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Can Palin Debate?

sarahpalinbook.jpgEarlier today, Byron York, at his National Review blog, The Corner, reported on his assessment of Gov. Sarah Palin’s abilities as a debater, based on her performance during Alaska’s 2006 gubernatorial Republican primary race. York found a two-year-old video at C-Span of Sarah Palin debating the other two GOP primary candidates, Frank Murkowski, the incumbent governor of the state and a veteran of 22 years in the U.S. Senate as well as Republican politician John Binkley.

It became evident, as I watched the video, that Governor Sarah Palin can more than “hold her own” in a debate.

York wrote the following about Palin’s performance:

And all I have to say is that Palin was good — really good. It wasn’t a debate in which the candidates were in each other’s faces or throwing out zingers, but Palin clearly outshone her rivals — especially Murkowski, the longtime senator who played the role of the experienced statesman.


This debate was not lightweight like the recent Saddleback Forum but one that, according to York, was substantive and “heavy”:

As far as substance was concerned, the debate was heavy — I mean heavy — on oil, natural gas, and the money that comes therefrom. To my ears, Palin knew a great deal about the subject and spoke with real authority about it — again outshining her rivals.

You can watch the video of the GOP primary debate at C-Span’s Web site.

As I watched the video, I was more than impressed. She is truly smart and knows her subjects well. The debate also dispels a rumor about Palin and her personally-held stringent beliefs about contraception. Here is the question that Palin was asked:

In a recent survey you said that you would support abstinence-until-marriage education but that you would not support explicit sex-ed programs. What are explicit sex-ed programs, and does that include talking about condoms in school?

Here’s Palin’s answer:

No, I don’t think that it includes something that is relatively benign. Explicit means explicit. No, I am pro-contraception, and I think kids who may not hear about it at home should hear about it in other avenues. So I’m not anti-contraception. But yeah, abstinence is another alternative that should be discussed with kids. I don’t have a problem with that. That doesn’t scare me, so it’s something that I would support also.

I once attended sex education classes for my son when he was in 6th grade. His education began with the birds and bees, which bothered me some. The remainder of the course subject was benign, no more explicit than the books my mother gave me to read when I was young. I was satisfied that the class wasn’t too explicit. The more explicit items are best left to parenting at home.

York learned in his research that Alaska didn’t have a death penalty, something I was not aware of either. I did find out that Palin and I differ on the death penalty. She supports the death penalty when it involves children. My belief is much more broad than hers. Here are her thoughts on the death penalty:

If our lawmakers were to consider such a thing, I think that support should be given for heinous crimes. A murder of a child? I say, my goodness, hang ‘em up. Yeah. A murder of a child, anything to such a degree, I don’t think that there can be anything worse. And if lawmakers were to consider it, that should be the consideration.

In short, this is a debate worth watching. It is my opinion that Biden is going to have a lot on his hands when he debates Governor Sarah Palin. She will certainly do her homework and be well-informed on all questions. Biden has much to worry about in Palin.

OF NOTE: At C-Span, you can also watch the 2006 general election debate between Sarah Palin, the Democratic candidate, former governor Tony Knowles, and the Independent candidate, Andrew Halcro.

  • Perry Logan

    I wouldn’t place too much importance on the ability to debate, in any case. History is full of great speakers who were lousy leaders.

    • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 Vince P

      I disagree. I think doing poorly at the debate can hurt badly.

      I’m convinced that if Al Gore didn’t stomp and sigh at his podium in the 2000 debates when Bush was speaking, he might have won.

      And in 2004 Kerry (or was it Edwards?) really hurt himself when they tried to use Mary Cheney against him..I guess that was Edwards.

      • Obama is a bum

        I agree. Gore tried to act like a tough guy in the debates and he came across very poorly.

      • Jen H

        Vince, you might not remember this, but Al Gore did actually win.

    • Leeban

      HAHA two words “couric interview” this broad is dumb as a brick, and u guys are dumber for ever beilieving otherwise. hahahaha

    • joe

      I think this woman should not be allowed to get her hands at the worlds second largest stock of weapons of mass destrucion. And – I will never understand how someone can be against abortion but for death penalty at the same time.
      Greetings from germany.

  • JB

    Ssssssh. Let’s keep the expectations low… ;)

  • blog force one

    history is full of great speakers who were lousy leaders?? Obama comes to mind immediately! he is a lousy leader of the Democratic Party!

    • roseeriter

      I remember trying to listen to John Kerry debate…blech. Obama without a teleprompter is extremeely annoying…um…umm…wait..wait..let me make my point…um..um..um..

      Obama Not. Ready. To.Lead.Ever.

      • Obama is a bum

        Jack Kemp comes to mind as putting in one of the poorest efforts in a debate.

    • Perry Logan

      Obama is that rare exception–a lousy speaker who is also a lousy leader.

      • Obama is a bum

        Agreed.

      • Animal Control

        Stop with the Jokes–I’m under doctors’ orders not to laugh.

  • JB

    Well, Sarah Palin is already a great leader. Obama? Not so much.

    • http://www.exlax.com Uninformed Bowel Movement

      Well, Sarah Palin is already a great leader. Obama? Not so much.

      Obama is not even a leader. He is a leach and he and his rabid followers are leaving a wake of destruction in their path.

      • jwrjr

        Obama is qualified to lead lemmings. People, no.

      • Obama is a bum

        Obama is a novelty. He generated a huge following for no apparent reason — he is a complete dud and on paper no reasonable person would waste their time putting this guy up for president. He is like the pet rock of politics.

    • Obama is a bum

      I would not trust Obama to lead a cubscout troop.

