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Go Ahead Obama, Do It

Obama wants tax increases? Let him have it. But he will damn well wear the consequences. He can’t blame Bush for ending the Bush tax rates and the subsequent economic decline will be his legacy. He is a total, ignorant ass.

I am with Republicans taking the Obama route of voting present. Do nothing. Let Obama “lead.” But he gets to take the credit for the ensuing results.

Obama has not offered a credible plan other than to demonize the so-called wealthy. It is laughable and delusional to label people who make more than $200,000 as wealthy. If you are living in a small town in the midwest I would agree, $200,000 is a lot of money and goes along ways. But go to New York or Boston or Philadelphia or Los Angeles and see how far you get with $200,000. Sorry, that’s not even comfortable middle class. But such is the lies and deceit of Obama.

The Wall Street Journal took a look at this claim back in 2011:

In 2008, there were 236,883 tax filers reporting income of $1 million or more. The Patriotic Millionaires, a group advocating the repeal of the Bush tax cuts on tax filers making $1 million or more a year, estimated that their plan would raise $500 billion to $600 billion over 10 years. That sounds like a lot.

But only $100 billion of that is projected savings from lower government debt costs. So the tax would actually raise $40 billion to $50 billion a year: equal to about 3% of the annual federal deficit.

Obama’s new taxes will do little to dent the pocketbooks of Mitt Romney and Warren Buffet. They don’t earn income from paychecks. There money comes from investment proceeds. For example, if Romney putts $10 million dollars in tax free municipal bonds that earn 7%, he will get $700,000 tax free to live off of every year.

What Obama is doing with the full support of the Dummycrats is to score a political point that will harm the economy in both the short term and long term. There is some good news, however. The taxes will fall most heavily on people who live in Democrat states:

With their enthusiastic backing of President Obama and the Democratic Party on Election Day, the bluest parts of America may have embraced a program utterly at odds with their economic self-interest. The almost uniform support of blue states’ congressional representatives for the administration’s campaign for tax “fairness” represents a kind of bizarre economic suicide pact.

Any move to raise taxes on the rich — defined as households making over $250,000 annually — strikes directly at the economies of these states, which depend heavily on the earnings of high-income professionals, entrepreneurs and technical workers. In fact, when you examine which states, and metropolitan areas, have the highest concentrations of such people, it turns out they are overwhelmingly located in the bluest states and regions. . . .
The people whose wallets will be drained in the new war on “the rich” are high-earning, but hardly plutocratic professionals like engineers, doctors, lawyers, small business owners and the like. Once seen as the bastion of the middle class, and exemplars of upward mobility, these people are emerging as the modern day “kulaks,” the affluent peasants ruthlessly targeted by Stalin in the early 1930s.

Suck on it Barack. You deserve it.

  • Hokma

    You are right.

    At this point you have incoherent and ineffective GOP leadership, a complicit news and entertainment media, and a clown cage of idiots inside the beltway who are clueless to how our economy works or what the implications of this will be.

    The sheer arrogance and stupidity of Obama has himself believing that he has a mandate to do whatever he pleases.

    If we do “go off the cliff” and those automatic cuts combined with the automatic raising of everyone’s taxes will ensure that this economy will remain bad for the remainder of Obama’s second term.

    There are still 23 million people without jobs and we are still on the brink of a second recession. And all Obama wants to do is raise taxes on households making $250,000 or more (which includes most small businesses).

    • DianaLC

      I believe now that our worrying about small businesses is correct, but what most of us just don’t see is that the small businesses are what O is trying to eliminate. He likes huge conglomerations where he can send in union thugs.

      I just always have my recent research of my family history in Russia in mind. My ethnic groups’ family farms were, in a sense, successful small businesses the way they were run. These farms were run by large extended families–the patriarch at the head and all the sons and their wives. They were very successful, but the lifestyles were not wealthy the way most people would call it. Those bolsheviks came in, stole them, set them up as factory farms and communal farms, bringing people down from the cities to work in them. The city folks had no idea how to farm and no desire to farm. The once thriving bread basket along the Volga and above the Black Sea was under the Communists decimated by horrible deadly famines in the 20′s and 30′s.

      What I might add is that the NYT reporter assigned there hung out with the gov. people and denied it was happening for a long time.

      I worry for my kids and grandson. I’m sure my taxes are going up and I won’t be able to help them as much as I’d like. My older sister and her husband plan to be able to leave a very sizable estate to her kids. They need, I think, to downsize quickly for themselves and give those assets to the kids now before O gets his way about inheritance taxes. I don’t have as much, but I’m doing lots of research trying to figure out how to make sure my own kids have some of my stuff now instead of later.

      • Hokma

        “To be ignorant of what occurred before you were born is to remain always a child.” Cicero

        You certainly are not. Unfortunately we live in a country that chooses never to grow up and a man-child for a leader.

    • elizabethrc

      And don’t forget that’s only half of his ill fated plan. He wants to keep on spending like it’s someone else’s money.
      Oh, wait….it is.

  • akaPatience

    The interest rate of 7% seems way too high for municipal bonds. Maybe cities teetering on the brink of insolvency pay that high of a rate, I’m not sure. Otherwise I agree that the very wealthy will find a way to avoid paying higher taxes, somehow. Savvy accountants will take care of their clients in this regard.

    Republicans have little to lose by voting “present” since media and other Democrats are mercilessly promiscuous in blaming them for every ill. I suspect Obama and Palace Guards in the media know the economy will remain sluggish (at best) in any case and they’re setting up conservatives to take the blame, yet again. It’s amazing that Democrats, who controlled the House and Senate for the last 2 years of the Bush administration, remain blameless virgins when it comes to the financial meltdown of 2008, yet Republican control of the House since 2010 is a perpetual scapegoat for everything that’s wrong with our economy. Oh no, don’t dare blame the lack of economic growth on Obamacare, over-regulation, profligate spending with little to show for it, or the threat of higher taxes, etc. No no no.

    And you’re so right about blue state areas where an annual income of $250,000 does not afford residence on Easy Street. Let them eat cake.

