distinction between the King David Hotel bombing and the Fort Hood shootings. Multiple warnings of an impending attack gives your targets time to find safety. What happened here with Hasan was without mercy or warning. Hasan’s final statement to his neighbor: “I am going to do something good for God…” doesn’t exactly qualify as a warning. (although in retrospect, it does have a ‘terrorist’ ring to it.)

      • TexasMirth

        Galt- After reading your post, I couldn’t help but think of the OKC bombing and those children in that nursery who might still be here had there been a phone call or warning that there was a bomb. There is a difference.

        • Unabashed Galt

          Obviously. But setting off a bomb even with warning for political purposes is terrorism. Moral relativism is a slippery slope I do not wish to foster.

      • Unabashed Galt

        Multiple warnings of an impending attack gives your targets time to find safety.

        The unintended consequences problem: what happens if someone fails to get one of the warnings or the bombers mis-set the timer and it goes off early?

        • TexasMirth

          What if…What if…
          Galt, a warning might not mean much to you. But for me and my house…we would prefer a warning should we ever have the misfortune to be near a bomb or a terrorist with a gun.

          • Unabashed Galt

            I fail to see why you assume the warnings hold no meaning for me. Of course they do.

        • mountainaires

          Sure, that’s what happened in Omagh in Ireland about 10 years ago. The old “unintended consequences” problem. Only in that case the location of the bomb was mistaken, so people rushed in the direction of the bomb. Very sad and tragic.

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omagh_bombing

  • creeper

    At the risk of being flamed may I point out that Jews have a long way to go before they balance the scale.

    • Unabashed Galt

      I won’t flame you or anyone else for stating an opinion. This is how we learn from each other.

      That being said, I am confused as to what you mean by “balance the scale” ?

      • creeper

        Thanks for asking, Unabashed Galt. My comment was a reference to the six million. It was prompted by Larry’s resurrection of an ancient movie in support of his argument that Jews are terrorists. If we’re going to go back fifty years, why not seventy? Maybe we should go all the way back to Masada. No, wait. Why stop there? Let’s dredge up Moses and Ramses.

        My point was that at some stage you have to stop digging at the scabs and deal with what is reality today. And what is reality today is that one man slaughtered twelve innocents while screaming the name of his god. That makes him a terrorist in my book and any reference to the terrorism of other groups is exactly the same as excusing his atrocities because someone else did it first. That’s the argument of a three-year-old.

        We don’t tolerate Obama supporters excusing his excesses by citing Bush’s. Why then are we engaging in all this navel-gazing about the excesses of Muslims?

        • Unabashed Galt

          creeper, I don’t read Larry’s actions (this thread) as you do. And thanks for elaborating.

          I think his point was some in the far-right going ape shit and being hypocritical, to boot.

        • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

          Excellent, creeper. I couldn’t agree more.

  • Unabashed Galt

    Larry, so is this how the meshuga world works to some people?:

    Israel founders wanting a homeland: freedom-fighters (good terrorists).

    Palestinians wanting a homeland: bad terrorists.

    This reminds me of Obama demanding a new election in Afghanistan due to alleged voter fraud, when he was “elected” via voter fraud.

    By the way I don’t take sides on this Israel/Palestinian conundrum, but do wish both sides could find an answer!

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      I like your analogy, Galt.

      • Unabashed Galt

        Thanks AnnieCarmel. I’ve come to the conclusion being brutally honest is the precursor to finding solutions and not repeating the mistakes of the past, ad nauseam…

        Until folks start being honest to themselves discarding preconceived notions when evidence proves appropriate, and honest to others in debate I don’t see a just and sustainable world in our future. I should mention not all mistruths are dishonesty: people from their upbringing and circumstances get misprogrammed and unwittingly repeat things as “truth.”

  • http://N/A breeze

    Sometimes, an extremist really is an extremist

    If we act as if ‘Islam is the problem,’ we will guarantee that Islam will become the problem.

    By Jonah Goldberg
    LA Times
    November 10, 2009

    Army Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan demonstrated many things when he allegedly committed treason in the war on terror. For starters, he showed — gratuitously alas — that evil is still thriving.

    He demonstrated that being a trained psychiatrist provides no immunity to ancient hatreds and religious fanaticism, nor does psychiatric training provide much acuity in spotting such things in others. For example, the London Telegraph reports that, in what was supposed to be a medical lecture, Hassan instead gave an hourlong briefing on the Koran, explaining to colleagues at Walter Reed Army Medical Center that nonbelievers should be beheaded, have boiling oil poured down their throats and set on fire.

    His fellow psychiatrists completely missed this “red flag” — a suddenly popular euphemism for incandescently obvious evidence this man had no place in the U.S. Army.