      • Jen H

        But Palin – now, there’s a leader. WOW.

        • WildChild

          It’s kind of funny that the dem pres candidate is running against the republican VP candidate. LOL it certainly puts things in perspective

  • wodiej

    Debates are not a comparison to giving a speech from a teleprompter in front of throngs of adoring, naive fans whose only purpose is immediate satisfaction w no real interest in facts or issues. A debate on the other hand deals w real issues, problems, situations and policies and knowledge of those things. So debates ARE one way of seeing leadership ability. It is also a way to see confidence or the lack of it in someone. Someone articulate and ready w answers like Palin shows far more leadership ability than Obama who stutters his way through his answers.

    • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 Vince P

      I hate how our Pres. debates are. They are usual (or seem so) ego-fests for the moderator. Theynever ask what I want to hear and they cut things of when it starts to get good.

      I liked Newt Gingrich’s idea of weekly two – hour debates. No moderator, just a time keeper, and let them talk to each other.

      • Ai1een

        Wow – I hadn’t heard that – interesting idea.

      • Obama is a bum

        I like the idea without the moderator. I would also prefer it without a big audience, the applause and noise from the audience is distracting and wastes time.

    • Lark

      Debates are now manipulated also. If the same question is given to each of the candidates, or a very similar question, the second to go usually neutralizes the first by agreeing with them, then they add their disagreement. Hillary was killed by Obama using that technique almost exclusively. The I am “Hillary Plus.” People don’t care about the stuttering, they just care that they can get more. You do that, I do more. You do that, I do more. End of debate.

      Biden’s debate with Palin will be the same. Biden will say, “I am Palin Plus.”

      The funny thing will be when Obama describes himself as Palin Plus too.

  • http://investigatebarackobama.wordpress.com/about/ kat in your hat

    Biden is good at debate. Gov. Palin is going to have to study him. I hate to say it but I think she is going to have to really go negative at the debate because I think the “journalists” who will run the debate will be extra hard on her, and I think Biden will try to outwit her.

    She’s going to have to study and come fully loaded.

    • wodiej

      I agree, she needs to make sure she is prepared and up to speed on issues. I think Biden will try to hit her hard but my guess is she won’t be rattled by it.

      • Tuppence 411

        She has an ace up her sleeve. Biden voted against the Alaska pipeline way back when. Wish someone would uncover some archive footage. He carried on like it turn the whole state of Alaska into a toxic waste dump, an environmental nightmare. She can flip that on him. He was wrong then. He is wrong now. He doesn’t have the right judgement when it comes to weighing energy policy for the US-uses scare tactics.

        • Ai1een

          Well – as of this morning Palin has another point she can drive home during the debate.

          This past weekend Biden reiterated (arrogantly I might add) in front of cameras on his plane that his plan to divide Iraq had been a solid plan and that, basically, it had ended up happening that way anyway, to a degree, and the peoples there had their own autonomy, so his plan had essentially happened …blah blah blah BLAH blah

          This morning on FOX (in addition to Bush announcing the removal of 8000 troops) one of the big stories being played up is an Iraqi offical saying that THE BIDEN PLAN WOULD HAVE BEEN A COMPLETE DISASTER FOR HIS COUNTRY. It would have involved having to forcably remove people from their homes, etc.

          Ouch! – Biden – added to the ticket for his foreign policy experience – getting dissed by a lead Iraqi official saying, (in the vernacular)”Biden’s plan ROYALLY SUCKED” – Sting!

          • Go biden

            Biden said it best when he said “Rudy Guliani is the least qualified person since George Bush to seek the presidency… 3 things in a speech, a noun a verb and 9/11″
            He just has to change it to : Sarah Palin is even worse than Rudy, the only thing she mentions in an interview is a blizzard of words, blinks, Russia and the state that she is the executive of.

    • Hope Floats

      From that C-Span debate, it seems Sarah is used to having tough questions thrown at her, and she takes it all in stride. At one point, the questions are so obviously referring specifically to her pro-life position, she just says that she makes no secret about her personal views, that she chooses life in situations where she is called on to make that choice, and that she is confident that her opponents will be asked the same questions.

      When Murkowski answers next his reply is so fake and creepy. He says, “My own precious baby girl would know that no matter what, I’m there for her, but if she feels…” In other words, he wouldn’t punish her with a baby pretty much.

    • Lucinda

      Gerald Ferraro said that same thing in reverse. She said that Biden needed to watch tapes of Palin and not underestimate her debating skills.

      • Lucinda

        I meant “Geraldine”.

    • beebop

      She has to keep her answers short, concise and able to be understood by the VOTERS. If she can TALK PAST the moderators to the people in the audiences — in studio and at home — she will do very well. Joe’s issue is that he is too much of an insider and speaks DC speak. And. He.Can’t.Shut.Up. If she can stand in stark contrast with him, she can hang the moon.

    • Obama is a bum

      I have never seen the media go after a VP candidate like they have with Palin. They went after Qualye but not this bad. Obama is trying to run against Palin which is unprecedented.

      The media has been telling us for over a year now that we need to elect Obama for them. The media now knows their task is to trip up Palin in the debate. Expect them to try and trip her up on foreign affairs where she should not be up to speed as a governor. I also expect them to go after her for having a baby with Downs syndrome and how she expects to take care of him while VP (this could backfire on the media because they would never ask this to a man).

      • http://none Peg

        “I have never seen the media go after a VP candidate like they have with Palin.”

        Geraldine Farraro was raked over the coals by the media over her husband’s finances. They put her and her family through hell; but she withstood it and prevailed, as far as anything illegal being found or alleged (as I recall).