    • http://noquarterusa.net Larry Johnson

      I know of one right now that is getting 7 1/8%. These are available to only qualified investors. The average Joe never gets a sniff at these.

      • BronwynsHarbor

        I just happened to ask an agent for State Farm about something to invest in. He picked two “mutual fund” plans for me. I hope I “rev up that engine” soon, and save all the money I can.

        Just a bit of information for those of you who aren’t “qualified investors.” The agent told me that it didn’t matter how much money I had — so, soon, I’ll start that account and watch my savings build. In fact, I just sent a note to one of his assistants to ask her to remind me to do that soon.

        • BronwynsHarbor

          P.S. He showed me a similar plan that someone else started. It was amazing. In just a few short months, its grown to 1-1/2 times the money that person invested. (He didn’t let me see the person’s name, but did show me the numbers.)

          • HARP2

            Careful……that`s an old trick. Best to ask him if he dosen`t mind you checking with some of his clients.

  • Dave L.

    Life’s a bitch, then you vote Democratic and find out what a real bitch it is. Higher taxes couldn;t happen to more deserving assholes, you reap what you sow. If you voted for this moron, serves you right, good luck in getting the billions needed to rebuild your homes and businesses,

  • no_longer_a_democrat

    I just found out yesterday I will be losing one of my jobs early january, I work a couple of part time jobs. frankly, I knew it was coming, we aren’t doing as much business, and my boss really didn’t have a choice and unlike the fed govt, businesses can’t print money, when they have less coming in, people are let go, spending is cut, and as immediately as possible.

    I say, start the pain so that we can at least start the path in the correct direction , we as a country are broke, taxing more (expiration of bush tax cuts) will bring only 70-80 billion extra per year, fine, but then cut spending, not slow the growth of spending, but cut spending, actual spending… when my family had reduced revenues, we didn’t say, oh we’ll cut out eating out from everyday to every other day, we cut out all eating out, starting cooking at home, etc.

    and Soetero thinks his word means something? raise taxes and some spending cuts later?? yea right, like that’ll happen, just like when Soetero said he would take public funding, until he didn’t, said he didn’t want an indiv mandate, until he didn’t, the man is a liar, if he’s talking, he’s lying.

    • HELENK2

      backtrack must have watched popeye when whimpy was on,

      I will gladly pay you Tuesday, for a hamburger today.

    • http://noquarterusa.net Larry Johnson

      I want you to know that your news of losing a job brings no joy. Just awful. Good people like you have to suffer for the stupidity of clowns like Obama. England is a preview of what is coming down the pike for us.
      We’ll keep a good thought for you.

      • win43

        Comparing us to Britain? Um…

        Two years ago, Britain instituted a massive austerity program of spending cuts, of the same kind that you’ve generally advocated here. Britain also CUT taxes on the top bracket this past spring, not raised them.

        In short, Britain’s done exactly the kind of things you, and the GOP, seem to think should be done here.

        Those things haven’t worked there. That’s because they don’t work.

        • elizabethrc

          “Britain also CUT taxes on the top bracket this past spring, not raised them”.
          I guess the 2/3rds of the wealthiest in Britain who are moving their wealth out of the country just haven’t heard about that cut! The reason they expressed? The 50% tax imposed on them.
          Perhaps you should share your great knowledge with them.

    • DianaLC

      Sorry to read about the loss of that job. This whole situation now where people have to patch together a living with temporary and part-time jobs in America is just wrong.
      At least you understand that. I sat in a room doing that temporary grade scoring with hundreds of people who were in your situation. And the thing that bothered me most were the MANY who felt O was the answer for their way out.

  • DianaLC

    I’m at a loss for a solution. I think you’re right. But Obama is not aiming to fix anything. He’s aiming to take America down. He’s not worrying about blame for not fixing the economy. His victory in his mind will be the destruction of our country. He just does not think the way a normal American thinks.

    • getfitnow

      THIS is what the GOP and many others don’t understand. HE, WANTS. THIS.

    • Alan Davis

      Maybe you are right Diana, Obama is not a ‘normal’ American and in fact I think he is not even from this planet. Probably from a different solar system and is a plant in order to scare everyone with the Mayan doom scenario. I think THAT is what is in his mind, and THAT is what he is aiming at and that the only thing he is “worrying about” is if The World’s Only Reliable News outlet will warn us humans in time. http://weeklyworldnews.com/

    • piattq

      No, I think O’s target in the cross hairs is white America. He wants to get even for his split genes. And he wants to destroy the Republican party and be the Democrat who put the Repubs down and out.

  • no_longer_a_democrat

    Barry Soetero is a LIAR. LIAR LIAR! Trust not a damn word that comes out of his lying mouth!

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-05/who-said-it

    It really never gets old…

    Date: March 16, 2006

    Place: Senate Floor

    Speech:

    The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt
    limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the
    U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on
    ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s
    reckless fiscal policies.

    Over the past 5 years, our federal debt has increased by $3.5 trillion to
    $8.6 trillion.That is “trillion” with a “T.” That is money that we have
    borrowed from the Social Security trust fund, borrowed from China and Japan,
    borrowed from American taxpayers. And over the next 5 years, between
    now and 2011, the President’s budget will increase the debt by almost another
    $3.5 trillion.

    Numbers that large are sometimes hard to understand. Some people may wonder
    why they matter. Here is why: This year, the Federal Government will spend $220
    billion on interest. That is more money to pay interest on our national debt
    than we’ll spend on Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program.
    That is more money to pay interest on our debt this year than we will
    spend on education, homeland security, transportation, and veterans benefits
    combined. It is more money in one year than we are likely to spend to
    rebuild the devastated gulf coast in a way that honors the best of America.

    And the cost of our debt is one of the fastest growing expenses in the
    Federal budget. This rising debt is a hidden domestic enemy, robbing our
    cities and States of critical investments in infrastructure like bridges, ports,
    and levees; robbing our families and our children of critical investments in
    education and health care reform; robbing our seniors of the retirement and
    health security they have counted on.

    Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to
    investment in America’s priorities.” — Barack Hussein Obama
    ===========================================

    Fast forward to today, when the same senator, now president, is openly
    threatening with using a veto to impose his will on raising
    the debt ceiling over that of what, at least according to the Congress,
    is still the majority of Americans.

    So much changes in 6 years indeed…

    • arturo_ui

      “Barry Soetero is a LIAR. LIAR LIAR!”

      If you say it just one more time, Tinker bell comes back to life!

      • HARP2

        Barney Frank is coming back ?

        • elizabethrc

          That is deliciously wicked of you!!

  • no_longer_a_democrat

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-05/guest-post-thought-experiment-why-obama-wants-fiscal-cliff

    “The use of economic pain to expand governmental control of a nation is not a new
    concept. It has been a tool successfully used many times in history.
    The reality that “taxing the wealthy” does not increase revenue or promote
    economic growth is lost on the 80% of Americans that are economically uninformed
    and are just struggling to maintain their current standard of living. The path
    over the “fiscal cliff” is bad for the economy, the average American family and
    the stock market. However, for the White House, going over the “cliff” is the
    next move in this elaborate game of chess which will clear the path
    towards completing Obama’s long term objectives of complete socialization of the
    American economy”

    my 2 cents, let it go over the cliff, most americans don’t earn enough, and have already gotten used to living with less standard of living. As Ace of Spades’s site as been saying “let it burn”, “go john gault”.

  • BronwynsHarbor

    Larry, am I ever glad you wrote this. I’ve been thinking about the exact same thing. This line from your post got to me in particular: “If you are living in a small town in the midwest I would agree, $200,000 is a lot of money and goes along ways. ”

    There are a LOT of small businesses near where I live. I keep wondering how in the HELL they are going to pay for those increased taxes … and keep their businesses going too? They have employees to PAY, products to purchase and sell, more employees to take inventories, accept deliveries, and provide customer service. These taxes will probably force many of these businesses to shutter their doors. DAMN both parties for this.

    I keeping thinking about the 1940s through 1970s. Legislators and presidents got SO much more done then. Dwight Eisenhower helped create the interstate highway system we all depend on. Those freeways replaced smaller, narrower streets that also work well, but they often — in larger cities — have more stop signs, red lights, etc. The speed limits are lower. (Sometimes I use those streets when I get off a freeway, and then I turn off onto side streets with fewer lights and less traffic.) I also knew all the best routes to use when I lived in Santa Monica and Beverly Hills many moons ago. Those freeways, in Los Angeles? Oh god, they are so jammed with traffic. One time, I got stuck in the middle of nowhere for many hours. I’d drive to a small city north of Los Angeles, and there was a sudden downpour of rain and that freeway was flooded. I don’t remember how long I sat in my car, but it was a hell of a long time. Luckily, I had some food and water with me … but guess what I couldn’t do? Yup, use a restroom anywhere near there. That turned out to be a rather unpleasant day. Now, had I known it was going to rain like that, I wouldn’t have made that trip. But, it was long before the Internet was available to all of us. (Back then, a few programmers, probably, used a primitive e-mail system — I remember using those too in the early 1980s.)

    • buzzlatte3

      As a small business co-owner I can answer the question about the taxes. There will be no employees in 2013.

      • win43

        Please explain why paying an extra 4% in taxes on your PROFITS — not your revenue, but your profits — over $200k will make you close your doors.

        You won’t have a tax increase on your operating revenue. Just your net income, i.e. profits.

        You won’t even have a tax increase on ALL your profits. Just those that fall into the top tax bracket.

        How, and why, is a 4% tax bump on profits in excess of 200k going to lead to you firing all of your workers?

        • buzzlatte3

          No employees. Final. You love Obama and you don’t want him to fail. We get that. But, it’s his baby now. It’s called consequences.

          • win43

            What a compelling non-response.

            • buzzlatte3

              Consequences. Live with it.

              • win43

                That makes even less sense. You’re going to fire everybody because you’re mad Obama won?

                • buzzlatte3

                  I can see that because you have to ask you have no real world experience and certainly no reality about what the real cost (actual expense) to run a business and pay for an employee (x how many you have) is these days. Do yourself a favor and study up before you blindly praise Obama. Start with your employer. Ask how much you really cost the company.

                  • win43

                    Yes, that’s nice.

                    Let’s start here: I don’t believe you co-own a business. I think you’re talking out your ass, and now you’re trying to avoid answering a VERY simple question because you don’t know how. Let’s get back to that question.

                    We’re talking about the proposal to raise income taxes on incomes over $250k (for households — I’ll assume you’re married) by roughly 4%. Right?

                    I’ll assume you, like most small business owners, pass through company income to yourself, such that after costs are subtracted from revenue, the company profits are taxed as your personal income. If that’s not the case please say so, because in that case there is no reason for us to be talking about this income tax proposal in the first place.

                    Now, your operating costs — which include employee costs — are what they are, regardless of your personal income tax rate. Right? This is pretty important, so don’t skip this step.

                    So explain to us why a small increase in the taxation of the portion of your income (i.e. your company’s profits) that EXCEEDS $250k would force you to reduce operating costs by firing employees.

                    How does making a very successful business LESS profitable (very slightly) make it so UN-profitable that you have no choice but to fire people? How is that the same thing?

                    • buzzlatte3

                      You know nothing.

                    • win43

                      Haha, you’re kind of proving my point for me, here.

                    • buzzlatte3

                      Your “concern” over employees is rather ironic considering you love Obama so much. You can’t even admit that you don’t know and didn’t ask. All that’s proven here is that you engage in conjecture, love Obama more than you have common sense or real world experience, and can’t be trusted to follow through on a task before blustering with your great Obama wisdom some more. So what’s the point to prove? I can’t do business how I see fit? Or that you’re a card carrying Matrix dwelling Obot?

                    • win43

                      I’m certainly not saying you’re not entitled to do what you wish with your business.

