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Cry Havoc And Let Slip The Dogs

Unless you are unaware that every season is silly season in politics, and where have you been, you aren’t surprised by the Obama/Romney Dog wars.

Romney put his on the roof of his car and Obama ate one.

We are a country deep in debt, with unemployment over 8%, deeply divided politically and racially and we’re talking about dog incidents that happened long ago and far away.

 Romney’s dog Seamus lived to die of natural causes and Obama was just a kid living in a culture where eating a dog isn’t considered a sin, it’s considered dinner. Should be enough said. Back to important stuff like deficits and budgets.

But no, not with the pinheads and pundidiots who like to turn little and insignificant incidents into fauxrage brouhaha. We are become ridiculous people!

It is not that the “dog lover” vote is insignificant. We are a country that loves our dogs. Americans spent close to $4 billion on miscellaneous pet services in 2011. Some/many dogs live better lives than some/many people.

People not only love their dogs, they love to dress them in ridiculous costumes and humiliate them. Personally I think what this individual did to her/his dog is worse than making it ride on the roof of a car. With or without a  windscreen.

Eating canine is something else entirely. However I don’t think anyone is saying that Obama caught his own, prepared it and then consumed it. He was just a child.

He wasn’t a child when he remarked in his book Dreams From My Father that dog meat was “tough”. That seems a tad insensitive for a dog lover. Something in the area of “oh yuck” would have been much better.

To be fair that was back in the days before Obama knew that he was the smartest guy around. Or before he had a teleprompter. Or maybe it was just something said by a ghost writer.

A picture of Obama riding around in a limo with Bo  may convince people that he’s a dog lover par excellance’ but it does sort of step on the meme of Romney being out of touch and flush with cash. How many dogs do you know who get to ride in a limo?

We like to remain silent and uneducated about the millions of dogs and cats that are euthanized in the US every year. We like to pretend that beef, pork and chicken arrive on our plates by some magical process that doesn’t “kill” them. And lamb? Oh my Dog, someone actually butchers those sweet little baby sheep? Lamb chops anyone? On aisle 3 next to the puppy chops  chow.

As for hunters? They are considered the lowest of the low by many animal lovers. Kill an animal and then eat it? Barbaric. Just eating it is fine.

I escape most of the hypocrisy by being a vegetarian. Not all because I do eat eggs, chicken embryos, and cheese, the  juice of lactating bovines meant to feed their young. It’s a complicated world and gets more complicated when you throw rocks at others. I would know about that. 

I don’t know who started the dogfight, although Gail Collins  was in the forefront and has been busy jabbing Romney with the Seamus story. Given that Ms. Collins bias is not only clear but persistent I don’t take much credence in what she says. Never did. Ms. Collins evidently is just being a dog in the mangerwith the dog lover vote. 

Ms. Collins is also a member in good standing of the Obamamedia and writes an opinion column for the New York Times. Therefore what she has to say is of importance only to those who find her opinion of value. That leaves me out.

If it wasn’t such a sad commentary on our national commentary this whole dog war would be funny. Or funnier. Because with all the problems we have in this country the fact that the POTUS, his Axelrod, his Press Secretary, the GOP candidate and too many members of the press are talking about this nonsense makes you wonder if there are ANY adults in the political class.

Mitt Romney did try to dismiss the story but then he’s accused of “trying to get out of the dog house” by Jay Carney. Carney said he just thought that up. Better he hadn’t. Lame Carney, very lame. 

Some fools are now talking about “Seamusgate.” Or they were until Obama’s eating habits while residing in Indonesia came to light. Oops. Some idiots think that attaching the word “gate” to something makes it newsworthy. It doesn’t.

Full disclosure, I have never put a dog on top of my car.  I had a Great Blue Dane that used to race the kids to the car to ride “shotgun”. Race over the kids at times too. He was the size of a pony. He pretty much sat where he wanted to sit. If the Romney’s had owned Boyo chances are one or two of the Romney kids would have ridden on the roof of the car instead of the dog.

The very thought of dressing my dog in funny clothes and destroying his enormous dignity was never even considered. That dignity was once tested when one of my milk goats butted him in the butt and sent him nose first into a flower bed. Knowing that he was not allowed to eat the goats he rose above it, and the goat, and walked with great dignity back to the house . He was totally unaware that a pink blossom rested between his ears. A sight to remember long after “Boyo” has gone to that great dog park in the sky.

Most of us have great dog stories to relate, most of interest only to ourselves, like the one I related above. We as a nation mostly love our dogs. The idea of someone mistreating them outrages us. But let’s be serious about the outrage. Dogs are being beaten, starved, turned into fighters for human “entertainment” today. It is sad and disgusting. It is something to be outraged about.

Therefore obsessing about Mitt Romney putting his dog on the roof of his car back in 1983 is only done to try to portray him in a negative light.  Did the dog die? Was it injured?  Comparing him to Michael Vick?  Seriously?

It’s all politics. Politics have been going to the dogs for a very long time. Just one more bit of proof.

Oh look a chicken nugget with legs. If that Saint inhales he’s a goner. Alert the media, it’s all Romney’s fault!

  • LindaAnselmi

    Love your post Marge!  It’s hard not to enjoy a little humor over the Obama/Romney dog fight, but I agree the MSM and both political camps sure seem to want to keep feeding these stories.

    When they are so intent on distraction we need to be looking at what is going on behind the curtains.

    Not vegetarian, but nearly there.   Love veggies, and the more I become aware of the industry practices and the likes of pink and white slime the less I trust and want to consume any of it.

  • HELENK2

    “Wait a minute. This is a cookbook!”

    “Wait a minute. This is a cookbook!”

  • EllenD818

    Terrific post, Marge. Given there are genuine atrocity stories about animals coming out every day this doesn’t even rate a mention – both sides.
    There is a belief in rural China that eating dog is protection against getting ill in cold weather.  I have seen some going to market. They don’t look like ours.
    I may also have eaten one. When I asked what this involved dish was I was told “Dock”.  I decided it was duck and not to push it.

    Things are changing in China though. More families are getting dogs as pets and  there are now demonstrations against selling dogs in markets.

    BTW – an Australian friend prepared rabbit for me. I couldn’t eat it.

  • HELENK2

    bill maher, a creep who could not make out in any prison with a fist full of pardons, now goes after Romney kids,
    he is not funny, he is just offensive

    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Hollywood/2012/04/22/maher-attacks-romney-kids

    • Anthony_1

      Well, if wives and kids are fair game this political season, then methinks Manzilla and the girls had better run for cover.

      Romney has shown he doesn’t waste time or have a problem returning a political punch.

      I’m beginning to like him.  Nice to see someone with a pair of balls finally cracking on the plastic Messiah

      • foxyladi14

         yepper..

      • Anthony_1

        OK, let me kick this off….

        Who is more manly?  The blonde? or the brunette?

    • foxyladi14

       makes me barf.

    • KenoshaMarge

      The excuse that he’s just a comedian doesn’t work when you don’t think he’s funny. He had to even attack his audience when they didn’t laugh. Nasty man.

      Maher Curses Out Audience for Not Laughing at His Joke
      http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2012/04/21/bill-maher-curses-out-audience-not-laughing-racist-joke-about-trayvon

  • HELENK2
  • Popsmoke

    How about we talk issues of substance… Like the continued depletion of our civil rights under this administration (brought to you by the last administration)……

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2012/apr/18/tsa-mission-creep-us-police-state

    Misplaced dog and women’s rights issues ( Rosen/Romney bullshit), when there are truly some real burners that are not getting any play, are just a waste. By the way Marge you would be surprised how many countries allow folk to eat dog meat and you would be surprised how many people are starving on this rock… None of which is funny….

  • Flop_Flipper

    We are making so much hay about Obama eating a dog. And it’s a distraction. What about all the shit he eats and attempts to serve us daily? Not too many folks discussing that. And there may be a connection. It could be doggy poo.

  • April454

    “We are a country deep in debt, with unemployment over 8%, deeply divided politically and racially and we’re talking about dog incidents that happened long ago and far away.”