        She also did a fine job against George Bush Sr. in their debate – which the media unanimously declare HE had won.

  • http://investigatebarackobama.wordpress.com/about/ kat in your hat

    My expectations of Palin in a debate are not high at all. Not at all.

    But it doesn’t matter. I already made up my mind on who I am voting for. (not oblow!)

    Meanwhile, I hope McCain is good at debate and keeps his cool.

    • Karen

      I think everyone’s expectations for Palin are lower. That’s a good thing. She won’t be expected to measure up to ‘politician’ Biden in debating because he’s done this for years. (I wouldn’t be surprised if she points this out sometime during the debate.)

      After the Clinton/Obama debates, people are going to be watching for the media bias. In fact, viewers believe the media is biased for Obama and that is in Palin’s favor too, because even a hint of bias will be exaggerated.

      I think she goes in to this in a good position. She needs to hold her own, not blow Biden away.

    • Ai1een

      I had thought Palin would do well just based on how she interacts – seems to have an inherent gift for communication in addition to her work in college. However, I did see the C-Span debate on TV this Sunday night – the one of of herself, the incumbent Gov. and the other contender and I was impressed greatly. She is skilled.

      That being said, as we all know, just one small mistake and the media harps on it for days so it’s treacherous ground for any candidate – not just Palin.

  • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

    Way OT:

    O PASTOR IN SEX SCANDAL
    REV. WRIGHT DONE ME WRONG: CHURCH LADY

    He almost wrecked Barack Obama’s presidential dreams, and now firebrand pastor Jeremiah Wright has helped destroy a Dallas church worker’s marriage – and her job, The Post has learned.

    Elizabeth Payne, 37, said she had a steamy sexual affair with the controversial, racially divisive man of the cloth while she was an executive assistant at a church headed by a popular Wright protégé.

    When word of the unholy alliance got out, Payne’s husband dumped her, and she was canned from the plum job at Friendship-West Baptist Church, she told The Post.

    “I was involved with Rev. Wright, and that’s why I lost my job and why my husband divorced me,” Payne said.

    She refused to reveal when the adulterous affair started or how she met Wright.

    But fellow churchgoers at Friendship-West “found out about the affair in the spring,” Payne said.

    At the time, she was secretary to the Rev. Frederick Haynes III, a longtime Wright disciple.

    In April, Payne organized a series of Texas public appearances by Wright, 67. Weeks before, Obama had disavowed his preacher of 20 years after Wright’s anti-government rants came to light.

    “Liz was by Rev. Wright’s side day and night during those days,” a church source said.

    “It’s all true,” said Payne, adding that she has filed a wrongful-dismissal claim with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission to get her job back.

    In an ironic twist, Wright last night spoke at an East Orange, NJ, church revival on the subject of “unexpected problems.”

    “There’s no such thing as a problem-free relationship,” he told a packed Elmwood United Presbyterian Church. “In life, you’ll have unexpected problems.”

    He punctuated his 45-minute sermon with evocative 1960s hits, including the Supremes’ “Where Did Our Love Go,” Frankie Beverley’s “Joy and Pain,” and the Temptations’ “Ain’t Too Proud to Beg.” He’s set to speak there again tonight.

    Payne’s husband, Fred Payne, 64, said he learned of the affair in late February, when he discovered e-mails between his wife and Wright.

    “There must have been about 80 of them, back and forth,” he said. “Wright said things like he was going to leave his wife for Elizabeth.”

    Wright has been married to his second wife, Ramah, for more than 20 years.

    The preacher reportedly wooed Ramah away from her first husband in the 1980s, when the couple came to marriage counseling at Wright’s Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago.

    http://www.nypost.com/seven/09092008/news/nationalnews/o_pastor_in_sex_scandal_128142.htm

    a. hillary
    b. mccain

    america first!

    • wodiej

      not suprised…people who surround themselves w others of poor character don’t usually have good character themselves.

      • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

        and it gets worse:

        He added, “Rev. Haynes doesn’t like the interracial thing, either. This was quite an issue for him.”

        Elizabeth Payne said she has been banished by Haynes and the flock at Friendship-West.

        “I’m not a member of the congregation anymore; I’m not even allowed on the premises,” she said.

        they don’t like the interracial thing??? what kind of church is this? are we living in 1920???

        i mean, WTF?!?!?!?!?!

        a. hillary
        b. mccain

        america first!

      • http://NoteToSelfDontDie.com/members/ gerard “Barracuda” Nedich

        The preacher reportedly wooed Ramah away from her first husband in the 1980s, when the couple came to marriage counseling at Wright’s Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago.

        marriage counseling? what?

        i wonder if Barack and michelle were lucky enough to get some of this marriage counseling…

        har har…

        a. hillary
        b. mccain

        america first!

      • http://investigatebarackobama.wordpress.com/about/ kat in your hat

        I’m not really surprised either, but it’s definitely a mini-scandal. Wright has a lot of problems.

        That NY Post article sets her up as sort of a victim, afterall, she lost her husband and her job, and now she is isn’t allowed in the property.

        Sooo, Wright gets laid, doesn’t lose anything, she does the same and loses everything.

        Anyway, that’s how the story is pretty much set up.

        Clearly, Wright is a dirtbag and I have no doubt that wasn’t his only affair.

        And did you check out how he married his wife?? He stole her from her husband after they sought him for marriage counseling? I think that’s what I read. Craziness.

        • Ai1een

          Addressing the issue of “Reverend” Wright wooing the wife of a couple he was giving marriage counseling – I remember hearing about this months and months ago. It doesn’t surprise me.