                      I’m just questioning the incredible lack of intelligence, not to mention common decency, shown by your assertion that, despite your alleged “business” being profitable — so damn profitable that you’re in the top tax bracket! — you’re going to take your ball and go home, and fire everyone, because your income taxes are going up a little.

                      That’s just cutting off your nose to spite your face. It’s dumb, petty, and lazy. But it’s okay, since you’re making all of this up anyway.

                    • buzzlatte3

                      Common decency? From you? That’s rich. Thanks for the laugh! Again, you know nothing.

                    • Hokma

                      Unemployment is back over 8% which is a surprise since we are in the middle of the holiday season which is the highest period of temporary seasonal employment.

                      He spent nearly a trillion dollars on stimulus beginning in his first year in office and now he wants more? For what? More payoffs to his supporters?

                      Obama is not a serious person because a serious person would do whatever it took to dispense with this fisal cliff issue and not make it into another political battle to score poiints – and then immediately understand what he needs to do to create a climate for companies to hire people and not in part-time jobs and for good wages.

                    • buzzlatte3

                      Well said. Ten thumbs up!

                    • DianaLC

                      Here’s a solution that will make you happy. Hokma should run the business with no profits anyway. The hard work and frustration will be the sole reason for Hokma’s existence as there will be nothing to use to pay living expenses.

                      I bet you’d last maybe two weeks managing a business.

                      You sound like the ex-”escort,” heroin addict on Medicaid paid drugs to keep her off drugs so she could care for the baby she had that had to withdraw from addiction when she was born who lived with me for a while and who was supported by her uncle’s money from the trust he left for his nieces and nephews. Her idea was to run a cup-cake truck because she really liked cup cakes. She had no idea how to do that or to acquire finances to start, but she was darned sure it was a good idea. She had the same amount of work experience as O has. Yet, somehow, I wouldn’t want her giving me advice or running the tax codes. When you own up to your experience running a business other than in your limited imaginings, we will listen to you.

                    • DianaLC

                      The real problem that you are not taking into account is the fact that with all the new regulations the employers are facing the fact that they will be running their businesses for the “fun” they get from all that hard work and frustration and lack of sleep since the end result of all the O added taxes and regulations will really mean that there won’t be a profit. And then O won’t get that 4% he wants so badly and soon the business owner will no longer have a business becaue he or she is just too frustrated with the whole thing, and then all those employees will be on O’s dole–getting their unemployment checks and Obama phones, etc. And there will be fewer wage earners to pay income taxes to pay for the growing number of people who do not have jobs, including those “wealthy” business owners who gave up. When there is a reversal of the situation now and the 47% are the ones making money and there are 53% on the dole, how are you going to do your rationalization then?

                    • buzzlatte3

                      Why, you just described life in the Matrix. Dumb, stoned, and worthless is no way to go through life, young man. (Sorry Animal House)

                  • DianaLC

                    win43′s likelihood of even having an employer seems minimal to me. I believe he/she/it works in the WH basement and lives of Cheetos and Kool Aid.

                • wylrae

                  Maybe it just gets to the point of “why bother”. If you invest and risk you are generally doing so with the thought of making a “PROFIT”. The individual putting in the time, effort, and taking the risk determines what he/she considers an adequate “PROFIT”. I realize that there are those who think it is okay for the government to determine what an adequate “PROFIT” should be but fortunately the individual business owner is still the one who makes the decision of whether he/she wants to continue taking the risks and put in the efforts required to continue operating his/her business.
                  Of course many might agree with your point about 4% of “PROFITS” over $200k or so, not being that big a deal. But when combined with the increased fees/taxes that will be creeping in with Obamacare, capital gains higher rates, etc. that 4% is really looking more like 5%, 7%, or 10%. A business owner has to decide whether those increased fees/taxes can be reasonably passed on to the consumer and the business can still remain a viable ongoing concern providing sufficient “PROFIT” for the business owner to continue operation.
                  Oh, I am retired, was not a small business owner, and during the best years of my employment it took slightly more than three and a half years to earn $200k but I truly feel sorry for small businesses under this administration.

        • Hokma

          When you are honest about just how many taxes (which also should includes fees and penalities) are coming from Obama that Pravda refuses to report then you will begin to have an understanding why so many small businesses will have to cut and many will not be able to survive.

          I have 112 employees and this is my third company. Planning for this coming year has been challenging because no one can predict exactly how many different taxes/fees/penalities are coming out of the CiC (Communist in Chief). Remember that each year there is more and more costs to Obamacare ebing forced on us before full implementation.

          I would suggest you take that Ajax Technical School education and learn what small, medium, and large business owners are faciing which you will not get from MSNBC, CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, The NY Times, the Washington Post, Los Angeles Times, AP, Reuters, etc, etc., etc. or ANY Democratic Party shill for Obama. Do that before you shoot your ignorant mouth off.

          • win43

            Look, as long as you’ll concede that employee costs are taken out before income tax is figured, I have no argument with you. Here, I’m just responding to the (utterly false) assertion that a small rise in the top marginal income tax rate will have an effect on small-business hiring.

            • buzzlatte3

              Only in your world.

              • win43

                No… in THE world. This is actually how the tax code works.

                • buzzlatte3

                  Oh you mean the Tax Code that they haven’t finished writing, yet? LOL! Yeah, Iike I said, you know nothing.

            • DianaLC

              And you are speaking from experience as a business owner, I assume. (SNARK)
              I love how these obotic people think they can think independently from the matrix.

          • buzzlatte3

            So true. There’s no way to guarantee long term employment now.

    • nickoury
  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Ryan-Holley/550626733 Ryan Holley

    I agree, just vote present. Let Obama wear this around his neck.

  • Popsmoke

    What a rotten and stupid game both sides are playing… what is really needed here is a totally revamped tax system. But in the meantime across the board cuts and a fair and balanced increase of taxes or new revenue for all income levels. We all need to feel some pain equally. Otherwise we do an injustice to our childrens, children…..

    • Fred82

      I agree.

      I think the enlarged sales tax and death of the income tax deserves at least a second look.