    So Marge complains about the attention put on this story, but yet writes a fairly lengthy post on the story. Funny. Why are you writing this lengthy post if you think there should be no attention paid to this story?

    • Flop_Flipper

      There you go again. More senseless drivel. Well PPAA, this butt’s for you.

    • KenoshaMarge

      I did write about it.

      It may come as a big surprise to you, I am not a member of the mainstream media. Nor of any importance in the blogosphere or in the great scheme of things.

       I was pointing out, how silly they are. I’m just a silly old lady living in obscurity who is pointing out their silliness. File it under it takes one to know one.

      Any other complaints pinhead?

      • Popsmoke

        Only pinheads continue to draw focus at specific silliness, you know like the birthers. While defending one side of that silliness….

        • April454

          EXACTLY…

          • http://twitter.com/VeronicaVerona1 Veronica Verona

            Although, you cannot deny that the majority of Obama’s records are missing or sealed.

            Just to level the playing field.  

      • http://twitter.com/VeronicaVerona1 Veronica Verona

        I see the negativity mongers are back this morning.  On another blog I saw a comment (joke) that said the new symbol for the Obama campaign was the inverted pentagram.  LOL!

        Useful Idiot demdromes certainly are grouchy and hostile like demons today.  

        • Anthony_1

          makes you wonder what side of the crypt they woke up on…..

      • April454

        Actually your story is far more then just commenting on the Media’s focus on this story.

        About 3/4 of your story is just commenting on the story itself. You are doing exactly the same as the MSM does, that you complain about. You are promoting the story you complain about on the Internet. You are just part of the problem you complain about and I am the “pinhead”?

        • KenoshaMarge

          Actually your commenting on “my” little story, which you find silly is as silly as anything I said or did.

           But then you never so find anything you like about anything anyone here writes do you? Which makes one wonder who is the pinhead for coming someplace they don’t like and don’t find agreeable in any way.

          Okay Pop time to put in your 2 cents worth…

  • KataKimbe

    This is a great article, and I say that as an animal advocate who sees cruelty of the real kind daily. I agree it is all about politics and staying away from the real current problems. You may say that dog-gate says something about somebody’s character… I say if they happened today, sure. I am more interested in knowing what associates of a person was doing 30 years ago and if a pal was part of national terrorism. This is way more revealing .

  • samb1

    Yes like when your dog is hiding in the corner,  
    eating  your  blush brush,  bristles and  all 
    with its face completely pinkish red,
    this was also known as Buffygate!!!! 

    My dog lived a good long life and made us all
    very happy and at no time was injured or almost eaten.
    LOL.

    K.M
    Thanks for making me think of her.

  • Flop_Flipper

    Ok, since no one else in the blogosphere or MSM has asked I just gotta. What color was the dog Obama ate? He might just be a racist.

  • Flop_Flipper

    Fido to Obama: Don’t blaze me bro.

    • KenoshaMarge
      • Popsmoke

        Continued nonsense…. Pinhead!

        • KenoshaMarge

          Good heavens Popsmoke, the SO and I went to Lowes Garden Center, bought a bunch of plants, came home dumped the compost containers, rototilled them, filled the patio containers with fresh compost, planted them, rototilled up the flower beds, cut the grass and then raced each other to the shower and the Ben Gay.

          And you are still here following my comments in order to say something snotty. Must suck to be you.

          • Popsmoke

             Yes Marge you make my day…..

      • Flop_Flipper

        An interesting read and I hadn’t seen some of the pictures before. Laughed uproariously. But I disagree with the author and am of the opinion that concentrating on things like this is a mistake. It is however, great for a good laugh which comes in so very handy during these trying times.

  • Wisewoman2

    I’ve read all the comments and my thoughts on the issue in the article is as Romney says:  Obama and his cohorts do not want to talk about his record, therefore they bring up any thing they think will portray Romney in a bad light.  Well guess what this too will backfire on them if enough people know the specifics.  I love the way the conservatives are counter punching the MSM Obama supporters.  Which is worst I rode my dog on top of a car or you ate dog meat?  This “can’t we talk about the serious issues confronting the country” will not happen until Obama is gone.  Heads up the next talking point they are bringing up is to suggest that Romney’s father was part of a polygamy cult of the Mormon church in Mexico according to Gov Schweister of Montana.  Romney has denied it.  Counterfact Obama’s father was a REAL polygamist having a number of wives supposedly including Obama’s mother.  CHECHMATE!

    • Retired_from_SPOnaj

      As I earlier predicted, Romney will be equated with Warren Jeffs.

      • http://twitter.com/VeronicaVerona1 Veronica Verona

        Probably.   Romney is a world and a half away from the Jeffs style polygamy.  But, of course, the dems will try to make the connection.  

        It’s a nasty part of mormon history.   

        • KenoshaMarge

          We all have a nasty history if we look hard enough. We don’t like to admit it, or think about it, at least I don’t.

          All this finger pointing blame-gaming and petty attacks are so childish. I wish the adults in this country would grow up.

          • Popsmoke

             ”All this finger pointing blame-gaming and petty attacks are so childish. I wish the adults in this country would grow up.”

            Looked in the mirror lately?

      • Flop_Flipper

        But will Obama be equated with Jim Jones? Of course the Kool-Aid is now Kewl-Aide. With Cosmo Obama playing the role of the doofus hipster.

    • KenoshaMarge

      I agree 100%. The Brian Schweitzer attack on Romney’s polygamist roots is another bit of stupid. (Plus beneath him, I actually thought Schweitzer was one of the “good” guys. Another disappointment and another lesson in trust none of the bastards.)

      This one too has to backfire because of the very real, and much closer polygamist in Obama’s family, as you mentioned.

      I think they just count on their pals in the media not reporting on things and thus the majority of the public, those who rely on the MSM to provide them with information, never know the facts. Much of the time it’s a pretty safe bet.

      • Popsmoke

        Mormonism (Churchanity) is no better than the hokey theology Obama was breed with….

        http://wdtprs.com/blog/2012/03/quaeritur-are-mormons-christians/

        • Anthony_1

          Feel that way about Harry Reid too?

          • Popsmoke

            Harry Reid…. Nice guy Harry…. Needs another line of work though….

            Look Anthony, I am all for term limits…Not professional politicians…

          • Anthony_1

            Popsmoke, did you know Harry (the “Nice Guy”) is also a Mormon?

          • Popsmoke

            Yes I know Reid is a Mormon. There are 15 Mormons serving in the US Congress. By the way Anthony, I have met Reid in his office… Have you?

            Nice guy…needs to retire….

          • Anthony_1

            yes I have, Pops, and I also had interesting (albeit hypocritical) dinner conversation with him.

            Just trying to make a point:  You have a problem with Romney being a Mormon, but Reid is excused?

            The more I read your posts, the more i wonder if you’re PPAA’s bitch

    • Flop_Flipper

      All these attacks are merely trial balloons to see how effective they are and what the defense response is. The election is several months away and the attack dogs (pun intended) are testing the waters. We ain’t seen nothing yet.

    • FLDemFem

       Not only was Obama’s father a polygamist, but because he was one and polygamy is illegal in the U.S., his marriage to Ann Dunham was not valid. So Obama’s parents were never legally married. When I tell people he is a real bastard, they seem to think I mean it metaphorically. I don’t.

      • Retired_from_SPOnaj

        Are you trying to say that yet another thing that Obama Jr inherited from Obama Sr was his respect for U.S. laws?

  • blogforceone

    Perhaps the Seamus story should be put to bed lest POTUS Obama gets linked to these kind of atrocious photographs of the reality of eating dog. 
     (Boy, he must be really pissed at Bill Ayers now!)

    • Flop_Flipper

      I would love to believe that the Seamus story would be put to rest but it’s already been decided that it fits neatly with the meme the Dems have agreed upon. Like the War on Women they aren’t going to stop attempting to convince us that it is true.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

      To paraphrase Jim Treacher (the guy on Twitter who got the #obamadogrecipes trending on there): Take all the days the MSM & the Obama camp (redundant, I know) have talked about Seamus and add 1 — that’s how long I’m going to talk about Obama8adog.

  • blogforceone

    Want to know how horribly disgusting the practice of eating dog meat is? CONTENT WARNING! dog-meat.net

    • Flop_Flipper

      Sorry, your warning won’t allow me to click your link. And I have no desire to see the photos.

  • Propertius

    Back in 2008 I said I wouldn’t vote for Obama for dog catcher.

    If I’d only known….

    • Flop_Flipper

       TOO funny!!!

      • Propertius

         The jokes practically write themselves, don’t they?

        • KenoshaMarge

          As do the cartoons practically draw themselves…

          • Flop_Flipper

            You really should warn folks when you are going to post something so funny this early in the morning. My monitor almost had a coffee shower.

  • Propertius

    I just have this mental image of Obama reading from the book in the recording studio and exclaiming (after the mike was off):

    Bill? Really? Really? Dog????

    • Wisewoman2

      It was hillarious when Hannity played the audio of Obama reading this passage from his book.  He read it with so much feeling as if it were something to savor.  That would make a great ad and I hope one is made by one of the  independent PACS. 

      • Flop_Flipper

        I checked on the Food Network and they have zero dog recipes. So it got me to thinking….. how does one season dog meat? Wolfbane?

        • http://twitter.com/VeronicaVerona1 Veronica Verona

          with a sprinkle of eye of newt…

          • KenoshaMarge

            Newt? Are you sure? I thought he was busy feeding his finger to a penguin.

  • Retired_from_SPOnaj

    Nice post, but you are just too dogmatic for me.

    • blogforceone

       ’Obama was just a kid when he ate dogmeat”   
      I can tell you from 1st hand experience as a parent, my kids won’t eat ANYTHING unless they know exactly what it is.  If they heard it was dog meat, they would totally melt down if I tried to make them eat it.  ”He was just a kid” does not change much IMHO.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

         Well, he brags about it in his book in his 30s/40s (audio recording) so yeah, it was all good when it strengthened his “foreign relations” bona fides (remember, Obama said in 2008 that his living in Indonesia & being exposed to that culture qualified him on foreign policy — good god, how did people fall for that cr*p). Now, not so much.

        • Popsmoke

          Romney’s foreign policy experience is what? He did missionary work to dodge the draft?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

    I escape most of the hypocrisy by being a vegetarian.

    Ha! I like the way you put that. Of course, there are those of us carnivores who know exactly where meat comes from (i.e., are under no illusions about it coming wrapped in paper/cellophane at the grocery store) and who don’t think hunting is barbaric. So we’re kind of escaping the hypocrisy as well, I’d say.

    But yes, people who eat meat (or even wear leather, for that matter — and that includes shoes) & think hunting is “barbaric” are hypocritical morons. My grandparents had a small dairy farm, with a flock of hens (and a rooster, of course) and a goat (fresh goat milk cheese, mmm, mmm good!)  for personal use, so I’ve helped kill & pluck chickens — in fact, the first memory that pops into my head when I think of my grandmother is that when we came to visit, she’d immediately  grab a chicken & wring it’s  neck to cook for dinner that night. (And, btw, if you have ever actually eaten farm fresh eggs and truly “free range” chicken, you know the difference) as well as participated in milking cows (and the goat). My grandfather liked to hunt & fish too. I used to fish with him all the time, so I’ve cleaned & gutted my own catch  (them were the rules) and while I never actually went hunting with him, I certainly helped prepare the game he brought back. I’ve got no problem with any of it.

    And I defy anyone to call me barbaric about it either — some animals are carnivores — lions, wolves, dog — its nature. Choosing to be a vegetarian (for whatever reason) is fine with me (I have no problem with those who do whether it be for health, religious or humane reasons), but just because people (unlike other animals) get to choose whether to be vegetarians or carnivores, doesn’t make one choice better than the other, IMO.

     The problem with most American’s diets health-wise is the amount of meat consumed, compared to the amount of vegetables & whole grains. The portion of meat at each meal should only be about the size of the palm of your hand, with about 3x that amount of vegetables. Throw in about a cup of whole grain & that’s a healthy diet. But what do we see? We see people eating a porterhouse steak that is bigger than a plate at one meal, with a baked potato & no vegetables at all (unless you count the few little chives on top of the potato). That is what is causing the ill-effects on people’s health — the amount of meat consumed, not the eating meat in & of itself.

    Now, none of that is to say I don’t have problems with some of the practices of commercially produced animal products,  especially eggs (hatcheries). I try to only get hormone free, grain feed meat. This isn’t as expensive as it sounds, because I eat proper portions of meat with my meals. Eggs are  actually about the last thing I like to buy in a store (and not just because I’m spoiled on the taste of farm fresh). When I do it it is only eggs from free range chickens (yes, I know there is some problems with that legal definition in the US). So I don’t consider myself completely inhumane. ;-)

    • Flop_Flipper

      I’ve raised chickens and have eaten fresh chickens eggs. Yummy. And I had an aunt that raised free range chickens that my grandmother would fix. The flavor and texture of the meat is no comparison to the bland crap most get in supermarkets. And I really have an issue with folks that say this or that animal tastes like chicken. Total BS from people with unsophisticated palates.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

        I confess, the first time I ate frog legs, I didn’t know they were frog legs & I *did* think I was eating chicken — but I think the psychology played a big part of that — I thought it was chicken, so it tasted like chicken. Knowing the difference now, I’d never make the same mistake.

        • Flop_Flipper

          I’ve eaten snails and eel and I assure you they don’t taste like chicken. As a child I remember eating squirrel, turtle and frog legs. Don’t remember what they tasted like but I did know what I was eating at the time.

          Today my brother told me that he had eaten snake and that it tasted like chicken. Somehow I kinda doubt it. I’ve had ostrich and it didn’t taste like any winged creature I’d ever tasted before.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

            I’ve eaten snail & eel too. They taste nothing like chicken — I actually can’t believe people say they do. Seriously? I’ve never heard that. If I had to describe eel to someone who hadn’t eaten it, I would say it was similar to kipper. And snail is just. . .snail. I can’t think of what else it tastes like.

            Ostrich doesn’t actually fly, so I don’t know if that comparison is the same. I think Ostrich would be considered ‘red” meat, not white (like most fowl is considered). I’d describe it to someone who hadn’t eaten it as tasting like a lean beef cut — like a filet minon.

            Growing up in NOLA, I’ve tried gater too (kind of tastes like pork; definitely not like chicken). Snake, OTOH, is kind of bland, so the chicken comparison might work there (I went to school in Dallas & Ft. Worth holds an annual “rattlesnake rodeo” where they serve rattlesnake — I tried it there).

      • KenoshaMarge

        We once did the “raise our own chickens and eggs” thing many years ago. Those who did eat the chicken said it was the best they had ever eaten. That did not include myself and two of our three children. We simply could not eat chickens that we knew. I think the vegetarian decision was planted in my brain back then. It took another 10 years before I took the step. 3 of my granddaughters are also vegetarians and one is a vegan. She’s still in college so she looks down on the rest of us. Seems to have more disdain for the vegetarians than the meat-eaters in the family. Her older sisters ask if they were such pains in the ass at her age and we assure them that they were.

        By the way, each of the girls, oops young women, came to their decision on their own not because of me. I am waaaay too un-cool to be a role model.

        • DianaLC

          The vegetarian thing was planted in my brain also long ago when I was little and they told me the chicken noodle soup we were eating was thanks to Henrietta, my favorite chicken.  I loved living on a farm with all the animals, but I never became the typical farm kid because, like you, I couldn’t understand eating my friends.

      • nickoury

        So you’re telling me it does not “…taste just like chicken…?”
        I guess I’ll have to take your word for it since these grizzled woodcarvers feel quite differently:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeU8GKNsrzUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeU8GKNsrzU

        Unless you’ve got a more personal experience, “So what do you think” now?

    • KenoshaMarge

      I meant no slur on meat-eaters in my remark. Evidently you took it as an insult. My thoughts were therefore poorly expressed.

      I live with a meat-eater and I prepare most of his meals. I don’t see him as some kind of a monster nor do I feel superior to him about it. We each must make our own life choices.

      He, being a wonderful man, expressed his thanks to me for my not proselytizing him by suggesting that we have two meatless meals a week together.

      Poor baby has to eat fresh pasta, I make my own, with home-made spaghetti sauce from our homegrown vegetables, grown in our own compost, sprinkled with freshly grated Parmesan cheese from a local Italian market. Oh the sacrifices the man makes for me.

      • Flop_Flipper

        Damn, your description has my mouth watering. Your husband lives a hard life. I have no idea how he could possibly put up with you. ;-}

        • KenoshaMarge

          It’s a puzzlement to me too.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

         No, no, no. I didn’t take offense to what you wrote — you were pretty clear about it being your choice & not something you want to impose on others. I was talking in general about some vegans/vegetarians attitude toward meat eaters. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

        And I do not think it is good for meat eaters to eat meat at every meal.

  • HELENK2

    I read about this EO yesterday and still do not understand the ramifications of it
    executive order 13547

     http://hotair.com/archives/2012/04/21/executive-order-13547-the-sleeping-power-grab/

  • HoosierinDixie

    Another good post Marge. Yes it is the silly season and I can’t imagine even the most ardent pet lovers allowing this to sway their vote one way or another. However, I think there are two things that should be noted here:

    1. It shows the Romney camp is not afraid to counter and mix it up a bit. 
    2. Seems the Obama camp is vulnerable to some criticism regardless of his MSM pals that try to protect him at every turn. People are not laughing with him……they are laughing at him. A few years ago they would be too worried of being called a RACIST for making him the brunt of a joke. This dog eating story is getting more attention than that even sillier ATTAAAAAAACK Watch idea. Could it possibly be that folks are waking up and realizing he is not as “Kewl” as the koolaid kids said he was?

    Silly or not, it’s definately game on.  

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

      And lets not forget, the best way to *get* a narcissist like Obama is to laugh at him. They simply cannot stand that because they take their delusions of grandeur extremely seriously. The laughter & the mocking has got to be driving him nuts & is definitely throwing him off his game. I’m hoping it keeps up until he is a quivering mess — I want to see a full-blown breakdown, on TV, with crying, pointing & yelling.

      • HoosierinDixie

        LOL.  Well Hank I bet his narcissistic ass was sulking around the WH after seeing Red Sox fans booed him when he appeared on the Jumbotron at Fenway Park. Just imagine that…. a democrat president getting booed in Boston of all places. Who knows, if you keep your finger crossed you may get to see a full blown tantrum afterall.

        • Anthony_1

          And if you really want to get things rolling along….

      • Anthony_1

        Think this would speed that up?

        • DianaLC

          Are you selling those as bumper stickers?

          • Anthony_1

            Was toying with the idea.  

            Also adding “LOL!, LMAO!, ROFL!, LOSER!, GTFO!”  and any other appropriate word where the “O” can be replaced.

            Any suggestions?

            Idle hands are the devil’s workshop…., gotta keep myself busy

        • DianaLC

          If you sell them, we will buy them!

    • KenoshaMarge

      Even Bob Beckel on The Five remarked that the Romney Camp is very good at counter-punching.

      A good and quick defense is essential.

      Add that to some people who are getting damn tired of Obama and his attacks, many silly and unimportant, on the right and you have a problem for Obama.

    • elizabethrc

      Obama makes himself such a large target.  His obvious favoritism of blacks vs whites hasn’t helped race relations, particularly since he seems to choose color over quality in his selections. 
      What’s different from the last presidential election is that he made the mistake of stuffing race down innocent people’s throats and people just don’t like being called racist at ever turn.  It was meant to shut us up and shut us down, but the oppposite has happened.  Yet another example of how little Obama understands the American psyche.

  • http://twitter.com/PBdebateforum PoliticalBuddies

    The whole dog thing is crazy, and a tad discombobulated considering the much larger problems in this nation. My debate community discussed this one recently, although I don’t know what, as in teh big picture I find it to be non-issue. Others opinions obviously vary however http://www.politicalbuddies.com 

  • Flop_Flipper

    You are undoubtedly correct that this dog subject has been used by both sides as a distraction from the real issues. But forgive me if I laugh about Obama for a little while longer. It’s much better than the typical rage and disdain I normally have for him 24/7.

    I currently don’t have any pets. The last dog I semi-adopted was my mom’s border collie. Poor thing developed some type of horrible illness while I was out of state working and died the very night I made it back, driving 10 hours straight to be with him. I laid on the floor with him as took his last tortured breaths and convulsions and I cried as I attempted to comfort him. The next morning I got up at the break of dawn and dug a respectably deep grave in what had been a vegetable garden and had my brother help lift him in. To this day, when I think about the way he died so tragically I tear up a little. He wasn’t my dog but I treated him as if he were.

    One of my sisters has a 14 year old border collie that has been going downhill for the past few years. His hearing and eyesight aren’t what they used to be and he suffers from arthritis in his back legs. We are best buds and I occasionally dog-sit when my sister is out of town for long periods of time. Ever since he was a pup he has always pretended to attack me. I can walk into a room where he is and he will start up by barking and growling. Then he’ll go into attack mode and charge after me with that big snoot of his, teeth chomping away. It’s a ritual we have enjoyed for many years. I’ll “fight” back and we can go on like this for several minutes. He loves it and so do I. My nickname for him is Loud Mouth Long Nose.

    I’m not a vegetarian like you. I do try to eat well and certainly enjoy my veggies, especially the ones I’ve grown. I’ve also been around sheep. When I lived overseas, the next door neighbor raised sheep in the adjoining back yard. I used to go out back and feed them scraps. They would Baaaah for them as soon as they saw me. But I learned the hard way that little sheep aren’t as gentle as the fairy tales would inform us. At least the boys aren’t. Been butted more than a few times. And I thought I was dreaming when I watched a female sheep get up on two legs to grab a tasty leaf morsel from a tree. I once saw sheep totally freak during a lightening storm. Those creature can really jump.

    Perhaps this week we will get back to politics as usual and, who knows, maybe the real issues might creep back into the conversation. More likely there will be more denials, more distractions and finger pointing blame games. But that’s become the norm in American politics. And as much as I hate and bitch about it, nothing is ever done to change the behavior, year after year. Perhaps after this coming election the moderates among us will take concrete steps to form an actual political party. It might not change the finger pointing game but at least we could point fingers at both of them. Or in my case, one middle finger from each hand might suffice.

    Addendum: The “excuse” for Obama’s dog eating is that his adopted father taught him that it was a practice of animist faiths in which the partaker of the “offering” took upon himself the powers of the beast eaten. The same “excuse” is given by cannibalistic societies. I’m not necessarily implying anything. Just sayin……

    • DianaLC

      Well, I keep getting the Native American explanation for why I should feel o.k. about eating meat.  You know, the practice of thanking the spirit of the animal after killing it.  I’ve even have people give me the Stranger in a Strange Land excuse from Heinlein’s novel about a man from Mars who explains that it’s supposedly an honor on Mars to partake of a friend’s flesh when that friend dies (because of a dearrth of food on Mars if I remember the story correctly). 

      Those explanations just don’t work for me, though.  I’ve had far too many animal friends, and I’ve always felt sick at the sight of bloody meat.

      • Flop_Flipper

        I have no problem with vegetarians. I was one once for a brief period of time. I felt the need to clean out and it worked. I did have issues with not getting enough protein because I can only eat so much tofu, beans and rice. But to each their own.

        I do have issues with people condemning me or anyone else for not being vegetarian just as I have issues with people condemning veggies. If we would allow ourselves to respect our individual choices without making condemnations based upon our personal moral or religious convictions perhaps we might become more tolerant, respectful and civilized.