          Michael Moore had released something a few months back where he “REVEALED” that the Clintons had called in Rev. Wright to help with their marriage when they were going through Monica Gate.

          Of course Moore then went on to say how hypocritical Hillary was to even mention the 20 year relationship of Obama & Rev. Wright when she and Bill had used him (a couple of times)in the past. He then went on to mention how noble and glorious Obama was to not mention that fact to the public… so he, Michael Moore, was doing it FOR him. (which translates – Obama is a passive aggressive schmuck)

          I wrote Michael Moore back and told him that pastoral counseling is a PROFESSIONAL association and, as such, it is considered completely UNETHICAL for any counselor, whether medical or spiritual, to discuss the private information of “clients”.

          Therefore, to then see “Reverend” Wright speaking about Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky and witnessing Wright mimicing carnal acts from the pulpit white discussing Clinton/Lewinsky was a complete violation of any standard of decency as a marriage counselor, pastoral counselor or even as a human being.

          • Karma

            Great point.

            Did he write you back?

            Sometimes he does when you have logic on your side.

            Anyway, it seems Moore forgets that Wright Clinton pic was printed at the time of the scandal.

            He didn’t reveal anything most don’t already know.

    • Heather

      “The preacher reportedly wooed Ramah away from her first husband in the 1980s, when the couple came to marriage counseling at Wright’s Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago.”

      OMG what a weasel.

      • Heather

        Sorry, that was a terrible thing to say about weasels who are, after all, relatives of the adorable river otter.

    • Obama is a bum

      Wright belongs in a nut house. I would not be surprised if Wright had an affair with Phleger.

      • Ai1een

        ROTFL – OMG! – Visual picture of that..ewwwww..no lunch for me.

  • JohninCA

    I wouldn’t bet on Biden taking out Sarah with a one liner, like Bentsen did to Quayle, e.g., “you’re no Hillary Clinton.”

    I suspect Palin will be looking at Biden’s voting record for any available lines of attack, and will come out aggressive as usual.

    Bet on her to exceed expectations because left wing bloggers, who can’t seem to help themselves, set the expectations so low.

    • http://www.exlax.com Uninformed Bowel Movement

      Bet on her to exceed expectations because left wing bloggers, who can’t seem to help themselves, set the expectations so low.

      Great point!

  • I Will Remember in November

    “…support should be given for heinous crimes. A murder of a child? I say, my goodness, hang’em up.”

    My thoughts exactly. This Sarah woman (i think i will call her VP) speaks like I speak. She is the real deal.

    PUMA

    • JohninCA

      This is why people like Sarah. She gives common sense answers.

      Compare that one to the answer of Michael Dukakis who, asked by Bernard Shaw, “if Kitty Dukakis were raped and murdered, would you favor an irrevocable death penalty” responded: “No, I wouldn’t Bernard…”

  • Judy L. NC

    I heard Donna Brazilnut say on CNN that ‘Obama MUST do well in the debates’. um, ah, uh, uh,

    • beebop

      That being the case, we can expect to see someone other than him behind the podium for the events, is that what she is indicating? If Barry could debate, HRC wouldn’t have finished kicking his scrawny ass in state after state.

      • Heather

        They’d better check him for bugs in his ear. They’re wireless now so he won’t have a big lump running down his back like GWB did in the 2004 debates. Seriously they should pat these people down, but good, before they walk out there.

  • RepublicanChick

    I think Sarah Palin will be fine debating or doing anything asked. She’s comfortable in her own skin.

    She doesn’t have to go negative with Joe Biden. Let Sarah be Sarah and all will be well.

    The people expecting her to fail are the leftwing idiots and staunch feminists aligned with Obama.

    After watching feminists go on the attack, it reminds those of us in middle America that the feminist organizaions are bitter and bitchy.

    As they go on the attack, Sarah’s picture or speech is displayed side by side. Bitchy and bitter? Or Sarah Palin who seems like a happy and content woman?

    Joe Biden seems like a happy guy as well. What a refreshing change from the last VP debate.

    • beebop

      I think that she’s also provided the lift that JSM needed. He is a much different campaigner with her out there. People see the Johnny Mac they love and admire. I think that that is one of the reasons he hasn’t sent her out on her own. It must be tough not to feed off of the enthusiasm she adds to the events. Do you notice that the MSM never reports how big their crowds are? Why is that, I wonder? Perhaps because they are getting more people than Zero? hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

    • http://chriss chris

      Yep. He(Biden) knows his career of being a potential Pres. candidate is pretty much over. So, he attaches himself to the pres. candidate of the party, not really caring whether the whole thing succeeds or not. He’s happy with his life and no matter what happens, he’ll be fine. Not so for Obama who is just beginning his career in Washington. A big dump here and he loses credibility for years and hopefully, forever. Biden is a good ol’ boy and he has lots to fall back on. Unless, that is, he’s found guilty of some sort of crime. Then life could get a little dicey for him.

    • http://mmb silverfox

      republican chick….

      i was part of the second wave of feminism. what an awakening it was.

      i’m now 63 yrs on the planet. been around a few blocks. have strong working class roots. the second wave did not go the distance when it came to class awareness and consciousness raising. a great disappointment to many of us and a point of divisiveness. there are many of the “intellectual”, privileged class of feminists who will remain “staunch” in their positions against Gov Palin. that is their right and i stand by that right.

      there are yet many more of us feminists who will stand with Gov Palin based on much of the classist/misogynist attacks being perpetrated on her from both men and women in the dem party.

      one of the most beautiful liberations for me that has come out the feminist movements is the right to think and make decisions for oneself, based on one’s own personal values, and to support all women’s right to do so.

      even when there is a difference of opinion or belief.

      no one party represents all things for all people. the lines are blurred.

      i support Gov Palin, and her sense of fair play and obvious intelligence. her politics are not entirely my own. but i have a sympatico with her that i trust to tend to what needs to be tended for the next four years,.

      not all feminists are democrats.

      the women who spoke at the repub convention were quite strong and verbal in their sense of self as proud , strong women. Gov Palin is all of them rising, and they will stand with, and for, her in a way that the dem men and women who attacked and abused Sen Hillary Clinton did not support or stand with Hillary.