  • Popsmoke
    • buzzlatte3

      More of Barry O’s dirty fingerprints all over people’s lives. Him lovin’ himself some Muslim Brotherhood…

  • arturo_ui

    “The taxes will fall most heavily on people who live in Democrat states”

    Well, thanks for proving our point for us, Larry: it is Red states who have been the “moochers” all along, paying the lowest taxes and reaping the most government benefits.

    • HARP2

      Looks like the red states are run by better people then.

      You should try it.

      • arturo_ui

        “Looks like the red states are run by better people then.”

        People who take more than they make? These are your “better people”? LOL, according to Mitt Romney you’re in the wrong party!

        • HARP2

          I see Detroit has it`s hand out begging. Just more libtards looking for a free ride.

          • buzzlatte3

            52% tax for the rich in CA….yeah, CA will have their collective hands out for money when the rich just move to their second homes in MT, UT, WY, – you know, red states

            • wylrae

              Oh please don’t let them move to WY. Enough have already moved into the Jackson Hole area to ruin it; heck, even a couple of decades ago CO wasn’t too bad a place but look what the migration into their state has done.

              • buzzlatte3

                I know – Sigh -

              • DianaLC

                I said it upthread. We in CO have always called it the Californication of CO. Makes me very sad when I remember my state as it was before.

          • wylrae

            But, but, but….0zer0 promised us the “bacon” and we voted for him so he owes us. But of course Mitt saying that he lost because 0zer0 was giving everything to everyone surely couldn’t have been true!

    • TexMexSoup

      oh puhleaze arturito…. shouldn’t you be somewhere wanking off to the Jamie Foxx, obama is your lord and savior youtube video?

    • http://noquarterusa.net Larry Johnson

      You are a moron. Because folks in Red States may have lower incomes does not therefore mean they are “reaping most government benefits.” Just wait and watch asshole. You will not be celebrating Obama in a year.

      • KenoshaMarge

        Yes he will Larry. There ain’t no cure for stupid!

        • wylrae

          Correct. He will still be buying 0zer0′s Bush is to blame nonsense.

          • KenoshaMarge

            Exactly wylrae! Because any obot-troll knows that Bush is to blame for everything bad in the world for all time and obama is responsible for nothing that happens on his watch. It’s so much easier than thinking.

      • elizabethrc

        Parasitism is a democratic and liberal disease.
        Hmm, I wonder who has the biggest numbers of participants in freebies…Dems or Republicans.
        Has anyone ever produced those numbers?

        • Alan Davis

          farm subsidies

          • buzzlatte3

            Try parity. Then complain.

      • Heather Stein

        There are many studies that show that Red states are more dependent on the Federal government than Blue states. Almost every single Red states take more federal tax dollars out of the system than they put in . Democrats in Blue states have been subsidizing the lifestyles of Republicans in Red states for decades.

        • Hokma

          “There are many studies that show that Red states are more dependent on the Federal government than Blue states. ”

          Show one to prove your point or just go back into your basement

          • win43

            Here you go. Federal dollars received per dollar of federal tax paid, by state: http://taxfoundation.org/article/federal-spending-received-dollar-taxes-paid-state-2005

            • Hokma

              The last I saw we are in 2012 and not 2005.

              The argument is that taxpayers in red states not only pay less than in blue states and also get more from the government than blue states.

              The chart you showed proves no point at all.

              What was that spending for specifically (government assistance or defense)?

              • win43

                LOL, okay. So the fiscal status of all 50 states has changed drastically since 2005, huh? That’s your argument?

                That chart shows that red states are by and large net recipients of federal tax dollars, and blue states are by and large net payors of federal dollars. Look up the word “net.” (Hint: blue states pay in more than they take out, and red states take out more than they pay in.)

                That chart proves the ENTIRE point. American tax dollars flow, by and large, from the liberal, prosperous coasts to the conservative, less prosperous South and Midwest.

                • Hokma

                  Actually there have been some shifts in the last 6 years. But that is not the point.

                  The chart proves absolutely zero including your assertion. Now go back and figure that out Ajax.

                  • win43

                    Explain why it doesn’t, without resort to ad hominem argument. I don’t think you can.

                    • wylrae

                      Heck, just have 0zer0 ‘splain it to you. Know it is hard to research and think for yourself.

                    • Hokma

                      It does not tell you the source of the taxes paid, or who/what the taxes dispensed to states is for. If the assertion is that individual republicans in a red state pay less in taxes, then that is not established at all. If the assertion is that individual republicans in a red state get more in entitlements than in a blue state that too is not at al estabished.

                      It is a very empty chart that tells you nothing other than the obvious.

                    • win43

                      Okay, that’s perfectly fair… if we’re talking about individuals, rather than states. If you change the word “states” in every one of the posts on this subject to “individuals,” you are correct. Congratulations, I guess.

                    • Hokma

                      This chart does NOT tell you the source of the taxes paid and it does NOT tell you what the spending is for. This is one of the most meaningless charts you could point to. I think you can figure why by my questions.

              • buzzlatte3

                Also, you have to look at how much land the feds own in red states….it’s like taking money out of one pocket and putting it in the other.

        • Hokma

          That is pretty much the same info as the chart provided by win43.

          So I ask you. What and who were the exact source of those taxes? And what specifically were those taxes spent on? Can you get any of that info from that mindless chart (also shows what a waste of education student get in college).

          The only response I want are specific answers. (Hint: they are not in those charts and the answers would refute the assertions being made by left wing morons).

    • getfitnow

      You need to speak with the gov of CA. How about the $10 billion spent a year on..wait…ILLEGAL aliens in the state. In the case of CA, residents voted to raise taxes on themselves. Genius. You also need to speak to business owners that have fled CA and set up shop in Austin, TX, contributing to and building a thriving economy there. Yeah, real moochers.

      • buzzlatte3

        Yup, and the money will flee to the red states and the balance will be struck. Why do you think Texas and Utah have been the top two places to do business in the last couple of years?

    • Hokma

      If you are going to attempt an opposing viewpoint, I would suggest that you first understand the information and present a plausable argument and not some ignorant left wing Daily Koz Kidz 4th grade rant.