        • KenoshaMarge

          Broccoli has more protein ounch for ounce than most meat. As do other members of the cabbage family. And when I add in the eggs, cheese and yogurt I consume I have no problem with protein.

          As for the beans? There is no such thing as too many beans. ;)

          • Flop_Flipper

            Well, I’m a country boy at heart and confess that I fix most of my beans with a ham hock. But I really do like broccoli, especially raw.

          • DianaLC

            I agree about the protein.  If a person eats more protein than he or she needs, it is not stored in the body.  That is true for most Americans. 

            Plent of non animal sources for protein exist.  I crave nuts–for example when I notice I’m needing for protein.

      • Flop_Flipper

        I should probably add that Native Americans also thank the animal for providing them sustenance. AND they use every part of that animal for something useful. There is no waste. It’s not only a practical thing due to limited resources, it’s a manner of conveying true respect to the beast and it’s maker.

        Sometimes the Cherokee in me can’t help but manifest, despite being a “white” guy.

        • DianaLC

          No argument here about the Native American way of living among the animals as being  a far better way than what we have nowadays.

      • KataKimbe

        I am a vegetarian too, but like you I eat dairy and eggs.  I buy the more expensive free range kind.  I’d love if the world became a more humane place for all and less cruelty.  But it will take time. I do what I can. All those complaining about the dog and his feelings on the roof, might think about the equally sentient animals lines up at the slaughter house after having lived a miserable and cruel existence.  They call themselves animal lovers… but how is that possible? Pet lovers OK… animal lovers, not really.  You don’t eat what you claim to love.

        The fact that these dimwits bashed Sarah Palin for shooting her own dinner, and then they go into the grocery store and buy a packaged dead animal of choice.  Clearly the animal shot had quality of life until the end… so I am so tired of these people judging others.

      • KenoshaMarge

        I feel the same Diana. That doesn’t mean that I look down on those that don’t feel the same way I do. It’s a choice. I’ve made mine and it’s one I can live with. That’s all any of us can do.

  • no_longer_a_democrat

    Great post!  this country’s going down the fiscal tube, if we are no longer fiscally strong, then the next step is that we won’t be militaryly strong.

    So Barry Soetero ate dog, that cute picture of doggies is probably a menu for him. I don’t really care.

    I want this loser defeated in november 2012, and some fiscal conservatives to right this country’s ship.  We are headed to 20 trillion  in debt by 2016, which is only 4 years away.  No teleprompter speech is going to alleviate it.  The only way for it to work is to cut baack on spending and massively start growing the economy… NOT by printing money, but actual real growth, which is very possible with the right leadership.

    That marxist in the WH aint it! Put in Romney, and have some of Ron Paul’s monetary policies in there too. 
    But first, Barry has to be kicked out in november, no need for a stimulus, defeat of Barry in nomveber will be stimulus enough.

    • DianaLC

      Sing it!!

      • Flop_Flipper

        Scream it from the rooftops!

  • Malcolm_Reynolds

    According to Lierre Keith’s book “The Vegetarian Myth: Food, Justice, and Sustainability,” vegetarians and vegans are just fooling themselves if they don’t think that modern agricultural practices don’t kill countless animal species by devastating prairies and forests and destroying the topsoil in the process of providing them their plant-based meals.

    • DianaLC

      As a vegetarian, I am not unaware of the give and take here.  It’s a personal decision, and a prabably unattainable wish that somehow the admonition (since I was raised Christian) that humans should have dominion over the aniamals would mean that we eventually learn how to manage that in a more godlike way, as our loving God has dominion over us.  The current state of “agribusiness is not godlike.

      I am not preaching–just trying to help you understand this vegetarian’s point of view (and wishing I could have become a vegan, instead.  My life’s path just did not help me to that so far).

      • KenoshaMarge

        I am also aware of the give and take. My decision to be a vegetarian was a personal one based on my profound feelings that I simply could not eat the flesh of a living creature. That’s on me. My decision, my life choice. Everyone else has to do what works for them.

        I to wish I could go the step further to vegan. Thus far, I just can’t give up cheese and eggs. Someday perhaps.

        • DianaLC

          I can easily give up the cheese and the milk–love almond milk instead.  The eggs remain the hurdle for me, because I can’t pass up the goodies sometimes.  Some of the vegan cookies I’ve purchased are excellent, but they are expensive.  But all my friends and relatives are great bakers–it’s the family that causes the problem since no one else wants to go vegan.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

          You do realize that if you are eating eggs that are produced for commercial consumption, you aren’t actually eating chicken fetuses, right? Because hens lay eggs whether there is a rooster around or not — but only eggs that  are fertilized can be said to contain “chicken fetuses.” The flocks  used for  commercially sold eggs aren’t mixed with roosters and hence, they eggs sold are unfertilized.
          Of course, your real objection may be the way the flocks are housed for the commercial production of eggs & you were just making a joke about the whole “chicken fetus” thing. Or you could live on a farm & eat fertilized eggs.

          • DianaLC

            Hank, I grew up on a farm and know all of this.  I have forced all my family members into feeling guilty enough to get the best brands for cage free vegetarian fed chicken eggs.  My little sister actually has her own very spoiled chickens who will get nice burials when they die.

            I’ve been able slowly to cut back on my consumption of eggs and someday before I die I may just become a vegan.

            I didn’t know it when I was growing up, but I absolutely loved eating over at my neighbor’s house.  Her mother, I thought was the best cook around.  I knew they were Seventh Day Adventists–strict–but at the time I didn’t realize I was eating vegan food.  Their cookbooks are the best for that.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

             @DianaLC:disqus I hear ya — I didn’t grow up on a farm (I was raised in the city) but my paternal grandparents had a farm, which we visited often. As I posted up thread, I’ve  got no problem eating meat (and I would literally die before I gave up cheese– I pity those lactose intolerant folks), but respect others choices. However, I do have somewhat of a problem with commercial flocks for the production of eggs. I also will only buy the best brands of cage free (real cage free, not just legally cage free) eggs. Still, I just really don’t like the taste of store-bought eggs — it pales so much in comparison to farm fresh. Those vacations at my grandparents spoiled me.

          • http://twitter.com/VeronicaVerona1 Veronica Verona

            Not to mention vegetarians shopping in the veggies and fruits section in leather sandals, carrying a leather satchel, sitting in leather seats in the SUV, and displaying a total lack of recognition of their hypocrisy.  Ah, this I have seen in the world of the liberal in one of those blue states.

            I once worked with a vegetarian who had many health issues including fainting.  She became pregnant.  However, the fetus seemed to not be thriving.  The doctors questioned mama to be and found out that she was a strict practicing vegetarian.  They told her she needed p-r-o-t-e-i-n  - preferably animal protein.  She was angry about it  but reluctantly added chicken and an occasional ham sandwich.

            Lo and behold.  She stopped fainting. The fetus was out of distress and she quit having debilitating head-aches and also stopping involuntarily shaking.  She could concentrate  for once and as her boss, that made me very happy.

            Of course now there may be supplements that help with the lack of protein.

            We had a young friend whose parents were vegetarians.  She loved to go out to eat with us because she would feel brave enough to order a hamburger.  It was like watching a rescued shipwreck victim get their first good meal.

            To each their own…steaks are on the grill tomorrow.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

             @twitter-500977265:disqus  — I love the description of the vegetarian kid with the hamburger! LOL. You make a good point about needing protein –and specifically animal protein. As I’ve tried to point out several times in this thread, it is the amount of animal protein that is consumed that is largely the problem in this country (health-wise & agribusiness-wise). I eat meat, but I don’t eat a pound of meat morning, noon & night, and certainly not red meat 3x a day. Nonetheless, IMO, in the right portions & frequency, I do think animal protein, including red meat, is important for the human diet. You really *cannot* get the same nutrients from a vitamin (most of which is expelled from your body via urine) that you need from animal protein.

          • KenoshaMarge

            It was a joke.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

        You’re right about the current state of agribusiness not being godlike –and I am proudly *not* a vegetarian. The reason for the current state of agribusiness (as I alluded to in that long *ss post of mine about my grandparent’s farm) is the way we eat. There is a high demand for meat, not just with fast food restaurants, but portion sizes as well. Hence, cattle & chickens get stuffed full of hormones to get more “meat” from them. It is why I only buy hormone free, grain feed meat; cage free eggs, etc. and if I*have* to get fast food I get the meatless salad option. If everyone did and also ate the proper portion of meat with their meals, “agribusiness” would change too.

        As to your choice to be vegetarian because of your animal friends — that cool with me (or, really, none of my business) but IMO (and as I said it is none of my business, we are just taking here, I’m not judging you) I would say you are projecting human characteristics onto animals. For example, if you were out in the wild & it was you or an animal, the animal would 100% choose to eat you (if it could). Just saying. . . :-)

        • DianaLC

          Hank,

          The oxytocin released to help create mother-child bonds is probably the same thing that helped us bond enough with certain animals to domesticate them in the first place.  You can talk the old “antropomorphism” thing all your want.  But to me that is an excuse for separating ourselves from other CREATURES. 

          We are created, I believe, by the same Creator.  That Creeator loves all the creatures equally, I believe, but gave us more responsibility.  Yes, of course, I know each species has its own character.  But in the end we all have spirits.  I don’t project human characteristics on my dogs.  I project dog characteristics on ME.  When I am with them, I love becoming part of their pack in a sense.  I actually love being with my dog pack much more than being around some human packs.  And my animal friends have often been the first to recognize when I needed medical help–as in the takosubo myocardiopathy I inexplicably suffered a few years ago.  I woke to find by two cats (who were still alive) pushing against my chest.  My Dane and my cat were the first to rush to me when I came home after being hospitalized for a severe depression.  My son said they kept looking for me as I was away.  The ability of big cats to sense the presence of the humans they like and the humans they don’t like is amazing.  They can sense it when the person is not within sight or sound.  I could go on….. 

          I don’t make a such a distinction between other creatures and humans in terms of their ultimate worth for the planet,  and my favorite scripture is from Isaiah–the whole lion and the lamb allusion.  When a lion can lie down with the lamb, we will be where creation is destined to be by the creator.

    • Flop_Flipper

      Not to mention depriving those poor vegetables of living full lives and being able to reproduce themselves. And I won’t even go into the lack of carbon dioxide scrubbing and oxygen producing issue.

      To cheer things up I present another Frank Zappa song: Call Any Vegetable. It’s played by Frank’s son, Dweezil’s band. Can’t help myself since arabella got me all Zapped out yesterday. Bless her warm and fuzzy soul.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=RZvFoSI5VN8

      • ObamaDubya2ElectricBoogaloo

        Have you ever heard the scream of a carrot? It’s quite mortifying really…

        Here’s the reality though. All life is dependent upon the killing of other life to sustain itself. Vegetative matter is every bit as alive as you and me. Spend some time in the old growth redwood forests and tell me that nature isn’t alive.

        Meat, unlike any vegetative matter, is a complete food. It includes all essential vitamins, a complete amino acid profile, and if you can eat organ meats or meat cooked extremely rare, you can provide the same equivilent of vitamin C.

        Vegetarian diets are the antithesis of how humans developed at a dietary level, and is thus one of the most unnatural diets.

        • Flop_Flipper

          I don’t disagree with what you said but I think it important to respect the choices of others even, if not especially, when I disagree with them. IF those choices are not used to condemn, discriminate against or attack others.

          • DianaLC

            Agree–People should make individual choices.

            I knew all my life that meat did NOT agree with me.  I hated the Sunday dinners I had to endure.  My mom would put the roast or the chicken in before we left for church so it would be done when we came home.  I felt sick after consuming those meals. 

            I have felt far more healthy on my vegetarian diet.  The Seventh-Day Adventists are strict vegans (if they follow their rules).  They are some of the longest-lived and healthiest people in the U.S. if you want statistics.  The whole idea of blood typing for diet comes from the fact that evolution is NOT the same for all humans.  We learned that the reason there is much lactose intolerance and probably my type of aversion to meat comes from centuries ago when my ancestors lived through long periods of poverty and drought.

            I don’t attack people who choose to eat meat.  I don’t purchase leather products.  But, from my experience as a vegetarian, I get more ridicule from people who don’t agree with my food choices than I give to them.

            As I said at first, it’s a PERSONAL choice.

        • Flop_Flipper

          I should add that I firmly believe that nature is alive. I’ve never had the pleasure of visiting a redwood forest but I do feel a kinship with trees and always have. I planted 16 last year and so far this year have planted 10. All evergreens.

    • KenoshaMarge

      That may or may not be true. I just know that I made the choice that works for me.

      The hypocrisy I refer to is the “Follywood” types that have a hissy fit about “animal” cruelty, by Sarah Palin for example, while eating meat that someone else has been kind enough to kill for them.

      That particular sentence was poorly constructed as several people seem to have been offended by it. I meant no insult to meat-eaters. I used to be one. I live with one. I gave birth to three. Some of my best friends are meat-eaters. Peace.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

    Well, the whole point of the Obama8aDog meme was to show how ridiculous the Left’s trotting out of a 30 year-old story about Romney and Seamus is. Of course, many on the Left didn’t get that, hence the defense that “Obama was just a boy!” and “They eat dogs in Indonesia” (actually, not *quite* true) so the fact that Obama ate a dog is irrelevant, but the Seamus story is still totally relevant! (Yes, that is what the Left is currently arguing). So while you’re correct, neither story is relevant, the Left isn’t conceding that. 

    But since you brought it up, dogs should be crated when traveling as a dog loose in a car is way more dangerous in an accident unless you’ve got some kind of seat belt that works on a dog. And don’t even get me started on the dogs I see with their heads hanging out of the window — heads chopped up, blinded by flying rocks/debris — that’s the risk those owners are taking with the dogs they claim to “love” so much (please note, Seamus’ crate was fitted with a windshield on front). And look, I’m not saying that people who let their dogs ride loose in the car and/or with heads hanging out the window are intentionally trying to put their dogs in danger– they are just falling into the widespread phenomena in our country today of projecting human characteristics onto our pets. A person wants to seat on the seat in a car, not a crate, so the dog must like that too, never mind that a dog is not anatomically equipped to travel safely on the seat of a car.  I’ve had dogs all my life (rescues) and currently have an 85 lbs mutt & she travels in a crate all the time — not on the top of the car, but inside, but also in the hull of an airplane and a few times in the bed of a truck when it was necessary. There is nothing cruel about crating a dog as long as the crate is the proper size (i.e., big enough for the dog to turn around in) and, in fact, for travel it is safer for them. In fact, all dogs should be crated as puppies — the crates give them comfort. My dog sleeps in hers. Crates are not, as many people think, “traps” any more than a house or a fenced backyard is a “trap” for a dog. By domesticating animals at all, inside fences, house, cars or crates, we are “trapping” the animal — it’s just a matter of how big the “trap” is. And, as I wrote, for dogs in particular, having the right size crate for sleeping and traveling actually creates a cozy, comforting feeling for the dog.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

       PS — I have a small little lap dog as well (also a rescue). She travels in her crate in the car and on planes as well, although on planes she is small enough that her crate goes under the seat in front of me in the cabin, rather than having to ride in the hull.

      • Propertius

        I have a small little lap dog as well (also a rescue

        So, that takes care of the appetizer and the main course. What’s for dessert?

        • Flop_Flipper

          Laughing my ass off. Shit, where did it go?

        • Flop_Flipper

          What’s for dessert?

          Poodle poo flambe?

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

           Oh, I’ve got a cat too. No worries.

        • elizabethrc

          There is an old farm adage:  If you’re going to eat it, don’t name it!

    • Sanshiro123

      I think it is more relevant personally that Romney bragged about hosing the poor thing off after it came down with diarrhea as a result of being on top an example of his own superior crisis management handling ability.

       This issue has been around for years and until he learns to admit that he’s human like the rest of us and has done and said some things that he is not proud of but most importantly, learned his lesson, then he will remain as the “out-of-touch rich guy” to the average voter. People can relate to the guy a lot better if he would stop trying to explain everything away and just own the mistake and remind that nobody’s perfect but at least he doesn’t go around blaming Bush for everything and taking responsibility for nothing, like Obama.  

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

        No, the issue is how “cruel” he was to “trap” the dog like that and the whole experience caused the dog to get sick because it was “so scared”  — that is 99% of what I’ve been reading. And as I wrote, it is neither cruel nor is it a “trap” to crate a dog. Further, this characterization you used:  “Brag about hosing the poor thing down”  — there is so much that is subjective in that. Do you know how you wash a big dog? I can tell you, it isn’t in the shower/bath tub unless your are some kind of freak who wants to clog up your drain with about 5 inches of hair. It’s outside. With a hose. So why the characteristic of “poor thing” for the dog? Because you are projecting human characteristics onto the dog.  The dog was most likely used to getting cleaned off with a hose. The dog got sick — not from the car, per se, because he traveled all the time like that, but from the fact that he ate turkey (and likely in combo with the movement of the car) because dogs often get sick when traveling in a car. Again:  dogs aren’t supposed to be in a car at all, it isn’t their “natural” mode of transportation & unlike humans (and it isn’t our natural mode of transportation either) dogs can’t rationalize/understand why they are feeling the movements they are in a car. A crate actually helps cut down on the unnaturalness of it for the dog because (1) if they have been properly crate trained they find the crate comforting; (2) the crate keeps them more stable vis-a-vis the movement of the car  and (3) much like blinders on a horse, in a crate they can’t see much of what is whizzing past (which can cause anxiety).

        • nickoury

          Speaking of horses,  do any of those dolts think about how they are transported – in stalls with no movement at all, no matter it’s value, thoroughbred or not.
          Your observations are right to the letter, from crating tips to flying in the cargo hold of an airliner (bet that’s a great ride.)
          Got to go, my husky’s calling me at the kitchen door of my fenced-in yard (just an obstacle deterrent to them.)

        • Sanshiro123

          Of course it is all subjective. Even 
          Mrs. Romney’s laughing defense that Seamus was already sick when they put it in the crate on the roof of the car (which makes it even worse).  There is no way to rationally compare or extrapolate the stress dogs have to undergo in that environment  with the stress humans undergo during work. etc but if Mitt’s entire crisis management “business model” revolves around animals being cold, wet, ill and back on the freeway to Ontario he is as negligent and exploitative as pet stores that don’t deserve to stay open. IMO.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

             No, you have to get the facts straight — I saw the interview, she did not say the dog was “already sick,”  she said the dog “got sick” that one time because he had eaten some turkey that the kids had left out on the counter right before the left. He “got sick” during the ride. That is NOT the same thing as “already sick” before going on the ride. You are allowed to be subjective in your interpretation of the facts, but you are allowed to change the facts.  The dog got sick while on the trip — what were the supposed to do, stay there on the side of the road/at the gas station? Give me a break — clean the dog off (once it got sick, it was done) & get back on the road — the dog air dried PDQ, trust.
            And you stilldon’t get it: this story — that took place 30 years ago — is 100% not relevant to day, especially given the ridiculous projection of human characteristics onto animals that we (case in point: you) do today that was NOT done 30 years ago. But if you want to pretend it does, then fair is fair and eating a dog as a child and then growing up and BRAGGING about eating dog as an adult is way effing worse and way more cruel than the sick/wet dog story will ever be. Better in the crate than on the plate.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

            And let me add to my post below: I  & my family have rescued many animals over the years (either taking them ourselves, or fostering them, paying to get them well if they were sick & placing them in good homes). I also do a lot of work capturing, fixing & re-releasing feral cats (on my own dime & with my own time). We consider our dogs “part of the family” but in the role of the dog not in the role of “child” or “human.”  It’s OK to project human characteristics onto animals if you psychological feel the need to do so, but you need to recognize that you are doing that for your  emotional benefit not the dog’s and it is certainly ridiculously unfair to expect other people to project human characteristics onto animals the way you do.  Still, if you want to continue to ignore all I’ve written about crating, projection, etc, I remind you again: Better the crate than on the plate.

          • Sanshiro123

             Naturally dogs see their world a whole lot differently than we imagine they do.
            They don’t think like us, or have emotional reactions to things as we
            do. That is obvious.  That doesn’t mean if they are sick or potentially so a good owner doesn’t want to keep an eye out for complications (dehydration etc) and think through the ramifications. Showing concern generally doesn’t imply reinstating the animal in the situation for it to re-occur only this time sick and wet in the whipping wind (even presuming the shield didn’t break off – airtight would have been even less popular). Basic empathy for a pet is not making the pet equal to a human.  

             The story was brought up 5 years ago as the only example one of the Romney sons could apparently come up with to illustrate their father’s crisis management skills.  

        • Popsmoke

           Hank you are so dead wrong it ridiculous.

          • Hokma

            Wrong about what?

            He is right about crating dogs as well as the safeest way for them to travel in cars. Or are you referring to something else?

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

             Don’t even start with me — you wouldn’t know “right” if it hit you in the face. In fact, you thinking I”m wrong,  proves I’m right. Why don’t you go burn some Mormons, OK?

        • elizabethrc

          Hank, I’ve bred Great Danes for a quarter of a century and have owned them for over 56 years.  The vast majority of dane owners DO wash their dogs in the tub.  I’ve done it both ways and it’s a lot colder with a hose.  Even in summer they shiver.  Washing them inside allows for the use of warm water, which is quite soothing to them.
          My daughter has a Cardigan Corgi and she and her Cardi friends wash theirs in the tub as well.  We’ve not experienced clogged drains.
          As to the safety of dogs traveling in crates inside a car as opposed to being loose, at one show I attended, one of the exhibitors was in an auto rollover.  Had the dogs not been crated, they would in all likelihood have died instead of sustaining minor injuries.

          • DianaLC

            elizabethre, It’s interesting that three of us on this thread have had Danes in our lives.  When I was in elementary school, an older couple lived across the street from our playground.  Their black Dane could not rsist the temptation to play and would escape one way or another to come to be with us.  Only a few of us were not afraid of him, as he was HUGE.  I couldn’t wait to get my first house after college just so I could finally get a Dane.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

            Well, Danes are short haired. Irish Setters are not. My lab mix has plenty of hair coming off during her baths (even though she is brushed often). And we all know that people who show dogs baby those dogs — they practically get 5 star spa treatments, so the fact that you wash your dog in a tub is really not a statement on whether it is “cruel” to wash a dog outside.

          • elizabethrc

            Hank, I didn’t use the word, nor did I intend to imply that hosing a dog outside was ‘cruel’.  It is less comfortable for a dog to be washed with cold water, no matter how you slice it, but that’s your choice.   Keeping them in a crate for 8 hours a day is, however, cruel, as I’ve known many thoughtless people to do (including one veterinarian I know!!!).
            I also was not suggesting that you blast your dogs a’la hosing down demonstrators.  It’s just not as pleasant when it’s cold water.  True, there are many breeds that are bred to tolerate cold better than others, but you can’t tell me that any dog that is crated on top of a car while the dog is wet, for several hours at a time, does not suffer discomfort. 
            Cardigan Corgi’s have three coats and still get cold and as to ‘coddling’ our show dogs, if you mean taking good care of them, seeing to their health and nutritional needs, yes, we coddle them.  That’s what caring and responsible dog owners do and it sounds like you do the same and good for you for doing so.
            There are many in the show world who abuse their pets (go to any dog show and see how many of these animals are left overnight, two or three to a crate. The ASPCA does nothing about it!
            And you’re dead wrong about lumping all show people together as babying their dogs.  Most of us recognize that they are dogs, not people.  It is true that there is a certain amount of grooming that must take place in order to show. 
            Most of us are in it for the joy of showing and when I see that one of my dogs just doesn’t like being shown, he isn’t shown.  You’d be surprised how many dogs get ‘up’ for going into the ring.  As for most reputable breeders, we strive to help our dogs have better health and greater longevity.

        • Popsmoke

          First of all Hank… I am not going to burn any Mormons at the stake. They have a right to believe what ever they want. But I… have a right to object to any religion that considers itself Christian when it really is not Christian and that is just not my opinion…..

          Secondly, I have four dogs, they are all washed in the tub with a drain protector and none of them ever would ever be placed on top of my vehicle created or not. That just shows how impersonal and uncaring Mitt Romney really is.  Its also why he is having a connection issue with voters and is well known for his emotion free management style. Might as well call him Mitt the Robot….

          As far  as using the garden hose to wash dogs, it depends on who and how that garden hose is being used. I have seen people hose down their dogs with straight streams as if they were washing their cars. That is cruel as well as dangerous.

          No vet would ever tell you to take the mutt outside and hose him down using high pressure streams.

    • elizabethrc

      Hank, I agree with how this Romney dog incident has been blown out of proportion and with part of what you state about crated dogs and travel.
      Where I disagree a bit is that, even though there may have been a wind shield on the crate, foreign particles can be lodged inside the nose, ears and eyes of the animals, and the dog will be a lot colder up there, exposed to the winds (I am amazed at how people do not know how much colder in winter it is at ‘dog level’ inside one’s home than it is where we humans dwell. If true that the dog was hosed off while in the crate, imagine how cold those winds must have been against that wet coat.
      People love their dogs (4 billion a year is spent on their wellbeing) but are sometimes so thoughtless about THEIR conditions.
      The highest compliment I ever received was when I was told that when that person died, he wanted to come back as a dog in my house.  (That shows how limited my life must be!).
      All in all, I think Romney is a decent person and like the rest of us, isn’t perfect.  I also believe that he is a person who isn’t afraid to admit to mistakes. 
      How many times has Obama admitted to any, except in the most oblique way?

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Hank-DeCat/100001190387982 Hank DeCat

        You actually aren’t disagreeing with me at all – I’m not advocating that a crate on top of the car is a “safe” way for the dog to travel. The only safe way (and it is really just safer than the alternatives because  it still carries risk because a dog isn’t anatomically equipped to travel via car) is a crate inside the car. My point is, people are calling the Seamus story “cruel” when they are traveling with dogs loose in the car, which is way more dangerous for the dog and that isn’t even addressing allowing them to stick their heads out of the window (which is crazy dangerous for the dog).

  • DianaLC

    KenoshaMarge

    You are a woman of my own heart.  I love Blue Danes, though I have been the proud servant of two Harlequin Danes and a Boston (black and white) during my life.  I could give many, many, many stories of the way they kept me smiling and laughing.

    The cat I use as my icon is/was my soul mate if I’ve ever had one.  He recently died at the age of 21 and 1/2 –or about 102 years in human equivalency.  I miss him something awful.  He was raised by my Boston Dane Hector, and for the rest of his life he really truly believed he was a big as Hector. 

    When they were both young, they used to love to taunt the neighbor cat.  Hobbes would jump over the six-foot wood fence into the neighbor’s yard to get the neighbor cat to chase him back into our yard, where he knew Hector would be standing.  Hector would not hurt a soul, so all he did was look at that cat, and back over the fence it jumped.  he never learned.

    But on a sadder note.  I think some on the site know that my two current big babies are rescues from Iran, so who knows what they are really in terms of breed.  The male is 120 pounds and the female (his “twin” sister) is 100 pounds.  I keep in contact with their previous servant, the wonderful woman who founded the first (now there are two in two different cities) animal shelter in Iran.  She keeps it going from her home in Canada, where her husband had to take asylum.  There are many ex-patriot Iranians around the world who send her help. 
    She could not keep her dogs as her finances were frozen somewhat and so her dogs ended up in Best Friends animal shelter in Kanab, UT, where I found them when I spent some days there volunteering. 

    I have also worked for two years at an animal shelter in its education department, so–YES–there are far too many animals needing homes, but far fewer than there were back in the early 70′s when I worked in the shelter.  Sitll it’s a long road we have to go in that regard.

    But, I want to pass along this email my babies’s previous mother sent me last Thursday.  In Iran, some of the more ridiculous imans claim that dog ownership is Western corruption.  So many Iranians who could don’t own dogs for fear of reprisal.  Most others can’t afford to have dogs.  At her shelter one of the favorite days is the day each month that people can come and check out a dog to take them on a walk.

    In any case, here is her email.  I can’t get the video she sent to post and it no longer works when I tried to find it off the email.  (Maybe others can get it.)

    “Last Thursday and Friday , some pet owners at this park, inside Tehran, were surprised by a sudden and pre empted attack by the City Security Guard team,while they were walking their dogs! As a result of such move, about 20 dogs were taken , without any warning, away from their owners; and all possible protests by their legal owners were left with no avail.”
    “In this video which was posted on Iran SPCA page: (http://www.iranspca.com/910127.mpg), one can witness the unsanitary atmosphere that depicts these poor animals state of despair and confusion. Apparently, some citizens were under the assumption that the increasing usage of this facility by pet owners makes it completely safe, especially that it’s under supervision of Environmental Society..!
    “We will let you know of any unfolding news.”

    • DianaLC

      OOPS!  I forgot to mention that I too wish we could get away from this juvenile style of politics.  I say it over and over–it reminds me of all the silly student council elections I’ve watched over the years as a public school teacher.  It’s as if these people never grow up.

      Great post-thanks!  (Sorry I got carried away by my real passion in life–animal care issues.)

      • KataKimbe

        I am also a fan of Best Friends… thank you for saving those babies.

        • DianaLC

          If you get a chance ever, take a trip to Kanab and rent one of their cottages or cabins.  It is even more amazing than you can imagine.

          • KataKimbe

            I have friends who have done that. They all ended up falling in love.  They do a real good job, and the fact that they here in LA now are working with some shelters really has shown to help.  I used to watch DogTown on Nat. Geographic.  Great show.  Don’t know why they cancelled that one while they keep that whispering guy.

    • KenoshaMarge

      Boyo was bought “on sale” because he had a white patch on his chest and one white foot. A no-no for Blue Danes. I thought then, and still think now that he was beautiful.

       He was a loving companion and I miss him still. We had two mixed breed rescues at the same time, looked like cock-a-poos, and he was very tolerant of their silliness. As he was of ours.

      I “lusted” for a harelquin but after Boyo passed I just couldn’t seem to find the energy to look for one. Then life intruded and I was glad I hadn’t gotten another giant breed because I wouldn’t have been able to keep it.

      Now I have one rescued parrot, a blue and gold Macaw. Her brother and companion for 22 years died right after Christmas,  and keeping her company and happy is a full time job.

      Plus I worry about her after I am gone. She is likely to outlive me by decades if the abuse she received in her first 11 years of life don’t shorten hers considerably.

      • DianaLC

        When those giant dogs die, they leave the biggest hole in your home imaginable.  Every time I lost one of my Danes, I would automatically walk around all the places in the house where  he used to lie down, and I would walk with enough space to accomodate him since he was always beside me.  My cat spent at least a month looking for him after he died.  It was pretty sad.  You can see from my cat’s photo that they were quite the pair:  big black and white and little black and white. 

        None of my Danes were “show quality,” but I thought they were perfect.

        I really admire your willingness to take on the parrot.  It is a lifetime comitment, and they do require attention.  I have a friend who has two.   I have a distant relative who has big birds also.  So don’t worry about leaving before her–though God forbid it, since we want you around here.  Best Friends gets these birds often when their owners die and has good luck finding them homes, and you can always contact me.

  • HELENK2

    BREAKING: Family spokesman: Charles Colson, Watergate figure who turned to religion, has died at 80 – @AP
     

    • felizarte

      Great post Marge.  Finally, an adult perspective.

  • foxyladi14

    Great post Marge.