      • Peggy Sue

        I agree with Silver Fox on the issue of feminism though I have far less generosity towards the elder statewomen of the movement, who feel compelled to disrespect Gov. Palin or any woman who doesn’t get with the political program, who doesn’t pass the litmus test for the “right” kind of woman or a “real” woman. In fact, I find comments in that regard an absolute insult to us all.

        The women’s movement worked to provide the freedom to choose, not from a limited, preselected list, but to choose as fully-realized human beings to determine our own lives: personally, professionally and biologically. Unless I missed the memo, I understood those choices applied to ALL WOMEN.

        Sarah Palin would not have existed in my mother’s era, where opportunities were limited and women who wanted true careers were labeled frigid, ice queens, not “real” women. And the idea of combining families and careers was unheard of.

        The so-called liberal women spouting this nonsense about real and unreal women have simply turned into their own worst nightmare–oppressive dictators.

        And I will not support that message, but I will support Gov. Palin even though we disagree on several issues. I’ll support her as a sister who is having a hell of a ride!

  • RepublicanChick

    Oh! I wanted to ask this the other day, but you know the debate preparations will probably be amusing.

    I wonder who gets to “play” Sarah Palin for the Democrats? Do you think it will be the Kansas Governor?

    Someone elsewhere stated Joe Lieberman would be helping with Sarah’s debate preparations. Hmmmm…..

  • an observer

    While we were distracted with Sara, the foxes were let into the chicken house….

    Hank Paulson’s Trillion Dollar Taxpayer Bailout of Speculators
    1. What Is It?
    What Hank Paulson announced over the weekend is an unlimited, Federal Treasury, taxpayer-funded credit line, to guarantee banks and financial funds all over the world 100% of the value of their mortgage-backed securities. It is a Federal bailout promise which will completely dwarf the $30 billion Federal Reserve bailout of the mortgage-backed securities of Bear Stearns in May. It will steal from American citizens and taxpayers on a scale they have never seen before, to the benefit of financial firms.
    This taxpayer bailout of banks and hedge funds, is called by Paulson’s Treasury the “Secured Credit Lending Facility.” It has been publicly presented as a takeover and rescue of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the huge government-sponsored mortgage companies. But the bailout credit will pass through Fannie and Freddie to the holders of the mortgage-backed securities (MBS) they’ve issued–that is, to international banks, investment banks, hedge funds, foreign central banks, etc.
    A clear tipoff that this bailout is not actually a rescue of Fannie and Freddie? The Treasury’s “Secured Credit Lending Facility” will also go through the 12 Federal Home Loan Banks. Nobody’s claiming the Home Loan Banks are being “rescued”; but they’ve been doling out big loans to bail out bankrupt subprime mortgage lenders like Countrywide Financial.
    2. How Big Is It?
    “Unlimited”–the Treasury Department insisted on that. The only limitation on the size of this bailout, temporarily, is the U.S. Federal debt ceiling. And at the Treasury’s frantic demand in July, the Congress raised the Federal debt ceiling, for this purpose, from $9.6 trillion to $10.4 trillion. So this bailout could rapidly use $800 billion of Federal borrowing, raising Treasury interest rates (it’s already doing that) and piling on you, the taxpayer, another $40-60 billion a year in Federal debt interest charges. To give one indication of how big it could get, a memo has been recently circulating among economists at the Federal Reserve, according to one source, that warns that the Federal debt could reach $23 trillion by mid-2010, if the unchecked bailout goes forward. That is one warning of how big it could get, but no one can actually place a limit on how big this bailout could be.

    There are $7 trillion in mortgage-backed securities (MBS) held by banks, hedge funds, “investors,” etc. They are the means by which these investors bought collection rights on risky mortgage by the millions. They could and should be frozen and written off for the duration of the financial crisis; instead, Paulson’s Treasury is guaranteeing them at 100% face value. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, between them, issued about $2 trillion of these, and bought another $1 trillion from other financial firms.

    3. Who Authorized This Bailout?
    The answer is The Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008, or HR 3221, passed into law in July, and known as the Dodd-Frank bill–for Rep. “Bailout Barney” Frank of Massachusetts, and Sen. Christopher Dodd of Connecticut, who was the chosen Presidential candidate of New York banker Felix Rohatyn.
    The bill was a Federal bailout of mortgage lenders to begin with. But in July, just before Congress was going to pass it, Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson insisted that the Congress add to this bill, the `unlimited’ authority to bail out Fannie Mae’s and Freddie Mac’s mortgage-backed securities. Hank Paulson “delivered” the end of President Bush’s threat to veto the Dodd-Frank bill, in exchange for adding this unlimited bailout. The Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008 doesn’t even go into effect until October 1; but this part went into effect immediately when the bill was signed into law in July.
    Here are the primary sponsors:
    Rep. “Bailout Barney” Frank (D-MA)
    Rep. Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House–her economic policies are set by Felix Rohatyn, New York banker, speculator and drug legalizer George Soros, and Al Gore.
    Rep. Steny Hoyer, House Majority Leader
    Rep. Rahm Emanuel, (D-Ill.)
    Sen. Christopher Dodd (D-CT)–head of the Banking Committee, “Senator from Wall Street,” his Presidential campaign was pushed by Felix Rohatyn, New York banker.
    Sen. Charles Schumer (D-NY) also participated, along with
    Sen. Richard Shelby (R-Ala.)
    4. Who Designed and Backed This Bailout?
    The idea for the Dodd-Frank bill was put in circulation by British-linked anti-FDR economists at the New York Council on Foreign Relations: “world currency” promoter Ben Steil, neo-Conservative Amity Schlaes, former Federal Reserve governor Thomas DeLilio.
    The bill was specifically designed by Wall Street and London financiers–by Credit Suisse Bank in particular–working with the staffs of Barney Frank and Chris Dodd, and with Paulson’s Treasury. It was also pushed by Fannie Mae CEO Daniel Mudd–he lost his job in the big bailout push this weekend, but will probably leave with a very “golden parachute.”

    The direct bailout of mortgage-backed securities by the Federal government was also pushed by Morgan Stanley investment bank, and it’s CEO John Mack. Morgan Stanley became the Treasury Department’s adviser in the bailout. And it was pushed on the Congress by chief economist Mark Zandi of Moody’s Economy.com, run by Moody’s Investors Service–the rating agency which helped trigger the mortgage bubble blowout by over-rating many billions in mortgage-backed securities.
    Paulson’s Sept. 7 bailout announcement was backed completely by Presidential candidates Barack Obama and John McCain. Obama probably didn’t know when he voted for the Dodd-Frank bill in July, that it would lead to an `unlimited’ bailout–now he does, and he says, “It had to be done.” McCain wasn’t present in the Senate when the Dodd-Frank bill was voted. Now he says of Paulson’s mega-bailout, “It had to be done.”

    • wodiej

      This news came out a week or so ago that the Federal government was bailing them out. While I deplore that these companies were doing shady crap, it seems one of few options we have to bail out our economy. If we don’t do something about the mortgage market, we may very likely go into a recession. I think there should be fines, penalities, jail time etc. for those who perpetrated all of it and severely. If we have to bail them out then we should get something in return. Jail time and fines would do it.

    • Lark

      The bailout is a tragedy but it is what is expected. It is a tragedy because it prevents people from unmasking the so call meme that a house use for residential purposes is an investment. A house is a shelter.

      The government has a vested interest in keeping the market value of homes high because property taxes are based on the projected marketing value of a house. That conflict of interest makes the government complicit in ‘enslaving’ the people of the country to a marketing meme composed of several levels of illusory imaginations. But lets face it the entire economy is based on the premise that a home is an investment and a determinant of the individual purchasing power.

    • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 Vince P

      I said in another post that I was going to document my statement that Fannie Mae is going to be considered the Democrat Enron. Here’s an attempt. Any search in Google with Democratic Enron Mae will provide much more information.

      This is probably the most concise long-term summary of the problem… I didn’t want to write a narrative. if one is interested then this is a good place to start.

      At the WSJ page itself are links to the individual stories.

      Through this whole time frame, Industry, the Fed, the White House, The Treasury ALL of them try to get reform passed through Congress.. Yet somehow Congress always gets blocked. These stories dont go into a lot of details as to why they get blocked, it seems like it’s fairly typical and annoying thing when it does, but the consistant theme running through this is that the Democrats shield any action from taking place againt Fannnie Mae because of cries about housing for the poor.

      Well thank you for your compassion because now we’re all going to poor.

      When the full facts come out about this, this nation might be in a revolt.

      Fannie Mayhem: A History
      September 8, 2008 8:41 p.m.

      http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1014169323358510560.html?mod=Extra

      • Fannie Mae Enron? 02/20/02 – Fan and Fred look like poorly run hedge funds: lots of leverage and snarkily hedged risk. Does the word Enron ring any bells?

      WSJ notices the debt for FM is going up a lot

      • Frantic Fannie 02/28/02 – Companies taking on so much risk and debt, and backed by taxpayers, ought to be more transparent in what they tell the world.

      Responding to last week The two biggest U.S. mortgage holders hit the airwaves to denounce us, accused us of bias against “housing”

      Ancedote of Rep Chairman wanting to hold hearings, Dem Rep shutting that down

      • Inside Fannie 03/19/02 – Fan and Fred don’t function like other companies. They’re allowed to pile up debt, implicitly guaranteed by taxpayers, without being held to even the minimum of corporate governance standards.

      • Fannie’s Inside Info 07/01/02 – Even in this post-Enron world, Fan and Fred do not provide as much information about these securities as private mortgage lenders do.

      • Fannie Capitulates, Sort Of 07/15/02 – Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac end months of resistance, stonewalling and downright crankiness and agree to register their common stock with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

      • Fannie Mae’s Risky Business 09/23/02 – We’ve been suggesting that Fannie Mae was exposed to too much interest-rate risk. All of a sudden investors seem to agree with us.

      • Fan and Fred Get the Business 02/19/03 – The year has not started auspiciously for the two mortgage-finance behemoths.

      • Speaking Truth to Fannie 03/12/03 – The president of the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis warns of a potential crisis arising from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      • Fannie Takes the Hill 10/09/03 – When the House of Representatives can’t get even a modest regulatory bill out of committee, the dangers of Fannie Mae become clear in reality.

      Notes that efforts by Committee chair keeps getting blocked, but doens’t say why

      • White House Fannie Pack 11/11/03 – White House chief economist N. Gregory Mankiw dares to tell the truth about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The mortgage giants were not amused, which means we’re getting somewhere.