  • http://lesstalkmoreactivism.blogspot.com/ Canaan

    We’ve already gone over the fiscal cliff. Right now we’re in the freeze frame at the end of Thelma & Louise. In Obama Dreamland, Thelma is sipping pina coladas in Mexico. In reality, we’re in mid-flight on route to an explosion at the bottom of the Grand Canyon. We might as well make it official.

    The triggered spending cuts are necessary. The triggered tax hikes are brutal — but they may be the only thing that can wake up the ‘affluents’ who joined with the Coalition of Losers to re-elect Obama. We live in a Democracy and right now the Coalition of Losers make up the majority. But just let a few million of these divorcees and media scum who voted for Obama get a real taste of Communism — let them lose their co-ops. The Day of the Losers will be very short.

    ‘Speaker’ Boehner or ‘Speaker’ Pelosi? We’re dead either way. Boehner should forget politics and if he loses the House in 2014, so be it. Pelosi paid with her gavel to get Obamacare. Let’s see if Boehner has the balls Pelosi does.

  • TexMexSoup

    When you have people, well more like clueless animals chanting “hail obama” does it really matter what the SOB does or does not do?

  • KenoshaMarge

    Obama doesn’t care what happens to the country because he is convinced he can get what he, and the dimwitted libs, want and the GOP will get the blame. He knows that MSM always has his back.

    Many of the idiot electorate are still blaming Bush after 4 years of Obama. People that dim can pretty much be convinced of anything. In fact they already have.

    Add in a complicit media, partners in the crime, and you have a recipe for disaster. The parasites aren’t smart enough to understand that once you kill and cook the golden goose, there will be no one to pay for all their “free” stuff.

  • getfitnow

    Boehner needs to follow McConnell’s lead from yesterday. Call for a vote by the House dems.

    http://hotair.com/archives/2012/12/05/huh-thats-odd-harry-reid-declines-to-bring-a-vote-on-obamas-cliff-plan/comment-page-1/#comments

    That One doesn’t care what he proposes. He probably doesn’t even know what’s
    proposed on his behalf. He just wants to get the GOP to cave into being his bitch so he can abuse them as much as he wants from then on. IN THE MEANTIME:

    Brian Terry is dead.

    The four of Benghazi are there still in the grave.

  • rino

    $200,000 in Philly not even comfortable middle class? My wife and I make a combined $100,000 and live there and we’re better off than most!

  • HELENK2

    http://hotair.com/archives/2012/12/05/huh-thats-odd-harry-reid-declines-to-bring-a-vote-on-obamas-cliff-plan/

    harry reid declines to put up or shut up
    declines to bring a vote on backtrack’s cliff plan

    • KenoshaMarge

      Reid and the obamamedia believe, and with some justification, that the public is so stupid that they will accept the left-wing talking points that bringing up Oblahblah and Geithner’s “plan” is some kind of a stunt. That makes no sense whatsoever. Therefore I predict that all those obamavoters and the obamamedia will swallow it hook, line and sinker.

    • HELENK2
  • HELENK2

    off topic

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20622233

    Egyptian army begins to clear streets around presidential palace

  • HELENK2
  • HELENK2

    backtrack never learned the art of the political deal.

    that will cost this country dearly.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323501404578161483449849070.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop

    /SB10001424127887323

    • KenoshaMarge

      I don’t think it’s so much that he hasn’t learned the art of the political deal as it’s his arrogance that makes him think that HE doesn’t have to make deals because he “won” the election.
      He seems to think he was elected dictator.

      • http://www.facebook.com/mary.cusack Mary Cusack

        he WAS elected dictator.

        • KenoshaMarge

          Not by the Americans who think dictators would be a bad thing for this, or any other country.

          The others, the obamavoters? They’ll vote for anyone who promises to keep the freebies coming. As their numbers grow the very real threat of a dictatorship emerges.

          What’s that old saying, “If you rob Peter to pay Paul you can always count on Paul’s support.

  • elizabethrc

    Don’t you think that it’s only a matter of time before Obama’s onerous restrictions on life in America are going to grow to the point where even his supporters will begin to feel the pinch the rest of us will? How long will they be in denial about THEIR reduced circumstances?
    Obama’s stock in trade is brinksmanship and bullying. People generally cave before he has to follow through on his threats. Look at his opponents and what they face in running against him in Illinois. Threats and intimidation worked.
    To offer no resistance to Obama’s plan is an excellent suggestion requiring considerable strength of character. Republicans need to vote present. How can he criticize them with his 130 present votes as part of his history? Like most bullies, he’s never had to put up or shut up.

  • HELENK2

    http://dailycaller.com/2012/09/26/taxpayers-spent-1-4-billion-on-obama-family-last-year-perks-questioned-in-new-book/

    taxpayers spent $1.4 BILLION on the backtrack family last year.

    so what about that fiscal cliff

  • HELENK2
    • HELENK2

      I keep hearing all about fair today

      fair is a place you go for amusement once a year

      life is not fair, never was and never will be

      • Hokma

        “…there is always inequity in life. . . . Life is unfair.” – John F. Kennedy

  • Heather Stein

    “the subsequent economic decline ”

    There is absolutely no proof that higher taxes result in economic decline, especially higher taxes on income over $250,000. Stop your fear-mongering. Moving taxes up just a little bit to where they were under Clinton will likely have no significant long lasting impact on the U.S. economy, but it will help to reduce the deficit.

    You do realize Larry Johnson that the proposal is that income over $250,000 is to be taxed at slightly higher rates. All income under $250,000 stays at the exact same existing Bush tax cut rates. That means if you make $251,000, your first $250,000 will not face a tax increase and only the $1,000 that is above $250,000 will be taxed at a slightly higher rate.

    For a deficit hawk like yourself you must realize that we can no longer afford to give these big tax breaks to the wealthy, who have made out very well over the last 10 years. They will survive.

