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Obama Ready to Economically Rape the Elderly

* Bumped Up *

Sounds a tad extreme but, when you look at the facts about what Obamacare will do to the elderly, there is no other conclusion. Watch this:

Obama tries to skate by with generalities and platitudes.

But the reality of Obamacare is a future of less medical care, more government intervention and control and higher costs.

Let Obama run on that come November. Good luck Champ.

  • mainbei649

    tinyurl.com/cyk9xz2 b

  • linwei873

    tinyurl.com/7zjh3zc uj

  • Earl Stick

    John Roberts is obviously letting his kids vote for him, like all the idiots who couldn’t make up their minds in 2008, so they let their kids decide who they should vote for, and they chose the American Idol guy.

    Or maybe he’s trying to be like Bill O’Reilly, saying in effect, “Look at how moderate I am! I’m not going to be the conservative asshole you thought I was! I’m going to let Obama touch my leg all he wants! I am NOT Sean Hannity!!”

  • HELENK2

    http://cnsnews.com/news/article/8733461-workers-federal-disability-exceed-population-new-york-city

    workers on federal disability now exceed population of NYC
    all I can say after reading this is WOW

  • Flop_Flipper

    I did something a little unusual today. I listened to “talk” radio for about 10 minutes. It really was all I could stand. The guy they had on was saying that because employers will pay the tax, the employees will need guvmint health insurance. And since there is what you might call a general trend of physicians not taking new patients with guvmint health insurance the employees will need to seek care in clinics. And clinics is what this dude suggests our healthcare facilities will become.

    If you like your healthcare you can keep it. What a load of crap.

    You can keep the same doctor. Total bullshit!

    It’s not a tax. I mean really, it isn’t. Couldn’t possibly be. No way. No how. Democrats tax the middle class? Surely you must be on drugs. Just say no. bama.

    • lola828

      What is “Government” insurance as you say? are you refering to medicare?

      If your employer does not cover you insurance there is no government insurance, only medicare if you are retirement age.

      Your comment makes no sense.

      What exact tax are you refering to? The penalty you have to pay if you do not buy health insurance. That only applies to people who do not buy health insurance. It will run at either about $600 a year or 2% of income, which ever is lower. It is a good thing that people who do not want to buy health insurance are fined or “taxed”. The rest of taxpayers should not have to pay for their health insurance, as is now the case.

  • KataKimbe

    It seems most polls now Americans are too busy to care and they don’t want to deal with this anymore.

    • Flop_Flipper

      I saw that, here and there. Healthcare isn’t the biggest issue for most Americans. Jobs are.

    • lola828

      The healthcare bills after +1 year of debate passed by a 60 vote Senate and now passes mustard with the SCOTUS. It is legitimate. Obama campaigned front and center on it. Get over it. The American people clearly want to move on. Most are gettting more comfort with it as they get to understand the reform. Current poll numbers are the most favorable they have ever been for the healthcare bills. As with everything the country is only split on party lines with many wanting to wait and see how it works out.

      • stodghie

        An Updated List of What’s Really in the ObamaCare Billby THE EDITORSAugust 10, 2009
        Note: As with all bills undergoing debate, there are different ‘markups’ in which sections are moved, specifics changed, and pages added or deleted. This bill is not yet final and is subject to change.

        • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure.

        • Page 30: A federal government health care advisory committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)

        • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer – they say in order to allow automated reconciliation with the related health care payment and remittance.

        • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)

        • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.

        • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No “judicial review” is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.

        • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages for participating plans .

        • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8 percent tax on payroll

        • Page 167: Any individual who doesn’t have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income.

        • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them).

        • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records.

        • Page 203: “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax.” Yes, it really says that.

        • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected.

        • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors’ time, their professional judgment, etc.

        • Page 272: a review of cancer hospital payments will be undertaken and costs adjusted accordingly.

        • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions.

        • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government.

        • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval.

        • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing.

        • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc.

        • Page 425: care provider must consult with government body regarding advanced care. More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia?

        • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory.

        • Page 425: Government provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death.

        • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient’s health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. This is an ORDER from the GOVERNMENT.

        • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services:

        • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN?

        As of August 13, the so-called “death panels” reportedly have been removed, so this will affect what was on page 425 abov

        Read more: Family Security Matters http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/id.3962/pub_detail.asp#ixzz1zZVXWVs8
        Under Creative Commons License: Attribution

  • foxyladi14

    Got my funeral plans all made.

    • Earl Stick

      Going somewhere? Well, I mean, soon? Hope not.

  • buzzlatte3

    OTish: Happy 4th of July! Romney retakes lead over Obama in Rasmussen Daily Presidential Tracking Report. Barry back down to -19 on the job approval scale. No bounce! 70% of Americans agree that the government only governs by the consent of the people via Declaration of Independence! *Roberts looks like he made an idiot decision but he’s firing up the patriots! Method to madness?!

    • lola828

      Yeah… Rasmussen is not a bias poll. WIth all other polls Obama is ahead and in fact has increased his chances of getting re-elected, given his lead in battleground states has increased.

      • stodghie

        figures don’t lie but liars figure.

      • buzzlatte3

        Oops, LOLa your ignorance is showing. Rasmussen is an automated poll. No room for human error such as college students marking the box for the guy they like instead of the real response

      • Hokma

        And for the umteenth time . . . .
        Rasmussen and Gallup have been proven to be THE most reliable polls . . . . Next . . .

  • jrterrier

    for those who haven’t read the dissenting opinion, it is a very well written document:
    The issue is not whether Congress had the power to frame the minimum-coverage provision as a tax, but whether it did so.

    In answering that question we must, if “fairly possible,” Crowell v. Benson, 285 U. S. 22, 62 (1932), construe the provision to be a tax rather than a mandate-with-penalty, since that would render it constitutional rather than un- constitutional (ut res magis valeat quam pereat). But we cannot rewrite the statute to be what it is not. “‘”[A]l- though this Court will often strain to construe legis- lation so as to save it against constitutional attack, it must not and will not carry this to the point of perverting the purpose of a statute . . .” or judicially rewriting it.’” Commodity Futures Trading Comm’n v. Schor, 478 U. S. 833, 841 (1986) (quoting Aptheker v. Secretary of State, 378 U. S. 500, 515 (1964), in turn quoting Scales v. United States, 367 U. S. 203, 211 (1961)). In this case, there is simply no way, “without doing violence to the fair meaning of the words used,” Grenada County Supervisors v. Brogden, 112 U. S. 261, 269 (1884), to escape what Congress enacted: a mandate that individuals maintain minimum essential coverage, enforced by a penalty.
    Our cases establish a clear line between a tax and a penalty: “‘[A] tax is an enforced contribution to provide forthe support of government; a penalty . . . is an exaction imposed by statute as punishment for an unlawful act.’” United States v. Reorganized CF&I Fabricators of Utah, Inc., 518 U. S. 213, 224 (1996) (quoting United States v. La Franca, 282 U. S. 568, 572 (1931)). In a few cases, this Court has held that a “tax” imposed upon private conduct was so onerous as to be in effect a penalty. But we have never held—never—that a penalty imposed for violation of the law was so trivial as to be in effect a tax. We have never held that any exaction imposed for violation of the law is an exercise of Congress’ taxing power—even when the statute calls
    In answering that question we must, if “fairly possible,” Crowell v. Benson, 285 U. S. 22, 62 (1932), construe the provision to be a tax rather than a mandate-with-penalty, since that would render it constitutional rather than un- constitutional (ut res magis valeat quam pereat). But we cannot rewrite the statute to be what it is not. “‘”[A]l- though this Court will often strain to construe legis- lation so as to save it against constitutional attack, it must not and will not carry this to the point of perverting the purpose of a statute . . .” or judicially rewriting it.’” Commodity Futures Trading Comm’n v. Schor, 478 U. S. 833, 841 (1986) (quoting Aptheker v. Secretary of State, 378 U. S. 500, 515 (1964), in turn quoting Scales v. United States, 367 U. S. 203, 211 (1961)). In this case, there is simply no way, “without doing violence to the fair meaning of the words used,” Grenada County Supervisors v. Brogden, 112 U. S. 261, 269 (1884), to escape what Congress enacted: a mandate that individuals maintain minimum essential coverage, enforced by a penalty.

    Our cases establish a clear line between a tax and a penalty: “‘[A] tax is an enforced contribution to provide forthe support of government; a penalty . . . is an exaction imposed by statute as punishment for an unlawful act.’” United States v. Reorganized CF&I Fabricators of Utah, Inc., 518 U. S. 213, 224 (1996) (quoting United States v. La Franca, 282 U. S. 568, 572 (1931)). In a few cases, this Court has held that a “tax” imposed upon private conduct was so onerous as to be in effect a penalty. But we have never held—never—that a penalty imposed for violation of the law was so trivial as to be in effect a tax. We have never held that any exaction imposed for violation of the law is an exercise of Congress’ taxing power—even when the statute calls
    it a tax, much less when (as here)the statute repeatedly calls it a penalty. When an act “adopt[s] the criteria of wrongdoing” and then imposes a monetary penalty as the “principal consequence on thosewho transgress its standard,” it creates a regulatory penalty, not a tax. Child Labor Tax Case, 259 U. S. 20, 38 (1922).

    So the question is, quite simply, whether the exaction here is imposed for violation of the law. It unquestion-ably is. The minimum-coverage provision is found in 26 U. S. C. §5000A, entitled “Requirement to maintain minimum essential coverage.” (Emphasis added.) It commands that every “applicable individual shall . . . ensure that the individual . . . is covered under minimum essential coverage.” Ibid. (emphasis added). And the immediately following provision states that, “[i]f . . . an applicable individual . . . fails to meet the requirement of subsection (a) . . . there is hereby imposed . . . a penalty.” §5000A(b)(emphasis added). And several of Congress’ legislative”findings” with regard to §5000A confirm that it sets fortha legal requirement and constitutes the assertion of regulatory power, not mere taxing power. See 42 U. S. C. §18091(2)(A) (“The requirement regulates activity . . .”);§18091(2)(C) (“The requirement . . . will add millions of new consumers to the health insurance market . . .”); §18091(2)(D) (“The requirement achieves near-universal coverage”); §18091(2)(H) (“The requirement is an essential part of this larger regulation of economic activity, and the absence of the requirement would undercut Federal regulation of the health insurance market”); §18091(3) (“[T]he Supreme Court of the United States ruled that insuranceis interstate commerce subject to Federal regulation”).
    So the question is, quite simply, whether the exaction here is imposed for violation of the law. It unquestion-ably is. The minimum-coverage provision is found in 26 U. S. C. §5000A, entitled “Requirement to maintain minimum essential coverage.” (Emphasis added.) It commands that every “applicable individual shall . . . ensure that the individual . . . is covered under minimum essential coverage.” Ibid. (emphasis added). And the immediately following provision states that, “[i]f . . . an applicable individual . . . fails to meet the requirement of subsection (a) . . . there is hereby imposed . . . a penalty.” §5000A(b)(emphasis added). And several of Congress’ legislative”findings” with regard to §5000A confirm that it sets fortha legal requirement and constitutes the assertion of regulatory power, not mere taxing power. See 42 U. S. C. §18091(2)(A) (“The requirement regulates activity . . .”);§18091(2)(C) (“The requirement . . . will add millions of new consumers to the health insurance market . . .”); §18091(2)(D) (“The requirement achieves near-universal coverage”); §18091(2)(H) (“The requirement is an essential part of this larger regulation of economic activity, and the absence of the requirement would undercut Federal regulation of the health insurance market”); §18091(3) (“[T]he Supreme Court of the United States ruled that insuranceis interstate commerce subject to Federal regulation”).

  • lola828

    How many of you eldely NQ regulars have benefited from lower prescritpion drug costs due to closing the “donut hole” with Medicare because of the ACA bills?

    • scottymac54

      It’s still insufficient, and doesn’t address the question of why pharmaceuticals are so expensive here, as opposed to being so much cheaper, in all nations with single-payer health systems.
      Doctors have abdicated their role in the treatment cycle, and few knowledgeable truthtellers who don’t answer to a profit-driven agenda are permitted to exist.
      Sadly, your candidate dwells on the wrong side of this crooked paradigm, whereas Hillary would have succeeded in eradicating it entirely (and we could have all moved on).

      • lola828

        Yeah Hillary Clinton did such a great job last time around.

        • Hokma

          The last time around? I don’t recall that she was ever President. Did we miss something?

          • buzzlatte3

            LOLa’s on auto-response.

          • scottymac54

            I think he’s referring to the “Hillarycare” period….

            • Hokma

              That was when Hillary was new to DC (wet behind the ears) and got slapped down.
              You’re supposed to learn from bad experiences and Hillary certainly did from that experience and rose well above it as Senator.
              Obama had the advantage of the experiences of others like that and others and learned ZERO.

      • buzzlatte3

        The docs have had their role taken from them by big Pharma. We don’t really know what Hillary would have done. Still, no government intrusion thank-you.

        • scottymac54

          Obama was VERY, very stupid not to address the tort reform issue, which is overdue. I don’t believe doctors should be forced to carry “malpractice” insurance, because the whole concept is false….patients run to these crooked ambulance chasers and trial lawyers before they’ve even finished the course of treatment, so, of course the diagnostic process is completely screwed. What gives you the right to sue, when you’re seeking the doctor’s advice, out of your own volition?
          I realize that this is unpopular, but no amount of money can bring your health back, things do just go wrong, and the amounts and frequency of these lawsuits is out of control.
          I do think you should be allowed to sue pharmaceutical companies and hospitals, but only to establish a clear record of fault, and only for a token amount.
          So I WANT “government healthcare”, but there is no way there can be no accountability, and no responsibility, on the part of the patient.
          I want a doctor to be no more prestigious of a profession than an auto mechanic or a lab technician. But soaking them for things that just happen in life is just wrong-it cannot be a free-for-all, where doctors, patients, and the insurance companies conspire with the system in order to cheat for big $$$$$.
          We need to take that profit motive away (at least for a while).

          • Hokma

            Very well said.
            Would only add to that is one of the primary drivers of higher healthcare cost is unnecessary testing and procedures because of the fear of lawsuits. You can call it the CYA effect of out-of-control lawsuits.

    • buzzlatte3

      – if the drug is on the approved list and only IF. So how’s the vodka today for you and your two commie-rades?

  • jrterrier

    the best that I’ve seen explaining my concern that there is no such thing as a free lunch. note that the article cites Obama-friendly people, who still predict huge increases and ineffeciencies in insurance costs:

    “The logic

    On the day of the Supreme Court decision, President Obama was ebullient. “Insurance companies can no longer impose lifetime limits on the amount of care you receive,” he said. “They can no longer discriminate against children with preexisting conditions. They can no longer drop your coverage if you get sick. They can no longer jack up your premiums without reason. They are required to provide free preventive care like check-ups and mammograms. . . . All of this is happening because of the Affordable Care Act.”

    But the simplest way to explain the economics of insurance is: There’s no such thing as a free lunch. Every one of those “benefits” that the president touts makes insurance more expensive for the vast majority of Americans.

    The law’s famous guarantee that you can buy insurance after you’re already sick—the situation otherwise known as “preexisting conditions”—gives Americans a huge incentive to go without insurance until they fall ill. The dirty secret of the law’s individual mandate is that it’s too weak: Millions will decide to pay the $695 fine, knowing they can buy insurance later, instead of ponying up $15,000 for health insurance. Their absence, in turn, will drive adverse selection, the process by which only the sickest people buy insurance, driving premiums to unsustainably high levels.

    The law’s community-rating provision forces young people to pay far more for health insurance, in order to subsidize the old. This is especially troubling given that the majority of people without insurance are under the age of 35. In some states, young people could see premium increases of as much as 75 percent, encouraging many of them to drop out of the system, thereby increasing costs for those who remains.

    The law’s requirements that plans cover a government-approved list of “minimum essential benefits” requires that every American will have to pay for things he or she isn’t likely to consume, like acupuncture and substance-abuse services. It’s like going to a restaurant where you’re forced to have a seven-course meal when you would have been just fine with three, and you don’t like salmon anyway.

