The Bullying Kind

failing to intervene when a group of middle school friends—my fiends—were taunting a genius classmate

Freudian slip?

I never had a problem with “snitching”. This strange code of silence is destroying schools and neighborhoods. OIf course, in my day, adults actually DID something.

I remember a case in our high school where a semi-popular girl led the rally towards bullying a very awkward large male.  I hated it, but didn’t really know much about how to stop it at the time.

After high school, there was a murder and this guy was smeared all over the Fort Worth Press newspaper with full front page pictures of the trunk of his car that contained some shell casings.  He was arrested and the sensationalism of it was extreme.  Lo and behold, he didn’t do it.  There was really no apologies.  It was disgusting.

This guy joined the Army, went to Vietnam, lost a leg, and then died (I think it was in a car wreck) at an early age.

I blame the constant badgering of him at any early age to be the reason he wasn’t capable of protecting himself later in life.

We had another girl that was extremely quiet and thin.  She was another target of the creep’s rath.  During the auto accident phase of Driver’s Ed, she went screeming through the auditorium.  She didn’t come back to school until the next year.  You could not recognize her as she was extremely overweight.  A few years ago she was on the news when it was discovered she had been living in the house (a total disaster area) with her almost or dead mother (I can’t remember all the details).

This has been going on forever.  We just hear about it now because of the 24/7 news cycle.

Sad.

>:o

Pat, your graphic is stunning.  The bold strokes of the bull and the letters above it are forceful calligraphy; you can feel the intimidating power behind the brushstrokes.  And then, almost as an afterthought, the eye notices the pitiful cowering figure in the corner.  The contrast is quite powerful.

I went to high school in Northern California, and bullying was pretty much institutionalized in brutal freshman hazing rituals known as “initiation.”  The teachers pretty much ignored these activities; after all, it was “tradition.”  Much of it was carried out by the football team and other athletes, and the Phys Ed teachers reveled in it, and encouraged the harrassment.  When I say it was brutal, I am not exaggerating–but I won’t describe it.   Of course, when freshmen became upper classmen, they felt empowered and entitled to inflict the same humiliation on the next class of incoming freshmen.  Indeed, that was the way to redeem the sufferings they had experienced.   Who was culpable?  Besides the basic brutality of human nature, the school system was culpable!

Ah, this brings back a memory of the tradition of “initiation” to my Art College. Freshmen were supposed to wear a bizarre costume and do whatever a senior told them. If they didn’t, there was a “court” held at lunch hour by the Seniors where they were brought and sentenced for their “crimes”.

Except it was the start of the Sixties and my Freshman class was the first ever to rebel. They refused to do this stupid stuff and when the Seniors tried to force a court, the Freshmen began pelting them with food and overturning desks and easels in a mini-riot (shades of Animal House). They routed the Seniors (there are always more Freshmen than Seniors in a 4 year College). And the episode finally attracted the attention of the Administration who had foolishly believed this “tradition” should be allowed to continue.

Bingo. No more initiation.

Powerful evocative toon Pat.  An all time favorite.

An incredibly sad story. The best protection for bullying (and other bad acts)  would be to develop a culture that says you are responsible for your action as well as your inaction.  When you remain silence about an action that is criminal or immoral, you are condoning that act.  Therefore your silence makes you complicit in the bad act – which makes you equally responsible for the bad act.

Since you will be responsible for your actions either way, you might as well be responsible for the positive (stopping it) then the negative (letting it continue)  

JMO, but it is only snitching when it involves petty issues or spitefulness.   

I say this as someone who has been reading way too much on what has been going on in our government and financial institutions.  Once norms are corrupted to such an extent unthinkable things are possible by good people.  And norms can only be corrupted by complicity of the many who know, but remain silent.

Strangely enough corporate life is much like school.  Peer pressure and bullying reign supreme.

High school kids, particularly freshmen, are particularly vulnerable.  Usually, they are physically smaller and weaker than the upper classmen.  They must suddenly get used to getting undressed and literally standing naked before upper classmen who are usually more physically developed sexually.  They are thrust into a totally new and intimidating environment.  When the teachers, particularly the gym teachers and coaches, are complicit in initiation harrassment, it can be a nightmare.  I went to high school in the late 1950′s.  I hope things have changed since then.  But indeed, will bullying ever change?  We can only hope that school administrators recognize their complicity in the problem and do something to address it.  And now we have the cyberage and bullying through cyberspace . . .

And indeed, one of the things that makes the Phoebe Prince story so heartbreaking is that not only was she thrust into an alien and hostile school environment, but she was had just taken up residence in a new country.  And at first, like a trusting animal entering a new home, she felt like she was going to be treated with kindness and love . . . Instead she was used, and finally abused unto death . . .

My wife works at a women`s shelter and they have found:

There are clear links between bullying and domestic abuse – both involve an abuse of power by the perpetrator.
Children may learn that violence is justified, particularly when you are angry at someone.
Children in domestic abuse situations may learn that it is acceptable to be abusive and that violence is an effective way to get what you want, including by bullying.

Ooops, Ellen D.  Yes, I am sure it was a Freudian slip.  Fixed it…
(Thanks for noticing.)

…i don’t want only to complain, and i don’t wanna second-guess contributors here.  yet to be honest, i’d wanna do more than read and write about wrongdoing, etc.  as citizens, we pay many in govt. and therefore, we must hold them accountable for wrongdoing: by actions of others, and their own action or inaction, etc.   wanna write on the “public record?  and read all about wrongdoing?  OK, fine!  now, will such literate (if not accountable?) write officials, experts, public and private–and discover whether or not they earn their pay?  and then have something to write about, and that others can take care to read?

again: this is not intended to be some typical “fearless/gratutitous internet rant,” and is, rather, a good faith effort to do what i tried to do as an instructor long ago…yes, i clould chime in with anecdotes, but can you guess what i prefer instead????  …maybe you do much the same, etc.,  and i can assume some reading this can do better than me about what i prefer getting done–and in terms of comments/advisories here, also, if you can spare the effort, etc. 

unfortunately, from me, this will have to do for here, and for now at least.     

:-[  

Adults must intervene when they see bullying or just plain old mean behavior. At school, many simply don’t want to deal with or aren’t sure how. I’ve seen teachers and playground supervisors walk away from some atrocious behavior.

In Seattle they had a girl beaten up in the bus tunnel while four security guards just stood around and watched. The excuse later was that they weren’t authorized to intervene, the girl brought it on herself, etc, etc. I call complete bullshit on all excuses. If you are an adult, you are required to respond. That’s why bullying happens because it is allowed to occur and adults are either unwilling or confused about when they should step in. Don’t hesitate, intevene.

Great toon and important issue.

A review of state legislative attempts to deal with bullying is summarized briefly in the site below.   These laws do not seem to be very effective and usually come about only after a terrible bullying outcome like Phoebe’s suicide.  Adults in schools and in the community must be held accountable for turning a blind eye to bullying and failing to intervene and for not reporting it to police when they become aware it is going on.

http://www.stopbullyingnow.hrsa.gov/hhs_psa/pdfs/sbn_tip_6.pdf

Here is how the California department of education is dealing with the issue of bullying.

http://www.cde.ca.gov/ls/ss/se/bullyfaq.asp

Bullying is so awful. Kids can be SO cruel.

There was a kid in my high school who was viciously picked on, even spit on. He hung himself off his balcony during the summer. He also had a terrible home life. It was tragic. 

The meanest kids at my school were always the most popular or football jocks. I made a strong effort to be nice to all the kids. Once a boy in school said to me “you are the only person I know who is friends with everyone.” Never have forgotten that.

Having moved to a new school in 9th grade, I suffered briefly at the hands of the Mean Girls, and knew how it felt. 

Kids need to be taught how to treat others. It starts at such a young age. 

Thanks for the important post, Pat!!

Yttik - My mom just sent me a news article clipping about that beating, and the girl. I had seen the video and was PO’d. The I read that the girl did the SAME thing to a woman in her 50′s and was facing robbery charges, and she also beat another man in the head while she and a friend robbed him. Karma’s a bitch.

I am still outraged the employees didn’t intervene, because that could have been some innocent older woman or something, but as far as that little hoodlum, who is currently charged with other counts of robbery? I hope she goes to jail. 

I think the majority of responsibility lies with the parents. If a school teacher sees it happening, they need to immediately reach out to the parents, and if it is violent, to the police. The problem, from what i’ve seen, is the parents always complain because their kids gets suspended or something. 

People need to know what the heck their kids are up to. And teachers need to tell them 

It is as if someone MUST intervene to break the cycle. As Alice Miller tells us, where abused children are concerned, it only really takes one adult to point out to the child that what is happening to him or her is *not OK.*

I don’t really recall being bullied. Though I was sometimes called “teacher’s pet.” And my teachers did look out for me. That I know.

Turning a blind eye to any kind of abuse is called “enabling.” Bullying is one such type of abuse. And, as HARP points out above… any form of abuse can be a red flag about other forms that are happening in that child’s family life now (or will happen in his/her future.)

Bullies need counselling! And suspension while they are being counseled is not off the mark.

Excellent! The analysis of the problem here is top notch. For example:

“Without support or intervention, students who bully will continue to bully and may engage in other types of antisocial behavior and crime. Although some students who bully are less likely to be trusted and may be seen as mean and manipulative, a bully who learns aggression toward others garners power and may find the behavior a difficult habit to break.  Some acts of bullying result in suspension or expulsion of students and translate into child abuse and domestic violence in adulthood. Research shows that 60 percent of males who bully in grades six through nine are convicted of at least one crime as adults, compared with 23 percent of males who did not bully.” 

Also like this part:

“The bystander should recognize that he/she must choose to be either a part of the problem or a part of the solution.”

Because the majority of kids are bystanders. They need to be educated… so they have the tools to react consciously and effectively.

I went thru a similar experience at the hands of mean girls, as well, and they were the popular kids also.My son had the experience of having a girl try to bully him, stabbing him during class with a pencil in the shoulder(she didn’t mean to do it), Kicking, throwing a book at his face, and strying to super glue his hair- all while playing an ‘innocent”, naturally she used some fairly vicious gossip to carry out her attack, mixed with all the fabrication of a very poorly written spy novel- with both male and female aides. My son was in 8th grade, and not only is that an ackward time it is an ugly time(literally for alot of kids). The reason for the attacks was she liked him, he just wasn’t at that place yet with the whole girl thing. To make it worse she lived two houses down, with very absent parents. He hadn’t been her first target. We talked about it, and came to the decision his only choice was to call her out for it, in a very public way, to embarass her, which hopefully would make it stop. However there may be consequences when he did this. WE talked about how to be direct, and to the point, then be honest and take his lumps if any were to come. This girl also rode the bus with my son; this is where he chose to make his stand, which he did, entering the packed school bus, he stood in the aisle and said the following:

“Roses are red,
Violets are small
Tell me __________, Why does your chest
Resemble a wall? 

I didn’t like the particular venue/subject, but it worked, she left him alone; he had to find another way to school for the rest of the year, as he was kicked off of the bus. Normally I would have told him remarks about someone’s body is not the way to go, but in this case, we had very little to go with, and at that age it is all about the looks, so it worked. I did go with my son to the parents house and had him apologize for the statement, where the father of the brat girl became quite agressive. To which I stood my ground in front of my son, and let them know I would rather have a child that has the integrity to stand up for themselves, even though I would rather there had not been the remarks about her body, and that I had encouraged him to embarass her; and further asked why were they not equally outraged at their daughter’s behavior, of physically attacking other kids: than to have a child so starved for attention that she was willing to attack other kids with whatever means she needed to get what she wanted.
The school didn’t help, other than to call me when he was stabbed in the shoulder to let me know there was an “Accident”(Right he somehow tipped over and got stuck in the shoulder)..and the counselor told us these things have a way of working themseles out.
They don’t! Either the bullying continues, faster and at a more vicious level, the child stops going to school altogether, or we have tragic suicides. Bullies grow up to become bullies. 

I learned from experience that anyone, under certain circumstances, is capable of bullying. My bullying story involved my son. When he was in elementary school, he was thin with strawberry-blond hair and freckles. He had the added disadvantge of being younger than his classmates because he had skipped 2nd grade. We had moved from Texas to Connecticut when he began 3rd grade, so he was also an outsider who was teased for his accent.

My son dealt with a small group of “meanies” for weeks before he admitted what was happening. Mother lion wanted to protect her cub, so I enrolled him in a karate class to build his self-esteem and give him the skills to protect himself. My plan worked too well. One day I got a call from the mother of one of his tormenters. My little freckle-faced angel had opened a can of whoop-ass on her son and given him a bloody nose.

While I was secretly proud of him for standing up to the bully, I saw the potential for my own son to turn into someone who could intimidate. Sadly, we ended the karate lessons, and turned his focus to other physical activities. But the episode gave me a new perspective on the whole issue of bullying. It seems somewhat Darwinian to have the stronger prey on the weak, but as sentient beings we are able to see the wrong and make the choice to stop it.

Excellent points Katmoon.  

Bullying feeds itself.  Those who bully are insecure at their core.  And the longer they bully, the more they need to bully so it escalates in intensity and viciousness. 

I know I’m older than many here, but I must have lived in an enlightened community.  Our school did not allow initiations.  Instead, entering freshmen were assigned an “older sister” or “older brother” whose job it was to be a person to go to with questions that first year.  It worked out pretty well.  It was a small school; we had only 63 in our graduating class.  

And when I first taught, ninth grade was still junior high.  They got to lord it over the seventh graders, but I don’t recall them doing any sort of bullying that much.  And when I taught in high school, in the districts where I taught, freshmen initiation was not allowed.

I am sure bullying went on in the high schools, but especially with girls, it’s pretty hard  for teachers to see it all, as students do their best to hide things from teachers.  I know the counselors did mention it occasionally during faculty meetings, asking us to look out for certain things.  It’s hard when there are over 1,500 students to 100 adults and the kids all have cars and the stuff happens mostly off grounds.

I don’t remember much bullying in my school years–only some cliquish behavior, mostly on the part of several groups of girls.  You know, the snotty mean girl types.   But, as EllenD said, in my day, the teachers and administration and counselors kept that sort of thing in check by being ever present on school grounds.

As for my graduation class, we were very close, more than most.  We’ve held a reunion every five years, and usually a lot show up.  When we all get together, it’s like no time has passed.  We sit around and laugh and talk and catch up with each other.  Most of us have each other on email contact lists.  We will even have an impromptu get- together when someone comes in from out of state.

The saddest thing for me, then, was to see the behavior get so bad in my  own kids’ schools later.  And surprisingly, it started in kindergarten for my younger son. I had to get snotty myself to the teacher and ask her to do a better job of watching.  She thought it was just “play” when a kid twice his side would constantly push him down and sit on him.  And later, when my older son was doing crossing guard duty in sixth grade, I finally had to get the police to intervene because the principal was a real prick and thought his job was to “understand” the bully who was making his job miserable every day.  We lived in a prison town, and this bully had a father AND stepfather in prison.  So the kid was obviously not getting good guidance at home.  One day, my older came home and was so frustrated and angry that he said he refused to go back to school.  I made him tell me what was happening.  I asked him why he didn’t report it to the principal.  Then he said that this particular kid had once got up and punched a substitute teacher and left the building, and the principal went after him to “talk” with him.  The next day, he was allowed to go on a field trip that required being on a school bus fifty miles both ways.  The bully sat on the bus bragging about how he could do anything he wanted because the principal would just talk with him.  I then called the police in town, who told me they’d had their own run-ins with the kid.  They drove to the street the next morning where the crossing guards worked, took the kid aside to make sure he knew they’d be watching him.

While I loved being at school as a student, my two boys left the building and school grounds as fast as they could every day.

This case and the questions it raises haunt me.

I was bullied through grade school and high school.  (The junior high school administrators were at lot more on it and those years were better.)  Being 5’7″and 102 pounds, myopic and a nerd I was a good target.  There are still a couple of boys involved in the bullying to whom I probably couldn’t speak a civil word these days.  (For some reason, girls were never much of a problem.  They just ignored me.)

It was a miserable experience–one I wouldn’t wish on anyone.  It was, however, my first clear lesson in the concept that life isn’t fair.  That lesson has been particularly valuable over the past ten years.

IS there some amount of agression people should learn to deal with?  Or should they go through life never hearing an angry word?

No, I’m not defending Phoebe Prince’s harassers.  What they did went far beyond anything I ever experienced.  I am just concerned that the political correctness which has already overwhelmed us will result in a generation of people with no backbone.

This one isn’t as black-and-white as it seems.

Bullying is terrible, horrible. But look where kids get it from: Their Parents. It’s not like kids just learn out of thin air how to bully others; they learn it at home, being bullied by parents. The way to stop bullying in school? Charge the parents with being accessories to a crime of assault. 

You know, if a child under the age of 18 drives a car and kills someone with that car, the perpetrator’s can be sued by the parents of the victim. So, why not charge the parents of the bullies with a crime. When parents are responsible for their children, they should be held responsible for their children. 

Very well said Portia, it is so tempting to want to bite back, hard, and heavy.

The greatest divide during my school years was between the “haves and have nots”. I was always tall for my age, athletic and did well academically, so I could navigate in both circles. We did not encounter bullying, for many of us would have intervened in a heartbeat.
My daughter was spanked in first grade for wetting herself. I did not confront that teacher, but made damned sure that she saw me often. Every event that allowed parents, this mom was the first to sign up. Every teacher and administrator knew that I would be aware of the atmosphere in their domain!
My daughter and son-in-law use the same approach, and it works!

Last year we stopped for a burger, and a teenage boy had a girl backed against a car with her chin cupped by his hand. He was in her face.
I told my husband that my heart was racing, and that I read NQ too much, but to prepare for trouble.
I stared that boy down as we crossed the parking lot, and stopped in my tracks when he waved me off. Once we were inside, I stood tall by our table, arms crossed, watching him while he scowled at me.
Finally, he was called inside through the employees entrance and did not emerge. Someone didn’t want the police showing up, either before or after the brawl broke out! Ha!

I bullied someone when I was in maybe the 4th grade?  I picked the only girl in school (my age) who was probably more poor than me.  I don’t know why I did it other than it made me feel better to pick on her for basically the same things I lived - mom on welfare collecting food stamps, not enough parental attention since my father abandoned us and my mom liked to have revolving boyfriends, and so on. It lasted only a few months or so. I never touched her physically, just said mean things to her. I remember it to this day and I regret it badly. I should’ve offerred her friendship and comfort instead.  It’s out of character for me since I’m very passive and if anything, more the type to be bullied than to do bullying. The only thing is during that time in my life, my mother was having her 4th child, wasn’t married and my home life was chaotic. Maybe making fun of someone else who was the only person I could see who was worse off than me in regards to family life, gave me a bit of comfort and lessened me feeling so powerless.

I might agree with you except that I was in a marriage that included three very “mean girl” stepdaughters.  Needless to say, I am out of that marriage now and have nothing to do with them.  Their father always took their side, and they could bat their eyes and act innocent very well.  So if I was ever bullied in my life, it was by them.  I would have hated to be held responsible for those three when I was still married to their father.  And in the town we lived in, he could have convinced anyone in charge that their behavior was all someone else’s fault.  Same town as above, where the in-crowd principal was very proud of what an understanding guy he was because he “understood” why this young up and coming prison inmate did what he did.  (The police in town were the ones who took my message and said to me that the best way to help this kid was to make it clear that if he didn’t change his ways, he would be exactly where his father and stepfather were in a few years.)

One of the most difficult things that a parent must face is how to deal with bullying.  What do you tell a child who is being bullied?

1–Turn the other cheek.
2–Fight back; don’t let them get away with it.
3–Go find an adult and get help.
4–Run away.  Live to fight another day.
5–Try and talk your way out of it; mollify the bully and try to make him think he’s on your side.
6–Get something on them and get even later on.  Be smart and nail them with treachery.
7–Join a tougher gang.

Any more possibilities?

This all reminds me of one of the greatest movies ever made about bullying: My Bodyguard.  The bullied kid’s solution was essentially to befriend a big kid who was an apparent loner psychotic with a history of murder and was feared by all (essentially solution #7 above) . . .

This all reminds me of one of the greatest movies ever made about bullying: My Bodyguard.  The bullied kid’s solution was to befriend a big kid who was an apparent loner psychotic with a history of murder and was feared by all (essentially solution #7 above) . . .

I had to report the crossing guard at my son’s school.  It was the brother of one of Ryan’s peers harassing him everyday – telling him he couldn’t walk across with the others, etc.  Ryan let it happen a couple of times before he told me.  I called the Principal.  The boy was suspended from being a crossing guard for a while.  His mother was pissed at me for the next 9 years.

Too bad.

This is an honest, touching, and compelling account.  A good and decent person always carries the pain of having hurt another being–even when it happens at a very young age.

Now, you have reminded me that a girl in the 8th liked Ryan.  When he didn’t like her, she harrassed him by calling him names in one class, cat calling him in the halls, etc.

I told Ryan to ignore her and be nice.  It didn’t stop.  She gave a ring to Ryan’s friend Scott to give to Ryan, Ryan rejected it, and Scott was pushed against the wall by one of her friends demanding the ring back.

Well, I called his school counselor.  She was very clear that Ryan didn’t have to be nice or ignore her.  The girl had to change her behavior.  She was called to the office, her mother was called, the teacher in the class was present in the meeting, and the girl was read the riot act.  She was technically in the school district illegally – the mother was using the grandparents address.  The girl stopped immediately.

I forgot about this until your story.

>:o

my heart breaks for your childhood Tango
I was very lucky growing up but saw many of my friends suffer because of the mistakes of their parents.  WE all do the best we can right?  And I’m sure she loves you fierce!

I find myself doing that quite often.  Parents yelling and alllllmost hitting their kids at certain places (lately) and BF/GF fights at malls, etc —  I always let them KNOW I seeeeee them so they can’t get away with what ever!  Then I worry about them the rest of the day or week, inevitably …..  but I can’t let things like that stand.  NOPE!  it may kill me young but what ever!

You make wise points from a credible vantage point Creeper, even though your story made me feel very sad.  I think there is a way to retain backbone and not resort to controlling speech though.  It’s more about values and having them taught early on.

I had one incident only when I was bullied over a 3 day period on my way to second grade.  I walked alone, and three older boys (probably about 10) would jump out from behind a building, surround me, and tease me until I cried–then they would laugh and leave.  On the 4th day an older girl of maybe 12 or 13 came over and yelled at the boys and told them to never do that again.  I remember what she looked like to this day although I didn’t know her and never saw her or the boys again.  She had long blonde hair and was wearing a bright red coat.  When I think of angels, I see her.

So, my point here is that whatever this girl/angel had inside of her, whatever her values and her feelings of confidence and courage, that is what all kids may be capable of if they can get it from wherever she got it.

Does that make sense?

I was thinking the exact same thing when I was reading your list!  My Bodyguard was quite the movie.  And I was also thinking that a number of movies “e.g. Mean Girls, The Revenge of the Nerds, Carrie, and so on and on) are almost formulaic in the “bullied and then get even” theme.  These must touch some Jungian place in most of us because the plot is so enduring.

Thank you LadyD! It is not easy, but it will take all of us showing up for the show-downs!

“We all do the best we can, right?”

The best phrasing of this thought that I know of is in the poem “8th Air Force” by Randall Jarrell:

“Men wash their hands, in blood, as best they can.”

We don’t have any clean water to wash out the stains, and so we carry them and live with them the best we can.

Yes Pat–these movies really resonate because we can all empathize so closely with the bullying dilemma.  In respect to My Bodyguard, after thinking about it further, the plot is not resolved until the bullied boy finally confronts the bully himself in the final scene and beats him in a fist-fight; and so, in this movie, joining a tougher gang is not the ultimate solution . . .

oowawa, we have not had to deal with bullying, but we taught number three.
Our grand-daughters implemented it to perfection when outsiders disrupted a teen party at their church’s recreation hall.
Nearly all schools have resource officers now, and most of them are dedicated to their duties. At least it is a good starting point!

Yes, Sassy.  But to play devil’s advocate for a moment: perhaps teaching kids that adults can solve their problems for them is really a comforting falsehood that prolongs the inevitable realization that they have to learn to fend for themselves.  Also, if a child is perceived as complaining to adults about being bullied, he may be branded as a “snitch” and may bring down even more severe bullying on his head.  This could be particularly dangerous if the child is being bullied by a gang (another movie, Gran Torino, comes to mind).  Once again, I’m playing devil’s advocate here.

It makes perfect sense, Pat.  And it think it points out the solution…the kids themselves.  Whether through peer pressure or direct intervention they have more power to stop this than adults. 

SYD touched on this above when he said we need to teach the victiims that what is happening to them is not OK.  Let’s take it a step further and teach all of them that this is not OK.

Bullies are seeking attention and validation. They are trying to prove to others, and themselves, that they are worthy of respect. They lack the confidence and self esteem that children normally develop in healthy and loving families, so by force or intimidation, they compel their unfortunate victims to supply them with the attention that they don’t get at home.

You ask oowawa, “Any more possibilities”, well, here’s one that I know works very well. The bully is seeking attention, and he/she is doing it on their own abusive terms. The best way to neutralize a bully is to supply him/her with the attention they crave, but NOT on their terms, the victim needs to find a better way to supply the bully with positive attention, so that the victim will be the one who determines the terms and controls the situation. The victim needs to closely observe the bully and find something praiseworthy about them. It doesn’t need to be much, and the victim doesn’t need to be a suck-up, but by simply saying something like “Gee Sam, you’re a really fast runner!”, or, “You’re really good at math Sam”, you will be giving the needed attention on YOUR OWN TERMS, and the bully will be far less likely to continue bullying someone who has voluntarily given them the recognition that they aren’t getting elsewhere.

In the second grade, my youngest child was being bullied by a kid who I knew was a nasty little kid. I was the kid’s soccer coach (my son’s team) and I had the chance to witness some of his family dynamics. His bullying was a form of acting out to get noticed because his parents were not giving him realistic and constructive appraisals of his soccer skills or of his interpersonal behavior. They coddled him and blamed everyone else when he screwed up. Kids know when someone is blowing smoke, and reflexively doling out false or unearned praise greatly devalues any real praise that the child legitimately deserves. When a parent gives too much praise when none is deserved, the child eventually learns that their parent’s praise has no real value, and will seek praise from other sources.

When my son eventually told me what was bothering him, that he was being bullied, I had a talk with his teacher. She told me that the bullying was just as much my child’s fault because he wasn’t standing up to the bully, and was constantly whining to her that he was being picked on. It seemed pointless to me to point out to this clueless teacher the fact that my son was very small for his age, and that the bully was very large for his age, so the size disparity eliminated any possibility that my son could adequately stand up to the kid, so I was on my own. I told my son to think very hard about something nice he could say about his tormentor, and eventually he told me that he liked the way the kid could draw pictures. I told my son to walk by the kid’s desk the next time they were doing art class, and tell him how good his drawing was. After my son did this, the bullying completely stopped. At the end of the school year, when I went to pick up my son at school, I asked the teacher if that kid had continued to be a bully (I knew what the answer would be) and she told me that he still picked on kids, but she noticed that he stopped picking on my kid for some reason, and she wanted to know why. I just told her that my son gave the bully what he needed, and he did so on his terms.

A wonderful cartoon!  Some of your brush strokes, to me, almost look like Middle- Eastern letters.  I guess the conflict is on my mind and is just another example of Bullying and someone has to stand up to it. 
Why might someone bully?  Some of the reasons are: Because there is some kind of benefit with minimal if any negative consequences.  For some, Bullying is a form of financial gain, as in getting someone’s’ lunch money.  It could be done so that the smart kid does not raise the grade average, if the class is graded on a curve, which would make weaker students grades go down.  It could be done as a strange form of entertainment for the bully and their friends, without much thought as to its negative effects. It could be done because there is bullying at home and this is the only way a child knows how to get its needs met.  And it could be done to make one self feel superior, while inside they feel inferior.
One solution is to teach children that assault, whether it is done adult to adult or child to child, will not be tolerated and that there are real punishments.  For children that is a bit more difficult since expelling them from school is not always perceived of as a punishment.  There also must be in place a system that is supported by the schools, parents, and the judicial system.  Role playing is also good, but it must be made a required course.
Finally, we have to get away from “kids will be kids.”  Isn’t that just like saying “terrorists will be terrorists?”

Oh, tango, are you sure we’re not twins?  You are so not alone.

Though I’ve tried for over half a century to forget this, I can’t.  I did almost exactly the same thing when I was about seven or eight.  I walked up to another girl who was a total stranger and slapped her across the face.

I cannot explain my act and I was horrified the moment I did it.  That blow exposed a side of me that scared me to death.   It is also one of the bitterest regrets of my life.  If you were to grant me one wish, it would be for an opportunity to apologize to that person.

I wonder why some people are shocked at their own capacity for meanness while others seem to thrive on it.

Wow–very eloquent, Onofre’s arm, and good practical advice that should be useful in many bullying situations.  I might suggest that this kind of relates to the 5th point above, “mollify the bully and try to make him think he’s on your side,” but also suggests a revision: “mollify the bully by trying to make him feel you’re on his side and that he is a worthwhile person . . . “  At any rate, your astute comment suggests concrete ways that this can be done.  Clever!

“Some of your brush strokes, to me, almost look like Middle- Eastern letters.  I guess the conflict is on my mind and is just another example of Bullying and someone has to stand up to it.”

You know, Rich, that connection had registered in my subconscious mind.  Very true!  Great point.

Here’s the ultimate bullying story and how one town dealt with it:

http://www.talkguests.com/mcelroy.htm

Interesting story OA!  I think the approach would work well in the individual case, but that bully just goes and finda another victim.  That part of it is unfortunate.

There is a fascinating book about this incident called In Broad Daylight.  It’s a real page-turner.  In addition, 2 movies have been made about these events.  Fascinating stuff.  From Wikipedia:

“Another film dealing with the killing takes the opposite view: Connecticut filmmaker Ralph Server‘s Without Mercy, which won the Grand Jury Prize for Best Picture at the New York International Independent Film & Video Festival in 2004. The film suggests that government will at times go to extremes not to punish lawbreakers and allow them to commit terrorist acts, as was the case with McElroy. But the townspeople owned guns and they used them to make the point that when government fails the people must take matters into their own hands.”

Well, that would have to have been WAY deep in my unconscious, LOL.  Of course, I did admit to one Freudian slip right off the bat (see top comment).

Rich,

“Finally, we have to get away from “kids will be kids.”  Isn’t that just like saying “terrorists will be terrorists?””

You’ve hit on something that has always seemed so studpid to me.  This “kids’/teenagers’ brains aren’t fully formed yet so they can get a pass on some things” attitude sometimes really, really bothers me.  Yes, in SOME circumstances, you have to give a kid a small break, as long as there IS some punishment, and teaching going along with it (perhaps, as in doing the punishment in a kinder way).  But, I feel that kids can understand right from wrong at a much earlier age than most give them credit for.  I think I read once that Aristotle settled on the age of five to begin teaching kids because he said that was the age when they could understand right from wrong.

I can’t tell you the dirty looks I got from several in the “Peyton Place” town I lived in once during a discussion about some teenagers who had sneaked out of the house during a sleepover, taken the family car for a joyride, and ended up crashed at the bottom of a hill with two dead.  Everyone was giving the “kids will be kids” argument and feeling so sorry for the kids involved.   It angered me because in this town there were constantly reports of people’s houses being trashed when parents were away and kids threw parties, of once yearly car crashes and deaths from kids acting irresponsibly, etc., etc. I had gotten the same story when my older son had to be taken to an emergency room after he was shot in the arm by a beebee gun because some kids in a nearby field were out using one irresponsibly.  

 I said something to this effect:  When I was growing up, my parents were working hard to pull us up out of the near poverty that they had grown up in.  They loved me and my siblings and I never once thought it was my “right” as a kids to disrespect the house they provided for me or to steal their car or to besmirch the family name by acting as irresponsibly as those kids had acted.  I said it seemed to me that it was the community attitude that “kids will be kids” that caused this type of thing to happen over and over.  The “kids” acted the way their parents had acted and would take it as their right to act that way UNLESS the community as a whole stopped making excuses for the kids and started instilling some old-fashioned values of respect and acting with dignity and restraint.
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Perhaps, but this is why it is important to identify and arrest bullying behavior while the bully is still very young. If the bully is treated too much like a little criminal, and he is punished frequently, he will actually start to accept the harsh results of his bullying as a replacement for the positive attention that he really wants, negative attention is better than no attention at all. Unless the bully is given a good alternative form of attention than what he receives through his bullying, he will naturally grow more dependent upon bullying to satisfy his need for attention. Once bullying has become too entrenched in an individual, a teenager for instance, then other tactics need to be used to treat it.

In the last 5 years, the kid who was picking on my kid has stopped bullying completely, we’re a small enough community that I could approach the kid’s parents, and the parents of kids he picked on, and I convinced enough of them to supply the kid with positive attention instead of constantly punishing him. His self esteem is maintained through more constructive activities that have replaced the bullying.

Onofre’s arm, I think you have really touched on some important psychological truths regarding one-on-one bullying.  However, when the bullying comes from a gang or a group, perhaps a different dynamic is at play since the bullies within a gang or a group get their positive feedback from the other members of the gang-group, and that positive feedback is contingent upon their mutual bullying activity. 

I had a good friend who was born with spina bifida, so he was mostly confined to a wheelchair, but could use crutches for short periods.

1. His mom had to almost sue the Jr High to have a SINGLE ramp put in so he could get inside by himself.

2. He got pushed around and dumped by the bullies and the admin and teachers at that Jr High looked on and didn’t stop it. But I did…thankfully I was 4-6″ taller than the other kids so they left him (us) alone.

Well heck Pat, IMHO art wouldn’t be any fun if the artist knew exactly what they were doing and had it all under control.  The art work has to have some surprises in store!

I remember two cases of bullying in my highschool and both occurred when a queen was being nominated for the annual football dance in Nov. One girl was nominated because she was big chested. She went on to win, but had a very disastrous life when she grew up. The other girl was the daughter of the Ag teacher, a very timid, pale faced, plain girl. She did not want to accept the nomination but the guidance counselor encouraged her to go for it anyway.
I’m sure that there was more going on, especially in the locker room, but I just never was aware of it. 

I remember a homecoming queen from a rival high school.  She, I hate to say this, was perhaps the homliest girl I have ever seen.  Some smart-ass boys on the team nominated her as a joke.  Then some of her rough friends made it their goal to turn the tables on those boys.  They threatened everyone and anyone they could think of into voting for her.  I am sure there were some who also voted for her because they thought what the boys had done trying to humiliate her was an awful thing and so they voted for her because they didn’t like what the boys had done.  Emotional bullying is a terrible thing, as much as physical bullying.

Gang behavior is a much different dynamic than individual bullying. People do things within the gang mentality that they would never do on their own. Gangs are tribes, and belonging to a tribe is an important requirement of the human species. Most forms of tribalism are positive and benign, like family units, clubs, sports teams, etc. When the positive tribal models aren’t available, young people may feel compelled to belong to gangs, and the requirements to join are quite often destructive and demeaning, it’s the initiation you’ve described up-thread. Initiation is used as a mechanism to prove the sincerity of the candidate who wishes to join the team, and very often, the initiation is of such a vile and illegal form, that once performed, the candidate is forever tied to the group, because the group now holds an extortive power over the individual. And the violence or other illegal activity will continue as a constant display of commitment to the group.

What’s the solution? Provide better alternative tribes for adolescents to belong to. This is sometimes very difficult, but it is never impossible. And again, it requires wise intervention BEFORE the problem has become entrenched.

Her name wasn’t Carrie, was it?

I’m sorry to hear your story Creeper. I don’t know why, I guess we just needed someone to take our pain out on. 

When I was in the 5th grade I was bullied at the bus stop several days in a row. A group of boys had decided that it would be fun to harass the younger girls by throwing frozen snowballs at our bare legs. I’m not a person who carries a purse, so imagine their surprise the next morning when I showed up w/a large brown leather purse w/pretty long straps. I waited quietly for the bus until the bullying began. At that point, I threw down my books & started swinging the purse around my head. I charged one of the bullies & whapped him a good one with my purse full of rocks, sending him flying & howling. I then picked up my books & resumed waiting for the bus. Funny, none of us were bullied by these boys again. There is nothing a bully hates more than someone who will stand up to them. Adults seem to have lost their collective spine and don’t feel the need to intervene. I always jump in and deal directly with the bullies because I know they are really spineless worms with major self-esteem issues- much like the adults who allow these things to happen.

Wow, Onofre, that was a great way to deal with a bully. Very creative and I think you taught your son a very valuable lesson. That people want to be noticed. And if they can’t get positive reinforcement and feedback, they’ll take negative.  And sometimes a kind word or deed really does make a difference.

I always decided that when it comes to my daughter being bullied or stalked, if I didn’t get right away positive help from the schools or the police that caused the bad behavior to stop, I’d have no problem moving my daughter across town, state or country. I guess I don’t have the faith in authorities that some have to keep my child safe. 

Good story Brodie!!!

This pisses me off. Why won’t teachers help? It’s kind like people who hear screams and refuse to call the cops because they don’t want to get involved.  Makes me sick and so sad for those victimized. Good for you for helping that friend of yours.

I think our stories are similar. It was the boys who nominated these girls thinking that it was funny.

And here are some other very effective aspects of the image that I just noticed.  The pitiful wilting figure in the lower right is standing in a beam of light and is casting a shadow.  The shadow is angled away from the glaring and hostile beam of the bull’s stare so that 1) It appears that the small figure is wilting under the bull’s torrid glare; and 2) It appears that the bull’s focus on the figure IS a spotlight from which the pitiful figure cannot hide; and 3) It appears that the figure is transfixed, locked within the circle of the bull’s stare, and is unable to escape.

I remember once walking down a street when a young boy and his mother were walking towards me. The mother was a little ways behind him and the boy started packing a snowball as he neared me. I knew he intended to throw it at me as soon as I got my back to him. so I said in a stern voice, “Don’t you throw that at me” He put the snowball down, but his mother came running up and said to the boy, “Don’t you let anyone tell you what to do”.

So much for teaching the child ….

I know.  Your stories reminded me of the story I told.  In our school, we had all given up on the queen/king voting thing.  Every year it was the girl who dated the captain of the football team.  He was kind; she was queen.  One of my friends just happened to date the captain her junior year and a different captain her senior year.  So she was queen twice.  She was a very beautiful girl, smart and nice too.  Few begrudged her.  One boy who had a crush on her for years finally got a date with her and was, it seems, willing to die for that date.  It happened his appendix burst that night, and he didn’t tell anyone about the pain until it was almost too late.

“One boy who had a crush on her for years finally got a date with her and was, it seems, willing to die for that date.  It happened his appendix burst that night, and he didn’t tell anyone about the pain until it was almost too late.”

Ah, romance.  The pain of unrequited and hopeless love.  We want these high-school love stories to have happy endings, and that’s why it’s so appalling when the romance turns to horror as in the movie Carrie or in the tale of Phoebe Prince’s suicide.  It pretty much never ends up like in the old Johnny Cash fantasy:

We want these high-school love stories to have happy endings, and

You had to say that , didn’t you……………….

I still love that big lug …… :’(                                                    

Oooops–sorry sowsear–deleted my Johnny Cash post.  It was just a little too poppy and pollyanna sweet to stand up on this thread.  I meant it sarcastically, but this whole subject is just too serious for snark.

True, Oowawa, but maybe we should have another post on lost loves (Hillary as well as big lugs)

The ability to call the police during the 4-5 cases of domestic violence I’ve witnessed has been worth the high price of having a cell phone for years. I never hesitate to call.

And I don’t know why the teachers didn’t do more about stopping the bullies. It didn’t have to be about my friend being protected because he was “different”, but the jerks needed to be put in place. Last I heard, at least one of them is/was in prison. 

Tango, thank you for sharing, I know it isn’t easy; just know most of us have at the very least thought about bullying, and may have actually done it. To be able to discuss it, is very healing and honestly I think takes a great deal of courage, just to admit, any part of our lives where we have had to come face to face with our own flaws.

Thanks, SYD.
I agree that you are either part of the problem or part of the solution.

When I grew up there were people called HEROES. These were people who defended those who could not defend themselves or did other unselfish actions. It was related to Chivalry which is not incompatable with my feminist beliefs. Heroes and Knights in shining armor come in all colors and can be of either sex. The one thing that distinguishes them is that they know what is right and what needs to be done and they do it. If they don’t do it, they know they will be forever diminished in their own eyes, even if no one else knows or cares.
Maybe it was the movies, but these were people you wanted to emulate.

Where have you gone Joe DiMaggio……….?

tango, my childhood was as chaotic as yours.  That sure as hell doesn’t excuse us but it may explain the anger that surfaced.

live the journey
and
fight the good fight

my mantras – they’ve worked so far
but for my daughter who grew up w/out her father around (and he had no excuses) so she’s quite cynical about men and I’m sure very high maintenance because of it.  At some point though you either grow UP or OUT of it or find someone who can HELP you adjust!  I hope she finds her soul mate and doesn’t shoot him down before he gets the chance to show himself to her.  sigh.

who dares question the MASTER painter?
Pat, remember, I’m on your “first mail” list of buyers for your first Art Book (lest I’m late) please let us know!  I will FIND the money for it!  I just LOVE your talent!  My daughter paints (not like you) but I just appreciate the talent so much as I’m a sloppy lefty that can’t draw myself out of a box!  LOL

got to watch out for those grown up bullies though (some carry weapons)

Yep–then there is Columbine.  When the bullied have had too much (and there are two or more who have each other for support), they can be far more dangerous than those who did the bullying.

A sixteen year old male, 25 miles from us, shot his grandfather 21 times and stabbed his grandmother 17 times last Saturday. Both of them had expressed their fear of him to other relatives.
With the average school having enrollments in the thousands now, who will protect the rights and safety of the majority from the 25, 50, or 100 bullies?
The death of this beautiful, young woman is tragic!
It won’t solve the problem entirely, but those with knowledge of what is going on need to highlight it for as long as it takes!

Solara 9,

As a Coloradoan, we have been totally immersed in the Columbine story.  The Rocky Mountain News (which is no longer published) did a great in depth report about the whole thing a few years after the fact in order to cover all the findings. 

When the story first came out there was the general belief that these two boys had been bullied.  And sudents in many of the other (there are about 20) Jefferson County highs schools empathized with that, because bullying does occur.  But the actual facts do not support the idea that these two were bullied.  I think Eric Harris was a definite narcissistic psychopath (or sociopath ?) while Dylan Klebold suffered some depression and was easily led by Harris.  It was one of those cases where the meeting and then friendship of those two personalities just created a sort of strange “entity” that was dangerous.  There are several notorious cases of just that happening, where alone each might not have become that dangerous but combined they were terrible dangerous.

Now, having taught in Jefferson Couny for many years, and knowing a little about the Columbine area, I would guess there was a great deal of bullying going on, more related to sports jocks and/or class distinction, etc.