    These new taxes will generate about $80 billion of additional tax revenue or about $800 billion over 10 years, which gets us most of the way to the $1.2 trillion that Obama wants in new tax revenue raises. The rest comes from dropping some tax loop holes and exemptions. Combine that with another +$1 trillion of spending cuts and we start to make a balanced dent in the deficit over the next 10 years.

    • wylrae

      Well of course you are assuming that 0zer0 and his minions will follow through on expenditure cuts; history has shown that the democrats aren’t too good on that part of the equation. And of course you are assuming that any additional revenue 0zer0 gets he is going to apply to debt reduction rather than increased spending. I would think that given his history of “telling the truth” over the past few years most people would be some suspicion of what he is saying now; of course, that may be just me because I thought he was a snake oil salesman the first time I heard him speak and I haven’t seen anything he has said or done that has changed my opinion.

      • sowsear1

        Another one of Murphy’s Laws:
        Expenditures always rise to meet income.

        • Heather Stein

          That is not what happened when Clinton and Reagan raised taxes. They precisely raised taxes to reduced the deficit, which is what happened. Do you have any proof of your statement?

          • Hokma

            Do you have any proof of what you said maggot?

  • samb1

    Obama has no problem doing a dive off
    the FC, that way he gets what he
    wants and he gets to blame the
    Republicans as well.

    Obama wants us to know-
    “I am your king and your all my subjects now”

    What a nightmare!!!!!!

    • MG6

      Obama has never held a meaning full job. Everything was given to him, so….it makes sense he would want a unlimited credit card.

      • Deapster

        We keep electing local school boards made up of the same people – ex teachers or other public employees who all live off the public dole.

        Local school boards spend equally tax dollars on more public employee perks and benefits than the federal government, yet few support independent fiscal conservatives for this elected position either.

        Think about this when you elect your next local school boards because this is where the rubber hits the road and you can make a huge difference and still get quality education without the socialist bias by changing things at the top of your local school boards.

        • DianaLC

          Deapster, years and years ago (in the early 90s) I did run for school board in a small town. I had taught in the district of that town and was disgusted with the way it was being run–the nepotism and corruption was awful. The education being provided was subpar. I quit working for the district and drove 50 miles one way to work instead as a half-time faculty at a community college and to do one extra adjunct class at the university there.

          When I ran, the teachers were opposed to my candidacy; the business leaders’ group was for me. I can’t remember the name of the organization, but a state-wide org of school boards sent in a training video to candidates which basically said that school board members were supposed to rubber stamp the administrators’ ideas. It became clear to administration and teachers I would not do that and that I would be a dissenting voice. Needless to say, I didn’t get in. There were too many angainst me.

          I could name teachers who showed up to work drunk and who were “covered” by the administration because they were friends. I could name a vice principal, and teacher in his school, and the head of the Social Services office in the county who routinely left their wives at home and flew to Las Vegas for gambling. (The SS director eventually was caught having stolen lots of money from the agency to cover gambling debts.) The teacher never had to do a damnded thing in his classroom because he knew the vice principal’s secrets.

          Many in the small community were next-door neighbors to the awful teachers and administrators in the community so were reluctant to speak out against their “good” neighbors despite the fact that many of those “good” neighbors were cheating their kids out of a good education. Small towns are indeed the worst sometimes.
          But even in the cities, you are correct that anyone running for school board who might be a dissenting vote for any NEA sponsored idea would have all kinds of NEA money spent against him/her in the election process.

  • Deapster

    A life plan for many young people today is waiting for Mommy and Daddy’s inheritance (result of their parents hard work, sacrifice and long-term goals).

    Are they in for a surprise when Obama now redistributes that inheritance expectation to the 47% of this countries federal benefit moochers, or what?

    Then next big spending bubble -spending out the estate accumulations of the last generation of sacrifice and savers.

    Will we let Obama spend what we have currently saved for our kids inheritance that was protected by the former Bush estate tax exemptions? No way!

    We will start spending it now on ourselves. Sorry kiddies, but your Obama votes have consequences. And we now honor Bush’s admonition to “go out and shop”.

    This is really the only accumulated wealth resource left in this country to tap to boost the economy, but we intend to spend it on travel abroad. Sorry US union employees, you won’t be getting any of it either.

    • buzzlatte3

      I know. The young hip have no idea how badly they screwed themselves over and prolonged their agony (and everyone else) of never having a decent life without lack. Why? Because they refused to take responsibility for themselves.

      • Deapster

        I used to feel sorry such a bad debt was getting passed on to future generations.

        No longer after this election when young voters were clearly presented a chance to turn things around. They chose not to. Now they own this growing debt at their expense. Party on.

        • HELENK2

          as backtrack says

          HELLO SUCKERS

        • DianaLC

          I understand your feelings; however, I do have childrent who did not go for the hope and the change. I’m trying my best to figure out ways to give what I have to them now instead of when I die.

          • buzzlatte3

            Be careful.

  • win43

    This is pretty funny:

    If you are living in a small town in the midwest I would agree, $200,000 is a lot of money and goes along ways. But go to New York or Boston or Philadelphia or Los Angeles and see how far you get with $200,000. Sorry, that’s not even comfortable middle class.

    Here are the mean and median household incomes in those four cities:

    New York: median $53,514, mean $77,865

    Boston: median $39,629, mean $44,151

    Philadelphia: median $36,669, mean $45,842

    Los Angeles: median $56,266, mean… I didn’t find right away, but you get the point.

    Not sure what your idea of “middle class” is, Larry. But even in the highest cost-of-living areas in the country, $200k is plenty.

    • MG6

      Ahhhh, how much you think rent, mortgages, food, transportation, parking, taxes (of all sorts), and did I mention taxes?

      • win43

        Yeah… I live in Chicago. It’s not like I don’t know what I’m talking about, here.

        Saying $200k a year doesn’t make a person even “comfortably middle class” is incredibly out of touch with reality.

        • Hokma

          Conversely, making an adjusted household income of $250,000 where you are or in metro NY, LA, SF, Boston does not make you wealthy as Obama says you are.