    He proved how lacking our domestic security system is. According to ABC News, intelligence agencies were aware for months that Hasan had tried to contact Al Qaeda. His colleagues reportedly knew he sympathized with suicide bombings and attacks on U.S. troops abroad, and one colleague said Hasan was pleased by an attack on an Army recruiting office and suggested more of the same might be desirable. That’s treason, even if you’re a Muslim.

    Which raises the most troubling revelation: For a very large number of people, the idea that he is a Muslim fanatic, motivated by other Muslim fanatics, was — at least initially — too terrible to contemplate. How else to explain the reflexive insistence after the attack that the real culprit was “post-traumatic stress disorder”? The fact that PTSD is usually diagnosed in people who’ve been through trauma (hence the word “post”), and that Hasan had never in fact seen combat, didn’t seem to matter much.

  • http://N/A breeze

    continued…..

    Apparently the “P” in PTSD can now stand for “pre.”

    A few months ago, an anti-Semitic old nut named James von Brunn allegedly took a gun to the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum to get payback against “the Jews” and killed a black security guard in the process.

    In response to this horrific crime, the leading lights of American liberalism knew who was to blame: Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh and the GOP. One writer for the Huffington Post put it succinctly: “Thank you very much Karl Rove and your minions.”

    The fact that Von Brunn was a 9/11 “truther” who railed against capitalism, neocons and the Bush administration didn’t matter. Nor did the glaring lack of evidence that Rove

    et al ever showed antipathy for the museum. It was simply obvious that Von Brunn was the offspring of the “right-wing extremism [that] is being systematically fed by the conservative media and political establishment,” wrote columnist Paul Krugman.

    If only Hasan was a fan of Glenn Beck!

    President Obama was right when he said, in the early hours after the shooting, that people shouldn’t “jump to conclusions” (a lesson he might have learned when he jumped to the wrong conclusion about a white cop who arrested Henry Louis Gates, a black Harvard professor). But just as we should not jump to conclusions, we shouldn’t jump away from them.

    Despite reports that Hasan had shouted “Allahu Akbar” as he opened fire, MSNBC’s Chris Matthews insisted that “we may never know if religion was a factor at Ft. Hood.” Thursday night, NBC and CBS refrained from even reporting the man’s name. Meanwhile, ABC’s Martha Raddatz’s reporting on the subject reflected a yearning for denial: “As for the suspect, Nadal Hasan, as one officer’s wife told me, ‘I wish his name was Smith.’ “

  • http://N/A breeze

    continued…

    We have a real problem when much of the political and journalistic establishment is eager to jump to the conclusion that peaceful political opponents are in league with violent extremists, but is terrified to consider the possibility that violent extremists really are violent extremists if doing so means calling attention to the fact that they are Muslims.

    I am more sympathetic toward this reluctance to state the truth of the matter than some of my colleagues on the right. There is a powerful case to be made that Islamic extremism is not some fringe phenomena but part of the mainstream of Islamic life around the world. And yet, to work from that assumption might make the assumption all the more self-fulfilling. If we act as if “Islam is the problem,” as some say, we will guarantee that Islam will become the problem. But outright denial, like we are seeing today, is surely not the beginning of wisdom either.

    I have no remedy for the challenge we face. But I do take some solace in George Orwell’s observation that “to see what is in front of one’s nose needs a constant struggle.”

    jgoldberg@latimescolumnists.com

    • hokma

      Excellent column!

      Truth (“what is in front of one’s nose”) is always a struggle because its denial is always the easier path to take.

      People on the far left have been in denial because it is far easier to not confront a problem than to attack it. Instead placing confronting the Muslim problem it is far easier to just go on and blame the Jews.

      Radical factions of Islam for far too long have become a growing threat to civilization. They do it not by moving groups but by moving individuals into jihad. They recruit quietly in mosques and community centers and place as much importance on the actions of one individual as a cell or group of people committing acts to support jihad.

      The actions of this Army Muslim were so horrific that we were outraged. But where has that outraged been voiced within the Muslim community in the U.S.? If this is a religion of peace that does not condone such acts then why are they silent?

      Obama’s indifference to this act reflects that of all that follow him in this country and should be of concern to everyone who still values this country.

  • chuva

    It is really sad when people talk about Islam without even reading their religious text. Islam is NOT a religion of peace. The terrorists are following the tenets of their prophet Muhammad.

    Muhammad is a pedophile, a racist, a murderer and a thief. Those who continue to defend Islam have not read the Quran yet.

    • Unabashed Galt

      Its not what is in old books, it is how people practice their faith today. If we use your standard of judging an entire faith by old books, Christianity is not a religion of peace either. But most modern Christians are good people. Broad brush proclamations do not further progress: they hinder it.