    Indeed, by the very act of subsidizing insurance, the law drives up its cost. If you were given a clothes subsidy, would you spend the same amount on clothes as you did before, or splurge from time to time? The laws of economics don’t magically go away when you buy health insurance. One of the costliest aspects of the law is that it requires all plans on the new exchanges to have a generous financial value, called a “minimum actuarial value,” that will force everyone to buy costlier insurance.

    A tiny minority of people will benefit financially from Obamacare: those who have serious illnesses, who are uninsured today, and who have low-enough incomes to qualify for maximal subsidies. Everyone else will pay more. Jonathan Gruber, an MIT economist who helped design Obamacare, has predicted that individual-market premiums in Colorado will go up by 19 percent by 2016, owing to the Affordable Care Act. And that’s on top of existing health-care inflation. In Minnesota, Gruber projects, premiums will go up by 29 percent because of the law. In Wisconsin, they’ll go up by 30 percent. And remember: It’s not like health insurance is cheap today.”

    http://www.nationalreview.com/blogs/print/304532

    • Hokma

      None of this will eventually and quickly matter.
      There is one condition in this bill which is THE most important. If an employer of over 50 employees does not provide health insurance to their employees, they will be fined.
      The fact is that it is far more financially beneficial to these companies NOT to provide health insurance – pay the fine/tax – and let their employees take advantage of government provided health insurance.
      With this clause, as more and more companies opt not to provide insurance, private health insurance companies will cease providing policies and eventually cease doing business.
      This will directly result, by default, in all Americans being on the government provided health insurance with funding coming from private companies (fines) which will evenbtually become another entitlement program tax – although this one will be astronomical.

      • lola828

        How many employers with over 50 employees currently do not provide healthcare insurance? Most do, so that mandate will not apply to very many businesses at all and it is a good thing that employers provide health insurance.

        Many companies will also be getting tax breaks to help them provide health insurance for the first time. That is also a good thing.

        “The fact is that it is far more financially beneficial to these companies NOT to provide health insurance – pay the fine/tax – and let their employees take advantage of government provided health insurance.”

        That logic makes zero sense.

        By your logic then why don’t those companies just drop health coverage now or why didn’t they drop it in the past, as that would also be cheaper?

        Employers provide health insurance to their employees because they want to, because it is a benefit and considered as part of compensation to their employees. In a competitive labor market companies have to give these benefits to attract the best employees. Why would that change?

        Actual single-payer would be the best option. It is proven over and over again to be the best heathcare system in the world; cheaper and the best outcomes.

        • scottymac54

          “Actual single-payer would be the best option. It is proven over and over again to be the best heathcare system in the world; cheaper and the best outcomes…”
          100% CORRECT!
          And we will, one day, have it, too (no thanks to Barky, who allowed insurance vultures to WRITE his plan).

          • Hokma

            Single payer would be the best option? What do you think Ron Paul thinks about that?

            • scottymac54

              I don’t march in lockstep to Dr. Paul, or any other politician, for that matter.
              Who do you march in lockstep to, Hokma?
              Single-payer will, in short order, be the ONLY option left, for the nation to consider. And, fortunately, it’s a good one.
              You will, of course, be free to scrabble around from the sidelines, for as long as you can sustain your choices financially, and it remains worthwhile for such providers to attend to your needs.
              Your nonsensical economic model is going straight down the tubes, regardless of which placeholder wins in November.

              • Hokma

                1. My non-sensical economic model is free market capitalism.

                2. It’s Congressman Paul until he retires and goes back into practice. Then you can refer to him as Dr. Paul except unless you have a sex change you won’t be using him as a doctor.

            • lola828

              Ron Paul is a complete nut. That moron lives in a fantasy world made up in his small brain.

              • Hokma

                Ron Paul is a medical doctor dumbass.

                Any clue just how smart someone has to be to achieve a medical degree? How much work and dedication it takes to be a medical doctor?

                What do you do for a living? Probably your peak potential is standing at a drive-through window asking, “Will that be with fries?”

                “Small brain”? What a moron you are.

        • Hokma

          Doesn’t make sense?

          Try and follow this.

          Companies have provided health insurance to their employees in the past to be competitive in order to attract the best talent. There were no other options for individuals to get health insurance at affordable prices.

          But these health plans have escalated in price to companies – much of it they cannot just pass along to their employees. So they get hit in their own profits.

          Here comes the Federal govenment now forcing them to have that same health insurance or else. If they do not provide it then they will be fined.

          However, that fine is far lest costly than actually providing health insurance coverage.

          So it is now worthwhile for these employers to stop providing that coverage since the Federal government is providing an “option” for individuals to hook up with Obamacare insurance.

          How many of these 50+ employee companies will do this? There are many who have already said they would and it will ultimately be ALL of them.

          Tax breaks? Please don’t make up stuff.

          This is the intent of Obama, is o have a socialized medicine. Think you will like it. Try it first. Go live in the UK or France or Spain or Israel and see what happens. Call the government health bureau and they will eventually find you a doctor somewhere, sometime. But you have to wait and you have no choice of doctor. You need medication? Wait.

          • lola828

            Again your reply is exactly the same as your original reply and does not make any sense whatsoever.

            If firms cannot afford healthcare and if they want to drop coverage for their employees with or without heatlhcare reform they would drop coverage.. The reform makes no difference, other than for many firms they will not get a tax subsidy to help them pay for healthcare coverage for their employees. The reform and the corrresponding fines makes it less likely they drop coverage to their employees. In fact, the new health insurance exchanges under reform will increase competition and lower prices for businesses helping them keep and afford coverage for their employees.

            What is “Obamacare insurance”? I have never heard of it?

            You do know there are no actual government health insurance plans. Inviduals and companies still have to buy their own private health insurance.

            Do you have a clue what is even in the health insurance bills? You sound very ignorant.

            You do not even know their are tax breaks/subsidies in the bills.

            “Small Business Health Care Tax Credit

            This new credit helps small businesses and small tax-exempt organizations afford the cost of covering their employees and is specifically targeted for those with low- and moderate-income workers. The credit is designed to encourage small employers to offer health insurance coverage for the first time or maintain coverage they already have. In general, the credit is available to small employers that pay at least half the cost of single coverage for their employees.”

            http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=220809,00.html

            Give me one example of any single company of significance that has said they will drop health insurance coverage because of reform. You said many are going to and said they would, so put your money where you mouth is and tell us which companies have said this. Why would they drop coverage? That makes no sense. You are just completely talking out of your ass.

            How does healthcare reform that revolves around the entire private sector health insurance industry a move to socialized medicine. That makes zero sense. There is not even a public option.

            I have lived in different countries and they all have better healthcare systems than in the U.S. A move to “socialized” medicine would actually be a positive thing.

            • Hokma

              I have a company with employees and have to deal with the inital effects of this healthcare debacle disaster – and it will only get worse.

              From what you said you either do not know what the hell you are talking about and simply pick up on far left blogs (or directly from the Obama propaganda office), or you are lying. Either way you’re not worth responding to.

              As far as other countries having better healthcare you are lying and, frankly, I would suggest, you pack up and get the hell out the U.S. and go live among your socialist buddies in whatever other country you want where life is so much better.

              This country does NOT want any form of socialism and in November it will get its ass kicked. At that point I expect you will want to leave here.

              The U.S. is a “free” country. To left wing loons like you that means everything is for “free.” To the founding fathers and to the majority of americans that means they are free from the government intrusion and to make their own decisions and choices.

              • buzzlatte3

                Thank-you. The demdrones make it abundantly clear that they’ve never run anything more than an ipod in they’re air deprived lives.

              • lola828

                Freedom, freedom, freedom…. always the cheer from you guys. It becomes a hilarious parity. You guys are always so paranoid that someone is taking away your freedom…

                So lets deal with your company then.

                How many employees do you have? Less than 50? If so then you are 100% exempt from the healthcare legislation.

                Also, if you are a small company you qualify for the tax credits I reference above with my link to the IRS website, so if you want to you can provide healthcare to your employees with a tax break, but you would be exempt with under 50 employees so you do not have to.

                If you are more than 50 employees and you currently provide health insurance to your employees then nothing changes, as you are already in compliance with the law, as you are already providing health insurance coverage to your employees.

                If you do not provide health insurance coverage for your employees and you are over 50 employees then shame on you and you will now have to provide it under the law. However, you will be able to go into the new insurance exchanges, which will make things much more competitive amongst insurance companies, so you should be able to get better prices to buy health insurance for your employees. Or you can choose to continue to not provide health insurance and just pay the fine. The fine is actually an incentive for you to provide health insurance.

                If you disagree with any of this then tell me what am I getting wrong here?

                • Hokma

                  I have 24 employees and chose to provide full healthcare benefits at no cost to them. Up until 2011 it was a significant cost and rates increased every year.
                  But in the beginning of 2011 the rates began accelerating at a higher rate and the actual plans were being changed to comply with Obamacare law. Companies like Blue Cross/Blue Shield and others dropped entire plans for small businesses as a direct result of Obamacare.
                  These plans MUST have certain levels of benefits that were previously not required and frankly not necessary.
                  As far as taxes, while I do not qualify for the 50+ employee rules, there are enormous regulations and paperwork associated wiith any company that provides healthcare.
                  In my case, the plans I have are considered “cadillac plans” and will be taxed. So what benefit is there for me to continue to provide those plans to my employees? Then there are a plethora of other taxes the lib media fails to mention.
                  When you speak to healthcare professionals (who are not socialists) the clear direction of Obamacare is to create one nationalized healthcare plan.

            • stodghie

              your comments have to be among the dumbest i have seen today and i have seen some doozies.

              • lola828

                So then tell me what I am getting wrong? Your comment is pretty meaningless.

                • stodghie

                  Do you have a clue what is even in the health insurance bills? You sound very ignorant
                  lola i know what is in obamacare. most of it has nothing to do with health care. i know it is over reach to break the back of the american people is what i know. clearly this blew by you.
                  Give me one example of any single company of significance that has said they will drop health insurance coverage because of reform
                  pray tell lola this turd hasn’t gone into affect as yet. plans are being made for many comapnies to drop health care. they will implement as they need. please use some maturity and thought in you comments and questions.

      • buzzlatte3

        Hucklebee had two small business owners on his show last night. Insurance costs have already gone up for them at 22% in 2010 and then an additional 28% in 2011 – they HAVE to pass the increases on to their employees…or drop out and force their employees to get government “Yugo” insurance and care. The other thing no one who supports the fiasco realizes is that MDs are small business people, too. They can’t take on more govt business ie medicare or medicaid or ACA because they don’t get paid. Doctors cannot be forced to practice. Unless, course, the government coerces them to do so and then, baby, we are looking at soviet style life instead of American liberty!

        • Hokma

          Well Physicians are licensed by the state they work in so there is a way government can manipulate them.

          The eventual outcome of Obamacare would force doctors out of business or to set up private practices where patient would have to be able to pay without insurance. You already see some of that. It would result in two completely distinct quality of medical services between the haves and the have-nots which does not exist now.

          • buzzlatte3

            But, farther than that, doctors cannot be compelled to practice medicine, period. Yes, IF obamacare stands there will be a two tier system. The rich will get all they want and the rest will get the gubmint mess. It doesn’t seem worth the loss of freedom gambling on a maybe – maybe you’ll need this or that. Insurance is a shell game.

  • Popsmoke

    Its like I said, neither one of these two (Obama or Romney) could tell the truth if they were standing in front of St. Peter….

    Romney, Obama Uphold Health Care Falsehoods

    Presidential candidates supremely spin court decision.
    http://factcheck.org/2012/06/romney-obama-uphold-health-care-falsehoods/

    So it has boiled down to this. Which bullshit artist are you really going to vote for?

    • jrterrier

      Pop, you really have to stop relying on factcheck. their logic is faulty. they test what people say against what factcheck believes not against facts. last time you cited them, they chastised a romney advisory for citing accurate numbers where factcheck believed that statistics on the topic would more accurately reflect the truth. nevermind that the actual numbers cited were perfectly accurate.
      and here is a gem from the healthcare fact check you just cited:
      “Many Republicans have claimed the law’s Independent Payment Advisory Board will lead to a rationing of patient care. But as we have written repeatedly, the purpose of the 15-member panel of doctors and medical professionals, economists and health care management experts, and representatives for consumers is to find ways to slow the growth in Medicare spending.”
      so the test here is what factcheck has writtent repeatedly no what the facts are. how else will a payment advisory board (made up of beaurocrats) reduce costs except by rationing care. they’ve already made noises about reducing the frequency of mammograms.

  • Popsmoke

    Try this one….

    My Experience of the National Health Servicehttp://www.patheos.com/blogs/standingonmyhead/2012/06/my-experience-of-a-national-health-service.html

    • jrterrier

      link doesn’t work.

  • foxyladi14
  • HELENK2

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/06/white-house-to-blacks-we-reduced-crack-cocaine-penalties/

    read this and either cry or laugh
    valarie jarret to black reporters
    we have reduced penalties for crack cocaine possesion

  • buzzlatte3

    Anyone else see the weather in Washington DC? 2 million without power. That lightening rod I was talking about…they’re blaming Obama and talking about how he’s going to create shortages…..ha, ha, ha! I do hope that people will be safe and protected, though. Then a utilities union threatens to strike during the heatwave. Now it’s confirmed the patients are running the democratic insane asylum! DrudgeReports.

  • HELENK2

    Is this why the new president of Egypt promised one of his first acts would be to get the blink sheik back???

    http://www.soopermexican.com/mexiblog/

    • Hokma

      Re-elect Obama and as one of his first acts in 2013 Obama will fly the blind shiek himself back to Egypt on Air Force One.

      • scottymac54

        That wouldn’t affect my vote, one way or another.
        My thinking is, what set of circumstances would have caused such a character to set foot in this nation, and set up shop in the first place?
        What foolish choices have we made, that would cause such a person to establish himself here, and make the sorts of choices he made?

  • HELENK2

    http://freebeacon.com/szechuan-surprise/

    here is a ” holy Shit” moment, China has more warheads then estimated says retired Russian General

  • JohnnyTwoDog

    Here is the reality.

    It’s cheaper to pay the tax than to pay for insurance. So everyone, especially the young and healthy, who currently do not have/want insurance will opt for the cheaper plan to pay the tax.

    Those that opt to pay the tax can later get insurance when/if they suddenly need it because they can’t be turned down for a pre-existing condition.

    Individuals will opt for the cheaper tax, and businesses will opt for the cheaper tax. Businesses that have not been exempted altogether via “Pay to Play”, of course. It is what Obama would call a “No Brainer” decision.

    Meanwhile nothing has been done to lower or at least shrink the rate of increase for health costs and health insurance premiums. If fact, there will be more pressure on limited services as Medicade expands and more demand chases limited health care supply.

    Good work dimwits.

    As the Majority Opinion stated,
    “The guaranteed-issue and community-rating reforms do not, however, address the issue of healthy individuals who choose not to purchase insurance to cover potential healthcare needs. In fact, the reforms sharply exacerbate that problem, by providing an incentive for individuals to delay purchasing health insurance until they become sick, relying on the promise of guaranteed and affordable coverage.”

    “The reforms also threaten to impose massive new costs on insurers, who are required to accept unhealthy individuals but prohibited from charging them rates necessary to pay for their coverage. This will lead insurers to significantly increase premiums on everyone. ”

    “We do not consider whether the Act embodies sound policies.”

    “Those decisions are entrusted to our Nation’s elected leaders, who can be thrown out of office if the people disagree with them.”

    “It is not our job to protect the people from the consequences of their political choices.”

    We The People – We the Stupid Gullible People.

    • buzzlatte3

      WEll, according to Rasmussen, we the people are getting a little smarter…Presidential Daily Tracking Poll gives Obama a 2 point bump. Two – not five or eight or ten…with his healthcare “victory” he should be sailing to Nov. This isn’t over.

      • arabella_trefoil

        What’s the margin of error in that poll? Two points is nothing.

        • buzzlatte3

          exactly – no statistical advantage gained by Obama. I expect the drip, drip, drip of the remaining four months will further erode his popularity.

  • HELENK2

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/06/unreal-obama-threatens-to-veto-defense-bill-unless-it-hikes-healthcare-fees-for-service-members/

    backtrack threatens to veto defense bill unless it hikes healhcare fee for service members

    get him gone

    • buzzlatte3

      Now he pisses off the military. What does it take to get a 72 hour involuntary in a psych unit for this guy?

      • scottymac54

        Buzz, I don’t think we can rule out that this hasn’t already happened.
        Obama has never seen very, for lack of a better phrase, “strong-minded” or resilient, to me.
        In fact, I wouldn’t rule out, from some of his behavioral patterns, him being on some sort of very powerful psychotropic medication, or even a mind-control experiment.
        I know people who were practically enraptured by him in 2008, who now get visibly agitated when his name is brought up.
        We are instinctive creatures. There has to be some reason (besides our reasons) why he brings such powerful emotional reactions in everyday people.

  • HARP2

    Let`s just see what Odumbo has to try and sell.

    This on top of existing taxes.

    Taxes that take effect in 2013:

    Surtax on Investment Income ($123 billion/Jan. 2013): Creation of a new, 3.8 percent surtax on investment income
    earned in households making at least $250,000 ($200,000 single). This
    would result in the following top tax rates on investment income: Bill: Reconciliation Act; Page: 87-93

    Hike in Medicare Payroll Tax ($86.8 bil/Jan 2013)

    Tax on Medical Device Manufacturers ($20 bil/Jan
    2013): Medical device manufacturers employ 360,000 people in 6000 plants
    across the country. This law imposes a new 2.3% excise tax. Exempts
    items retailing for <$100. Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,980-1,986
    Raise "Haircut" for Medical Itemized Deduction from 7.5% to 10% of AGI
    ($15.2 bil/Jan 2013): Currently, those facing high medical expenses are
    allowed a deduction for medical expenses to the extent that those
    expenses exceed 7.5 percent of adjusted gross income (AGI). The new
    provision imposes a threshold of 10 percent of AGI. Waived for 65+
    taxpayers in 2013-2016 only. Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,994-1,995

    Flexible Spending Account Cap – aka “Special Needs Kids Tax”
    ($13 bil/Jan 2013): Imposes cap on FSAs of $2500 (now unlimited).
    Indexed to inflation after 2013. There is one group of FSA owners for
    whom this new cap will be particularly cruel and onerous: parents of
    special needs children. There are thousands of families with special
    needs children in the United States, and many of them use FSAs to pay
    for special needs education. Tuition rates at one leading school that
    teaches special needs children in Washington, D.C. (National Child Research Center) can easily exceed $14,000 per year. Under tax rules, FSA dollars can be used to pay for this type of special needs education. Bill: PPACA; Page: 2,388-2,389
    Elimination of tax deduction for employer-provided retirement Rx drug coverage in coordination with Medicare Part D ($4.5 bil/Jan 2013) Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,994

    $500,000 Annual Executive Compensation Limit for Health Insurance Executives ($0.6 bil/Jan 2013). Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,995-2,000

    Taxes that take effect in 2014:

    Individual Mandate Excise Tax (Jan 2014): Starting in
    2014, anyone not buying “qualifying” health insurance must pay an income
    surtax according to the higher of the following Exemptions for religious objectors, undocumented immigrants,
    prisoners, those earning less than the poverty line, members of Indian
    tribes, and hardship cases (determined by HHS). Bill: PPACA; Page: 317-337

    Employer Mandate Tax (Jan 2014): If an employer
    does not offer health coverage, and at least one employee qualifies for a
    health tax credit, the employer must pay an additional non-deductible
    tax of $2000 for all full-time employees. Applies to all employers with
    50 or more employees. If any employee actually receives coverage
    through the exchange, the penalty on the employer for that employee
    rises to $3000. If the employer requires a waiting period to enroll in
    coverage of 30-60 days, there is a $400 tax per employee ($600 if the
    period is 60 days or longer). Bill: PPACA; Page: 345-346

    Combined score of individual and employer mandate tax penalty: $65 billion/10 years

    Tax on Health Insurers ($60.1 bil/Jan 2014):
    Annual tax on the industry imposed relative to health insurance premiums
    collected that year. Phases in gradually until 2018. Fully-imposed on
    firms with $50 million in profits. Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,986-1,993
    Taxes that take effect in 2018:

    Excise Tax on Comprehensive Health Insurance Plans
    ($32 bil/Jan 2018): Starting in 2018, new 40 percent excise tax on
    “Cadillac” health insurance plans ($10,200 single/$27,500 family).
    Higher threshold ($11,500 single/$29,450 family) for early retirees and
    high-risk professions. CPI +1 percentage point indexed. Bill: PPACA; Page: 1,941-1,956

    http://atr.org/full-list-obamacare-tax-hikes-a6996?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AmericansForTaxReformRssFULL+%28Americans+for+Tax+Reform+FULL+CONTENT+RSS%29

  • Flop_Flipper

    Obama and his donkey-assed minions claim that their healthcare policy is not a tax even though the Supreme Court and their Democrat appointed allies have declared it to be so.

    When petitioning the Supreme Court, the Obama Administration specifically declared that Congress had the authority to impose taxes and that the penalty for not complying with the mandate is a tax.

    The United States argues in its petition that the Eleventh Circuit decision is wrong and that the minimum coverage requirement is constitutional. It contends, as it has in all of the cases so far, that Congress had the power to enact the law under its authority to regulate interstate commerce, to impose taxes (arguing that the exaction imposed on those who do not purchase insurance is a tax), and to enact laws “necessary and proper” to effectuate its other constitutional powers.

    Regardless of what comes out of both sides of their lying mouths, the truth will set us free.

  • Popsmoke

    Well LJ we are normally on the same page, well most of the times anyway. I have a great deal of respect for you and think you need to keep pounding away at government largesse. I watched you take some real hits and deliver some real hit testifying on the Hill or during interviews.

    However, on this topic we disagree. Look we are the only western nation that does not have a national medical insurance program for those who cannot afford it.

    I look at things very differently.

    The Robert’s decision kills any attempt of a federalized central government based on the commerce clause. For this dittos to Roberts for holding up the rule of law. It also strikes at the heart of the federal government forcing states to follow it mandates by coercion. Again dittos to Roberts.

    Roberts called it what it was.. a tax based program. Once again dittos.

    Anyone who attacks John Roberts for this ruling in my personal opinion, is a complete and total moron and jackass. Tea Party call for Roberts to step down because of his ruling are just foxtrotting outrageous .. http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2012/06/the_politics_of_the_obamacare_decision.html .

    Now funding. Yes this will be paid for by taxes as well as alternative sources of revenues, meaning foreign and domestics investments, but for the most part the money will come from government coffers. Like most major social programs. Though the republicans are doing they’re best to cut most of those programs while layering pork over pork over pork on national security and defense. That LJ is a moral crime far worse than Fast and Furious.

    No the ACA its not a completely great piece of legislation and has many, many faults that need to be worked out. Eventually like social security, medicare and medicaid there will be course corrections. Congress must act like grown ups and not as over stuffed bought and paid for fat pigs.

    But for the sake of human dignity I am willing to pay those extra taxes to help others who are in worse shape than I am and I am not in great medical shape either. I am also willing to try this and work with it to make it better not just screw it over and kill the entire act. Mitt Romney should be ashamed of himself for playing that political flute. Romney-care was the grandfather for the ACA. He is going to have a very hard time fighting that.

    As far as the private sector goes? I expect to see a drop in insurance rates. Just like what happened in Massachusetts. But I am dead set against privatizing any part of this program at the moment without very strict oversight.

    LJ you now as well as I do that privatizing most things in government normally tends to cost the American public more than if federal workers were doing the job. Matter of fact POGO did that study, http://pogoblog.typepad.com/pogo/2012/06/occupational-education-1-the-cost-of-contractor-accounting-services.html . We should not and cannot privatize the fiduciary responsibility of this program without very strong oversight.

    When we privatize without the proper controls in place that job costs more than it was worth. So who the hell is Romney or for that matter any other politician either democratic or republican who wants to privatize government kidding?

    Romney placating the right wing of the republican party will come back to bite him in the ass. Yes he is correct the legislation and now upheld law is flawed. So the great bastion of private enterprise and job creation says what? Dump the entire act? What the foxtrot is wrong with this man? He knows as well as you and I that killing this entire act is NOT POSSIBLE and politically would hurt him more than anything else. What can he really do? Modify the act to republican likings is mostly what can be done. Otherwise this is mostly political duckspeak to beat the drums of election war.

    So now for the next few weeks the American public will be bombarded by false and erroneous statements by both Romney and the republicans and Obama and the democrats all for the sake of an election?

    So how many American suffer and even die because of the lack or improper of health insurance? How many died because of Fast and Furious?

    LJ, in my book, this is one of the most stupidest arguments we Americans can ever have.

    • EllenD818

      I agree with you Popsmoke. We pride ourselves on being the leaders of the Western world but don’t show respect for our citizens by taking care of the neediest.

      My admiration goes to the Nuns on tour for defying the establishment and staying true to their principles. How can we even think of ourselves as the greatest nation on earth when we squabble over health care for everyone, and let the banks become organized crime?

      • Hokma

        “but don’t show respect for our citizens by taking care of the neediest.”

        One of the first thngs Rudy Giuliani did as Mayor was get homeless people off the streets and created shelters for them.

        Conservatives contribue far more to charities than liberals do.

        All liberals have done is create a class of people who have become dependent on government for all their needs and keep them foreever entrenched in poverty.

        You want to see how badly a society can treat its most needy? Then go to almost any other country and walk the streets in the winter.

        Maybe then you’ll have a better perspective on this subject.

        • buzzlatte3

          Oh this is so much closer to the truth than the whine that we don’t honor our poor. Please, study all the programs available and quit buying the garbage that the poor don’t have any access to anything. That’s Poppy’s bullshit liberal talking point. It’s a fallacy and if someone is doing without – check out their preferred lifestyle. You see no one can be forced to use the programs and the ones that don’t are the ones that the libbies use as the argument. Be real, not disingenuous, Poppy. Here’s the kicker!! LOL! The guy who recently REDUCED programs for the poor is the ever famous Gov. Jerry Brown, ol’ Moonbeam himself, from – do we need to be reminded – the ever navy blue state of California!!! LOL!!! Stop spreading the lies!

        • EllenD818

          Hokma. I’ve LIVED in other countries. I presume you mean Western because I’m not going to pat myself on the back for being better than third world countries. I haven’t found that other Western countries treat their needy badly. And I’m tired of Liberal vs Conservative mantras.

          • Hokma

            I am speaking specifically about France, UK, Germany, Spain, Ukjraine, Russia, Japan, and Australia. In many of these countries, they are in plain sight.

            • EllenD818

              Never saw them in the UK, France, Germany, Spain, or Australia.
              The other three I’ll have to take your word for but I’d be surprised at Japan.

              • Hokma

                At night they become more apparent – in certain parks and neighborhoods. The saddest thing is walking the streets on Christmas Day in Madrid or Paris and seeing these people in the cold.

                • EllenD818

                  Thanks, Hokma. Wasn’t in Madrid on Christmas Day – spent it in Toledo Spain instead so I will take your observation.

      • scottymac54

        100% correct! Thank you, Ellen.

        • stodghie

          100% wrong!

          • scottymac54

            You are 100% stupider than Palin (and that’s quite an accomplishment).

            • stodghie

              look in a mirror when you say that!

            • jrterrier

              great. let’s get to namecalling because that shows how much smarter we are than sarah palin or the next person. NOT

      • stodghie

        ellen explain to me where the money is coming from for ‘taking care of the neediest”????? we don’t have any dang money. fact it we are frigging broke.obama is using this to break the back of the american people. where is all that sympaythy you talk about for the average american paying his bills and not having a bunch of childeren to pay mom’s bills like many on welfare for generations do? there won’t be any money to pay for our care or their care with the crap of shit obama foisted on us with the help of the delusional who don’t know how to use a calculator.
        also i am sick and tired of the pointed fingers indicating we don’t care. hell we are the most sympathetic and compassinate people in the world. there won’t be any money for anybody’s health care with this crap staring at us.

        furthemore where is all the sympathy for the elderly with obamacare raping medicare. let me tell you in plain english what that means. death for the elderlly by restricting their care and medicine. so wake up and smell the dung.

        So let’s just deal with the damn facts.
        Fact ONE–The Court said that Obama was wrong in his repeated insistence that his Health Care act was not a tax. Nope. It is a tax.
        Fact TWO–States cannot be required to expand Medicare rolls.
        I think Judge Roberts did what he was selected to do–judge the strict merits of the law. He reaffirmed the right of the Federal Government to tax your ass off. He rejected the notion that the Federal Government can demand that you buy health insurance. This by no means settles or erases the controversies surrounding this law. The problems remain.
        What does all of this mean? Bad news for Obama going into the election. If this was a popular law and embraced by a majority of Americans, then Obama would be running on it. He is not. He has not attached himself to it. Now he will have to. No matter what the Court says about Constitutionality, it does not alter the reality that businesses face in trying to deal with this turd of legislation. Romney just got a gift. Let the Obama folks celebrate all they can. It is a Pyrrhic victory at best

        • EllenD818

          I believe we should be taxing large financial transactions a small percentage.Yes, I used the “T” word.
          All this squabbling over welfare moms and healthcare is designed to set us peasants fighting with each other while the oligarchs continue to rape our country.

    • Hokma

      “However, on this topic we disagree. Look we are the only western nation that does not have a national medical insurance program for those who cannot afford it. “

      How many people from other countries come here for healthcare because of higher quality and how many Americans go elsewhere for their healthcare? Exactly how many American physicians move to practice in other countries and how many foreign trained physicians comes to practice in the United States?

      National healthcare reduces the quality of medical care and aside from the loon socialist studies who can point to in left wing news that is a decided fact.

      “I look at things very differently. “

      You look at things much the same way Obama does. That is now very clear.

      “The Robert’s decision kills any attempt of a federalized central government based on the commerce clause. For this dittos to Roberts for holding up the rule of law. It also strikes at the heart of the federal government forcing states to follow it mandates by coercion. Again dittos to Roberts.”

      Obamacare will inevitably be one single government run healthcare system. So no kudos for Roberts.

      “Roberts called it what it was.. a tax based program. Once again dittos. “

      Since when is it legal to use taxing to punish? The dissenting justices were correct in citing the Stamp Act of 1765. This will hopefully have the same effect as that did – crush an authoritarian government and impose a government that grants us more freedom.

      “Anyone who attacks John Roberts for this ruling in my personal opinion, is a complete and total moron and jackass. Tea Party call for Roberts to step down because of his ruling are just foxtrotting outrageous .. http://www.americanthinker.com….”

      Anyone who sides with Roberts on this decision is a jerk. Roberts essentially maneuvered the position of Obama to give him his law. He did not do it because of the rule of law. He did it to save his legacy because he is more politically thin-skinned than even Obama.

      “Now funding. Yes this will be paid for by taxes as well as alternative sources of revenues, meaning foreign and domestics investments, but for the most part the money will come from government coffers. Like most major social programs. Though the republicans are doing they’re best to cut most of those programs while layering pork over pork over pork on national security and defense. That LJ is a moral crime far worse than Fast and Furious.”

      I can’t even begin to respond to nonsense like this.

      “As far as the private sector goes? I expect to see a drop in insurance rates.”

      Unfortunately for your delusional view, health insurance rates have already escalated at a greater rate to factor in Obamacare and some companies have dropped programs for small businesses already such as Blue Cross/Blue Shield. That is not some Huffington Post bullshit – those are plain facts.

      The full intent of Obamacare is to create DIS-incentives to companies for keeping employee health insurance and thereby forcing more and more, and eventually everyone, onto one government run healthcare plan.

      “LJ you now as well as I do that privatizing most things in government normally tends to cost the American public more than if federal workers were doing the job. Matter of fact POGO did that study, http://pogoblog.typepad.com/po… . We should not and cannot privatize the fiduciary responsibility of this program without very strong oversight.”

      POGO – yet another far left-wing organization. Privatizing does NOT increase costs. Government control and regulation does. Now I know where you get your socialist fantasies from.

      “He knows as well as you and I that killing this entire act is NOT POSSIBLE and politically would hurt him more than anything else. What can he really do? Modify the act to republican likings is mostly what can be done.”

      How do you modify a turd? Do even begin to understand the details of this policy and, more importantly, how this will play out? Are you that ignorant of the facts or are you that socialist to believe in it?

      Americans will demand that this bill be repealed and replaced with responsible and effective measures to lower healthcare costs and ensure coverage of all legal citizens.

      “So how many American suffer and even die because of the lack or improper of health insurance? How many died because of Fast and Furious? “

      Tell me? How many? And try not going to your far left wing support groups. The FACT is that in this country NO ONE is turned down at any hospital. NO physician allows a patient – particularly an indigent patient – to not get essential care. You don’t know a friggin thing about the medical profession, but you feel you can come on here and just call people names. The only jerk is you for being willfully ignorant and dishonest. If you were to send your comments to Dr. Ron Paul he would laugh hysterically and then ask you NOT to support him with crap like this.

    • scottymac54

      The bottom line here really is, “Do we hate Obama enough to gleefully embrace an opposing candidate that will take us back to the exact foreign policy goals, and massive debts, that will portrayed as “investments” to pacify the vulture class, and, despite Plame, despite Guantanamo, etc., justify it all as being worth it?”
      I, personally, can’t.
      Some will, because they approved of GWB in the first place, or profited handsomely from his policies. Obama’s excesses can be used to draw in centrists and Clinton Dems to inflate their sagging ranks and cement their position, while strengthening their base.
      A smaller percentage will use the “Overton Window” excuse to justify a total jump to support of Romney’s campaign, and full-scale support of establishment Republican parties, because it seems understandable and acceptable on the surface to anyone they feel compelled to explain themselves to.
      I see this manifested in the long, sometimes moving accounts of those with horrific accounts of past experiences with the existing, uniquely American healthcare clusterfuck. They regard their experiences as harbingers of any sort of organized healthcare reform (including, sadly, single-payer, the only plan that can work, and Hillary Clinton’s preferred goal), whereas I see all of this pain and suffering as a direct result of not attending to the healthcare crisis at all, the establishment Republican solution).
      So, the question of healthcare, and even Roberts’ decision have nothing to with anything….this is about opportunism and political realignment.
      As one pundit said, this makes the entire election about Obamacare. So, it’s insane to think any productive dialogue will come of it.
      Thank you for your insightful arguments.

      • Hokma

        “American healthcare clusterfuck”

        I am sick and tired of ignorant liberls like you denegrating our healthcare system with baseless hyperbole.

        Tell us precisely why the American healthcare system is a “clusterfuck?”

        And when you finish with that, explain to us just how you and Popsmoke are agreement on Obamacare with Dr. Ron Paul.

        • scottymac54

          “I am sick and tired of ignorant liberls like you denegrating our healthcare system with baseless hyperbole…”
          Get used to it….

          • Hokma

            So you are admitting to being an “ignorant liberal.”

      • stodghie

        So let’s just deal with the damn facts.

        Fact ONE–The Court said that Obama was wrong in his repeated insistence that
        his Health Care act was not a tax. Nope. It is a tax.

        Fact TWO–States cannot be required to expand Medicare rolls.

        I think Judge Roberts did what he was selected to do–judge the strict merits of
        the law. He reaffirmed the right of the Federal Government to tax your ass off.
        He rejected the notion that the Federal Government can demand that you buy
        health insurance. This by no means settles or erases the controversies
        surrounding this law. The problems remain.

        What does all of this mean? Bad news for Obama going into the election. If this
        was a popular law and embraced by a majority of Americans, then Obama would be
        running on it. He is not. He has not attached himself to it. Now he will have
        to. No matter what the Court says about Constitutionality, it does not alter
        the reality that businesses face in trying to deal with this turd of
        legislation. Romney just got a gift. Let the Obama folks celebrate all they
        can. It is a Pyrrhic victory at best
        what larry johnson said!

      • jrterrier

        oh, please. Romney has shown himself throughout his entire life to be a person who makes decisions based on fact and logic. and he has been one of the most successful men to ever run for president. everything he has touched has turned to gold.

        i have no fear that he will launch us into another iraq.

        and for me it’s not about hatred for president obama. it is about his philosophical view that govt knows best and about his definition of “fairness” which looks only to the subgroup he chooses, whether it works or not and whether it is the way for the country to prosper. he would refuse to amputate a leg after gangrene set it because it isn’t fair for the person to have to live with only one leg. never mind that he won’t survive with the grangrened leg.

        it didn’t work in the Soviet Union, in Eastern Europe (compare before and after the Berlin was came down), in Maoist China, in Cuba, in NKorea, etc.

        just to be clear, I’m not calling the President a socialist or a communist. this is not about labels. it’s about results.

        • scottymac54

          I hear you. Nonetheless, I beseech you to look into who Romney has surrounded (or, more accurately, have surrounded him) on foreign policy.
          “Neocon” may be a label, but in this case, it’s an accurate description and frightening harbinger for the world.
          If you liked Cheney and his foreign policy goals, that’s fine, and then there’s no conflict in supporting Romney, which I realize you do in a big way.
          But if it raises red flags for you (and it should, if anything, because you should know how to respond to it), it’s essential for you to understand that it is the dealbreaker for voters like myself.
          I knocked Santorum,. Cain, and Gingrich off my “list” for similar reasons and I can’t very well be honest and consistent, and give Romney a pass, simply because he seems more reasonable on domestic issues.

    • stodghie

      roberts handed obama’s bowl of turds right back to him and told him to own thereby letting the american people see what fuckup obamacare is. geez get real. you missed the point again as usual. larry was right on and you fell overboard as usual.

      larry johnson got it right!

      So let’s just deal with the damn facts.
      Fact ONE–The Court said that Obama was wrong in his repeated insistence that his Health Care act was not a tax. Nope. It is a tax.
      Fact TWO–States cannot be required to expand Medicare rolls.
      I think Judge Roberts did what he was selected to do–judge the strict merits of the law. He reaffirmed the right of the Federal Government to tax your ass off. He rejected the notion that the Federal Government can demand that you buy health insurance. This by no means settles or erases the controversies surrounding this law. The problems remain.
      What does all of this mean? Bad news for Obama going into the election. If this was a popular law and embraced by a majority of Americans, then Obama would be running on it. He is not. He has not attached himself to it. Now he will have to. No matter what the Court says about Constitutionality, it does not alter the reality that businesses face in trying to deal with this turd of legislation. Romney just got a gift. Let the Obama folks celebrate all they can. It is a Pyrrhic victory at best

      • jrterrier

        there is much to criticize about the Roberts opinion even if you can argue that there is rough justice.

        the dissenters said it best: “The issue is not whether Congress had the power to frame the minimum-coverage provision as a tax, but whether it did so.”

        • stodghie

          not a constitutional scholar here jrterrier and thanks for your comments. what we do know that it is over reach via the commerce clause and is not legal. what else can it be? a penalty? NO so if it were to stand as legal then it would have to be a tax. yes that is twised and hard to understand. the fact is this is turd of the administration pretending to be health care but is much much more that would basically destroy the usa as we know it. that is why it is a turd.
          the obama administration did a lousy job in putting together needed legislation. i too among many here know we need change but change we can be proud of and will work and not destroy. there is where i find the liberal element here irritating bleating about cruel and uncaring we are and wanting up to join their march off the cliff supporting this peice of bs. they fell for the obama/liberal line of ideaology and making decisions on just feel good. that is not how the world works. you have to have something that is fair to all and doesn’t destroy those it is suppoed to serve. you documented very well the real damage that will be done and i admire your posts.

          • jrterrier

            i’m not a constitutuional scholar nor a health care expert. what i have learned from reading and listening to politicians and others is that Obamacare is hardly a fix for the health care problems, which are vast and which have gotten worse due to the economic downturn.
            there are a lot of people uninsured and underinsured. some by choice; some because of limited resources; some because their lives are otherwise non-productive in multiple ways — mental disease, drug & alcohol addiction, uneducated, criminal background, creeps trying to game the system — some of which is personal choice and some not.
            the mandate and the requirements for particular coverage don’t solve a lot of the problems and just make the system worse for the rest of us.

    • jrterrier

      Isn’t that what Medicaid does? I don’t believe an emergency room can turn away a sick person, with or without insurance.
      And as JohnnyTwoDog wrote above, for most people who fall into the uninsured category, paying the penalty (if it can even be collected) paying the penalty will be the less expensive thing to do. which will either cause insurance companies to get out of the business or pass on the costs to the rest of us.
      the idea that now insurance companies will have to provide free preventive care is just a ridiculous statement. nothing is free. someone has to pay for it; maybe not the person who is getting the free preventive care but someone will pay for it. are doctors, nurses, hospitals, the person who owns the building where the doctor’s offices are located, the labs and others involved with such “free” preventive care providers are willing to work for free?

    • jrterrier

      more on the reality that nothing is free. Most states are already straining to cover their portion of medicaid costs not covered by the fed govt.
      In OH, it is “estimated that 440,500 new people would be added to Medicaid at an additional cost to the state of $457 million over five years. “Until we figure out how to cover these new costs to Ohio taxpayers, we don’t have the luxury of considering whether to expand Medicaid,” said Robert Nichols, a spokesman for Kasich.
      The benefits and burdens of the Medicaid expansion are particularly great in states with the greatest number of low-income uninsured residents.
      In Texas, the expansion would add 1.2 million people to Medicaid in the first year and cost the state $27 billion over 10 years, said Stephanie Goodman, spokeswoman for the Texas Health and Human Services Commission.

    • jrterrier

      and just so i’m not just citing to Republican Governors, here is a pre-opinion article on the burdends of medicaid for CA and Jerry Brown’s attemtps to deal with the budget shortfall:
      Like many states, California is struggling to pay for the health insurance it
      offers poor residents. The ranks of the Medi-Cal program grew by more than 12% after the economy tanked, and
      rising healthcare costs increased the fiscal burden. Making matters worse, state
      officials kept trying to solve the problem mainly by paying doctors less for
      their services and charging Medi-Cal beneficiaries more, ignoring the skewed
      incentives and inefficiencies in the system that were driving costs higher.
      . . .
      The courts and the Obama administration have blocked several of the state’s
      cost-saving efforts over the past year. Although those decisions will make it
      harder for legislators to balance the budget, they should also force the state
      to start addressing the Medi-Cal problem at its root. . . .
      Medi-Cal is the state’s version of Medicaid, a joint effort by state and
      federal governments to provide health insurance to the poor. The higher a
      state’s average income, the less the federal government kicks in. Although
      California has an unusually large number of
      residents living in poverty, average incomes in the state are relatively high. As a consequence, it gets the
      bare minimum federal Medicaid contribution:
      50%.

  • shelldoll2

    If Obama is taking a victory lap I am LMAO. His Obamacare “victory” just cost him the election. The Supremes are either very smart or very stupid.

    Americans are furious and those WH idiots are too stupid to see that.

    There goes millions of votes Mister super smart. Those that may have been waffling are now firmly in the Romney camp.

    Nancy, “I’m a total idiot Pelosi and Harry I can walk and chew gum Reid just took out what was left of their party.”

    • FormerLiberal9

      Obama’s campaign has been focusing on keeping his base interested in the Campaign. But he seems to be doing a better job in solidifying the Republican base thru his policies. It seems like even the Mormon haters, for the most part, are rallying to Romney’s campaign. l was afraid that some of the social conservatives would boycott this election. But now thanks in a large part to Barrack’s governance I think Social Conservatives will turn out to vote for Romney in November. Because the consequences of another unfettered term for Obama seem catastrophic for many people.

      • stodghie

        nice analysis former liberal!

        • FormerLiberal9

          Thanks.

  • alicewolf

    Don’t bother running at all please, Mr Obama. Spare yourself the embarrassment. Take a look at the front page of this week’s Globe and take the hint. The Birth Certificate issue is back to haunt you again……………………….you still swaggin’?

  • HELENK2

    off topic

    there are no words

    http://weaselzippers.us/2012/06/29/obama-regime-contemplates-handing-taliban-detainees-over-to-afghanistan/

    backtrack wants to hand taliban detainees over to afghanistan

    • buzzlatte3

      The man is truly, at the very least, full on personality disordered.

  • buzzlatte3

    Wah oh….Supreme Court decision doesn’t poll well in CA or FL, or anywhere for that matter Breitbart.com Big Government

    Seems even the liberals don’t want Obamacare.

  • TeakWoodKite

    A case in point. A human I know has two health insurance policies. One fine day, he was having a medical problem which rendered him unable to respond to the EMT’s regarding his coverage. This question was asked by the EMT’s so they would know which hospital to take him to. The EMT took note of the first healthcare card he found in my human friends wallet. It was not his “primary” card. Four months later,thankfully he suffered no ill affects from the medical incident, just a $6,000.00 dollar bill from the primary insurance company, who would have covered all of the costs, if only the EMT had found it first.
    healthcare costs are going to go up because as the government herds the sheeple into the “cattle shoot” for transportation to the financial slaughter house, private insurance companies will have a to pass on the cost of our government pulling the wool over everyone’s eyes and skyrocketing level of risk in the pool.
    This same friend said he liked Medicare, I asked him what did he think would happen when medical professionals are driven out of the business with millions of people being added to a market that is being shrinking in the amount of medical treatment and professionals. The law of supply and demand is not only economic. It is, in this case, a matter of life and death. DO the Obama math….

    ”‘Reeling and Writhing, of course, to begin with,’ the Mock Turtle replied; ‘and then the different branches of arithmetic–Ambition, Distraction, Uglification, and Derision.’”
    – Lewis Carroll, Alice in Wonderland

    The elderly are going to get screwed and this administration is actively lying to prevent the electorate from dealing with the facts.
    TGIF.

    • Dissentispatriotic

      Responding only to the portion of your post with the patient, the EMT and insurance cards. As a healthcare worker frequently working with emergency admissions and EMTs, I find it hard to believe that they would take the time to search for insurance cards to determine where to take the patient having an emergency. Emergency triage must occur, by EMTALA law, before ability to pay is determined.
      As for this health care law, I don’t believe that healthcare exchanges will keep people out of emergency rooms. Just because there is expanded Medicaid enrollment doesn’t mean there are a proportional number of expanded physicians, nurses, and other allied health professionals available to treat problems. While hospitals may now be reimbursed a small amount for the visit, you will still need a lot of extra personnel and they don’t exist.

      • elizabethrc

        Dr Martin Segal yesterday said again what I have read in a number of places: that some 83% of physicians have stated that if Obamacare becomes a working reality, that they will consider closing their practices.
        I also read that in England some 130,000 elderly have been (their word, not mine) ‘euthanized’, in effect, because of their healthcare situation in that country.
        Not an attractive option.

        • EllenD818

          Don’t believe everything you read or hear. The US still attracts Doctors from other countries because they can charge more here. The system just needs to be adjusted. Start with a program that they have in Canada – free medical education for doctors if they agree to a commitment to serve underserved areas for a specific time after they graduate.

          • stodghie

            ellen that is changing very fast. i have several friends who are doctors that came here from other countries. they are going back home. hmm with the exception of the one from egypt who is coptic christian. obama totally screwed up foreign policy too especially in egypt.

            • EllenD818

              Thanks for your POV stodghie. I went an East Indian doctor who came here by way of Canada. I just wanted a checkup, but he was the only doctor I’ve ever had to make it into 2 appointments – one for me to fill out all the paperwork and one for him to actually take blood pressure etc. What a double-bill pain!
              His waiting room was full of Prescription Drug propaganda.
              It was obvious why he was here. He can go back where he came from (I don’t think he is one of your friends).

              • scottymac54

                “His waiting room was full of Prescription Drug propaganda…”
                Isn’t it absolutely DISGUSTING???
                Our offices have the telescreens constantly disgorging marketing clips, while patients sit in pain, desperately praying for some relief that never comes for them.

          • Hokma

            Your comment shows a complete lack of understanding of our medical education systen in this country which is the finest in the world.
            Canada has socialized medicine and it does not work.
            To become a physician in this country you cannot be average – the education, training and testing compares to no other profession. If you do not achieve a high score on your Board exams you will not get a Residency assignment.
            And because of the lack of Residency assignments in thsi country, top quality medical school graduates do end up serving areas where the underprivileged live.
            The underprivileged have always had access to medical care. The mantra that quality medical care is limited to the well-to-do has always been a liberal perpetrated myth. Physicians have awlays donated their services to hep the less fortunate and still do. Hospitals willl never turn away a patient, even if they do not have health insurance, and will make sure that they are properly cared for.
            If you love other countries so much (better medical care, treat homeless better) it is a pity you still have to suffer and live here.

            • EllenD818

              Hokma, calm down.
              All I’d like is for this “finest in the world” medical care to be available to everyone.
              And remember, you’re talking to a Canadian who has had operations done in Canada.The Canadian system works just fine.

              • Hokma

                Then why did I think it was the President of Canada come to the U.S. to get his operation? I knew too many people in Canada and am well aware of the problems they experienced.

                Healthcare IS available to everyone in this country one way or another – if you want it.

                Can it get better? Yes. But it WILL get worse if Obamacare is allowed to continue.

                1. there should be exchanges for lower-priced health insurance but ones that allow for crossing state lines.

                2. Comprehensive tort reform that does not only cap awards, but does not force unnecessary procedures which are what has driven up healthcare costs ( the CYA cost).

                3. Create incentives for medical school graduates to choose to be primary care physicians by either forgiving loans or creating other incentives to counter the natural incentives of specialization.

                4. Allow for a quicker path to market for new drugs and reduce the time a company has exclusive use in the market for a drug they develop before it can go generic.

                Those are some of the reforms that would actually work. NONE of them are in Obamacare.

                • EllenD818

                  I have no idea why you thought the President of Canada came to the US for an operation.
                  The PRIME MINISTER didn’t do that.
                  You may have been thinking of the multimillionaire Premier of Newfoundland (also known as “Danny Millions) who left the poorest province in Canada in 2010 to have a heart operation immediately.

                  This was the comment from Canada:

                  “The Cardiac Care Network of Ontario classifies heart patients for
                  care on three bases: “emergent – you’re done right away,” “urgent –
                  you’re done in a few days” or “elective – you may have to wait for a
                  while, because you’re not at any significant risk.”

                  “I hate to speculate … but the situation does arise where
                  somebody who is wealthy wants to be done in luxurious surroundings and
                  wants to be done right away,” – Conservative Senator Wilbert Keon, a retired heart surgeon and professor emeritus at University of Ottawa

            • scottymac54

              I”f you love other countries so much (better medical care, treat homeless better) it is a pity you still have to suffer and live here…”
              Funny, but that’s exactly the sentiment I have towards you…
              My fervent prayer is that your life, circumstances, and privilege deteriorate so rapidly and profoundly, that you will feel compelled to live out the rest of your life elsewhere.
              So tired of your pompous, arrogant attitude and your lies.

              • Hokma

                My fervent prayer is that a psycho like you, along with all your alter-egos, gets permanently banned from this blog. You contribute nothing with your comments and appear to be just an rude Obama troll.

                • Popsmoke

                  If scottymac54 gets banned then so should you…. Hokma I am disappointed….

              • stodghie

                dang!

              • stodghie

                sick puppy!

      • buzzlatte3

        My doc is no longer taking medicare/medicaid. Even with an appointment, the wait is sometimes over an hour. I wait one time a year because he’s good.

      • TeakWoodKite

        All good points. Thanks :)

    • Flop_Flipper

      Yes, but will elderly LGBT illegal immigrant atheist couples be harmed? Or would that be racist?

    • Popsmoke

      Healthcare costs are going up because of many factors. Not just because of government. By the way, that incident you posted of? Well that had absolutely nothing to do with government. But it had all to do with private insurance regulations…. Oh yes those cut, cap and balance gains? Well this is one of them.

      I remember the days when the ambulance took you to the closest hospital and did not even ask if you had insurance….

      The sad part of all of this is, why would any first-aider or paramedic even care if someone had insurance? That is not taught in any of the first aid , EMT-A or Paramedic classes.

      • stodghie

        So let’s just deal with the damn facts.

        Fact ONE–The Court said that Obama was wrong in his repeated insistence that
        his Health Care act was not a tax. Nope. It is a tax.

        Fact TWO–States cannot be required to expand Medicare rolls.

        I think Judge Roberts did what he was selected to do–judge the strict merits of
        the law. He reaffirmed the right of the Federal Government to tax your ass off.
        He rejected the notion that the Federal Government can demand that you buy
        health insurance. This by no means settles or erases the controversies
        surrounding this law. The problems remain.

        What does all of this mean? Bad news for Obama going into the election. If this
        was a popular law and embraced by a majority of Americans, then Obama would be
        running on it. He is not. He has not attached himself to it. Now he will have
        to. No matter what the Court says about Constitutionality, it does not alter
        the reality that businesses face in trying to deal with this turd of
        legislation. Romney just got a gift. Let the Obama folks celebrate all they
        can. It is a Pyrrhic victory at best
        what larry johnson said. read it and weep!

        • Popsmoke

          Facts? Where are these so-called facts coming from? RNC talking points?

          • stodghie

            hmmmm pop that statement was aimed directly at larry johnson since those are his words. let’s see what larry thinks of your comments.

  • jrterrier

    wonder when pres obama will have to withdraw this latest bain attack. hey popsmoke, i remember a couple of months ago you calling out a romney advisor fo making accurate statements which one of the left-leaning outfits said were misleading. what do you have to say about this?

    FactCheck: No Evidence for Romney Outsourcing Allegations

    Over the past week, a Washington Post story about Mitt Romney and Bain Capital’s role in “outsourcing” and “offshoring” American jobs prompted a flurry of ads and dubious assertions from the Obama campaign along those lines — and now, FactCheck.Org has determined that there is “no evidence to support the claim that Romney — while he was still running Bain Capital — shipped American jobs overseas.” That is, the Obama campaign’s line of attack about our prospective “outsourcer-in-chief” appears to have little basis in fact.They run down the various allegations and the lacking support for them:

    One TV ad, called “Come and Go,” claims that Romney “shipped jobs to China and Mexico.” But two examples cited by the Obama campaign occurred after Romney left Bain. There’s no clear evidence that a third company shipped jobs to China under Romney.

    A second ad called “Revealed” mocks Romney’s tough talk about cracking down on China’s trade practices by saying “all he’s ever done is send them our jobs” and citing the Washington Post article. But the newspaper article contained no examples of U.S. jobs being shipped to China while Romney was working at Bain.

    The “Come and Go” ad casts Romney as a “corporate raider,” but that term, loaded with negative connotations, is simply inaccurate. Bain didn’t engage in hostile takeovers when Romney was at the helm.

    That ad also repeats the claim that as governor of Massachusetts, Romney was “outsourcing state jobs to India.” But it wasn’t the state that outsourced contracts. Rather, Romney vetoed a measure that would have prevented the state from doing business with a state contractor that was locating state customer-service calls in India.The Romney campaign also released a useful PowerPoint this week explaining what happened with the various companies — most of them added jobs in the U.S. during Romney’s tenure at Bain.

    • elizabethrc

      The Romney people had a meeting this week with the WAPO to get a retraction. The paper refused.

      • Hokma

        I have said for years that any GOP candidate will have TWO opponenents in this campaign:

        1. The actual Democratic Party candidate (Obama)

        and

        2. The Sycophant media who distortr the news to provide the propaganda.

        • KenoshaMarge

          That’s a given. You cannot have a free country without a free and unbiased press. We don’t have a free and unbiased press. People can’t make informed decisions without the facts. Granted most partisans don’t need or want facts when they have their nice comfortable talking points to regurgitate. But some people still actually want to know. And many/most don’t.

    • Popsmoke

      I should stop using fact check to prove points? !!!

      First of all I actually know some of the folk over at Annenberg…. I
      know that they are very diligent and yes something they get it wrong.
      But expalin where in this story are they wrong? (
      http://factcheck.org/2012/06/obamas-outsourcer-overreach/ ). Where? Do
      not cite campaign power points to me either as a source.

      What bullshit….

  • HELENK2

    on the news talking about backtrack going to the Colorado fire and touring by car and helo. photo op and short speech. How Nice.
    what they are NOT saying is that he is making the stop on his way to LA for a fund raiser. By stopping at the fire, the taxpayer will have to foot the bill

    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/barack-obama-jared-leto-zach-braff-fundraiser-340126

    • buzzlatte3

      Read some of the responses. Even Hollywood is hating on Barack…man what a fall from the styrofoam pillars of 2008.

  • jrterrier

    don’t know if anyone has been following the electoral map projections, but this from the NY Times looks pretty good. a few months ago, they had the President ahead of Romney almost 2 to 1 in electoral votes. now it’s almost a tie: 217 to 206, with the remaining states as toss ups.
    http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/06/29/romney-ad-shows-hillary-clinton-attacking-obama/

  • jrterrier

    if you haven’t seen this ad already, take a look. it’s terrific. ends with hillary saying “shame on you barack obama.”
    http://youtu.be/sxoVqMhuzTo

  • TeakWoodKite

    OT: Just a tech note…I couldn’t get Disqus to load and found I was IE “compatibility mode” ( i knew it was toast I wanted, but the toaster thought it was bagels)
    Turn it off and now it’s working. TGIF :)

  • HELENK2

    Sarah was just on Hannity. the obots are going to explode. She just called nancy pelosi a dingbat.
    for those of you that do the twiitter thing,it should get interesting tonight

  • JohnnyTwoDog

    Joan Walsh at Salon says, “In fact, the law’s penalties would hit between 2 and 5 percent of Americans”

    Yes, and the other 95 – 98 % will be paying more in insurance premiums for a lot less health care (goverment rationed).

    And as Larry points out, Medicare benefits will be slashed to pay for the Obamacare expansion. That is if the elderly are able to find a doctor who will take Medicare. Many do not already, fewer will if Obamacare stands.

    • buzzlatte3

      You got it. Washington Post put out a calculator to show your “benefits”. Let’s take a young person, single, over age 26, making 25,000 a year. Medical insurance costs – up to $1800. and change per year. No credits either. That’s for a person making less than 2000.00 take home/mo. That’s over $100.00 per month in ins through state exchange. It’s okay if your living rent free, have no large student loans, don’t drive a new car and don’t live in a high car ins. premium area, and have no aspirations or goals.

      • Popsmoke

        and this is who’s fault right now?

        • buzzlatte3

          Ah, but the cost of the ACA is Obama’s fault, snookums. Yep, he owns it big time…..he owns it and he’s gonna have to sell it….snake oil reputation of a liar and all.

          • jrterrier

            the proof is that the president has hardly defended Obamacare, even after his “win” in the supreme court.

  • http://www.facebook.com/deborah.m.lopez Deborah Mackie Lopez

    NOW IS NOT THE TIME TO SIT BACK….NOW IS THE TIME TO REACT!!!! DONATE TO ROMNEY ND GET YOUR FRIENDS SIGNED UP TO VOTE OBAMA AND THE DEMS OUT!!!!

    • http://www.facebook.com/deborah.m.lopez Deborah Mackie Lopez

      Not ND meant AND

    • Popsmoke

      Another brain dead humanoid…. Yeah lets keep the republicans who got us into this mess in the first place….

      Here is my recommendations. PUSH FOR TERM LIMITS and LOBBYING REFORMS!

      • Hokma

        ” the republicans who got us into this mess in the first place…. ”

        . . . . and spoken like a true Obama supporter.

        • scottymac54

          I Thank God, there are real Americans who haven’t been bought and paid, and still have objectivity.

          • stodghie

            there is no objectivity in obamacare. clealy you have no idea what is really in it. you think it is about helping people. that is a fool’s errand.

          • jrterrier

            bought and paid? by whom? “real Americans” as defined by whom?

      • scottymac54

        Pop, they are totally in the tank for Romney now, and this is the sum total of everything we will see now (until the next psyop provides the pretext to switch “sides”, that is).

        • Hokma

          and it is evident that you and Popsmoke are in the tank for Barak Obama.
          You think this so-called support of Dr. Ron Paul fools anybody? You two have zero in common with Paul’s beliefs.

          • Popsmoke

            I will tell you this much as you have my word on this. I will not vote for Obama. Nor will I vote for Romney. Matter of fact I am going to right in “HOKMA”. You can go to the bank with that one…:-)

            • Hokma

              Put “Hokima” on your ballot and you’ll be a candidate but for a rubber room!

              • Popsmoke

                Well folk here at NQ have been telling me that is where I belong. So you be my write in candidate…:-)

                You know I was really considering what action I would take on election day. Not vote? Vote third party? Or write in? You Da Man! Hokima….

          • scottymac54

            You don’t have the capability to understand what Dr. Paul is talking about. Dr. Paul’s outlook is diametrically opposed to your hardcore neoconservative perspective.

            • Hokma

              It’s Congressman Paul dumbass. He does not currently practice Medicine and like all the other physicians who get elected to office they are called by the title of that elected office. It’s basic ettiquette.
              Second, there is not a single comment you have made that Paul would agree with. YOu have no clue what his posiitons are or what it means to be a conservative libertarian. You think it is some kind of counterculture cult.
              You are willfully stupid and compound that by coming here to just be obnoxious. After being banned I have no idea why you were allowed back.

            • jrterrier

              scotty why is your first response to question the writer’s capacity, morals, or whatever.

              • scottymac54

                Why is your first response to question mine?
                I have not challenged you in any manner.

                • jrterrier

                  i’m questioning your ad hominem attacks. i’m not calling you names or claiming you lack the capacity to understand.

        • Popsmoke

          The tank? Wait until they find out that the water in that tank is just a polluted as the water in the others guys tank. The funny part of all of that is that its the same folk polluting both tanks….

      • jrterrier

        the DEMS controlled both houses of Congress from 2006 – 2010. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2006/nov/10/midterms2006.topstories3
        the majority of congress of both parties gave W the go-ahead on iraq; on patriot act; on guantanamo, etc.
        for every “evil” you can lay at the feet of REPS there is an equal and countervailing one you can lay at the feet of DEMS. so get off this meme.

        • Popsmoke

          I have been saying this since I have begun posting to this site again. Besides I will not give up repeating the same things as you have posted so well. Yes both parties are at fault and until people like you get the picture and start changing it I will continue to pound away. Besides you died rescinded the Constitution and left you king to tell anyone what to say or not to say? Very arrogant…

  • BronwynsHarbor

    It is time to stop feeding the troll.

  • lola828

    This post is funny.

    The reality is that healthcare reform actually strengthens medicare, increases benefits from things like lower prescription drug costs by closing the donut hole and looks to reduce Medicare costs by reducing subsidies to Medicare Advantage healthcare insurance providers.

    What does Romney and the Republicans want to do? Through the endorsed Ryan budget the GOP and Romney want to turn medicare into a voucher program pushing all the healthcare cost inflation on to the backs of seniors.

    If you disagree then prove that absolutely anything I say above is wrong. I look foward to your replies.

    • HARP2

      Damn shame they can`t tax stupidity. The libs could fund ObamaTAX all by themselves.

      • jrterrier

        Please use the correct terminology. according to Obamacare, it’s not a tax. It’s a “shared responsibility payment.” As in, we must all share responsibility for the ignorance of the kool-aid brigade. I’m sure they are all entitled to “free” mental health care.

        • buzzlatte3

          And what they don’t get is they are NOT exempt from paying the damn TAX. LOL! Liberals are always the last ones to get it. duh…

        • arabella_trefoil

          “Shared responsibility payment”???????

          • jrterrier

            that’s the term used in Obamacare for the penalty, oops, the tax.

    • JohnnyTwoDog

      “all the healthcare cost”
      What happenend to the Obama of ’08 who pledged to reign in health care cost? Obamacare does nothing except allow costs to spiral while diluting care, and raising premiums and taxes.

      • buzzlatte3

        Ah, of course, that was before the media let us know what a freakin’ liar Obama is. The libbies think they are raging against the machine. What they don’t know is that they’ve just become a faceless number whose bank account is going to feed the machine, instead.

    • shelldoll2

      As a veteran I sometimes wonder why I put on the uniform. But we are required to protect even idiots like you.

    • Popsmoke

      Oh shit the other side of the two headed coin just showed up….

    • stodghie

      how long is your nose lola with all the baloney your spout here. “strengthens medicare” bs

  • HELENK2
  • lola828

    Nice video… what is the source?

    Sounds like a bunch of fear-mongering propaganda that now NQ is promoting.

    It is complete wrong and misleading. Do you have any standards at all on NQ? I guess why start now.

    First of all do you even know what Medicare Advantage is? Your video even says the cuts are to Medicare ADVANTAGE.

    And do you even know what is being cut?

    Here let me help you:

    > Medicare Advantage is a way for senior to receive their healthcare coverage through private insurers rather than through actual Medicare Part A or Part B. Their choice.

    So any cut to Medcare Advantage funds is not actually a cut to Medicare itself.

    The government generally spends 12% more on Medicare Advantage programs than it does under regular Medicare. All the ACA does is eliminate some of the subsidies that were used to establish Medicare Advantage. These subsidies will be gradually be reduced until payments to Medicare Advantage are inline with the costs of regular Medicare. Basically those private insurance companies will not longer be getting any excess payments. There is no cut in actual Medicare or in the services that the elderly will receive only a cut in excess payment to insurance companies for those who are only on Medicare Advantage.

    No big deal and a way to save money force the pushing down of the costs curve.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_Advantage

    “Health care reform does not cut Medicare benefits. In fact, health care reform expands Medicare coverage, by eliminating cost-sharing for preventive services, adding a yearly wellness visit, limiting some cost-sharing in private Medicare plans, and closing the Part D “Donut Hole.”

    It also improves the solvency of the Medicare program itself. Reform does, however, change some Medicare payment policies. Some misstated reports of these changes have resulted in exaggerating public fear of cuts to Medicare benefits. This Alert summarizes the changes in certain Medicare payments in order to clarify that the Medicare reforms do not reduce Medicare’s guaranteed benefits.

    The Affordable Care Act[i] achieves savings in the Medicare program through a series of payment reforms, service delivery innovations, and increased efforts to reduce fraud, waste, and abuse. The actual projected reduction in Medicare spending is $428 billion over 10 years, after $105 billion in new Medicare spending is taken into consideration.[ii] These projections actually extend the life of the Medicare trust fund by about a decade. It is important to stress that none of the payment reforms affect Medicare’s guaranteed benefit packages. The law specifically states that the guaranteed benefits in Medicare Part A and Part B will not be reduced or eliminated as a result of changes to the Medicare program.[iii]”

    http://www.medicareadvocacy.org/2010/10/28/health-care-reform-does-not-cut-medicare-benefits/

    Why don’t you read the truth here (although the truth was never a priority at NQ):

    http://news.yahoo.com/fact-checking-romney-does-health-reform-cut-medicare-230303419–abc-news-politics.html

    and here:

    http://www.sfgate.com/business/bloomberg/article/Medicare-Scare-Ad-Makes-False-Claim-of-500-Bln-3674139.php

    • buzzlatte3

      Yeah, LOLa….where’s the funding? The real truth is Obama isn’t any better liked to today – check Rasmussen. The real truth is there’s no real funding attached. The real truth is now Obama can’t blame Bush for his failures. The real truth is that you don’t actually know what really happened to the dems yesterday. The real truth is that the dems are still begging for $3.00. The real truth is that Obama didn’t want to own this stinkbomb because NOW he has to answer to the question of the bait and switch tactics that said it wasn’t a TAX. Every dem that is running for office will have to answer that question. You can find the vid clips where Obama doesn’t call it a tax. He’s been caught in a lie, again, and NOW he can’t blame Bush. The quick fix was to strike this law down. The real fix is recognizing and fixing the problem in WA DC…which, of course, is to rid the WH of Obama and the leftist goon dems. CJ Roberts just stuck it to you demdrones. You’re all too stupid to get it.

      • lola828

        blah, blah, blah…

        A completely zero value-added comment.

        You want to know how the ACA bills or healthcare reform is funded then you should actually read the bills or at least some analysis by an objective source. There is actually not a lot of funding required. People are still going to be paying for their own healthcare. There will be some funding of the subsidies for low income people.

        Why don’t you start with he CBO? They have done a ton of analysis on the economics of healthcare reform.

        There are some minor taxes on high income people and on Cadillac plans. Those who choose not to buy healthcare insurance will pay a penalty.

        You can read all about it here:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient_Protection_and_Affordable_Care_Act

        The exactly same system was inacted by Romney in Massachusetts and it only added 1% to the State’s budget and has got 98% of people covered. People love it in Massachusetts.

        Actually, the latest polls look very good for Obama. He has pulled significantly ahead in most of the swing states.

        • buzzlatte3

          Blah, blah, blah….explain how you and Obama are going to sell the turd? It’s already established that Obama is a liar. Refer to the “He was born in Kenya.” pamphlet from the 1990′s, as an example. Remember his brand is damaged from four years of lies and non-leadership and now, in the worst economic times, he’s got to sell people on a tax for something they don’t want to buy. Go ahead – give us the gameplan on how Barry O’Choom is going to sell it. Is he marching out the minions of dementia girl Pelosi and Skelator Reid? Explain how he and the legislative branch are the chosen ones who are exempt from Obama care. And by all means, explain how without jobs people are going to pay for it – besides being sucked into socialism and government nanny overreach. Please do. We’re waiting…tic, tic, tic Gosh, and while your at it, explain the part about the IRS connecting directly to your bank accounts and the seven (breitbart) or twelve (other sources) new taxes on the middle class are going to endear Dear Leader to them. What brand of vodka are you comrades all drinking these days?

          • lola828

            Another meaningless off topic rant by you. Just a lot of childish name calling and nothing of substance on the topic at hand.

            The healthcare reform bills are beginning to sell themselves, as they begin to take affect and millions begin to benefit from them.

            No different than Romneycare in Massachusetts. Romneycare polls very well in Massachusetts.

            So by calling Obama a socialist and suggesting a nanny state you sound like a hard core conservative. So you disagree with Larry Johnson’s post above and believe that we should not even have government run healthcare like Medicare, which is about as socialist in healthcare as you get in the U.S.??

            • buzzlatte3

              You can’t defend it. We all know you can’t and so you deflect and demur just like the liar in Chief you adore. I’ll refer you to the references in a comment to Dbb3 above. Try to have an open mind about Dear Leader’s real truth.

            • stodghie

              lola there was a stern looking man with a letter of ‘get lost’ from the obama campaign looking for you. i directed him to the basement. hmmmm tough losing your job. oh well get in behind the millons ahead of you. LOL obama doesn’t give a dang about you.

              • scottymac54

                “Dang?”

          • TeakWoodKite

            tic tic tic.

        • TeakWoodKite

          Wiki ?

        • MG6

          You definitely don’t know what you are talking about and are making things up as you go along.
          We hate here in Mass. The insurances premiums have gone up. We have to pay a deductible before for medical procedures and test whereas before we did not. It’s harder to see my Doctor then it was before.
          We have fraud with illegals accessing services using other peoples insurances cards. Now you have to provide proof you are the card holder before receiving services.
          BTW, Both chambers are all held by dems, so what Mitt wanted and what came out of the dems house was different all together.

        • stodghie

          oh yeah the great progressive proclamation. “i didn’t do it” bush, romney, washington, adams, franklin, lincoln! anybody but me did it! i am progressive therefore i must be perfect. LOL LOL LOL NOT

        • shelldoll2

          If stupid was a disease you’d be terminal. You are really pissing off us veterans. You are too stupid to stop. There’s millions of us. Millions of votes your boy won’t get.

    • jrterrier

      what is the “pushing down of the costs curve?”

    • http://twitter.com/jbjdjbjd jbjd

      As economists building econometric models say, “Garbage in; garbage out.”

      In other words; the forecast is only as good as the input data.

      CBO and Medicare actuaries acknowledge the double-counting issue. “In
      practice, the improved [trust fund] financing cannot be simultaneously
      used to finance other federal outlays (such as the coverage expansions)
      and to extend the trust fund, despite the appearance of this result
      from” traditional budget rules, Medicare actuary Rick Foster wrote last year.
      And
      in 2010, the CBO wrote that, absent the Medicare savings, the law would
      increase deficits by $226 billion through 2019 — instead of decreasing
      them by the commonly cited $132 billion.

      http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/health-care-law-will-add-340-billion-to-deficit-new-study-finds/2012/04/09/gIQAti1o6S_story.html

    • APO_AE_09173

      Doctors are dropping medicare patients like flies–unless they pay 1200 to 2000 dollars per year for concierge care. Medicare advantage is better received by most doctors. They have a better chance of being paid. The insurance reimbursement rates are much higher than the CMS pricer tables. The CMS DRG scheme puts reimbursement at 30 to 40 percent of the doctors negotiated fee for insurance.
      The CMS pricing methology was recently adopted by he VA and they are losing support from civilian doctors because they get paid so little and have to wait so long for payment. In some cases it takes up to 9 months for a provider to be paid.
      The government has no capacity to handle the requirements placed upon it by the new Law–the first of several requests for services to mange the day to day operation for the waiver requests and other management tasks. They will hire a company toprocess the work–very likely a small women owned set-aside that will not provide insurance to its employees–kinda like my employer. Ironic. The RFI is available to the public on fbo.com–search DHHS. You will see that there is no estimated funding limit. The RFI is looking for estimates as to how to staff and the level of funding this contract. Because this is an unknown level of work it will have to be a T&M contract or a cost plus contract. It will require large computer repository systems that do not currently exist in the DHHS. It will be expensive and the scpoe of work is not defined. This was not taken into account by the law or the OMB/GAO estimates of cost.
      What is written in the law says much of what you presented above–application is rarely accurate contracts run over all the time because the contracting agencies don’t understand the requirements and mission creep. Very Very expensive.

      • Popsmoke

        And this is CONGRESS fault……Yes this is what happens when you privatize without strict oversight….

        • Hokma

          What? You are not making any sense.

          • scottymac54

            But, Hokma, most people know exactly what he’s talking about, and agree, too…
            They have no viable choice.
            How long do you believe this is sustainable?

            • Hokma

              Really? Then you explain it. What sustainable?

              • buzzlatte3

                Oh no….apparently the politburo forgot to send over the talking points and Poppy and Scotty have to make something up.

                • scottymac54

                  Poor angry thing, still living in the past, LOL!

  • BronwynsHarbor

    Holy cow. Who knew. I wish I could say I knew, but no.

    People I know pay $99/month for Medicare Part A. They pay $35-55 premium/month for Medicare Part D (the prescripton drug plan) and they must pay co-pays as well as the infamous donut hole. Then, since Medicare Parts A and B only pay 80% of charges for physicans, hospital stays, any kind of test (from bloodwork to MRIs), physical/occupational therapy, etc., etc., etc., these people also must “buy” Medicare Part C aka Medigap coverage, which picks up the 20% not covered by Medicare A & B. That 20% adds up fast, so Medigap insurance is critical … but it costs around $180 to over $200/month.

    This means that every senior on Medicare pays $99 (A), $180+ (B) and $80-100 (D) … for a minimum total of $380 per month (and it’s usually far more).

    And there are many more costs that are not covered by any part of Medicare or any available insurance. For example, many medications are not covered by Part D or by any insurance plan that exists, so the patient has to pay for those drugs in full.

    Then, if a patient needs a new drug that’s not gone generic yet, their co-pay is big — a friend takes Abilify, and the co-pay at the least expensive pharmacy is $90/month.

    So if Obamacare slashes Medicare, and does away with programs like Advantage that help seniors keep costs down — particularly since their monthly costs are already over $350, even $500 or more — they are really going to be screwed. They will have to avoid getting medical tests they need. They won’t be able to buy prescriptions they need. And on and on.

    Gee thanks, Obama.

    • BronwynsHarbor

      Also: If it is true that Obamacare does not permit seniors to shop for insurance across state lines, they are at a considerable disadvantage. I have a friend in California who pays $215 per month for her AARP Medigap policy while another friend in Washington state pays $180 per month for AARP’s identical plan.

      That’s because AARP negotiated with each state’s insurance commissioner, and some states, like Washington, were able to get a better deal than California’s.

      Which is why it would be good to allow people to shop in other states!

      • buzzlatte3

        People who never go to the DR, like my sister – she hasn’t been to one in over 20 years – are going to be paying more to for a “service” she doesn’t use. Our grandmother made it to 90 without ever going to a doctor, had her kids at home, ate pickles everyday and drank green tea, because she liked it…not because she knew it was beneficial. We learned not to be sucked into thinking you need this or that test on a schedule. As a holistic Dr I went to said, “The tests are so they can get data, not for improving your health.” I go once a year because I renew a couple of prescriptions that are beneficial to me. The prescription costs are low and I can pay out of pocket. Now I will be forced to pay for my good health!!!

        • BronwynsHarbor

          It’s a good thing for me that I didn’t solicit your advice when it turned out that the pain in my abdomen was a ruptured appendix with a huge abscess that required hours of surgery, a week in the hospital, and a month at home in bed with a wide-open wound so that it would heal properly and not seal too soon, giving me yet another infection.

          If I’d not finally gone to the doctor, I would have died of a massive infection — 5 years ago.

          I could go on, but won’t. Well, it is also a good thing that my mother, my aunt, and I went to orthopedic surgeons because we have a GENETIC trait that gives us all 1) degenerative disk disease, and 2) hips that wear out early — I had to have both hips replaced at the same time, after years of being misdiagnosed and in excruciating pain. My life has improved greatly since I went to that surgeon. The same is true for my mother and aunt.

          • buzzlatte3

            But you do need to admit there are healthy people in this country who do not use the medical system on a regular basis. We’ve been programmed to believe you can’t live without colonoscopies, mammograms, GI tract scoping and all the rest. Ever read the Healing Codes? The doctor that wrote it cured himself of Lou Gehrig’s disease. I use it to make my arthritic knee stop paining. It works for me.

          • KenoshaMarge

            Some people need medical care and some don’t. And some, many, only get drugs and a pat on the head like my dog gets at the vet.
            Ignoring serious symptoms is foolish. Running to the doctor for every twinge, equally so.

          • stodghie

            bronwynsharbor, my grandmother did die of a ruptured appendix.and toxins. unfortunately it happened before we had today’s medications.

        • KenoshaMarge

          I seldom go to a doctor. The one I trusted retired and the new one is one of those that thinks the best way to treat senior is to drug them to the eyeballs in order to shut them up. I can do that with a six pack of Killians Red for a lot less and enjoy it more.

      • GeminiRising

        I’m going to cancel my AARP membership. They are making a fortune off of the elderly.

        • KenoshaMarge

          I cancelled mine a long time ago. But I still get junk mail from them every month. I write, in black marker, “leave me alone” across their phony literature and mail it back in their envelope.
          An envelope they don’t have to pay for unless it’s used. I use it. Every month. For years. And they still keep mailing their crap out to me.
          Do you want your health care in the hands of people who are that stupid?

          • elizabethrc

            Ditto.
            I save up the political mailings from Dems and AARP, stuff their postage paid return envelope and mail it back to them. They have to pay the additional postage!

            • KenoshaMarge

              But they just keep sending it. How stupid is that?

      • JohnnyTwoDog

        Shop across state lines.
        That’s another thing Obama ’08 pledged to do to reduce costs.

        Competition.
        Obama the campaigner ran on it, Obama the socialist can’t comprehend it.

        • KenoshaMarge

          That’s because Obama is a big fat liar!

    • GeminiRising

      That just about says it, Bronwyn. I’m going broke being elderly (I mean middle-aged). The price of certain drugs also escalates the monthly costs.

      • elizabethrc

        I’m only on one high blood pressure med which I get at my super market pharmacy (with dr. prescription). For several years now Stop & Shop has been giving 2 weeks free antibiotics (with a prescription) for most antibiotics. It’s a wonderful program that more places should offer.

    • KenoshaMarge

      And you can benefit from all those wonderful things that us greedy old seniors take from the young only if you can find someone to explain it to you. Then you play phone tag and try to keep your head from exploding as one voice after another treats you like you are simple-minded if you don’t understand what they understand.

      Usually I just give up. It’s hard on my health.

    • Popsmoke

      Bronwyn, ask yourself who paid for the study that says the ACA will cut medicare? The only way Medicare is going to get cut is if Congress cuts it.

      • FLDemFem

        Since Congress passed the ACA, which has Medicare cuts in it, they did cut it.

  • samb1

    After yesterday I will never understand why anyone
    would vote for Obama especially if you are a
    elderly person or a baby boomer since those individuals
    will be the ones who will be hit hard by this.
    Many are choosing to think out of site out of mind,
    good luck with that because Liberty Has Been Lost.

    • Dave L.

      After this entire administration, I can not understand how anyone that has ever worked one day in their life, would ever vote for a Democrat. An administration that wants to take what I have worked for, and earned, and pass it out to someone that hasn’t earned anything in their life will never get a vote from me !

      • samb1

        Agreed.

  • Retired_from_SPOnaj

    Hey, we have to thin out the herd if we are going to ration healthcare efficiently and effectively in the future. The elderly have already lived their lives and “had a good run.” Now it’s their turn to make their final contribution to society by dying by dying at the optimal time. This was all laid out in the movie, “Soylent Green.” Time to throw Granny and her wheelchair off the Malibu cliff. Oh, wait, save the wheelchair!

    • samb1

      Next it will be women let them wait for cancer
      screenings or why giving them life saving drugs.

    • samb1

      Retired from SPOnaj-
      This came out August 2009.
      It kinda freaks me out now.
      ————
      Obama Eugenics –
      ObamaCare is Eugenics admits Glenn Beck
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGiINxTaBA4

    • KenoshaMarge

      Us greedy old folks who paid into Social Security our whole lives need to just die out so that the money can be given to the young.

      I intend to start taking better care of myself so that I can live longer and thumb my nose at the young socialist buzzards who think the country owes them a living.

      Of course if I get sick and have to face the Obamacare Death Panel, I’m toast.

  • Hokma

    “But the reality of Obamacare is a future of less medical care, more government intervention and control and higher costs. Let Obama run on that come November. Good luck Champ.”

    100% correct and very well said.

    • buzzlatte3

      …And the other consequence that no one has mentioned. There will be a big spike in anger.

      • KenoshaMarge

        And that’s hard on the blood pressure. Maybe obamacare can kill off a lot of us old farts that would have voted against him before November.

      • elizabethrc

        It’s already happening.

    • Popsmoke

      USSC says they can’t do what you are saying…..

      • Hokma

        I said: “100% correct and very well said.”

        I didn’t see the USSC have any comment on what I said.

  • jrterrier

    hope this gets out to every retired person and their adult children, who worry about them.

    • Popsmoke

      Yeah lets spread more falsehoods!

      • Hokma

        Falsehoods?

        The only falsehoods being spread here is your so-called conservative principals.

        If you bothered to uinderstand what Obamacare actually does you will discover that it does NOTHING to lower healthcare costs – it does NOT ensure your keep your current benefits or your doctor – it significantly reduces the quality of healthcare (particularly among the elderly) – it sets an inevitable road to socialized medicine – and it will (without exaggeration) bankrupt this country.

        And if it were so great, then why did they set 2014 as the year for full implementation and not now so that they could run on it?

        • Popsmoke

          Look we have been pretty civil lately to each other. Lets keep it that way.

          None of us know how any of this is going to play out. Its all opinion with out fact. This is very much a work in progress and I will support any fixes that actually will better the act. No matter who proposes them.

          • FormerLiberal9

            Then stop calling people “pieces of dog crap” and “pompous asses”. It would go along way in restoring civility to this site.

            • Popsmoke

              I was not addressing anyone else.. and I will respond as I am addressed… You want me to be civil then act accordingly. Otherwise be prepared to receive back 10 fold…

              • stodghie

                Popsmoke: why don’t you stop making accusations at people here. sick and tired of your ugly and rude putdowns. you are the one who is dishonest with yourself and then you run around yelling at everyone to agree with you since in your view you are superior to all of us here

                AND DON’T YOU DARE MAKE THREATS AT ANYONE HERE! THIS IS LARRY’S SITE AND NOT YOURS.

                • Popsmoke

                  Threats? Who made a threat? By the way, look who is talking shit here now. Mr/Ms. smart ass. You do more name calling than a pager system at a hospital.

                  Actually yo have some nerve… I will say that much. Not much in brains but some nerve….

                  • stodghie

                    you made the threat! and again go look in a mirror at yourself and quit trying to put others into the same pool with you. all you do with others is name call and refuse to face reaility. i am sorry for you.

                    • Popsmoke

                      I made a threat? What did I say? Act civilly or my response will be worse than the idiotic statement made to me? That is a threat?

                      OK since you seem to have a few neurons misfiring lets try it this way. When you stop calling others names (i.e. snotty… ole poop pop, troll and so on and on and on..) so will I.

                      Until then… Take a very long walk off a very short pier…

                    • stodghie

                      stuff it! you refuse to look at yourself and therefore don’t tell the truth. oh well! your problem!

                      popsmoke’s comment Otherwise be prepared to receive back 10 fold

                      that is a threat pop!

              • FormerLiberal9

                I am responding to your name calling. I don’t as a rule see many on the blog who call you names. I try not to resort to calling names to those I disagree with because it is the Hallmark of a Bully. I don’t expect anything out of you. You were the one asking for people on this blog to return to civility frankly I don’t care I can handle trash talk or reasoned discussion equally. Just pointing out to you if you want people to listen to you then quit the name calling.

                • Popsmoke

                  Really? Let’s see.. I am a troll.. a closet Obama freak…a lefty… Like i said my comment stands. What to label someone? Then tough shit on the reaction….

            • scottymac54

              Popsmoke is virtually persecuted here, just because he dissents from the prevailing groupthink.
              He makes intelligent, pertinent points, and is almost immediately set upon in an abusive, insensitive, uncharitable manner, by the same cast of indignants.
              It’s wrong.

              • FormerLiberal9

                Franky I am glad to see Popsmoke having a good friend like you to offer support. Friendship is a good thing.

          • Hokma

            This is NOT a work in progress.

            In factoring in Obamacare, healthcare insurance companies have been already increasing their rates at a more accelerated pace than before – they have been dropping plans for small businesses as well. That is not theoretical – theat is real world.

            There is not going to be any redcution on drugs because they made deals with the big pharmacy companies to allow them to do what they want. And the ambulence chasing lawyers – they still have no limits.

            The ENTIRE intent of Obamacare os to FORCE all Ameericans onto one government run healthcare program.

            • Popsmoke

              Hokma now your being intellectually dishonest and you know better than this.

              • stodghie

                why don’t you stop making accusations at people here. sick and tired of your ugly and rude putdowns. you are the one who is dishonest with yourself and then you run around yelling at everyone to agree with you since in your view you are superior to all of us here.

              • Hokma

                Do you understand the definition of “real world?” That means it really did happen!
                In terms of honesty, you clearly have no clue what the stipulations of this abortion of a bill is? Do you?
                True Obama supporter.

      • jrterrier

        Pop, there is nothing false in that story. What is up with you lately.

        • Popsmoke

          Really? OK lets start with the bullshit of penalties….

          “(g) ADMINISTRATION AND PROCEDURE.—

          (1) IN GENERAL.—The penalty provided by this section shall be paid upon notice and demand by the Secretary, and except as provided in paragraph (2), shall be assessed and collected in the same manner as an assessable penalty under subchapter B of chapter 68.

          (2) SPECIAL RULES.—Notwithstanding any other provision of law—

          (A) WAIVER OF CRIMINAL PENALTIES.—In the case of

          any failure by a taxpayer to timely pay any penalty imposed by this section, such taxpayer shall not be subject to any criminal prosecution or penalty with respect to such failure.

          (B) LIMITATIONS ON LIENS AND LEVIES.—The Secretary shall not—

          (i) file notice of lien with respect to any property of a taxpayer by reason of any failure to pay the penalty imposed by this section, or

          (ii) levy on any such property with respect to such failure.”

  • buzzlatte3

    Begs the question of what really happened to Toots. (his grandma – that typical white lady)… the heat’s getting to me. As time goes on and the law is dissected six ways to Sunday, the truth will come out. OT: But what about wiretaps and Holder over on Drudge.

    • BronwynsHarbor

      I blew a FUSE when Obama used his own grandmother as an example of “unnecessary surgery.” The poor old woman needed a hip replacement, but Obama decided that that was a waste of money since she was so old.

      Uh. When one’s hip is so bad that it requires replacement, the pain is unbelievably excruciating. There is no pain pill in the world that begins to help take that pain away. The ONLY cure for that amount of pain is SURGERY and REPLACEMENT of the hip.

      I PRAY that Obama’s hips go bad. I want that more than anything. Of course, he’ll be able to get his hips replaced, no matter how old he is. But I hope he really SUFFERS before he gets the surgery. Only then will he realize how CRUEL his remarks were about his own grandmother.

      • buzzlatte3

        You reap what you sow….I think life is going to tattoo that on teh One’s forehead in about 4 months.

        • KataKimbe

          I wish I was as hopeful as you… most polls today show differently.

      • Dbb3

        That is a complete utter lie, Madelyn Dunham fractured her hip the last few weeks of her life when she was at death’s door, much too fragile to undergo the surgery Obama would have paid for himself. And on top of that you floated the depraved lie that Obama went to Hawaii at the 11th hour of the ’08 election not to see her for the final time, why the old gal was just fine, but to garner sympathy and to head off an investigation into his phony birth certificate.

        • buzzlatte3

          Prove the certificate is real and prove the case for grandma Toots and make sure they’re sources that are relatively non-partisan. Why should we believe you or Obama? Why?

          • Dbb3

            You just go believing everything you read here buzz, I wouldn’t want to mess up your beautiful mind.

            • buzzlatte3

              You can’t prove it. Is that what you are saying? You won’t because there always seems to be no definitive and verifiable way to prove it? You see, you’re backing liar. For reference go to: http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com – Obama Laundry List of Lies. Or for something more up to date: Politifacts list of Obama’s Habitual Lies to America. Oh, it’s there and it’s free to read.

            • stodghie

              an articulate sounding putdown. failed! buzzz

        • JohnnyTwoDog

          Dbb3 – Birthers? Really?
          Don’t tell me, I know what comes next – RACISTS.
          You have lost the argument.

        • elizabethrc

          She WAs near death and the numerous press reports stated that that was one reason for his going there. Besides, it made for good press.

        • stodghie

          ddbs please prove that. i followed it closely and that is not accurate. ty

      • GeminiRising

        It will come back on him—guaranteed.

        • KenoshaMarge

          Karma is a bitch!

      • KenoshaMarge

        Realization from Obama about how cruel his words were about his grandmother? I don’t think so. That would take introspection. From a narcissist? I don’t think so.

        • elizabethrc

          I wonder how Obama is going to deal emotionally with the fact that, come November, America doesn’t want him, doesn’t like him and got rid of him.

          • KenoshaMarge

            I sure hope we get to find out.

      • elizabethrc

        Imagine the effect on his golf game!

      • Wisewoman2

        Don’t forget he did not visit his birth mother on her death bed. He was campaigning for state senator from IL. Said he couldn’t spare the time. Story is true and appeared in Chicago Sun Times. Who would vote for a man who refused to visit his dying mother?

  • stodghie

    yup obama never liked the elderly. i noticed snotty references from his followers in the 2008. he wants to appeal to the youth and “poor” because he thinks they are more easily fooled than those that have worked, raised families and know a thing or two. well obama, like everything else you have ever done, you are a pathetic failure.

    • FormerLiberal9

      Yes especially those white privileged old people who should just die and give what little money they have to poor folk.

      • buzzlatte3

        After all, the poor folk, they’ve suffered on the welfare benefits and all that free stuff. Buying their ciggies on the taxpayers’ dime. Anyone know of a good study of how many recipients actually get off welfare?

        • KenoshaMarge

          Don’t forget the free phones.

          • Popsmoke

            Yeah 250 free minutes… There is a killer…

            • buzzlatte3

              You’ve blown more smoke than the fires in Colorado. I think you come here to chew everybody up because YOU hate working with your so-called downtrodden. 250 minutes? So what!!! At least there’s one way for people to learn to be responsible. You vent. We vote it down. Wow, what a positive experience. Why don’t you use some benefits and get the 15 free sessions of counseling. We wouldn’t have to put up with you and you would be more likable.

              Now, as far as everything being screwed up, who are you going to support, the biggest lazy screwup in the history of the WH?

              And don’t twist this. I spent too many years listening to sob stories, whines for more freebies, tales of why they couldn’t, missed appointments, children’s prescriptions being sold on the street, providing socks in the winter to kids and food year around because mom was too busy buying ciggies and pot and having the latest uncle eat up all the food.

          • Popsmoke

            Yeah 250 free minutes… There is a killer… Especially for those moms who have been battered….

            • KenoshaMarge

              Yeah, those are the only ones that get the “free phones”. You always put the worst possible spin on what anyone who doesn’t agree with you 100% says.
              I am sure there are many deserving people who need the “free” phones. I am equally sure that a lot of parasites get them too.
              No one would want to do anything that kept a battered woman from getting help. And I didn’t say that at all. What I am saying is that government programs hand out “freebies” like candy without making sure that no fraud is involved. And for those of us who struggle to pay our damn phone bill that doesn’t seem right.

        • Popsmoke

          “after all, the poor folk, they’ve suffered on the welfare benefits and all that free stuff.”

          You know actually SHIT! You stupid ass… I know cops and firefighters families who come to food pantries because they meet the poverty standard. I know many working middle class and the working poor who without that so-called free stuff would be living in tents!

          People like you are nothing more than heartless pieces of dog crap.

          Want to talk about a study? Try this one. I have a client who has gone from being homeless with four kids back to work and literally off of 90% of government assistance. They did this within two years. Most people who are on assistance want to come off and many do as long as they can find work. By the way, most social programs make it hard for you to stay on them. With exception of food stamps which is more lenient. By what the hell? Why would anyone like you give a shit?

          • elizabethrc

            Popsmoke, you haven’t cited a study. You’ve given your personal experiences and good for those people who got off of assistance programs. I doubt Buzz is speaking to those people.
            Nancy Pelosi’s daughter Victoria, has posted on uTube an on the street interview video outside of a welfare building in NYC. It was shown on Bill Mahr’s program, of all places. I don’t know how to get it to you but if you go onto uTube you can pull it up. It is to this mentality that I think he speaks.
            It is just undeniable that fraud is rampant in the system and I myself know of instances where people rush into the store to purchase luxury items the first day they get their checks. That doesn’t make it a study.

            • Popsmoke

              Look the studies are out there. Welfare in many states has been recently reformed and studies are not yet totally completed and one must go state by state for them. For example… http://www.irp.wisc.edu/research/welreform/national/informingwd.htm

              On top of that there are so many studies and counter studies that it makes mud look transparent.

              As far as fraud is concerned? Hell its rampant throughout the system. Funny note though. Try and call the OIG’s office to report fraud. Congress it its cut, cap and balance wisdom cut the staffing levels where as if you do not call at 8am/EST you will never get through.

              So who is really our worse enemy? The answer is… We are our own worse enemy.

              • elizabethrc

                I can’t disagree with your last statement.

            • Popsmoke

              By the way, eliz.. I work with this stuff almost everyday. I do not need to read a study. I have real life incidents both real and fraudulent to work with…

              Its a very difficult and trying experience. But I rather error on the side of gentleness. Rather than jump without a common frame of reference.

              • elizabethrc

                Pop, I don’t doubt your experiences with these people, but it’s exceedingly difficult to square police and firefighters as not being an exception and not the rule, given the countrywide job entitlements they get. I know in my town, which is an average town somewhere in the middle economically, they get lifetime pay benefits which are very close to their highest salary at retirement. Not to mention the lifetime healthcare for them AND their families. They also retire at an earlier age than most of us. Nationally, those programs are bankrupting cities and towns and contracts negotiated years ago need to be redressed or we’re never going to correct this downward spiral. The towns just don’t have the money.
                Pop, people like you are needed to help these people, but you’re human, like all of us and I think it’s a mistake to judge the whole by a small number. Fraud continues to be rampant and if more people paid attention to dealing with correcting that, we’d all be a lot better off.

                • Popsmoke

                  Eliz.. Not all salaries are equal throughout the country. Here in farmville Indiana most cops and firefighters are paid really crap…. They use the job as a stepping stones to better departments.

                  One thing for sure.. Its a mess…and a nightmare….and unfortunately no one in Congress is fixing it.

              • scottymac54

                Without completely unprovable personal anecdotes to arouse outrage and manipulate hardworking people, how would these good burghers ever serve their right-wing partisan masters, while justifying their own contempt and hatred for those in pain, suffering, or lacking in the very basics, just as you and I do?
                This is not new. We’ve had over thirty years of these bullshit memes.

                • Hokma

                  Who is “they?” You seem to have an inability to articulate comprehensible thoughts. Try writing in plain English.

          • Hokma

            Come off to what? What jobs? How is anyone expected to come off of assistance in this Obama economy? And now add in this obination of a so-called healthcare reform and you have NO chance of reducing people on assstance.

            Now, you know full well how people on assistance get jerked around by government bureaucrats who do not give a shit because the unions protect them from getting fired for working at a snails pace.

            So how is this healthcare crap going to do anything than make life more miserable for them and now many others?.

            • Popsmoke

              I work the system every day… I know the folk who are in need and I know the abuses. The abuses when I catch them get reported. But for the most part most people are really hurting. There is an over politicization of the abuse issue and its being used as an excuse to kill the program. That is bullshit….

              As far as abortion that is one of the issues I have with the law. Remember I am a practicing Catholic and part of the Church’s
              Religious Freedom movement. But that does not mean we kill the entire law. Yes as I have said it needs to be amended in many areas. But I oppose killing the law entirely.

              • Hokma

                You know the system. So why should it take 60 days for someone in need to get temporary assistance? Isn’t the idea to get that immediately?
                Anything the government does is less efficient and takes longer. When the government decided to take over government backed student loans from Sallie Mae and others the government created more steps, delayed sending the loans, and made the system less transparent than it was previously.
                Politicians think that by simnply enacting a bill they solve a problem and never monitor how it is being enacted.

                • Popsmoke

                  60 days? Where? I just had a guy go homeless. Within one week he had approval for food stamps and medicaid and starting the 1st (today) his food stamp card is a go. The only time I ever saw benefits go longer is if there was a submittal glitch or if the case worker is a dolt (which happens from time to time), nothing is perfect. By the way, in many states the case workers are “private contractors”….

                  Yes we agree the government may not be efficient in many cases. But neither is the private sector… We are a mirror reflection of ourselves and as the saying goes. You get what you pay for.. The question always is in both government and the private sector, what are we really paying for?

                  • Hokma

                    I know a number of people who had lost their jobs or businesses and eventually ended up needing assistance. They were in several New York area counties.
                    In all cases it was SOP that decisions on assistance would take about 45 days and typically took 2 months.
                    A typical complaint was a complete inability to speak to anyone or even leave a message for someone because of filled voice mail systems
                    I got involved by trying to contact political people I know in Albany but they offered no better assistance in the matter.
                    From my own experiences with government agencies, you have to devote half a day to try to reach anyone to accomplish anything.

                    • Popsmoke

                      This is what happens when we cut, cap and balance without thinking what we are really doing or hurting…..

                    • buzzlatte3

                      Yup, just have a friend who got assistance because of a job loss and it took from Jan. to May 31st to get benefits. By the way, hates it and feels demeaned by accepting assistance…this person is working to set up own business and has a goal to get off asap. Has a mortgage payment that can’t be modified – FHA – the govt will screw you from every direction… they are life long dems who just switched after ACA. No more Barry O for them!

                    • Popsmoke

                      Its just not Obama and for those out there who continue to focus just on Obama and not the republicans. Then you are the biggest problem this country has….

            • Popsmoke

              I work the system every day… I know the folk who are in need and I know the abuses. The abuses when I catch them get reported. But for the most part most people are really hurting. There is an over politicization of the abuse issue and its being used as an excuse to kill the program. That is bullshit….

              As far as abortion that is one of the issues I have with the law. Remember I am a practicing Catholic and part of the Church’s
              Religious Freedom movement. But that does not mean we kill the entire law. Yes as I have said it needs to be amended in many areas. But I oppose killing the law entirely.

              • buzzlatte3

                You don’t think it would be replaced, oh ye of little faith? Sheesh, go light a candle and pray for your brain. By the way, I love the whole candle thing, do it in my home, too. But I’m concerned about your cognitive abilities.

                • Popsmoke

                  You either do not understand the complexities and cost factors of killing such as large piece of legislation or you are blinded by your own partisanship. But its good to see you light candles. Hopefully you pray as well…

                  • buzzlatte3

                    Yup, put you in,too. Asked God to please give you some divine inspiration to look past your nose and, for once, experience and embrace the bigger picture. I know grinding through all those files and listening to sob stories can severely narrow one’s perspective to the size of a pinhole. Inspire people to better themselves rather than be just another cog in their dependence on the govt. I know a guy who had to go through bankruptcy because of a bad marriage and divorce. Then he lost his job. He refused govt assistance. He works one full and two fill in jobs to make it and he’s more happy and energized about his life and sending his kids to college than any chronic welfare participant I ever ran across. I will never vote to get sucked into the machine. So, no, after years of being a faithful dem, I no longer feel the need to change people or buy into their self imposed limitations. If it were a GOP pres that had used corruption to pass a law that marks the death knell of freedom, I would be raging against him/her, too. The big picture loss is your freedom.

                    • Popsmoke

                      Look everyone is different. Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses. No one can judge another by their own standards. That is just bullshit.

                      Besides you pray? GREAT! Here is the question I ask you then. If you went to Heaven and God asked you to explain your postings here. What would you say to Christ?

                      How would Christ handle any of this?

          • FormerLiberal9

            No one is complaining about giving assistance to people who really need help. Your example is the way government help should work but rarely does in reality. Most of us believe that Welfare should be a hand up not a hand out.

            I can give you an example of a female Meth head who was receiving food stamps and assistance (because she suffered from depression). She was also collecting SS survivor benefit because the father of her
            child had died even though the grandmother of this child was being raised and totally supported by her paternal grandmother.

            I am sure most people would not support giving aid to some one like this woman who is not attempting to raise themselves out of their poverty. In fact she is in her situation because of bad choices she has made and continues to make. But if you think that asking the Government to stop enabling this woman makes us “pieces of dog crap” then I relish being a “piece of dog crap”.

            • Popsmoke

              There is a lot of those type of people around. I have had a few of them myself. They are not the majority thank goodness.

              However, do you shoot the children because the mother or father is a doper? Take the kids away from them? Not as easy as you think. Give you an example of stupidity.

              Had a family with six kids, with a mother and father. Living along with another single mom who also had six kids. So now we have 12 kids all in the age range between 1 and 13. Ok dad lost his job and worked side jobs and mom had drug issues. The other mom was just a dunderhead. Did not want to live with her mom and dad because of the strict rules… go figure so she moved in with this family.

              So the entire group lost the electric to their house, lost the phone service and was house camping as we know it. State family services comes in and places the family under supervision. So now we need to find sources of revenue to help pay their bills to get the power back on , which was the order from the state, the bill? $1800.00.

              Ok so we access four sources for the bill and finally get it paid. What happens next? Mom is arrested and jailed for drugs….

              Oh yeah, she also had drug warrants… Think the State Family Services would have known this? Think the State would have told us? You would think the State would have just taken the kiddies? Not so simple. Why?
              Cut, cap and balance…. The political idiots cut, capped and balanced the budget cutting funding to cover removals such as this as long as the children were not in immediate danger. They had a roof, a generator and food. So the state just placed them under supervision and then pushed them off after the electric was turned back on.

              Want another one? Had a single mom who lost her job with a 13 year old get evicted for the second time in one year. Got her funding to survive the eviction order and moved to her parents home.

              So now we cannot find her another place to move into because of her eviction record. Can’t blame the landlords for that and she has a roof over her head. So as we are trying to find her a place. We discover that she is normally sitting at a local bar and even buying drinks for her friends on her unemployment. Lets see, can’t afford rent but can go to the bar and buy drinks. Well as one can imagine, this gal is not getting any assistance for me or anyone else.

              Now what do both of these cases have in common? The kids are more educated than their parents who do not even have high school diplomas or GEDs…

              Yes its a vicious cycle… Again the majority are not anything like these cases.

              But we error on the side of gentleness and pray for the best.

            • Popsmoke

              Yes and folk like this do get caught. But as you cut budgets and make it more difficult to get fraud reported then you can only blame yourself. This is what you want then so be it….

          • Wisewoman2

            We give a shit because we are the ones who pay for all the freebies, *sshole. I certainly think that all types of welfare should come with a work or volunteer requirement, helping at daycare centers, cleaning trash from parks. etc., anything taht would add dignity to the person receiving it. Now don’t go lecturing me because as an african American, I have worked all my life starting in the cotton fields of MS at the age of 6 years. My mom and Dad had 14 kids not all living at home at the same time. We all had to work from the time we were about 6 or 7 years old. The main work we did was in the cotton fields of MS in 100 degree heat. We sharecropped and later chopped and picked cotton by the day. We earned $2 to $2.50/ day for chopping and about $2.50/100lbs for picking cotton. My father died when I was 13 years old but we were never on food stamps (didn’t exist in the late 50s) or commody as it was callled at the time. We had to work to survive. I do not mind helping people who help themselves or people who are sick, otherwise let them work for the handouts.

            • Wisewoman2

              Forgot to add nearly all of us went to college and graduated, moved from MS, got good jobs and was successful in life. None of the 14 ended up in jail or prison. I credit my Mom mostly for instilling in us morals and a work ethic. Those are the things that make a person successful not a handout it cripples people instead.

              • morris1030

                Wisewoman…what would happen to you if you became seriously ill and your medical bills exceeded your insurance? Your meds are not covered by insurance and they are huge as are the tests and uncovered treatment tou must have. You lose your job. Unemployment compensation runs out, and you are $300,000 in the hole and now broke. You cannot find another job & are about to lose your house. What the hell would you do, and why are you so arrogant when this scenario can happen to you and does happen to many many people?

            • Popsmoke

              Very ill informed and arrogant…

            • Popsmoke

              Very ill informed and arrogant…

              • scottymac54

                Yes, and every comment by the latest self-described special interest group, “black conservatives”, always contain a full but irrelevant rundown on their ethnic/racial heritage, followed by a completely unverifiable tale of whatever long-ago tale of slave labor, servitude, hard luck in the work world, etc., and how, THEY, and they alone, rose above the frey and achieved self-realization, by the sweat of their own brows, of course.
                And, in the next sentence, they hold themselves up against their own, and claim that, not for one minute, are they claiming special privilege.
                WHO CARES? What BULLSHIT!!
                They claim the WORDS of conservatism, but believe themselves superior! (And sprinkle all that sanctimony with profanity and disrespect, to boot.)
                Overblown windbags, if you ask me.

                • Wisewoman2

                  The overblown windbag is you. Don’t assume I am a conservative. In fact I was a life long liberal dem until they decided that morals were not important, lies were OK, and taking what did not belong to you was OK. Working if you are healthy is not OK because you have a young child although I and most other women worked after our children were just six weeks old. No, looney liberals are a detriment to the country. For your info I may lose my temper and write a bad word occasionally but I try to restrain myself. You see my Mom would wash our mouths out with soap if we uttered a curse word. Yeah I know, I am lying by your mental disease.

                  • scottymac54

                    Do you deny the existence of the syndrome I describe? Some of “us” were at the barricades too, way back when.

              • Wisewoman2

                How so? The person refuses to see is the one who is blind. That applies to you.

        • http://www.facebook.com/karen.lorentzson Karen Lorentzson

          the incentives for having children are enormous then eventually they kick them off the welfare when they need it the most, to become criminals/worker slaves/military as they do not get an education ofr the most part sex education and the public school system!!

      • KenoshaMarge

        Screw that. I’m not privileged, but I am old and white. Two things that are disdained in Obama-country.
        Yet their party is full of dessicated old farts who have hung onto and will benefit from the “perks” of sucking government teat lifelong.

        • elizabethrc

          Oh, but we are a powerful voting bloc, Marge. Hear us roar!

          • foxyladi14

            In November it will be the roar heard around the world.

    • Popsmoke

      Snotty? Who died and left you King? What a pompous ass….

      • stodghie

        do the math and give us a rest.

        • Popsmoke

          Who’s math? Yours?

          • stodghie

            i suggest you look at the math offered here on larry’s site about the screwing that obama has in his plans for seniors after the election. you make all these claims about caring for people. frankly i don’t see it. just vain attemtps at trying to best and be right all the time.

            • Popsmoke

              With all respect to my friend Larry Johnson. Anyone can play with numbers and make them work the way they see them working. Maybe Larry is right. I don’t know. But neither can anyone else say he is correct at this point in time. This is theory right now. Lets get the ball rolling and see for ourselves and then make the proper adjustments.

              Give you an example. Ever do a business plan? You know the Dilbert Principle.. A business Plan…

              “Some where between the hallucinations of senior management and the cold
              reality of the market lies something called a business plan.”

              Well until that business gets off the ground one is hallucinating. After the first quarter you start to make the necessary adjustments..one hopes… and you go on from there….

              Same deal applies to these types of programs…. We need to see how they start out and we need to place in the proper oversight and then make the necessary adjustments. In theory anyway….

              But the same things were being said about social security and then medicare.

              Lets give it a shot. We can always then kill the program if its a failure.

              • stodghie

                let’s be clear pop! i own a busienss and have for years. i have done the math on insurance due to all this. the information re the math is all here and i am not going to do your job for you. stop trying to talk down to people when you are the on one on the bottom.

                • Popsmoke

                  Bravo, bravo and bravo.. A small business owner! Well my friend I was a managing director of a very profitable maritime corporation and a fixer for three of the largest venture capital funds in the US at one time.

                  So you like to throw your weight and math around eh? OK I’ll play the game. Lets see your math? Or are you the type that just opens his mouth without being able to back it up? Now here is your chance to shut me up and make me look like a fool and do it right here at NQ. You’ll go down in NQ history as the man who shut popsmoke up….

                  Want to dance with the devil in the pale moon light?

                  Lets dance…..

                  • stodghie

                    oh stuff it pop! you wanted to know if i knew about business. i answered you. deal with reality and stop trying to be a bully when someone answers you.

                    fixer? yeah right! i know people in business and pop they don’t behave in the irrational mean spirited bullying manner you do all the time. you don’t get anywhere that way but why waste any comment on you since you think you know it all. LOL

                    • Popsmoke

                      Sorry my friend, but your nothing more that a huge windbag. Insult me all you wish but you had a chance to show me and everyone else your stuff and you decided to go to dopeville and blow more smoke. This is typical of people who think highly of themselves when in fact they are dumber than dirt and need an extension ladder to climb out of the gutter.

                      The sad part is that you did not even try…

                      Oh yes and if you do not like my attitude that too is tough shit.

                    • stodghie

                      gee thanks for proving my point pop!

                • scottymac54

                  Where did you own a business, LOL? In Nicaragua?
                  Because you absolutely have the worst communication skills, spelling, grammar, and punctuation of ANY NQ commenter I’ve EVER seen (and that’s quite remarkable).
                  Cut the crap and respect your betters.

                  • stodghie

                    naw you silly idiot! you just showed your backside. please put your pants back on. espero qui si usted tiene nada in su cabezo!
                    scotty you are so juvenile and silly in your comments that i suspect you are still in your teens and not very good in school either.

                    scotty you are never better than any person at this site. in fact you are among the lowest ones here. your comments are laughed at by most. you make no sense and have no knowledge. as i said a silly juvenile!

                    now i see a trend here of foolish people showing off not engaging in discussion that is interesting and enjoyable. this group of so call libs reminds me of the ones sitting in parks throwing turds at the police and in general solving nothing and adding nothing to the welfare of the people. no answers just bs! so scotty i won’t be responding to you again. i have no respect for you and think you are very dull insulting person of no consequence!

      • stodghie

        well dang it! sigh ole pop is showing backside again. please put your trousers back on ugggg! making comments about obama’s minnons being snotty? must have been describing you! LOL

        • scottymac54

          Stop antagonizing Pop. You are sowing discord and you don’t even have a point to make. It’s vicious.

          • stodghie

            scotty you are the vicious one. stop antagnoziing everyone. many good people left here because your rude behavior.