      WH attacked by Barney Frank for being against “housing”

      • Christmas for Fannie Mae 12/23/03 – The Federal Reserve Board releases a new staff study about the impact of taxpayer subsidies for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      So no wonder the companies are fighting so hard to block the Bush Administration’s effort to more thoroughly monitor and supervise their risk-taking

      • Fannie’s Risky Business 02/25/04 – Alan Greenspan putshis credibility behind the cause of reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      • Fannie Uncovered 09/23/04 – The housing-finance giant has been engaging in some accounting funny business.

      • Fannie Mae Enron? 10/04/04 – The company was cooking the books. Big time.

      The target EPS for maximum payout was $3.23 and Fannie reported exactly . . . $3.2309. This bull’s-eye was worth $1.932 million to then-CEO James Johnson, $1.19 million to then-CEO-designate Franklin Raines, and $779,625 to then-Vice Chairman Jamie Gorelick.

      • Fannie Mae Liberals 10/14/04 – There were many moments of high entertainment during the House hearings on Fannie Mae’s creative accounting. But our favorite was the Mister Magoo performance given by Barney Frank (D., Massachusetts).

      Mr. Frank chided Fannie CEO Frank Raines and CFO Tim Howard, saying, “At the level of compensation you get, we ought to be able to count on you to do your very best without additional incentives.” (THIS AFTER LEARNING ABOUT MILLIONS IN FRAUD!!! we were counting on you??!!?!? WTF)

      the good liberals in the Congressional Black Caucus. Members of this group are often the loudest defenders of Fannie and her brother, Freddie Mac. Can it be that the annual donations made by the Fannie Mae Foundation to the Caucus have blurred their vision too?

      Maxine Waters (D., California) cooed all over Mr. Raines, and Clay Lacy (D., Missouri) played the race card by calling the hearings a “political lynching” of Mr. Raines, who is African-American

      The default position for Fannie’s defenders is that the giant mortgage finance company provides more affordable housing.

      Fan and Fred’s Congressional sympathizers (including some of the same Members who lavished valentines over Fan last week) sent a letter to HUD complaining against the new quotas

      The evidence is overwhelming that Fannie only pretends to be a tribune of the poor.

      • Fannie the Centaur 12/17/04 – Understanding their half-man, half-beast nature is crucial to fixing Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in the wake of their recent financial scandals.

      • Fannie Turns a Page 12/23/04 – Fannie Mae – a slick, semiprivate firm operating with the patronage of politicians – is the kind of institution one still expects to find in a country like France.

      • Fannie’s Friends on the Hill 05/09/05 – Congress finally seemed ready to protect taxpayers from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Then Republican Mike Oxley decided to ride to their rescue.

      We should have known the two mortgage giants wouldn’t change without a fight. Their new, post-scandal, executives are talking a nice, cooperative game. But their allies in the homebuilding trades are deluging Congress with the usual fears that reining in Fan and Fred will hurt home ownership. They’re even playing the race card, as in the email we received from Mary Mancera of the National Association of Hispanic Real Estate Professionals. “Reform Proposals Will Limit Latinos Access to Homeownership,” she declared, apparently with a straight face.

      At a recent Senate hearing, the best New York’s Chuck Schumer could do on the point is browbeat Mr. Greenspan with studies disputing a Fed study showing that even the implicit government guarantee for Fan and Fred hardly lowers mortgage rates at all.

      . Mr. Schumer and other politicians are in it for the campaign contributions, and it is especially amusing to see liberals fight for MBS portfolios that merely enrich already rich Fannie executives.

      We hope the Bush Administration and Republicans on the Senate Banking Committee don’t flinch the way House Republicans have.

      • Fannie Mae’s House 10/25/05 – Every Congressional session can be counted on to produce its share of bad bills. But the “reform” bill for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac is in a class of its own.

      The bill’s new “affordable housing” fund confiscates potentially billions of dollars of the profits of these nominally private companies to finance the pet projects of Barney Frank and other Democrats. This sort of targeted profits tax is not only a bad idea in its own right but also gives Members of Congress an even greater stake in opposing any reform that might dent that profit stream. That is precisely why it is being promoted by the homebuilder lobby and others who benefit from Fannie subsidies.

      Chairman Oxley seems oblivious to all this, focusing instead on raising PAC contributions and showing he can pass a bill by giving Mr. Frank whatever he wants.

      The sad political truth is that a Democratic Congress probably couldn’t pass this stinker without being accused (accurately) of promoting state socialism. That an ostensibly conservative House will pass it is another embarrassment for Republican governance.

      • Freddie’s Friends on the Hill 04/27/06 – The Federal Election Commission sheds some light on how Freddie Mac rewards its friends.

      The Bush Administration has been forceful in calling for Congress to reform how Fannie and Freddie are regulated and run. But if it wants its effort to succeed, it is going to have to show Fan and Fred and their friends on the Hill that Treasury will act if Congress doesn’t.

      • Memo to Fannie 06/14/06 – A joke in Washington these days goes like this: “What’s the difference between Enron and Fannie Mae? Answer: The guys at Enron have been convicted.”

      Mr. Quarles said the Administration would prefer that Congress act to give a new regulatory body that power instead. But Fannie and Freddie and their political allies — the homebuilders especially — have been lobbying furiously to stop such reform legislation. So Treasury is telling the mortgage giants that even if they keep blocking reform, the Administration can achieve the same results administratively.

      • The Fannie Tax 04/12/07 – Democrat Barney Frank and the Bush Administration seem to have found common ground on new rules for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Naturally, there’s a catch.