      • mountainaires

        Christianity…hmm, you mean like the crusades, etc? All religions have their moments of shame in history I suppose. I prefer not to adhere to any organized religion. I would describe myself as very spiritual and a strong deist, but cannot bring myself to be part of a religion that includes Pat Robertson.

        :-)

        • Unabashed Galt

          I was referring to the Bible being chock full of violence (even from God) if taken literally. Most modern people do not take these old texts literally, and for good reason.

          I’m open on the spiritual and tend to think there is validity to it based on personal experience. :)

  • westexan

    Major Hassan is more than simply a terrorist. He is a traitorous bastard who wore the uniform of the United States Armed Forces. It is probabely only a matter of time before Obama appologizes to Hassan because an American police-woman shot his sorry ass. There are probabely a lot of American troops who are now thinking whether it is safe or not to be serving with other troops who claim to be of the muslim religion. I would not feel safe having anyone of the Islamic religion guarding my back in a combat zone where the enemy is Islamic. Exodus, the movie is not Afghanistan the combat zone nor is it Ft Hood Texas. When we are in a fight for the very survival of America– America is first and foremost and if anyone wants to call US terrorists — so be it who gives a shit?

  • mountainaires

    Goldberg is such a wingnut and wrong on most everything, that I find it really hard to read him.

    But Goldberg hit the proverbial goldmine when he writes that Hasan

    “demonstrated that being a trained psychiatrist provides no immunity to ancient hatreds and religious fanaticism, nor does psychiatric training provide much acuity in spotting such things in others. For example, the London Telegraph reports that, in what was supposed to be a medical lecture, Hassan instead gave an hourlong briefing on the Koran, explaining to colleagues at Walter Reed Army Medical Center that nonbelievers should be beheaded, have boiling oil poured down their throats and set on fire.

    His fellow psychiatrists completely missed this “red flag” — a suddenly popular euphemism for incandescently obvious evidence this man had no place in the U.S. Army.

    I think that is the entire point of all of it. Hasan was and is mentally ill, a very disturbed, in my opinion, very paranoid, personality disorder. In fact, I would say he’s a Paranoid Personality Disorder. He was delusional. His colleagues and ranking officers had plenty of opportunities to stop him; the FBI also had opportunities to intervene.

    I think Larry’s right when he writes,

    “Was Nidal Hassan a terrorist? No. He may have tried to contact Al Qaeda operatives but he acted alone. But he shared the mentality that justifies indiscriminate violence in pursuit of a cause he believed to be just. In this regard he is certainly a terrorist sympathizer and, based on several press reports, made no effort to conceal his devotion to an extreme vision of Islam.

  • massoud

    Thank you Larry Johnson for exposing truth. The jew devil is the center of all evil, and drinks the blood of Palestinian virgins. The jew devil kills and kills and kills and nobody talk because the jew owns the world and all banks. Only people talk is like you brave soul and fighter-philosopher cia super agent. Inshallah a fatwa we bring on the house of paul newman the zionism supporter, and inshallah the death of allah rains on jew ben affleck who has anal time with other jew matt damon. If they have baby he is anti-christ.

    Thank you larry johnson for exposing jew! Thank you! All jews are murderers and zionists and rapists and kill the babies of palestine.

    You are a brave american!

    • anon

      Not funny.

  • shoshana

    Thank you for your very valuable article Mr. Johnson. As a person who once belonged to the Jewish faith, I must thank you for speaking truth to power. I remember the evening when my dad, a crypto-Zionist fascist killed an entire Arab family and had us move into their house. I was given the toys of the children he killed, the toys still soaked, dripping with blood. My mom actually pickled some of the body parts of the dead children, using traditional Yiddish child-pickling recipes. During my teenage years I remember my father and his Zionist friends attacking Arab villages, killing the poor farmers and taking their goats, rice, transistor radios and arugula plants.

    At a certain point I decided that enough is enough, and joined the Peace Now movement. Now I’m a devout Muslim, I work as an administrative assistant for the J Street organization and listen to NPR.

    I firmly believe that there is a peaceful end to this Arab-Israeli conflict: kill all the Jews, and let there be peace.

    • Portia Elizabeth

      Your sarcasm will sadly go right over the heads of many.

  • Josh Rabinowitz

    What a wonderful article! As a gay man who works for the Gays for a Free Palestine Now organization, I must remind everyone everyday that the Apartheid that Zionists, Neocons and Christian Fundamentalists are promoting in the Occupied Holy Muslim Territories is something that no decent person should be silent about!

    We must fight the march of the blood-soaked boots of the murderous Jewish military “Zahal” and stop them from stomping on the land of Arabs.