          • buzzlatte3

            No kidding. And the worse part is now they’ll flee the high liberal induced taxes of those states and ruin the rest of the country with sprawl and Agenda 21 220 sq ft apartments (just signed off on in SF) – Kind of like the crap place Bruce Willis lived in the “Fifth Element”.

            But hey, America is not racist, homophobic, or unkind to terrorists and illegal aliens. Hell, we’ll even pay for them to come here illegally! We’ll be just like all the other 3rd world countries! Kumbayah! Nice trade-off. /sarc.

            • DianaLC

              Here in CO, we’ve got quite a few people who escaped CA. We call their influence Californication.

              • buzzlatte3

                We call them PIBs ~People in Black ~ because they’re always wearing it in some form to look skinnier or younger or wealllllltheeearrrr! Black SUVS, black jeans, black skinny coats, black rimmed glasses, black credit cards…yeah, they blend. LOL!

        • MG6

          Yeah…..I lived in Boston and now in NY……so, yeeeaaahhhh…….living with roommates bc none of us 200,000 can afford to live on our own. So, I know what I am talking about. I don’t qualify for sec 8 to cover the rent or funding for heat and electricity nor is my cell covered.

  • MG6
    • buzzlatte3

      Oh if this were only true and verifiable.

  • Deapster

    California teachers constantly complain they are paid less than other states, but fail to mention because they blocked teacher reforms they made themselves ineligible receive federal “Race to the Top” dollars.

    They then demanded state taxpayers make up the difference by increasing state and local education tax initiative which stupid California voters passed.

    Reason: vote was carried by young voters, public employee unions and renters who think someone else will be paying for these benefits. Gov Brown additionally exploited the “tax the rich” class warfare theme also pandered by Obama campaign forces.

    And there you have it folks — California again leads the nation.

  • HELENK2

    http://weaselzippers.us/2012/12/06/obama-regime-excludes-israel-from-global-counterterrorism-forum-to-appease-islamist-turkey-for-the-second-time/

    to appease Turkey, backtack bunch exclude Israel from counter terrorism forum. It’s not like Israel has any experience they could share on the subject

  • HELENK2

    http://freebeacon.com/obama-bundler-ready-to-profit-off-fiscal-cliff/

    why is this not a surprise???
    backtrack bundler due to make a bundle if country goes over fiscal cliff

  • HELENK2

    http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2012/12/06/twilight-of-the-blue-states/

    11 states where citizens receive more money from the government than they contribute

  • HELENK2

    gag me
    harry reid has just brought a bill where food would be allowed in the congressional auditorium.

    never mind any real legislation,

    • buzzlatte3

      I bet Harry wears cream pies really well.

  • HELENK2

    http://www.lignet.com/ArticleAnalysis/Syrian-CW-Reports-Could-be-Ploy-for-Asylum-for-Ass

    I am praying that this is true
    syrian siran gas threat is a ploy to get asylum for assas

  • HELENK2
  • HELENK2

    http://www.monroenews.com/news/2012/dec/06/right-work-legislation-moving-ahead-lansing/

    right to work law moving ahead in Michigan

    now the fun begins

  • HELENK2

    makes me think of the fiscal cliff

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isvuttQTETw

  • DianaLC

    I have always loved Larry Doyle’s contributions to this site. Here’s his most recent posting on his own site:

    http://www.senseoncents.com/2012/12/david-kotok-on-why-we-need-to-go-over-the-cliff/

  • Popsmoke

    Here is another no shit sherlock! Go figure..

    http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/9751

  • HELENK2
  • sowsear1
    • DianaLC

      I keep hoping, but it’s hard to believe anymore that truth will win out.

    • buzzlatte3

      Is this truly legit?

  • HELENK2
    • buzzlatte3

      LOL!

  • HELENK2

    http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2012/12/06/lee-doren-breaks-down-the-ridiculous-bad-people-are-rich-teacher-union-video/

    this is good. breaks down california teacher”s union video.
    maybe the teachers should have taken some lessons

  • HELENK2
    • buzzlatte3

      Did anyone really think he was going to improve?

  • Eyes Wide Open

    Agreed

  • HELENK2

    http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2012/12/06/former-texas-naacp-president-no-reason-blacks-vote-obama-except-race

    what are the odds this guy will be invited back to msnbc???
    the obama worshipping network

  • piattq

    Obama has the perfect win-win. If the Repubs cave and let him get what he wants, they will probably splinter and implode even more than they have following Romney’s defeat which they had no small part in causing. If they oppose and take things over the cliff, O will not get the blame. Repubs will wear the crown of thorns. In both cases the Repubs are likely to lose the house in 2014 giving O the last 2 years to go for broke.

  • Propertius

    But go to New York or Boston or Philadelphia or Los Angeles and see how
    far you get with $200,000. Sorry, that’s not even comfortable middle
    class.

    Which means that most New Yorkers are impoverished, since the median household income in NYC is only $50,285 (http://project.wnyc.org/census-maps/nyc-income/index.html). There are certainly neighborhoods where the median income is much higher (Central Park views are not for hoi polloi) , but citywide it’s only a bit higher than the rest of the country. LA and Boston are a bit higher than NYC. Philadelphia is much lower – only about $32,300 per household.

    80% of NYC households make less than $81,700/yr.

    90% of NYC households make less than $111,000/yr.

    How do you define “comfortable middle class”? Top 20% of households(>$81,700/yr in NYC)? Top 10% (>$111,000 in NYC)? Top 5%?

    I’m sure Mayor For Life Bloomberg considers anything less than 8 figures a year to be grinding poverty, but his standards are somewhat atypical.

  • HELENK2
  • HELENK2

    i have a question that may sound dumb,.
    If Syria releases the siran gas weapon, does is dispurse all in one place or is it carried by wind currents to a wide spread area?.

    could it go beyond Syria?

    now I read both sides have chemical weapons and if they are used they would act so fast that nothing could be done to stop them.
    I also read that the threat from assad might just be a ploy to gain asylum.

    so many different stories, anybody got an answer?

    • http://noquarterusa.net Larry Johnson

      Read my new post.