      The bad news is that Mr. Frank is an expensive date, and his price for tolerating reform of his favorite corporate giants is dunning them for mega-bucks in the name of “affordable housing.” His bill would tax Fannie and Freddie to the tune of 1.2 basis points of their total book of business — or just over 1/100th of 1% of all the mortgages Fannie and Freddie have bought and packaged to sell to investors. That’s more than $500 million a year, with potential to grow.

      • Freddie Krueger Mac 05/10/07 – Just when you think they’re defeated, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac arise in Congress to kill any attempt to clean up their dangerous habits.

      The four Members fronting for the scandal-plagued companies are Democrats Melissa Bean (Illinois) and Dennis Moore (Kansas) and Republicans Gary Miller (California) and Randy Neugebauer (Texas). They prove that corporate socialism isn’t partisan, and no doubt they’ll be handsomely rewarded with campaign contributions if their amendment succeeds.

      • Fannie to the Rescue? 09/29/07 – Fannie and Freddie went up the Hill to fetch a pail of money.

      • Fannie More 10/23/07 – Barney Frank and Chuck Schumer have come up with a proposal that would increase the risk to taxpayers from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      • Fannie Mayhem 11/20/07 – Chuck Schumer is lucky Congress ignored his idea that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac should ride to the rescue of the housing market.

      • Too Political to Fail 04/21/08 – Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac aren’t held to the same standards of accountability as everyone else.

      • The Price of Fannie Mae 07/10/08 – It’s time Americans understood the price they could soon pay for the Beltway’s confidence game with these high-risk “government-sponsored enterprises.”

      • Fannie Mae Ugly 07/12/08 – Investors continued to flee Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac almost as frantically as the political class tried to reassure everybody there was nothing to worry about.

      • Paulson’s Fannie Test 07/15/08 – Does Hank Paulson want to leave the U.S. financial system better than he found it? That’s his test in the wake of his commitment to use taxpayer money to rescue Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      • Fannie and Freddie’s Enablers 07/21/08 – The same folks who put taxpayers on the hook for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are now demanding ransom to let taxpayers bail them out.

      • Fannie Mae’s Political Immunity07/29/08 –Congress sets the rules in favor of Fan and Fred, which then repay the Members with cash from their rigged profit stream.

      • When Henry Met Fannie 08/19/08 — That taxpayer capital injection looks closer all the time.

      • Weekend at Henry’s 09/08/08 — Propping up the living dead at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

      • http://home.comcast.net/~vincep312 Vince P

        Why does Jamie Gorelick keep coming up in our national catastrophes?

      • Lark

        This was a great post, Vince. Thanks.

    • Heather

      Great post. That’s a keeper!

  • yttik

    So…..if Palin believes in contraception and sex ed, isn’t she at least as progressive as Obama? If she believes in a windfall profit tax on oil companies and issuing everyone a rebate, isn’t she actually to the left of Obama, LOL?

    People just keep trying to sell me on the idea that she’s a book burning, birth control banning, rabid right winger. To the Right of Vlad the Impaler, somebody hysterically screamed at me. Yeah, that’s rational, LOL. Dracula. She prowls the streets at night looking to drink the blood of young virgins. Somebody get the garlic and holy water!

  • katmandu

    Here’s an example of what the smear machine against Palin thinks of women:

    http://www.salon.com/opinion/kamiya/2008/09/09/mistress_palin/

    It portrays Palin as a dominatrix (with photoshopped picture). Mainstream America doesn’t read crapsheets like Salon (the name of the rag is a giveaway) so I have no concerns about its political weight, but it gives insight into the attack mentality.

    Looks like someone writing for Salon is afraid of a strong woman.

  • Sassy

    Gov. Palin may have two problems:
    One, isn’t Gwen Ifil the moderator of the VP debate?
    Two, Sarah will need to throw a body-block on Biden…to get a word in edge-wise!
    I’ve got confidence in the “barracuda”!

    • AF catfish

      Ifil is not just black – she’s also a woman.

  • PewL

    I think Sarah has had to fight hard to where she got today.. She’s no fool,imo,and won’t be fooled by Biden..I’m sure she’ll do her homework,and she’ll come out shining.imo

    Mccain/Palin

    Should have been Clinton

  • renegade

    This site cracks me up. Biden will eat Palin’s lunch just like he did Browkaw’s. But you got this wonderful spin machine here so if she somehow does not fill her Depends and overflow you will declare victory.

    Bitter party, your table is ready.

    PS: Obama wins in November.

  • pa

    Can she even form coherent sentences now days?

    Sarah Palin, Sep 18:
    Oil and coal? Of course, it’s a fungible commodity and they don’t flag, you know, the molecules, where it’s going and where it’s not. But in the sense of the Congress today, they know that there are very, very hungry domestic markets that need that oil first. So, I believe that what Congress is going to do, also, is not to allow the export bans to such a degree that it’s Americans that get stuck to holding the bag without the energy source that is produced here, pumped here. It’s got to flow into our domestic markets first.

  • donald bly

    comment by don bly:

    i think that the republican parties attempts to paint palin as a qualified presidential candidate is a a joke. the party doesn’t even trust her to answer a media question that wasn’t handed to her before it was asked. look at the number of soldiers that has sacrificed their lives for this country and the republican party nominates someone who has been a govenor for 20 months. i’m sure half that time was spent learning how to be governor. i guess the other side of that is that bush was considered qualified and look at what he has done for us.

  • Andrew

    Check out the palin compatibility test :
    http://www.palin-compatible.com/

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