    Join me in my fight against injustice! – gfpn.org

    • califlefty

      I wonder what would happen if your organization opened a branch in an Arab capital? Oh wait, you were being facetious, now I get it!

  • aleesha

    [There are repugnant comments from you in several threads, so you've been banned.]

    THANK YOU LARRY JOHNSON !!!

    I$REAL = SATAN

    FREE PALESTINE.
    FREE GAZA.
    FREE THE OCCUPIED TERRITORIES.

    JEW$ = FILTH

    • califlefty

      Look Larry, you’ve made a friend.

  • Avraham Mushnik PhD

    [There are repugnant comments from you in several threads, so you've been banned.]

    1.
    I am a 72 year old Jew who voted for Obama for one reason only: that he end the conflict in the Middle East by giving the Jews a swift kick in the butt and sending them into the nearest ocean. My whole life I have suffered because of the actions of these freak Zionists who invaded Arab land that does not belong to them and called it Israel. This is ridiculous. I live in New York and I’m very happy. Why do these freak Jews think they need their own land? No people of any religion have their own land. That is racism. There is no “Muslemia” or “Christianos” so why should there be an “Israel”?

    2.
    That whole worthless desert poop-hole does not belong to Jews.

    3.
    The Arab kids in my neighborhood and the Black kids all throw garbage at me and curse me and call me names and kick me and spit on me because the Jews are invading land that is not theirs. Why do I need to suffer because a bunch of crazy people are clinging to a pathetic strip of desert that does not even have oil?

    4.
    Just give this mythical “Israel” back to the Muslims and we will finally have peace in the world. Obama, this is why the Europeans gave you the Nobel peace prize: just get the Jews out of the way. That is what we are all expecting you to do Mr. President.

    5.
    Oh yeah, and by the way – Bush Lied and People Died.

    • Portia Elizabeth

      Dr. Mushnik — I might have believed you were sincere if you hadn’t put that part in about black kids spitting on you because “the Jews are invading land that is not theirs”. I’m fairly gullible, but even I don’t believe that statement.

      So now I question everything else you’ve written. And I mean everything.

  • califlefty

    Larry threw out the hook on the anti-Semitic angle then gloats that he caught a fish. Lets look at at the most notorious act of the Irgun, the bombing of the King David Hotel. Is the destruction of the enemy’s military headquarters a highly discriminate military act, or an indiscriminate act? Would issuing a warning with the intention of allowing those inside to escape makes it even more discriminate? The point is that Larry’s labeling of the Irgun as terrorist paints indiscriminate acts by a standard that classifies all warfare as such and is therefore a misuse of language and an obfuscation of important issues. Now when he does so selectively, such as when the perpetrators are Zionists, we have the right to question his motives. He says “What is sickening are those people who excuse terrorism by Jews because they support the cause but then have an aneurysm when a Muslim does the same kind of thing.” No, what is sickening is that moral equivalency can be found in totally unequivocal acts, as odd as if movies were history.

  • mountainaires

    Israel Finally Admits Lavon Affair

    MI figures out what went wrong in Lavon affair – 55 years later

    By Amos Harel, Haaretz Correspondent

    Fifty-five years after the notorious failure of an Israeli sabotage operation in Egypt, Military Intelligence has finally gotten around to figuring out what went wrong. The answer? Pretty much everything.

    An educational presentation about the 1954 Lavon affair prepared by the MI history and heritage division found that MI had not sufficiently trained the members of the sabotage unit, who were mostly amateurs and included several Egyptian Jews, and had failed to give them cover stories, plan escape routes or otherwise plan for the possibility that they would be caught.

    http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1127384.html

    The Lavon affair – also known locally as esek habish, “the rotten business” – was a plan to discredit Egypt’s government, then headed by Gamal Abdel Nasser, by bombing theaters, post offices and U.S. and British institutions, and making it seem as though Egypt was behind the bombings.

    http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/conspiracy-theories-are-like-good-wine.html#comments

    The Lavon Affair refers to the scandal over a failed Israeli covert operation in Egypt known as Operation Susannah, in which Israeli military intelligence planted bombs in Egyptian, American and British-owned targets in Egypt in the summer of 1954 in the hopes that “the Muslim Brotherhood, the Communists, ‘unspecified malcontents’ or ‘local nationalists’” would be blamed.[1] It became known as the Lavon Affair after the Israeli defense minister Pinhas Lavon, who was forced to resign because of the incident, or euphemistically as the Unfortunate Affair (Hebrew: העסק הביש‎, HaEsek HaBish).

    In 2005, Israeli President Moshe Katzav honored the nine Egyptian Jewish agents who were involved.[2]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair