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FlipFlopFlipFlop: Obama on Troop Surge! [Updated]

By NancyA on September 6, 2008 at 8:45 AM in Arugula (Elitism), Barack Obama, Current Affairs, Flip Flopping, Foreign Policy, Fox News, Iraq, Obama

[UPDATE FROM LARRY JOHNSON--Great Piece by Nancy. I've inserted the clip of what Barack told O'Reilly. Barack has a problem. He now insists no one envisioned the surge success. Nope. Wrong. McCain staked that position out early on and reaps the benefit.]

flip.jpgObama flipped on the troop surge again or is it again? Can we count the flips, I’ve lost count? I will tell you this, we decorated flip flops on the way to Denver, writing all of Obama’s flips on them, we ran out of room! Sorry no more flip flops to spare! I have no idea how many times he flipped but here goes in his own words,

Earlier Thursday, in taping a segment for Fox’s “O’Reilly Factor,” Obama said the surge of U.S. troops has “succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.”

But back in July, Fox News reported that Obama downplayed the troop surge. Here is what Obama said on the troop surge (in my opinion he is dissing the troops and their commanders.) back when? July….2007, 2008

…he (Obama) credits the surge with helping to reduce violence in Iraq it “doesn’t meet our long-term strategic goal.” (What is the long term goal Obama?)

Asked about that comment, Obama said in his latest interview with CBS News that “there’s no doubt” spending billions a month in Iraq and sending extra troops will “have an impact.”

“But it doesn’t meet our long-term strategic goal, which is to make the American people safer over the long term,” he said, repeating his argument that the resources spent in Iraq are detracting from U.S. efforts in Afghanistan.

And then Obama said this….

…”the argument was and continues to be: When are we going to turn over responsibility to the Iraqis for their own country? When are they going to resolve their political differences?”

That will happen when he (When who is president, McCain?) is president, Obama said, “because we are going to withdraw our troops” and, while giving Iraqis support, “we are going to bring this war to a close.” (Does that mean we are going to win the “war” or cut and run like we have done so many times before?)

You’re killing me Obama…..I am laughing so hard my ribs are killing me! We have already turned over 11 regions, the latest Anbar!

Here’s the exchange with O’Reilly:

Doesn’t Obama read the papers? (Ahem! the sound bite I saw of the O’Reilly interview didn’t mention this change!) It was recently reported that the Anbar Region in Iraq has been turned over to the Iraqis….yes you heard me right….Anbar Region is now under control of the Iraqis. Here is more news from The Christian Science Monitor on that milestone for the region.

The US military handed over control of Anbar Province Monday, marking a significant milestone in the Iraq war.

Anbar was the deadliest Iraqi province for US troops, with nearly 1 in every 3 Americans killed there. It was once the symbol of Sunni resistance, the base of operations for Al Qaeda, and home to two major US military offensives and the most intense urban combat of the war.

But in the past two years, Anbar has emerged as the symbol of a turnaround as Sunni sheikhs formed “Awakening Councils,” ousted Al Qaeda, and created community police forces.

Anbar is the 11th of Iraq’s 18 provinces to return to Iraqi control, but it is the first predominately Sunni province handed over.

Where in the hell has Obama been? I know campaigning….the same excuse he used for not holding one hearing on Afghanistan!

Wake up and smell the coffee…stop eating the arugula and actually read the papers on the table next to you when you ride in that big plane of yours! You might just learn a thing or two!

Oh! Yeah right! I forgot you told that guy in Britain that you will need time off as president so you can think! And so far that has escaped…..you!

  • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

    That is not the surge i knew…

    a. hillary
    b. mccain

    america first!

    • Leisa

      Obama: the Hip Hop, Flip Flopper…

      • http://www.youtube.com/user/PaulFVillarreal Paul F. Villarreal

        Senator Inhofe thinks another Obama flip flop, that of the flag pin, is going to help contribute to Obama’s impending loss in November:

        http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectID=13&articleID=20080906_11_A1_STPAUL227187

        “Do you really want to have a guy as commander in chief of this country when you can question whether or not he really loves his country?” he asked.

        “That’s the big question.”

        It is a very real and legitimate question, and the recent revelation of Obama’s close ties with yet another radical figure, Khalid al-Mansour…

        http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/obama_sutton_saudi/2008/09/03/127490.html

        …is only going to stoke the flames of doubt among many that he is, in fact, The Manchurian Candidate.

        More about Khalid al-Mansour:

        http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/khalid_al_mansour/2008/09/04/127844.html

        ‘His life story could have been written as a Horatio Alger-style rise from rags to riches. He sees himself as something of the “return of Antar,” a mythical black poet-warrior of pre-Islamic times. His real-life exploits range from a surprise one-on-one meeting with the prime minister of India as a college student to mentoring Black Panthers’ founders Huey Newton and Bobby Seale in the early 1960s.’

        As we approach this crucial election, figures such as al-Mansour, Bill Ayers, Rev. Wright, Frank Marshall Davis and many more absolutely MUST receive the focus they deserve. Obama will balk at such vetting, but we cannot be deterred. This is not an application for dog catcher, it is about who is in charge of defending our nation from the kinds of terrorists that Rev Wright all but celebrated 5 days after 9/11.

        This is about whose hand is on ‘The Button.’

        I don’t care what anyone says or who feels that it is time for a ‘symbol’ president, this man scares the heck out of me and I do not want him, in any way, as my Commander in Chief. I do not trust him to protect me, my family or this country.

        NObama.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/PaulFVillarreal Paul F. Villarreal

          Please contact Sen. Inhofe and tell him you support his giving voice to questions which numerous Americans feel but may be reluctant to voice:

          http://www.inhofe.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Contact.ContactForm

          • Fuck you Barack Obama!

            Sending Sen. Inhofe as case of troll repellent. He will need it since he will be getting a salvo of hate male from koolaid drunk trolls for speaking the truth.

            • http://www.youtube.com/user/PaulFVillarreal Paul F. Villarreal

              Amen, great work!

              Thanks, Fuck You Barack Obama!

              ;)

        • Flipper Slippers

          Khalid al-Mansour is just freaky. He’s a feeble minded nitwit.

    • Steve-O

      touché :-)

  • John

    Just to be clear: to be Pro-Hillary and determined NOT to vote for Obama (as I am,) is it required that I do all of the following?:)

    1. Embrace the surge?
    2. Constantly refer to liberals as “Marxists?”
    3. Call Ted Kennedy a murderer?
    4. Work for the defeat of John Kerry and other Democrats?
    5. Contribute to and vote for the McCain-Palin campaign?
    6. Endorse drilling in the ANWAR, off the coasts of Florida and California, and everywhere else?
    7. Embrace the “pro-life” philosophy?
    8. Refer to global warming as a left-wing Marxist Myth?

    In other words, because Hillary was denied (I believe, fraudulently) the nomination, does that mean I’m supposed to become a fundamentalist right-winger with a brand new set of beliefs and principles now?

    Just asking.

    • cpl

      Independent thinkers generally do what they think to be right regardless of what others may think. As for myself I voted for Hillary, but she seems to have compromised her own principles. While campaigning she said all Obama would bring to the white house was a speech. But now she has chosen to endorse and campaign for Obama. Hypocracey is not a new set of principles but rather no principles at all. That is the hope and change the democratic party is now projecting.

      • ritamary

        Hillary is a politician and if she wants party support in the future then she has to back the party candidate now. She does not have any choice in the matter. Stop criticizing her. She has enough troubles.

        • Fuck you Barack Obama!

          A lot of the talk lately critical of Hillary is legitimate but a lot is also troll spew. As usual the trolls will overplay their hand. The whitey tape being a prime example. The actual Hillary supporters are venting because they are rightfully upset.

      • Flipper Slippers

        Watch who you call a hypocrite.

    • Mamatx

      Please don’t! Even those of us who consider ourselves Republicans don’t like the fundamentalist right-wingers. They did to our party 8 years ago what the Obama thugs are doing to the Dems this year–took over and threw reason and moderation out the window.

      • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

        The Religious Right hasn’t been in control of anything for a while. It’s been a action-filled decade so I could be wrong.. so if I am let me know how.

        • Mamatx

          I think that depends upon where you are. Tom DeLay used to be my congressman. The religious right took over early in that area and still has more sway there than in most places. Many of those die hards still think DeLay was a good guy….

          DUMB………..

          Both parties need to clean house. Hopefully this election will begin that process.

          • Fuck you Barack Obama!

            The extremist right wingers are out of power. Now we have extremist left wingers trying to gain power. Both extremes suck and need to be stopped. At our heart America craves the middle and common sense solutions. Not a bunch of rabid crazy power hungry assholes.

          • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

            ok i can see that.

            I had DeLay in the “Incumbancy Betrayer” bucket.

            not to say he couldn’t be both.

            I look back and shake my head at how stupid the Republicans were.

            And now we got Pelosi ugh

            I have two ideas to reform govt.

            1 – Require all Congressional districts to be as square as possible

            2 – Repeal the XVII amendment ,and put the States back in control of the Senate.

      • McKatmoon

        Mamatx,

        I agree, and I saw what happened with the Republicans, and see it with the Democrats now, no longer one of the party, myself; Many know this.
        There isn’t need for division for the voters who are voting for our country as a whole, and know we see through what is happening to the democratic party. I don’t serve the politician, they are suppose to serve us, we are the employers, and I will gladly join ranks with others who feel the same way, regardless of party affiliation. We need to stand up for ourselves, we aren’t children and we also need to think for ourselves, especially when a party changes the definition of what it is.

        • JoseyJ

          Sen. MBNA Biden’s real estate deals! Yikes!
          ABC News does good reporting – online – but rarely reveals anything negative about Obama on TV.

          http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/questions-about.html?cid=129388828#comment-129388828

          Also Biden pushed the 2005 Bankruptcy bill that benefitted MBNA and other credit card companies!
          AND Obama voted against capping credit card interest rates! he didn’t care how high they were.
          Hmm….did the Establishment also promise the VP to Biden?

    • Lark

      I think it means working with your congressman/woman, and state senator to move in the direction you like. The way you think and what you say to others should be your own very particular way. That is what representative government and freedom is all about.

      • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

        They don’t listen.

        I asked them to get the Detoit Mayor out, they kept silent. I asked them to drill, they told me to inflate my tires. I wanted my vote to count but they moved up my primary. I voted for Hillary but they gave it to Bambi.

        • Lark

          They listen to reason and they listen to the cumulative voice. You add your voice to other voices and you come up with the right reasons. Usually they write down a good reason and they think about it.

          • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

            Like after 6 months of silence, when the mayor was about to be sent to jail, Obama told him it was time to go. Not before. Nor did any of our other politicians. You know, the ones that moved up the primaries.

            The only time they listen is when they think they will be voted out of office and have to get real jobs. Solely self-interest.

            I want to vote for someone in my state who has guts to stand up for something that may not be popular, but who will convince me they are right. Someone with the courage of their convictions who has something in the pit of their stomach telling them what is right and what is wrong. I have no politicians in my state like that but I hope that this year we will start a new trend. Reform. Get the bums out from both parties.

            • JoseyJ

              How Kilpatrick’s fall hurts Obama –
              http://www.newsweek.com/id/157274

              btw – I don’t understand why Kilpatrick blames the governor of MI for his fall.

              • ritamary

                Thanks for posting that Newsweek article. I had stopped reading it for several months now.

                Kilpatrick blames the governor for his problems as an explanation for those who choose to believe racism is the reason for his downfall. He won’t take responsibility for what he has done and cries racism as an excuse. This is such a familiar tactic to those of us who read NQ regularly.

              • Flipper Slippers

                Uh – because she’s a WOMAN?

          • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

            My Congressman (D-IL-3) is a slave of Nancy Pelosi.

            He’s another member of the Democratic Machine. His father was congressman forever, and then one year, he ran for reelection, and then won.. but decided to retire before the session started, and the Party selected his son to replace him.. they do this all time. Obama’s political mentor, Emil Jones has just done so with his Senate seat.

            Cook County President Todd Stroger did the same thing.. and then when his son ran for reelection. barely won, and the day after the election announced he had prostate cancer.

            If people wren’t so tied down to work and family they would burn the govt down here.

            • Flipper Slippers

              Good old Emil Jones also put Obama’s name on a bunch of bills Obama had never seen.

    • Tuppence 411

      John, I can only share with you my perspective. I loved the Democratic Party. At one time it stood for everything I believed in and fought for. I no longer recognize it. It is not my party. A do nothing Congress sitting by while America suffers. Squandering their majority with spin and misleading rhetoric. Selecting and promoting a false prophet as our nominee.

      I want to re-build the Democratic Party. Set it back on a firm foundation. Restore it. The first step of rehabilitation is demolition. I am not afraid to tear down the parts that are condemned and unfit.

      • Mamatx

        I could say the same thing about the Republicans.

        That saying that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely is SO true!

        • Mr. Natural

          Nice to see a Republican and a Democrat keeping those lines of communication open – and friendly.

        • getfitnow

          Rebuilding–looks like the GOP is light years ahead of the Dems.

    • Leisa

      John,

      Bill Clinton said:

      Suppose for example you’re a voter and you have candidate X and you have candidate Y,” Clinton said. “Candidate X agrees with you on everything but you don’t think that person can deliver on anything. Candidate Y disagrees with you on half the issues but you believe that on the other half, the candidate will be able to deliver. For whom will you vote?

      This is not about absolutes and conforming. This is about doing what is right for our country and to bring democracy back to our party. I will not condone the corruption that has been inspired by the idea of Obama.

      I believe in the right to choose.
      I believe in individual liberties as long as they are not hurting the common good.
      I believe in transparency in government.
      I believe that politicians that stop working for the people and serve their own petty self interests should not be working for the people.

      I believe that Obama does not walk his talk, his past actions confirm that he is not a man of his word. He has no firm convictions and he was willing to win under dubious means… How can he stand infront of us and credibly say he is anti-corruption?

      I will not vote for him, and I will be sure to support any cause to clean up Washington.

      • JoseyJ

        Obama said he would fire anyone in his campaign that attacked Palin’s family.
        What about for attacking Palin’s parenting?

        Obama Campaign National Finance Committee Member Criticizes Palin’s Parenting
        September 05, 2008 9:27 PM

        On the Laura Ingraham Radio show, Friday, attorney Howard Gutman — an original member of the national finance committee for Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill. — very directly criticized the parenting of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

        http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/obama-campaign.html

      • Flipper Slippers

        I will not condone the corruption that has been inspired by the idea of Obama.

        That’s the key issue. That’s now the key issue of this entire campaign.

    • Kate

      “In other words, because Hillary was denied (I believe, fraudulently) the nomination, does that mean I’m supposed to become a fundamentalist right-winger with a brand new set of beliefs and principles now?”

      Seems so.

      Makes me reassess things, personally. I guess a lot of neocons have a lot invested in dissatisfied Hillary supporters swinging to their side.

      Not likely. (Considering Hillary’s positions and theirs are diametrically opposed.)

      At least not for this former Hillary supporter.

      This site has become totally useless. And I also question that Larry is still Larry.

      • Heather

        Go to Talk Left if you don’t like it here. Quite a range of voices.

      • Leisa

        Who are you Kate?

        This site is not moderated as much as others, and yes, we have republicans commenting here. Many are up front about who they are, some are not.

        Your accusations are very troll worthy.

        Polarity in thinking serves no one. We are all Americans, and I know many decent people that, gasp, happen to be republicans. Guess what, they were Hillary supporters too.

        Did you know that just because someone has an R by their name they are not automatically fundamentalist Christians and pro-life?

        I am not going to be swayed by arguments such as yours.

        • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

          Thanks for defending us infidels. (Conservative ex-Republican)

        • http://noquarter Pinay 46

          I agree with you 100%, Leisa.

        • Mamatx

          Thanks Leisa,

          Why does the ultra left think that just because I believe something is right for me (religion, not choosing an abortion) that I am going to push it on them? Yes, the ultra right wing of the party is that way, but the ultra left pushes their ideology on all also.

          Most Dems and most Repubs are closer to the middle. I may support smaller government (and that for me means not in my bedroom!) and you might support more government programs, but other than that, what is so frightening about “the other side”????

        • I Like Middleclassness

          Did you know that just because someone has an R by their name they are not automatically fundamentalist Christians and pro-life?

          Rudy Giuliani, Mayor Bloomberg, Olympia Snowe,Arlen Specter, just a few Republicans who don’t fit that profile. I don’t even know where I fit in that spectrum, but I was this close to registering as an Indy cause I was sick of both parties.

          But I stayed Republican, just because it teed off some of my way leftie friends. ;-)

      • candymarl

        Well Kate what about”liberals” that attacked Sarah Palin for not being a stay-at-home mom?

        How about the ones that attacked her infant son as not hers and implied he was a product of incest?

        How about so-called pro-choice liberals sneering at Plain’s daughter’s choice to keep her child?

        How about the implication, spread by so-called liberals, that Sarah Palin must have had an affair w/her hubby’s business partner because he wanted his divorce records sealed?

        Those types of attacks are as vicious and nasty as anything the RW dishes out. Except this time they came from the so-called left.

        • candymarl

          “Palin’s daughter”.

        • Kate

          So?

          Sounds like things Republicans said about Hillary for years and years.

          Your point being?

          Yes, media and society are sexist. That is correct.

          But you don’t correct sexism by voting for someone, woman or man, who holds sexist positions (anti-choice, against sex education, against equal pay).

          • destardi

            “so.”

            That right there pretty much sums it all up, people.

            “so.”

            “So” let obama defend himself and get exposed for who he is.

            “So” who cares if democrats morph into republicans before our very eyes, just for a power grab.

            “So” who cares if democrats have lost all moral authority in their transformation.

            “So” I’m a HIllary supporter voting for McCain/Palin.

          • Julia

            Yes and you don’t correct sexism by voting for someone, woman or man, who spreads and keeps the sexism while running his campaign like Obama has done. This is essentially undemocratic.

      • Flipper Slippers

        Then don’t come here. But you’re right: Larry is no longer Larry. Now he’s Larry instead.

    • Heather

      Absolutely not. Some folks’ enthusiasm for sticking it to Obama has bubbled over. I have to say I share that enthusiasm to a large degree: anyone BUT Obama is my view. One thing that has happened is that the dirty politics and misogynism of the Democratic party have forced some of us to re-evaluate our allegiances. Do we want a pro-choice president who appears to dismiss and revile women? Or a pro-life president who appears to respect women? These are not easy choices and we’re all just trying to find our way.

      • Observer

        Some people are held hostage to a PARTY. I watched Geraldine Ferrer, after being branded by Obama as a racist, slowly fall back to her PARTY. How cowardly & gutless to be owned in such a way. Thanks to men like John McCain who does what he believes in regardless of how his party or any other party feels. Get to know yourself & most of all get some backbone. You’ll never find a PARTY or nominee who shares all your beliefs so you need the guts to think for yourself & vote for the person YOU can TRUST. You must decide which is more important, voting for a man who can run the country & keep you safe or a man who is friends with terrorist & thugs.

        • Heather

          As I read your words, I realized that for a career politician, PARTY must be a lot like family, workplace, and community. All rolled into one. Imagine being banished from every group you belong to?

        • MOmule

          Observer – That’s totally unfair. Ferraro had the guts to speak out which very few did. In what way is she cowardly and gutless? It takes a lot more courage to stay than to pick up your marbles and push off.
          Did it occur to you that she stays in the Dems because she believes in what the party is supposed to be and intends to keep on trying to move it back? (Like Hillary?).It would do absolutely no good if people deserted permanently. That way we would end up with one major party and where would that get us? As the Lib Dems in UK can tell you it is extremely difficult to create a new party and become strong enough to influence let alone win elections.
          Ferraro is still another pol I wouldn’t trust as far as I could throw her (like the rest). But she has some intestinal fortitude for saying the unpopular when she could have just kept quiet. And I for one give her a gold star for that.

      • Flipper Slippers

        Clean out the corruption first. You have to clean out the corruption to restore the discussion. Remember when Bill said it would be cool if people could just discuss the issues? Remember who intentionally got in the way? That’s the first step. After that you can discuss issues again. It puts everybody back by four years but no one in their wildest dreams saw what Obama was going to do to corrupt politics.

    • Jackie

      No one is asking you to give up what you believe. Having your opinion in the mix is vital to having a balanced government.

      The troop surge was necessary to bring about a situation in which we can draw down our troops in a manner safe for us and the Iraqis. That is simply responsible troop management.

      I want you to support a good dem congress. We need to get rid of corruption is both parties.

      McCain/Palin will help get us there. I want the “old progressive DNC” back not the extreemist no clear adgenda just not them party.

      It is time that We the American People take back the dialog.

      • Flipper Slippers

        It is time that We the American People take back the dialog.

        Hear hear.

    • http://www.lostinspacetv.com/ The Robot

      No.

    • PhxNickD

      You know not every Democrat (or Republican for that matter) believe in every thing someone else in their party stands for. This week after weeks of looking at all the issues together I realized I am more Republican then Democrat. Country First!

    • Monet

      John asks: “In other words, because Hillary was denied (I believe, fraudulently) the nomination, does that mean I’m supposed to become a fundamentalist right-winger with a brand new set of beliefs and principles now?”

      I hope not. I know I’m not planning to change my moderate and liberal views to keep Senator Obama out of the White House.

      I still think it was absolutely wrong to invade Iraq and believed it was mistake at the time of the invasion. I have always thought once we were in, we couldn’t leave until Iraq had a stable government that couldn’t be taken over by extremists. There was a stable government (not a nice one, but the country wasn’t led by Muslim extremists) before we invaded and we have to leave a better government than we found when we pull out most of our troops. Regardless of who is president, we are going to establish permanent military bases in Iraq like we have in Japan, Germany, Italy, Cuba, etc.. and anyone who thinks we aren’t, is in fairy tale land. The quicker we establish a stable nation, the better it will be for us and the surge appears to be the only way to do it. I reluctantly support the surge, because it’s long past time of correcting our mistake of invading Iraq by establishing a secure and stable government and ending our occupation.

      I’m tired of hearing liberals are Marxists too. Most liberals more than likely read Karl Marx in college. If you take enough Poli. Sci and Sociology classes, sooner or later you end up reading him, along with Lenin and Mao. Big deal. College is about expanding your horizons, learning about different ideologies. Senator Obama may have been weaned on Marx, but in a technological age and global economy, it’s a mute point. Marxism is now a quaint ideology that is as likely to make a comeback as the Conestoga wagon for cross country moving.

      I don’t understand why Ted Kennedy is supporting Senator Obama. My guess is he finds him to be an earnest politican and believes it’s time to reshape the Democratic party. I find Senator Obama to be earnest too, but I also think he’s very naive and hasn’t worked hard enough to understand his ideas need buffering, that we live in the real world, not the utopia Obama wants us to be. I disagree with Senator Kennedy that Senator Obama is ready for the Office of President. I see no reason to attack Senator Kennedy because I disagree with him and think he has taken a misstep, he has a career in the Senate that I respect.

      I tend to think the DNC has given Senator Kerry a lobotomy. Maybe I didn’t listen well enough to him four years ago, but the senator today is not the one I remember. He’s not my senator so I’ll leave it up to the voters of Massachusetts to decide if it’s time for him to retire. As for other Democrats, I could do without Nancy Pelosi. In my own state, I’m not going to vote Carl Levin out of office. I’m iffy about Bart Stupak, but I’ve had issues with him for quite a while which have nothing to do with his support of Senator Obama. It’s up in the air for me right now as to whether I’ll vote for him. Anyway, I’m not going to jump on any bandwagon to knock every Democrat out of Congress.

      My intention is to vote Senator McCain. Between the two candidates we’ve been given, I think Senator McCain will do less harm. I live in a swing state, voting third party, writing in Hillary Clinton or abstaining is a vote for Senator Obama. I have to do what I can to make sure in a close race in this state that the electoral votes don’t go to Senator Obama, that means putting aside my political orientation and voting for Senator McCain in this election.

      So far, I haven’t gotten on the Governor Palin bandwagon. I’m pleased there is a woman on a party ticket, I’m happy she has people flocking to McCain’s rallies and I don’t care about how she plans to juggle her career and her family. That’s her concern, not mine. Her children and their issues are none of my concern. I am leery about her career as a mayor and governor, I don’t believe she’s the paragon of wonderfulness we’re being led to believe. I don’t think she’s ready to be president, but since she’s in the vice president slot, it’s not an issue for me. I disagree with her on just about every issue and would have a problem with supporting her for president, she’s too far to the right. The reservations I have concerning Governor Palin won’t prevent me from voting for Senator McCain.

      I’m against drilling in ANWR. I don’t see myself changing that view. Opening new territory for offshore drilling isn’t sitting well with me either. We have million of acres set aside for drilling that aren’t being utilized and I think those acres need to be exhausted first or taken off the drilling reserve land first. If the majority of Americans want to drill, it doesn’t matter who is president, drilling there will be.

      Voting for McCain will not have me changing my position on pro-choice. Nor will I be scared into voting for Obama by threats that McCain will ban abortion. I don’t see McCain having a social agenda for the next four years. Maybe he’s hoodwinking me, but I think he plans to concentrate on the economy, energy, international relations and national security. Same sex marriage, abortion, health insurance, etc…, just don’t appear to be on his agenda. I think it’s up to states and churches to decide if they want to marry same sex couples. It would be nice if the Federal government would support the decisions of states and churches who decide they want to marry people of the same sex, but you can’t have everything. As for health insurance, I don’t think Obama’s plan for national coverage is going to work any better than no national coverage.

      While I’m confused about Governor Palin’s stance on Global Warming (I think her opinion is based on what brings the most money to Alaska), McCain appears to have a good grasp on it and doesn’t believe it’s a Marxist myth.

      So no, voting against Senator Obama in this election and pushing a chad for Senator McCain, isn’t going to change my political views and turn me into a right wing fundamentalist, sporting Moral Majority buttons from the 1980′s on my clothes. I’m going to hold strong to my political beliefs and keep a watchful eye on Governor Palin. I just hope her celeb of the day light doesn’t burn out before November. After that, hopefully it dims before 2012. As for Senator McCain, what we see and hear from him is what I think we’ll get in the White House. I doubt there will be any surprises and his career in Congress indicates he tends to be more moderate than conservative. I can settle with that for four years and keep my fingers crossed that Senator Clinton runs again in 2012.

      • JozefAL

        My intention is to vote Senator McCain. Between the two candidates we’ve been given, I think Senator McCain will do less harm. I live in a swing state, voting third party, writing in Hillary Clinton or abstaining is a vote for Senator Obama. I have to do what I can to make sure in a close race in this state that the electoral votes don’t go to Senator Obama, that means putting aside my political orientation and voting for Senator McCain in this election.

        If your swing state is slightly leaning towards Obama, then voting third party is ALWAYS an option. If your swing state is slightly leaning towards McCain, then voting third party is ALWAYS an option.
        The fact that many people choose to ignore about third-party voting is that such votes work against the party that would normally get your vote, not against the party that you normally wouldn’t.
        Wallace attracted very few Republicans to his cause in 1968 even though he was really more conservative than Nixon, but he peeled off enough Democrats (especially in the South) that the Democrats lost the White House.
        In 1992, Perot may have attracted some Democrats from Clinton, but took far more Republicans from Bush (as well as attracted many people who were previously apathetic towards politics).
        And, of course, in 2000, Nader and Buchanan caused many races to be much closer than they should have been and Nader cost Gore far more votes than Buchanan did Bush. Granted, in most cases neither Bush nor Gore would have gained (or lost) any states from the Nader/Buchanan factor, but the Gore and Bush wins would have not been nearly as close. The Gore margin of victory in Wisconsin, Oregon and Ohio was less than 10000 votes each; in Wisconsin more than 100,000 people voted for Nader or Buchanan, in Oregon over 84000 people did so, and in Ohio almost 145,000 people did (in Oregon, Nader led Buchanan by 10 to 1; in Wisconsin, it was almost 8 to 1; in Ohio, it was roughly 5 to 1).
        If you TRULY dislike the candidates of the “Big Two”, vote for a third-party (or write in a candidate’s name). Voting for a candidate you dislike less than the other candidate does nothing. A good number of Democrats felt that way in 2004, and we were rewarded with Barack Obama’s nomination this year. The whole electoral process needs to be changed to give the primary candidates a fair chance to be heard by ALL the voters, not just the lucky ones who get to vote in January. Don’t forget that among the Dems, only Hillary and Obama were still officially in the running on February 1st. Out of 8 candidates on January 1st, we were down to just two, one month later–after just FOUR states had their official say. (Granted most of the other candiddates’ names generally stayed on the ballots in the other 46 states and DC plus the territories, but it was really down to just two “real” candidates. The others were seen as having no chance.)
        If the parties would just tell Iowa and New Hampshire to get over themselves, the process would go much more easily. Rotate the primaries by region, allow some of the electoral-rich states to vote earlier (make the smaller states the real battlegrounds by forcing candidates who have “big-state appeal” work harder in the smaller states–the winner in California might not appeal to the voters in Iowa or Mississippi while a 2nd or even 3rd place candidate could sweep those states). If Iowa insists on holding its caucuses first but doing so would violate the DNC/RNC rules, punish the state according to the stated rules. (I would advocate an end to the whole caucus system except for the geographically and population-wise small states; of course, most of those states hold primaries.)

        • Monet

          “If your swing state is slightly leaning towards Obama, then voting third party is ALWAYS an option. If your swing state is slightly leaning towards McCain, then voting third party is ALWAYS an option.”

          Not as far as I’m concerned, it is not an option. I want my vote to count and what I want it to count as in this election is a vote against the fraud within the DNC. Sure, I can vote third party, abstain, write in Senator Clinton in protest. Guess what, no one will care, no party is going to take notice and make changes. However, if McCain wins the White House when everything points that a Republican shouldn’t be able to win this election even if there isn’t an opponent, both parties will take notice.

          My state swung towards Kerry in the last election by 85k. My vote will count this November. I’m not going to give it to a third party, I’m going to do my best to swing the state Republican. I don’t think in this election I have the luxury of a protest vote. If Senator Obama wins the electoral votes in my state but only does so by 5k, both parties will notice. You’re right, they’ll notice if the defecting Democrats vote third party, but they won’t give it as much significance as that 80k voting Republican will. They know they’ll probably pull those third party votes back in the next election, but they can’t be as sure when Democrats go Republican or Republicans go Democrat.

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      You own your vote. I own mine. For the first time in my voting history, I will not vote for any Democrat in this election. But, hey that’s just me. Do as you wish. No hard feelings. I got over it.

    • http://lesstalkmoreactivism.blogspot.com/ whoframedrudy

      “because Hillary was denied (I believe, fraudulently) the nomination, does that mean I’m supposed to become a fundamentalist right-winger with a brand new set of beliefs and principles now? Just asking.”

      There’s no such thing as a stupid question. The answer is no, to all of the above. And to be an Obama supporter, one did not have to:

      1. call Hillary ‘really a Republican’
      2. call the Clintons racist
      3. ignore the lessons of ‘Animal Farm’
      4. believe John Edwards’ bullshit apology for his Iraq War Vote
      5. ignore John Edwards’ two-faced war-mongering at the Israeli Security Conference
      6. attack Hillary like she was Karl Rove
      7. make excuses for Obama’s flip-flop on FISA, etc.
      8. make fun of McCain’s suffering as a POW, the reason he opposes torture
      9. pretend Kerry never asked McCain to be his V.P., and Kennedy never asked McCain to switch parties, and McCain never bucked the ultra-right on immigration, and McCain never worked with Russ Feingold on campaign finance reform
      10. try to scare Americans that we might end up with a woman President if McCain is elected.

    • HB

      Just to be clear: Yes

  • cpl

    The republicans always said “the reason we are fighting in Iraq is so we don’t have to fight them here”, which was a crock. But now if the dems have their way and Obama should win the general election I think we may very well be fighting “THEM” here.

    • Irish1139

      You got it. That is the ultimate goal.

  • katmandu

    Another rumor debunked — Andrew “I don’t like women very much” Sullivan’s advancement of the rumor that because Todd Palin’s business partner wanted to have his divorce papers sealed, it might mean Palin was involved in something untoward.

    Sorry for the description, but that’s how ludicrous the rumor mill has been

    Here’s the debunking link: http://hotair.com/archives/2008/09/05/another-palin-smear-bites-the-dust/

  • The surge

    My dad served his country in WWII, earning a Purple Heart from the physical injuries sustained there. Perhaps the deeper wounds he suffered were carried within his heart. Today as his Alzheimer’s Disease advances, we are just now reliving with him the deep pain he felt while serving his country as his platoon buddies died in his arms. He hid the stories my entire life, but now I know more about the ugliness of war as he recalls those memories as if they happened just yesterday. No one likes war, but sometimes there is no other way but to stand up and fight. At least when my dad returned home, he returned to a grateful country who treated him and his service with the honor he so much deserved.

    I guess I’m old because I remember the tumultuous 60′s. I remember the hippy generation and the anti-war movement. I remember my mother crying at the kitchen table for not only my brother, who was in Vietnam, but those POW’s. I thought those who were serving were heroes and thought that everyone did–my mother surely instilled that in me. I remember my brother sending us letters and how often we read them until he could come home. Then one day my brother was to come home on leave and we all packed into the car to greet him at the airport. I was so proud that I had a brother who believed in his country and who was willing to shed his blood and never had any doubt that others felt the same way. Until—my brother walked through those gates and I witnessed what happened as my brother, wearing his uniform, arrived home from that commercial flight. Yes, he was spat upon. I will never forget that moment, when my sheer happiness quickly turned to fear and anger as the hatred of my brothers generation fell on him before my very eyes. No one can tell me what did and did not happen and I am shocked at the mere denial.

    When John McCain delivered his acceptance speech Thursday, I recollected a time in my life when integrity and service were more than just words. The men and women who are willing to serve their country deserve our respect, our pride, our unflinching defense and our unwaivering support while they remain in harms way and to return home in honor. Thank God John McCain stood by the surge that won them their military victory.

    • Mamatx

      Thank you for your story. I had many friends from high schoolcollege who went to Nam. Many never came back. My brother in law served in the Marines there. He almost never talks about it even today. He did journey to Viet Nam about 5 years ago and it seemed to help him heal a bit.

      The idea that our young men and women could voluntarily sacrifice themselves for our country and then be mistreated by “peace activists” enrages me. It has not happened as often as it did during Viet Nam, but some of our Iraq and Afghanistan vets have also been disrespected by war protesters. That should NEVER happen!

      • cpl

        I had a lot of friends who never made it back from that country . As a matter of fact almost an entire company of Marines.

        • The surge

          So many of us. Thank you all for not mocking this story and for your input.

          It almost seems right fitting that a Vietnam war hero should defeat the likes of a William Ayers hugging big-talker like Obama.

          I will feel much better once I vote for a vietnam vet and a woman this year.

          • cpl

            My sentiments also. I keep saying I will vote for the man who actually fought the communists but certainly not for the man who chose to befriend the communists.

          • Irish1139

            I think too how hard both McCain and Cindy McCain have worked and given so much to their country. Cindy has been on so many medical missions and saved so many children and adults all over the world that she deserves to be first lady. What has Michelle ever done? Nada.

          • I Like Middleclassness

            When John McCain delivered his acceptance speech Thursday, I recollected a time in my life when integrity and service were more than just words.

            John McCain embodies what our country once stood for – honor, integrity, and service to a cause greater than self. When we elect him, it will be the last time our nation will have a President who is a direct link to the Greatest Generation and who comes from a proud military tradition. No chicken hawk, he.

            And I like his mom a lot.
            I read in Vogue that when Roberta McCain and her sister went to Europe, they were denied a rent-a-car due to their age…so they just bought one instead! And proceeded to tour around Europe on their own.

        • Mamatx

          It was not a good time. Sad too that politicians in Washington were using the war for political gain and tying the hands of our military leaders (deciding from their desks in DC what the rules of engagement should be) and IMHO that is what led to our defeat.

          I do not mean to belittle the loss of life in our current wars (all lives are precious and all service is to be honored), however, the younger generation does not seem to know that at the height of the Viet Nam war, US casualties were horrible. If memory serves, I think during the worst times we lost about 1,000 young soldiers per week! (Please correct if I am misstating)

    • katmandu

      Having lived through the 60′s myself — doesn’t it seem that the vitriol we are seeing in this campaign by a segment of the Democratic Party is reminiscent of the same type of uncivil behavior from the 60′s? This unbridled, irrational anger? It seems to be coming from the same personality type.

      I was a liberal teen in the 60′s. When I went to college and met SDS types I was appalled. I had grown up in a small town and had never seen people with violent personalities. You can see the violence tendencies in the words of many people over at Kos. There’s a way to protest and disagree — but it’s the way of Gandhi and MLK.

      Another thought. Jonathan Martin at Politico says that women on the Palin/McCain campaign trail are really enthusiastic. http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/0908/On_day_one_crowds_come_to_get_a_glimpse_of_Palin.html?showall Here’s my theory. A lot of people (incorrectly, IMO) perceived Hillary Clinton as cold and calculating — this was fed by the Republican attack machine. In any event, many people did not warm to Hillary. Palin seems more conventional — not a typical politician at all. And I think people may be attracted to her despite some of her positions (e.g., rigid positions on abortion).

      We’ll see. But right now, the Biden pick by Obama seems like a huge mistake.

      • Lark

        Huge and costly mistake. Every day more costly.

      • cpl

        Does it seem strange that the SDS was reintroduced at about the same time Obama became an US Senater?

        • Irish1139

          There is nothing strange about it. It is the SDS that gamed the caucases and ran all the Hillary people away from the polls. The whole democratic primary was a joke. Obama didn’t win.

      • Heather

        Yeah, and the violent anti-war leader of my own college campus went on to become an insurance salesman.

        Just sayin’

    • Mamatx

      Thank you for your story. I had many friends from high school/college who went to Nam. Many never came back. My brother in law served in the Marines there. He almost never talks about it even today. He did journey to Viet Nam about 5 years ago and it seemed to help him heal a bit.

      The idea that our young men and women could voluntarily sacrifice themselves for our country and then be mistreated by “peace activists” enrages me. It has not happened as often as it did during Viet Nam, but some of our Iraq and Afghanistan vets have also been disrespected by war protesters. That should NEVER happen!

    • Heather

      Funny, my dad started telling the gruesome side of war in his later years too. That generation sure knew how to clam up for 50-60 years didn’t they?

      • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

        I truly believe they were the greatest generation. The lived through the depression, they fought a war, the women built planes and war materials and painted lines, like hosiery, on the backs of their legs. They raised there children to have values and integrity and they tried to give them what they didn’t have.

    • Roninstia

      {The surge}

      • The surge

        {{Roninstia}}

        • Heather

          could you guys take your lovemaking elsewhere? This is a public place.

          ;>

    • John

      I just wonder where John McCain’s respect for his fellow veterans was when John Kerry was being mocked and ridiculed (remember the Purple Heart band-aids being worn at the 2004 GOP convention?) for HIS service.

      McCain was too busy supporting George Bush, the guy who called McCain’s daughter an “illegitimate black baby” during the South Carolina primary in 2000.

      Refusing to support Obama doesn’t make me an admirer of John McCain. It just makes me a person who refuses to support Obama.

      • street_parade

        In all fairness to McCain, he did defend Kerry in ’04. Like you, I’m not supporting either candidate this cycle and I also agree with your original post, not supporting Obama does NOT make me a supporter of RW bullshit.

        I think it is also fair to point out that there are a range of opinions on the Republican side that I was never willing to admit before the Democrats opened my eyes. Not all Repubs are right-wing nutjobs and even those that are very Conservative may have an occassional opinion I agree with. If nothing else, this debacle has made me a bit more open minded. BOTH political parties are in need of a detox!

    • http://www.lostinspacetv.com/ The Robot

      “Yes, he was spat upon.”

      May I ask, how did this occur? Were the spitters lined up in preparation for spitting, was it a stealth spitting from a passer-by?

      I’ve never heard a first hand account of hippys spitting on military men and it would help to set the record straight. If you could, please provide some detail. Thanks.

      • The surge

        No question it happened and I only recently learned it was ever denied. I just wonder, how is it possible that others do not know this? I can understand the 20-somethings but where are all the 40+ year olds?

        • http://www.lostinspacetv.com/ The Robot

          I hope the person or persons who spit were arrested for assault – especially spitting on an American in uniform in a public place, that couldn’t have been tolerated.

          • The surge

            Maybe since AIDS but not in the 60′s. I’m truly incredulous at the disbelief. This was COMMON, not uncommon.

      • Marigat

        You took the words right out of mouth. I might add, Did you personally see the spitting incident?

        • The surge

          Absolutely.

        • Marigat

          I’m 50 plus, by the way, daughter of a Navy pilot, raised on Navy bases during the war. Viet Nam was in my face. Never heard about spitting from anyone in the service, only from conservatives on TV complaining about hippies.

          • The surge

            Marigal and others.
            I googled. There are plenty of people who not only had it happen to them but admit doing it.

            I’m astonished that this part of the story is met with disbelief because this is the first time since elementary school I remember even bringing it up.

            http://dailypundit.com/?p=24230

            You can chose to believe me or not, however, this is becoming very frustrating and unexpectedly a topic which I thought was simply common knowledge.

            Apparently it was also documented by a book by Bob Greene from 1989.

            I cannot vouch for anyone elses specific stories, only my own–with my eyes as a little girl.

            This is sad. “Those who cannot remember the past, are condemned to repeat it.”

            • Ms. Misderweiner13

              I remember the past and this an utter fabrication.

              Might have happen one or two times, maybe.

              Nice Reactionary talking points Surgei.

              But I ain’t buying.

              • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

                Francis, is that you?

    • street_parade

      Surge, I do not support Obama in anyways but your story seems very much like a story. No one has ever come forward with a first-hand account of actually being spit on during that period….the spit-on stories have always been without substantiation, second-hand accounts.

      Actual dates, places and names would add authenticity to your claim. You are after all, making a pretty, horrible accusation against a person when you say they spit-on a fellow human. Even if the accused is anonymous.

      • The surge

        It would be nice, by roll call, to find out exactly how many people on this site really didn’t know this was true. Is it an age thing, a locale thing or what? I really just don’t understand and may need to google. If I had ever heard this questioned I would certainly have given a polygraph as would my mother and brother. How many people could possibly be mislead on the subject?

        • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

          Surge: I was very much at the center of the counter culture during the 60′s. I have heard this but never saw anyone spit on a soldier. For one thing, there was a draft. People did enlist but unless they were career soldiers, who would know? The people I was around were anti-war and very radical…detested LBJ for lying to us about the war and Nixon even more. But the soldiers? In Central California, we were pretty sympathetic for their plight…even though we would have preferred they resist…Canada or conscientious objector. Fort Ord was active and also the Big Sur Navel Station, Navy Postgraduate School and Defense Language Institute. We did socialize with military without condemnation. Peace, Love and Brown Rice, ya know. I can imagine that Berkeley might have been a bit different though.

          One of my friends did get conscientious status…was sent to Chicago to work in a children’s ward in a hospital there. He became a reborn Christian when he came back…very changed. I preferred not to know anyone’s draft status. It was a deeply personal choice. I lost friends in the 60′s more to drugs and alcohol than the war.

          I feel fortunate that my children grew up healthy and happy and so did I. Turbulent times.

          • The surge

            Thank you.

            I was still very young in the 60′s and cannot place the exact year but I think it would be about 1971 and in the metro Detroit airport. Detroit is relatively close to a well-known university that probably had war protests of its own so maybe the area was not represented of the whole country though I really thought so.

            My cousins planned on departing to Canada and I don’t know if they were ever drafted but I don’t remember them leaving. My brother had volunteered so that he could chose the branch that he served.

            The flight he arrived on was a commercial flight, probably from California since thats where he was stationed. He is still alive and I will ask him about it–until this day I had never brought up this subject. This is a more painful story for him then it is for me but I can assure you this whole topic has stirred up a lot of emotion for me too.

            I can tell you more about the times and the environment which was well into suburbia and I think there was a great deal of anti-war sentiment. There was a great deal of anti-war sentiment here that extended to people serving and many were treated with utter contempt. Even the old vets did not respect the service of those from vietnam–they “lost” (but I think we failed them).

            My recollection as a small kid, looking up at a lot of adults, is that there was nothing organized, just people waiting for loved ones from a plane.

            Now, I am not here to talk about the war, about vietnam, about spitting or any of that but I do not like being called a liar.

            No Bo, Mo or stumbling Jo….

            • street_parade

              Surge, of course there was a great deal of anti-war sentiment – there were 1/2 million American soldiers in the middle of civil war 10,000 miles away. There was a draft, there were over 50,000 American dead, over 2 million Vietnamese dead. The spitting stories were used by the right to stir up hate against the anti-war movement which was a wide-spread mass movement by the early ’70′s, not just a bunch of radicals – far from just a bunch of radicals in fact. If you say it happened then I’ll take your word for it. But understand where the spitting stories originated (from the rabid, right-wing) and that to date first hand accounts of NAMED soldiers who experienced it do not exist.

              • http://www.nysun.com/comments/11742 The surge

                But understand where the spitting stories originated (from the rabid, right-wing) and that to date first hand accounts of NAMED soldiers who experienced it do not exist.

                I have seen multiple sites with many names. Who is the ultimate authority that is claiming this didn’t happen?

                Oh, here is another link for another site…please scroll the comments.

      • Mr. Natural

        This story is probably an urban legend.

        http://www.slate.com/id/1005224/

        I was seventeen the year Vietnam was closed out. No one I knew did it or would have done it.

        The story never made a bit of sense. Who in their right mind would spit on a trained soldier?

        From the story I cited:

        Lastly, there are the parts of the spitting story up that don’t add up. Why does it always end with the protester spitting and the serviceman walking off in shame? Most servicemen would have given the spitters a mouthful of bloody Chiclets instead of turning the other cheek like Christ. At the very least, wouldn’t the altercations have resulted in assault and battery charges and produced a paper trail retrievable across the decades?

        Surge, you don’t need to milk the Vietnam tragedy. McCain can stand on his own merits.

  • John

    Obama claims the surge has succeeded “beyond anyone’s imagination”? Not so fast, Barry. Senator McCain based a large share of his national security credentials on saying, early and often, that the surge WOULD be successful. He staked his entire campaign on this. If the surge had failed, McCain would sure have a lot of “splainin” to do. Credit him for being correst about the surge a year ago. The failure of imagination was Obama’s when he underestimated what the US troops could accomplsh once Gen. Petraeus intitiated the needed changes in tactics to address a war that was headed in the wrong direction. Nothing separates McCain more from Bush than McCain’s recognition that change was needed there. McCain led the call for a troop surge when the rest of the Washington establishment was stuck on empty.

    • beebop

      And we know what Zeroman has based his campaign on …. convenience. And inconvenience. When his principeles become inconvenient, out they go, replaced by those which appear to garner more widespread acceptance …

    • Heather

      He also said “nobody expected it to work.” WHA? Obama is a man who is so egocentric that he just naturally believes that whatever he thinks, everyone else is thinking too. That’s stage 2 of moral development, typically completed by age 10 in the average human child.

    • Steven Mather

      John,

      Before video, lying was an a more effective propaganda tool (see Goebbels). This is an occasion where the lie you are trying to spread works against the Obama campaign because too many people have seen Obama say too many times, “In fact, it (the surge) will make things worse.”

      Why do you think that Obama is so good for the country that it is proper to lie to people so that he can get elected?

  • SlowBurn

    i now just ignore obama . . .he’s irrelevant

  • Mamatx

    We all know how to tell when Obama is lying–his lips are moving.

    But you know how to tell when he is about to tell a GIANT WHOPPER that contradicts everything he has said or done before?

    He begins: “Let me be perfectly clear….”

    or: “I have ALWAYS said….”

    • Tucson

      It is so true, isn’t it?

    • Steve1

      Is that why is lips turn purple? Wonder if that is a sign of illness or rugs? Interesting.

      • Steve1

        his, drugs

    • TeakwoodKite

      Also, the one where he starts with
      “The notion that I…”

      I just want BO to talk as much as possible about military affairs as he can. Just to include it in all the other issues that BO doesn’t know jack about.

  • blog force one

    This is truly cathartic! Mcain Palin, after getting elected will gut renovate the Republican party ending the old boys network that we have all hated so much! They will bring responsible accountable leadership and in the process this will allow us to gut renovate the Democratic party and throw Dean, Pelosi, Brazile & reed out on their sorry corrupt manipulation asses! a new dawn for both parties is coming1 Macain Palin ’08

    • Fred

      She even tried to get her own pay cut by $4000 a year when she was a mayor:

      Both in Illinois and in Washington, Obama has used his position to cosponsor legislation that rained millions of dollars upon Tony Rezko and his other major donors in the slum-development business, to obtain state grants for his private law clients, and to earmark funds for government contractors who donated money to his campaigns and even to his wife’s employer, which had just given her an annual $200,000 raise.

      By way of contrast, Mayor Palin once tried to get the Wasilla city council to cut her own pay, because she had opposed and voted against a $4,000 mayoral pay raise when she served on the council.

      link here

      • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

        wow!

        now that IS change i can believe in…

        amazing…

        ethics? morals? principles?

        they get my vote!!!!

        a. hillary
        b. mccain

        america first!

      • Fred

        If you want a good list of facts and debunked lies about Palin, go here:

        http://explorations.chasrmartin.com/2008/09/06/palin-rumors/

      • TeakwoodKite

        OT: Fred or anyone; How do you make “link here” work?

        Thanks…

        • Patrick Henry

          KITE..

          You give him a job in a “LINK” factory..

          ha Ha

    • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

      The republicans I know here in Chicago are so eager to have someone in Washington who is going to get the debt under control. That seems like everyone’s number one. And allowing drilling. That one sseems so simple to me. no-brainer. that takes one day of work for Congress to do.

      Can I ask you Dems.. a question..

      Why does it seem that you prefer to Federalize things that should properly belong at the STate Level.. is that a legacy from the Civil Rights era?

      I ask because it seems that the more the Federal Govt gets involved with, the larger it becomes, the costlier it gets, the more unmanagable it gets, but also.. the harder it is for all of us to have a vision of its mission that is compatable with one another.

      i do distinguish the normal Dem. voter from the leadership. I dont think most Dems are anywhere near as ideological as the leadership.

      Us conservatives (as distinct from Republican politicians), oppoe the Fed. doing a lot of things because we think it voilates Federalism and the country is too big for one-size fits all stuff.

      Do you share that view ? i’m asking on the conceptual level… not so much in real-world.. because i want to avoid using the examples of what politicians did because that will derail into a political fight probably.

      • street_parade

        Vince,

        Given that the Republicans have been in charge of the Congress for 12 of the last 14 years and in charge of the White House for all but 12 of the last 40 YEARS your might want to ask the Republicans about the ever growing government. For the party of small government they sure have a taste for big spending.

      • Steve_in_KC

        Vince, to answer your question:
        Why does it seem that you prefer to Federalize things that should properly belong at the STate Level.. is that a legacy from the Civil Rights era?

        Here’s a detailed example. I was working for MediCare at the time they started the prescription drug benefit. What very few people realize(d) was that in funding this MediCare “benefit,” they took most of the money from MedicAid. MedicAid was run at the state level, with subsidies from the Federal government. I worked as a telephone advisor to people who called MediCare to find out how they could replace the medications they lost when MedicAid lost its funding base. MedicAid is for the poor, many of whom are handicapped or elderly.

        I had to quit the job after two months because it was making me, a big grown man, want to cry nearly every day. I took so many calls, day after day, from people who had just been dropped or sharply curtailed from MedicAid, and were being fed BS from the government that this new MediCare benefit was better for everyone. All they gained from the MediCare program was a bunch of “plans” offered by collusion, or partnerships, of drug manufacturers, insurance companies, and drug store chains.

        Now to address your question more directly, when left to the individual states, the states with a high tax base can afford to provide better MedicAid benefits than tax-poor states. So one result was a flood of calls from states like Mississippi, with callers actually weeping because they were elderly or handicapped, and had been on MedicAid to receive their medications, but now all they had were discount plans that only saved them an average of 15% off retail. And then, of course, the drug companies just started raising prices to offset the discounts.

        These people had necessary medications that were prescribed to them, but no help from the government to help pay for them. The money that had paid for them under MedicAid came from the Federal government subsidies to the states, and when the states lost that subsidy, they were on their own to take care of their elderly and infirm. The depth of the deprivation to these people varied from state to state.

        That’s one example of why some of us prefer that our Federal taxes go to where they help people regardless of what state they live in. This is the United States, not a bunch of competing nations.

  • doc99

    Independent thinkers don’t need either the government nor Matthews and Olbermann to tell us what videos we can and cannot watch.

    Here’s the video too tough for Olbermann:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tudwfldzeNw

    • Steve1

      doc99 During the 1st part of video, Jihad was called, this was during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Osama Bin Laden called the Jihad. I believed this is the same time time period Mr. Soetoro-Obama, “Little Boots” took his sorry ass to Pakistan!! Was he heeding Osama”s jihad? Who paid for this trip? If Saudis did pay for his college tutition to Culumbia or Harvard, is it possible they paid for his trip to Pakistan? BTW-during that period, Pakistan was under martial law! Who did he meet when he was there, did he travel to other countries…where is the MSM, trying to dig some dirt on Palin. Clinton, 2012.

      • Lark

        Wow. This man has much to account for to the voters, including those who intent to vote for him. MSM is not serving well those who intend to vote for Obama.

      • cpl

        The Al Kifah Center was established in the early 1980s in Peshwar Pakistan by the Palestinian fudamentalist Sheikh Abdullah Azzam. He is the one who sent out the call for Jihad against the invading USSR in Afghanistan. His call for Jihad was directed in particular to all Arabic youths WORLDWIDE. Obama went there in 1981. Recall the hell that was raised because some people had been looking at his [passports from that period ot time. Oh yes, Another huge Al Kifah Center was established in Chicago. The Al Kifah Centers were the main recruiting stations for Jihadists who later came to be called — Al Queda—.

        • Steve1

          cpl Was his visit a coincidence? Yeah, sure! Where are the lazy fat arse MSM. They discussion whether Palin can be Vp and mother of five! What?

  • Pink Panther

    THE SURGE, ACCORDING TO OBAMA (DEPENDING ON THE POLITICAL WIND PATTERN

    January 2007: Obama said “We can send 15,000 more troops; 20,000 more troops; 30,000 more troops. Uh, I don’t know any, uh, expert on the region or any military officer that I’ve spoken to, uh, privately that believes that that is gonna make a substantial difference on the situation on the ground.”

    July 20, 2007: Obama told the crowd of more than 500 people that nobody wants to get U.S. troops out of Iraq more than he does, but doing so will require voters to pressure Senate Republicans, including New Hampshire Senators Judd Gregg and John Sununu, to break with President Bush.

    Obama says there’s no reason to give the president’s troop surge more time. “Here’s what we know. The surge has not worked. And they said today, ‘Well, even in September, we’re going to need more time.’ So we’re going to kick this can all the way down to the next president, under the president’s plan.”

    January 5, 2008: Obama said, “I had no doubt, and I said when I opposed the surge, that given how wonderfully our troops perform, if we place 30,000 more troops in there, then we would see an improvement in the security situation and we would see a reduction in the violence.”

    July 15, 2008: Obama said that overall American interests have been hurt rather than helped by the Bush administration’s decision to increase troop strength in Iraq 18 months ago, and vowed to stick to his plan to withdraw combat troops within 16 months of becoming president.

    July 17, 2008: Obama website’s opposition to successful surge gets deleted. A funny thing happened over on the Barack Obama campaign website in the last few days. The parts that stressed his opposition to the 2007 troop surge and his statement that more troops would make no difference in a civil war have somehow disappeared…

    September 4, 2008: “I think that the surge has succeeded in ways that nobody anticipated,” Obama says in an interview with FOX News Channel’s Bill O’Reilly, which airs on The O’Reilly Factor at 8 pm EDT this evening. “It’s succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.”

    • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

      OMG, you’re good.
      Now do you think you can flow-chart and timeline all his other BS? LOL

      • Pink Panther

        We are working on that so you will see more in the future.

        “We didn`t leave the Democratic Party; the Democratic Party left us.”

      • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

        You would need the side of a building to map out just this snippet of an interview with Couric:

        Couric: All that may be true. But do you not give the surge any credit for reducing violence in Iraq?

        Obama: No, no … of course I have. There is no doubt that the extraordinary work of our U.S. forces has contributed to a lessening of the violence, just as making sure that the Sadr militia stood down or the fact that the Sunni tribes decided to flip and work with us instead of with al-Qaeda – something that we hadn’t anticipated happening.

        All those things have contributed to a reduction in violence. So this, in no way, detracts from the great efforts of our young men and women in uniform. In fact, that’s one of the most striking things about visiting Iraq is to see how dedicated they are, what a great job they do – all those things … are critically important. What I’m saying is it does not solve the broader strategic question that we have been dealing with over the last five, six, seven years. And that is how do we take the limited resources we have, both militarily and financially, and apply them in such a way that we are making America as safe as possible? And I believe that my approach is the right one.

        Couric: But talking microcosmically, did the surge, the addition of 30,000 additional troops … help the situation in Iraq?

        Obama: Katie, as … you’ve asked me three different times, and I have said repeatedly that there is no doubt that our troops helped to reduce violence. There’s no doubt.

        Couric: But yet you’re saying … given what you know now, you still wouldn’t support it … so I’m just trying to understand this.

        Obama: Because … it’s pretty straightforward. By us putting $10 billion to $12 billion a month, $200 billion, that’s money that could have gone into Afghanistan. Those additional troops could have gone into Afghanistan. That money also could have been used to shore up a declining economic situation in the United States. That money could have been applied to having a serious energy security plan so that we were reducing our demand on oil, which is helping to fund the insurgents in many countries. So those are all factors that would be taken into consideration in my decision– to deal with a specific tactic or strategy inside of Iraq.

        Couric: And I really don’t mean to belabor this, Senator, because I’m really, I’m trying … to figure out your position. Do you think the level of security in Iraq …

        Obama: Yes.

        Couric … would exist today without the surge?

        Obama: Katie, I have no idea what would have happened had we applied my approach, which was to put more pressure on the Iraqis to arrive at a political reconciliation. So this is all hypotheticals. What I can say is that there’s no doubt that our U.S. troops have contributed to a reduction of violence in Iraq. I said that, not just today, not just yesterday, but I’ve said that previously. What that doesn’t change is that we’ve got to have a different strategic approach if we’re going to make America as safe as possible.

        Can you believe that!!! He opposed the surged ,, and still opposes it knowing that it worked, and yet when asked if his “plan” would work, he said he has no idea.

  • doc99

    Roger that cpl. The fauxgressives so far aren’t progressive at all. They’re Marxist thugs. Sen. Clinton was far superior to Captain BS.

  • SJ

    I saw a clip on FOX about the upcoming interview with Obama and Bill I think he also flipped once again on the Rev Wright issue.

    That man is really unbelievable, I don’t know why FOX is dragging this thing out so long am sure we are going to have lots to speak about next week with the great one.

    • Mamatx

      Did anyone see Bob Beckel live on Fox News when it was announced that Obama was going to be interviewed by O’Reilly?

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh6Gx1KrvTw&NR=1

      Methinks Beckel is a wise man……..

      • Heather

        Wrong clip. But a good one!

        • Mamatx

          So sorry. Cuting and pasting are not my strongest suit.

          Here’s the right one.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnoiZr6AL0M

          • TeakwoodKite

            He won’t survive it.

          • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

            oh dear… the look on that dudes face…

            what does he know about Obama? what does that tell us about what he THINKS about Obama?

            hilarious…

            a. hillary
            b. mccain

            america first!

  • georgiapeach

    I saw the commander of Alaska’s National Guard being interviewed on Fox last night. He said that one of the first things Sarah Palin did after being sworn in as Governor of Alaska was to ask where the Alaska Guard was stationed and what she needed to do to arrange a visit with them. He said that she went over, took the time to sit down and talk to them to find out how she could best help them and their families during their deployment. Then she came home and put that knowledge to use. Imagine that. A politician with a genuine interest in and desire to help the troops under their command, as opposed to all those pols who want to use them for a drive-by photo op.

  • Mr. Natural

    Later that night, Obama reviews the interview:

    The setting: Temple Rezko, high atop Mt. Obama.

    Before the marble colonnade stands the One. His chin thrusts proudly, his nose impossibly high, his butt clenched improbably tight.

    He is lord of all he surveys, and it is good, for it is a magnificent facade, its marble columns carved of the finest Corinthian styrofoam.

    Before him kneels O’Reilly, an insignificant insect who has dared to disturb Obama’s reveries.

    Obama does not answer O’Reilly. For there are no answers. And it is good.

    He cues the chorus.

    ♫
    No, no, no… That’s not the point… Look!

    No, no, no… That’s not the point… Look!

    Obama reaches into his robes, grabs his chief of staff, tightens his grip, and begins to sing in a high falsetto:

    ♫♪
    Oh – Bama – ma-an…

    … got a secret plan.

    “More mirrors,” he decides, “I need more mirrors.”

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      Oh, my God! You are too good.

      • Mr. Natural

        Awwww shucks, ma’am. Thank you.

  • KB

    OT, but Biden is really a loose cannon. Check out this link and yet another political gaffe…sad really. He’s got some problems.

    http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080904/NEWS02/809040379&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL

  • Steve-O

    he (Obama) credits the surge with helping to reduce violence in Iraq it “doesn’t meet our long-term strategic goal.”

    I guess his long-term goal is and was to keep the war going on badly for the campaign period to make sure that Iraq remains an issue.
    Otherwise, his “I-was-always-against-dumb-wars-and-this-is-the-mother-of -all-dumb-wars” argument falls flat. “Okay, you were against the war, but we are winning and we are on our way out, so what’s your problem?”

  • Marilyn

    As a young man, it took McCain being in the Hanoi Hilton to discover who he really was. It took a young Obama pot and cocaine to discover the same

    • TeakwoodKite

      “Never smack”

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      And he still doesn’t have a clue…so how could we?

  • HARP
    • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

      here are 2 more:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kFrFIFizkU

      and

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GliQjmuf8_s

      a. hillary
      b. mccain

      america first!

      • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

        and another:

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07u6uffKvpA

        a. hillary
        b. mccain

        america first!

      • HARP
        • TeakwoodKite

          And the “Eruca Sativa” goes to…..

          ah…ahh.. ummm

          Obama: Don’t Bring The Troops Home

          Staring Barak Obama….(crowd goes nuts)

          Anounser whispers: BO has won 4 other Eruca Sativa awards to night for best lying politician, best immoral astroturfed Short Story production,and the upset of the evening, one that not one of his fans saw coming, can you believe it?!?!

          The “Lifetime Eruca Sativa Quid pro Quo Flipfloppery” award for squandering positions and money for an all time record.

          Although the runner up was so close…Rezko sadly could not attend as he was filming on location.

          • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

            -=chuckle=-

            a. hillary
            b. mccain

            america first!

    • TeakwoodKite

      Hey a utube party.

  • katmandu

    Palin effect? From Rasmussen today — where Obama has a one point lead, three if you include leaners:

    As McCain has begun to chip away as [sic] Obama’s convention bounce, most of his gains have come among women voters. Obama still leads 51% to 44% among women, but that seven-point edge is just half the fourteen point lead he enjoyed last Tuesday. McCain leads by three among men, little changed in recent days.

    One-third of the interviews were conducted after Palin’s speech.

  • Sonia
    • Sonia


      Biden Gaffe: Palin Lieutenant Governor of Alaska

    • nickoury

      Is chuckles drunk?
      HE is definitely too wasted to be in anything other than a rehab intake office.

  • Sonia”Barracuda”4Hillary /Mccain


    Obama: Sarah is Bullying Me – Make It Stop
    This is the man that would stand up to Iran and Russia

    Bon Jovi hosted more than 100 people for a $30,800 a plate dinner on their mansion lawn by the Navesink River in Middletown, N.J. to support Obama.

    It’s clear that Obama is concerned over the impact of Sarah ‘Barracuda’ Palin. Obama said:
    We’re not going to be bullied, we’re not going to be smeared, we’re not going to be lied about

    We were also paying attention to that smear part. Obama needs to get busy telling his surrogates to stop smearing his female opponent.

  • Ghetto Queen Michelle Obama

    Ghetto queen Michelle Obama tells Ellen Degeneres we should not discuss Palin’s children. She is right, for if she does, we will not how she dragged her children and her “babies’ daddy” to a God Damn AmeriKKKa” church in inner city Chicago.

    I am from Missouri, and we do not want ghetto queens in the White House.

    • StrawberrybitesBarky

      Michelle is far from a Ghetto Queen. She is from an upper middle class family and has never really went without. That is what makes her bitter attitude so hard to understand. She, as an African American woman, has benefitted so much from the fruits of this country, yet all she sees is the dark underbelly. It’s woe is me 24/7 but does she actually roll up her sleeves and try and fix the problems, no. She bitches and moans about how mean the US is. May I suggest a year in the Peace Corps in a place like Uganda for Michelle. Then she would have a better aprreciation for being female in the US.

      • TwoTermObama

        Barky, you’re usually better than this. If Michelle Obama grew up upper-middle class, then I had a Bill Gates upbringing. Her dad was working-class and battled MS before dying early. Seriously, I still think you’re cute and all, but get your facts straight.

        Born on January 17, 1964, Michelle Robinson was raised in a one-bedroom apartment on Chicago’s South Shore.

        Of note is that she shared a “bedroom” with her brother, but it wasn’t much of a bedroom. It was actually the living room with a divider down the middle. Michelle’s father died in 1990 two years before she married Barack, but her mother is still alive and living in the same one-bedroom apartment, protected by a burglar-proof wrought-iron door and secured windows.

        • Ghetto Queen Michelle Obama

          I am not referring to her economic status. I am referring to her conduct.

        • Pink Panther

          You are handing out the typical Obama propaganda. The UK Daily Mail did an investigative report and found the following:

          When The Mail on Sunday went back to the gritty district of Chicago where Michelle LaVaughn Robinson was raised, we found a rather different picture from the one so single-mindedly promoted by Camp Obama.

          Instead of the one-room tenement that now appears in most accounts of her upbringing, we found a well-kept neighbourhood of red-brick Arts and Craft-style houses which have long been home to respectable black families.”Michelle was from a middle-class family,” confirmed one of her long-time friends, Angela Acree.

          “She came from a regular family. They had a nice home. It wasn’t a mansion, but it was just fine. It was a decent neighbourhood.”

          Indeed, according to family friends, Michelle’s father was a volunteer organiser for the city’s Democratic Party, a by-word for machine politics in America, and his loyalty was rewarded with a well-paid engineering job at Chicago’s water plant. Even before overtime, he earned $42,686 – 25 per cent more than High School teachers at the time.”

          dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-517824/Mrs-O-The-truth-Michelle-Obamas-working-class-credentials.html

          • Steve1

            Pink Panther Thak-you for that info. I fell for the shit-lies regarding Michelle’s upbringing! It the same as Soetoro-Obama’s when he implied he was from Kansas? Than poor boy from Hawaii. Shit he was well-fed, educated in an elite private highschool. Soetoro is a first class LIAR and they had the nerve to call Hillary a liar!

        • Leisa

          Why is her mother still living in those conditions when Michelle has a mansion now???

          • TeakwoodKite

            Like a I hit a downdraft, Leisa your question is a very alarming one.

            Never mind that her mother was depicted as living in such conditions as portrayed by BO, but I am my mothers keeper doesn’t appear to apply.

            With all due regards to the facts as posted by Pink Panther citations.

            To deceive for gain is called what?

            To make 300k and not save some cheezedoodles for grandma seems too slight of hand by half.

      • Heather

        Absolutely. Hey I’m here in the U.S. because my ancestors were starved in Ireland by the English. Michelle is here because her ancestors were enslaved by English settlers. Ok, question is, would either of us prefer to replay that and end up being born in the original country? Would I go back to Ireland? Would she go back to Africa? I mean, really, it’s time to get over the past people and enjoy what you have which for both me and Michelle is better than what we would’ve had in the old country.

        • street_parade

          Well, Ireland’s pretty damn nice nowadays! The Celtic tiger.

      • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

        Strawberry, I think it’s her front to try to have the down and outers relate to her as one of them. She’s phony all right. Her pose is just a means to an end. Neither of them had the black ghetto experience in America.

    • Steven Mather

      I do not like Michelle. I think calling her a “ghetto queen” is like calling Palin “trailer trash.” Neither term is appropriate.

      If I was an Obama supporter who wanted to discredit this site, however, I would call Michelle that name.

      • Buzz Latte

        Ghetto queen attitude…

        Michelle thinks she and other blacks are owed by whitey. “Mean country” and “For the first time…” are quotes not to be swept under the rug.

        Michelle has a chip on her shoulder the size of her Rezko mansion.

        • Steve1

          I don’t care how much training King Kong’s baby sister gets (ala Rev Manning). She can’t hide that hate that just drips out of her face!

  • http://edgeoforever.wordpress.com/ Not your Sweetie
  • Fred

    Just in case anyone missed this the other day:

    Service of legal documents to DNC and Senator Obama confirmed

    SERVICE OF LAWSUIT CHALLENGING SENATOR OBAMA’S RIGHT TO BE A CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT BECAUSE HE DOES NOT MEET THE QUALIFICATIONS HAS BEEN COMPLETED

  • yttik

    “Governor Palin, thanks for your Trans/Canada Natural Gas Pipeline act. It’s such a fabulous piece of legislation I went ahead and put it in my energy plan back in December. I hope you will forgive me for the hypocrisy of copying your homework while accusing you of being inexperienced.” Yours truly, Barack Obama

    “Senator Clinton, help me. I’m in deep moose poop over here! I know you already gave me your policies, lines from your speeches, your blood, sweat and tears, but I need more! I started with 99 problems and a bitch ain’t one, and it’s all gone downhill from there. I heard “white women can be a real problem, we all live with that”, but damn, this is getting ridiculous. I got PUMA’s riding my ass, I got people chanting Sarah Barracuda. Christ on cracker, what’s with all these raging females and their animal totems?” yours in complete desperation, Barack Obama.

    No matter what happens on Nov 4th, women just won this election. Have yourself a good cackle and celebrate all that is shrill. It’s about time we started recognizing the talents of the other half of the human race.

    • Heather

      Yeah baby! I like “celebrating all that is shrill”. Mwuhahaha

  • Dan

    I simply cannot belive that half the US polulation can’t see how totally full of shit this clown is. There isn’t an ounce of conviction in his entire body. He’ll say whatever he has to say, whenever he has to say it, to get elected.

    Contrast this with a true American hero like John McCain who’s often made compromises with Democrats and endured the wrath of the far right wing of his party as a consequence. The choice couldn’t be clearer. For the sake of our country, I hope enough people wake up between now and Nov.

    • Heather

      Rasmussen “weights” their results by the proportion of dems v. repubs in the population. So when they say the numbers are 45% Obama and 44% McCain, the actual interview numbers were closer to 60% McCain and 40% Obama, but they jacked up Obama’s on the assumption that with more dems in the country the actual numbers would reflect that.

      Problem with this approach is that in fact dems are not voting dem, so it’s a ridiculous thing for Rasmussen to be doing. Someone should call them on that.

  • Betty

    Why is it that we can not think of our own labels and are always recycling last years outdated Republican ones? It is proof of how well they traumatize us that the next year our ultimate insult is their old tired phrase.

    I have noticed that the Republican are not using flip flop. Why don’t we try “elitist woose”, like the one who always gets ahead of you in line and then can’t make up his mind on anything.

    • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 VinceP1974

      They are not using Flip Flop because Obama is so new to the scene with so little record that no one knows when he’s flip flopping.

    • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

      The one who has 20 items in the 10 item line and tells the cashier to wait a minute, he forgot to grab his arugula?

  • sandshark222

    I wish this had it’s own thread. From the Denver Post:
    http://blogs.denverpost.com/opinion/2008/09/06/republican-recycling/

    This morning, Republicans tell me that a worker at Invesco Field in Denver saved thousands of unused flags from the Democratic National Convention that were headed for the garbage. Guerrilla campaigning. They will use these flags at their own event today in Colorado Springs with John McCain and Sarah Palin.

    Before McCain speaks today, veterans will haul these garbage bags filled with flags out onto the stage — with dramatic effect, no doubt — and tell the story.

    “What you see in the picture I sent you is less than half of total flags,” a Republican official emailed. “We estimate the total number to be around 12,000 small flags and one full size 3×5 flag.”

    I’m not sure what the DNC was supposed to do with unused hand-flags, frankly. But the Republicans are obviously questioning someone’s patriotism here.

    • yttik

      The Democrats seem to have forgotten that the devil is in the details.

    • Heather

      I”m no rabid flag waver, but I am a compulsive keeper of keepsakes and those flags look pretty darned nice.

      Worst of all, the Dems let themselves get on the wrong side of the “flag” issue again! Haven’t we learned that lesson by now? Obaby is such an arrogant jerk he’s tanking our party for us. Thanks, ahole.

    • http://firefox AnnieCarmel

      You don’t throw them in the trash.

  • //Yahoo ALforHill

    At the Bon Jovi event, Mr. Obama remarked that he had not flown on all those airplanes and eaten all that hotel food just to come in second. Oh dear…poor whiney bastard. My husband and I don’t know from one day to the next what we will eat or if we will eat hot dogs and cheese and macaroni. He is bellyaching about hotel food. With all the money he spent on his Invesco Field event, he could have helped alot of people like us who are struggling to get by from one day to the next. At the Confluence someone said the Bots are urging disgruntled Hillary supporters to vote 3rd party or stay home. That way Mr. Obama will win. Please reconsider your votes people. I am not all so thrilled voting Republican but I feel John McCain will not do the damage Obama will to the American people.

    • LilRod

      It is all about ME ME ME..Obama

  • Kate

    Just remember, Republicans have an atrocious record on women’s rights.

    • yttik

      Just remember the Democrats lost their integrity in that argument and didn’t even invite us all to the funeral.

      • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

        They did. They just told us to give Obama an endorsement as we gave our own eulogies.

    • Dr. Kate

      just a reminder that you know nothing and are a useless troll.

  • Francis

    Nice too see an embrace of all the Republican talking points from this “democratic” site.

    Palin will be brought back to earth. Every politician is…she’s in the honeymoon period. She will never be as popular and “fresh” as she is now, and McCain still has only cut Obama’s lead from 6 pt to 2-3 points.

    Methinks in the long run this is a losing ticket. Sorry, Republican trolls!

    • Dr. Kate

      oh its FRANCASS the talking mule. Couldn’t keep your promise, could you? You said you were leaving this site.

      leave the site. keep your promise, talking mule.

    • Steve1

      You’re just like your head BOT! Flip Flop, Flip-Flop. Frist you leaving the site, now you’re changed your mind and you are back. Ok Francis, I know you want to emulate Soetoro, like a good bot.
      Well this is America. But don’t you have any shame for lieing. Well I know your phony messiah does it-so its OK for you! Typical Soetoro thug supporter. Well those $7.00 does come in handy-that kool-aid isn’t cheap, especially now when you really need it.

      • Steve1

        lying

  • lollipop

    The flip Obama in front of his fellow Christian audience: I am a genuine Christian.

    The flop Obama in front of his fraternal Muslim audience: I am a true Muslims.

    Well! To the flip-flop Obama: Once a Muslim, Always A Muslim

    • Francis

      If you were a “genuine Christian” you would not support a candidate and a party who mocks the work of community organizers.

      • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

        And how grateful we all are, no one has organized the dead-people vote quite as well as ACORN.

        The mockery began by you trolls, we’re just laughing as you stew in your own sewage.

      • Firefly

        Sarah Palin’s remarks about “community organizer” were, in part, a great response to barky’s VERY FIRST comments after she was chosen as VP.

        If, Mr. Mule, you recall, barky’s campaign called her “a former mayor of a town of 9,000″ – of course, we all know – especially barky’s because HE’S SO JEALOUS – that she’s THE GOVERNOR OF THE LARGEST STATE IN THE UNION IN AREA – with an 80% approval rating.

        Of course, barky thought calling her a “former mayor” was an insult – everyone else knows otherwise. The truth is exactly what Sarah said – the mayor of a town of 9,000 has INFINITELY MORE RESPONSIBILITY than a piddly little “community organizer” – actual responsibilities – actual decisions – actual budgets – solving actual problems – with actual employees and constituents to answer to.

        The whining of barry and his bots is hilarious – waaaa waaaa waaaa – “They’re attacking community organizers!”

        I laugh in your face, Francis – I laugh in barky’s face – the country laughs in your faces for the classless, whining, truthless idiots you are!

        • Heather

          Plus, by Barky’s own admission (in one of his several premature autobiographies), his community organizing never achieved the results he’d hoped. Not his fault, probably but Governor Palin HAS achieved results and should be respected for that.

        • baby_puppy

          I don’t think the Gov meant t put down community prganizers a s a whole, she just meant to put down Barry because noone has ever figured out what he actually accomplished as one.

          I was listening to Kojo on NPR for a quick minute (too much BO love there to take much more), and they correctly pointed out the value of community organizers and some who actually changed history; like Harriet Tubbman Mahatma Ghandi, etc. I would even include Hillary Clinton because of her work for voter’s rights.

          The point being these folks were/are great Americans who accomplished much for others, while Barry didn’t do anything for anyone besides himself and rezko and Ayers and Jeremiah Wright,and Excelon,….

          So that is Sarah’s criticism -not of community organizing, just Barry’s lies about his accomplishments giving him more Presidential experience than being a Mayor. Hope she clarifies that at the debates.

      • Send Not to Know 4 Whom Obama Blows; He Blows 4 He

        No one is putting down or laughing at community organizers, Francis Sweetie.

        However important the jobs were to those he served, his positions were small both geographically and in terms of responsibility.

        It is laughable that anyone would believe it a qualification for the Presidency.

  • MaggiefromMichigan

    From my interactions with people they don’t see it because they watch the mainstream media news. In some cases they’re being brainwashed by the likes of Keith O (or Bathtub Boy as John Gibson likes to call him). When I show them videos like the ones showing the caucus fraud they get a worried look and say why hasn’t this been on the news? That’s when I say “exactly” and now here’s more important information you need to know that’s not on the news. Since the most of the news programs can’t do their job anymore we all need to pitch in and make people aware of the information being withheld. One thing I’ve starting doing is referring people to blogs like No Quarter and to the book called “The Case Against Barack Obama”. We need to keep trying to get the word out. I keep wishing that at least one of the Mainstream Media outlets would try to distinguish themselves and get back to true investigative journalism. I’ve had to start watching Fox News and International News, but it would be nice to have more balanced and legitimate news to turn to. I kind of had my hopes pinned on ABC News to do this but alas….

  • Babs

    I got polled by Quinnipiac this morning. 25-30 questions, straight quaestions, nothing weighted one way or the other, and when I didn’t like the absolute of the question, the women conducting the poll took down an alternative answer. For instance, one of the questions was: What concern that you have will most likely determine your vote for the presidency? (Not verbatim, but you get the meaning.)Choices were war in Iraq, the economy, immigration, energy, maybe one or two more, but I told her none of the above. So she said, OK, tell me your answer, I told her in one word, ethics, and she wrote it down.

    This is the second time I have been polled in the last week, the first being a 5 question robocall about a week ago. I live in PA, that’s probably why.

    Rasmussan and one of the other pollsters were on Fox yesterday. said their polls are a cumulative of 3 days of polling, so that the full effects of the Republican convention will not be seen until Monday’s results. Also said that Obama’s bounce was seen even later than the 3 day window, and that may also occur with McCain.

    • Heather

      Hey no one ever calls me. Probably because I’m in a ‘safe’ blue state.

    • Linda

      good response.

  • No Mo, Bo or Stumblin Jo

    ACORN latest polls, Obama is gaining among cemetaries across the the nation. Stay tuned for an unexpected bounce near November 4.

    • Mamatx

      LOL

      Except he might actually win that way……

      • Firefly

        That’s why McCain needs to be up by more than about 4 points going into November 4.

        The larger the lead by McCain, the more difficult it will be for barky to steal it – or the easier it will be to prove that he did steal it – and how.

  • Babs

    Big business has taken over the MSM, as we all know. One of the Democrats talking points forever has been that the Republicans are in bed with big business, and I, like other loyal Dems, have always bought that story. So why is the MSM blatantly supporting the Democratic ticket this election? Could it be that they are afraid of a McCain preidency, based on transparency and reform and actual ethics in government? If not, what is up? If the Republicans are so aligned with big business, as the Dems claim, why is the big business MSM biting the hand that feeds them?

    • Firefly

      Same reason they needed to eliminate Hillary – NOT in the pocket of big business.

      Barky IS in bed with big business – as well as with all the other BIG BOYS for whom POWER is the be-all-and-end-all.

      The American media IS big business – and they have their agenda – their marching orders – they don’t even try to hide it anymore.

  • TeakwoodKite

    “No No No No No No No No NO…”

    wonder were he learned to say that….

    Does anyone else think Obama’s posture is one of weekness

    Oh The flipfloppery of it!!!

    Can we get BO to do more of these? BO, The emperor has no clothes.

  • NOBAMA

    Dear Sarah Palin,

    Wash my Dishes!

    Sincerely,
    Barrack Obama

  • Susan1968

    Economic reasons to vote against Obama.

    I was speaking with a very savvy investment expert who specializes in global marco-economics.

    From a purely economic standpoint, he’s a Ron Paul guy because he wants as little government as possible regulating the economy. But his wife supported Hillary.

    During the primaries he analyzed Hillary’s economic policy (which is more centrist) with Obama’s policiy.

    First, he said he found gaping holes in Obama’s plans and no real evidence of where Obama thinks he can get the money to fund his programs.

    Which leads him to suspect Obama will raise taxes even higher than what he indicates now — its the only way he can fund the programs he proposes. And to do so he would have to raise taxes on all Americans.

    Second, he said that raising of any taxes during a time when the dollar is so devalued is a guarantee for economic disaster.

    Raising taxes on corporations will lead to more layoffs BECAUSE – and this is interesting — he said even the most “stable” corporations are highly leveraged and in debt.

    His bottom line — which he said so bluntly it was eerie — if Obama is elected and a Democratic Congress gives him everything he wants, the national deficit will expand and there will be a true depression by the end of the decade.

    That’s two years my friends.

    Conversely, if McCain keeps his promise about slashing pork spending (and his track record shows he is likely to keep this promise), my economic guy says this will go far to shrinking the debt and stabilizing the dollar.

    I don’t trust the flip-flopping Obama on anything he says about taxes.

    During the primaries, I remember seeing a clip of Michelle telling a group of working class supporters: We will want a bigger piece of your pie. I think she was telling the truth then — an Obama administration believes higher taxes will solve everything.

    And according to my expert friend, during this rocky period, this is the worst thing we can do.

    He also said we don’t need to tax big oil — we just need to stop giving them subsidies. Which is something McCain said when he voted AGAINST the Bush-Cheney Energy Bill.

    • Flipper Slippers

      The welfare state works. The US model doesn’t work. It doesn’t work because there are programs on the federal level, the state level, the municipal level – and it’s a quagmire. To make matters worse: no one ever thought of coordinating all the legislation and lots of programs were proposed only to curry favor with voting constituencies with no regard or consideration for the consequences. At the end of the day it’s not how much is being spent but how it is being spent. At the end of the day “United States” is a bit of an oxymoron. Hillary had the right idea – but with her gone it will be as she predicted, namely that in 15 years you won’t recognize the country anymore.

      Right now things are bad enough but there are so many factions – libertarians are my absolute favorite – who have nothing but a bunch of academic abstract ideas – and of course a teaspoon or two of fanaticism. None of these ideas have ever been practiced in reality.

      The only economic theory that’s ever been tested in reality is that of John Maynard Keynes. The theories of Milton Friedman were indeed tested – but they were a total flop.

      In terms of social evolution the United States stands at the bottom of the ladder. It’s described as a “positivistic” state – “we won’t stand in your way”. Which is about as far as you can get in the days of the pioneers and early settlements but it’s hardly the hallmark of a mature society.

      On the next rung up is the “socialistic” state. Don’t laugh: “socialistic” in this context is a bit like Lenin – it only guarantees a “minimal” standard of living. But no more.

      At the top of the heap is the “welfare” state. Don’t go ballistic – “welfare” is good. The difference between “welfare” and “socialistic” is that “welfare” guarantees not only a minimal standard of living but a decent standard of living. Most countries in Western Europe today practice this model and last anyone looked they were doing just fine, thank you.

      • Send Not to Know 4 Whom Obama Blows; He Blows 4 He

        You neglected to mention the rigidity of the class boundaries that come with this little piece of utopia.

    • ohio

      I actually took my taxes to my accountant and asked her if the Bush cuts helped me or did I get anything. Between my spouse and myself, working lots of overtime, we gross about 70,000, which I would say is middle income or lower, depending on who is defining it. She looked at them and did some calculating and said the tax cuts saved us about $1500, not counting the increase in the child credit. So I am beginning to believe that those tax cuts did not just help the rich, as I am certainly not one. I’m an indy who voted for Hillary in the primaries and knew McCain had it wrapped up. I didn’t like how she was treated. I now have absolutely no concern in voting for McCain/Palin. And my accountant is a die-hard dem, was shocked in what she found in our tax returns concerning the tax cuts. Said she was going to look over a few more to see if she found more like that.

  • baby_puppy

    Hillary wants to defend the flag while Obama won’t even salute it.

    Where’s that picture that shows him satnding with arms folded behind his back while Hillary, Richardson, and others were saluting? That pic needs to be front and center on all Clinton blogs.

    How can we risk having this man someday decide not to salute the flag while in another country or in the Chamber of the Senate or visitng a school?

  • Linda

    OMG This piece alone is enough to finish off Backtrack Barry, who NEVER can admit a mistake.

    tv ad

    Obama-”I think the surge has succeeded in ways no one anticipated” {announcer) “John McCain did”. “There are two keys to any surge of U.S. troops: to be of value, it must substantial and it must be sustained” “Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., a potential candidate for president in 2008, has come out early, and strongly in favor of sending more U.S. troops into Iraq – an idea many see as counter to the opinion of the 2006 midterm electorate.”

    Obama-”there is an underlying problem that the Iraqi’s haven’t taken responsibility”. Announcer, maybe Senator Obama has been too busy to read the progress or even news reports announcing areas turned over to the Iraqi’s”. (then flash the different articles of recent changes and turn overs).

    Then end it with “John McCain has the leadership to make the decisions and experience to know better.”

    roflmao

    • Linda

      And, btw, I wasn’t none to happy that Camp Obama copied Condomweezer’s remark,

      “No one could have imagined them taking a plane, slamming it into the Pentagon”

      and that is why you don’t belong in the position you’re asking to be elected for.

  • Patrick Henry

    You give him a Job in a “LINK” Factory..

  • Babs

    Susan 1968: My brother is a retired stock broker and agrees with many of your friend’s points about Obama and the economy. Says people forget that many small business owners file personal income taxes, and Obama’s pledge to increase taxes for those earning over $250,000 would decimate the small business community. Also says the same thing about increasing taxes during an economic turndown, and says that the main thing that Obama seems to forget is that our participation in an ever increasing global economy requires more support of businesses in this country, not less.

    • Flipper Slippers

      It’s not Keynesian economics anymore. The old macroeconomic theory went out in the 1930s and it’s way gone today. Today it’s about balance of payments – and about getting a lot of money coming in to an economy. It’s fiercely competitive – but that’s the way it always is.

      • http://lnab.newsvine.com/ Linda

        but I will say this, ultimately BASING your economy on consumption is going to end in disaster! NO society has managed to survive such an economic structure long term. Eventually resources fail and the pyramid falls down. We are seeing it now with peak oil.

        BTW…the reason oil supply increased is because China went off line for 2 months with 1/4 of their factories and ordered cars to be parked in order to lower their pollution for the Olympics.

        We’re going to be back in the same boat when they get back to full speed.

    • http://lnab.newsvine.com/ Linda

      I work for a small business. I know in lean times the boss didn’t take home a paycheck for a year. He got us ALL through it by not taking one. No one ended up laid off.

      I get what they are saying about many small business owners. Our boss had laid back and lived on his savings to keep the company healthy. Eating that up with taxes would have probably tanked us because he wouldn’t have had that to fall back on.

      But I do think SS limits MUST be raised. People at the top of the bracket are the ones who are going to get the most benefit…they live longer.

      • Flipper Slippers

        That’s anecdotal. And more: it’s way too simplistic.

    • Flipper Slippers

      Obama’s pledge to increase taxes for those earning over $250,000 would decimate the small business community

      This is simply not true. You’re confusing personal taxes with corporate taxes.

      • Send Not to Know 4 Whom Obama Blows; He Blows 4 He

        S-Corps, Sweetie.

  • Heather

    ANOTHER BELITTLING QUOTE FROM OBAMA TOWARDS HILLARY:

    “She has got a little desperate towards the end of this campaign, and I think, has been a lot more aggressive in her negative attacks,” he said during an interview on ABC’s “Good Morning America.” Arguing that his judgment in opposing the invasion of Iraq trumped Clinton’s decision to vote to authorize the war, Obama said that his best credential for dealing with crises is that “in difficult or stressful moments, I don’t get rattled. And I don’t get rattled during campaigns.”

    What an arrogant and condescending man. Not rattled? I’ll bet Palin is making his teeth chatter.

  • Deb

    OMG! Look what Barry said today (please take a deep breath first)

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13205.html

    “That is not change, come on,” Obama continued. “I mean, words mean something. You can’t just make stuff up. You can’t just make stuff up. We have a choice to make and the choice is clear.”

    • http://noquarters foxyladi14

      and he is soo right folks we do have to make a choice
      and the choice is very very clear
      mccain palin 08
      hillary 12/16
      obama 20 to life
      puma

  • Wayne

    Of1L9DnM48ePY